S33.E08: 500th Episode

[TVbitch]

The insta dance was a fail and pretty boring. Even the judges  were unclear how to judge or score it. 

Nice to see Sharna. I like her as a judge on DWTS Australia and was hoping she would be sitting in as a judge last night as her critcques are very good compared to Carrie Ann Crazypants. 

Edited November 14 by TVbitch

[Desperado]

I wish we would’ve seen more of the past dances and professionals for the 500th episode.

I really liked everyone’s first dance but the insta dance concept was bad. Didn’t they do something similar in the past but with 20 min to prepare or something? That was better.

[crowceilidh]

I found the insta dance badly set up and tediously repetitive. 

The re-do of the supposedly "iconic" dances was full of nonsense too.  I hate it when they expect us to believe that 1) the celeb is picking which dance they're doing and 2) they just happen to have the dance  in their head.  I certainly didn't agree with some of the choices either.

 

[livinforthetea]

If you have experience learning choreography pretty much from when you were a little kid then you have a huge leg up and I rather watch and root for the people that are not dancers and are learning something completely new to them, giving it their all and improving week to week. So I'm not in favor of the "Ringers", but ultimately it comes down to the votes and if Chandler can pull them in then she will likely win this season. 

I'll miss Dwight and Dani, Dwight may not have been the best dancer but he loved being there and he exuded joy every time he danced. It was a joy to watch. Dani is officially my favorite pro, her choreography skills are absolutely amazing.

I'd just love to see Illona keep sticking around as long as possible. 

 

[Soapy Goddess]

12 hours ago, Andiethewestie said:

Well that didn't take long. The on line hate towards Chandler is just nauseating. She even addressed it.  Why does America hate black women? 

She's a beautiful dancer! What are they hating on?

[Andiethewestie]

2 hours ago, Soapy Goddess said:

She's a beautiful dancer! What are they hating on?

It seems that certain fans decided to bully Chandler and fill her feed with hate after she got the first 30 of the season, claiming their boy should have got it, which goes with the territory I guess, but then it started getting personal that she gives off a "bad vibe"

and should be eliminated. She saw it and responded that she's all for differences of opinion but was confused when comments got personal.

None of the other contestants reported getting this kind of vitriol.

Charity Larson season 32 has been supporting her  and was quick to come to her defence, having experienced similar hate messages last season, so much so that she broke down on Cheryl Burke's podcast and confirmed that all of the hate messages not only on her personal feed but the Dancing With The Stars feed was so bad that it affected her mental health. She suggested there be someone available to help contestants cope but the show wasn't interested. Comrad Green said it hasn't been a problem so he didn't think there was a need. Artem went to the producers to try and get it to stop. Charity could delete comment on her own feed but not on the official DWTS feed. Last season Charity's family made a statement and were very upset.
 

Someone did post that this time DWTS did remove the offensive messages, leaving a few positive ones after the deluge of hate, so imho that is a direct result of Charity going public with this on line bullying.

I posted earlier in the season about this because the viewership is highly racist in their attitude towards black females in general.

Brandon's wife also posted about this so it obviously has affected Chandler on the night that she should have been celebrating her success. That's cruel.

 We have message boards where fans can vent frustration amongst other viewers but to post on the contestant's feeds with personal attacks is beyond the pale. unfortunately some believe it's part of the game and it all just increases viewership.

The show is increasingly encouraging on line engagement so they need to be cognizant of all the ramifications. 
Heres a repost of Charity's ordeal last season 

https://variety.com/2024/tv/news/charity-lawson-dancing-with-the-stars-bullying-racis-1236089326/amp/

Edited November 14 by Andiethewestie

[TVMovieBuff]

This episode was just boring in the dances. Two rounds, both consisting of nothing new. 

The first copying another iconic dance the best they can. We have the originals, we love them, why do it? Let us appreciate the historic wonder!

And the instant dances are just a mish-mash of what they already know how to do well, not to take chances on something innovative and new to the couple, because then they could screw up and lose points. 

Is it just me?

[boyznkatz]

I think Len Goodman's passing really affected the show. He kept the scores in check. He would have never given some of this garbage 10s. I think people know they can just get a 10 easily now, so they don't really try anymore.

Danny, Ilona and Stephen should be getting 7s and 8s like Bobby Bones did, and they would be getting those if Len was still here. Those folks have better attitudes than Bones, but their dancing has only marginally improved and they really aren't any better than he was.

[twilightzone]

10 minutes ago, boyznkatz said:

I think Len Goodman's passing really affected the show. He kept the scores in check. He would have never given some of this garbage 10s. I think people know they can just get a 10 easily now, so they don't really try anymore.

Danny, Ilona and Stephen should be getting 7s and 8s like Bobby Bones did, and they would be getting those if Len was still here. Those folks have better attitudes than Bones, but their dancing has only marginally improved and they really aren't any better than he was.

On that note, the judges should a lot tougher on Chandler - who has gotten a tongue bath from them every week.  Why aren't they pointing out the fact that she's has years of professional dance training, including with Debbie Allen.

This is why viewers do not like Ringers and root for the underdogs. DWTS is supposed to be an amature competition. 

