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S28: Val Chmerkovskiy

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Val really stuck up for Tamar in the package they showed last night. It seems hard for Tamar to show vulnerability to the audience, and I get that. The vulnerability would help her dancing, but I'm glad she and Val get along and can understand and enjoy one another..

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Val is a good liar! ;)

Oh, I should be kinder: fibber, coverer-uperer, etc., cause what else is he gonna do, he's stuck! Imo

Edited by just prin
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I doubt Val is the only person who argues with his partners. I'm sure they all do, but TPTB only show us what they want us to see. I don't know if Val and Tamar are BFFs, but I'm sure they get along professionally. She hasn't said anything bad about him, and neither have any of his former partners.

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Val really stuck up for Tamar in the package they showed last night. It seems hard for Tamar to show vulnerability to the audience, and I get that. The vulnerability would help her dancing, but I'm glad she and Val get along and can understand and enjoy one another..

I actually really enjoy their partnership. While the editing is shenanigans a large part of the time, and I'm not a huge Val fan, I do strongly get the sense that he's working towards the best for her, and I think she's a great dancer. I really hope she makes it to the finale.

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When they tweeted to each other about being #thunderbuddies for life, I figured they looked at all the bullshit against them and sang the song. That is a sure fire way of being together in this. Val did go along with the producers early on, but glad he turned it around.

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I'm a huge Val fan, but not so much that I support him when I don't like his partner.  Unfortunately this means that I've only been rooting for him completely in three seasons (Kelly (sorta - hated the fauxmance), ZENDAYA, Danica(sorta) and Rumer).

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I'm a huge Val fan, but not so much that I support him when I don't like his partner.  Unfortunately this means that I've only been rooting for him completely in three seasons (Kelly (sorta - hated the fauxmance), ZENDAYA, Danica(sorta) and Rumer).

I am similar though I didn't really become a Val fan until his partnership with Zendaya. He really won me over that season which was impressive considering how much I wanted to throw things at the TV anytime he and Kelly were on the screen in Season 15. Elizabeth Berkley left me cold but I didn't really like anyone that season so I was pulling for them because I like Val. Season 18 I had the opposite problem of liking too many couples so Danica never got my votes even though I liked her quite a bit. In Season 19 I actively rooted against him and Janel (see my feelings about Season 15 for reasoning, LOL) and I was pulling for him and Rumer last season. 

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That is what I was thinking, though I don't he used the right wording to express that.  Doing DWTS can be a long term commitment for up to 3 months.  Even Andy said he cancelled a few shows just so he can focus on this.  Backstreet Boys were on Best Time Ever without Nick last week and Brian said "he's busy with his dance pants right now" or something.  It becomes a question of "how much are you willing to fully commit to this and can you drop a few things in the meantime."  I take for Tamar, that answer is a solid "I can't cancel on anything."  And I think Val has this sense of frustration that she can be really good if she had the time.

 

Bringing this over from the show thread, but thought better to answer it here.  Weirdly, I tend to think of Val's real DWTS career starting with Kelly M.  I know that's not true, but that was his first breakout season.  But in general I think Val is used to having partners who really want to go balls to the wall where DWTS is concerned and they will either clear their schedules or in some cases just don't have that much else going on. 

 

I hated the Kelly showmance and I'm one of those that didn't fully start paying attention to Val until he was with Zendaya, but I'm pretty sure Kelly was filming GH while doing the show.  However with soaps it's fairly easy for showrunners to write somebody in the background for a few months.  Nobody is in an A story at all times.  Janel had PLL, but at the time her character had just "died" so she was maybe filming 1-2 days a month at most.  The only week her PLL schedule was a problem was finale week and it really wasn't that big a deal since they only had 2 dances to prepare and one was a straight retread and the other was contemporary.

 

Elizabeth, Danica and Rue really didn't have much else going on at the time and they were all super gung ho about DWTS and wanting to learn as much as possible.  Zendaya wasn't nearly as busy as she is now, but either she or her mother/father said after the fact that somewhere around week 3 she came to them and asked if they could clear her schedule for the next few months so she could focus on DWTS (and school).  Plus in her case she had child labor laws to deal with as well.

 

Whereas I think Tamar was just hoping she could do it all and so as much as I think Val likes her and they get along, I also think it's probably a bit frustrating.  Because he has this partner with all this potential to be amazing and he can't really get her there because she's too busy and now too sick.  At this point if Tamar is cancelling appearances and having people fill in for her on her talk show, it's more about her own health than about DWTS.

Edited by spanana

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I see how even if Tamar is really good, she could have been excellent if she had more time.  Val is competitive and wants to win.  I think all the pros are since they started out in ballroom competitions which is really cut throat.  It's more so than jazz/contemporary competitions (at least from what I've seen).   However, I also think he's concerned for Tamar's health.  When he mentioned that she shouldn't be here, I think that he meant that her health was more important than this show.  She is really spreading herself too thin and needs to take care of herself.

