S01.E02: Another Benghazi

[Kromm]

And I can't even with the notion that the Chief of Staff outranks the Secretary of State in every way. 

Even if someone was older and hadn't been to a Government or Civics class in decades, all you have to do is read a freaking newspaper or watch the nightly news semi-regularly or even just use some common sense to know that Denis McDonough doesn't tell John Kerry what to do.

[sifar]

Even if someone was older and hadn't been to a Government or Civics class in decades, all you have to do is read a freaking newspaper or watch the nightly news semi-regularly or even just use some common sense to know that Denis McDonough doesn't tell John Kerry what to do.

 

I hesitate to comment on this topic because all my not-so-real political knowledge comes courtesy of The West Wing. So I googled powers of CoS and came across dozens of articles about how powerful a CoS is - some writers even went as far as  to say that he/she is more powerful than the VP.

 

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2013/01/obamas-chief-of-staff-will-be-the-most-important-appointment-of-his-term/267124/

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/09/white-house-chiefs-of-staff-96492.html

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/16/us/politics/16emanuel.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

Edited October 5, 2014 by sifar

[Kromm]

I hesitate to comment on this topic because all my not-so-real political knowledge comes courtesy of The West Wing. So I googled powers of CoS and came across dozens of articles about how powerful a CoS is - some writers even went as far as  to say that he/she is more powerful than the VP.

 

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2013/01/obamas-chief-of-staff-will-be-the-most-important-appointment-of-his-term/267124/

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/09/white-house-chiefs-of-staff-96492.html

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/16/us/politics/16emanuel.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

Of the three (CoS, SoS, VP), the SoS is the one who really has the most effective power.  The VP has certain guaranteed jobs, but the rest is at the discretion of the President.  The CoS also has a few implied jobs (none really guaranteed), but again a particular President can use discretion to give the CoS more authority.  The duties of the SoS, on the other hand, are fairly well entrenched and probably the only real variation is how much leeway they have before the President him or herself has to sign off on stuff.

So sure, I can easily believe the idea that a Chief of Staff might have more influence or effective authority than a VP.  But not more than the Secretary of State, IMO.  On one level I know it makes no sense at all--we THINK the VP should be more important--but the nature of the job is so badly defined.

[shapeshifter]

...I love her hair. Probably because I have ruler-straight hair. Curly hair is absolutely beautiful to me....

If my 3 curly-haired adult daughters heard you say that, they would likely hold you down and perm your hair and say, "How do you like it now??!!!!" My hair's more wavy, so I don't have to spend too much time taming it, but sometimes my daughters' hair looks great, and sometimes it looks--well, almost as bad as Bebe's did in this episode. Bebe's hair was more of a character than Bebe's character was.

...Although it would be great if Leoni turns to him [hot not!Blackwater guy] to investigate George's supposed murder. It's not as if she can do any sleuthing on her own - too visible for that.

That's a great idea. I hope they go there, except I have to agree with this point:

...I deeply resent this show trying to clean up the image of Blackwater, deeply resent it....

...The scene with Tea and her daughter talking about his terrible magic tricks was the best scene in the episode.

Yes, more of that and the show will do just fine.

[sifar]

The duties of the SoS, on the other hand, are fairly well entrenched and probably the only real variation is how much leeway they have before the President him or herself has to sign off on stuff.

 

I think this is the point. The President decides how much power a CoS has. IMO, the reason Russell Jackson gets away with what he does is because everyone understands that he has the President's implicit backing. He is the President's dragon (thank you TVtrope), the one who does all the dirty work so that the President can remain the good guy. For example, he says no to Elizabeth's face about sending troops to Yemen, so that the President doesn't have to even though everyone including Elizabeth understands that the President is saying no. Likewise, the President magnanimously thanks Bishop for a job well done and then Jackson gets rid of him (sort of rudely) so that the President doesn't have to.

 

If my 3 curly-haired adult daughters heard you say that, they would likely hold you down and perm your hair and say, "How do you like it now??!!!!"

Just give me the time and place and I'll be there. They won't even have to hold me down. LOL. My hair is so stubbornly straight that nothing has ever been able to add the slightest hint of wave to it. I always look like the creepy ghost girl from all those Japanese horror movies like "The Ring".

 

That's a great idea. I hope they go there, except I have to agree with this point:

 

 

The sad thing is that Blackwater isn't even the worst of them out there. There are others who have committed even worse human rights violations. I am ambivalent to use the "this is just a tv show" defense but I really want to see Bishop again(the hotness is too strong to resist). So for me, as long as the show makes him a completely different person than Eric Prince, I'll be okay.

Edited October 5, 2014 by sifar

[Beach Party]

Happened more than once: Elizabeth was involved in a tense situation with critical updates being texted to her at home, but she's got her cell set on vibrate mode!?!?!

[myril]

I realize adding a daughter is post-pilot tinkering, but to frame it as a "secret daughter" State has to deal with is just ridiculous. It wasn't going to come out at a confirmation hearing or on the news or the Internet, social media or Wikipedia that she had a third kid of college-age? It sounds more absurd than usual.

 

When I look at what some even bigger news companies are making stories of, how even news fell for the Emma Watson image publishing meta hoax (wow, don't get people trained in validating information anymore?), would say, there would be some media making a big fuzz where there is nothing to make of, because, everyone could have known following the hearing or reading Wikipedia. Who looked utterly incompetent at this point was Matt, he should have known, and not make some smug joke about it. Kinda surprising that this guy with the emotional intelligence of a plank is head speech writer. He might be great with words, but his social skills need a lot of improvement - and some more of this stuff and he will have to look for a new job (or should have to).