[iMonrey]

I have nothing against Chandler herself. I'm just tired of the Disney kids with extensive dance backgrounds. It was obvious very early on that Chandler was the designated winner this season. It's more obvious now that she's going to win. What's the point of even continuing the "competition"? Hey, if all you care about is watching good dancing, that's great for you. There should just be a show that has great dancing. This is supposed to be a "competition." Hence the vitriol against ringers. 

Imagine if Chandler were not here. The finalists would be Joey, Danny, Stephen and Ilona. Now that would be a real horse race that would come down to who ultimately improved the most and had the best final dance. 

Instead we've got this lopsided situation where it's someone who is virtually a pro dancer versus four amateurs. It's like I said earlier, it would be like Dwight in a basketball game against a bunch of Munchkins. I just don't see how it's fair.

Edited November 14 by iMonrey

[crowceilidh]

I don't know about the contention that DWTS is supposed to be an amateur competition.  I've been watching since S2 and I've never seen a season that didn't arguably have one or more ringers in it.

I think Chandler deserves the accolades, myself. And she probably isn't pulling the votes as she might be were she a white ringer.  But somebody who used to be on this forum has analyzed how often ringers win, and I don't think it happens all that often.

I'm for Joey winning, precisely because he is supposedly not a ringer? I'm not making an accusation, he just dances so well for someone without training.

But star power and attitude can make up for any ringeryness in the final, so the ringers never bother me, I just enjoy their dancing.

 

[boyznkatz]

Chandler isn't going to win. She has been on the bottom three numerous times. It will probably be one of the Olympians (I think Ilona). They are a lot more popular. 

I'm all for amateurs winning over ringers, but this season, they have been noticeably bad. Remember Rob Kardashian and Rikki Lake? They started out bad, but got pretty good by the end. I think the lack of Len Goodman and the now mediocre pros are to blame (I'll cut Rylee some slack since she is new). I honestly don't remember a single dance that Whitney or Alan ever did. This show is getting stale and if they don't do something (like getting new pros, judges and hosts) then it's not going to last very long.

Edited November 14 by boyznkatz

[realdancemom]

I also think that one of the Olympians might win. At first, I thought it might be Stephen since he was the Clark Kent/Superman of the men's gymnastics team. Now, I do think it will be Ilona. She and Alan have a great partnership and are very active on social. I'm old and not savvy with social but even their posts pop up on my FB feed. I'm not following them so it's just some algo doing it. She's also a positive role model for bigger girls.

If it was all about the best dancer winning, Bobby Bones would have never won or  made the finals. Tinashe and Juan Pablo would have been there. I've been worried about Chandler/Brandon being eliminated the last few weeks and next week. You can see it in Brandon's face every time they are in the bottom. He's worried too.

[Andiethewestie]

11 hours ago, iMonrey said:

Imagine if Chandler were not here. The finalists would be Joey, Danny, Stephen and Ilona. Now that would be a real horse race that would come down to who ultimately improved the most and had the best final dance. 

Then I just wouldn't bother because the calibre is far below any sort of enjoyment I get as a viewer. I can barely watch the other 5 because they are making the same mistakes over and over and not making a real effort to correct their technique. Len would have scolded them to get practising.
 

 I just find it rather tiresome but at least there's Chandler working her butt off to put out a good product, so I will watch for her until the big fanbases get rid of her so they can stop worrying about having black women in contention. 

 I stopped watching after season 25 because I was not impressed with the show anymore, it ran its course and if you think talented Disney kids are annoying, I just cringe at the next Bachelor  nation being cast and I gave up..
 

I came back Season 30 after watching the first episode with a dynamic pair who Len gave a 4 and I was hooked because he had insane rhythm to Hey Ya. I thought maybe a basketball player can win this. 

I watch for good dancing and someone who can wow me. The show has been holding back on giving Chandler a perfect score, I thought her first Cha Cha should have scored higher and her Paso Doble was worth more. You've got Carrie Ann all over the place with this team. Not giving feedback when Chandler pleaded with her to help her get better. Len would have been more consistent, but this show is so worried about offending the Olympics or the NFL  or the Bachelor franchise that they are basically controlling the narrative now more than ever.

We are now at the semi finals and Danny who hasn't danced much all season will get a Salsa so another lift heavy dance. He  never got a Rumba or a Samba or a Cha Cha all season.
 

That's not cricket. He should do at least one rhythmic dance.  Stephen didn't get Rumba or Samba either but at least he's got Cha Cha this time to show if he can move his hips. Dibs on awkwardly.

They gave Chandler a Salsa while okay but I  really wanted to see her get Samba because I know it would be an excellent showcase for her skill, and apparently Brandon wanted Samba.

It just sucks we had only one Samba from a Joey that needed  a lot of improvement. 

The Final show is scheduled for 3 hours. Maybe they can fill it with the Redemption Dance, the  Freestyle and how about a Samba Dance off for points?  If it keeps Chandler around I'm all for it. We have been deprived of Samba this season.
 

 

 

 
 

 

 

[boyznkatz]

I wish they had sambas and argentine tangos over lame ass contemporary and "jazz."

[ams1001]

12 minutes ago, boyznkatz said:

I wish they had sambas and argentine tangos over lame ass contemporary and "jazz."

