S06.E03: The Devil You Know

[jewel21]

While in Florida caring for her ailing father, Athena and Bobby investigate the disappearance of her childhood friend from 45 years ago.

Airdate: 10/03/2022

[Crashcourse]

So Junior did it and turns out he's a serial killer.  And, of course, it's Athena running all by herself to catch him because, apparently, no one else is capable. 🙄

And Bobby really got on my damn nerves sitting at Athen's father's desk and going through his stuff.  This is not his house.   

I'm sick of both of them.

[Kleav]

The episode reminded me of Cold Case. I miss that show!

[shapeshifter]

Did those "Beginning" episodes about the characters have zero 9-1-1 scenes? 
I guess they couldn't really spread the story over anymore episodes in order to include some 9-1-1 stuff back at the ranch 118, but maybe there could have been a local 9-1-1, like some of Athena's trigger-happy childhood neighbors needing to call 9-1-1 instead of "Barney Fife"?

Last episode I posted:

On 9/27/2022 at 11:31 AM, shapeshifter said:

Yeah, Athena's childhood friend would not have been digging up the foundation where either he buried a body or knew his dad had buried a body.

So I guess the serial killer's father never told his son where the body was buried.

[iMonrey]

I don't mind a story centering around Athena and a cold case from her childhood but I don't want it to be the whole show. I don't like any two characters well enough for them to take up the whole show. It goes against the whole premise/format of 9-1-1. This isn't CSI.

Quote

And, of course, it's Athena running all by herself to catch him because, apparently, no one else is capable. 🙄

What killed me is that after the gun went off Bobby was perfectly fine and told Athena "Go!" Yeah, go chase after the serial killer, Athena! Even though you are unarmed, alone and dwarfed in size compared this killer. Good thing that shovel just happened to be lying around. Convenient!

Athena is not a superhero no matter how much the show wants us to think she is. She's no spring chicken either for that matter. It's one thing for her to constantly put herself in danger by going into situations like that by herself, but for Bobby to urge her to do so is sort of horrifying. There was no immediate need to catch the guy, they knew who he was, he wasn't going to get very far. 

[Redrum]

3 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

So I guess the serial killer's father never told his son where the body was buried.

I mean, in fairness, thats an awkward topic to bring up.

"Gosh, Mama, Christmas dinner looks wonderful. Junior, pass me the knives so I can carve the turkey and by the way, I buried that little girl you murdered in our neighbor's enclosed porch foundation so don't dig there. Now who wants dark meat? I mean, I know Junior does...."

[Irlandesa]

I liked this episode more than I thought I would.  I like mysteries but I didn't really think they'd build it out well but I think they did for a 60 minute episode.

I especially appreciate that they dropped in a clue to who the murderer was when the sister was telling what she didn't originally share in that Junior was at the party she went to.  She was probably wallowing in her own guilt that she didn't realize Junior never shared Tanya showed up at the party either.  And never considered why that was.

I did feel turning him into a serial killer felt superfluous.  But I guess once he realized killing was the perfect way to shut up his assault victims.

19 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

Did those "Beginning" episodes about the characters have zero 9-1-1 scenes? 

Many of the "Begin" episodes didn't have everyone in them.  Maybe two or three of the characters.

ETA:  Interesting-- The Cleaning Lady's episode title is also "The Devil You Know" but in Spanish.

Edited October 4, 2022 by Irlandesa

[shapeshifter]

2 minutes ago, Irlandesa said:

I especially appreciate that they dropped in a clue to who the murderer was when the sister was telling what she didn't originally share in that Junior was at the party she went to.  She was probably wallowing in her own guilt that she didn't realize Junior never shared Tanya showed up at the party either.  And never considered why that was.

Now that you mention it, there is no way none of those kids at that party would not have leaked to someone that the missing girl was at the party.

Gossip in a small town should have solved this thing long ago. I mean, did they just think it was normal for another young girl to disappear every so often? And where are the other bodies????

And last episode Athena said Junior used to chase her through the orange groves. As a cop who dealt with predators, shouldn't she at some point have looked back and seen him for what he was?  I kind of wish that was what brought them back to her childhood home instead of her father driving the car into the house and uncovering a body.

The best part of the episode was giving the young actors a chance to show their talent.
Other than that, the show should stick to its implausible accidents and rescues.

