The Anarchists

[DanaK]

Quote

A 6-episode documentary series that airs on HBO Sundays at 10pm ET and streams on HBO Max starting July 10

In 2015, Jeff Berwick, a Canadian entrepreneur turned provocateur, launched a conference in Acapulco, Mexico in hopes of promoting anarchy in its purest form - an ideal espousing the absence of government with absolute individual self-rule. The event, called "Anarchapulco," draws an international array of libertarians, fugitives, and families seeking to "unschool" their children to protect them from the bureaucracies of modern life, as well as crypto-currency evangelists and others attracted to the idea of creating a stateless community, free from governments and central banking systems. Unfolding over six years, THE ANARCHISTS chronicles a strange and deadly series of events.

THE ANARCHISTS follows individuals engaged in this movement with full access to the drama that ensues as a community tries to live alongside tourists and drug cartels with only the principles of anarchy as their guideposts. The loosely defined ideology proves unable to hold the community together and many of the radical expats eventually find their dream of an anarchist paradise crumbling around them. Ultimately, this stranger-than-fiction tale evolves from a critique of our modern culture into a dramatic observation of the limitations of ideological thinking and the consequences of rejecting consensus.

[sadie]

First ep! They had me at the opening scene of burning books and adults encouraging some serious rage and profanity from their children. I know where this is headed as I know the story of two of the people introduced here. As to the rest, fascinating what babble people will buy if you only say it convincingly enough and dont think too hard. 

[Darian]

I knew every single person  in this would deeply, violently annoy me and yeah, they did. But I'm still interested enough to watch at least one more. It's not that I'm wishing active harm on the dude that smugly yelled about not subsidizing women's pregnancies but he might feel differently if he became a quadriplegic or something else debilitating and didn't have a trust fund. 

[DanaK]

Pretty interesting first episode. I think freedom movements, including anarchy and libertarianism, only work well in small groups. So if these folks want their freedom from paying taxes, rejecting consensus, and thinking only of themselves, among other things, let them go find a place that allows them to live how they like, as long as they aren’t committing violence. Acapulco certainly seemed like a bad choice given the violent drug cartels nearby

As for the unschooling concept, I think it probably works well for some kids, but I think most need some kind of structure to make sure they learn the important stuff

[Guest]

9 hours ago, DanaK said:

Acapulco certainly seemed like a bad choice given the violent drug cartels nearby

Frankly, it seems like the perfect place for allllll of the people because every single one of them was some sort of insufferable edgelord. I am seriously rooting for the drug cartel in this equation.

As for the Freemans: "Ooooo...my child just runs around and screams, 'fuck' all day! My last name is 'Freeman'! We're gonna burn books!" Ooooo...so edgy!

LOL ... Circus called and said they need their clowns back.  

Lady Freeman also needs to free herself of those ridiculous watermelons she got installed as well.

Still love how all these people want to "think freely" when they're the ones following some cult leader who's only using them to push his crypto Ponzi scheme. 

[DanaK]

What folks like these never seem to realize is that freedom is never completely free. If they lived completely alone in the wilderness providing only for themselves, they don't have to live with any rules. Starting getting a crowd, then some rules are needed or you have chaos

Edited July 15, 2022 by DanaK

[Welshman in Ca]

For the most part they all struck me as just modern day hippies who want to live without any rules to follow but once you start to get a group there has to be rules even if they're only implied or it would be okay to murder each other & take what you want without any interference, any actual rules would mean that you eventually end up back where you started in a society with rules & some form of government to make sure the rules are followed.

It might be a bit extreme but they all need to find an island to live on without all of the modern day things that we have & let them figure it out for themselves and once they've figured it out let us know by sending a message in a bottle.

A bunch of self righteous idiots who think they know better than everyone else, I'm siding with the cartels from whom they buy their drugs on this one.

[DanaK]

1 hour ago, Welshman in Ca said:

For the most part they all struck me as just modern day hippies who want to live without any rules to follow but once you start to get a group there has to be rules even if they're only implied or it would be okay to murder each other & take what you want without any interference, any actual rules would mean that you eventually end up back where you started in a society with rules & some form of government to make sure the rules are followed.

It might be a bit extreme but they all need to find an island to live on without all of the modern day things that we have & let them figure it out for themselves and once they've figured it out let us know by sending a message in a bottle.

A bunch of self righteous idiots who think they know better than everyone else, I'm siding with the cartels from whom they buy their drugs on this one.

I think in the end, people like this just want to make their own rules to live by and not a larger society that they don't agree with. Libertarian types just want to take care of themselves with what they can pay for and to heck with anyone else who can't afford private police and fire protection

[MCMLXXVII]

On 7/15/2022 at 8:34 AM, Giant Misfit said:

Frankly, it seems like the perfect place for allllll of the people because every single one of them was some sort of insufferable edgelord. I am seriously rooting for the drug cartel in this equation.