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I think it's very telling that Val apparently had no idea where she had disappeared to, had not received a phone call or text, nothing to let him know she had just walked off from a show that was about to go live.  I understand his not being able to accompany her to the hospital (even if he had known) since someone had to show up on live tv. But whatever hospital she went to, either they must have a very not-busy emergency room or some producer raced over there to grease the skids for her to get examined, treated and back to the show in record time.

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He didn't actually write that (thank goodness because that was way over the top). It says it's a blog "imagining" the innermost feelings of Dancing With the Stars contestants, as written in their “journals.”

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We really don't know for a fact that no one knew where Tamar was, least of all Val. All I saw was a bunch of people saying " Have you seen Tamar", etc. I don't trust producer manipulations and those supposed " searches " could be spliced together from other times. Why jump to the negative conclusion?

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I'm wondering if Val is going to lose his Job over this meme fiasco. If he does, I will truly be done with show.

I understand why they would fire Val, even though I think the mother is a money- grabbing opportunist. However Val and Sharna save this show from being an unbearable Hough-mess. I literally could not bear this show if Val were not there to save me from the Houghs and their side-kick Mark

Edited by gohawks

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Not to absolve Val from his misguided tweet, but I think that mom saw an opportunity for a payday and she decided to cash in. That photo was a meme before Val posted it or before the news outlet reported it. Why not go after whoever created and originally posted it? ... because they don't have the money or the press to lose. Either way she wins because it's likely someone will pay just to make her go away. That's just as bad - if not maybe worse - because instead of coming out and showing her daughter as a person who shouldn't be shamed she's actively using her daughter and her daughter's image for monetary gain.

 

She's not acting in her daughter's best interest. She's just looking for money.

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Why not go after whoever created and originally posted it?

 

 

Not that I disagree that this is quite likely a cash grab, but the family is suing the person who originally took the picture as well. 

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Here's what GMA's legal contributor had to say about Val's case. 

 

I doubt very much ABC/DWTS will take any action though. Wait and see... Val will get a contender ( again ) and the trophy

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"Intentional infliction of emotional distress" sounds like such a giant catchall of crap and is something that allows America's sue-happy culture to breed. Unfortunately for the family, it's going to be hard to prove and even if they can, harder still to prove a combined $12.6 million dollars in damages. I still maintain the parents should have come back with a response along the lines of "our daughter is happy, healthy, and a person, and THIS is why you shouldn't shame her or call her out". It would have been much classier (and an even bigger f-u to Val) than going for a payday.

 

Unfortunately for Val, the damage has probably already been done to his image. We'll see if there are any professional ramifications (probably not, considering I think he's handled the fall out well enough). Luckily people have short memories and tend to be relatively forgiving.

 

Honestly, I think the whole situation is wrong. Two wrongs don't make a right - and the only person suffering for all this is that girl, both by Val for posting the tweet and by her parents for trying to cash in on it.

 

Do we know if Val created the meme? (Like, did he add the text to the photo?) I was under the impression that he just reposted it, but the GMA spot makes it sound like it was something he created from the Flickr photo.

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"Intentional infliction of emotional distress" sounds like such a giant catchall of crap and is something that allows America's sue-happy culture to breed. Unfortunately for the family, it's going to be hard to prove and even if they can, harder still to prove a combined $12.6 million dollars in damages. I still maintain the parents should have come back with a response along the lines of "our daughter is happy, healthy, and a person, and THIS is why you shouldn't shame her or call her out". It would have been much classier (and an even bigger f-u to Val) than going for a payday.

 

Unfortunately for Val, the damage has probably already been done to his image. We'll see if there are any professional ramifications (probably not, considering I think he's handled the fall out well enough). Luckily people have short memories and tend to be relatively forgiving.

 

Honestly, I think the whole situation is wrong. Two wrongs don't make a right - and the only person suffering for all this is that girl, both by Val for posting the tweet and by her parents for trying to cash in on it.

 

Do we know if Val created the meme? (Like, did he add the text to the photo?) I was under the impression that he just reposted it, but the GMA spot makes it sound like it was something he created from the Flickr photo.

 

I think Abrams' point was that by retweeting or reposting it, Val in effect "published" it even though it was created  by someone else and is therefore just as responsible as the original creator (and everyone else who retweeted/reposted it).

 

The crazy thing is, the picture is from 2008, it's 8 years old and the child is now 16. No one would like recognize her or know her name except immediate family.  It was the mother who brought emotional distress (if any) by publicizing that the child in the pic was her daughter.  The child's face is a profile and in shadows. And the question will likely come up that if she knew the photographer, why did it take 8 years to complain. 