Jazz can be fun when they do it well, and I always love the AT because they get to do all kinds of cool-looking lifts. I hate when they do them early in the season, though, when most of the celebs are just learning how to do choreo. Start with the easier dances so they hopefully won't look so awkward when they get to the more intricate stuff.

[boyznkatz]

1 hour ago, ams1001 said:

Jazz can be fun when they do it well, and I always love the AT because they get to do all kinds of cool-looking lifts. I hate when they do them early in the season, though, when most of the celebs are just learning how to do choreo. Start with the easier dances so they hopefully won't look so awkward when they get to the more intricate stuff.

I agree. I've seen jazz done by professionals and it can be good, but most of the celebs don't have the skills to do it. My favorite AT on the show was the Gilles and Cheryl one, but Maks and Val had some good ones, too.

[Fliz]

On 11/12/2024 at 7:18 PM, DEL901 said:

 Danny was missing the joy Helio projected.   

Agreed. My theory is that Danny spent so much time perfecting his football player face that it has become his default expression. I really notice this when he is in the background in the skybox.

Edited November 15 by Fliz
incorrect grammar

[boyznkatz]

i heard Danny has a lot of plates in his body, so it might be painful for him. It would explain why he is stiff, anyway. There is no excuse for the Olympians, though. They are fit and in their twenties, but they still have two left feet and never improve.

Edited November 15 by boyznkatz

[Andiethewestie]

3 hours ago, boyznkatz said:

i heard Danny has a lot of plates in his body, so it might be painful for him. It would explain why he is stiff, anyway. There is no excuse for the Olympians, though. They are fit and in their twenties, but they still have two left feet and never improve.

And yet all those plates allowed him to do a flip in an early Foxtrot instead of learning proper technique. 🙄Danny is  a cop out. Ty Murray had a shit load of surgeries from bull riding and James Hinchcliffe had a hunk of racing car metal inpaled in his pelvis so  neither of them could do rhythmic dances well but they tried. This guy gets to duck them all because......????? Bone spurs? 

 

Edited November 15 by Andiethewestie

[iMonrey]

On 11/14/2024 at 11:11 AM, boyznkatz said:

Chandler isn't going to win. She has been on the bottom three numerous times. It will probably be one of the Olympians (I think Ilona). They are a lot more popular. 

"Not necessarily the bottom three." The judges have a lot of leeway in their scoring to ensure it can compensate for whatever votes the others are getting. They've done it before.

Let's put it this way, I'll be shocked if Chandler doesn't win. I'm pretty sure this show and ABC are invested in that outcome.

[RomanKat]

On 11/13/2024 at 11:25 AM, realdancemom said:

I'm glad that Chandler is still there. I don't care if she's a ringer. I watch for the dancing and she's miles ahead of everybody else. I wish they had a five person finale like last year. That way, I know she made it. I mostly want to see their freestyle. I'll be happy that Brandon finally has a chance to do one if that's the case. People are saying that his choreography is boring. Len would have loved it. He is teaching proper ballroom technique.

FWIW, I enjoy Brandon's back-to-basics approach to choreography. I also like his relatively low-key, ambiverted personality. That said, I recognize how general audiences might prefer Alan's (for example) higher energy, extroverted personality and showier routines, even though I personally don't find Alan's choreography to be objectively better than Brandon's <shrug>.

To be clear, I can enjoy different approaches for different reasons on DWTS. It's a variety show, after all. And good choreography is good choreography, regardless of approach.
 

Quote

Personality wise, I do like everybody left. As I mentioned, I mostly want to see Chandler/Brandon's freestyle. I don't really care who wins although I do hope it's them.

I'd rate their chance of making the final as pretty good. We're at the point of competition when producers historically "help" contestants they'd like to see in the finals. Between her Disney connections and the show (presumably) preferring a diverse cast, Chandler and Brandon might get some help. They might not need much, however, because her dance ability justifies high scores. Also, the scoring spreads haven't been huge this season, like in Ally Brooke's season when artificially large spreads helped extend her stay. We also haven't seen sudden wrinkles, like the winner-take-15 points dance-off during Chelsea Kane's season. My guess is that Chandler/Brandon are doing well enough within the current voting system to make the finals without blatant assistance. But that's just a guess, presuming the producers very much want Chandler in the final.

Speaking of producer shenanigans, the cleverest of all imho was when they tricked Davis/White fans into thinking Charlie was safe but Meryl was in jeopardy. It indirectly knocked Charlie out of the finals, and consolidated support for a Meryl/Maks win. Which indirectly brings me to this very loose take on ringers and voters: Ringers do better when a plurality of voters want their pro partner to win. However, pros have to priorly "earn" ringer wins--especially mega-ringer wins--in the voting fans' view. Lindsay "deserved" to win with Jordan after taking the likes of Alek Skarlatos, 40-something Wanya Morris, Calvin Johnson, and David Ross deep into the competition. (They all made the finals save Wanya, who made the semi-finals.) Maks was "over-due" with Meryl, per his fanbase. Mark had been through many shocking eliminations / near misses before finally winning a 3rd mirror ball with Charli. Derek deserved ringers, alongside challenges, because of his record of awards worthy choreography, per his fanbase. Etc..