[DanaK]

Really well done episode and unique for this show. That scene running through the grove with the music playing was top notch

Edited October 4, 2022 by DanaK

[Empress1]

43 minutes ago, Kleav said:

The episode reminded me of Cold Case. I miss that show!

It reminded me of Cold Case, which is probably why I thought it was hard to watch. Cold Case regularly made me cry. The scene with Tanya running through the grove was so upsetting - I kept wanting her to get away, even knowing what the outcome was. And I felt sad for Reggie Senior. I know what he did; I still felt sad for him. The actor sold me on “he’s my only child.”

23 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

What killed me is that after the gun went off Bobby was perfectly fine and told Athena "Go!" Yeah, go chase after the serial killer, Athena! Even though you are unarmed, alone and dwarfed in size compared this killer. Good thing that shovel just happened to be lying around. Convenient!

I was thinking “you’re not going to take the gun?!” It was right there!

15 minutes ago, Irlandesa said:

I did feel turning him into a serial killer felt superfluous.  But I guess once he realized killing was the perfect way to shut up his assault victims.

Yeah, I assumed he was a pedophile who killed his victims - like, the former was his primary motivation (ugh) and the latter was “tying up loose ends,” as he put it (ugh ugh ugh).

The detective was right - you don’t sleep in barrettes. They dig into your scalp and it hurts.

[Demian]

37 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

Now that you mention it, there is no way none of those kids at that party would not have leaked to someone that the missing girl was at the party.

Gossip in a small town should have solved this thing long ago. I mean, did they just think it was normal for another young girl to disappear every so often? And where are the other bodies????

I completely agree, but if the young girls disappearing were all young girls of color, I doubt the local police would have prioritized any of their cases.

However, if they'd been missing white girls, the cable news networks would have had round-the-clock, wall-to-wall coverage of the disappearances for months.

[Redrum]

43 minutes ago, Empress1 said:

1 hour ago, Kleav said:

The episode reminded me of Cold Case. I miss that show!

It reminded me of Cold Case, which is probably why I thought it was hard to watch.

I was waiting for the ghost of the victim to appear and nod to Athena as she boxed up the case info. The running sequence made me forgive some of the story's flaws. 

59 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

Now that you mention it, there is no way none of those kids at that party would not have leaked to someone that the missing girl was at the party.

Like this flaw :D

Having grown up in a small town, smaller than this - tragedy trumps getting in trouble over sneaking down to the party. On one occasion, while drinking at ye olde waterfall, a teen girl went OVER the waterfall and died. Everyone at the illicit party fessed up or ratted each other out but it was one of those "mom and dad are mad but more glad you didn't die" kind of things. Little girl at a party like this probably would have had a couple of girls walking her home if the general attitude wasn't "big sis needs to take the baby home" - no one wanted an eight year old around. 

1 hour ago, shapeshifter said:

And last episode Athena said Junior used to chase her through the orange groves. As a cop who dealt with predators, shouldn't she at some point have looked back and seen him for what he was? 

Doubt it. Try reading The Stranger Beside Me by Ann Rule. She worked with Ted Bundy on a suicide hotline, he used to walk her to her car at night because she fit the profile of the killer stalking the women in the area and didn't believe he was guilty until the physical evidence was impossible to deny. Athena never saw Junior with the mask off and had no reason to ponder him as a suspect until the body turned up in her dad's house. 

[kwnyc]

4 hours ago, iMonrey said:

Athena is not a superhero no matter how much the show wants us to think she is.

Well, she DID have a shovel. Athena works alone and takes down serial killers & kidnappers.

[CoderLady]

I'll admit it: I'm apparently the target audience for this, because Athena going full warrior on some miscreant is always really satisfying to me. I even savor the aftermath moments when she's just two seconds away from chewing some fucker's face off but manages to restrain herself.

To me a whole episode of Athena and Bobby solving a crime was a rare treat, but YMMV. I'm ready to get back to the 118, though.

Edited October 4, 2022 by CoderLady

[Lady Calypso]

I really did like this. For a one off detective episode, it was very solid. Although, yeah, thinking about it, no way the kids at the party didn't tell anyone about Tanya being at the party. Would have been better if Joanne and Junior had found Tanya on the outskirts of the property and not had her stick around. Because unless Junior also murdered everyone at the party, them allowing police and Tanya's family to believe she was taken at home, even if they thought she made it home, it was a bit questionable. 

