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Smallville in the Media: Get Your News From Other Sources Besides The Torch Here!

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The NXIVM folks are doubling down, it appears:

https://nypost.com/2018/04/21/sex-cult-moves-to-brooklyn-and-is-ready-for-war/

I find it interesting that the odious Clare Bronfman is confident that Keith Raniere will be vindicated, but makes no mention of AM.

It probably doesn't matter because both of them are likely to spend at least 25 years as guests of the federal government.

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18 hours ago, Rina99 said:

I'm sure that comforted her victims as she burned her initials into their flesh.

I'm sorry that you seem to be unable to draw a distinction between Mack's professional work and her personal depravity, but I am perfectly willing and able to recognize her acting ability while condemning her personal actions. 

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1 hour ago, Bercilak said:

I'm sorry that you seem to be unable to draw a distinction between Mack's professional work and her personal depravity, but I am perfectly willing and able to recognize her acting ability while condemning her personal actions. 

If we're distinguishing the professional from the personal then the #metoo movement is misguided, isn't it? By that logic someone like, for example, Kevin Spacey shouldn't have been fired from House of Cards and All The Money In the World.

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I haven't posted in a Smallville-related forum in years, but had to come find this when I read the story. Jesus Christ.

I was a big Chloe fan in the day, and have read or viewed tons of AM interviews, then her blog. She always seemed sweet, but a little bit lost. She appears to have been a perfect target.

Unfortunately, you don't get to abuse and destroy other people because you've been hurt yourself. Although I can't say I don't feel sorry for how her life has devolved, she is an extremely dangerous person and should be removed from society for the safety of others. Mostly, i am horrified for her victims.

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Here's a first-hand account from one of AM's intended victims.

https://pagesix.com/2018/04/21/how-allison-mack-tried-to-lure-me-into-a-sex-cult/?_ga=2.189696875.1964778539.1524083492-1815346948.1524083492

All of the accounts of AM's appearance consistently describe her as gaunt with dark circles under both eyes.

Clearly, Rainere's formula of sleep deprivation and an 800-calorie-per-day diet was the key to bending victims to his will.

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5 hours ago, Katsullivan said:

If we're distinguishing the professional from the personal then the #metoo movement is misguided, isn't it? By that logic someone like, for example, Kevin Spacey shouldn't have been fired from House of Cards and All The Money In the World.

I don't think anyone here is saying Allison shouldn't be prosecuted for her crimes. If anything, this incident illustrates that women can occupy spaces on both sides of #metoo, as victims and perpetrators. However, AM's violence and willingness to exploit other women doesn't negate her talent. The world isn't that simple. If anything, I think AM's charisma and acting ability probably made her a more effective Number One to Raniere, scary as that is.

On the subject of #metoo, the analogy that comes closest in my mind is the Cosby case. I grew up listening to his albums and watching The Cosby Show, and when the accusations first began to gain steam I was devastated. There were so many of them I couldn't doubt that they were true, but ... this was America's Dad. It was horrible to think he had a monster inside him. Horrible because he was (and hell, probably still is), a very funny, very talented performer.

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This whole thing is so insane that I had to do some reading about it yesterday just to get my mind around all of this.

I checked Allison Mack’s Twitter, and she made several supportive tweets of #metoo (including mentioning Eleanor Roosevelt’s quote about how no one can make you feel inferior unless you let them(!)) from just this year, and it blows my mind that her twisted worldview let her say those things and abuse women simultaneously.

And unlike some cult members, she apparently didn’t cut her parents out of her life because she posted a recent picture of her and her mom hanging out, and I guess her parents worked for the cult, too. 

After watching the first season of Smallville, I only watched the last couple of seasons of the show (where her role had been minimized or after she had left), so I wasn’t a big fan or anything, but this story just horrified me so much that I had to try to read more to understand how something like this could happen.  But I still can’t comprehend it.  I feel terrible for her victims.  It sounds like Katherine Oxenberg has tried hard to deprogram her daughter, but the daughter may also be in too deep.

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I remember reading years ago how Allison was involved in an alleged cult, and that many were concerned.  I'm guessing maybe a lot of fans were totally unaware?

At any rate, it is deeply unfortunate to learn that not only did she remain in this group, but that she had apparently risen in the ranks to such a horrible and surprising extreme.

