S12.E05: In Hot Water

[RealHousewife]

4 minutes ago, Surrealist said:

I don't watch WWHL, but heard Crystal now claims that the "dark comment" was something else entirely.

Are we going to find out what it was?

[Surrealist]

2 minutes ago, RealHousewife said:

Are we going to find out what it was?

It'll be hinted at for the next five years.

[lawrbk]

1 hour ago, nichelle said:

While I don't believe I would have reacted the way that Crystal did, I don't see the difference. The issue is that I, as a person of color, want others to see color. See the whole me. I don't live in a world where color is not a factor in my life, therefore, I appreciate it when people see my complete self. 

I think Sutton means well. I really do. There is just opportunity for education, and it is much easier to get there when everyone speaks *and* listens.

Listening is key. I’ve mentioned on another post that I’m a 51 year old white woman. In our day (lol I sound ancient) we were taught that was the ‘liberal’ thing. To not see color, that being colorblind was the goal. If you were white and noticed color it was underlying racism. You wouldn’t even be able to describe what a micro aggression may be. We’re in a different place now. Now we actually hear FROM BIPOC what should/shouldn’t be considered racist. And, as Garcelle said, if you don’t see color, you don’t see her. As well as noting that it’s white people who have the privilege to say they don’t see color. So I absolutely get where Kathy and Sutton were coming from in the ‘not seeing color’ discussion last season. It’s what they were told their whole lives was the ‘right’ way. But there’s a whole new world of discussion out there and I think Sutton, at least, is open to it. I imagine she’s had some great conversations with Garcelle. Who, by the way, has done more to explain some of these issues then she’s been given credit for. Certainly in comparison to the RHONYC implosion.  

Edited June 9, 2022 by lawrbk

[Mar]

4 hours ago, Keywestclubkid said:

My white child in a pool with a black child and a Asian child in the jucuzzi and a red headed Irish catholic child and I said this is how it’s supposed to be 

is it ill worded yes but I’m not seeing “dark” in that .. but maybe I’m missing something.. and I could be …

Not only do I not see anything dark in the comment that Sutton made, I didn’t see anything even remotely inappropriate about it. Really, what am I missing?

[bencr]

4 hours ago, eleanorofaquitaine said:

I think that Crystal was probably trying to move forward but she probably should have just said, "here's what Sutton said, I found it problematic." Because much as I think Sutton's "I don't see color" stance is naive, that is all that it is, really, IMO - naive.

Crystal has a right to find it problematic (IMO, it is a problematic belief that comes from white people with privilege who don't understand that "not seeing color" is a privilege not afforded to BIPOC individuals) but by not putting it out there, it's become a bigger thing than it would have been if she had just said what it was.

I agree with all this. I just think it's too bad that Crystal chose to focus on what was problematic about what Sutton said rather than what was kind about Sutton's intentions. This could have been a much more productive conversation.

Edited June 9, 2022 by bencr

[Mar]

Whoa, both Sutton and Rinna have “heard things”  about Crystal from other people, Including some of Crystal’s  friends.  The plot thickens. Is this going to be dropped or re-addressed in the future?

[hoodooznoodooz]

At the Mezquite Beach Bar & Grill, they all look like they’re wearing dresses they bought at a mall. A mall with a Sears as one of the anchor stores.

[emmawoodhouse]

5 minutes ago, Mar said:

Whoa, both Sutton and Rinna have “heard things”  about Crystal from other people, Including some of Crystal’s  friends.  The plot thickens. Is this going to be dropped or re-addressed in the future?

Correction: Crystal's EX friends. I hope Sutton and Garcelle go for the jugular. 

[CrinkleCutCat]

55 minutes ago, Surrealist said:

I don't watch WWHL, but heard Crystal now claims that the "dark comment" was something else entirely.

No no no no….. Crystal had plenty of opportunity at that dinner table to claim that. Too late now, her moment has passed.