Well, I said the episode would produce a twist that wasn't obvious like Junior's dad being the killer, and I was right. Junior not just being a killer, but a serial killer was certainly something. The sad part is that I thought "thank god it wasn't Junior's dad because Junior will spend a lot more time in prison being punished for his actions, but a shame he got away with it for 45 years."

Athena struggling with the case was an intriguing subplot. I didn't love Bobby snooping through his things without permission, nor did I love Bobby pushing Athena to look into it when she clearly wasn't ready, but I understand that this isn't just Athena's wheelhouse, it's been her reason for becoming a cop in the first place. 

All in all, a good one-off episode, but I am so ready to go back to the 118.

[Redrum]

7 hours ago, CoderLady said:

I'll admit it: I'm apparently the target audience for this, because Athena going full warrior on some miscreant is always really satisfying to me. I even savor the aftermath moments when she's just two seconds away from chewing some fucker's face off but manages to restrain herself.

Agreed. Mind you, a full diet of Athena on the rampage solving cold cases would get old, but this was fine and makes me think we won't have a lot of Athena heavy episodes going forward.

I am going to call bullshit on Athena's dad coming out of the stroke coma with no impairments though. 

[Empress1]

40 minutes ago, Redrum said:

I am going to call bullshit on Athena's dad coming out of the stroke coma with no impairments though. 

Do we know that? He just woke up and was speaking, albeit in a labored way - do we know he has no cognitive or physical impairments?

[Redrum]

5 minutes ago, Empress1 said:

Do we know that? He just woke up and was speaking, albeit in a labored way - do we know he has no cognitive or physical impairments?

I was genuinely amazed he was speaking and aware of his surroundings and able to ask for his daughter. 

[shapeshifter]

52 minutes ago, Redrum said:

I am going to call bullshit on Athena's dad coming out of the stroke coma with no impairments though. 

I'm assuming they will be installing the ramp as suggested in the previous episode.

[Snazzy Daisy]

I like this episode. Even though it is not as compelling as Athena Begins, it is still a solid episode. Am glad the writers gave Tanya Kingston's story the attention it deserves and wrapped it nicely because she is the reason why Athena becomes a police officer.

We also got to hear about Michael and Harry which is cool.

Word!

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“The Devil wears a familiar face and tricks you with his lies.”

[Clanstarling]

Given that the pick up truck's pop-pop sound was prominent in one of the first scenes, I knew it narrowed down to Junior and his dad.

I have no problems with spending this time on the mystery of the dead girl. I liked the way it played out, even though Warrior Athena can be a bit much sometimes. She also did a great job of struggling with her emotions.

I was glad to see Athena's father could speak, albeit slowly and with deliberation. To my understanding, strokes can affect different things depending on their location. I'm also not sure whether the swelling was due to the stroke or the car accident. But in any case, since we won't be spending a lot of time with Athena's parents other than some verbal updates in the future, I don't have a lot of need to know the details.

But it will be good to go back to the crew and in particular see how Hen is dealing with her failure in med school.

[Redrum]

14 minutes ago, Clanstarling said:

Given that the pick up truck's pop-pop sound was prominent in one of the first scenes, I knew it narrowed down to Junior and his dad.

And this and a few other things sort of pinged the "how very fucking coincidental" buttons on this case.

1. Athena's parents still live in the same home after 45 years.

2. Junior and his parents still live in the same home after 45 years. I know its not stated that Junior lives at home but he does live within easy hang out with dad and help the old neighbors distance.

3. The family of the murdered girl never sold the home and the daughter lives in the same house after 45 years. Complete with an untouched for 45 years bedroom. 

4. Junior or Junior's dad, still owns the SAME antique truck that backfires exactly the same after 45 years. 

This is also why it reminded me of an episode of Cold Case :)

[shapeshifter]

44 minutes ago, Redrum said:

And this and a few other things sort of pinged the "how very fucking coincidental" buttons on this case.

1. Athena's parents still live in the same home after 45 years.

2. Junior and his parents still live in the same home after 45 years. I know its not stated that Junior lives at home but he does live within easy hang out with dad and help the old neighbors distance.