That's not to say that ringers can't win with relatively unproven pros. It's just a loose observation about why/when fans have been more willing to vote for ringers to win DWTS.

Edited November 16 by RomanKat

[Andiethewestie]

This show is now beyond ridiculous. Danny is being set up by production for a Win.

That viral leg yank got the attention of Frosted Flakes and they put a picture of the Yank on a cereal box. Sorry Witney you have been replaced by Tony the Tiger's tail. Make of that what you will.
 

Danny gets a pass from Rumba Cha Cha Samba any technical rhythmic Latin Ballroom in favour of a trick heavy social Salsa. This is the only guy who just got lifts both contemporary and jazz and an awkward jive and a backflip in a Foxtrot. No hip action required!
 

Now I get why Reggie and Eric had to do a Cha Cha instead of a 40 year old who played hurt in the NFL but gets a pass for the extreme difficulty of moving his hips. Give me a break.

I also get why instead of getting Samba that dance fans look forward to, they give him trick heavy Salsa, and they do Chandler and Brandon dirty by giving them Salsa as a comparison. This is utter bs. Instead of assessing dance ability we get Danny showing how high he can toss Witney. I also think it was advantageous for Danny that Dwight is gone because he's the only one who did better on his fork lift duties.
 

 So when Chandler gets the boot she will never had the opportunity to show us what she can do with the most challenging  Latin dance -Samba because the show wants rotting teeth cereal money. In fact the show dismissed Samba almost exclusively which is such a huge loss to the dance line up. 

my prediction Chandler is eliminated and this horseshit is the reason why. 
 

I hope I'm not correct, but if I am when you know you know.

Edited November 16 by Andiethewestie

[RomanKat]

9 hours ago, Andiethewestie said:

This show is now beyond ridiculous. Danny is being set up by production for a Win.

That viral leg yank got the attention of Frosted Flakes and they put a picture of the Yank on a cereal box. Sorry Witney you have been replaced by Tony the Tiger's tail. Make of that what you will.
[....]
 So when Chandler gets the boot she will never had the opportunity to show us what she can do with the most challenging  Latin dance -Samba because the show wants rotting teeth cereal money. [...]

my prediction Chandler is eliminated and this horseshit is the reason why. 

Samba's hard, even for trained ringers. At this stage of the competition, producers are more likely to assign samba to contestants they want to kick out, not keep in, imo. The show might be doing Chandler a favor...

FWIW, I doubt that ABC-employed producers would back Tony the Tiger over Mickey the Mouse. But we'll see...

Edited November 17 by RomanKat

[Andiethewestie]

3 hours ago, RomanKat said:

Samba's hard, even for trained ringers. At this stage of the competition, producers are more likely to assign samba to contestants they want to kick out, not keep in, imo. The show might be doing Chandler a favor...

With respect, ridiculous.
 

Some of the best Sambas on this show were achieved by so called non ringers. Apolo Ohno anyone?  Hines Ward,  Stacey Kiebler who had ballet training like Chandler turned out one of the best Sambas in the history of the show. But the kicker is Brandon wanted Samba, which means they have tried something in rehearsal and he liked what he saw.
 

Instead we get a faux match up against Danny with a social Salsa that he can easily get a high score because it doesn't have the needed technicality to differentiate between the contestants. Another free pass for a weak dancer instead of a real challenge.

Effectively erasing a beloved dance from the line up because the majority of the remaining contestants can't do it is pathetic and production putting the thumb on the scale is off putting

[realdancemom]

Previously, I wrote that Danny is only excellent in lifts. He had contemporary, jazz, and AT three weeks in a row. Now, he has Salsa. I'm sure Witney will fill it with a bunch of lifts again. She knows what works for him and votes.

It would have been nice to see a samba from Chandler/Brandon. I think we only got one this season. It was when Joey did Tarzan. It might have been his weakest technically. I saw people saying that he should have received 10s. A lot of posters think that their favorite is low balled and should receive 10s. I'm sure Chandler would have been the best at it this season. However, samba is also a dance that the judges can nit pick. Maybe, that's not a good idea for the semis.

[peachmangosteen]

On 11/12/2024 at 11:49 PM, Andiethewestie said:

Nobody had a problem with Jordan Fisher winning. 

I did. Couldn't stand him lol.

[Andiethewestie]

9 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

I did. Couldn't stand him lol

Interesting he seemed to have a lot of fans never hit bottom and swept season 25 pretty easily. The only time I ever had a notion to see a Tour show is when he was on it. He was very good. Frankie Nunez was also there.and he wasn't so great. I'm sure he's a nice guy but I'd never buy a ticket to see him dance

[boyznkatz]

On 11/16/2024 at 9:27 AM, Andiethewestie said:

This show is now beyond ridiculous. Danny is being set up by production for a Win.

I wonder why though? He was pretty forgettable when he played football just like he's forgettable now. Is he going on the tour?

[Andiethewestie]

3 hours ago, boyznkatz said:

I wonder why though? He was pretty forgettable when he played football just like he's forgettable now. Is he going on the tour?