As for the Freemans: "Ooooo...my child just runs around and screams, 'fuck' all day! My last name is 'Freeman'! We're gonna burn books!" Ooooo...so edgy!

LOL ... Circus called and said they need their clowns back.  

Lady Freeman also needs to free herself of those ridiculous watermelons she got installed as well.

Still love how all these people want to "think freely" when they're the ones following some cult leader who's only using them to push his crypto Ponzi scheme. 

Agreed. Also, the fact that these types almost always move to a poorer, browner country to find “freedom” is peak colonialism.

[DanaK]

Some thoughts as I watch the second episode:

The guy who cited Jesus as an anarchist and also wanted to make sure he had a lot of money seems to forget Jesus lived simply. These anarchists certainly seemed to have a lust for money given how much they scorned everything about regular regulated society. And cryptocurrency? Ok dudes

These folks used social media, which is funny since they scorned much of modern society

Lily and John Forester realizing that the cryptocurrency stuff was starting to take over the movement in unwanted ways was interesting foresight and hindsight. But they were against the organization being run top down (especially by the Freemans) instead of more free and experimental, which makes it kind of hard to remain cohesive as a group

Bunch of dolts all around

[Guest]

OMG I cannot with these names: Juan Galt, John Galton, Irebel (so edgy! so clever!)? I wonder if any of these morons bothered to look up their hero's biography where good old Ayn Rand died penniless relying on -- wait for it -- NOT HERSELF but the benevolence of government-sponsored programs, Social Security and Medicare? 

These lower-level "anarchists" are just getting played by wealthy buffoons shilling their Ponzi-scheme crypto bullshit like the "Freemans." The "Freemans" were already loaded before moving to Mexico (where I guess there aren't any taxes to be paid LOL) when they realized they had many more marks there to enrich themselves. And I guarantee their money is STILL in US stocks and banks earning income that doesn't involve cRyPtO. 

The whole thing is a SCAM -- much like that stolen ATM that was supposed to "print" bitcoins. 

Speaking of, that dude who transported that ATM in his rickety school bus is a complete and total psycho. I mean, ALL of these people are psychos but he, in particular, seemed like a dangerous one. 

I feel for that hippie girl who couldn't watch that cringey "rap" video made by the other millionaire (whose name I forget, thankfully). I regret having even seen just the snippet of it they showed on this doc. 

[sadie]

This remains gripping to me. How is the Freeman’s poor baby going to feel, when one day, she wants to live anywhere but their apartment and can’t get a passport, drivers license or bank account because she has no birth certificate. What idiots. Newsflash: you can have a home birth in America, they made it sound like we haul pregnant women off to hospitals to have tortured birthing processes regardless of the mothers wishes. And their holier than thou attitude about everything is just grating. 

I must have missed the passage in the Bible where Jesus says “fuck the government”? Maybe I just have a bad copy. Lol 

I guess I’m a brain washed American because I think despite all our problems (I know there are many) this is still the greatest country in the world. I would like to see one of these baboons get hauled off to a Mexican jail and then tell me how free they are when they realize there is no due process. Methinks they would be screaming for help then. It just rubs me wrong how they spit on our nation and act like it makes them smarter than the rest of us.

[DanaK]

2 hours ago, Giant Misfit said:

OMG I cannot with these names: Juan Galt, John Galton, Irebel (so edgy! so clever!)? I wonder if any of these morons bothered to look up their hero's biography where good old Ayn Rand died penniless relying on -- wait for it -- NOT HERSELF but the benevolence of government-sponsored programs, Social Security and Medicare? 

These lower-level "anarchists" are just getting played by wealthy buffoons shilling their Ponzi-scheme crypto bullshit like the "Freemans." The "Freemans" were already loaded before moving to Mexico (where I guess there aren't any taxes to be paid LOL) when they realized they had many more marks there to enrich themselves. And I guarantee their money is STILL in US stocks and banks earning income that doesn't involve cRyPtO. 

The whole thing is a SCAM -- much like that stolen ATM that was supposed to "print" bitcoins. 

Speaking of, that dude who transported that ATM in his rickety school bus is a complete and total psycho. I mean, ALL of these people are psychos but he, in particular, seemed like a dangerous one. 

I feel for that hippie girl who couldn't watch that cringey "rap" video made by the other millionaire (whose name I forget, thankfully). I regret having even seen just the snippet of it they showed on this doc. 

Yeah, funny that the Freemans are preaching anarchy and freedom, but are the ones in charge of the Acapulco stuff, are very rich and control the conferences and don't let other people steal their thunder.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, DanaK said:

are very rich and control the conferences and don't let other people steal their thunder.