3. The family of the murdered girl never sold the home and the daughter lives in the same house after 45 years. Complete with an untouched for 45 years bedroom. 

4. Junior or Junior's dad, still owns the SAME antique truck that backfires exactly the same after 45 years. 

This is also why it reminded me of an episode of Cold Case :)

And that vintage 1955-ish truck was still running with the same engine 45 years after the event——which would have been about 1976, when Athena and Tanya were 8-year-olds. 
That was my biggest eye roll. 🙄 

Edited October 4, 2022 by shapeshifter

[tennisgurl]

I am glad that I wasn't the only person thinking of Cold Case while watching this episode, I was really getting that vibe. The unsolved case, the period music, the flashbacks, seeing the past and present versions of everyone involved in the case, that was such a great show, although those writers still owe me a few thousand dollars worth of tissues, with the amount of time I spent crying watching it. I liked the mystery even though I guessed even last week that it would be Athena's old friend and it was full of contrivances. Of course they're still driving the same crappy truck decades later, of course the body is found after Athena's dad got into a random car accident, of course Athena is still going to run after this murderer on her own because the woman will NEVER learn to wait for backup, its a lot to make the story work, but it did still work for me. Poor Tonya, the sequence of her running through the fields trying to get away from Junior was so well done but hard to watch, I kept hoping she would get away even though I knew that she wouldn't. The ending where Athena told Tonya's sister how much of an impact Tonya made despite her short time being alive was really sweet. 

Junior becoming a serial killer is a bit of the usual 911 melodrama, but I can see how he killed Tonya then realized that killing his victims is an easy way to tie up loose ends, or even found a taste for it when he murdered Tonya. I suppose it makes sense that a person who would sexually assault and murder a little girl wouldn't only do that one time. 

I do find it rather far fetched that no one at the party ever told anyone about seeing Tonya there the night she disappeared, even if the teens were afraid of getting in trouble I feel like at least one or two would have confessed, its a small town, this case was a huge deal, and people talk. 

I liked solving this mystery and giving Athena more backstory, but I am excited to get back to our regularly scheduled programming.

[Redrum]

1 minute ago, tennisgurl said:

I do find it rather far fetched that no one at the party ever told anyone about seeing Tonya there the night she disappeared, even if the teens were afraid of getting in trouble I feel like at least one or two would have confessed, its a small town, this case was a huge deal, and people talk. 

Plus the positive attention of 'I was helping the police find the missing girl' outweighs the "mom and dad will be mad I snuck out" stuff.

[shapeshifter]

9 minutes ago, Redrum said:

15 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

I do find it rather far fetched that no one at the party ever told anyone about seeing Tonya there the night she disappeared, even if the teens were afraid of getting in trouble I feel like at least one or two would have confessed, its a small town, this case was a huge deal, and people talk. 

Plus the positive attention of 'I was helping the police find the missing girl' outweighs the "mom and dad will be mad I snuck out" stuff.

I was just thinking the kids at the party would gossip about it and it would leak. 
Or maybe one kid would feel the need to unburden what they'd seen to an adult, but I can also then imagine that adult not wanting to spread rumors about a neighbor that might not be true, especially since the witnesses were all drinking.

The only way I can imagine him continuing to rape and kill little girls in a small town is if he drove out of town to find his prey. The truck suggests that possibility.

Edited October 4, 2022 by shapeshifter

[Andyourlittledog2]

17 hours ago, Redrum said:

18 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

And last episode Athena said Junior used to chase her through the orange groves. As a cop who dealt with predators, shouldn't she at some point have looked back and seen him for what he was? 

Doubt it. Try reading The Stranger Beside Me by Ann Rule. She worked with Ted Bundy on a suicide hotline, he used to walk her to her car at night because she fit the profile of the killer stalking the women in the area and didn't believe he was guilty until the physical evidence was impossible to deny. Athena never saw Junior with the mask off and had no reason to ponder him as a suspect until the body turned up in her dad's house. 

Yeah. I was work friends with a serial rapist/killer in LA for years and never realized he wasn't the fun charming sweet guy we all thought he was. Not in a million years. Imagine the shock. I'm still shocked and honestly don't trust anyone any more. Not really truly. The mask is real and they are good ones. Seriously, you cannot know for sure who is standing next to you.

