S05.E01: See No Evil

[Whimsy]

Audrey, Nathan and Duke's victory over William feels hollow as they deal with the aftermath of Duke on death's door. Mara is in control of Audrey's body, and a strange trouble supernaturally silencing citizens all over town.

[bmoore4026]

So, the black stuff that Mara and William were using to create the Troubles was dark matter, essentially?  Eh, I'll take it.

 

And as prolific as Stephen King is, you'd think that he'd come up with a better term for a dimensional wall than "thinnie".

[Whimsy]

I've been waiting and waiting for this show to come back!

Yeah, "thinner" really bothered me. Also, the wig poor Emily Rose had to wear also bothered me.

Not sure what to think yet. I'll wait to hear you guys' input before I comment further. I just was so happy it's back!

[Cardie]

Haven still attracts tourists? Really?

 

I didn't quite understand how Duke's blood was letting loose the "terminated" Troubles.  Did he have to bleed on or interact with someone?

 

Since Mara does retain the memories of all the Haven helpers, that's obviously going to be how her evil Maraness is brought to heel.

[wanderingstar]

Loved seeing everyone again. I have such affection for these characters that even if they'd all stayed in that cave reading passages from Jennifer's vampire novel, I would still have been happy to see them all again.

 

I'm already tired of Mara's sneer and laugh, but hopefully they don't make her always one step ahead of our heroes. That will get old fast.

 

So, if Mara's not causing the sewed eyes Trouble, who is?

Edited September 12, 2014 by Gillian Rosh

[anstar]

So, if Mara's not causing the sewed eyes Trouble, who is?

Duke. Now instead of curing Troubles, Crocker blood seems to reactivate one.  When he came out of the cave, he was still bleeding. He smeared some of his blood on a rock or something; they made sure to show it on camera.  Dwight and Duke figured it out near the end, when Duke accidentally told Dwight that Mara created the Troubles.

 

I nearly panicked when Dwight went into the morgue and Gloria was passed out in that chair.  I thought a Trouble had gotten her. Thank goodness she was just sleeping. (Dwight looked worried too.)

 

 

 

Also, the wig poor Emily Rose had to wear also bothered me.

I didn't notice hers, but Eric Balfour's wig was horrible!  It looked like a squirrel tail stuck to the back of his head.

 

Mara has been atoning for her crimes as a "Haven Saver" for 500 years?  I wonder if it was supposed to be an eternal punishment, or if it could have ended if she'd learned her lesson.

Edited September 12, 2014 by anstar

[johntfs]

So, the black stuff that Mara and William were using to create the Troubles was dark matter, essentially?  Eh, I'll take it.

 

And as prolific as Stephen King is, you'd think that he'd come up with a better term for a dimensional wall than "thinnie".

 

Well, the stuff was dark and apparently matter, so, yeah, dark matter is close enough.  Thinnie is a term SK used back in his Gunslinger series.

 

I did like how much Emily Rose seemed to enjoy letting out her inner "evil spoiled brat" and that Mara has if anything only gotten worse over time.

 

I do like that they haven't immediately forgotten that Jennifer existed like they have for some characters who died/vanished.

Edited September 12, 2014 by johntfs

[Shanna Marie]

I did like how much Emily Rose seemed to enjoy letting out her inner "evil spoiled brat" and that Mara has if anything only gotten worse over time.

Yeah, the fun just seemed to radiate off her, she was so gleeful. Though the weird thing was how modern and colloquial her language is -- and I'd noticed the same thing with William. I guess they're keeping up with the times? But even in the previous episode's flashback, they were saying stuff like "yeah." I wouldn't necessarily want them talking like the King James Bible, but they shouldn't be talking like 21st century Americans. Mara could possibly have a mix of all her lives. She did seem to have a couple of phrases that seemed dated for Audrey, and there were a couple of moments when she sounded kind of like Sarah.

 

Things are going to get really interesting if not only are there the regular Troubled people, but there are also all the Troubles Duke is releasing. I wonder how they're going to deal with that. Do they have to talk Duke down each week?

