S07.E01: Black Widower

[sunshine2288]

I mean Juice why the hell haven't you skipped town? You know Jax has gone off the deep end and you betrayed him how many times? What exactly is the point of staying in Charming?

 

Juice is such a sad, lost soul begging for someone to care. He's so messed up he doesn't even realize Gemma could care less what happens to him.

[Insomnia]

I'm not sure if I should be relieved, or creeped out that I seem to be the only one who noticed (or is mentioning) they thought Gemma and Juice were going to make out.

 

I'll just think about naked Juice pushups until I'm not confused anymore!

[Guest Accused Dingo]

I mean Juice why the hell haven't you skipped town? You know Jax has gone off the deep end and you betrayed him how many times? What exactly is the point of staying in Charming?

 

 

Juice is planning on leaving town.  Its been 9 days since Tara's murder and I think some other thing the club wants to "talk" to him about.  His plan was to lay low until the heat died down and then swing buy his weed shop and take out his money and then leave.  Gemma told him the place was being watched pretty much 24/7 either by club members or cops.  She offered to give him money and then for him to go "Somewhere where there is no SAMCRO charter."  That is only option now.  For Juice and guys like him the club is family and probably the only family he has ever known.  Gemma is probably the closest thing to a mother he has ever really had.  

 

And the ending was extra stupid. Did Jax assume that this poor guy was ex special forces or something. Because otherwise, after that much torture, if he was involved with Tera's murder, I am pretty sure he would have spilled everything he knew. The fact that he didn't might mean something.

 

 

I actually thought it was rather appropriate especially for the show.  Jax even said that he didn't blame the dude for the actual murder.  Business is business and he was just following orders and all that shit.  It was how he did it.  IF you remember...Tara didn't go easy.  There was a fight between Gemma and Tara and Tara died hard.  That is what pissed Jax off.  A bullet to the head and he probably would have just shot the dude in the head...easy peasy but in Jax's mind the guy tortured Tara first....so well......Now if he actually waited for the guy to answer he might have figured out that he wasn't the one who killed Tara but then well.....a whole other storyline and I don't think Jax is ready to listen to the truth anyway.  

[Kel Varnsen]

Juice is planning on leaving town.  Its been 9 days since Tara's murder and I think some other thing the club wants to "talk" to him about.  His plan was to lay low until the heat died down and then swing buy his weed shop and take out his money and then leave.  Gemma told him the place was being watched pretty much 24/7 either by club members or cops.  She offered to give him money and then for him to go "Somewhere where there is no SAMCRO charter."  That is only option now.  For Juice and guys like him the club is family and probably the only family he has ever known.  Gemma is probably the closest thing to a mother he has ever really had.  

 

 

Maybe it is just me but waiting around seems really dumb, even for juice. I mean the guy used to be SAMCRO's intelligence officer. I mean if is hiding at Wendy's because there is no where else to go, it shouldn't be that hard to figure out there is no reason to stay in Charming unless you want to get killed.

 

I actually thought it was rather appropriate especially for the show.  Jax even said that he didn't blame the dude for the actual murder.  Business is business and he was just following orders and all that shit.  It was how he did it.  IF you remember...Tara didn't go easy.  There was a fight between Gemma and Tara and Tara died hard.  That is what pissed Jax off.  A bullet to the head and he probably would have just shot the dude in the head...easy peasy but in Jax's mind the guy tortured Tara first....so well......Now if he actually waited for the guy to answer he might have figured out that he wasn't the one who killed Tara but then well.....a whole other storyline and I don't think Jax is ready to listen to the truth anyway.

 

But if Jax was torturing him for as long as he did, it wouldn't take too much brain power to realize that if the guy was still saying shit, like "I didn't do it" right up to his death(which I would think would be a natural reaction), then he probably didn't do it. 

[Kel Varnsen]

 

Double post

Edited September 14, 2014 by Kel Varnsen

[MrsRafaelBarba]

Tara's murder screamed PERSONAL, enemies of the Sons wouldn't have been so messy.