[RealHousewife]

34 minutes ago, lawrbk said:

Listening is key. I’ve mentioned on another post that I’m a 51 year old white woman. In our day (lol I sound ancient) we were taught that was the ‘liberal’ thing. To not see color, that being colorblind was the goal. If you were white and noticed color it was underlying racism. You wouldn’t even be able to describe what a micro aggression may be. We’re in a different place now. Now we actually hear FROM BIPOC what should/shouldn’t be considered racist. And, as Garcelle said, if you don’t see color, you don’t see her. As well as noting that it’s white people who have the privilege to say they don’t see color. So I absolutely get where Kathy and Sutton were coming from in the ‘not seeing color’ discussion last season. It’s what they were told their whole lives was the ‘right’ way. But there’s a whole new world of discussion out there and I think Sutton, at least, is open to it. I imagine she’s had some great conversations with Garcelle. Who, by the way, has done more to explain some of these issues then she’s been given credit for. Certainly in comparison to the RHONYC implosion.  

I'm slightly younger than Crystal and get this. I think I don't see color was intended to mean you didn't fixate on color and saw everyone as human beings. We've all known people who do this-mentioning someone's race telling a story when it's not relevant, focusing on a minority's color/background and not seeing them beyond it. I don't think it was ever intended to mean "I literally don't see color, and all our life experiences are the exact same. I don't care where yo come from, and you do not go through unique struggles. Racism was a long time ago."

[Rosebud1970]

Rinna’s mother dies, but Dorit insists on making Lois’ death about HER.

Sorry, Dorit. Your 15 minutes about your fake trauma is, like, you know, over.

Lisa has lost her mother, her last remaining parent, for realz. And you, Dorit, are still dining out on the alleged ‘robbery’.

Please stop. This isn’t The Dorit Show.

[SemiCharmedLife]

As much as I haven't liked Rinna these last few seasons, I always loved it when Lois was on the show.  She could have swapped with Rinna anytime and we all would have been much happier.  It's sad she is gone, but she has left lasting impressions on so many, including the viewers.

[Hiyo]

Quote

Did Diana send her security team ahead to make sure the accommodations are secure?

At least dust free.

[Hiyo]

Quote

So Crystal’s mission of taking down Sutton is completed — without getting her hands dirty.

I don't see her trying to take down Sutton. At all.

[Hiyo]

Quote

I won't cut Rinna any slack on ordering (presumably beef) tenderloin well-done.

Bad enough she'll only be taking 1 or 2 bites from it...

[SemiCharmedLife]

Judging from the previews, many of the ladies are going to continue to gang up on Sutton.  Erika's wearing her Teflon underwear- (oh, wait, she doesn't wear underwear!)- so nobody will say "boo" to her, despite her terrible attitude and lies. 

I have read something (on Reddit, so take that with a grain of salt) that speaks to why the Sutton take-down:

Spoiler

Teddi Mellencamp is desperate to get back on the show. She is tweeting all kinds of anti- Sutton messages and wants to create more interest/drama so she will be invited back.  The FF5 are all wanting Teddi to replace Sutton.   Also, a reminder that Crystal and Teddi are long time friends...

[Haute Messe]

3 hours ago, dbell1 said:

Dorit has ground floor suite trauma. K. 😑 I’ve got trauma from that widow’s outfit in all her talking heads.

Right??? Loved your whole post but this made me howl. 😂

[Hiyo]

Quote

I understand why Crystal found Sutton's comments problematic. Saying "I don't see color" is also saying "I don't see the obstacles and challenges that people of color face everyday." Crystal was also seemingly saying to Sutton, "it's not enough to live in a fantasy-world where you think that children from BIPOC families have the same opportunities as white kids."

So sure, it's problematic but it's basically "well-meaning but tone-deaf rich white lady" problematic. I can also see why Garcelle didn't really find it offensive. 

Quote

My initial evaluation of Crystal last year was that she was a snake who decided to choose the weakest gazelle at the water pond as a target as a way of placing herself into some drama for the purpose of having a story line and invitation to return for another season.

Except it was Sutton who started all the drama with Crystal. Crystal wasn't choosing anyone to go after.

Quote

I can only wonder who her target would be if Sutton were not there.  

Probably nobody, again, since Sutton was the one started it all...