 

I find it amusing how easily Nathan was felled with a gunshot this time. He's taken fatal shots and stayed on his feet longer than that, and then there was the season three finale in which he took multiple shots, was still on his feet and apparently carried Jordan to safety and helped deal with a Trouble before he got any medical attention. Now, one shot and he's on the ground and soon passed out entirely. But not to worry. I have a feeling he'll be back on his feet in the next episode and running around with a bloody shoulder, perfectly okay, and with no hint of an injury by the episode after that, and next time we see him shirtless, there will be no scar. Not to mention what's likely his second concussion in one day -- the goo goons bashed him in the head and he was barely conscious when he was trying to tranquilize William, and then Mara bashed him in the head and knocked him out. If he were a football player, he'd be sitting out a couple of games. Maybe it was the head injuries catching up with him that knocked him out when he got shot.

 

And Mara couldn't bring herself to kill him, so maybe he's not wrong. Even so, much as I love the guy, I was ready to shoot him myself by the end of the episode. There's faith, and then there's unrealistic and blind.

 

I'm thinking that Dave is the one closing the portals. That's what he's up to in his sleep/dreams.

[Cardie]

Now, one shot and he's on the ground and soon passed out entirely

 

Something Mara said led me to believe that being shot by the entity would hurt him just like her touch does.

 

Agree that Dave is closing the thinnies. I don't think anyone not from "over there" could do it.

[anstar]

I'm thinking that Dave is the one closing the portals. That's what he's up to in his sleep/dreams.

That's what I'm thinking too. Did something come through that 'door' and throw them all out before destroying the lighthouse (again)? In Dave's dream's it looks like they are all backing away from something and I can't tell if it's supposed to be something he's remembering or not.

 

Even so, much as I love the guy, I was ready to shoot him myself by the end of the episode. There's faith, and then there's unrealistic and blind.

Agreed!  In other circumstances, you'd have to feel a little sorry for Mara.  If a bullet to the chest doesn't convince you that she wants to break up, what will?

[Shanna Marie]

If a bullet to the chest doesn't convince you that she wants to break up, what will?

Alas, I don't think it will convince him because she didn't kill him. She tried and couldn't pull the trigger again, so dear, deluded Nathan will be convinced that there was some part of Audrey that wouldn't let her kill him (never mind leaving him to die). Duke and Dwight need to stage a massive intervention as soon as they get a free moment.

 

Did something come through that 'door' and throw them all out before destroying the lighthouse (again)?

It seemed like it. I wonder what that could be. Probably nothing good, knowing this town. Poor lighthouse. Is that the same one the Chief crumbled?

 

Oh, and from the spoiler thread, it looks like we guessed right on all the teaser lines except the lighthouse one, which was said by Gloria instead of Duke, but I figure Gloria and Duke are kindred spirits. I liked the little tidbit about Lucassi working on a screenplay. He's become far more interesting in his absence than he was when he was actually on the show.

[KayElektra]

I love Nathan to death, but he's never been the brightest crayon in the box.  This ep was the worst, though...he's randomly looking around for Audrey/Mara to show up...as he sits there in a BRIGHT BLUE truck in the middle of nowhere.  Super stealthy, former sherriff.

 

Also, that rock in the middle of nowhere that somehow came closer to the truck in low tide (while the sand was perfectly dry)?  Awesome.

Edited September 12, 2014 by KayElektra

[Wheels08]

Okay I love Nathan but why is his love so blind?  I mean he was saying Audrey was still in there when there was no evidence to support that she was. Someone needs to talk to him.

 

And Dwight is going to be po'd with Nathan for not telling him the whole truth.

 

And Mara better run from Duke. That confrontation is going to be intense. There's no telling what he'll do when he gets near her. Also now the troubles are coming out of him. I wonder what everyone's going to do to stop them.

 

I will end this post by saying how much I love Mara. Emily Rose did an awesome job at playing her. an we keep her?

[Tabbyclaw]

Well, I'm excited. Don't really have thoughts right now -- it's been a bit of a brain-dead day -- but I have the excitement. Emily Rose is clearly having the time of her life and I'm loving it, and about every ten minutes something made me go, "...oh God." as a realization hit. So, yeah. Fascinated, anticipating what's coming next, and wondering why it's not next Thursday yet.