I definitely think her mind was gradually warped by this group until she became capable of this level of sick behavior.  And it honestly doesn't surprise me that any person could do the things she allegedly did and still think that they were doing good for women, for society.  The brain is a very powerful organ that can be twisted and molded into all sorts of shapes.  I don't think this has anything to do with "good and evil", "demons and monsters", or "free will and personal responsibility" either.

So I personally hope that Allison is able to somehow be treated and recover from everything that has occurred, and that she and all of the other victims of this organization receive justice, become survivors, and move on to a better life.

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4 hours ago, Peace 47 said:

I checked Allison Mack’s Twitter, and she made several supportive tweets of #metoo (including mentioning Eleanor Roosevelt’s quote about how no one can make you feel inferior unless you let them(!)) from just this year, and it blows my mind that her twisted worldview let her say those things and abuse women simultaneously.

 

There were a bunch of actors who wore #TimesUp pins that were later revealed to be sexual predators. 

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That’s fair.  It just makes me extra sad that a woman was among them, especially one who allegedly cloaked crimes in the guise of women’s empowerment.

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Regarding AM’d recruitment campaign:

1) Gross 

2) I imagine that her SM campaigns Demonstrate a series of aggressive efforts.  

3) I’m sorry for anyone who was even contacted.  They must feel like they dodged a bullet.  

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On 4/22/2018 at 4:06 PM, Flyingwoman said:

However, AM's violence and willingness to exploit other women doesn't negate her talent. The world isn't that simple.

Not trying to argue here, but sometimes the world actually is that simple.  Funny or not, Cosby is a serial rapist.  And rumor has it Hitler loved animals, too.  AM is no less evil IMO.

Edited by Winston Wolfe
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I don't know that the terms Good and Evil help us get anywhere at the end of the day. I am still trying to wrap my head around this like many of you because I was a huge Chloe fan. I really thought her to be a balanced enlightened person. I think that can still be true even given this new information. It's obvious she was seeking out some kind of purpose in her life and gradually wound up hurting people without realizing it. Or maybe she did realize it and enjoy the rush of power it gave her. Maybe, like fraternities that turn around and haze the newbies because they themselves were once hazed, becoming this guy's Number One felt like a victory after years or months of degrading herself for his pleasure.

There are so many elements at play in the story but I really can't boil it down to Allison Mack Is Evil. I'm definitely more willing to cut her some slack based on the fact that I loved her performance as that character she played for a decade on a show I watched, and that does bug me on some level. It also does bug me that because she's a woman I'm inclined to want her to be some helpless victim in the whole thing rather than someone actively hurting others. It's just easier to believe she's been led astray by a man, right?

But I think at the end of the day the only way we can get anywhere as a society is to remember that criminals are people who were dealing with their own mental illnesses, familial pressures, professional pressures and societal pressures when they snapped and started doing things they really shouldn't have.

 

Hopefully in the months to come, there can be something of an untangling of this mess. I would really like to better understand how Mack went from being the MVP of Smallville to someone this dilluded, broken and yes dangerous. I'm not going to throw the book at her and I'm not going to say she was set up either. I just hope that people can start to recover and that ultimately this can lead to a greater conversation about the ways people can be manipulated. That happens on a daily basis in all kinds of different scenarios and we aren't always prepared to know when we are being manipulated or how to prevent it from happening.

But then again, perhaps Mack had some really dark fantasies and decided to give herself the freedom to act them out at the expense of others. Who knows?

I somehow doubt that Kristin Kreuk knew nothing of this. Wasn't she the one who brought Mack into the cult? Didn't she stay in it for several years?

It'll be really interesting to see what the other former cast members of Smallville new at the time they were close with Mack.

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3 minutes ago, DisneyBoy said:

I would really like to better understand how Mack went from being the MVP of Smallville to someone this dilluded, broken and yes dangerous.