Quote

I think Sutton, at least, is open to it.

Yeah, she at least is willing to reflect and look back and learn something from that experience. And listening to people. If only more people were like her.

Quote

I just think it's too bad that Crystal chose to focus on what was problematic about what Sutton said rather than what was kind about Sutton's intentions.

Yeah but back then Sutton was a bit more closed-minded than she is now, and didn't seem as willing to listen. So that probably skewed her view of Sutton's intentions.

Quote

Crystal's EX friends. I hope Sutton and Garcelle go for the jugular. 

Crystal still seems to be on good terms with both of them, so...

Quote

And you, Dorit, are still dining out on the alleged ‘robbery’.

Whatever happened to her business? Is that still happening?

[Surrealist]

32 minutes ago, SemiCharmedLife said:

Judging from the previews, many of the ladies are going to continue to gang up on Sutton.  Erika's wearing her Teflon underwear- (oh, wait, she doesn't wear underwear!)- so nobody will say "boo" to her, despite her terrible attitude and lies. 

I have read something (on Reddit, so take that with a grain of salt) that speaks to why the Sutton take-down:

  Hide contents

Teddi Mellencamp is desperate to get back on the show. She is tweeting all kinds of anti- Sutton messages and wants to create more interest/drama so she will be invited back.  The FF5 are all wanting Teddi to replace Sutton.   Also, a reminder that Crystal and Teddi are long time friends...

I saw another post that theorized the reason Kyle, Erika, and Rinna are helping to drag out this fight between Crystal, Sutton, and Garcelle is to create discord and divide them. They don't want the three to be friends. Plus all three have a ton of fan support.

Edited June 9, 2022 by Surrealist

[film noire]

15 hours ago, eleanorofaquitaine said:

I understand why Crystal found Sutton's comments problematic. Saying "I don't see color" 

Agreed,  but those are not the comments Crystal referred to in such dire terms  ("very dark" "hurtful" "would get her cancelled"  etc - all of which left me thinking Sutton had let loose with a string of ethnic slurs worthy of a Klan meeting). It was Sutton's memory of a pool and jacuzzi full of diverse kids enjoying themselves together that Crystal found so dark and troubling. 

Quote

Crystal was also seemingly saying to Sutton, "it's not enough to live in a fantasy-world where you think that children from BIPOC families have the same opportunities as white kids."

I didn't see anything in the "kids" conversation that would lead Crystal to fairly assume Sutton was saying that - when Crystal said Sutton's memory of those kids together was "Not enough, you have to go further" Sutton didn't disagree, which doesn't seem like the response of someone living in a fantasy world blindly claiming all BIPOC kids are doing just fine.

I like Crystal, but this has revealed her to be untrustworthy, imo, and until she owns up to the impact of her insinuations, none of them should assume any friendship with her is genuine, or let their guard fully down (other than Erika:  Crystal knifing that grifting, low-down flea-bag in the back would endear Crystal to me all over again.)  Because of Crystal's lack of transparency, I don't have much patience for whatever it is (emotionally) that's driving her to throw out insinuations of dark & hurtful racist comments, further mysterious accusations on WWHL - all while respecting only her own feelings as valid -  which would not have been the case if she'd been clean-handed with this from jump.  She weaponized whatever her issues are, instead of sharing them. And it annoys me no end that she carries around her own issues, with no self awareness (see: Crystal trying to shame and mock Garcelle re: "Rorschach" - "I know! These are big words!" - beyond ugly. And for the record: you are not superior to Garcelle in any way,  Crystal,  so just zip it). 

I'm also annoyed watching promising cast members turn into assholes with no pay-off or purpose - Andy Cohen throwing nasty shit at the wall, just to see if it sticks.  This show is not built to handle that kind of freight; to genuinely take on vital issues like race, class (or trauma). It all ends up feeling glib, shallow and very disheartening, because nothing is accomplished.  The dynamic cheapens issues that should be treated with respect, kills off any possibility of light-heartedness,  and doesn't leave any room for anything fun - ridiculous moments, foolish fights that amuse not enrage,  unexpected moments of camaraderie - instead, another dining scene with yet another vicious-spirited conversation. Makes me feel complicit in dumbing down crucial issues in the world,  and stupid for watching this show. 

