S02.E11: Call Me The Bad Boy of Cheese

[Door County Cherry]

Airs March 17, 2022

Quote

Kat tries to welcome a new business to the neighborhood, but the owner thinks he can get away with whatever he wants. Meanwhile, Randi tries to figure out a great gift for Carter.

 

[kaygeeret]

Is this one of the most predictable and boring sitcoms on TV?

The jokes aren't very funny, the plot (at least tonight) is predictable if not full on stereotypical.

There is such a ton of talent on the show, I really struggle to understand why I find it so dang dull.

I particularly struggle with Mariym's performance.  I LOVED her in The Big Bang Theory and I really can't seem to find that engaging actor who inhabited her role with such grace and humor.  The dialogue is spoken so quickly and throw away, I feel I am missing something.  Gestures over done, etc.  Perhaps it is in the weakness of the scripts and poor direction, but I sure am missing something.

[PinkRibbons]

NO. BAD SHOW. NO.

Seriously I can't believe Mayim let them pull this bullshit - you do not perpetuate the stereotype of boys treating girls badly as "romance"!!! This dude is a complete asshole, and the response to "panties in a twist" is "oh my panties aren't in a twist, but say it again and your balls are going into a vice grip". He's not challenging, he's gross! I wish this show would remember that Kat is not only a grown-ass woman but a successful business owner and a PHD! Giving her feelings for what is clearly a misogynist douchebag with a "bad boy" disregard for the law everyone else has to follow for a damn reason is regressive as hell. There's nothing wrong with having a business rival - that's a fun old trope. But she has to have a crush on him? Because she's a girl? UGH.

 

[Snow Apple]

Who wrote this and why do they think women fall for jerks? Do they think Kat and Oscar's romance is going too well and need conflict? It doesn't. It's too cliche and I'm disappointed. 

[Door County Cherry]

On one hand, I liked the dynamic, at least in the beginning of the episode, more than I should have.  I thought they worked well off of one another.

On the other, I agree with everything that has been said. In fact, the more "I know you better than you know yourself" he got, the less enjoyable I found the dynamic.  It started with the reintroduction of the Kat/Max history which we do not need to revisit.  And then it ended with "does he challenge you?"  Challenging her isn't what he's doing.  

But I don't blame her for getting turned on.  Sometimes we get turned on by things that logically should not turn us on.  However, I hated how it ended with a note that it has to be a. problem. instead of having her just channel that energy into bed with her boyfriend.  Or heck, more role playing with Oscar playing the bad restauranteur she wants to punish. 

[SoMuchTV]

8 minutes ago, Door County Cherry said:

But I don't blame her for getting turned on.  Sometimes we get turned on by things that logically should not turn us on.  However, I hated how it ended with a note that it has to be a. problem. instead of having her just channel that energy into bed with her boyfriend.  Or heck, more role playing with Oscar playing the bad restauranteur she wants to punish.

Eww.  But, yeah. 

[CainF]

Wow, this episode was a lot of fun.  Gotta give MVP to Mayim this time around, with Swoosie a very close second.  The writing was near perfect.  Leslie Jordan had some great lines, a nice change...his former coworker from Will and Grace was back and although very short scenes and dialog, he and the writers seem to be on the right track to making that character...dare I say in the delightful mode of Phyllis from MTM?

Mayim's breaking the 4th wall moments were fun and handled very well. Swoosie gets MVP for the dance-out this time around.  Once she was in scene, I just had to keep watching her.  Fantastic.

My only concern is that the show is hinting a direction in Kat's relationship with Oscar that might be a real turn-off for me.  Oscar is sexy, kind, funny, and pitting him against another, any other, is going to be very hard for me to accept...don't do it, show, please don't do that to the audience.  The current relationships continue to grow and are a joy to watch in large part because this kind of tension doesn't exist.  I get the feeling the writers think shaking things up in (at least) Kat and Oscar's relationship is the way to go, at least as an arc or even a cliffhanger but please show, we don't need cliffhangers at the end of the season to keep us anticipating the show"s return.  We only need fun and good writing and characters that we enjoy spending time with, which the show has already achieved for the most part, and making steady improvements every episode.

[appositival]

14 hours ago, Door County Cherry said:

the owner thinks he can get away with whatever he wants.

Isn't that Max's role? Are all tall attractive men jerks? Do all women fall for jerks? Are all TV scriptwriters slaves of cliché? Tune in next week!

Kat, it was just a dream. I dreamed that I died once and it hasn't happened yet. Your subconscious was just taking out the trash. Kudos to the promo monkeys for making such a misleading promo, though. Nothing like starting an episode with an underlying feeling of dread.