It's shocking how people can compartment their lives. A part of me feels like she went off to New York and made it sound like she was having acting opportuntities and acting classes and she really left people behind.  She could have had steady convention work but I don't recall her attending any since the show went off the air -- conventions are another way former cast mates stay connected.  In otherwords, it seemed like a proactive choice on her part to distance herself from the past. Yet she posted a dinner with her mother.  How could her mother not suspect?  AM is emaciated!  But she also strikes me as strong willed. So if she set boundaries, weaved a story that non-cult people "bought"....  I guess I see how she could have created the AM blog "persona" and it was completely separate from her cult dealings.  She's an actress, after all.  It's kind of her skillset. 

Still, disturbing. 

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50 minutes ago, DisneyBoy said:

I don't know that the terms Good and Evil help us get anywhere at the end of the day. I am still trying to wrap my head around this like many of you because I was a huge Chloe fan. I really thought her to be a balanced enlightened person. I think that can still be true even given this new information. It's obvious she was seeking out some kind of purpose in her life and gradually wound up hurting people without realizing it. Or maybe she did realize it and enjoy the rush of power it gave her. Maybe, like fraternities that turn around and haze the newbies because they themselves were once hazed, becoming this guy's Number One felt like a victory after years or months of degrading herself for his pleasure.

There are so many elements at play in the story but I really can't boil it down to Allison Mack Is Evil. I'm definitely more willing to cut her some slack based on the fact that I loved her performance as that character she played for a decade on a show I watched, and that does bug me on some level. It also does bug me that because she's a woman I'm inclined to want her to be some helpless victim in the whole thing rather than someone actively hurting others. It's just easier to believe she's been led astray by a man, right?

But I think at the end of the day the only way we can get anywhere as a society is to remember that criminals are people who were dealing with their own mental illnesses, familial pressures, professional pressures and societal pressures when they snapped and started doing things they really shouldn't have.

Hopefully in the months to come, there can be something of an untangling of this mess. I would really like to better understand how Mack went from being the MVP of Smallville to someone this dilluded, broken and yes dangerous. I'm not going to throw the book at her and I'm not going to say she was set up either. I just hope that people can start to recover and that ultimately this can lead to a greater conversation about the ways people can be manipulated. That happens on a daily basis in all kinds of different scenarios and we aren't always prepared to know when we are being manipulated or how to prevent it from happening.

But then again, perhaps Mack had some really dark fantasies and decided to give herself the freedom to act them out at the expense of others. Who knows?

I'm not inclined to cut Allison Mack any slack.  There is a tendency to view cults, in general, as one leader who is evil and the rest as victims.

But Mack's position in this cult is closer to Manson's followers (including a half dozen women) who murdered nine people or Jim Jones' inner circle (all women) who handled all the logistics necessary to carry out mass suicides and murder of over 900 including killing their children first.

Mack is #2 in this cult that is branding women, keeping, them as slaves, blackmailing them and I'm sure there are a hundred other crimes I haven't read about.  And her ability and willingness to become a high ranking abuser means that I have no desire to sort through how this could happen to someone who was on a TV show I watched.

I'll leave that to the professionals in the court system that are evaluating, prosecuting, and defending her.

1 hour ago, DisneyBoy said:

I somehow doubt that Kristin Kreuk knew nothing of this. Wasn't she the one who brought Mack into the cult? Didn't she stay in it for several years?

Yes Kristen Kreuk is claiming she didn't know anything and didn't recruit anyone.  I'm glad she got out.  But I don't believe for a minute that she never brought anyone in and had no idea what was going on.  I think I saw somewhere that she split once there were some allegations that underage girls were being used for sex.  So maybe she didn't know the full extent and ditched it when she started getting a clearer view of what was going on and made an assessment that staying was worse than whatever the repercussions of leaving (the blackmail material, etc).

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7 hours ago, ParadoxLost said:

I'm not inclined to cut Allison Mack any slack.  There is a tendency to view cults, in general, as one leader who is evil and the rest as victims.

But Mack's position in this cult is closer to Manson's followers (including a half dozen women) who murdered nine people or Jim Jones' inner circle (all women) who handled all the logistics necessary to carry out mass suicides and murder of over 900 including killing their children first.

Mack is #2 in this cult that is branding women, keeping, them as slaves, blackmailing them and I'm sure there are a hundred other crimes I haven't read about.  And her ability and willingness to become a high ranking abuser means that I have no desire to sort through how this could happen to someone who was on a TV show I watched.