[babs1226]

I am happy that Haven is back.  I can't wait to see what happens next.  But the name everyone kept calling the Emily Rose character is Maura, not Mara.  Just saying....

[Cardie]

It depends where you live. I would pronounce Maura MORE-a, whereas they are saying MARR-a.

[coppersin]

Haven still attracts tourists? Really?

 

*raises hand* I'd goes because of the troubles - at least vacation isn't dull there. I can't be the only tourist with a lack of self-preservation.

 

Did something come through that 'door' and throw them all out before destroying the lighthouse (again)? In Dave's dream's it looks like they are all backing away from something and I can't tell if it's supposed to be something he's remembering or not.

 

Since Dave was remembering from the p.o.v. of the terrifying thing, I'm thinking he's either psychically linked to it, or it's him. Maybe spending time near the portal brought out something latent in him.

 

I don't mind Nathan/Audrey, but his True Love schtick has worn out its welcome. It's making me miss William and his cheery evilness even more. I know Colin Ferguson is busy on Vampire Diaries this fall, but we need at least a few non-flashback episodes of William and Mara raising hell.

 

Poor Duke. And Dwight, with the bullets and the tasering and the putting up with Nathan's nonsense.

[bmoore4026]

I do like that they haven't immediately forgotten than Jennifer existed like they have for some characters who died/vanished.

 

Ball's in your court, Under the Dome.

[Shanna Marie]

But the name everyone kept calling the Emily Rose character is Maura, not Mara.  Just saying....

They spell it "Mara" in all the promotional materials. So that's apparently the official spelling, and pronunciation depends on where you're from and individual preference (I know people who spell their name the same way I do but pronounce it differently).

 

The Chief always said that Nathan had problems seeing what was right in front of him. He's always been bad about believing what he wants to believe and then being hurt and disappointed when the truth turns out to be different. Denial is his superpower. He did seem to be kind of right there at the end because she couldn't make herself kill him, and she didn't have any trouble shooting the pothead at the coffee shop. It would probably go better for everyone if he turns out to be right and they can get Audrey back or bring out Mara's inner Audrey (and maybe Sarah and the others) to the point that her behavior is influenced by all her past experiences. But I have a feeling he's going to get himself into a lot more trouble and put a lot of others at risk while persisting in this plan.

 

We may be on track for the Longest Day Ever in Haven. The last two episodes of season four took place on the same day (dealing with the baby, then going to the lighthouse). This episode continues that day, and it looks likely to spill into yet another episode. So that's four episodes (at least) to cover a single day.

 

Nice bit of continuity: the baby was wrapped up in the airplane blankie when Gloria was holding him in the gazebo. When the dad went to go get a blanket for him (and to get shot by Duke), Gloria told him to get the blanket with airplanes on it. I hope they keep the thread of Gloria trying to raise Aaron going -- not too much, and not necessarily in every episode, but just the occasional reminder that this crusty old bat (and I mean that in a very positive way because I utterly adore Gloria) is trying to bring up an infant. Bonus points if she makes Nathan hold the baby while she's doing work in the morgue. Not that you have to "make" Nathan hold a baby. But it would be a fun visual if he's holding a baby while she's pointing out what's crazy about the latest corpse.

[Cardie]

I'm worried about the baby and Gloria's safety because Duke's new Trouble restoration condition could make his crying lethal again.

[Julie23]

So glad Haven is back!  Although I think Mara and her evilness is going to get old real fast. It seems a little over the top to me. Fun for an episode or two, but hopefully not all season long. I get it, she's evil, but even villains can be beaten every once in a while. Hard to believe two seasoned law men let her get the drop on them so easily.

[Shadda2]

So I finally signed up here.  I'm always a little late to the party.

 

Interesting episode.  Mara and the whole evil for the sake of being evil is just about as boring as any story line can get.  Give me a reason or just go away.  Is there a chance that the essence of all of the Haven Savers is the true Mara and this evil persona is something the Dark Matter (for lack of a better name) has created?  It seems that the more that Nathan calls on Audrey to come out the more irritated and worried Mara becomes.   It this point I see no other strategy that anyone else has come up with for combating her.  I suppose they could just kill her, but then that will probably mean the troubles will go on forever.  Not just every 27 years, but forever. 