Amazes me that didn't set off any bells or whistles in Jax, Chibbs or Bobby.

[Sir RaiderDuck OMS]

Something was rubbing me wrong about the plotting this episode, and I finally realized what it was: Sutter is plagiarizing himself, specifically Season 6 of The Shield:

Our violent protagonist (Jax Teller/Vic Mackey), wanting to avenge the murder of someone close to him (Tara Knowles/Curtis "Lemonhead" Lemansky) acts on lies told by someone else close to him who actually committed the murder (Gemma Teller/Shane Vendrell) and tortures and kills a gang member who had nothing to do with the murder itself.

If an episode this season ends with Gemma tossing a manila envelope filled with a handwritten confession into Jax's lap, I may give up the show altogether....

Edited September 14, 2014 by Sir RaiderDuck OMS

[spaceytraci1208]

Something was rubbing me wrong about the plotting this episode, and I finally realized what it was: Sutter is plagiarizing himself, specifically Season 6 of The Shield:

Our violent protagonist (Jax Teller/Vic Mackey), wanting to avenge the murder of someone close to him (Tara Knowles/Curtis "Lemonhead" Lemansky) acts on lies told by someone else close to him who actually committed the murder (Gemma Teller/Shane Vendrell) and tortures and kills a gang member who had nothing to do with the murder itself.

If an episode this season ends with Gemma tossing a manila envelope filled with a handwritten confession into Jax's lap, I may give up the show altogether....

I was also reminded of when Tig and Jax lied to Opie about one of the Mayans being the one who killed Donna. You'd think that would trigger something

[MrsRafaelBarba]

Didn't they blame Donna's murder on the One Niners?

[spaceytraci1208]

Didn't they blame Donna's murder on the One Niners?

That was the original plan but it didn't work (don't remember why). So they said it was Mayan and set up a guy, said he confessed and had Opie shoot him

Edited September 14, 2014 by spaceytraci1208

[DrSpaceman]

So much for the kinder, gentler Jax.

when other people are dying its all about overlooking it for the good of all. When his wife dies, it becomes about vengance quickly.

I don't see how this ends with anything other than every single one of them ending up dead.

I actually liked the Bohemian rapsody montage though.

[Stratego]

Tara's murder screamed PERSONAL, enemies of the Sons wouldn't have been so messy.

Amazes me that didn't set off any bells or whistles in Jax, Chibbs or Bobby.

Or to anyone else--Police, District Attorney... .  Again we must suspend disbelief to advance this plot.

[Mrs peel]

Nice to know I'm not the only one disgusted with the show. I'm "hate" watching now just because I invested so much time. I had to fast forward through the torture murder scene - Sutter could learn a lot from "the Vikings" - which had a horrific torture murder scene that was very compelling, but we didn't actually SEE much of the gore.

I wasn't sorry to see Tara die last season because she was written as such an idiot. But Gemma starting a gang war just to shift suspicion away from her? That is all kinds of wrong.

I think the DA and cops are very concerned about Roosevelt's murder. But without evidence, there is not much they can do. Highlighting Tara's death to the people who may know who killed her (and they have every reason to think the same person killed both) is smart.

As is the DA's attempt to get the former sheriff (blanking on his name) back into police work, even informally. They know he knows a lot, and bringing him back to the right side of the law could help them out. I doubt he'll do it, because he is yet another stupid guy who just loves, loves Gemma!

At this point the former hooker/porn star and Wendy need to take the kids and get the hell out of Charming. Let Chibbs live because I have a soft spot for that impossible to understand Belfast accent, but everyone else needs to die. Preferably the same way Opie died.

 

[edited to correct what must have been another incredibly aggressive Apple auto-correct.  Sorry, no idea what "bi monthly" meant, I was indeed talking about Tara]

Edited September 18, 2014 by Mrs peel

[MrsRafaelBarba]

At this point, Chibbs should go back home to Fee and his daughter.

Or

Go nomad with Bobby, Rat and those guy that looked disgusted by the Pastor quadruple murder/burial.