I didn't like that the entire episode was devoted to this and I hated that Athena was allowed to do things no detective in their right mind would ever allow.  She participated in an official interrogation of the suspect? When her own father was also a suspect? What the hell was that about?  She and Bobby participated in the search in the Orange Grove for the suspect? Bobby makes a risky grab for the gun but miraculously it doesn't go off and shoot Athena. And then she chases through the orange grove after him in her tank top, dressy slacks, and I hope flats without any weapon whatsoever and when she catches him she slam a conveniently located shovel into his head to subdue him and wrestles him to the ground and the other cop just happens to come up in time to hand her handcuffs. Lucky that. And hitting someone in the head hard with a shovel is no way for a cop to subdue a fleeing suspect. She could cause brain damage, even kill him. She had no reason to chase him (they knew who he was and could catch him later if he got away) and especially no justification for using a shovel to bash his brains in. That was a brutal and unnecessary risk. You aren't allowed to kill a fleeing suspect just because you can.

Athena as superhero, going alone after suspects, is long overdue for retirement. It's ridiculous.

ETA: And that padlocked shrine/bedroom 'she never goes in' was mysteriously dust free. If I knew that locking a room up would keep dust from settling on everything I'd have locked up my rooms years ago. Everything in that room looked like it was just bought from the Sears catalog yesterday. No aging or fading whatsoever. I must remember to pick up some padlocks.

Edited October 4, 2022 by Andyourlittledog2

[Redrum]

3 minutes ago, Andyourlittledog2 said:

And hitting someone in the head hard with a shovel is no way for a cop to subdue a fleeing suspect. She could cause brain damage, even kill him. She had no reason to chase him (they knew who he was and could catch him later if he got away) and especially no justification for using a shovel to bash his brains in. That was a brutal and unnecessary risk.

Agree in the real world, but I won't lie, I liked seeing the child raper and murderer get his head bashed in. 

5 minutes ago, Andyourlittledog2 said:

Yeah. I was work friends with a serial rapist/killer in LA for years and never realized he wasn't the fun charming sweet guy we all thought he was. Not in a million years. Imagine the shock. I'm still shocked and honestly don't trust anyone any more. Not really truly. The mask is real and they are good ones. Seriously, you cannot know for sure who is standing next to you.

Don't let the bastards win. Good people are all around you. I'm sorry you had that experience. 

[possibilities]

What show of this sort doesn't treat their ensemble as superheroes? Athena as superhero is nothing compared to the worshipping they do of Rob Lowe over on 911: Lone Star. 

So, I like seeing Athena be a badass, generally speaking. 

I agree this episode was like Cold Case. I probably would have liked it more if I had tuned in for Cold Case. I just really want this show to be about rescues. For what it was, it was fine. But I don't really want this show to be that.

Edited October 4, 2022 by possibilities

[Redrum]

9 minutes ago, possibilities said:

What show of this sort doesn't treat their ensemble as superheroes? Athena as superhero is nothing compared to the worshipping they do of Rob Lowe over on 911: Lone Star. 

I really want a crossover where Captain Strand and Athena solve crimes by beating up a crowd of zombies, stop school children from being eaten by sharks, rescuing people from a fire by sliding down elevator cables, and then gravely and respectfully shaking each other's hand, knowing they have met their equal but can never indulge their rising passion. 

Then they do indulge their passion and we get hot Angela Basset/Rob Lowe sex. Then Bobby walks into the room, and sees them doing it and loses his mind and kills them both with his fire ax that he just happens to be holding....

Then Bobby wakes up and tells Athena she can never go to Austin. 

[tinderbox]

I enjoyed this “Cold Case” type episode of 911.  It doesn’t even bother me that the 45 year old truck was still in operation or that the little girls bedroom was untouched for the same amount of time.  I loved that it was different and unexpected and that I never lost focus by glancing at my iPad, which I usually tend to do while watching tv.

Am I looking forward to upcoming regular 911 episodes?  Of course.  However, this one intrigued me.  Kudos to whoever came up with the idea of trying it.  

[Irlandesa]

8 hours ago, Redrum said:

1. Athena's parents still live in the same home after 45 years.

2. Junior and his parents still live in the same home after 45 years. I know its not stated that Junior lives at home but he does live within easy hang out with dad and help the old neighbors distance.