Don't you mean "fork" their thunder? OMG..."fork." These fucking people.

2 hours ago, sadie said:

I must have missed the passage in the Bible where Jesus says “fuck the government”? Maybe I just have a bad copy.

Was the guy who said that the one from Chicago who never worked and let his wife support them and then she ditched him for some crypto bro after they arrived in their Anararcoparadise? That guy. He had all the freedom he ever wanted in the U.S.! He didn't have a job and did what he wanted the entire time! But, you know, the wOrLd BaNk had it in for him or something. 

[merylinkid]

Ahhh Anarchists.   "We don't like rules, America sucks."   "Let's go to Acupulaco, the most Americanized city in Mexico and set up our own place."    Bonus, we don't even have to learn a new language or try to fit in with a different culture.   We don't even have to worry about security as long as we stay in a very defined area.    Said security is, of course, paid for by the taxpayers of Mexico.

The Freemans "No rules, you can say fuck all you want."   "Oh wait someone said 'Fuck you' to US, that cannot be allowed."  IRebel is so going to change her name when she is 18.   Also, great your kid can say fuck all she wants, but can she read or write?   Oh and that measuring they do when babies are born?   It's called the Apgar test and has literally SAVED millions of babies lives.   But you know you get all bent out of shape over something you don't understand.  

The Fowlers.   Ahh yes,  how UNFAIR that the cops went through your drugmobile.   I mean at least be freaking discreet about as long as marijuana remains illegal.   But its all peace and love, and everyone should do their own thing.   But if we have a conference, the organization of a panel who has to do all the work and sell tickets, only gets 50%.   Who gets the rest?

Paul.   Was he really in the military?   And if so was he anything but a REMF?   Because he did a lot of that pseudo military crap you see wanna bes pulling.   Until the fecal matter hits the rotating blade and then they run away.

I'm with other posters, I'm rooting for the cartels.  I am also totally watching every episode because this makes The Way Down and QAnon look sane.

Edited July 24, 2022 by merylinkid

[DanaK]

Episode 3 had more things of people and things falling apart. Never put all your money and investments in crypto currency; it’s just too risky. Freeman getting pushed aside from planning the annual conference because he was supposedly so bad at actual logistics. That military guy slowly going insane, openly selling cocaine that apparently pissed off other people selling drugs (to the conference attendees) and being killed by some unknown men. What a mess

[sadie]

Wow. So, a bunch of people that label themselves as people that don’t want to live by rules, call themselves anarchists, then get upset when other people don’t follow the rules they think THEY should follow because they all over there thinking they were smarter, at the top of the new food chain, and entitled to their new freedom but only so far until you didn’t step on their toes. Well who saw that coming (said no one). 

Why does everyone look so dirty? And every time they show the streets and roads and buildings (outside the convention hotel) does everything look like a third world country. Ive never been to Mexico and this certainly isn’t making me want to.

The final scene was chilling and as bad as I felt for that poor girl screaming for help on a Facebook feed (A FACEBOOK FEED), all I could think was their “fuck America, we shouldn’t have to pay taxes or live by your laws” attitude got them there. I’m sure she would have liked to dial 911 when they needed help, but wait, there is no 911 there and the cartel doesn’t give a shit about entitled ex-pats trying to live like outlaws. America ain’t looking so bad now is it. I’m not saying that poor guy deserved to be murdered but what did they think was gonna happen in this corrupt violent part of the world they picked as their nirvana. How long did they think they could deal drugs, you know being “stealthy” about it as she described, the cartel don’t play, and eventually they aren’t going to take kindly to you moving in on their business. Frankly the cartel ARE the real anarchists and all these dumb Americans just look stupid.

[Welshman in Ca]

Every new episode makes them look more & more like a bunch of hippies trying to get rich quick but at least the hippies were honest about their drugs & free love & not trying to wrap their greediness in a cloak of anarchy which bears no resemblance to an actual anarchist movement.

And WTF is up with that one girls skin? It looks like it's being eaten away by some unseen virus.

[DanaK]

57 minutes ago, Welshman in Ca said:

And WTF is up with that one girls skin? It looks like it's being eaten away by some unseen virus.

Bad acne maybe? It looks like her skin is clear in the recent interviews

What should a true anarchist movement look like, other than chaotic (unless it’s a really small group)?

Edited July 25, 2022 by DanaK

[MCMLXXVII]

I thought her skin looked like a Face of Meth, but that’s just me.😒

[merylinkid]

So I took notes during this episode so as not to forget anything.    So this may be a bit stream of consciousness and disjointed.

Anarcharists who fly to conferences on Gulfstreams.   ooooookaaaaay.   Although I am laughing my ass off at all the Bitcoin Stans.   That 2018 crash was nothing to now.   But still Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahaha.   Also wonder how many of the "anarchists" are calling for government regs now thaat they lost their money in unsecured exchanges, etc.