The long haired one's face, screamed I didn't sign up for this type of fuckery.

[placate]

How did Jax get out of jail? I had to rewind and see if I missed anything. One minute he's torturing/killing someone for the brotherhood and the next minute he's in a van talking to Gemma?

[leisawoo]

I wish I knew.

[Artsda]

How did Jax get out of jail? I had to rewind and see if I missed anything. One minute he's torturing/killing someone for the brotherhood and the next minute he's in a van talking to Gemma?

They were holding him for Tara/Roosevelt, Patterson came in and talked about the investigation, who she spoke too and they had nothing on him. 

[Raja]

They had a parole violation for the gun but perhaps since he was making a deal the DA used her discretion to squash the thing.

[Artsda]

It's easy for viewers to forget they're even still on parole from being jailed at the end of season 3. lol No time really has passed since they were let out on parole. A few days between end of season 4 and start of 5. A couple weeks between end of season 5 and start of 6. Then now 10 days between end of season 6 and start 7. 

 

Thomas is still a baby like he was at the start of season 4. Tara and Jax were probably married a month in this SOA timeline. Opie and Lyla were probably married for a couple weeks.

[Pickles Aplenty]

 

Thomas is still a baby like he was at the start of season 4. Tara and Jax were probably married a month in this SOA timeline. Opie and Lyla were probably married for a couple weeks.

Are you being cereal?

 

Wow.  What an incredibly stupid timeline.

[Kel Varnsen]

I was also reminded of when Tig and Jax lied to Opie about one of the Mayans being the one who killed Donna. You'd think that would trigger something

Or the time they blamed Clay's shooting (by Opie) on the niners and Tig tried to kill their leader.

 

The long haired one's face, screamed I didn't sign up for this type of fuckery.

 

I don't understand why anyone would sign up for this fuckery. I mean when they were sitting around the table and Jax said that no was the time to speak up, I don't understand why no one stood up and said "that's it, I'm out!". I mean the benefits of being in an organized crime group (from what I see in TV/movies/books) is money, protection and respect. These guys are always broke, their life expectancy is lower than an average criminal, and the people in Charming kind of hate them.

 

Amazes me that didn't set off any bells or whistles in Jax, Chibbs or Bobby.

 

Just more proof that these guys are all really stupid. It often makes me wonder who was the brains behind the operation that took The Sons of Anarchy from a small town biker gang, to a world wide criminal empire in the space of 1 generation.

[leisawoo]

"The long haired one's face, screamed I didn't sign up for this type of fuckery."

Yep, I think a couple of 'em looked like that this episode, lol. Nero has looked pretty squeamish more than once. That kinda surprises me considering his "lines of work" but I do see that the girls love him. I guess he takes great care of them? Are they just there for the Sons? I don't think I have seen customers other than the Sons or their guests.

[stagmania]

It's easy for viewers to forget they're even still on parole from being jailed at the end of season 3. lol No time really has passed since they were let out on parole. A few days between end of season 4 and start of 5. A couple weeks between end of season 5 and start of 6. Then now 10 days between end of season 6 and start 7. 

 

Thomas is still a baby like he was at the start of season 4. Tara and Jax were probably married a month in this SOA timeline. Opie and Lyla were probably married for a couple weeks.

 

Wow, this is kind of blowing my mind. That makes the plot even more ludicrous; no way can Jax and Tara go from their wedding day to all this crazy shit and falling out of love/trust with each other in such a short timespan. That is not remotely plausible.

[Artsda]

It was just days after their wedding that the whole Otto thing happened and Tara ended up jailed. They married at end of 5x2 I think and Otto killed the nurse like 7 episodes later. No time really passes in between episodes, so probably a week or 2 in between the wedding and Tara being jailed. 

[RedHackle]

Let Chibbs live because I have a soft spot for that impossible to understand Belfast accent

Chibs is Scottish, not Irish - as is the actor who plays him, Tommy Flanagan.  Unless you mean that during the time he spent in Belfast, he ended up with a Balfastian-Scots brogue, in which case, you're got a better ear than I do. 