3. The family of the murdered girl never sold the home and the daughter lives in the same house after 45 years. Complete with an untouched for 45 years bedroom. 

4. Junior or Junior's dad, still owns the SAME antique truck that backfires exactly the same after 45 years. 

1. My parents have been in the same house for 45 years and counting so I don't find that surprising at all.

.2. They also have had many of the same neighbors over that time.

3. It's possible they hung onto the house hoping she'd come home.  They left it as a shrine.  Remember, she disappeared.  They didn't know she was truly dead until they dug up the house. 

4. Ha.  Okay, that is a stretch.  But maybe it's new vintage-like car. 

[possibilities]

44 minutes ago, Irlandesa said:

It's possible they hung onto the house hoping she'd come home. 

Her sister straight up said that's why she kept the house, and that now she can sell it and move on.

[shapeshifter]

23 minutes ago, tinderbox said:

It doesn’t even bother me that the 45 year old truck was still in operation

Just to obsess a bit——which I earned the right to do when helping my ex vainly trying to get a similar truck running back in the 80s:
If it was the same truck, it would now be about 65 years old, not 45, since it was about 20 years old at the time of Tanya's murder.
But:

34 minutes ago, Irlandesa said:

4. Ha.  Okay, that is a stretch.  But maybe it's new vintage-like car. 

Maybe this👆 explains it a bit. Some people luv a specific vintage vehicle and fix them up for resale.
So it would still be 65 years old, but not the same truck. 
IDK. Seems like parts would be expensive now, since I doubt there are used ones in wrecking yards anymore.🤷‍♀️
So I'm not sure it would be any less of a stretch.

[chediavolo]

17 hours ago, Clanstarling said:

Given that the pick up truck's pop-pop sound was prominent in one of the first scenes, I knew it narrowed down to Junior and his dad.

I have no problems with spending this time on the mystery of the dead girl. I liked the way it played out, even though Warrior Athena can be a bit much sometimes. She also did a great job of struggling with her emotions.

I was glad to see Athena's father could speak, albeit slowly and with deliberation. To my understanding, strokes can affect different things depending on their location. I'm also not sure whether the swelling was due to the stroke or the car accident. But in any case, since we won't be spending a lot of time with Athena's parents other than some verbal updates in the future, I don't have a lot of need to know the details.

But it will be good to go back to the crew and in particular see how Hen is dealing with her failure in med school.

How convenient they still own that pick up 45 years later!🙄

[Empress1]

11 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

1. My parents have been in the same house for 45 years and counting so I don't find that surprising at all.

.2. They also have had many of the same neighbors over that time.

3. It's possible they hung onto the house hoping she'd come home.  They left it as a shrine.  Remember, she disappeared.  They didn't know she was truly dead until they dug up the house. 

4. Ha.  Okay, that is a stretch.  But maybe it's new vintage-like car. 

Yeah, living in the same house for 45 years isn't weird to me. Not everyone downsizes when their kids leave, or needs to move to a house without stairs or whatever when they age (and I don’t think that house had stairs, a lot of Florida homes are ranches). I can think of several relatives I have who live(d) in their homes for that long or longer (one just passed away but she lived in her house for a good 50 years).

I found the bedroom thing a little creepy, but I can understand how taking the stuff out made things “final” and could see how that would be too hard.

With the truck, I just assumed that they had been maintaining it, including replacing parts as needed. Lots of people drive vintage cars and that was a cool-looking truck, so I could see keeping it running if you know how to “upgrade” parts, or know someone who knows how to upgrade parts. I have an uncle who had the same Mercedes for 35 years until he gave it to his son’s friend who is into vintage cars - and he did that, like, a year ago and was still driving it.

Edited October 5, 2022 by Empress1

[Madding crowd]

I found it a little disturbing to see the little girl being touched by her killer and then her being chased. Usually when we see a child killed on TV we only see her before she was taken and then see her parents getting the news. This was good but I’ll be happy to get back to the regular rescues.

[DearEvette]

So a prequel and a sequel to the Athena Begins episode.

This was a good one.  Yes, I like the regular rescues, but I also like the little one-off forays into the more character driven episodes or the fun high concept ones (like the bank heist).  This felt like a 9-1-1 version of a bottle episode almost in that it was a single location and a very tightly plotted single story. 