Amen.  My sensitivity to this issue could lie in part because I live in AM's adopted base of operations (Brooklyn, NY).  The thought that she could have tried to recruit one of my young nieces or female cousins is frankly chilling.  And makes me far less inclined to be understanding or forgiving.

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9 hours ago, Winston Wolfe said:

Amen.  My sensitivity to this issue could lie in part because I live in AM's adopted base of operations (Brooklyn, NY).  The thought that she could have tried to recruit one of my young nieces or female cousins is frankly chilling.  And makes me far less inclined to be understanding or forgiving.

I know where my sensitivity comes from.  I, fortunately, have never experienced any kind of abuse.  The one person that I know who has, and not this type or this degree, is a truly wonderful person.  One day we were watching TV and some news anchor was trying to make sense of something horrible a criminal did by explaining their tragic childhood.  This person who has never hurt a soul and reacted to abuse by learning what not to do became very upset that they were making excuses for that behavior because she didn't see it as an excuse.  She never used it as an excuse.

It made an impression on me.  I get why people try to figure out how someone could do something like this.  Its a normal reaction.  But I just can't ever think personal responsibility doesn't apply.

At the end of the day, Mack is the second most evil person in this organization.  Something about her caused her to rise to the top to run a "slave pod".  Others who I expect suffered the same abuse as Mack did not end up where she did.  And there are enough celebrities involved in this that it can't be the explanation.

Edited by ParadoxLost
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Pimp Mack out on 5 million dollar bail. Her condo, retirement account, and her parents house were put up as collateral.  She cannot contact ANYONE associated with the cult and cannot use the internet or cell phone with the only exception of email correspondence with her lawyers.  She is also on house arrest at her parents house in California and will be monitored by an ankle monitor.  She is due back in court on May 3rd.  She is expected to testify against Vanguard in a plea deal.

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20 minutes ago, Unclejosh said:

Pimp Mack out on 5 million dollar bail. Her condo, retirement account, and her parents house were put up as collateral.  She cannot contact ANYONE associated with the cult and cannot use the internet or cell phone with the only exception of email correspondence with her lawyers.  She is also on house arrest at her parents house in California and will be monitored by an ankle monitor.  She is due back in court on May 3rd.  She is expected to testify against Vanguard in a plea deal.

Aren't her parents associated with the cult?

I'm curious if she will really take a plea that provides evidence against Raniere this fast,  That would seem to point to he not being as under his thumb as might otherwise be expected with a cult.

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28 minutes ago, ParadoxLost said:

Aren't her parents associated with the cult?

I'm curious if she will really take a plea that provides evidence against Raniere this fast,  That would seem to point to he not being as under his thumb as might otherwise be expected with a cult.

Her parents are putting up the collateral, maybe they're hoping to convince her to go along with it.

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At the end of the day, Mack is the second most evil person in this organization.  Something about her caused her to rise to the top to run a "slave pod".  Others who I expect suffered the same abuse as Mack did not end up where she did.  And there are enough celebrities involved in this that it can't be the explanation

Mack didn't rise up the ranks.  KR set up the group with her and a few others already in their ranking positions.  These were women he'd already made his slaves and had subjected to many years of conditioning.  So it's really not as simple as saying others suffering the same abuse didn't end up where she did because many DID end up where she did but it seems her fame such as it was and her ability to recruit made her important. 

And in the criminal complaint, there is at least one other female co-conspirator which I couldn't ID from the documents but others said WAS one of the other actresses involved and hints of several more top-tier slaves on nearly the same level all who reported directly to KR. 

It sounds like AM was the most "successful" of the bunch in carrying out her "vow" though. She'd been a top recruiter for Nxivm for a long while and I guess that could be called rising up the ranks before DOS started but they all were doing the same stuff because of the man that started the whole cult in the first place. 

AM's actions are terrible but this isn't a case of some bad childhood that anyone is trying to use as an excuse for something terrible that she did later in life. 

I don't think anyone is suggesting she not be held accountable but it's not a simple case of her just two years ago starting up a sex cult since she was already IN a cult and a relationship with the head guy that included brainwashing, starvation, sleep deprivation, verbal abuse, physical abuse and even imprisonment.  He locked her in a cage people.  A cage.  How could she think that was ok and be still completely of sound mind?  (The details are all in the state's complaint.)  And all that was apparently going on BEFORE the sex cult started up as well as during per what they quote her as saying. 