Just spitballing -Latin Ballroom would be risk he didn't want. He wanted insurance to make sure he's final 3. So the better gamble is to get a favourable judgement going head to head against Chandler's  Salsa proving he can hang with the dancers . Possibly a top placement gets him something even more lucrative than the payday and the cereal endorsement. Since social media and viral moments are a recent phenomenon  it obvious the show wants to capitalize on every occurrence. He also was a good player in the Brady era, just got inducted into the Patriots HOF

2 minutes ago, Andiethewestie said:

 

 

Edited Monday at 07:29 PM by Andiethewestie

[ljenkins782]

10 hours ago, Andiethewestie said:

Interesting he seemed to have a lot of fans never hit bottom and swept season 25 pretty easily. The only time I ever had a notion to see a Tour show is when he was on it. He was very good. Frankie Nunez was also there.and he wasn't so great. I'm sure he's a nice guy but I'd never buy a ticket to see him dance

Frankie Muniz? Or was there a Frankie Nunez on the show too? I haven't seen all of the seasons. 

I'm sure there's no shortage of professional dance shows out there to go see live, I don't really think the DWTS tour is the place to go if you're really invested in dance perfection. I'm not even sure this is the show to be watching if you're a dance purist, it sure doesn't seem like it's much fun to watch amateurs dance if all you can see is what they didn't do right and lament the judging for not being harder on them. 

[Andiethewestie]

Frankie sorry about the spelling, I'm sorry didn't exactly do so great. But  if you're into gold stars for participation I guess you'd love it.

 But my reason for going is I wanted to see the pros in action and if there was a good contestant with them all the better. That's why I thought it be fun to see Jordan, that hateful guy do his thing. I really don't know his personality but I love his dancing. See I'm not a personality hire kind of fan, I'm a dance fan and I root for those with training and those without when they really strived to do something extraordinary . And sure do I love going to Lincoln Centre to see New York City Ballet crush a Balanchine choreography or watching the Alvin Ailey dancers you betcha! But we don't get a lot of Ballroom shows around so it's nice when one comes along in my area.
 

Since you're considering what my preference is, If I want to spend money on being entertained I prefer watching people regardless of dance background get as close to the standard idea of ballroom as they can. You know Len Goodman approved contestants who can give it some Welly. Certainly there are those who clamoured to see Harry Housey in action on tour such as it was last  season. Hard pass for me.  But I do wish I had the opportunity to see Iman Shumpert on tour. From the fan vids he looks like he crushed it.

Edited Monday at 11:28 PM by Andiethewestie

[RomanKat]

5 hours ago, Andiethewestie said:

Just spitballing -Latin Ballroom would be risk he didn't want. He wanted insurance to make sure he's final 3.

 

FWIW, I'm not seeing signs that the show is blatantly favoring Danny. It's not like "he should have been gone weeks ago, why is he still here?" Also, it's not true that Danny, Stephen, or Ilona can have good semis only at the expense of Chandler or Joey.

My guess: The producers are well-situated. Not only are ABC/Disney affiliated stars Chandler and Joey the best dancers, they both made semis without massive help. There could have been a marathon dance or something, had there been urgent need of score separation. Instead, the judges have been maxing out contestant scores lately, imho. (That not only reduces point spread, it reduces the impact of high scores by diluting differential vote percentages.)

Here's an optimistic take: It's possible that the show can give all remaining stars a positive semis experience, while still producing enough score separation between the top and bottom to ensure that Chandler and Joey advance. The best possible scenario would be for the eliminated couple to leave with their heads high, feeling supported not targeted.

Assuming my guess is correct and Chandler and Joey are in, the judges might cluster Danny, Stephen, Ilona close enough to allow the fan vote to decide who's out. (And if Danny's in, I'd likely enjoy a Witney freestyle over an Alan freestyle, fwiw.) If my guess is off and Chandler or Joey are out, then I'll do a post-mortem. I'm just not ready for a pre-mortem, based on what we've seen.

Edited Tuesday at 01:23 AM by RomanKat

[Andiethewestie]

2 hours ago, RomanKat said:

6 hours ago, Andiethewestie said:

Just spitballing -Latin Ballroom would be risk he didn't want. He wanted insurance to make sure he's final 3.

 

FWIW, I'm not seeing signs that the show is blatantly favoring Danny. It's not like "he should have been gone weeks ago, why is he still here?" Also, it's not true that Danny, Stephen, or Ilona can have good semis only at the expense of Chandler or Joey.

My guess: The producers are well-situated. Not only are ABC/Disney affiliated stars Chandler and Joey the best dancers, they both made semis without massive help. There could have been a marathon dance or something

The favouring of Danny is blatant. He is the first in the history of the show to take a pass on Latin Rhythmic dances. You cannot underestimate the power of getting placement of only those dances that aren't technically judged - contemporary, jazz, ( in a row mind you.which is quite rare, most contestants get one or the other lift heavy dance not both-plus Argentine Tango ) and an instant dance Jive for the third time, when he already danced it twice. Nobody else has got to compete with that kind of familiarity of one dance style.

Carrie Ann miraculously dropping the marks off for any lifts in ballroom dances, why?  A backflip in a Foxtrot would not have been something Len would have approved of.  