I like Bobby and Athena so I was happy to spend a little time with them.  They are yet another example of a couple getting together and not having to give us couple angst to show them working together and being a good matched pair.

Young Athena's mother was so warm and loving.  What the heck happened there?  What made her so mean?

"Shut up Barney Fife." LOL.  Young Joanne was a pistol.   But Barney wasn't so bad.  He was nice to little Athena and seemed to care.  But poor adult Joanne.  The guilt.  No wonder she looks so torn up.

I loved the music and the last scene with them inter-cutting young Tanya running in the orange grove with Athena was very affecting.  Especially with the Nina Simone music.

I agree with everyone about the truck though.  The truck sound was so distinctive that only now Joanne links the sound?  She has to have heard that truck many times before.  Either it would have been so familiar as to not have made any impact on her recollection or it would have been so distinctive and rare that it would.  But given that it seemed Junior and his dad has had that same truck and tooling around in it and not had the engine checked fro 45 years it is hard to believe she would not have made the connect.  Or when she did she would not automatically know it was their truck -- so Bobby wouldn't have been the one to make the connection.

Good episode.  But yeah. ready for more rescue hijinks!

[Clanstarling]

12 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

Just to obsess a bit——which I earned the right to do when helping my ex vainly trying to get a similar truck running back in the 80s:
If it was the same truck, it would now be about 65 years old, not 45, since it was about 20 years old at the time of Tanya's murder.
But:

Maybe this👆 explains it a bit. Some people luv a specific vintage vehicle and fix them up for resale.
So it would still be 65 years old, but not the same truck. 
IDK. Seems like parts would be expensive now, since I doubt there are used ones in wrecking yards anymore.🤷‍♀️
So I'm not sure it would be any less of a stretch.

Living in a town where an annual event is the parade and display of really, really, old cars (even Model T's), I have no problems with the truck's age. The pop-pop sound, on the other hand seems unlikely as surely whatever part made that sound would have been replaced by now. And as @DearEvette says, Joanne must have heard that sound many times (especially close to her sister's disappearance, when the concrete was poured), so that part seems unlikely too.

But even so, it was a decent enough story line, and I did like seeing Athena and Bobby on their own, out of their usual context.

[kwnyc]

Slightly O/T but not really: Cold Case was a helluva show, and I love that people still remember it, and specific cases, years later.

[Redrum]

Just now, kwnyc said:

Slightly O/T but not really: Cold Case was a helluva show, and I love that people still remember it, and specific cases, years later.

Its a fantastic show and its extremely sad that it rarely gets syndicated and only exists on DVD for non us countries 

[possibilities]

3 hours ago, Madding crowd said:

I found it a little disturbing to see the little girl being touched by her killer and then her being chased.

It was definitely disturbing. I liked that they showed it, though. It made it more real, without going too far and making it exploitative. It's a delicate balance. You don't want to sanitize it so it's too abstract, but you also don't want to go too far. I thought they struck a good balance, showing the spirit of the girl, her switching from gratitude for the offer of a ride, to discomfort and then panic as she realized what was happening. And how she tried to defend herself, and get away, she escalated from "give him the benefit of the doubt by saying she didn't like it and moving away" and when that didn't work, she ran. So often portrayals fail to humanize the victims and show them as having agency. I really liked the way they navigated between "innocent child" and "but she isn't clueless". It's sad that even an 8 year old is aware enough to react so lucidly, but I believe it. Because that's the world we live in, always trying to be open, relaxed, at ease living our lives, not leap to conclusions or think the worst of anybody, but able to pivot quickly. It's exhausting because of the familiarity of the situation.

[marceline]

I enjoyed this episode even though the story itself was a mess for all the reasons already cited. The 45-year old truck was more than I could stand. As soon as we heard that Sanford & Son junkmobile putt-putting I knew it was Chekov's truck.

I like Bobby and Athena as a couple and this episode showed why. I love how Bobby supports Athena while also respecting her independence. He lets her call the shots until the moment he thinks she's in danger whether physically or emotionally. I like in the last episode when he confronts Athena's mother then apologizes and Beatrice tells him it's okay because it's his job to look out for her. We saw it again when he disarmed Joanne. In fact my favorite scene was when the cops load Athena in the police car and Bobby and Athena both make these sort of "Well here we go again" hand gestures to each other.