 

I was surprised when Nathan pointed out that Mara hadn't given any new troubles.  I hadn't even noticed that and yet it's a very important point.  She can't do it without the Dark Matter.  So one of the goals is keep her from finding the blasted stuff.  

 

Both Duke and Nathan talked about Mara being the only way to end the troubles.  That does seem like the only out of this mess so getting Audrey to resurface sounds like their only option at this point.  The problem is even if Audrey does resurface she may not know what Mara knows so won't necessarily be able to end it all.  And if we spend the next 25 episodes wondering if it's Mara or Audrey talking I'll just shoot myself.  Well not really.  I'll just move on and watch the series final when it finally comes my way. 

 

My poor Duke.  My heart breaks for him.  I want Jennifer back and I want her back now, but I have a feeling we won't ever see her again.  Boo.   

[Elsinore]

I get Nathan's persistence now. Pretty sure it's why she couldn't kill him. Even if she wanted to. As annoying as it might be, he is doing it for a reason. Random chapstick flashback notwithstanding. I liked Nathan in this episode and I didn't think the pining was over the top.

 

It was an okay season premiere. Better then 301 and Fallout in any case.

 

I liked Mara's frustration at not being able to open the special effects curtain. I liked her frustration and demeanour in general. And the facial expressions.

 

So glad we're not giving up on Jennifer yet.

 

Felt sorry for Dwight because he is indeed the last to know everything. I don't think the original story of how the Troubles work is included in the Guard Welcome Package. Nor is the exact reason for the existence of the Guard. I mean, they are there to keep Mara and William and whoever else OUT, right? Or perhaps the mantra got skewed over time.

[Cardie]

The black goo was not defined by Mara as being dark matter but as being aether, the "fifth element" from classic Greek science:

According to ancient and medieval science, aether (Greek αἰθήρ aithēr[1]), also spelled æther or ether, also called quintessence, is the material that fills the region of the universe above the terrestrial sphere. The concept of aether was used in several theories to explain several natural phenomena, such as the traveling of light and gravity.

 

[johntfs]

 

Though the weird thing was how modern and colloquial her language is -- and I'd noticed the same thing with William. I guess they're keeping up with the times? But even in the previous episode's flashback, they were saying stuff like "yeah." I wouldn't necessarily want them talking like the King James Bible, but they shouldn't be talking like 21st century Americans.

 

I don't remember the author or book title but I recall an author foreward in a book set in medieval (or fantasy medieval) times stating that he deliberately had the characters speaking in modern, colloquial English because that's what they would have been like with each other and that clarity of meaning was more important than "verbal set dressings" of "thee, thou and forsooth."  Aside from all that, Mara and William are magical beings.  Instant, perfect assimilation of the most up-to-date language and culture, including idioms, is kind of a "par for the course" ability for them.

 

Agree about Nathan trying (and partly succeeding) in using the power of "twu wuv" against Mara.  In truth, one of the more interesting challenges Nathan is going to face is finding a way to love and care about Mara.  As much as it sucks for him, Mara is kind of right.  She's the core entity.  Audrey is more of an aspect or possibility of Mara.  Nathan can't simply push for that one aspect to take over.  He's going to have to love the whole (spoiled, vindictive, sociopathic) person to help bring Audrey out.

 

As far as Mara shooting Nathan and him feeling pain, I figure that at fairly short range, she has the ability to manipulate people's Troubles to her advantage.  So, when fighting Nathan, she can make her blows hurt him worse and can make him feel the impact of her bullets.  Likewise, when Dwight is around guns, the bullets mostly seemed to hit him when there was a real potential for them to do so.  Mara enhanced that Trouble to the extent that when she fired bullets in the opposite direction of him, they actually turned around in midflight and struck Dwight.

Edited September 12, 2014 by johntfs

[Tabbyclaw]

"Mara" and "Maura" (and "Moira," to muddle the pot further) are different names and shouldn't be expected to be pronounced the same.

 

 

I'm worried about the baby and Gloria's safety because Duke's new Trouble restoration condition could make his crying lethal again.

 

I had that thought for half a second, but they specified that the Troubles are now being caused by Duke, not the original families. So after all the times I've accused the show of weaponizing Eric Balfour's ability to play heartbroken, now they've done it literally.