 

My guess is, Val's, CBS's and the photographer's lawyers will each offer a little money and the case will go away.

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Dragging this thread up to say how much I've appreciated Val's work this season so far. I'm not a fan (though I have great respect for the work the pros do and obviously he's a top notch dancer, teacher and choreographer) and I've written my fair share of critical things about him on this forum. So I thought it would be only right to post about the positive as well. (-;

I think his partnership with Laurie is super interesting and it's the most enjoyable Val has been for me since Rumer (and even there IMO though the partnership was great, some of the choreo was questionable). I flove Mark, but I feel like I already know what a season with Laurie would have looked like. He already had Shawn and Aly and Sadie, tonally it would have gone in that direction. Nothing wrong with that, but not new ground. I also feel like I already know what Derek would have done with Laurie, since he already partnered Shawn and Bindi.

Val danced with Zendaya, but IMO she had a very different vibe to Laurie. She was cool and collected in her dancing. He's also never had an athlete before. And it's fascinating to watch how he reacts to her gymnastics background compared to the other pros: Mostly, it seems like he's not that interested in directly incorporating it. He uses it to advantage in certain moves and lifts and flexibility, but it's not his main focus. He's interested in grounding her in technique and pushing her on content. He also talked about "not being cute Laurie all the time", so it's about getting her to perform not only one shade of exuberant. Even in the fast dances. The salsa seemed like a conscious effort to give her nuance in that genre. Softer and more serious dances will be coming up for Laurie, and I think he'll keep on pushing in that direction. It's risky, not everything works, but it seems like a coherent strategy to me. It's certainly better than doing try-hard stuff that he himself isn't comfortable with just because he thinks it'll pander to the audience. Basically I feel like I'm gaining insight into his teaching and style preferences and actually learning new things about him after ten seasons. And I think that's kinda cool. (-:

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I really like Val, and I loved his partnership with Rumer, but did last night's tears feel a little OTT? Either producer-driven, or because of something else that's going on in his life that's making him so emotional?

Although he had a very similar breakdown after hurting Rumer's neck in rehearsal...

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I think it's both? It's totally DWTS scripting 101 (early frontrunner slumps a bit midseason and then gains speed again towards the end), but the undercurrent of it felt authentic enough. Perhaps not the dramatic staging of it in the package, but I think it's resonating with people and effective (it seems to have worked and the reactions I've seen have been overwhelmingly positive) because it rings true? Val is a perfectionist, he gets invested, even overinvested, almost every season, and he beats himself up and feels terrible whenever he feels he's let a partner down. Then you get the staged aspects, of course. The "crisis" the show fabricated was nonsense, Laurie did two great dances with IMO great choreography where she was perhaps slightly underscored (to better set up her "comeback"). She's also done five light and fast dances now. This week was her first lyrical and slow dance EVER. They're creating a narrative for her.

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Also, the show often answers message board comments and the comment that Val's choreo isn't up to Laurie's abilities is a fairly frequent one.  Acknowledging that (by showing it's one of his fears) causes those people who were bitter about it to become sympathetic instead.

Edited by crowceilidh
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7 hours ago, tessaforever said:

I really like Val, and I loved his partnership with Rumer, but did last night's tears feel a little OTT? Either producer-driven, or because of something else that's going on in his life that's making him so emotional?

Although he had a very similar breakdown after hurting Rumer's neck in rehearsal...

I thought the same thing last night. Maybe it's the Amber effect or he misses Maks or maybe it's what he explained in the package. Whatever it was, I think the emotion was real.

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Saw Amber Rose in the audience this week.  I know she and Val are no longer together.  So I guess it's just a practice for previous contestants to go to the show?  I saw her at the end of Rashad/Emma's routine.

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There are previous contestants every season at multiple shows, all the time. That said, Amber and Val insisted that they are still friends and there certainly didn't seem to be any bad blood, based on their comments and social media after the breakup.

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56 minutes ago, truthaboutluv said:

There are previous contestants every season at multiple shows, all the time. That said, Amber and Val insisted that they are still friends and there certainly didn't seem to be any bad blood, based on their comments and social media after the breakup.

Oh I saw it was mutual.

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Continuing the Val discussion from the main thread, I don't necessarily think Val is some horrible, horrible guy.  I was a fan at one point and then the more I genuinely started watching him, I sort of realized he was full of bull with his psycho babble and over seriousness about everything. 

However more than anything, he needs a long break to recharge.  He automatically goes to the finals almost every season, and then is the main star of the DWTS tour between seasons.  Seriously every tour is basically built around him.  The one time DWTS didn't tour, he did his own tour with Maks.  I guess I can't knock the guys hustle, but I think this is the big reason for me his choreography is starting to get really repetitive.  Even for as good as Normani is, a lot of her routines seem based off of previous routines he has done with other celebs, or he will fall back and use the same moves over and over.  I get Normani can do a hell of a high kick but it doesn't need to be in every dance. 