[Insomnia]

Watching any scripted TV series with maybe the exception of SitComs, is like watching stars; you are watching the past.

 

Even True Blood doing it's time skip in the middle only really caught up to real time after doing it's little mini-skip at the end. Castle is probably going to start up last year. Teen Wolf was just on their second year of high school and who knows how much time has passed in Game of Thrones with the jumping ahead for some and not for others. One of the (many) things I like about Outlander is they say "months have passed."

 

Shows used to have a cliffhanger, and then a wait, but with shows having seasons that are shorter, and a longer wait it's easy to forget how little time has passed. But I think this is also because of binge-watching. Watch all the seasons back to back and the time compression makes more sense. I think though in some cases it has to do with the material as well. Not so much for SoA but we have so many shows on right now that were books; they stretch out the whole season of one book which usually doesn't span months. And if they don't have some sort of cliff hanger from season to season, people might not come back.

 

Well, that's enough of me being profound, I have an intro to watch again... in preparation of tomorrow's episode, of course.

[Guest Accused Dingo]

Watching any scripted TV series with maybe the exception of SitComs, is like watching stars; you are watching the past.

Even True Blood doing it's time skip in the middle only really caught up to real time after doing it's little mini-skip at the end. Castle is probably going to start up last year. Teen Wolf was just on their second year of high school and who knows how much time has passed in Game of Thrones with the jumping ahead for some and not for others. One of the (many) things I like about Outlander is they say "months have passed."

Shows used to have a cliffhanger, and then a wait, but with shows having seasons that are shorter, and a longer wait it's easy to forget how little time has passed. But I think this is also because of binge-watching. Watch all the seasons back to back and the time compression makes more sense. I think though in some cases it has to do with the material as well. Not so much for SoA but we have so many shows on right now that were books; they stretch out the whole season of one book which usually doesn't span months. And if they don't have some sort of cliff hanger from season to season, people might not come.

The entire course of Breaking Bad was three years. Think of all the crazy shit that happened on that show. There is real life logic/time and tv logic/time. In real life all the crazy would have taken at least a decade to happen but this is tv and unless you really want to watch what goes on in a motor cycle club on a daily basis then crazy shit needs to happen on a daily basis. Plus this is just a story and not real life. I happen to like the story; warts and all. Edited September 16, 2014 by Accused Dingo

[Insomnia]

Oh yeah, I'm not complaining, just pointing out the fact that while some things happened a while ago to us, not so much to the characters becase we as the audience do sometimes tend to forget.

[missy jo]

I have a kind of Stockholm Syndrome about this show, so I'm sticking around for the duration. The "to be or not to be" for Jax has been answered. He's now a psychopath and serial murderer.

 

The best part of the episode was the very beginning with Juice doing push-ups. I yelled "thank you!" out loud to the TV.

[NoWillToResist]

Thank Christ this is the final season. I would not be able to continue with this otherwise. The stupidity is staggering.

 

"Sure, come to our party...it'll be family and friends. My kids will probably be there!" When Lin arrived and saw that it was all naked ladies and no kiddies in sight, he should have realized some shit was up. Awfully convenient for one of his men to be isolated, thus allowing Gemma to use the guy as her patsy.

 

So, has Jax just been hit in the head one to many times now? Is that how I'm to explain his utterly incomprehensible stupidity? Your mother claims that some Asian guy came out of the back of your house in the dead of night, claims she didn't know Tara was home, and she went to "find the club". Um, what? Did Gemma lose her phone? She clearly never reached anyone that night, so what's her excuse for why no one heard this story that night?

 

And yeah, if a rival gang wants revenge, they don't tend to hit family, they hit your club. They don't tend to HIDE FROM YOU THAT THEY DID THE CRIME. They also tend to have to BREAK INTO THE HOME if they plan on killing someone at home and generally WON'T HAVE TO FIGHT WITH THE 110 LB FEMALE VICTIM BEFORE STABBING HER WITH HER OWN COOKING FORK. They tend to come with their own weapons, y'know? They also don't usually lie in wait and then murder a cop who must have just randomly stopped by and entered the house. Jesus Christ. 