No one has to forgive her for her actions but at least please don't forget the man that really started all this crap in the first place.    

Edited by BkWurm1
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I imagine a lot of #metoo detractors will be monitoring how her story is covered, and if the pretty blonde girl will be put under the same kind of scrutiny and ostracization as male offenders.

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6 hours ago, ParadoxLost said:

Aren't her parents associated with the cult?

I'm curious if she will really take a plea that provides evidence against Raniere this fast,  That would seem to point to he not being as under his thumb as might otherwise be expected with a cult.

I had heard her mother and sister were to some extent but her parents I guess live in CA so maybe they were not up to the crazier level stuff.  Or maybe this was a wake up call.  Hopefully for all of them.  Four nights in jail had to have made some kind of impression.  And that's on top of nearly a month away from direct contact with KR. 

I think it was 20/20 that had an interview last year with a woman that had been in a relationship with him for like a decade.  She spoke of "sessions" where she'd go in and think she talked to him for like 10-20 minutes and was told no it had been many hours.  Freaky stuff.  Even just the regular offered to the public "intensives" they taught are scary stuff.  This is from a Vanity Fair article written back in 2010  https://www.vanityfair.com/culture/2010/11/bronfman-201011

Quote

These days Keith Raniere is rarely seen at nxivm training sessions, which some former members say can get very dark. In 2003, Kristin Snyder, a 35-year-old environmental consultant, disappeared after a nxivm session in Alaska. Her body was never found, but in her truck, parked on the shore of Resurrection Bay, was a note which read, “I was brainwashed and my emotional center of the brain was killed/turned off. . . . Please contact my parents . . . if you find me or this note. I am sorry . . . I didn’t know I was already dead.” Today, people describe nxivm therapy sessions in which they were convinced that they are “reincarnated Nazis” or “responsible for 9/11.” Looking back on her experience, Natalie says, “Keith finds your vulnerabilities and then he preys on them.”

27 minutes ago, Katsullivan said:

I imagine a lot of #metoo detractors will be monitoring how her story is covered, and if the pretty blonde girl will be put under the same kind of scrutiny and ostracization as male offenders.

She's been arrested for her actions and will go to trial unless there's some kind of plea which is more accountability than most of the male offenders who only lost jobs or popularity have faced.  The pretty blond girl didn't get special treatment.  They should make note of that.    

Edited by BkWurm1
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I imagine that if any of the male offenders was arrested for sex slavery, he would also be arrested and face charges. I'd like to think that the time lapse between when this news first broke out (years ago) and now, and then again between Raniere's arrest and Mack's was the authorities gathering evidence but I dunno...

If she is convicted and is made to serve actual hard time, it will definitely send a powerful message that there are no "sacred cows" in this matter. 

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On 4/23/2018 at 9:15 PM, Winston Wolfe said:

Not trying to argue here, but sometimes the world actually is that simple.  Funny or not, Cosby is a serial rapist.  And rumor has it Hitler loved animals, too.  AM is no less evil IMO.

Well, now that we've proved Godwin's Law works, I think the appropriate Hitler parallel is to his oratory, as in: Hitler's genocidal mania did not negate his ability to rile a crowd, but rather his ability to rile a crowd made him more effective at instigating global war and ordering the deaths of millions of people.

Please note that I am NOT saying that being good at something makes someone righteous. I am just saying that talent and sin can co-exist.

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9 minutes ago, Flyingwoman said:

Well, now that we've proved Godwin's Law works,

Well, I've learned about Godwin's Law, thank you.  Honestly didn't know it existed.  :).  Does removing my Hitler reference make my POV any more valid?

Edited by Winston Wolfe
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I'm just so shocked by this.

I find it hard to countenance Allison Mack with the bright, sparkly girl on Smallville. They are just worlds apart. I think it's ruined the show for me.

I hope justice is served and the victims of this cult can move on with there lives.