Edited June 9, 2022 by film noire

[CallmeCray]

5 hours ago, Keywestclubkid said:

You are allowed to be offended Crystal… but don’t get mad when other people don’t take offense to the same thing or in the same way (you don’t see how that’s offensive to Garcelle) 

Excellent point.  Taking it a little further, the fact that others do not have the same feelings or response is not “denying your experience”.  

[Cheezwiz]

2 hours ago, Surrealist said:

I don't watch WWHL, but heard Crystal now claims that the "dark comment" was something else entirely.

Oh, good grief. She needs to just stop. They also should have added an eye-roll emoji to all the new emoticons!

[CallmeCray]

1 hour ago, film noire said:

Agreed,  but those are not the comments Crystal referred to in such dire terms  ("very dark" "hurtful" "would get her cancelled"  etc - all of which left me thinking Sutton had let loose with a string of ethnic slurs worthy of a Klan meeting). It was Sutton's memory of a pool and jacuzzi full of diverse kids enjoying themselves together that Crystal found so dark and troubling. 

I didn't see anything in the "kids" conversation that would lead Crystal to fairly assume Sutton was saying that - when Crystal said Sutton's memory of those kids together was "Not enough, you have to go further" Sutton didn't disagree, which doesn't seem like the response of someone living in a fantasy world blindly claiming all BIPOC kids are doing just fine.

I like Crystal, but this has revealed her to be untrustworthy, imo, and until she owns up to the impact of her insinuations, none of them should assume any friendship with her is genuine, or let their guard fully down (other than Erika:  Crystal knifing that grifting, low-down flea-bag in the back would endear Crystal to me all over again.)  Because of Crystal's lack of transparency, I don't have much patience for whatever it is (emotionally) that's driving her to throw out insinuations of darkly racist comments, further mysterious accusations on WWHL - all while respecting only her own feelings as valid -  which would not have been the case if she'd been clean-handed with this from jump.  She weaponized whatever her issues are, instead of sharing them. And it annoys me no end that she carries around her own issues, with no self awareness (see: Crystal trying to shame and mock Garcelle re: "Rorschach" - "I know! These are big words!" - beyond ugly. And for the record: you are not superior to Garcelle in any way,  Crystal,  so just zip it). 

I'm also annoyed watching promising cast members turn into assholes with no pay-off or purpose - Andy Cohen throwing nasty shit at the wall, just to see if it sticks.  This show is not built to handle that kind of freight; to genuinely take on vital issues like race, class (or trauma). It all ends up feeling glib, shallow and very disheartening, because nothing is accomplished.  The dynamic cheapens issues that should be treated with respect, kills off any possibility of light-heartedness,  and doesn't leave any room for anything fun - ridiculous moments, foolish fights that amuse not enrage,  unexpected moments of cameraderie - instead, another dining scene with yet another vicious-spirited conversation. Makes me feel complicit in dumbing down crucial issues in the world,  and stupid for watching this show. 

I agree with your whole post, but came to post the bolded.  She lost me for good with that one.  NOW, I feel like I know her, and I regret that I’d eased up and still had hope that she might be both real and likeable.  

Instead, I now believe she’s an entitled, condescending snob with a superiority complex.  Insulting the intelligence of a table full of grown women as she whines about being “triggered” by Sutton’s tale of a diverse group of innocent kids having fun splashing about in a jacuzzi…that’s rich.  🙄 I’ve felt from the beginning that she’s conflicted about being there, and I can’t say I blame her - but what I wasn’t picking up was that she thinks they’re beneath her.  That’s one thing that puts such a bad taste in my mouth, I’m automatically out - for good.

Film Noire, that last paragraph was pure 🔥!

Edited June 9, 2022 by CallmeCray

[ZettaK]

4 hours ago, Surrealist said:

I saw another post that theorized the reason Kyle, Erika, and Rinna are helping to drag out this fight between Crystal, Sutton, and Garcelle is to create discord and divide them. They don't want the three to be friends. Plus all three have a ton of fan support.