Not to mention SPONSORSHIPS of a conference for a group that doesn't believe in Rules and Regs.    That Avengers opening was gag inducing.   Like the Avengers are heroes.   You guys are just a bunch of control freaks who hate when others have control.   You are every VILLAIN in the Avengers, not the good guys.

Yes that is both the Fowlers and the Freemans.   They are just petty bickering little children "no anarchy this way."  "you are doing anarchy wrong, I don't want to play with you anymore."   Lily got all pissed because Paul wasn't following the RULES for Drug Dealing.   Hey isn't the whole freaking point no rules.

And really died laughing when the Freemans got pushed out of the conference they took over.   HOW DARE the founder find someone who actually knows how to run things?   Doesn't he know who WE ARE?????    They were also pissed at Paul for cutting out their own drug deals.   Which hello, Anarchy.   If you can deal drugs, so can he.    Of course, neither one knew how bad the cartels were living in their privileged little Ex-Pat bubble.     Lisa Freeman is not a nurturing soul.   She is controlling.   She wants things HER WAY.   So she will "mother" you to get it.   You could see how PISSED she was at Nathan during the conference because he wasn't doing what SHE wanted.   of course, he's a fucking narcissist too.   "How do you fix a broken world."   Well not by creating a conference to push the scam of the century, Bitcoin.   But like only HE can run things and only HE knows what the conference is about and how to do it and only HE can fix the world.   They deserve each other.

Paul.   Paul is a dumb fuck.   Pure and simple.   The more I see how he behaved, the more I HIGHLY doubt he was in Iraq.   Unless they show his DD214, I will not believe he was there.   It's too many stories.   You know how you tell a real special ops guy?   He's the one NEVER talking about special ops.   real special ops guys don't brag about their ability to kill or how strong they are, etc.   Because the first thing you learn is to SHUT THE HELL UP.   Also there are psych tests.   It's really not about strength or even brains, they look for a certain personality.   Which Paul DOES NOT HAVE.    

2 hours ago, MCMLXXVII said:

I thought her skin looked like a Face of Meth, but that’s just me.😒

I agree.

So there is a shooting right at the gate.   And Lily's first thought is to go on Facebook?   Same with John, "oh I've been shot" let me LIVE STREAM IT.   Then they do call for help and nurturing mothering Lisa's first thought is "we ain't leaving this house."   Not "oh hey one of our group needs help."   Also what sheltered lives all these VERY WHITE folks led.   They didn't realize how bad the violence was in Mexico until they went to a cemetary.   Like had they never seen a newspaper?    Watched a news program.    Read TWITTER for heaven's sakes?  

Yeah this is a whole bunch of self-centered people who decided to live their own lives and found out the rest of the world doesn't see them as special.

[zenithwit]

This docuseries is a bit of a slow burn but I'm digging it so far.  Also, it's hilarious to me how even a group of self-proclaimed "anarchists" end up as a bunch of corporate sellouts.

[cmfran]

I'd be shocked if Lily and John weren't from wealthy families. They probably followed Phish before getting involved in "anarchy." 

I was going to bail on this after the first ep because all these idiots made me irrationally angry, but I kept with it and chose to laugh at all their nonsense. My favorite was when they moved the conference to a different resort because the first one wasn't nice enough for their standards. Hilarious.

[merylinkid]

59 minutes ago, cmfran said:

I'd be shocked if Lily and John weren't from wealthy families.

Oh probably.   "We want things OUR way and don't think we should have to follow Rules" is very much an entitled, I've never had to deal with consequences attitude.   Anyone who has had to budget doesn't have TIME to take off to Anarchapulco just for fun.   

I went to law school with a self-styled "anarchist."    He loved to brag about all the changes he implemented at his college.   Turns out his daddy was president and let him do stuff.   He certainly didn't have to worry about being expelled.   He had the same "its we all come to together in agreement on what to do."    I'm all "that government dude."   But yeah definitely privileged WHITE background.

[KristenR]

On 7/25/2022 at 10:24 AM, sadie said:

I’m sure she would have liked to dial 911 when they needed help, but wait, there is no 911 there

There is, in fact, 911 in Mexico. They rolled it out two years before the shooting. She’s just an idiot. 

[sadie]

11 hours ago, KristenR said:

There is, in fact, 911 in Mexico. They rolled it out two years before the shooting. She’s just an idiot. 

Good to know, yes she is just an idiot. (And I know I shouldn’t laugh around anything surrounding a murder but your

post did make me laugh -I’ll go sit in the corner now.) 