Val did announce, in his over the top way, that he is taking off the summer tour.  Maks/Peta are supposedly getting married this summer, so it makes sense and the guy I'm sure needs to recharge.

But I think the biggest issue is the show pretty much will give Val whatever he wants since he is their main star now.  The show has this weird belief that they need either Derek or a Chmerkovskiy to center the show around season to season, which I don't think is even remotely true.  If Val or Derek weren't the center of attention, the show would go on.  However the show will give him whatever he wants to keep him there since Maks is aging out and Derek is off elsewhere.

Also just as a personal sticking point, it also always bugged me how he has and continues to position himself as Laurie's mentor. I get it from the standpoint of her age, but for one he seems to be pushing her hard to get into the industry.  Maybe that is something she has always wanted for herself, but he is intent on making her a star.  In the second, Val comes from a place of privilege and he quite often pontificates on these social justice issues, but again, from this place of extreme privilege and based on his experiences in this country.   I cringe at the thought at some of what he may be trying to impart on Laurie.

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1 hour ago, spanana said:

Continuing the Val discussion from the main thread, I don't necessarily think Val is some horrible, horrible guy.  I was a fan at one point and then the more I genuinely started watching him, I sort of realized he was full of bull with his psycho babble and over seriousness about everything. 

However more than anything, he needs a long break to recharge.  He automatically goes to the finals almost every season, and then is the main star of the DWTS tour between seasons.  Seriously every tour is basically built around him.  The one time DWTS didn't tour, he did his own tour with Maks.  I guess I can't knock the guys hustle, but I think this is the big reason for me his choreography is starting to get really repetitive.  Even for as good as Normani is, a lot of her routines seem based off of previous routines he has done with other celebs, or he will fall back and use the same moves over and over.  I get Normani can do a hell of a high kick but it doesn't need to be in every dance. 

Val did announce, in his over the top way, that he is taking off the summer tour.  Maks/Peta are supposedly getting married this summer, so it makes sense and the guy I'm sure needs to recharge.

But I think the biggest issue is the show pretty much will give Val whatever he wants since he is their main star now.  The show has this weird belief that they need either Derek or a Chmerkovskiy to center the show around season to season, which I don't think is even remotely true.  If Val or Derek weren't the center of attention, the show would go on.  However the show will give him whatever he wants to keep him there since Maks is aging out and Derek is off elsewhere.

Also just as a personal sticking point, it also always bugged me how he has and continues to position himself as Laurie's mentor. I get it from the standpoint of her age, but for one he seems to be pushing her hard to get into the industry.  Maybe that is something she has always wanted for herself, but he is intent on making her a star.  In the second, Val comes from a place of privilege and he quite often pontificates on these social justice issues, but again, from this place of extreme privilege and based on his experiences in this country.   I cringe at the thought at some of what he may be trying to impart on Laurie.

I agree with all you've said but I think it's because there really is no other pro with "star power" so they're taking whatever amount Val has and overusing it.

Even if Maks still had the popularity he used to, his whole image on the show was about being the sexy guy and was he or wasn't he romancing his partners, which is no longer an option. And I don't think the whole Maks/Peta "love story" was nearly as popular or interesting as they and the show thought it would be. And, of course, Derek has moved on.

Back in the earlier days of the show, not only did they have Derek and Maks (and even, to an extent, Mark and Tony) but they also had female pros who were popular -- Cheryl, Karina, Kym, Edyta. None of the female pros now even come close to that. I'd say they closest they have is Sharna, but who but DWTS fans even knows her name?

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49 minutes ago, Toonces464 said:

I agree with all you've said but I think it's because there really is no other pro with "star power" so they're taking whatever amount Val has and overusing it.

Even if Maks still had the popularity he used to, his whole image on the show was about being the sexy guy and was he or wasn't he romancing his partners, which is no longer an option. And I don't think the whole Maks/Peta "love story" was nearly as popular or interesting as they and the show thought it would be. And, of course, Derek has moved on.

Back in the earlier days of the show, not only did they have Derek and Maks (and even, to an extent, Mark and Tony) but they also had female pros who were popular -- Cheryl, Karina, Kym, Edyta. None of the female pros now even come close to that. I'd say they closest they have is Sharna, but who but DWTS fans even knows her name?

I'd argue I think the show is partly to blame for that.  They push their male pros harder than their female pros, I think because they realize part of the appeal is that female fans drool over their fave male pros.  Look at the Hough & Chmerkovskiy fans and the to the death fanwars that exist out on the internet.  It's also interesting because while I agree there isn't a ton of star power, the female pros IMO are way stronger than the male pros right now from a talent perspective.  I personally think Lindsay is the brightest rising star they have had in ages and she's producing better routines than a lot of the vets.  But you are right in the sense that with Val out of tour, Sharna now seems to be main star.