Kyle and Dorit attacked Sutton on a recent Watch What Happens Live about her reaction to Dorit's burglary, and the gala/charity event table. So this is STILL going on. Dorit also supported Erika by saying that she knows Erika was vindicated, and that the media ignore positive stories (about Erika), and highlight salacious ones (that's not verbatim). 

Edited June 9, 2022 by ZettaK

[Surrealist]

44 minutes ago, ZettaK said:

Kyle and Dorit attacked Sutton on a recent Watch What Happens Live about her reaction to Dorit's burglary, and the gala/charity event table. So this is STILL going on. Dorit also supported Erika by saying that she knows Erika was vindicated, and that the media ignore positive stories, and highlight salacious ones (that's not verbatim). 

To me, it's pretty clear what these women are up to with this nonsense.

Edited June 9, 2022 by Surrealist

[Baltimore Betty]

I think I will be referring to Crystal as "The Dark Crystal," for now on.

[RoseAllDay]

Why is Crystal on this show? Almost from Day One she’s had no real presence — no real storyline (other than the two-episode arc about Chinese New Year). Other than her basement and her $1,000,000 handbags, and a husband who’s responsible for The Lion King, we really know nothing about her. She’s just — there.

If the show has to dredge up a murky controversy from over a year ago that only she can explain (but won’t) to keep her relevant — and to throw another, more established castmate under the bus in the process — it’s time for her to go. She’s not even a FOH at this point.

I’m not much into guessing games, and unless Crystal says in plain words soon what exactly Sutton said, I’m FF-ing through her scenes. It’s passive-aggressive, tedious meanness, and even that isn’t being done well by HW standards.

Unless Sutton used some racial slur, or said something equally repellent, Crystal either needs to check her delicate sensibilities or hit the road. Yes, Sutton was equally cryptic about what she knows about Crystal’s MO, but Rinna seemed to cosign. And given that Crystal and Rinna haven’t had a lot to do with each other, I find this credible.

Crystal should have been a one-and-done. Bravo, stop trying to make this work, whatever it is. I’m done trying to figure this chick out.
 

[IslandGirl]

4 hours ago, film noire said:

 She weaponized whatever her issues are, instead of sharing them. And it annoys me no end that she carries around her own issues, with no self awareness (see: Crystal trying to shame and mock Garcelle re: "Rorschach" - "I know! These are big words!" - beyond ugly. And for the record: you are not superior to Garcelle in any way,  Crystal,  so just zip it.

Thank you for putting into words what bothers me the most: Crystal weaponizes her feelings (similar to when she felt so “violated”). As a person of color, I actually like when people don’t see color. If I have to hear one more time that I “don’t look like someone who’d play golf”…😡🤬 It’s fine that I don’t agree with Garcelle & that she wants her color seen; we don’t have to agree just because we both have dark skin 😊

What a piece of garbage Crystal is to tell Garcelle these are big words—now it could be said that’s about the most racist thing said so far Crystal…

[ZettaK]

4 minutes ago, Surrealist said:

To me, it's pretty clear what the others are up to with this nonsense.

And by perpetuating those storylines Erika remains in the background. There is no wonder she appears to be so happy.

She shouldn't be on the show. She offers nothing, she complains she cannot sell her designer clothes to buy new because the bankruptcy trustee doesn't allow it, she still owns expensive Cartier jewelry, and she is the darling of most cast members.

[JD5166]

Why on earth does Dorit get a pass after what she said about her servants?! Jesus. If this show wasn’t on at a great time for me, I would stop butnrigt now I am just bored. 

[Baltimore Betty]

2 minutes ago, IslandGirl said:

What a piece of garbage Crystal is to tell Garcelle these are big words—now it could be said that’s about the most racist thing said so far Crystal…

With this sort of behavior I am hoping that Crystal is digging herself a hole that she will disappear in to, this "storyline," is tiresome and dragging the whole cast down with it.