I'm not sure what Jerk!Nick's trajectory is, but unless Kat rats him out (my preference) it looks like we will be seeing more of the same. I agree with everyone who thought Kat's reaction to Nicks manly douchery was cringe-worthy.

[needschocolate]

18 hours ago, PinkRibbons said:

NO. BAD SHOW. NO.

Seriously I can't believe Mayim let them pull this bullshit - you do not perpetuate the stereotype of boys treating girls badly as "romance"!!! This dude is a complete asshole, and the response to "panties in a twist" is "oh my panties aren't in a twist, but say it again and your balls are going into a vice grip". He's not challenging, he's gross! I wish this show would remember that Kat is not only a grown-ass woman but a successful business owner and a PHD! Giving her feelings for what is clearly a misogynist douchebag with a "bad boy" disregard for the law everyone else has to follow for a damn reason is regressive as hell. There's nothing wrong with having a business rival - that's a fun old trope. But she has to have a crush on him? Because she's a girl? UGH.

 

If they keep going in this direction, there will eventually be a scene where he grabs her, pushes his lips against hers while she struggles, then she melts into his arms and kisses him back.  I hate when shows do that.  

 

 

 

[Johannah]

On a different note - for some reason, I really enjoyed the Tyler's Mom exchange.

When Kat went into the other store (don't remember what kind it was):

"Tyler, your Mom is here." ...

"They still call you Tyler's Mom"

"He's a good kid.  I could do worse."

 

Don't know why I enjoyed that so much.  

[possibilities]

The Tyler's mom thing was the best part of the episode. 

I am starting to think I ought to just go watch cat videos on You Tube, so I don't have to keep being disappointed about there not being enough cats in this show.

I don't find guys like the new dude amusing at all. I really, really have no use for his character and find everything about it poisonous.

It looks like they want to add him to the ensemble and they think he's fun, but I agree that what makes this show watchable is that there really isn't a villain or a bad boy and everybody is basically decent and makes an effort to be kind. Even when Max was being an ass about money, they had the others be kind but not indulging his BS. I don't want them to pivot to "obnoxious is compelling".

And I love Oscar. I don't know why TV thinks happy and healthy relationships aren't fun to watch. Maybe TV writers are all sadists who enjoy seeing people suffer. I don't know. 

I just absolutely wish they hadn't introduced this guy, even for one episode. They've barely gotten the show to the point where I'm not embarrassed to watch it. I hope they don't throw it all away.

Edited March 19, 2022 by possibilities

[Yeah No]

Weirdly, although I agree with everyone about the new guy, I thought it wasn't a bad episode in every other respect.  We've had worse!

They could have made him a hot new sexy guy without making him a misogynist asshole.  It wrecks up the dynamic of the show.  It's like ripping the needle off a phonograph record every time he acts like an offensive dick and I have to stifle my impulse to figuratively kick him in the nuts.  And I almost feel bad for saying last week that she didn't have enough romantic chemistry with Oscar.  If the alternative is THIS, forget I ever said that!

My hope is that he's going to be used as a foil for Max and Oscar for a while until that gets played out and then just calm down and become the weird guy next door.  I'm hoping he's not a fixture every week.  I somehow doubt that but with this show you never know.

 

[Yeah No]

On 3/17/2022 at 9:34 PM, kaygeeret said:

Is this one of the most predictable and boring sitcoms on TV?

The jokes aren't very funny, the plot (at least tonight) is predictable if not full on stereotypical.

There is such a ton of talent on the show, I really struggle to understand why I find it so dang dull.

I particularly struggle with Mariym's performance.  I LOVED her in The Big Bang Theory and I really can't seem to find that engaging actor who inhabited her role with such grace and humor.  The dialogue is spoken so quickly and throw away, I feel I am missing something.  Gestures over done, etc.  Perhaps it is in the weakness of the scripts and poor direction, but I sure am missing something.

While I think the show is going in a positive direction (generally) this season compared to last, I can't help but agree with you somewhat.  What gets me is that when I checked on individual episodes, they are actually being written by some of the same writers that wrote Big Bang Theory.  So go figure.  I think the problem with the show is that it was loosely patterned on another show and couldn't really replicate it well enough so it went off in its own direction, but it really hasn't found a solid direction to go in and keeps floundering around with different things.  BBT started off with a solid direction and a funny one, and sticking with that was all it needed to be as funny as hell.  Every character was well thought out and there were a million hysterical lines and plots that could written for each one of them.  The characters on this show have not been thought out well enough.  They are nice but as characters they are still finding themselves.  Also, Mayim herself is such a bright, happy, talkative person that it's hard to get used to her being more like herself after knowing her only as Amy for 12 years.  But I do think if they could have crafted a character for Kat better than what we've seen so far that wouldn't be an issue.   I'm wondering if it doesn't come down to a "too many cooks spoil the TV show" issue.