And yet if he wasn't called weeks ago there are those who agree he shouldn't still be there, but for the grace of viral TicTok. 

As for help for Chandler of course the Instant Dance helped her. When the judges wouldn't give others appropriate marks for their main dance, (Sharna re-cap judged Stephen at an 8 tops for example instead of wildly inflated 10's)

The judges had to deduct for the rough instant dances, so that by the end of the night the one dancer who could actually improv part of the instant dance to new choreography and came out  5 points ahead of Joey, 6 points ahead of Stephen   8 points ahead of Ilona and 9 points ahead of Danny. With that kind of point spread she should've cleared the bottom easily.
 

But still with the boost she hit bottom 3 for the third time along with Dwight who as we know didn't score well. Without the boost Chandler may well have went home ahead of Dwight, if Dwight scored an 8 instead of a 7. It's that tenuous.

 

 

[RomanKat]

8 hours ago, Andiethewestie said:

The favouring of Danny is blatant. He is the first in the history of the show to take a pass on Latin Rhythmic dances. You cannot underestimate the power of getting placement of only those dances that aren't technically judged - contemporary, jazz

[snip]

And yet if he wasn't called weeks ago there are those who agree he shouldn't still be there, but for the grace of viral TicTok. 
 

OK, we're seeing things differently. Admittedly, I haven't seen the social media reactions you're referencing. Who exactly are these like-minded fans believing was hurt by (Danny's?) TikTok?  (Maybe we should clarify "shows ago" or "eliminations ago", as having one week off ambiguates "weeks ago".)

ETA: I don't know the reason for the lack of rhythmic dance, nor do I automatically process it as clear favoritism. There could be other reasons, especially if celebrity well-being is of greater priority this season.

Quote

As for help for Chandler of course the Instant Dance helped her. When the judges wouldn't give others appropriate marks for their main dance,

[snip]

But still with the boost she hit bottom 3 for the third time along with Dwight who as we know didn't score well. Without the boost Chandler may well have went home ahead of Dwight, if Dwight scored an 8 instead of a 7. It's that tenuous.

Again, we see things differently. I don't consider this scoring scenario to be blatant boosting. The final scoring margins weren't inexplicably huge. Chandler averaged 10's while Dwight averaged 8's. If Chandler needed more help, then the judges could have set lower baselines for several contestants (as you noted). Apparently, they didn't have to.

Edited Tuesday at 10:44 AM by RomanKat

[boyznkatz]

8 hours ago, Andiethewestie said:

 Since social media and viral moments are a recent phenomenon  it obvious the show wants to capitalize on every occurrence. He also was a good player in the Brady era, just got inducted into the Patriots HOF

 

He was a solid player, but he wasn't a superstar like Brady or Mahomes. I don't think the show has any reason to favor him unless he is going on tour, but other people are surely going as well. They have plenty of ABC people they would be more invested in.

[Andiethewestie]

8 hours ago, RomanKat said:

Admittedly, I haven't seen the social media reactions

3 Million views on Tik Tok in one week is definitely going to change the trajectory of the show. Even though this leg lift in Danny and Witney's contemporary is quite common in contemporary dancing and a version of it was done in Iman and Dani's astonishing contemporary two seasons ago, it has not got this kind of attention ever as an isolated movement.  This kind of attention gives Danny not only a huge increase in his fandom which other fanbases envy, good for him, but more concerning for fans of ballroom dancing  is an easy path to appear in command of his dancing. Production changed rules to suit an athlete who can lift or do tricks, instead of learn the techniques of  3 out of 5 Latin Ballroom dances. This has never been done in the history of the show. I believe the medical reasons is a distraction, so many contestants over the years even this year (See Eric Robert's Cha Cha) have danced injured, or with chronic osteo issues that affect range of motion that to think a medical pass is necessary for a guy who played football hurt or could manage a backflip in a Foxtrot almost comical.

But just looking at amazing tricks, Dwight is better at it, however the show made sure he also got a mix of standard and rhythmic Latin which is what took him out. Danny is not getting this kind of scrutiny, and is only finally getting a social Latin Salsa at the semi finals which is not judged at the same level of technical specifics that a Cha Cha or a Rumba is.  It appears the show is fine with phasing out dances that so many fans looked forward to. Social dances have come and went on DWTS, but now core Latin Ballroom is affected.

 

8 hours ago, RomanKat said:

I don't consider this scoring scenario to be blatant boosting

Everyone who wasn't Chandler hated the Instant Challenge because they and their fans knew the challenge was too much for them.  It significantly moved the needle in terms of their ranking. Before the challenge everyone but Dwight was within a 3 point margin that can easily overcome Chandler's fanbase. After the challenge the point margin increased by 5-9 points which is more than statistically significant when calculating the final number. Alarming for Chandler is that while she only needed to clear Dwight's numbers to advance, being in the bottom for the third time meant she barely did so. 
 

Then the huge backlash of racist and misogynistic comments reared its ugly head so much so that DWTS had to remove over a 1000 comments on Chandler's DWTS feed, unfortunately after Chandler saw it, which is history repeating itself from last season. 