Sorry that people don't think you look like you'd play golf, maybe when you beat the pants off of them on the course they will reconsider their words!  I never leave the driving range and everything goes to the left...I hate it, the balls mock me so.

[Chatty Cake]

I think Sutton overdid it trying to back pedal her initial “I don’t see color “ comment and it came off cringeworthy and awkward. I don’t think it’s worth two plus episodes. I still want to like Crystal so I’m going to give her some time before I jump ship. Plus I’ll take that nonsense drama over Dorit.. Did anyone else think she was dressed like a widow in one of her talking heads?  
I had to rewind Lisa saying her moms age because I also thought she said 73 and 1/2 at first. Then it sounded like slightly garbled 3 in a way people don’t want to say their true age would say but viewers knew Lois was up there so I guess it just didn’t come out right. RIP Lois.  
I enjoyed Garcelle and her sister on the beach. 
Still don’t get why Erika is so mad at Sutton for questioning her last season when the others did too behind her back. Erika saw all this as the episodes played out. She knows Dorit, PK, Mauricio……..etc had questions. 

[Surrealist]

21 minutes ago, ZettaK said:

And by perpetuating those storylines Erika remains in the background. There is no wonder she appears to be so happy.

She shouldn't be on the show. She offers nothing, she complains she cannot sell her designer clothes to buy new because the bankruptcy trustee doesn't allow it, she still owns expensive Cartier jewelry, and she is the darling of most cast members.

For what it's worth, I don't mind Crystal calling people out on their hypocrisy or trying to convey to others how she's feeling.

What's happening to Crystal this season is what happened with Sutton last year. Both tried explaining to others how they were feeling and the others piled on and backed them into a corner. They reacted by responded defensively. 

I know some fans are turning on Crystal, and maybe she deserves some of that. I'm of the belief that the other women (Kyle, Erika, Rinna, and Dorit) are goading this storyline along for their benefit, and I think Crystal is being used to accomplish this goal. This all feels calculated in some way.

I do find Crystal's manner somewhat confusing. It's hard for me, sometimes, to figure out what's going on with her.

At any rate, I'm pissed that these women are choosing to back off Erika and her bullshit stories to instead indulge in this current pettiness.

Edited June 9, 2022 by Surrealist

[Keywestclubkid]

I officially can’t with Crystal at this point .. she had EVERY opportunity to say that that wasn’t the story she was talking about at that dinner but instead nodded and agreed that that WAS the story she was talking about … NOW she’s saying it was a different story? Girl STOP this no one believes you at this point 

[RoseAllDay]

4 hours ago, CallmeCray said:

I agree with your whole post, but came to post the bolded.  She lost me for good with that one.  NOW, I feel like I know her, and I regret that I’d eased up and still had hope that she might be both real and likeable.  

Instead, I now believe she’s an entitled, condescending snob with a superiority complex.  Insulting the intelligence of a table full of grown women as she whines about being “triggered” by Sutton’s tale of a diverse group of innocent kids having fun splashing about in a jacuzzi…that’s rich.  🙄 I’ve felt from the beginning that she’s conflicted about being there, and I can’t say I blame her - but what I wasn’t picking up was that she thinks they’re beneath her.  That’s one thing that puts such a bad taste in my mouth, I’m automatically out - for good.

Film Noire, that last paragraph was pure 🔥!

Crystal’s Rorschach dig was beyond insulting, and she really showed her hand with that. If she does think she’s too good for this group, well, then, BYE. 

My dislike started when she made Sutton melt down at Rinna’s garden party. That took some balls for a newcomer — not to mention the smirk on her face as she did it. I tried to give her the benefit of the doubt later on, but with this season, nope. When people show you who they are the first time, believe them. (Or however the quote goes.) 

Garcelle is just biding her time with all this, and when that reaches critical mass — 🫣🍿. But when that happens, I expect Garcelle to be seen as the Bad Person.

[Surrealist]

I'm not trying to sound all over the place about Crystal this season, since she kind of annoyed me last season. I'm trying to give her the benefit of the doubt.