 

The very idea that the Chinese would have executed a hit on Tara like that is so preposterous that everyone who believed it deserves to die.

 

That no one, NO ONE - not even the D.A. - has even mentioned the possibility that it was Gemma is fucking ridiculous. There was no forced entry, there was a struggle and a spontaneous weapon was used. No one told Gemma that Tara was no longer going to snitch, and Tara turns up dead...and NO ONE thinks there may have been a connection? Holy. Fuck.

 

I was supposed to laugh when Gemma was saying that lying about killing Tara was "the right thing to do for Jax and the boys" right? Right? Because she may not be an actual psychopath (OMG, tears!) but holy fuck does she take the cake for self-delusion. "It may appear selfish..." HA! You mispronouced *IS*, Gemma.

 

Wendy was in rehab for 9 days...why does her front garden look like it's been abandoned for months? Also, she's in an apartment...since when do the tenants do yard maintenance? Does Wendy still have drugs in her system? That's the only reason I can think of for her behaviour in this episode. Oh, there's a fugitive hiding out in my home. Let me INVITE UNSER INTO MY HOUSE AND LEAVE HIM UNSUPERVISED. I was dying when she told Juice to hide because she "had" to invite him in. Um, no, you don't. You open the door, tell him you'll be right out and close the door in his face. Holy fuck. And don't even get me started on "I bought groceries for myself. No, I won't take them with me and I'm going to leave them on the counter to rot!" Slow clap for Wendy, y'all.

 

And Unser. Oh Unser. Why wouldn't you suspect that the third party was still in the apartment? Jesus.

 

At this point, I'm rooting for Nero and Wendy to take the kids and run. Everyone else can die, please.

Edited November 30, 2014 by NoWillToResist

[Ohwell]

I love your rant!

[CreamedPeas]

I binge watched all seven seasons and came here to see what everyone had to say. So if you get likes on your posts from two years ago, it's just me wandering around, by myself, reading, and needing a support group because I didn't want the series to end. *wipes away tears* 

[Dobian]

Watching this show for the first time and starting season 7 now.  I've really enjoyed the show but there is just way too much plot armor going on for all characters and believability is going out the window.  This motorcycle club has strayed too much from Hells Angels and into Goodfellas.  Dead bodies everywhere, cops getting killed, international gun smuggling from major known terrorist groups flowing through this sleepy little California valley town and the law can't do anything about it.  The ordinary people of Charming just seem to go about their days oblivious to the murder and mayhem surrounding them; you just hear the occasional beef from the city council then it's back to business as usual.  No media attention from all the extreme violence going on.  Sure.  The police and the D.A. have no clue who killed Tara and Roosevelt, give me a break.  Gemma's DNA would be all over that crime scene and all over Tara herself.  Juice didn't clean anything up, he just tossed the murder weapon and some things.  Sick and tired of Unser - who I used to like - he's the one who got Tara killed because his nose is so far up Gemma's ass and he wrongly told Gemma that Tara ratted, which set her off.  And this idiot knows how Gemma flies off the handle even when she's normal and he told her this when she was stoned out of her mind.  Good grief, the cancer can't take this sad clown soon enough.  Juice should have been dead a couple of seasons ago, but he's like a cat with nine lives.  Jax is a violent hotheaded buffoon.  It never occurs to him that given the whole situation with Tara talking to the D.A. about the club, the FIRST people he should suspect in her murder would be the club and Gemma - especially Gemma.  So he tortures random Chinese guy to death just because mommy said that's who did it, without even un-gagging the guy to get some kind of corroboration or information to refute that.  The same mommy who lied after driving off the road while stoned and almost getting his kids killed.  This guy deserves nothing short of the worst ending possible at the end of this one, just for shear stupidity, setting aside the fact that he's turned into a homicidal monster you can't even relate to anymore.

Edited December 27, 2017 by Dobian