[Amelie06]

I didn't really enjoy this episode. Much like I didn't enjoy most of last season. Evil Mara was absurdly evil.  Her insane glee at torturing Dwight wasn't even amusing. I need slightly more subtle characterization. Given how batshit crazy she acts, I can't understand why the people of Haven didn't go all "Burn the witch" 500 years ago.

 

What is the deal with Audrey and Nathan's dullard son? Is he dead? Did Nathan kill him? If so, why hasn't this been mentioned? Do they just want us to forget all about this ickiness?

[Cardie]

They left James in the barn because otherwise he'd die. Where he is now isn't certain.

[AudienceofOne]

but his True Love schtick has worn out its welcome

 

 

Look, I was bored as I often am when a show suddenly decides to be EPIC and especially when that EPICness is undermined by Twu Wuv. I actually found the whole thing tiresome. Part of my problem, I think, was that I found it hard to believe that Mara could remember 500 years of being somebody driven to help people and still be EVIL. And she was  - tiresomely. I mean, for want of a less clichéd way of putting it, what is her motivation? Who is she and where did she come from? Why did she create the Troubles? Who cursed her? It's season 5 and I feel like this is something we should know.

[johntfs]

 

Part of my problem, I think, was that I found it hard to believe that Mara could remember 500 years of being somebody driven to help people and still be EVIL.

 

I didn't really have a problem with that aspect because she was "driven to help" people.  It wasn't her choice.  She was forced to do that.  For me, Mara seemed too... detached and gleeful.  I recall fantasy stories where a wizard forces a demon to do his bidding.  When the demon inevitably breaks free from the wizard's control it invariably tries to destroy the wizard along with anyone and anything for which he cares.  Mara has been that enslaved "demon" for a very long time.  I'd've figured she'd want to annihilate Haven and wreak some terrible vengeance on those who enslaved her.  And then go somewhere else and play.  As is, all she seems to want to do is find her special toys and starting playing again.

Edited September 13, 2014 by johntfs

[StarBrand]

Welcome back, show!

 

I'm not sure how long they're going to go with this "Mara" has taken over thing. The question seems to be just when-and how-Audrey takes back over. The last scene would indicate that it might already be happening. Given Nathan's insistence that Audrey wouldn't "let" Mara kill him, it was a bit surprising that she actually did. But then Nathan was all "I'll love you, Parker", and then something happened. I'm not sure if she was physically unable to pull the trigger, or just felt something very odd in her. Maybe both. 

 

I wonder if the end result will be Nathan and the gang getting Audrey back, but at the cost of being able to end the troubles for good. As for right now, Audrey better come back before Dwight and/or Duke do something. That might turn out to be a good thing-I think the Mara personality has to "die", for Audrey to take over again.

 

I'm sad that we won't be seeing Jennifer this year (EB pretty much confirmed it on twitter). I liked her delightfully goofy character. Although I would really not like her absence take all the funny out of Duke. On that matter, I liked how, when Nathan told him that Mara took down Dwight, he said he'd "never let him hear the end of it".

 

Yeah, Dave's sealing the pathways. I wonder if Mara's figured that out already, as she was legitimately surprised everyone knew where the soft spots were.

 

All in all, nice to have this show back. :)

Edited September 13, 2014 by StarBrand

[catray]

Well at least with Jennifer mysteriously vanished, there is a chance she could show up later in the season. I'll take that over her being dead. No body, no death. I agree that it is probably Dave closing the thinnies, but they might need Jennifer to reopen them or getting a message across.

I think Emily Rose is having a good time playing Mara, and it's a nice change up, for the moment. Like Shadda (and others), I hope Mara gets a little more chararterization aside from "I'm evil, mwahahahaha" which seems to be all we see right now. It's going to wear thin pretty fast if that's all we get.

Glad the show is back!

[mybabyaidan]

I admit, I love Nathan/Audrey, but I laughed really hard when she shot him.   Even I got annoyed with all the "I know Audrey is still in there" crap.  I mean, of course she is, but you were asking for it Nathan. 

 

Shall I turn in my shipper card?? 

 

I need to re watch and collect more thoughts.