She's made some valid points. I really, really wish this convo had been put to bed last season. This whole argument being drawn out in the way that it is is giving this season a weird vibe, so far.

I'm also hesitant to watch whatever went down between Kathy, Rinna, and racism.

Are these two storylines going to overlap, or will there be an end to the Crystal/Sutton/Garcelle argument on the show (since it seems like the three are friends IRL)?

Edited June 9, 2022 by Surrealist

[Surrealist]

11 minutes ago, RoseAllDay said:

Garcelle is just biding her time with all this, and when that reaches critical mass — 🫣🍿. But when that happens, I expect Garcelle to be seen as the Bad Person.

My favorite thing about last night's episode was when Garcelle took her sister to see the (teardown) house on the beach she bought and showed the plans. I love house porn, and her second house looks like it'll be really cool.

Edited June 9, 2022 by Surrealist

[Keywestclubkid]

15 minutes ago, Surrealist said:

My favorite thing about last night's episode was when Garcelle took her sister to see the (teardown) house on the beach she bought and showed the plans. I love house porn, and her second house looks like it'll be really cool.

her sister and this will be my summer vacation home ...lol loved it

[RoseAllDay]

7 hours ago, CrinkleCutCat said:

No no no no….. Crystal had plenty of opportunity at that dinner table to claim that. Too late now, her moment has passed.

Nope. She can’t keep moving the goalposts like this. Either spill it, or zip it.

If Andy is looking for a “villain” for this group, I’m sure there are others in the wilds of Beverly Hills who would do a much better job. Here’s where I wish LVP were still around. I can just picture her looking at Crystal with that withering gaze and letting fly some barb that cuts to the quick, not to mention the THs.

[bencr]

I can't imagine Erika is happy with how this season is going for her so far.

After losing the battle of public opinion to Sutton and Garcelle last season, Erika has pretty much been sidelined this season. She's reduced to playing the role of the crazy old uncle at the Thanksgiving table who just makes inappropriate comments, tells whopper lies that everyone is too bored to challenge, and nurses grudges.

[Surrealist]

21 minutes ago, Keywestclubkid said:

her sister and this will be my summer vacation home ...lol loved it

These are the kinds of moments I love on these shows. Her sister's hilarious. I hope Garcelle shows the progress of her house on the show, but I won't hold my breath on that.

I'll have to keep an eye on her IG, I suppose.

Edited June 9, 2022 by Surrealist

[CrinkleCutCat]

I’m needing an angry reaction button for goodness sake! There are things these heifers make me angry about and I need to react appropriately!! For example: every post here about Erika… I need to be able to label my opinion with an angry reaction. Why oh why has that option been taken away?

[Lady Lucy]

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Listening is key. I’ve mentioned on another post that I’m a 51 year old white woman. In our day (lol I sound ancient) we were taught that was the ‘liberal’ thing. To not see color, that being colorblind was the goal. If you were white and noticed color it was underlying racism. You wouldn’t even be able to describe what a micro aggression may be. We’re in a different place now. Now we actually hear FROM BIPOC what should/shouldn’t be considered racist. And, as Garcelle said, if you don’t see color, you don’t see her. As well as noting that it’s white people who have the privilege to say they don’t see color. So I absolutely get where Kathy and Sutton were coming from in the ‘not seeing color’ discussion last season. It’s what they were told their whole lives was the ‘right’ way. But there’s a whole new world of discussion out there and I think Sutton, at least, is open to it. I imagine she’s had some great conversations with Garcelle. Who, by the way, has done more to explain some of these issues then she’s been given credit for. Certainly in comparison to the RHONYC implosion.  

I was going to say this as well. There was a time (not long ago) that not seeing race was the "correct" thing to do - ie. I treat all people, no matter the color of their skin or their ethnic background, or whatever, the same. Everyone is equal.  That has now changed . . . now the "correct" thing is to SEE racial differences so you can understand the challenges people of color face.  Most of these women are of the age where they were taught not to see race. Crystal is much younger.  In many ways this is pretty similar to the problems RHONY faced when bringing in Leah and Eboni. It's an age gap issue and I think it's pretty clear (at least to me) that Housewives shows don't do well when you mix different generations of women. (I only watch NY and BH so there might be other cities where it has worked.)