[peachmangosteen]

I thought Kat had more chem with the new guy than she has with either Max or Oscar. And while everyone is totally right about how bad it is to perpetuate this kind of thing, I enjoyed it so whatever lol.

[MaryMitch]

I do not like the new guy - he's a jerk. But when he popped up in the bed at the end of the episode, all of a sudden, he was cute. Acting!

[ctlady]

On 3/17/2022 at 9:48 PM, Snow Apple said:

Who wrote this and why do they think women fall for jerks?

To be honest, Nick is exactly what Max was in the first season.  A full of himself, 'all the ladies love me' jerk, until the writers tried to redeem him with some humility

On 3/17/2022 at 9:44 PM, PinkRibbons said:

Seriously I can't believe Mayim let them pull this bullshit - you do not perpetuate the stereotype of boys treating girls badly as "romance"!!!

I wouldn't go so far as Nick treating Kat 'badly'.  Yes, there was some inappropriate verbal sparring - and she was giving back just as good - but I didn't detect anything that bordered manipulative or even abusive.  They're rival business owners who are testing each other and pushing back.  As for Kat having a crush, I don't know why the writers had to insert that part in, unless it's a test to strengthen her and Oscar's relationship.  Also, with all the 'women's empowerment' narrative, I highly doubt the writers will go down a mountain they can't climb back from

Best part of the episode - the Great Dane.  Although the kitties are cute, I'm not a cat person - never was (also highly allergic), but give me a great, big dog jumping up to put his paws on my shoulders and I'm ecstatic.

18 hours ago, needschocolate said:

If they keep going in this direction, there will eventually be a scene where he grabs her, pushes his lips against hers while she struggles, then she melts into his arms and kisses him back.

Or.....in order to show 'empowerment' the writers could have Kat be the aggressive one - which would be just as bad.

23 hours ago, CainF said:

Mayim's breaking the 4th wall moments were fun and handled very well.

Takes a bite of sandwich:  (4th wall)  "Holy balls, that's good!

Reality:  "Eh, it's alright"

26 minutes ago, peachmangosteen said:

I thought Kat had more chem with the new guy than she has with either Max or Oscar

And, sadly, I have to agree with this.  I like Oscar.  I really do.  He's incredibly sweet, attentive and loyal to Kat.  But the quick pecks on the cheek and courting gestures come across too tame.  Showing them in bed together (with Kat in neck to ankles pjs) doesn't sell it

23 minutes ago, MaryMitch said:

But when he popped up in the bed at the end of the episode, all of a sudden, he was cute. Acting!

The end was great - didn't expect the actor to pop up in the middle.  Shelia and Phil coming out of the closet (no pun intended), the dog jumping on the bed, the customer with one of the 18 free cupcakes he's wangled. 

On a (my opinion) critical note, I wish the actor who plays Carter would take the height of that hairdo down.  That thing can take an eye out in bed

[needschocolate]

I like Oscar, but as a character in a sitcom, there is not much there.  He is always extra in the scene, not necessary.  His character isn't fleshed out enough. We know more about Nick than we do about Oscar.   All we know about Oscar is that he is really into efficiency (although that only seemed to be for that one episode).  The whole purpose of his character seems to be so Kat has a boyfriend - that way, every once in a while, they can have a "Does Kat stay with Oscar or go with this other guy?" story line.  They don't really have a relationship. All the relationship stories are about Randi and Carter.   

3 hours ago, Yeah No said:

My hope is that he's going to be used as a foil for Max and Oscar for a while until that gets played out and then just calm down and become the weird guy next door.  I'm hoping he's not a fixture every week.  I somehow doubt that but with this show you never know.

I was hoping that all his lawbreaking - illegal cheese, painting the curb, selling alcohol, etc - would catch up with him and he would either leave town or get arrested.  Anything to get him off the show.  I thought it might take two episodes, but now that Kat has a crush on him, he will probably be around for a while.  Ugh!

[Yeah No]

6 minutes ago, needschocolate said:

I like Oscar, but as a character in a sitcom, there is not much there.  He is always extra in the scene, not necessary.  His character isn't fleshed out enough. We know more about Nick than we do about Oscar.   All we know about Oscar is that he is really into efficiency (although that only seemed to be for that one episode).  The whole purpose of his character seems to be so Kat has a boyfriend - that way, every once in a while, they can have a "Does Kat stay with Oscar or go with this other guy?" story line.  They don't really have a relationship. All the relationship stories are about Randi and Carter.   