So regardless if you think the Instant dance was there to help Chandler or not, I personally thought it was a challenge to balance out the trick based dancing - she hasn't had an easy ride.

 

 

 

[Andiethewestie]

8 hours ago, boyznkatz said:

He was a solid player, but he wasn't a superstar like Brady or Mahomes. I don't think the show has any reason to favor

He didn't play Quarterback he caught balls from the GOAT Tom Brady, and did get an MVP award in one of the Patriots championship seasons. A little better than solid but not a superstar like Emmit Smith agreed.

 

The favouritism stems from the viral TikTok that has exploded this season all those views and likes are unprecedented in the history of DWTS and has significantly increased viewership particularly amongst the youth demographic that the show has been chasing for years.Production wants to keep Danny for as long as possible, and I believe the rules have been bent to make sure that happens.

[boyznkatz]

Actually I don't think they are manipulating the outcome like they usually do. They seem to be leaving it up to the fans this year. That's going to result in worse dancing. FWIW I think the fans should be the ones to decide, although I'm always going to like the good dancers. I just haven't had much interest this season because the dancing isn't good.

I still think Ilona is going to win. She is everywhere these days. 

Edited Tuesday at 02:38 PM by boyznkatz

[Andiethewestie]

2 hours ago, boyznkatz said:

I still think Ilona is going to win. She is everywhere these days. 

She has by far the most on line fans. It isn't even close

Just now, Andiethewestie said:

She has by far the most on line fans. It isn't even close

 

2 hours ago, boyznkatz said:

Actually I don't think they are manipulating the outcome like they usually do

I think there is always manipulation but this season it's helps a weak dancer who imho wouldn't have got to the semis without it.

[Andiethewestie]

From the New York Times:

Producers learned that everything is content. These days on set, producers are focusing as much on shooting for other platforms as they do for TV. The “D.W.T.S.” social media team comes into rehearsals every day to capture content, like a behind the scenes blooper reel that currently has over 6 million views on the show’s official TikTok. Staffers also post videos and pictures to social media on show days to encourage fan voting. For the show’s 500th episode, which aired last week, two of the professional dancers who have been eliminated this season — Emma Slater and Ezra Sosa — went live on the official “D.W.T.S.” TikTok page during the second half of the episode, when they showed behind the scenes of couples rehearsing, reactions in the ballroom and live commentated on an instant dance challenge. Green sees the use of social media as a “virtuous circle”: Though each episode runs two hours, the dance performances are a minute long — about the average length of a TikTok video.

Viral performance moments give a lift. This season’s unexpected front-runner pairing is Danny Amendola, the former New England Patriots receiver, and Witney Carson, a pro in her 13th season. The pair have gotten lots of praise from judges and viewers alike for their choreography, but their routines have a life outside the show, too. In Week 5, the duo performed a contemporary piece to “Unsteady” by X Ambassadors that became an instant sensation. In it, Amendola lifts Carson from the floor, pulling her up by an ankle. People tried to recreate the move in TikTok posts; on the dwtsofficial TikTok page, the video of the dance has over 12 million views. “We really didn’t know until we were scrolling on TikTok that everybody was doing it,” Carson said. The former “Bachelor” . And while these viral moments help the show, Carson said she doesn’t choreograph with that in mind. Instead, she tries to create “wow moments” in her dances, which become viral as a happy accident. “I’m thinking about the audience thinking ‘this could be a really great moment’ in every single routine that I do.”

 

 

4 minutes ago, Andiethewestie said:

From the New York Times:

Producers learned that everything is content. These days on set, producers are focusing as much on shooting for other platforms as they do for TV. The “D.W.T.S.” social media team comes into rehearsals every day to capture content, like a behind the scenes blooper reel that currently has over 6 million views on the show’s official TikTok. Staffers also post videos and pictures to social media on show days to encourage fan voting. For the show’s 500th episode, which aired last week, two of the professional dancers who have been eliminated this season — Emma Slater and Ezra Sosa — went live on the official “D.W.T.S.” TikTok page during the second half of the episode, when they showed behind the scenes of couples rehearsing, reactions in the ballroom and live commentated on an instant dance challenge. Green sees the use of social media as a “virtuous circle”: Though each episode runs two hours, the dance performances are a minute long — about the average length of a TikTok video.

Viral performance moments give a lift. This season’s unexpected front-runner pairing is Danny Amendola, the former New England Patriots receiver, and Witney Carson, a pro in her 13th season. The pair have gotten lots of praise from judges and viewers alike for their choreography, but their routines have a life outside the show, too. In Week 5, the duo performed a contemporary piece to “Unsteady” by X Ambassadors that became an instant sensation. In it, Amendola lifts Carson from the floor, pulling her up by an ankle. People tried to recreate the move in TikTok posts; on the dwtsofficial TikTok page, the video of the dance has over 12 million views. “We really didn’t know until we were scrolling on TikTok that everybody was doing it,” Carson said. The former “Bachelor” . And while these viral moments help the show, Carson said she doesn’t choreograph with that in mind. Instead, she tries to create “wow moments” in her dances, which become viral as a happy accident. “I’m thinking about the audience thinking ‘this could be a really great moment’ in every single routine that I do.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/11/19/arts/television/dancing-with-the-stars-tiktok-gen-z.html

 

 

[Andiethewestie]

So was looking at another message board. It seems a lot of fans were upset at how certain fans of other contestants went into Chandler's feed to leave untoward comments and she may have picked up support from the on-line community. I guess we will know tonight.