That said, I don't like Crystal and I don't think she adds anything to the show.  

[SweetieDarling]

9 hours ago, nichelle said:

While I don't believe I would have reacted the way that Crystal did, I don't see the difference. The issue is that I, as a person of color, want others to see color. See the whole me. I don't live in a world where color is not a factor in my life, therefore, I appreciate it when people see my complete self. 

I think Sutton means well. I really do. There is just opportunity for education, and it is much easier to get there when everyone speaks *and* listens.

I remember the push to "not see color". My understanding of the intent of that, was to appreciate people as their complete self, and not judge, label or stereotype them from how they appear on the outside. I don't think it was intended to discount or ignore the struggles people go through because of their outward appearance, I think it was intended to try to ease or lessen those struggles by trying to get others to see beyond the color of someone's skin, and appreciate them (or not) for the person they are, and treat them accordingly.  There was no malevolent intent, to the best of my knowledge -either that or I grossly misinterpreted it at the time.

[Surrealist]

2 minutes ago, SweetieDarling said:

I remember the push to "not see color". My understanding of the intent of that, was to appreciate people as their complete self, and not judge, label or stereotype them from how they appear on the outside. I don't think it was intended to discount or ignore the struggles people go through because of their outward appearance, I think it was intended to try to ease or lessen those struggles by trying to get others to see beyond the color of someone's skin, and appreciate them (or not) for the person they are, and treat them accordingly.  There was no malevolent intent, to the best of my knowledge -either that or I grossly misinterpreted it at the time.

This is how I remember it too, even though I fully understand why it's perceived as problematic now. 

[CallmeCray]

8 hours ago, RoseAllDay said:

Nope. She can’t keep moving the goalposts like this. Either spill it, or zip it.

If Andy is looking for a “villain” for this group, I’m sure there are others in the wilds of Beverly Hills who would do a much better job. Here’s where I wish LVP were still around. I can just picture her looking at Crystal with that withering gaze and letting fly some barb that cuts to the quick, not to mention the THs.

Not to mention the fact that we’ve ALREADY got a built-in villain named Erika Girardi!  Interesting how they can pick and choose who gets a pass and who is left to squirm. 

It’s all gross. 

Edited June 9, 2022 by CallmeCray

[Cosmocrush]

12 hours ago, RoseAllDay said:

No room for the rest of the squad and Erika’s 10,000 tacky outfits.

No money. 

[pasdetrois]

7 hours ago, lizajane said:

I’ve got trauma from that widow’s outfit in all her talking heads

The Elizabethan headband alone sent me to my fainting couch.

Also, her lips look like a baboon's ass.

I don't think Crystal's motives are anything more than a determination to take Sutton down. Ever since the ugly leather pants shade. They aren't "friends;" Crystal has been biding her time. And Crystal is using her supposed "trauma" and "triggering" and "violation" to gaslight everyone - castmates, audience and production. She is a thug. I'm pretty sure there is no "dark" comment - I think she's lying through her teeth. She's playing a very sordid, ugly game.

Edited June 9, 2022 by pasdetrois

[MaggieG]

What in hell was Diana wearing on the plane? Please go to a store and pick a different outfit.

So did she make her assistant fly coach with all her bags so she can get there first and set up the room?

Every situation about Sutton is not about you Erika. You are not the victim. Stop. 

Crystal just needs to give this up. It's tedious and tiring. And her "I know, these are big words" comment was so condescending. 

Did Dorit speak Italian to the driver first before switching to Spanish? Only for the driver to respond in English 🤣 

I'm living for the preview for next week! Garcelle tells Erika: You're bugging the shit out of me

[Shauna]

13 hours ago, Straycat80 said:

I just noticed Erika walks like she just spent eight hours on a horse. 

Erika? What about Kyle.  She has a really crazy walk.  Have any of you noticed?  You can kind of see it when she answers the door when the newest housewife arrives (forget her name).  Kind of like her feet are turned outward.  It really is very odd.