 

Edited September 13, 2014 by mybabyaidan

[BlueJay81]

Found the episode fast moving and quite interesting. Nice to see Dwight getting to do a bit more acting wise. I think Howard sealed the thinnies as a precaution, just like he had Jennifer as back up. I think there may be more like her.

I like Mara so far, you can tell Emily Rose is enjoying it and it's the most lively she's seemed in a long time. Hope we do get more depth to her character because being evil just for the fun of it is boring. It's interesting that Mara said William hid the black goo from her. Why would he do that?  William could make that box appear out of thin air, why can't Mara do the same?

Nathan wasn't as annoying as I expected, found Duke's search for Jennifer more annoying. Even if Audrey does make a reappearance she is going to have a very hard time dealing with the fact that she just killed and tortured people. And why can't Mara become Lucy or Sarah or whoever else she's been in the last 500 years.

Timeline /continuity error How could Duke's grandfather have murdered the woman with the sewing trouble in 1929 (Roy would have been a baby if he was even born then) I guess they meant great grandfather.

This show certainly has a different feel to it now, in season 1 it seemed like a simple small town supernatural mystery now we have 'thinnies' and other worlds and possibly aliens, I still want to know about Lucy, the necklace she gave to Duke, who killed the Colorado Kid

Edited September 13, 2014 by BlueJay81

[pcta]

Nathan is still borrrrriinng.

Dave is doing something in his morphine induced comma. Is he responsible for the doors being deactivated?

Poor Duke.

Mara could get on my last nerve pretty soon. Is she gleefully evil (that would be OK). Or is she a villain with angst (not killing Nathan)? Or is she suffering the worst case of bipolar disorder known to man?

[Sakura12]

Well, I see Nathan is still as annoying as ever. I was waiting for Mara, Duke or even Dwight to knock him out after his 1000th whine about Audrey still being in there and loving him. She probably is (along with 500 other people) but that doesn't mean it's smart to keep using that as your only defense. 

 

Dwight had a right to know what's going on, even if it means him trying to take down Mara. 

 

 

 

I'm not sure how long they're going to go with this "Mara" has taken over thing.

 

Mara hasn't taken over anything, it's her body and her mind. Audrey (and everyone else) took over her body and pushed her mind down. I hope they do give Mara more of a backstory and motivation before letting Audrey come back because of tru wuv. 

 

I'm going to guess at some point Duke is going to think of sacrificing himself to stop the troubles inside of him from being released. 

Edited September 14, 2014 by Sakura12

[Tabbyclaw]

I'd've figured she'd want to annihilate Haven and wreak some terrible vengeance on those who enslaved her.  And then go somewhere else and play.  As is, all she seems to want to do is find her special toys and starting playing again.

 

Why would she want to destroy Haven? It's her playground and her battleground. The entire town is still ruled by its fear of what she created, and once she finds the aether she'll be able to control the Troubles even further. She's on her way to being the top of the heap again, which she wants for reasons that are as-yet unknown to us. She keeps saying that she and William still have work to do, that the Troubles have worked out the way they wanted them to and that they're going to get even "better." There's clearly a plan here, she's just indulging herself in tormenting the people she was "forced" to be friends with for the past year while she puts all its pieces together.

[icandigit]

 

As much as it sucks for him, Mara is kind of right.  She's the core entity.  Audrey is more of an aspect or possibility of Mara.  Nathan can't simply push for that one aspect to take over.  He's going to have to love the whole (spoiled, vindictive, sociopathic) person to help bring Audrey out.

That's the issue I'm dealing with now with all this. She may be evil, but that is who she is. There's a part of me that misses and wants Audrey back. But, my brain keeps going back to the fact that she is Mara and  Audrey was something imposed on her. I hope they deal with all of that in a satisfying way.

 

I wasn't really excited about watching the episode at first, but I ended up loving it. I thought I would get annoyed with Nathan's quest for Audrey but I didn't. But, the season is still young. I think Dwight is the character I'm really excited about now. Nathan is still my favorite but I can tell I'm going to be bored by his storyline. I feel a little fatigue from all the hell they put Duke through. I know he can take it, but can't the guy catch a break.