[RomanKat]

On 11/19/2024 at 11:37 AM, Andiethewestie said:

From the New York Times:

Producers learned that everything is content. These days on set, producers are focusing as much on shooting for other platforms as they do for TV. The “D.W.T.S.” social media team comes into rehearsals every day to capture content, [...] Staffers also post videos and pictures to social media on show days to encourage fan voting. For the show’s 500th episode, which aired last week, two of the professional dancers who have been eliminated this season — Emma Slater and Ezra Sosa — went live on the official “D.W.T.S.” TikTok page [...]

Viral performance moments give a lift. This season’s unexpected front-runner pairing is Danny Amendola, the former New England Patriots receiver, and Witney Carson, a pro in her 13th season.[...]

Thank you for posting the article. I don't participate in TikTok enough to assess it's effects on votership. (Hardly at all.) However, I do remember Rylee-Harry going viral last year--because there was news about it going viral--and figured that played into the Rylee-Stephen pairing. So even though I don't participate in TikTok, I figured it had some influence in producer decisions, TikTok being the trendiest social media.

Same thing happened with Twitter in the past. "Twitter impressions" became a thing in measures of TV viewer engagement, with even Nielsen getting involved, and all of a sudden DWTS was having Twitter voting challenges every week. That stopped when media corporations realized there was no money to be made in "Twitter impressions".

To simplify the argument that DWTS may be favoring Danny & Witney: They get TikTok views, and that could potentially translate into money (or season 34) for themselves or the network. That could also influence the producers choice of dance styles: To help Witney create those social media "moments" she speaks of. That's more plausible, and kinder, than accusing Danny of dictating dance styles to get himself a spot in the finals. JMO

I've seen DWTS encourage voting for all contestants on Twitter and Instagram, so I'll assume it's the same on TikTok. FWIW, Rylee & Harry didn't make the finals, despite their TikTok popularity. ETA: YouTube views, Instagram followers, Twitter likes, etc. have never been reliable indicators of voting. Also, I'm not convinced that Danny needed extra fandom to pass most of the eliminated contestants. Jenn, maybe, but I'm not aware of Bachelor Nation blaming Danny and TikTok for her elimination. (Do they?)

Circling back to Instant Dances: I'm not denying that they created separation. However, the producers know the voting patterns this season. They could have used the first dance to create separation. They used the Instant Dance. All that matters are the final scoring percentage margins, and those weren't exaggerated, nor were placements illogical.

For reference, these were the scoring percentage margins between Chandler and the other contestants after the Instant Dance: Joey 1.6%, Stephen 1.9%, Ilona 2.5%, Danny 2.8%, Dwight 3.8%. Chandler needed to beat one contestant, and Dwight was the target. The only thing we know for sure is that he did not get 3.8% more votes than Chandler, nor enough to overtake anyone else. With five celebrities remaining, the same week 8 scores would yield the following margins: Joey 1.8%, Stephen 2.2%, Ilona 2.9%, Danny 3.3%. (Sorry for getting technical. It's as much for my own reference.)

Presuming the producers want Chandler (and Joey) in the finals, they'll do what they can to create the separation they need, as reasonably as possible. Should they need to "target" anyone, I would normally guess the lowest projected vote getter among Stephen, Ilona, Danny. Based on what you've posted, maybe it's the lowest social media impact instead. We can guess more, should they actually target anyone tonight. They might just cluster them, and let the fans decide.

Edited Wednesday at 09:25 PM by RomanKat

[Andiethewestie]

Just to confirm Production organized the dances for Danny and he accepted without complaint. 

[FilmTVGeek80]

On 11/14/2024 at 12:11 PM, boyznkatz said:

I honestly don't remember a single dance that Whitney or Alan ever did.

I disagree. In fact, watching this week's episode, I specifically thought about how far Whitney's come as a choreographer. I thought if she had a dancer who got emote/performer better, salsa would have been an all-around amazing dance, not just a lift fest. I remember many of her dances with Alfonso and Milo Manheim and a few of her great ones with Frankie Muniz.

On 11/14/2024 at 9:33 AM, boyznkatz said:

I think Len Goodman's passing really affected the show. He kept the scores in check. He would have never given some of this garbage 10s. I think people know they can just get a 10 easily now, so they don't really try anymore.

Again, I don't think that's true. Actually, they've become stingier with 10s in the last few seasons. There were times people would roll their eyes because contestants were getting tens in week 4. I believe Alfonso got his first 10s - a perfect 30 (actually, it was a 40 because that week viewers could give their scores, and he was the only dancer that viewers gave a 10) for his week four Jazz (the Carlton dance.) Though that was absolutely deserving. I can't remember when the first perfect score was handed out last year (it might have been for one of the team dances), and the first 10s were not long before that. This year, Chandler didn't get the first perfect score until the quarter-finals, which is a week after Dwight got the first 10 because Carrie-Ann went crazy with the 10s on Halloween night.