The other way you can see how differently the show treats the male "star" pros versus the others is in partner assignments.  Most of the female pros get a dud every now and again.  If your name is Emma, until now you have always gotten crappy partners.  Since early DWTS, all female pros did their time with a dud celeb.  Even Jules and Cheryl got their Wayne Newton seasons and etc.  With the male star celebs, that rarely happens.  The show is never going to waste Val with a bad partner because they need to ensure he lasts to keep people interested.  Even with Maks/Amber last season, I think Amber was meant to be a bigger gift than she turned out to be.  The other thing with Maks is he's an awful choreographer, or at least become so over time.  I blame him to some extent for Heather's exit because the Frozen routine was so bland and not well staged, which is on him.

I have a weird theory about Val and Laurie though.  Back when he was paired with Zendaya, he tried to somewhat position himself as a mentor, and she may have looked at him as one for a bit, but as she's grown up she's clearly moved past that.  Also she always had her own career people around her and she was basically on her way to stardom by the time she got to Val.  It was just that through working with Val it helped introduce her to the more general public, but there was nothing he could really do for her beyond that.  My theory is that Val saw an in with Laurie to mentor her and guide her and push her into some type of superstar career in a way he didn't get to do with Z, and so here we are.  I'm not saying he's trying to turn her into Z specifically, but it's like he gets to do with Laurie what he didn't get to do with her.

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I'm not sure Val is trying to turn Laurie into a star. What can she do besides gymnastics? Zendaya can sing and act and looks like a model. Laurie is cute, but too short for Hollywood, and she can't sing or act that I know of. She might have a career as a broadcaster, but most gymnasts go the way of Shawn Johnson. What does she do now besides a reality show here and there?

If anything, he will continue to ride Normani's coattails as she is a bona fide star.

Edited by boyznkatz

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1 hour ago, boyznkatz said:

I'm not sure Val is trying to turn Laurie into a star. What can she do besides gymnastics? Zendaya can sing and act and looks like a model. Laurie is cute, but too short for Hollywood, and she can't sing or act that I know of. She might have a career as a broadcaster, but most gymnasts go the way of Shawn Johnson. What does she do now besides a reality show here and there?

If anything, he will continue to ride Normani's coattails as she is a bona fide star.

She's trying to act.  She submitted an audition tape to Disney, per her own admission.  She also plans to major in theatre in college, though that might change.

http://olympics.nbcsports.com/2017/04/20/laurie-hernandez-gymnastics/

http://www.refinery29.com/2017/04/150764/laurie-hernandez-audition-tape-disney?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=twitter_share

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3 hours ago, spanana said:

I'd argue I think the show is partly to blame for that.  They push their male pros harder than their female pros, I think because they realize part of the appeal is that female fans drool over their fave male pros.  Look at the Hough & Chmerkovskiy fans and the to the death fanwars that exist out on the internet.  It's also interesting because while I agree there isn't a ton of star power, the female pros IMO are way stronger than the male pros right now from a talent perspective.  I personally think Lindsay is the brightest rising star they have had in ages and she's producing better routines than a lot of the vets.  But you are right in the sense that with Val out of tour, Sharna now seems to be main star.

The other way you can see how differently the show treats the male "star" pros versus the others is in partner assignments.  Most of the female pros get a dud every now and again.  If your name is Emma, until now you have always gotten crappy partners.  Since early DWTS, all female pros did their time with a dud celeb.  Even Jules and Cheryl got their Wayne Newton seasons and etc.  With the male star celebs, that rarely happens.  The show is never going to waste Val with a bad partner because they need to ensure he lasts to keep people interested.  Even with Maks/Amber last season, I think Amber was meant to be a bigger gift than she turned out to be.  The other thing with Maks is he's an awful choreographer, or at least become so over time.  I blame him to some extent for Heather's exit because the Frozen routine was so bland and not well staged, which is on him.

I have a weird theory about Val and Laurie though.  Back when he was paired with Zendaya, he tried to somewhat position himself as a mentor, and she may have looked at him as one for a bit, but as she's grown up she's clearly moved past that.  Also she always had her own career people around her and she was basically on her way to stardom by the time she got to Val.  It was just that through working with Val it helped introduce her to the more general public, but there was nothing he could really do for her beyond that.  My theory is that Val saw an in with Laurie to mentor her and guide her and push her into some type of superstar career in a way he didn't get to do with Z, and so here we are.  I'm not saying he's trying to turn her into Z specifically, but it's like he gets to do with Laurie what he didn't get to do with her.