[kat165]

I'm rewatching last season and enjoying it more than I did the first time around. I loathed Duke's brother, William was annoying as hell (although I like the actor) & I pretty much hated the whole Mara/William black blobs of trouble storyline. So I was looking forward to this season with mixed feelings. Excited because basically I love the show & dreading it because I dislike Mara and Nathan's true love issues. But this episode was surprisingly exciting & energetic. Mara's evilness is going to get tiresome real fast even though Emily Rose seems to be enjoying herself. I've been rewatching from the beginning for the past month or so & I've concluded that Emily Rose isn't the best of actors which I didn't really notice the first time around. Now her one note acting really stands out & I dread her repeating Mara's evilness for more than an episode or two.

 

I didn't like Jennifer at first, but by the end of the season I liked what she & Duke had and so I miss her this season. If they brought Kelton (Jordan) (another limited actress) back for a 2nd reason wny couldn't they bring Jennifer back?

 

I'd still like to know what Vince's trouble is.

 

And why did we go through 2 seasons of the Colorado Kid mystery only to have it end up being nothing (he was killed with the barn)? I'd love to see more background on Lucy. And I hope we're not going to spend the next few eps watching everyone chase Mara around the woods trying to STOP HER.

[Wheels08]

I didn't like Jennifer at first, but by the end of the season I liked what she & Duke had and so I miss her this season. If they brought Kelton (Jordan) (another limited actress) back for a 2nd reason why couldn't they bring Jennifer back?

Quote

 

The reason they couldn't bring Jennifer back is because the actress wanted to left the show.

[BlueJay81]

I just hope the true love conquers all thing will turn out to be more interesting and  not the trite Nathan loves Audrey so much that Mara transforms completely. That would really be disappointing IMO.

Having Audrey at the expense of suppressing Mara also doesn't work because that is who is she is and there would always be a possibility that she could come back. They  need to either redeem Mara or get rid of her for good which may mean killing her and  the possibility of Audrey too.

I think Dave has been affected/possessed by the great force that escaped when the door was opened. His dreams seemed to suggest that all of them were afraid of 'it' including Mara. Maybe Mara's behavior is influenced by this great evil or she and William are doing what they are doing to protect themselves at the expense of the people of Haven. When Nathan asked why she needed the aether she asked why he needed his gun, I think it's for protection from whatever they are also afraid of.

Edited September 14, 2014 by BlueJay81

[Enigma X]

My opinion is that Mara (and William) became old last season. I like my villains with less moustache twirling. 

 

With that said, the episode was ok but really hope that we move on from this Mara thing soon. 

[shapeshifter]

I did like how much Emily Rose seemed to enjoy letting out her inner "evil spoiled brat" and that Mara has if anything only gotten worse over time.

I wondered if Emily was maybe deliberately or subconsciously channelling Agnes Morehead's Endora of Bewitched for Mara's personna.

Things are going to get really interesting if not only are there the regular Troubled people, but there are also all the Troubles Duke is releasing. I wonder how they're going to deal with that. Do they have to talk Duke down each week?

Nah, Gloria can just give him a shot of some sort of blood clotting agent. Let's just hope it's done in time to prevent Duke from offing himself first. Or is his bad wig a sign that he's going to die? This is the last season, right? They could kill him off in the penultimate episode, or even earlier and use Balfour in flash backs and hauntings.

I'm thinking that Dave is the one closing the portals. That's what he's up to in his sleep/dreams.

I missed that, but now that you mention it, that seems obvious.

The black goo was not defined by Mara as being dark matter but as being aether, the "fifth element" from classic Greek science:

So that wasn't just a mispronunciation of "ether"? Or is that the Canadian way?

My opinion is that Mara (and William) became old last season. I like my villains with less moustache twirling. 

 

With that said, the episode was ok but really hope that we move on from this Mara thing soon.

Me too, but I think Mara is going to be here till the end.

I don't mind the Twu Wuv arc if it has a good pay off at the end.

[anstar]

When Nathan asked why she needed the aether she asked why he needed his gun, I think it's for protection from whatever they are also afraid of.

Interesting theory!  I like this. I have no idea why or how black balls of goo that cause the humans of this 'side' to do/be/suffer weird things would offer protection, but clearly something on that 'side' is terrifying.