 

Daisy rephrased it as "not hidden but underrepesented", meaning McCord hadn't made a secret of her eldest daughter, just tried to keep her out of the spotlight, low profile. Which of course meant Stevie had to try herself as well to keep a low profile and not organize protests at her college. And while this really shouldn't even be a problem, people make a problem of it. When you're the kid of one of the most (formally) powerful people in your country you're easily under the microscope.

 

And it sucks, when people stop seeing you and all you are to them is the daughter or son of that person. It might open some doors, but it makes you feel invisible as your own self at times, a person with feelings and skills, mistakes and successes. Stevie is new to this, and not everyone is born to handle such change of attention. I know kids with parents of some public interest, and that was just the local kind, no big power or celebrity, and even that already sucked at times. Yes they were asked about their parents doings and politics and public appearances, and judged for it. It might calm down after a while, when you are great at ignoring it, but we are still quite early in the term of McCord, last episode was 2 months after the President asked McCord to be SoS, and think between this episode and the pilot barely some days have passed.

 

I liked that Stevie tried, after being rejected for having not graduated (yet), to play the powerful mother card, but then decided not to go through with it, because it shows she is conflicted about the whole situation herself. Was she dumb to apply for a position for a graduate? Depends on if it was published with graduation being obligatory, and in a way understandable for someone new at job hunting.

 

LOL - That's her real hair style and I love it.  Why are a lot of people so against naturally curly hair?  Don't get it.  I wish more women would wear their naturally curly hair instead of spending hours straightening it everyday. 

 

Thanks, but saying this as someone with naturally curly hair, straightening sometimes looks like the simpler option than struggling all day to keep the curls in some acceptable form (aka one you feel good with and not feeling like you look as if entertaining a place for a bird's family on your head). At least on day with sunny, dry weather forecast, otherwise any effort is vain anyway. Not to mention, while curly hair for kids is cute (oh I hated it), as adult you get the sense, that being cute is not getting you much respect eventually.

 

That's true. But he's the Usher's direct boss (I was kind of alluding to that).  Basically the CoS is the head bureaucrat, the 4 or 8 year appointed one, who the lifetime bureaucrats in the Executive Branch report to under that president.  Operating budgets, overall staffing policies, all that stuff it takes to run an "office" with several thousand employees.

 

Nope. The position originated more in the position of private secretary of the President, personal close, administrative and political assistant. No head bureaucrat but a very influential political position with administrative and management tasks. It's not a stated position, there is no term, it's a position that doesn't need any confirmation of the Senat, it's appointed by the President, and it's the decision of a President if he even has a CoS. You can see this position as the gatekeeper for access of all information and people, overseeing the Executive Office, which includes a number of the President's close advisors.

 

Just looking at the list of who has been CoS gives me a different impression than that of this job being for some bureaucrat or being just maintaining the president's calendar and house.

 

Political Science 101: difference between formal and informal power.

 

 

So, come on show and embrace your tawdry, conspiracy-loving inner Scandal (because The West Wing you aren't) and give Olitz a run for their money since I actually love Tea Leoni in her role and would absolutely love to see Isaac Bishop on my screen every week.

 

I wouldn't mind if they don't scandalize, don't turn this show into just another conspiracy or political thriller soap, because IMO politics are a lot more complex and interesting than cheap thriller and conspiracy theory often paint it. No matter how well written and acted Scandal is, it's a good show in its own merits, but I don't need a clone of it just with different staff. Neither am I looking for another Honorable Woman (good show, but demanded to pay attention every second to not get lost in the connections and twists,better thriller than Homeland, though maybe even crazier than Homeland).

 

I mean, it is a problem that the show might be itself not quite sure, what it wants to be or to become, and I admit, I am not quite sure what I want it to become either, only know what I don't want it to turn into, but maybe it can be political drama without this thriller hype for a change. Not all shows have to be a thrill and big twists and turns to be entertaining. I am getting a bit worn out by all this sensationalism. I like me some good thrill and action, but need to take a breath once in a while.

 

Making the Vesuvian (where did they get such name ideas? playing scrabble much?) boss such a charming, good looking guy with some spark was subtle while him or his work being called "satan", "devil". No idea if that was meant so subtle, but kudos if. Temptation, enticement in more than one way. Yes, there was chemistry, but don't see them going anywhere near to affair. It was though very interesting, that the political establishment discounted McCord's valid analyse, judging her disrespectful as overreacting, she had good reasons for her suggestions, and the guy doing basically something McCord has some ethical problems with, she accused his people of acting reckless and only motivated by money if I got that right, was the one showing her some respect and listened to her.

Edited November 8, 2014 by katusch

[romantic idiot]

Good lord, yes.  I mean, he just had "it"...whatever "it" is.  I also thought he and Tea had good chemistry.  I don't want to see an affair either but I'd sure like to see him again. I guess it's not terribly likely unless they use his company again.

 

I've seen him on Chicago Fire and Boss and keep hoping he'll turn up in more things. He's like Bomer, as in it's not apparent that he's a pretty good actor because he's so pretty. Or rather hot. Next to Jon Groff, he's the actor I most hope will turn up in random shows.