I was hoping that all his lawbreaking - illegal cheese, painting the curb, selling alcohol, etc - would catch up with him and he would either leave town or get arrested.  Anything to get him off the show.  I thought it might take two episodes, but now that Kat has a crush on him, he will probably be around for a while.  Ugh!

I agree with you about everything here 100% except I'm hoping that like someone else said above, they find a way to redeem Nick because he is hot, seems to have a more definite purpose and personality, and he and Kat already have great chemistry.  They've made Max and Oscar so milquetoast and blah that I think they need Nick to bring the romance factor.

[Door County Cherry]

I thought Kat and Sandwich boy had more chemistry in the beginning of the episode too but I think it's more because it's easier to feel chemistry when there's friction mixed with flirtiness.  Years of will they/won't me has definitely made me in tune to it. 

I don't think it's more than Oscar, though.  I just think it's different. 

But definitely more than Max.

And I don't think Max was ever this bad, though.  A bit arrogant/center-of-attention but I don't recall him ever being to the level of "does he challenge you" douchiness.  It feels very mansplainy which is what started to turn me off. 

[Johannah]

I didn't talk about Nick in my earlier post because, after reading all the early posts, I thought I wasn't watching this episode critically enough.  I sometimes tend to ignore what is politically correct or what might offend someone and just watch for fun.  Yeah, I thought he was a jerk and I didn't like the Kat crush over him, but I thought their exchanges were fun and Kat didn't seem to be intimidated by him.  If her crush and his flirting just stay a fun little interaction between them and goes no further, it could be fun.  Throw in a few times that he gets in trouble for breaking the rules and I'm okay with him being an occasional visitor.  Other than him being something of an entitled jerk, Nick's relationship with Kat could be like Max's - a male friend she's attracted to, but wouldn't do anything about because she loves Oscar.

39 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

I agree with you about everything here 100% except I'm hoping that like someone else said above, they find a way to redeem Nick because he is hot, seems to have a more definite purpose and personality, and he and Kat already have great chemistry.  They've made Max and Oscar so milquetoast and blah that I think they need Nick to bring the romance factor.

I agree, but not so much the romance factor as the fun bickering.

[Bruinsfan]

5 hours ago, ctlady said:

To be honest, Nick is exactly what Max was in the first season.  A full of himself, 'all the ladies love me' jerk, until the writers tried to redeem him with some humility

I... don't recall Max being a jerk in the first season. At least not until he confessed romantic feelings to Kat right before her anniversary celebration with Oscar. He didn't return her interest prior to that, and got rightly mad at her for interfering in his love life, but I don't remember him being dismissive or rude to anyone.

Nick, on the other hand, is giving me sociopath vibes between his total disregard for rules/common courtesy and the way he immediately picked up on strangers' subtext at a single glance and spoke about it to manipulate them.

[Toothbrush]

If they tone Nick’s character down to just be a fellow business owner on the block who has contraband cheese, beer, & sausages he has the potential as a fun recurring character. But not as part of the core gang, and not, I repeat NOT, as a romantic partner for Kat. I like Oscar & would miss him if he left, but not for Kat to be paired with a douchey guy like Nick. Not all relationships have to start with conflict and his “get me a coffee honey”, “does he challenge you”, “do you want me to touch your neck” bs is just gross. Have a little imagination writers!

I love Kat & Randi’s wardrobes.

I loved the big orange kitty on the chair at the end. Looks like our Penny. 
 

[Bruinsfan]

I think we're about half a century past "get me a coffee Honey!" being a workable first line in a romance. Now a murder mystery, that I could be down for. Sheila needs more storylines.

Edited March 19, 2022 by Bruinsfan

[kaygeeret]

8 hours ago, ctlady said:

nd, sadly, I have to agree with this.  I like Oscar.  I really do.  He's incredibly sweet, attentive and loyal to Kat.  But the quick pecks on the cheek and courting gestures come across too tame.  Showing them in bed together (with Kat in neck to ankles pjs) doesn't sell it

I assume due to Mariym's religious beliefs she requested the wardrobe.

In BBT she shared the bed with Sheldon the same way - altho' it worked there because of the 'quirky' characters.  Actually one doesn't really need to have 'revealing' pjs to get great sex....just saying.

11 hours ago, Yeah No said:

What gets me is that when I checked on individual episodes, they are actually being written by some of the same writers that wrote Big Bang Theory. 

Was absolutely shocked to find this out!  Maybe it has to do with an incompletely thought out premise or sheer laziness?

[HyeChaps]

I'm hoping that Sheila and the tv guy hit it off.  