Two compliments I have to make:

• I always have issues with Ryan Murphy projects for a number of reasons but one thing he gets right in his work is the music. Hearing Easy (Like Sunday Morning) by the Commodores took me back to watching my parents dancing to that song. Rubberband Man by the Spinners for the party then the Nina Simone at the end? Stellar work.
• Once again I have to give this show credit for how it addresses gun safety. When Bobby left Joanne's house he looked at her gun on the counter and said "Now lock that thing up." We've seen Athena put her gun in a safe and grab it from there numerous times. I wish more show's would consider modeling responsible gun ownership.

Edited October 5, 2022 by marceline

[Empress1]

2 hours ago, Redrum said:

Its a fantastic show and its extremely sad that it rarely gets syndicated and only exists on DVD for non us countries 

I think that’s because rights to the music cost a ton (the music was a really important part of the show, for those who don’t know - they’d prominently feature music from the era the case was in, so if it was 1994 you’d hear Nirvana), so it might be too expensive to syndicate.

2 hours ago, possibilities said:

I thought they struck a good balance, showing the spirit of the girl, her switching from gratitude for the offer of a ride, to discomfort and then panic as she realized what was happening. And how she tried to defend herself, and get away, she escalated from "give him the benefit of the doubt by saying she didn't like it and moving away" and when that didn't work, she ran.

That child actress was great - she did convey “oh good, my sister’s friend is going to take me home” to “this is wrong” to panic and fear really well.

[Crashcourse]

I hope Athena's father becomes well enough for him and his wife to visit Athena and Bobby.  Then Bobby walks into his office/bedroom and finds the father rambling through his papers out of curiosity. 

[Redrum]

20 minutes ago, Crashcourse said:

I hope Athena's father becomes well enough for him and his wife to visit Athena and Bobby.  Then Bobby walks into his office/bedroom and finds the father rambling through his papers out of curiosity. 

You know... speaking as someone who's done this with an elderly parent, it rang true. In my case, I had traveled cross country to assist the living parent with the deceased parent's business and financial affairs. However I could only go into the deceased parent's office and look thru paperwork if the living parent was available to sit in the room and watch me.... and they had lots of other things going on, or were tired, or were "not ready" to deal with things. As much as I wanted to be sensitive to their feelings, I was burning thru my vacation time to help out. I started getting things sorted etc while living parent was out and got soundly yelled at for "being sneaky" and "dishonest".... and meanwhile there were a ton of financial decisions that had to be made. In the show situation, Bobby and Athena are assholes for wanting to get the porch area fixed because its not their house so leaving the place open to the elements until Mom is ready to cope is wise? Bobby at the desk was going thru papers to see if he could clear the dad of a murder charge.... is he less of an ass if he let's the sick old man go to prison rather than violate the office space?

These aren't easy decisions to make.

[Crashcourse]

2 minutes ago, Redrum said:

Bobby at the desk was going thru papers to see if he could clear the dad of a murder charge.... is he less of an ass if he let's the sick old man go to prison rather than violate the office space?

All Bobby had to do was ask Athena if it was ok to go through her father's papers.  Instead, she found him there.  They could have gone through the papers together.  But no, Bobby felt like he was entitled to do so alone.  

Full disclosure:  I don't like him anyway, and this episode made me dislike him even more.  

[Redrum]

2 minutes ago, Crashcourse said:

All Bobby had to do was ask Athena if it was ok to go through her father's papers.  Instead, she found him there.  They could have gone through the papers together.  But no, Bobby felt like he was entitled to do so alone.  

Full disclosure:  I don't like him anyway, and this episode made me dislike him even more.  

I mean is he a stranger or a welcomed member of the family?

I'm no fan of Bobby either. My little nick name for him is Captain Manpain.

I just relate to this 

Edited October 5, 2022 by Redrum

[Crashcourse]

20 minutes ago, Redrum said:

I mean is he a stranger or a welcomed member of the family?

I'm no fan of Bobby either. My little nick name for him is Captain Manpain.

I just relate to this 

My point was that Athena should have been with him.  

[Ailianna]

On 10/3/2022 at 10:39 PM, Demian said:

21 minutes ago, Crashcourse said:

My point was that Athena should have been with him.  

And his point was that she was acting like if she ignored it, everything would go away.

[I can't get this weird quote box to go away.]