[DanaK]

Episode 4:

Man, what a mess with the cartel killing John and wounding Jason and the fallout from that. Someone (either them or Paul) effed around with selling drugs in the face of the cartel and people suffered the consequences. Paul was clearly a nutcase. Lily hid or moved John’s body and stayed away from the police because she didn’t want to get deported; that to me would have been the safer option. And the disregard for safety after the murder from conference leaders in order to keep the conference going was nuts

I felt so bad for John’s mom and grandmother trying to retrieve his body.

Most of Lily and Jason’s fellow anarchists pretty much left them on their own, which was a clear sign of how soulless these people were

People trying to figure out how to deal with Paul Propert’s increasing threats was interesting (and why didn’t Facebook kick him off?). Jeff’s crappy attitude was you handle your own business. People die, but no big deal, we have to stick to our principles and build our ideology. Sheesh

[meep.meep]

1 hour ago, DanaK said:

I felt so bad for John’s mom and grandmother trying to retrieve his body.

Most of Lily and Jason’s fellow anarchists pretty much left them on their own, which was a clear sign of how soulless these people were

Me too.

Isn't that the definition of anarchists?  You do you and I won't care.

[DanaK]

34 minutes ago, meep.meep said:

Me too.

Isn't that the definition of anarchists?  You do you and I won't care.

Jeff certainly made that really clear in his opening conference speech. It definitely seems to be the definition of most if not all libertarians. It's odd that these "don't tell me what to do" people end up grouping up and then wondering why such things fall apart

Edited August 1, 2022 by DanaK

[sadie]

I have issue with Henza saying “John fell victim to a drug war”, no, John participated in the drug trade ( whether weed, cocaine, whatever) and lost his life in a lawless country where the cartel rules the day. Lily and John fled America to avoid American law and punishment thinking they could do what they wanted in Mexico. It’s very sad this young man lost his life but he wasn’t some innocent bystander on the street hit by a stray bullet. Live by the sword die by the sword and all.

Lily's back story tells me this girl never had a chance.I hope she’s learned something and is no longer look g for drugs to support her lifestyle. She certainly looks healthier in her talking heads. 
 

Why didn’t John’s family call the consulate? Isn’t that what they do? Although, again, not surprised that they were extorted over John’s ashes, Mexico is known to be corrupt, why do these people all keep expecting American like treatment in a place that they fled to in order to avoid American ways and laws.

Sad sad story all the way around on this ep.

[merylinkid]

1 hour ago, sadie said:

ily's back story tells me this girl never had a chance.I hope she’s learned something and is no longer look g for drugs to support her lifestyle. She certainly looks healthier in her talking heads. 

Definitely looked healthier and more together.   Maybe John dying saved her in a way.

1 hour ago, sadie said:

why do these people all keep expecting American like treatment in a place that they fled to in order to avoid American ways and laws.

they hate American rules, but still expect to be protected by them.    typical entitled idiots.

[merylinkid]

Okay, back to back posts, but this one is on the episode itself.   I took notes again.

The Freemans -- oh look they still suck.   I think they were more upset about Anarchapulco being "taken away from them" than John's death.   Although they found it "stressful."   But not stressful enough to go "oh hey we can use this to our ends, let's make our own conference."   The same thing they bitched about Lily and John doing.   Of course, Lily and John were beneath them.   "Lily and I don't talk."  And OF COURSE John was selling coke and it got him killed.   Not like the Freemans deal with the actual cartel to be an authorized ealer.  

Someone is screaming that people have been shot and at least one person is dead on Facebook and everyone just goes "what happened?  Can you believe it?"    Erika is a wonederful person.   She belongs on a commune not in an anarchist cult.   She's definitely more the kumbaya work together for the greater good type.   I hope she finds peace.

And of course the conference is all "Oh no, this might affect the conference."   Someone is DEAD.   Someone you knew and the reaction is "damn messed up the conference."   While distancing yourselves as fast as you fucking can.   "John?  Nope, never heard of the guy, nothing to do with us.   Have you been the crypto seminar yet?"   The bit at the end "Oh well people die.   it happens, no biggie."   

Then there's Lily.   Who is the biggest idiot of them all.   "The State oppressed me since birth."   Your mother was fucking drug dealer.   that's not the State.   that's your mom's choice to expose her kids to that.   You know, choosing her own thing.   She even called it "My mom doing shady things."   Yeah sorry but your mom wasn't driving around in a car full of weed, she was doing heroin, and meth.   BTW, apple didn't fall far from the tree.   Lily grew up to be a drug dealer too.   Just selling edibles over here where its not illegal.   Trying not to get deported to face drug charges in the US.   To the point she didn't want the guy who murdered the only person who ever mattered to her put in jail.   Guess her freedom mattered more.   Just like all the other "anarchists" me, me, me, I want, I want.   The remark that really pissed me off?   When she said Paul hired "some poor ass people" to kill John.   Way to put your white privilege out there sweetcakes.  