[MarkHB]

I enjoyed it, although my gut feeling is that we're going to have "pure evil because it's fun" Mara for the full season, and there's no telling whether the ending is "Audrey comes back" or "Mara dies".  I also wonder if Mara's refusal to pull the trigger on Nathan was Audrey staying her hand, or Mara being unsure if killing the person she loved (as Audrey) would be enough to trigger the "cure the Troubles" part of the curse.

 

So that wasn't just a mispronunciation of "ether"? Or is that the Canadian way?

It's an archaic version.  The concept was abandoned by science in the 19th century (cf. Michaelson-Morley), paving the way for Einstein, so to me it makes sense she'd use an old term for an old concept.  Plus, "dark matter" didn't come into the general vernacular until well after the departure of Lucy Ripley, and the real Audrey may not have been the type to spend her time on cutting-edge science, so it makes sense that she might not know the modern term (if it's even the same stuff).

 

Maine nitpick: pot is NOT generally legal here.  Portland passed a "legalization" ordinance a year or so ago, but at the time even the police chief said that it didn't really mean anything.

[BlueJay81]

After seeing Mara in action I am really doubtfut that her killing William would have solved anything. Don't think her love for William runs that deep. It may be more about killing him means I also die so that can never happen.

[jhlipton]

*raises hand* I'd goes because of the troubles - at least vacation isn't dull there. I can't be the only tourist with a lack of self-preservation.

 

Next week on Extreme Vacations!!!! Haven may seem like your average sea-side town, but you haven't seen troubles 'til you see the Haven Troubles!

 

Poor Duke. And Dwight, with the bullets and the tasering and the putting up with Nathan's nonsense.

Poor dumb Dwight. Troubles are all around ad those which had them still has got them, but the "bullet magnet" still takes a gun to a knife fight! The FX of all three bullets turning was pretty cool though!

[shapeshifter]

...I also wonder if Mara's refusal to pull the trigger on Nathan was Audrey staying her hand, or Mara being unsure if killing the person she loved (as Audrey) would be enough to trigger the "cure the Troubles" part of the curse...

Excellent theory!

And thanks for clarifying the use of the archaic pronunciation of ether/aether, and also the Maine pot laws--which had me going: Huh. I thought only Colorado and Washington were state-wide. Maybe wishful thinking on the part of the writers--how long ago was the script written and the filming done?

[Shadda2]

I guess I wasn't "listening" for it so I didn't notice Nathan being annoying about thinking that Audrey was still in Mara.  Also, while Mara is the core personality, for lack of a better word, and didn't ask to be taken over by the other entities, neither did the other entities ask to be used in the same manner.  Audrey, Sara, et al didn't ask to be Haven Savers and to have their own lives be lived in short spurts.  The true manipulators are the barn people.  It might be interesting to find out that Mara isn't the true original, but there is some other entirely different personality that was effected by the aether and turned into Mara.  For that matter William could have been very different in an earlier phase of his life. 

 

One thing we know for sure is that we know nothing for sure.  Well there is one thing I know for sure, if Mara is going to be some sort of omnipotent villain I will have to do an awful lot of fast forwarding, or perhaps napping, during the episodes. 

[BlueJay81]

 

Audrey, Sara, et al didn't ask to be Haven Savers and to have their own lives be lived in short spurts.  The true manipulators are the barn people.  It might be interesting to find out that Mara isn't the true original, but there is some other entirely different personality that was effected by the aether and turned into Mara.  For that matter William could have been very different in an earlier phase of his life.

Yes the whole stealing some innocent woman's memories and then essentially 'killing' her if she comes in contact with Mara (the real Audrey Parker is just a shell now) and the whole 27 year cycle is just a band aid. They know Havensaver Mara will never kill anyone she loves to end the Troubles for good so the cycle will just keep going. Who benefits from this? Why not just destroy Haven and be done with it. Sometimes it seems there is a cosmic battle taking place and Haven is just a pawn caught in the crossfire.

The way they seem to be alluding to the fact that Mara is not really human it is quite possible that she may have originally possessed the body of some colonial era woman and her true form is very different. Or they may be very different versions of Mara depending on which world she is in.

Edited September 14, 2014 by BlueJay81