[possibilities]

Max was always friends with Kat, he wasn't interested romantically at first but he's never been aggressively obnoxious, that I recall. I remember them singing together at the piano bar and generally being friends, talking about college times together, etc. 

Nick started negging her right out of the gate. I thought he was toying with her, not that he was actually interested. Honestly, a guy like him would not be interested in Kat. He just likes to dominate. And to the extent that she's been raised to feel like a guy like that would never be interested, her being excited by his interest strikes me as low self-esteem, not genuine attraction.

If the show decided to explore how cultural messages about who is or is not attractive messes with people and undercuts their genuine interests, I'd be okay with it. But if they are going to make this an on-going UST and treat it as valid (Kat actually has legitimate reasons not to be compatible with this guy, even if she didn't already have Oscar; not only is he an obnoxious jerk to her, but he's also a lawbreaker, and Kat is a genuine goody two shoes kind of person who would not be happy with a guy who tries to undermine a local business by putting a free coffee sign in front of someone else's cafe, or painting his own yellow zone). 

I don't see Nick as redeemable, because I just don't believe in giving peopel a pass on being aggressive jerks just because... what? They're wounded little boys inside? They somehow don't know better? I don't think he's interesting and I don't think he's sympathetic and I wish they had never introduced him at all because I don't see a fun, lighthearted way out of this. ANd it makes me think less of the guys, who in this episode were broing out with him and didn't seem to care at all about what an obnoxoious jerk he was. 

I did notice they didn't have Randi or Phil participate in the "Nick is Okay!" stuff they had Max and Oscar involved in. So maybe there's something there. I don't know. I do like the idea that Sheila might be the one to dispose of Nick; she'd have the most experience wrangling this kind of jerk, so it would be interesting to see her be the one to take him down.

They can keep the dog, though. But teach him some manners. He jumps up on the wrong person and someone could get hurt.

[CrystalBlue]

12 hours ago, MaryMitch said:

I do not like the new guy - he's a jerk. But when he popped up in the bed at the end of the episode, all of a sudden, he was cute. Acting!

I do enjoy the waving (with dancing sometimes) at the end of the show, and not because it's a tribute to the original-idea show Miranda.  It just has a great vibe to it and I love how they include all the actors in that episode.

[CarpeFelis]

13 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

I thought Kat had more chem with the new guy than she has with either Max or Oscar. And while everyone is totally right about how bad it is to perpetuate this kind of thing, I enjoyed it so whatever lol.

Honestly I think this guy should have been cast as Max. Better looking and yes, he does seem to have more chemistry with Kat than Max ever did.

[CrystalBlue]

12 hours ago, ctlady said:

To be honest, Nick is exactly what Max was in the first season.  A full of himself, 'all the ladies love me' jerk, until the writers tried to redeem him with some humility

I wouldn't go so far as Nick treating Kat 'badly'.  Yes, there was some inappropriate verbal sparring - and she was giving back just as good - but I didn't detect anything that bordered manipulative or even abusive.  They're rival business owners who are testing each other and pushing back.  As for Kat having a crush, I don't know why the writers had to insert that part in, unless it's a test to strengthen her and Oscar's relationship.  Also, with all the 'women's empowerment' narrative, I highly doubt the writers will go down a mountain they can't climb back from

Best part of the episode - the Great Dane.  Although the kitties are cute, I'm not a cat person - never was (also highly allergic), but give me a great, big dog jumping up to put his paws on my shoulders and I'm ecstatic.

Or.....in order to show 'empowerment' the writers could have Kat be the aggressive one - which would be just as bad.

Takes a bite of sandwich:  (4th wall)  "Holy balls, that's good!

Reality:  "Eh, it's alright"

And, sadly, I have to agree with this.  I like Oscar.  I really do.  He's incredibly sweet, attentive and loyal to Kat.  But the quick pecks on the cheek and courting gestures come across too tame.  Showing them in bed together (with Kat in neck to ankles pjs) doesn't sell it

The end was great - didn't expect the actor to pop up in the middle.  Shelia and Phil coming out of the closet (no pun intended), the dog jumping on the bed, the customer with one of the 18 free cupcakes he's wangled. 

On a (my opinion) critical note, I wish the actor who plays Carter would take the height of that hairdo down.  That thing can take an eye out in bed

I agree with you about everything you've said here, although it makes me sad about the cats*.  I love the Great Dane too.

*I totally understand the allergies situation, which can lead to asthma attacks or hives and rashes because of the cat "dander" in addition to constant sneezing, congestion or runny nose and teary, watery eyes.  I'm allergic to everything and have adjusted to my love of cats and dogs with medication and time.

Glad you're a dedicated dog lover!  I'm an animal lover too.