Erika is the only likable one.   That's because she has a heart.

[DanaK]

1 hour ago, merylinkid said:

Okay, back to back posts, but this one is on the episode itself.   I took notes again.

The Freemans -- oh look they still suck.   I think they were more upset about Anarchapulco being "taken away from them" than John's death.   Although they found it "stressful."   But not stressful enough to go "oh hey we can use this to our ends, let's make our own conference."   The same thing they bitched about Lily and John doing.   Of course, Lily and John were beneath them.   "Lily and I don't talk."  And OF COURSE John was selling coke and it got him killed.   Not like the Freemans deal with the actual cartel to be an authorized ealer.  

Someone is screaming that people have been shot and at least one person is dead on Facebook and everyone just goes "what happened?  Can you believe it?"    Erika is a wonederful person.   She belongs on a commune not in an anarchist cult.   She's definitely more the kumbaya work together for the greater good type.   I hope she finds peace.

And of course the conference is all "Oh no, this might affect the conference."   Someone is DEAD.   Someone you knew and the reaction is "damn messed up the conference."   While distancing yourselves as fast as you fucking can.   "John?  Nope, never heard of the guy, nothing to do with us.   Have you been the crypto seminar yet?"   The bit at the end "Oh well people die.   it happens, no biggie."   

Then there's Lily.   Who is the biggest idiot of them all.   "The State oppressed me since birth."   Your mother was fucking drug dealer.   that's not the State.   that's your mom's choice to expose her kids to that.   You know, choosing her own thing.   She even called it "My mom doing shady things."   Yeah sorry but your mom wasn't driving around in a car full of weed, she was doing heroin, and meth.   BTW, apple didn't fall far from the tree.   Lily grew up to be a drug dealer too.   Just selling edibles over here where its not illegal.   Trying not to get deported to face drug charges in the US.   To the point she didn't want the guy who murdered the only person who ever mattered to her put in jail.   Guess her freedom mattered more.   Just like all the other "anarchists" me, me, me, I want, I want.   The remark that really pissed me off?   When she said Paul hired "some poor ass people" to kill John.   Way to put your white privilege out there sweetcakes.  

Erika is the only likable one.   That's because she has a heart.

I was thinking Lily had way more heart than folks like the Freemans and was more a dippy hippy than an anarchist, but after denying she and John were dealing behind the cartel’s back, she pretty quickly confessed that John was often doing his own thing at times. Way to throw your dead husband under the bus, plus she didn’t care to have the police arrest his killer, I guess because she didn’t want to be deported

By Erika, you mean the woman who offered Lily a place to stay in Belize? That lady was definitely one of the very few of these people who seemingly had a heart, especially compared to the unnamed people who told her to stay out of it. 

I don’t get these people saying they were a community but then being all too willing to leave people to deal with their own troubles. I guess that’s one of the issues with these kinds of ideologies

Edited August 2, 2022 by DanaK

[cmfran]

On 7/30/2022 at 11:11 AM, merylinkid said:

Oh probably.   "We want things OUR way and don't think we should have to follow Rules" is very much an entitled, I've never had to deal with consequences attitude.   Anyone who has had to budget doesn't have TIME to take off to Anarchapulco just for fun.   

I went to law school with a self-styled "anarchist."    He loved to brag about all the changes he implemented at his college.   Turns out his daddy was president and let him do stuff.   He certainly didn't have to worry about being expelled.   He had the same "its we all come to together in agreement on what to do."    I'm all "that government dude."   But yeah definitely privileged WHITE background.

Seems I was wrong about John and Lily. Definitely not from privileged families. 

After watching so much footage where everyone talks about how psycho Paul was, why were so many people helping him, letting his stay with them etc.? Regardless of whether or not his veteran status was legit, dude is mentally ill and a danger to society. I hope he's in jail somewhere.

[DanaK]

46 minutes ago, cmfran said:

Seems I was wrong about John and Lily. Definitely not from privileged families. 

After watching so much footage where everyone talks about how psycho Paul was, why were so many people helping him, letting his stay with them etc.? Regardless of whether or not his veteran status was legit, dude is mentally ill and a danger to society. I hope he's in jail somewhere.

It seems strange people were so willing to help Paul who was clearly having mental issues but not help Lily and Jason hide from the cops

[merylinkid]

Paul got them drugs.   Lily and Hazan could get them deported and their little paradise shut down.

[DanaK]

I think I'm a little confused. In Episode 3, wasn't Paul the military guy slowly going insane who was then killed by some guys who caved his head in or something or was that someone else?

[carrps]

I was vaguely aware of this series, but it didn't look like something I'd be interested in. But I saw a short interview with the film maker this morning and binged the first four episodes. Damn. Or should I say Fuck because we're freeeeeeeee.