None of the current female pros are even remotely stars, IMO. Peta gets the most exposure outside of the show but it's all from her relationship with Maks. Between the first time they were dating and Maks taking her back, you never saw her name mentioned. Karina, Cheryl and Julianne in particular could at least carry themselves.

As for partnerships, the males used to get duds, big name or not. Maks suffered through Denise Richardson and Debi Mazur. Derek had Shannon Elizabeth and Joanna Krupa. Mark had Kim Kardashian. I do agree, however, that these days they don't give bad partners to Val or even Maks or Derek when they're back. The two biggest ringers in show history, Heather and Meryl, have both gone to Maks. He failed Heather miserably and I don't think his dances were that great with Meryl. They just sold the showmance. 

Val definitely likes to mentor his younger partners. I haven't really followed him with Laurie since their season ended but the whole Zendaya/C family thing annoyed me to no end because I felt like Val, Maks and their entire crew were just trying to ride her famous coat tails.

I do wonder if Val will be around next season. He's not touring this summer and Maks has insinuated they'll be taking their Maks and Val show to Vegas (which I assume Peta will join now that she's not pregnant). If he's not, they better hope they can get back  Derek or  Mark or even Cheryl or Karina. No one currently in the pro lineup has enough appeal to carry the show.

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9 hours ago, spanana said:

Continuing the Val discussion from the main thread, I don't necessarily think Val is some horrible, horrible guy.  I was a fan at one point and then the more I genuinely started watching him, I sort of realized he was full of bull with his psycho babble and over seriousness about everything. 

However more than anything, he needs a long break to recharge.  He automatically goes to the finals almost every season, and then is the main star of the DWTS tour between seasons.  Seriously every tour is basically built around him.  The one time DWTS didn't tour, he did his own tour with Maks.  I guess I can't knock the guys hustle, but I think this is the big reason for me his choreography is starting to get really repetitive.  Even for as good as Normani is, a lot of her routines seem based off of previous routines he has done with other celebs, or he will fall back and use the same moves over and over.  I get Normani can do a hell of a high kick but it doesn't need to be in every dance. 

Oh yeah, I'm actually a Val fan (although I like Derek too) - Val is a sensational dancer and I think sometimes that gets lost in the drama of the show, the showmances, the psycho babble, lame poetry, etc. I was extremely underwhelmed with his season with Ginger (for all that Bindi was overscored and overpraised, I did enjoy watching her dance - Ginger got the same over-the-top treatment and I didn't like her dancing at all). Then he did better with Laurie - who couldn't, she's adorable - but now that I've been watching for a long time, I see the burn-out just like I did with Derek. 

2 hours ago, Toonces464 said:

I do wonder if Val will be around next season. He's not touring this summer and Maks has insinuated they'll be taking their Maks and Val show to Vegas (which I assume Peta will join now that she's not pregnant). If he's not, they better hope they can get back  Derek or Mark or even Cheryl or Karina. No one currently in the pro lineup has enough appeal to carry the show.

I'm sure he will...they need him so badly, I can see the show giving him anything (money, partner), that he wants. 

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3 hours ago, tessaforever said:

but now that I've been watching for a long time, I see the burn-out just like I did with Derek.

So much of this. I get that the show is competitive and everyone wants to be on every season to "keep their spot" but I wish the pros were incentivized more to rotate in and out. A larger cast that trades in and out. I usually am a Derek fan but his worst seasons were when he burnt himself out trying to do too many things, you could just see he didn't have reserves in the creativity tank - it would have been better for him to sit those out and come back fresh if he wanted. The same seems to be happening with Val - he needs a break to get some new perspective and inspiration. Then maybe come back. Kinda feeling the same about Witney and Sharna as well. I don't dislike any of them. But I could see them benefitting from a break.

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23 minutes ago, MsJamieDornan said:

If Vegas will take Val and  Maks. That might be all in their own minds.

The only reason I think they have a shot is because Maks seems to be tight with Wynn & Encore Hotels thanks to Le Reve. Personally I'd rather see Cheryl bring her show to Vegas.

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10 hours ago, spanana said:

She's trying to act.  She submitted an audition tape to Disney, per her own admission.  She also plans to major in theatre in college, though that might change.

http://olympics.nbcsports.com/2017/04/20/laurie-hernandez-gymnastics/

http://www.refinery29.com/2017/04/150764/laurie-hernandez-audition-tape-disney?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=twitter_share

She's 16.  She's been exposed to showbiz and now she wants to act.  Give it a little time and she'll want to do something else.  To major at anything in college, she'd have to finish high school first, then 4 more years in college.   If she's done with competing in the Olympics, then NOW is her big earnings time.  She could rake in big bucks just for appearances and autograph signing events.  More big bucks for endorsements.  This is an Olympian's money-making time.  Any college will love to have her and will make adjustments so she can attend while also taking full advantage of her post-Olympian opportunities.  For Val to get in the middle of all that is mind-boggling, as if he'd know anything about that world.  Her management should be protecting her from him (hopefully in her best interests, but at least in their own interests aka their cut).  