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She's far too composed in those pictures for someone who has had a "wakeup call".  Maybe it's part of her ability to compartmentalize and put on a "game face" for the media.  IDK.  What I suspect: those woman are not following her, they follow Keith with her as his right hand.  The big money that the cult has comes from some women.  Their willingness to use that money for AM is debateable.  She may have stashed away the money paid to her as part of this cult but ultimately, some of those funds may be seized.  I guess what I'm saying, is that without access to a large amount of independent money, I'm not sure she's a flight risk.  OTOH, she could also be a 'true believer' still, think that everything happening is wrong and that they will be cleared on the merits of the case.  (It's a cult, delusion is part of the ethos).

IDK.  I just found her waif-like calm appearance to be unsettling.  She may have gained a tiny amount of weight but she still looks emaciated around the neck to me.  She doesn't strike me as someone who has a grasp reality.  I'm not saying she has a insanity defense, I'm just saying I think she's still in the cult-bubble right now. If so, I wonder when that will finally burst.  I'm pretty sure.

This got me thinking back to the Charles Manson crowd, did they all eventually break out mentally?  From what I can tell, yes.  But after a recent denial of parole for the youngest of the cult members, Gov Jerry Brown indicated he was blocking parole because she claims full responsibility for letting Manson control her life.  Brown thinks she's not owning up to taking actions for her responsibilities.  I find that interesting, because unless AM gets a plea deal, the standard Brown is using suggests that only a complete de-programming and owning up to one's actions, in addition to being a model prisoner, is what it takes to get out.  

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I guess some scumbags posted her parent's address on twitter.  I really cannot stand that type of stuff. It was wrong when Spike Lee did it, it is wrong in this situation.  Do not encourage people to undertake potentially criminal activities like stalking or harassment or worse in order to get some sort of perceived justice or whatever other bs excuse people use for posting this type of stuff.

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I am always fascinated by cults and how these men are able to have the power to suck people in. I finally got around to reading the Vanity Fair article on Nxivm, terrifying. I don't understand how these women weren't shaken out of their stupor and didn't flee when Allison Mack was taking close up pictures of their vaginas. The sexual abuse, blackmail, and extortion were bad enough, but at least one member has apparently been driven to suicide. If those allegations against Allison Mack are true, she deserves to be locked up for a minimum of 20 years, IMO. However, I understand why the prosecutors want to negotiate a plea deal with her. Keith Raniere still the Seagram heiresses and all their money backing him. He could wiggle out of the more serious charges if they cannot produce sufficient evidence. Prosecutors want Mack to tell them where the bodies are buried, so to speak, so they can bury him in prison.

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On 4/23/2018 at 11:38 PM, ParadoxLost said:

I'm not inclined to cut Allison Mack any slack.  There is a tendency to view cults, in general, as one leader who is evil and the rest as victims.

But Mack's position in this cult is closer to Manson's followers (including a half dozen women) who murdered nine people or Jim Jones' inner circle (all women) who handled all the logistics necessary to carry out mass suicides and murder of over 900 including killing their children first.

Mack is #2 in this cult that is branding women, keeping, them as slaves, blackmailing them and I'm sure there are a hundred other crimes I haven't read about.  And her ability and willingness to become a high ranking abuser means that I have no desire to sort through how this could happen to someone who was on a TV show I watched.

I'll leave that to the professionals in the court system that are evaluating, prosecuting, and defending her.

There are accounts that the branding didn't start until Mack became #2 and she's the one who introduced it. It's hard to square away the idea that she might have been a victim when some of the most abusive behavior seems to have been her invention.

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Allison Mack’s ‘Smallville’ Costar Sam Jones III Says She Hid Her ‘Inner Freak’ on Set

Quote

Did Allison Mack’s behavior on the set of Smallville offer any warning signs of her involvement with an alleged sex cult? Her costar Sam Jones III says she didn’t display her “inner freak” at work.

“While we were on the show, she had a boyfriend, so she was cool,” the actor, 34, told TMZ in a video published on Wednesday, April 25. “So, I mean, I guess she just became freaky, you know what I’m saying? I guess the inner freak just came out of her or something, but I don’t know, man.”

Jones claimed that he didn’t know if the allegations against Mack are true. Still, he sent his well wishes. “Hopefully everybody involved is OK, and hopefully she bounces back from it,” he said.

The ER alum also suggested the actress’ work on the CW superhero series, which ran from 2001 to 2011, could help her secure good representation: “Smallville got those good residuals, so she [should] be able to get a good attorney.”