I love these "anarchists" who say they built their own world....in the middle of a existing built up city in a luxury hotel. They talked about most people being in a bubble. These people were in a bubble in a bubble. The Freemans. Sigh. Both Irebell and Axiom (OMFG) are changing their names when they hit 18. Did they ever say the older daughter's name? Too normal???

[Guest]

On 8/1/2022 at 10:46 AM, DanaK said:

People trying to figure out how to deal with Paul Propert’s increasing threats was interesting (and why didn’t Facebook kick him off?).

Probably because they were generating a lot of ad revenue from his page. Trash company. 

On 8/1/2022 at 8:50 PM, merylinkid said:

"The State oppressed me since birth."   Your mother was fucking drug dealer.   that's not the State.   that's your mom's choice to expose her kids to that.   You know, choosing her own thing.

Exactly. The state had nothing to do with her "oppression." And while she did look healthier in her later interviews, she most definitely was doing meth with John Galton (LOL that name) hence the horrific skin issues and her wraith-like appearance. Also likely the reason the guy was targeted for assassination. 

On 7/25/2022 at 1:24 PM, sadie said:

Frankly the cartel ARE the real anarchists and all these dumb Americans just look stupid.

This is exactly correct. It's the cartel who are the true anarchists. They don't have a fuck to give about "the state," its laws, or the fucking tourists who are squatting there LARPing as "anarchists." The "Freemans" acted pretty damn quick in giving up their fReEdOmS to the cartel who are, essentially, their owners but the "Freemans" are too up their own asses to admit it. 

I forget which chud said it but I recall one of them saying their mission was to destroy "the state" and the "world bank." Which is super easy to assert if you're flying around on your private Gulfstream and surrounded by bodyguards.

These people are utterly delusional. It's like I'm watching a real-life reenactment of the Human Centipede. 

[monagatuna]

Of coooourse they're Bitcoin Bros. 

And I got a good laugh at the question "Did they call the police?!" when John was shot. Um, they're anarchists, I don't think anyone's gonna be calling the cops anytime soon. I'm not laughing at John's death--stupid choices or not, that was sad--but the knee-jerk, pearl-clutching reaction of "call the police!" when an anarchist gets shot is just too, too rich.

Lily was definitely methed up prior to John's death. Her skin healed like magic and she looks a million times better now.

[sadie]

I guess I don’t understand this movement. Towards the end of ep 5 when they are saying things like “the leadership just wasn’t there” is confusing. The definition of anarchy is: a state of disorder due to absence or no recognition of authority. There is not supposed to be leadership? It seems to be what these lunks really wanted was to set up their own managed governed movement, not engage in anarchy. Everyone was happy when they were making money and posing like rock stars but when the cracks started to show how quickly it became every man for himself. 

While John’s death was sad, who didn’t see it coming in one form or another? And did John not know Lily was doing meth (sorry but she obviously was), their whole lifestyle from evading US authorities to how they were “supporting” themselves in Mexico was going to end badly.

And I won’t ruin it for everyone but I couldn’t help google “where are they now”, I hope it is covered in the final ep because the irony is thick. 

[DanaK]

Episode 5 thoughts:

We talked about Ericka being one of those who wanted to help rather than ignore members of the group in need. Author Thaddeus Russell seemed to go further and understood how crappy Lily was being treated and tried to get the community to help. He indicated in his interview how dangerous it was to be an anarchist in Mexico and said how easy it was for crypto billionaires to escape governments, banks and states but very hard for people like John and Lily with far less resources to do so. And he nailed it right there. The rich folks could do what they wanted without much consequence while the poorer folk couldn’t. People tend to want to rely on community no matter the ideology and rich douches doing their own thing and looking the other way when people are in trouble while supposedly building up a community spoil that. Berwick was a prime example of that crappy attitude. I really disliked him. I felt the same way about the Freemans

[merylinkid]

No notes this time.   

BUT OMG, I just cannot with Linda.   Lily needs help and she is all "Lily who?"   But she helps Paul -- who is credibly accused of the murder get out of Mexico.    Then when the news comes about Paul, like the narcissist she is, makes it all about her.   "Oh because I am such a mother figure, I just wanted to  help him and I failed."    Bitch, you didn't even lift a finger to help Lily who was the victim.   You literally said it was Lily's and John's fault for selling drugs.   While you were trying to be "save" the guy who was ACTUALLY selling the drugs.   Guess Lily didn't kiss her ass enough while Paul actually treated her as the special person she thinks she is.   

Both the Freemans are butt hurt snowflakes.   Someone else gets credit for the 2018 conference, you know who actually ran things WELL, and they are just sitting there fuming.   Then they got all irked about not being able to just sell shirts if they wanted to.   The same people who ran Lily and John out of Anarchapulco for not following the Freemans' rules for the conference.   They are such freaking hypocrites.   Anarchists they aren't.   What they are is wanna be capitalists who love it when they are on top but when they get treated how they treat others whine and complain and get butt hurt.