Which all brings up the obvious question (to me, at least).  If Val thinks he's so qualified to mentor Zendaya or Laurie, how about himself? What's he got going on other than dancing?  One wrong move and his dancing could be over in an instant. He's not getting any younger. He wanted to be a rapper/singer/whatever - that didn't go so well.  He wanted to be a fashion designer - whatever happened to that?  Where does he have other irons in the fire to make the next steps after DWTS?  Shouldn't he be mentoring himself first?  Somehow I doubt he'd be satisfied conducting dance lessons at "the fam's" studios for the rest of his days.

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1 hour ago, Toonces464 said:

The only reason I think they have a shot is because Maks seems to be tight with Wynn & Encore Hotels thanks to Le Reve. Personally I'd rather see Cheryl bring her show to Vegas.

Has he ever done anything besides that ? Serious question, I have no clue.  And, that was long ago.

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2 hours ago, kitcloudkicker said:

So much of this. I get that the show is competitive and everyone wants to be on every season to "keep their spot" but I wish the pros were incentivized more to rotate in and out. A larger cast that trades in and out. I usually am a Derek fan but his worst seasons were when he burnt himself out trying to do too many things, you could just see he didn't have reserves in the creativity tank - it would have been better for him to sit those out and come back fresh if he wanted. The same seems to be happening with Val - he needs a break to get some new perspective and inspiration. Then maybe come back. Kinda feeling the same about Witney and Sharna as well. I don't dislike any of them. But I could see them benefitting from a break.

It sounds good in theory, but for the pros I'd imagine each season is a major chunk of their annual income and they've got to bring in the money while they can.  Plus, I suspect they get signing bonuses because just prior to the cast announcement each season, they all seem to go on spending sprees buying pricey new cars and down payments on houses/condos etc.  On the other hand, the show wants the popular pros (and their fans) each season.  The pros are the continuity from one season to the next.  Producers aren't worried about the pros longevity.  When they're used up, they'll just find new ones.

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1 hour ago, Uke said:

It sounds good in theory, but for the pros I'd imagine each season is a major chunk of their annual income and they've got to bring in the money while they can.  Plus, I suspect they get signing bonuses because just prior to the cast announcement each season, they all seem to go on spending sprees buying pricey new cars and down payments on houses/condos etc.  On the other hand, the show wants the popular pros (and their fans) each season.  The pros are the continuity from one season to the next.  Producers aren't worried about the pros longevity.  When they're used up, they'll just find new ones.

Yeah, I suspect this is just the reality of the situation. The pros don't do this for fun, this is their job, their employment. And sitting out even one season always brings the risks that the producers will just throw you over for the next hot thing. It doesn't matter how popular you are, everyone can be replaced. Since this is the majority of their yearly earnings, probably, of course they keep on. Also? Val's not getting any younger. He's 30 now, I think? In dancer terms, he doesn't have all that much time anymore. So it makes sense that he earns as much money now while he still can. He's got his skill set as a dance teacher and the dance studios, he won't be destitute after his DWTS career is over. But right now is the time for him to cash in. That's the economic truth behind all the sparkly BS all the pros have to spout on the show. And I don't blame them for spouting all that BS tbh, you see how fickle TPTB are.

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5 hours ago, Uke said:

It sounds good in theory, but for the pros I'd imagine each season is a major chunk of their annual income and they've got to bring in the money while they can.  Plus, I suspect they get signing bonuses because just prior to the cast announcement each season, they all seem to go on spending sprees buying pricey new cars and down payments on houses/condos etc.  On the other hand, the show wants the popular pros (and their fans) each season.  The pros are the continuity from one season to the next.  Producers aren't worried about the pros longevity.  When they're used up, they'll just find new ones.

Oh yeah, I don't blame them for it, they're totally incentivized to try and get hot, and then ride that into the ground until they burn themselves out. (You see this elsewhere in showbiz too, like how a Benedict Cumberbatch or Jennifer Lawrence will be in every movie ever for a while because they're "hot," and the movies will usually start out great but get a liiittle iffier if they start to do too much.) Just for my enjoyment though I wish they'd switch it up a bit, so we get them at their freshest and most creative. Or maybe do a better job at bringing in guest choreographers to breathe a little more creative life into the mix. I know they do this some, I'd be a fan of more of it. I don't know that their egos would handle it, but I think you'd get some more variety.