[Yeah No]

5 hours ago, kaygeeret said:

17 hours ago, Yeah No said:

What gets me is that when I checked on individual episodes, they are actually being written by some of the same writers that wrote Big Bang Theory. 

Was absolutely shocked to find this out!  Maybe it has to do with an incompletely thought out premise or sheer laziness?

Yeah, that's pretty much what I was getting at when I said upthread that the show and its characters were still floundering around trying to find themselves.  I think the problem was that they started off basing it "loosely" on another show, but didn't really figure out how close or far away to make it from the original beforehand and decided to figure it out as they went along.  Not a good idea.

[CrystalBlue]

If Nick stays, they should drop the Kat crush on him, and let him be the annoying (to Kat and the other ladies) business rival.  I can see Max and Nick bonding, and Oscar will just hang with them for the fantastic food at Nick's sandwich shop.

I'm most annoyed by his law-breaking being the yellow-painted curb.  Contraband food, not so much, unless it foie gras, which has been banned in California (rightly so IMHO) but not in Kentucky, so it wouldn't even be contrand there in Louiseville!

Yeah, Sheila definitely has the chops to set him straight!

[Yeah No]

5 hours ago, CrystalBlue said:

If Nick stays, they should drop the Kat crush on him, and let him be the annoying (to Kat and the other ladies) business rival.  I can see Max and Nick bonding, and Oscar will just hang with them for the fantastic food at Nick's sandwich shop.

Just what we need, yet another male character to bond with the guys who are just hanging around in search of a good storyline on this show.  😏

[chediavolo]

20 hours ago, ctlady said:

To be honest, Nick is exactly what Max was in the first season.  A full of himself, 'all the ladies love me' jerk, until the writers tried to redeem him with some humility

I wouldn't go so far as Nick treating Kat 'badly'.  Yes, there was some inappropriate verbal sparring - and she was giving back just as good - but I didn't detect anything that bordered manipulative or even abusive.  They're rival business owners who are testing each other and pushing back.  As for Kat having a crush, I don't know why the writers had to insert that part in, unless it's a test to strengthen her and Oscar's relationship.  Also, with all the 'women's empowerment' narrative, I highly doubt the writers will go down a mountain they can't climb back from

Best part of the episode - the Great Dane.  Although the kitties are cute, I'm not a cat person - never was (also highly allergic), but give me a great, big dog jumping up to put his paws on my shoulders and I'm ecstatic.

Or.....in order to show 'empowerment' the writers could have Kat be the aggressive one - which would be just as bad.

Takes a bite of sandwich:  (4th wall)  "Holy balls, that's good!

Reality:  "Eh, it's alright"

And, sadly, I have to agree with this.  I like Oscar.  I really do.  He's incredibly sweet, attentive and loyal to Kat.  But the quick pecks on the cheek and courting gestures come across too tame.  Showing them in bed together (with Kat in neck to ankles pjs) doesn't sell it

The end was great - didn't expect the actor to pop up in the middle.  Shelia and Phil coming out of the closet (no pun intended), the dog jumping on the bed, the customer with one of the 18 free cupcakes he's wangled. 

On a (my opinion) critical note, I wish the actor who plays Carter would take the height of that hairdo down.  That thing can take an eye out in bed

I’d hate to have him sitting in front of me at a show. It’s as bad as a woman’s hat, or worse. And it looks ridiculous, like he had a block of cheese on his head. 

[ctlady]

9 hours ago, CarpeFelis said:

Honestly I think this guy should have been cast as Max. Better looking and yes, he does seem to have more chemistry with Kat than Max ever did.

I have to agree with this. Perhaps the writers are testing Nick’s character and storyline out as a way to segue Max out of the show. He’s relegated to being a sidekick to Carter and Kat. There’s no substance and the writers may think they’ve written themselves into a corner with him, thus the introduction of Nick-to take his place on the show. And I think that may be a good move. He’s got a successful business next to Kats so he’s here long term. I wouldn’t be surprised if they wrote Max off in the finale -maybe he wrote a catchy commercial jingle that got picked up and he was offered a job out west or something. And this way Randi inherits his apartment! 

 

10 hours ago, possibilities said:

They can keep the dog, though. But teach him some manners. He jumps up on the wrong person and someone could get hurt.