John/Shane got all mad at the government because they shaved his head in the boot camp program.   Dude, it was your hair or life in prison.   Easy choice.   As he found out, hair grows back.    He got off EASY.    Yet "oh the state is oppressive."

Lily the crazy lady in the parking lot didn't foresee you were going to Mexico.   it was SAN DIEGO.   The chances that SOMEONE she was ranting to was going to Mexico were going to be pretty big.   She probably tried that spiel on people all damn day.

[One Imaginary Girl]

I liked the irony of Nathan complaining that Jeff drank a lot at the convention when there were multiple shots of Nathan taking swigs from his flask.  And then he was filmed driving home!

[carrps]

Yes, I think the Freemans annoy me more than almost anyone else. They're such smug hypocrites. Big old fakey fakes.

[cmfran]

On 8/10/2022 at 11:30 AM, carrps said:

Yes, I think the Freemans annoy me more than almost anyone else. They're such smug hypocrites. Big old fakey fakes.

I was thinking the same thing. What a sad life they lead. Nathan is no different than a high school kid complaining about who likes him or doesn't like him, not getting invited to things, etc. So anarchist. 

Funny how they pivoted to yoga and peace when Jeff kicked him out of the conference.

[sadie]

Well the movement certainly crashed and burned didn’t it. Everything was great for all these people until it wasn’t. Seems none of them were really very happy. For everything they were “escaping” there was another price to pay. Ironic Freeman died, in part, because he didn’t have health insurance. Losing their money to another get rich quick scheme and then having to forego medical care because you don't have the money for care is just tragic, and in their case, ironic.

Lily finally admitting her lifestyle with John was stressful and, frankly, not much fun, hit home. The conference imploding because this was never anything more than another conference where the goal was for the promoters to make money, vs an actual lifestyle people could adopt became very apparent in the end. As the one woman said, there was no community when it came down to it, they were all in it for the money and that’s where it stopped. Super interesting documentary, I really enjoyed this one. 

And on a shallow note, I hope to never see anyone try to get rid of dreads again, it was just yuk. 

[DanaK]

Why did Berwick get the last word though?

I haven't fully seen the last episode yet, but though I initially thought 6 episodes would likely be too much, it ended up being just about right, even if the subject matter was somewhat obscure

[DanaK]

Final episode thoughts:
John’s grandmother and mother seemed like really good people, especially the former. Too bad it was John in part who was preventing Lily from contacting her dad. Lily looks so much better without dreadlocks. I wonder if she was taking care of them correctly because they didn’t look good on her or John. She does seem like she’s found some measure of peace

Berwick sounded like he was starting to edge towards getting involved in the men’s movement or at least espousing their views. “Men need to become much stronger men again”

I think you can create a community from ad hoc circumstances, but I’m not sure the leaders, like Berwick, really cared to do so here. He just seemed to want to preach his philosophy

Now that I think about it, it’s not clear to me if the annual conference ended

Edited August 16, 2022 by DanaK

[merylinkid]

I was starting to wonder why we only saw Linda in the talking head.   But while I was wondering that, I laughed my ass off at Lily being a speaker at Anarchapuco in 2020 after the Freemans escaped to San Miguel.   The person the Freemans despised is still part of the conference and they aren't.   

So Nathan after complaining that Berwick was drunk all the time at the conference, literally drank himself to death.   Leaving behind his family and 3 young kids.   Guess being special was more important than your family.    I'm sure they appreciate the freedom to say fuck all the time rather than having a dad.  

Of course the community fell apart.   It was never a community.    That would require rules for people to get along.   It was a bunch of people who wanted to do what they wanted when they wanted and they didn't like being told no.   Most people didn't give a damn about anyone else or what anyone else needed.    One guy said its about treating others how you want to be treated.   Well maybe.   but the Freemans were about being on top, the lessers should treat them accordingly.   If they don't they don't deserve notice.   ANd they would get pissy about it too.   John just seemed to use people too.   Not surprised he turned out to be abusive.  The rest of them weren't about treating others as they wanted to be treated.   It was all about fun and no rules.   Until it wasn't fun anymore.

One last shallow note - DAMN it takes a lot to undo dreads.   I would not have had the patience.   I'd have shaved it off and started over.   Lily looks MUCH better with straight clean hair.   Some people can look good in dreads, she is not one of them.

@DanaK    according to the website they are planning 2023.   I read somewhere that 2022 was happening too.   So, it is still going on -- with VIP tickets to anarchist event.   Think about that one for a second.

Edited August 16, 2022 by merylinkid