Allison Mack ‘Was Brainwashed’ By NXIVM, But It Won’t Save Her From Prison — Expert Says

 

TV Series in the Works Based on Alleged Sex Trafficking Cult Nxivm

Edited by Tenshinhan

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On 4/25/2018 at 12:31 AM, Katsullivan said:

I imagine that if any of the male offenders was arrested for sex slavery, he would also be arrested and face charges. I'd like to think that the time lapse between when this news first broke out (years ago) and now, and then again between Raniere's arrest and Mack's was the authorities gathering evidence but I dunno...

If she is convicted and is made to serve actual hard time, it will definitely send a powerful message that there are no "sacred cows" in this matter. 

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Just a timeline thing.  AM's involvement with the cult Nxivm and it's classes has been known for years and people have been complaining about the coercive nature of it and KR the founder for a very long time even if there was denial it was a cult, but news of the special cult within the cult DOS (the slave master thing) that info only broke last fall even if it probably started up in 2015. 

And while AM was his right hand for DOS  which involved about 50 women or so, she's not at the top for his "mainstream" money making venture and all those thousands of followers.  Someone that his followers called The Prefect was his right hand for the more general group. (And her house did get raided and oodles of cash was seized but so far no arrest) It's easy to get it all confused. 

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The weird part is that some articles mention a Nancy Salzman who is Raniere's business partner, and apparently has been for a long time, and supposedly  has a similar rank to his own in the organization - but nothing about whether she's to be arrested or not. 

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An AWESOME, pardon the pun, hilarious, funny, sweet interview with Lex, Flash, Michael Rosenbaum and Clark Tom Welling at Awesome Con on April 1.

I loved hearing about their time on Smallville. I thought for sure they'd bring up that one blooper, where both ended up talking like Surfer Dudes in the third? season, I think it was?

Edited by GHScorpiosRule
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Sadly based on the most recent reports, it appears Allison is rejecting any plea deals and now wants to go to trial to prove Vanguard's innocence. Her parents brought in a deprogrammer but he seems to be unable to reach her as of yet.  So sad.  

Speculation is she only appeared to fake interest in a plea deal just so she could get out on bail.  It is also speculated that somehow Clare Bronfman was able to reach her despite the no contact rule and is telling her and the other members that she will fix everything and get Keith off due to her money and influence.  I guess Allison despite not looking at KR at their court date last week, stopped to personally thank his lawyers for helping him which isn't something one would do if they were looking to plead out and testify against their co-conspirator.  She is still in love with him and thinks he will be freed.

Just a total shit show all around.  There is also reports that there are videos of the brandings with Allison holding women down and stuff which if true will not do her any favors.

Edited by Unclejosh
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If that's true, then it's even worse than I thought. I assumed she'd come to her senses and go for a plea deal, but if she's ride or die for Keith then truly, screw her. Even now while facing serious charges, she's getting opportunities and chances to turn it around, if she wants to spit on that, then a-okay.

And have people seen the last post on her twitter/instagram? It's a very worrisome video of a boy who is apparently part of this cult. The way he's speaking is not normal for a child of his age, he's clearly been indoctrinated. I've read that the trafficking charges include child victims, but it's being kept from the media. I don't know what to believe, the whole thing is crazy and in my opinion only the tip of a much bigger issue concerning abusive powerful people.

Edited by greenbean
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On 5/11/2018 at 1:57 PM, Unclejosh said:

Sadly based on the most recent reports, it appears Allison is rejecting any plea deals and now wants to go to trial to prove Vanguard's innocence. Her parents brought in a deprogrammer but he seems to be unable to reach her as of yet.  So sad.  

 

There's no sadly in this. The worst thing that could have happened was for her to wiggle out of this with a temporary insanity plea deal. This way she's definitely going to answer for her crimes. 

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Quote

 

She told her employee she would never choose to have kids of her own because she was "so fucked up."

 

Maybe there is some self-awareness there?

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Has anyone seen anything about John Schneider facing a light bit of jail time since he didn’t or couldn’t make spousal support payments? I saw a few articles, but it made me wonder, maybe he is not getting good residuals from his time as Pa Kent? One article not linked below said he’s trying to rebuild his studio that got ruined by flooding. Just curious if you guys had seen this amidst all the AM stuff. 