While I’m fine with overly friendly strange dogs I agree some are not. But to be fair, I’m still skeeved by cats slithering around in an establishment where food and drink is sold and could be prone to scratching someone

Nick may be snarky, insulting, condescending, ‘I always get my way’, but then again-so was Sheldon, minus the ladies man vibe

[CrystalBlue]

16 minutes ago, ctlady said:

I have to agree with this. Perhaps the writers are testing Nick’s character and storyline out as a way to segue Max out of the show. He’s relegated to being a sidekick to Carter and Kat. There’s no substance and the writers may think they’ve written themselves into a corner with him, thus the introduction of Nick-to take his place on the show. And I think that may be a good move. He’s got a successful business next to Kats so he’s here long term. I wouldn’t be surprised if they wrote Max off in the finale -maybe he wrote a catchy commercial jingle that got picked up and he was offered a job out west or something. And this way Randi inherits his apartment! 

For awhile now I've thought that Max would be better off in France, for us viewers' sake, with Brigitte.  Perhaps Max will have second thoughts about nixing their relationship?  He moves to France and she takes him back!

[Yeah No]

10 hours ago, CarpeFelis said:

Honestly I think this guy should have been cast as Max. Better looking and yes, he does seem to have more chemistry with Kat than Max ever did.

I double checked looking at their photos online and I still think Cheyenne Jackson is better looking.  But I still find Nick attractive.  They never wrote Max's character to give him and Kat any chemistry.  Why I don't know.  For some reason they want Nick to have more chemistry with her.  I have to think it's all intentional, but it's still an example of how they can't pick a direction and stick with it.

52 minutes ago, ctlady said:

Nick may be snarky, insulting, condescending, ‘I always get my way’, but then again-so was Sheldon, minus the ladies man vibe

Yeah, but we could always forgive Sheldon because he supposedly didn't know any better.  What's Nick's excuse?

[ctlady]

6 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

Yeah, but we could always forgive Sheldon because he supposedly didn't know any better.  What's Nick's excuse?

I never liked that Sheldon’s behavior was excused. He’d said some pretty mean things to his friends ( and Amy) who were equally gifted, intelligent and educated as he was ( except Howard, which he always pointed out and put down). He was a rotten friend and with Amy, a condescending partner at times   Sheldon had years surrounded by his friends that, as smart as he was, he could’ve been influenced by to be considerate, compassionate and less of a narcissistic tool. And Sheldon also had the benefit of a Christian mother who tried to teach him values whereas the other guys had ones who ignored them (Raj), screamed all the time ( Howard) or used them as psychological experiments ( Leonard) and they turned out more in tune with being able to filter themselves than Sheldon 

As for Nick, he’s just your garden variety, pretty boy who thinks he can get by on his looks and smooth talk. We don’t know his background or upbringing so we can’t say for sure what made him this way. I’ve known several guys like this and most were brought down several notches by someone who saw through the BS rather than be sucked into their self imposed awesomeness 

[Yeah No]

Just now, ctlady said:

I never liked that Sheldon’s behavior was excused. He’d said some pretty mean things to his friends ( and Amy) who were equally gifted, intelligent and educated as he was ( except Howard, which he always pointed out and put down). He was a rotten friend and with Amy, a condescending partner at times   Sheldon had years surrounded by his friends that, as smart as he was, he could’ve been influenced by to be considerate, compassionate and less of a narcissistic tool. And Sheldon also had the benefit of a Christian mother who tried to teach him values whereas the other guys had ones who ignored them (Raj), screamed all the time ( Howard) or used them as psychological experiments ( Leonard) and they turned out more in tune with being able to filter themselves than Sheldon  

I agree pretty much but we were supposed to suspend disbelief about Sheldon.  Even Amy couldn't stay mad at him.  Having known many real Sheldons it is true that they are tone deaf about the unwritten social rules and are to varying degrees unable to learn them, so you have to filter it out because they know not what they do.  It's supposedly a common character trait of some disorders on the autism spectrum, although the show never came out to "diagnose" Sheldon that way.  At least they showed Sheldon making some progress in learning to read a room and understand social situations better as the show went on.  We can only hope that Nick gets toned down that way too.

[Snow Apple]

Awww. I like Max and don't want him to leave unless the actor wants to leave. I hope they start writing stories for him. It doesn't have to involve Kat.

If they want Kat having a love triangle, at least Max tries to be nice. Or introduce another character. I hated everything about Nick. He doesn't even have a fun reckless charm. I just thought he was a jerk. Calling Kat "Honey" and ordering her around? Yuck! The character can still redeem himself and become part of the friend group, but I don't think I can get that bad taste of the bad first impression out of my mouth to root for Kat/Nick. He reminds me of the "no tip" guy who I also hated and happy they got rid of.

Edited March 20, 2022 by Snow Apple

[appositival]

39 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

It's supposedly a common character trait of some disorders on the autism spectrum, although the show never came out to "diagnose" Sheldon that way.

Sheldon said that he wasn't crazy and that his mother had him tested, but autism is not insanity, and I'm pretty sure he was on the spectrum with his emotional blindness.