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17 hours ago, Toonces464 said:

None of the current female pros are even remotely stars, IMO. Peta gets the most exposure outside of the show but it's all from her relationship with Maks. Between the first time they were dating and Maks taking her back, you never saw her name mentioned. Karina, Cheryl and Julianne in particular could at least carry themselves.

I don't think any of the male pros are huge stars, either. I don't follow any of them outside the show, and I'd have to google to see what they have done outside of dwts.

All the male pros have huge egos, but they would be smart to realize that dwts is their main source of stardom.

Edited by boyznkatz
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8 hours ago, Uke said:

Which all brings up the obvious question (to me, at least).  If Val thinks he's so qualified to mentor Zendaya or Laurie, how about himself? What's he got going on other than dancing?  One wrong move and his dancing could be over in an instant. He's not getting any younger. He wanted to be a rapper/singer/whatever - that didn't go so well.  He wanted to be a fashion designer - whatever happened to that?  Where does he have other irons in the fire to make the next steps after DWTS?  Shouldn't he be mentoring himself first?  Somehow I doubt he'd be satisfied conducting dance lessons at "the fam's" studios for the rest of his days.

I think Val's fashion business was much like Maks's jewelry business --- a whim that passed pretty quickly. The difference is that Val partnered with Nicole Volynets and she seems to have kept the business going using his name. I don't think it's really gone anywhere outside of his fan base though. 

 

8 hours ago, MsJamieDornan said:

Has he ever done anything besides that ? Serious question, I have no clue.  And, that was long ago.

Years ago Maks used to revamp LeReve at least once or twice a year. I remember him going to Vegas with Serge last year to choreograph a new piece but otherwise it's probably been at least five years since he worked with the show. I think I remember his "Maksim Chmerkovskiy Productions" (cough) doing something in Las Vegas last year after the Maks & Val tour which involved Serge and the people from his Soho studio who were part of Sway being backup dancers for some Vegas show (Wayne Newton maybe?).

48 minutes ago, boyznkatz said:

I don't think any of the male pros are huge stars, either. I don't follow any of them outside the show, and I'd have to google to see what they have done outside of dwts.

 

No one said they're huge stars. But pros like Maks, Derek, Mark, Tony, Karina, Cheryl, Julianne were known outside of DWTS. They got exposure in magazines, they were on talk shows both as guests and co-hosts, they attended a lot of Hollywood and charity events (not just the D list events most of them attend now), they got small movie and TV guest roles outside DWTS. I don't see a lot of magazines (outside the tabloids) putting any of the current pros on their cover and I don't see any of them co-hosting The View or making guest appearances on other ABC shows. 

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Val's fashion line exists, but as mentioned, it's largely run by Nicole Volynets and I think she does most of the work.  Also it's not what it started as.  When it started, it was supposed to be a legit fashion thing.  Then I think when they realized the price points were too high and they weren't really selling items (or maybe they just weren't equipped to do real fashion), so it mostly got reduced to logo t-shirts and shirts with various sayings.  When there is a way to profit off DWTS with shirts for Val's current partner, they do that.  They haven't done a shirt with Normani, but I'm betting it's because her label won't let them use her image for something like that.

I get why pros don't take off.  It addition to the pay off, it's also the out of sight, out of mind thing.  If a show takes time off, and then the show is as successful as it is otherwise, then you run the risk of the show deciding they don't need you.  Though I don't think that is the problem with Val since I think he will always get his spot back.  But for instance, Jenna supposedly took off this season after being passed over for pro.  She made it sound like her choice, but it made me question in the sense is it really smart for someone who was a pro for all of 2 weeks to take the season off when she has yet to even make a mark on DWTS outside of the troupe?

I also wasn't saying there is anything wrong if Laurie wants to act.  I know the payout only lasts until the next group of gymnasts break out of the gate.  Just for me in Laurie's case it's a shame since she was only an elite gymnast at that level for like .5 seconds.  I understand she needs to let her body rest and maybe she will go back if the offers dry up, but her accolades compared to her fellow elites are lacking.  She basically bowed out at the peak of her career.  She's never been on a Worlds team.  I don't think she's ever even been in an international competition at the top level, minus the Olympics.  I'm not taking anything away from her Olympic medals, but she was somewhat poised to be the future of the sport with people like Simone and Aly being older and closer to retirement (I know neither are retired).

Plus what I meant to say was less about Laurie and more about how Val relates to his partners.  In interviews he did last season, that I am too lazy to look for now, he went on and on about how he wanted for Laurie to do everything.  He wanted her to be in movies.  He wanted her to act.  I think he wants her to go to college too but I know he was trying to convince her to go in Cali.  However at that point I didn't know if the stuff Val was saying he wanted for Laurie were things she actually wanted or things that he wanted for her because he wants her to be a star.  If it's stuff that Laurie actually wants for herself then fine, but it's hard to tell.

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