 

Looks like payments are over $18,000 a month!! 

https://people.com/tv/john-schneider-sentenced-to-jail-delinquent-alimony/

 

https://www.wonderwall.com/news/john-schneider-ordered-spend-three-days-jail-failing-pay-spousal-support-elly-castle-3014772.article

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-5832985/John-Schneider-faces-three-day-jail-sentence-failure-pay-spousal-support-estranged-wife.html

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I don't have a link, but apparently there are rumors floating around that Erica Durance was in NXVIUM as well for a period of time.

Edited by Unclejosh · Reason: Spelling

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On 5/17/2018 at 2:59 PM, Morrigan2575 said:

A really good outline of how AMack got to this point. She was a victim before she became an abuser. It's quite tragic, she needs helps but, she also needs to pay for her actions.

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/allison-mack-get-involved-sex-cult-first-place-disturbing-new-details-emerge-230257397.html

It’s possible to be both.  A good cult leader/abuser makes you both especially if you are at the top of his cult.  You are a victim of the cult but an abuser of other members.  It looks like Alison Mack is the worst kind of both victim and abuser.  

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5 hours ago, Unclejosh said:

I don't have a link, but apparently there are rumors floating around that Erica Durance was in NXVIUM as well for a period of time.

I wouldn't be surprised. Think of all the shows filmed in Canada, I'm sure a good number of actors/crew were targetted.

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On 14/06/2018 at 12:50 PM, Unclejosh said:

I don't have a link, but apparently there are rumors floating around that Erica Durance was in NXVIUM as well for a period of time.

I would not be at all surprised. Do you remember that interview she gave on the Howard Stern Show where she became uncomfortable because he kept talking about how she had said in a previous interview that she and her husband were swingers? She walked out of that place in tears and Howard Stern in his co-hosts we're all incredulous as to why. It always struck me as possible that she was being forced to say things in interviews to sound sexy or maybe even forced to participate in things just to be in the business and was privately ashamed of the whole thing.

 

That may have nothing to do with this Cult of course but it comes to mind.

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1 hour ago, DisneyBoy said:

I would not be at all surprised. Do you remember that interview she gave on the Howard Stern Show where she became uncomfortable because he kept talking about how she had said in a previous interview that she and her husband were swingers? She walked out of that place in tears and Howard Stern in his co-hosts we're all incredulous as to why. It always struck me as possible that she was being forced to say things in interviews to sound sexy or maybe even forced to participate in things just to be in the business and was privately ashamed of the whole thing.

 

That may have nothing to do with this Cult of course but it comes to mind.

That was the first thing I though of when I heard this new rumor. I immediately flashed back to that interview and it made so much more sense or at least provided possible context.

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I was always rather disgusted with the way Stern and his team handled that. I understand that their show is all about talking a certain way to a certain audience for their amusement, but when you start digging into a woman's sex life to the point where she's walking out of the studio crying you should probably reevaluate your actions. She's just an actress not someone who deserves to be a target or made to feel ashamed of her private sexual life.

 

Of course I was always frustrated with the way Smallville depicted their version of Lois. They never missed an opportunity to sex her up in a way that felt very outdated and misogynistic. I realize this show also had men stripping down and was probably an equal-opportunity offender in that regard, but it stood out to me how Chloe never had to take off her clothes or act the Pussycat Doll to be alluring.

 

...strange to know now what was really going on behind the scenes with AM.

 

The thing that boggles my mind the most is how someone seemingly as curious and questioning as Mack sought enlightenment and female empowerment from an organization designed to give one man total psychological and sexual control over women. Was she not able to see that what she was involved in was the exact opposite of what she was looking to find?

Edited by DisneyBoy
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On 6/16/2018 at 11:52 AM, DisneyBoy said:

...strange to know now what was really going on behind the scenes with AM

Timeline suggests while SV was going on she wasn't in that kind of personal relationship with KR but after SV was over, he got more control over her.  

 

On 6/16/2018 at 11:52 AM, DisneyBoy said:

Was she not able to see that what she was involved in was the exact opposite of what she was looking to find?

That's what is so insidious about his method, selling to people what they want to believe even while giving them really just the opposite.  

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