Nick on the other hand is coming across as a sociopath who will wear your skin as he eats your brains. (YMMV)

[ctlady]

43 minutes ago, appositival said:

Nick on the other hand is coming across as a sociopath who will wear your skin as he eats your brains

Yikes!  I mean, the guy's an insensitive, full of himself tool, but I wouldn't put him in the same category as Buffalo Bill

[possibilities]

Sheldon was an equal opportunity jerk. He didn't single out the females as targets for insults, while being friendly with the guys. 

I thought they were giving Max things to do. He's having to learn to be more responsible, grow up, not rely on his looks, and have some humility. He's a decent friend most of the time and he's not constantly obnoxious. 

The compulsive need for melodrama and obnoxiousness is such a weird thing about TV. IRL, there are plenty of everyday things that people struggle with, even when there's no particular villain around. Randy and Carter figuring out how they each express their affection was a decent story. Nobody had to be an abusive shit for them to mine that one. 

Good writing can mine basically decent characters and life situations for comedy. We don't need some insane caricature to insert tension.

 

[Door County Cherry]

5 hours ago, Yeah No said:

I double checked looking at their photos online and I still think Cheyenne Jackson is better looking.  But I still find Nick attractive.  They never wrote Max's character to give him and Kat any chemistry.  Why I don't know. 

I just don't think Cheyenne and Mayim have much chemistry.  Maybe I'll change my mind as the show goes but that has been a concern for me since the beginning.  I would like to know if they chem tested Cheyenne and Mayim or if they just went with him because he's semi-known.  He's not a huge star but he has been on Broadway and done quite a bit of TV.  

They have been better with his stories this season but everyone knows what his ultimate role is supposed to be and if he's unsuited for that role, he does feel like he doesn't quite fit in. 

[possibilities]

I am hoping they don't plan to put him and Kat together so the lack of chemistry is on purpose. I just don't find anything about the pairing plausible, but I'm fine with that. Of course, I didn't watch the UK MIranda, so I'm not coming to this show with any expectations.

[SmithW6079]

On 3/19/2022 at 2:38 AM, possibilities said:

I am starting to think I ought to just go watch cat videos on You Tube, so I don't have to keep being disappointed about there not being enough cats in this show.

It's a sitcom about people, one of whom runs a cat cafe. It's not about cats. That's like saying they don't show enough drunks in Carter's bar. It would be different if they were highlighting cats for adoption at the end of every episode.

[possibilities]

I don't know. Grand Crew is a show about friends who hang out in a bar, and they always drink there. No alcoholism, but it would be weird if there were never any drinks.

The cats at Kat's Cat Cafe are hardly even visible most of the time. I don't need there to be constant adoption stories, but the point of a cat cafe is that there are a lot of cats and people go there to be with the cats as much as to drink coffee or buy muffins. The cats on this show act like they're hiding more than interacting with the customers, and the customers don't even seem to know there are cats there. It would be easy to forget it is a cat cafe if Kat's name didn't sound like "cat".

[Yeah No]

4 hours ago, possibilities said:

I don't know. Grand Crew is a show about friends who hang out in a bar, and they always drink there. No alcoholism, but it would be weird if there were never any drinks.

The cats at Kat's Cat Cafe are hardly even visible most of the time. I don't need there to be constant adoption stories, but the point of a cat cafe is that there are a lot of cats and people go there to be with the cats as much as to drink coffee or buy muffins. The cats on this show act like they're hiding more than interacting with the customers, and the customers don't even seem to know there are cats there. It would be easy to forget it is a cat cafe if Kat's name didn't sound like "cat".

I agree.  Usually people that run places like that are very into cats so you'd think there'd be more storylines featuring cats or at least interaction with cats.  It's making me get the impression that Kat opened the café because she thought it was a cool idea since her name was Kat, but nothing more.

[sugarbaker design]

7 hours ago, possibilities said:

The cats at Kat's Cat Cafe are hardly even visible most of the time.

And for that I am eternally grateful.  I would be happy with cardboard cutouts of cats.

[Door County Cherry]

I think part of the issue is that cats are harder to work with as animals than dogs. But I think there are plenty of cats.  Just because Friends hung out in Cafe Nervosa didn't mean they had a story about the coffee they were drinking. 

 

[ctlady]

1 hour ago, sugarbaker design said:

The cats at Kat's Cat Cafe are hardly even visible most of the time.

As they should be.  It's an establishment that sells coffee and baked goods.  We'd be sending a dish back if a human hair was found in it.  I don't know how Kat gets away with the health code by having fluffy cats who obviously shed a lot roam around inside a cafe