S02.E11: The Reunion

[Jane Tuesday]

 

Quote

Everybody gathers for uncomfortable chit chat.

. 

[NeenerNeener]

Iyanna looks completely different with the long braids and the extra weight. Shayne is actually likeable; Shake is not.

Nick and Vanessa are saying to Shake a lot of what we've said here. He did go on the show for the wrong reasons. It looked like Nick wanted to punch him several times. And Shake finally admits at the end that he went on the wrong show. I can't see him on FBoy Island or Too Hot to Handle though; he's too old.

What is it with these guys and wearing socks?

Edited March 4, 2022 by NeenerNeener

[Blakeston]

I just binge-watched the whole season. So much to say!

Deepti and Shake - I have no trouble believing what was said in the AMA Reddit about Shake asking for a villain edit. He clearly gets off on it. I won't be surprised if he shows up on Big Brother-style reality shows now. His goal all along may have been to set himself up for those opportunities - the casting people are always looking for villains.

I wish Nick and Vanessa had asked Deepti when her feelings for Shake dissolved. She seemed to enjoy his company even after Mexico, but she must have known by that point that he was talking shit about her.

Jarrette and Iyanna - They seem very sweet. I don't buy that Jarrette's conversation with Mallory was just inappropriate joking, though.

I think the most generous interpretation for Jarrette's behavior in that conversation was that he was still hurt by Mallory's rejection, and so he wanted to show her what she was missing. (Which certainly isn't great, but is better than him saying, "I wish I was with you instead of her.")

Mallory and Sal - We never really saw what was going on with them. I don't like that Sal was praised for his "I'm too much of a gentleman to talk about what happened" thing. That seemed like a cover for him to avoid telling the truth - which was that outside of the pods they never had much of a connection to begin with, and they both just stayed on the show for the exposure. (I hated agreeing with Shake, but I think he was right that they were being fake.)

Shayne and Natalie - I still have no idea what to make of Shayne. He obviously has a very ugly side, but is the sweet puppy dog side of him really genuine, or just an abuser's charming facade? I suspect it's genuine, but I can't say for sure.

I never thought I'd say this at the beginning of the season, but Shayne is completely fascinating. If he goes to rehab or therapy (and I absolutely think he should go to both), I'd love to be a fly on the wall. He has some deep, deep issues with shame. I also have to wonder how much losing his father just two months before filming had an effect on his moods and his use of substances.

Danielle and Nick - I'm not buying for a second that it's been smooth sailing for them.

Nick sets off my gaydar so hard that I consider him one of the most obvious closet cases I've seen in a long time. Some closet cases are so deeply repressed that they can't even acknowledge to themselves that they feel same-sex attraction. But I don't think that's the case with Nick. My guess is that he's been with guys, and wants to come out, but he just can't bring himself to do it. If that's the case, marrying a woman (especially one with so many rejection issues) is truly awful of him.

And no matter how much Danielle works on herself, I think she's always going to have a ton of issues. I only know what I've seen on the show, and I know I'm not in a place to be able to diagnose any of these people in any way. But I will say that the behavior we've seen from Danielle on the show is about 1,000% consistent with Borderline Personality Disorder. Creating drama for the sake of creating drama, fear of abandonment, having the urge to push her lover away exactly when she needs him the most. Not to mention falling for a guy who clearly loves drama himself! I don't think anyone can be enough for her. Their whole relationship makes me deeply uncomfortable.

Kyle and Shaina - Ugh. Kyle really does seem to be as oblivious as he came across. If I were him, I wouldn't be holding out hope for Deepti to slide into his DMs. 

And Shaina seems like a very shallow, ignorant person who's nonetheless shrewd about using language like "taking full ownership" to make it sound like she's holding herself accountable, when she's just being self-serving. I can't believe she didn't get fully called out for her reprehensible comments to Shayne about how his relationship with Natalie was fake and a joke. I wish someone had asked her how Jesus would feel about her saying that.

[procrasstinator]

3 hours ago, NeenerNeener said:

 Shayne is actually likeable; Shake is not.

 

What is it with these guys and wearing socks?

And I had the opposite reaction during the show.  I thought Shake was likeable and Shayne was not.  After watching the reunion I thought neither was really likeable.  I also binge watched this season and had heard a lot of negative comments about Shake's behavior.  I didn't think anything they showed on the season was so bad but then during the reunion hearing people say that he was basically trash talking Deepti behind her back way worse than was shown I stopped being on his side at all.

And Shane, Shane.  He has these moments where he seems to be be okay and kind of aware.  He did the right thing in apologizing to Natalie for "gaslighting" (that's not really gaslighting) her during the Who is this Shaina?  conversation.  Saying he went straight to victim mode when he should have listened and let Natalie speak.  Then he turns around and does the exact same thing when Natalie was talking about their fight the night before the wedding.  And no Shane, no one believes that an emotionally mature adult who takes ownership of their own feelings and reactions to situations in any situation anywhere is justified in telling someone they love I hate you.  That is 100% on him.  That shows such a lack of maturity.  This is what a young child or at best a rebellious teenager does when they don't get what they want not an adult.  Mature people learn to regulate their emotional reactions so even though you are feeling panic, upset, fear etc you don't use that as an excuse to attack other people and ESPECIALLY not the people you claim to love.  (Danielle needs to learn this same lesson.  Nick is not responsible for your crazy ass feelings.  You have the right and the responsibility to express your feelings you do not have the right to blame someone because you are feeling anxious.  That is so toxic.)

 

I totally agree about the socks.  That's just weird af to me. 

[procrasstinator]

40 minutes ago, Blakeston said:

Mallory and Sal - We never really saw what was going on with them. I don't like that Sal was praised for his "I'm too much of a gentleman to talk about what happened" thing. That seemed like a cover for him to avoid telling the truth - which was that outside of the pods they never had much of a connection to begin with, and they both just stayed on the show for the exposure. (I hated agreeing with Shake, but I think he was right that they were being fake.)

 

Kyle and Shaina - Ugh. Kyle really does seem to be as oblivious as he came across. If I were him, I wouldn't be holding out hope for Deepti to slide into his DMs. 

And Shaina seems like a very shallow, ignorant person who's nonetheless shrewd about using language like "taking full ownership" to make it sound like she's holding herself accountable, when she's just being self-serving. I can't believe she didn't get fully called out for her reprehensible comments to Shayne about how his relationship with Natalie was fake and a joke. I wish someone had asked her how Jesus would feel about her saying that.

I really liked Mallory on the show.  I don't know how much of a connection she had with Sal after the pods, but from my understanding there's contractual obligations in play after accepting a proposal in the pods?  Mallory always seemed like a genuinely kind and reasonable person.  She didn't go on the attack even when Sal was accusing her of just wanting exposure or whatever.  She just very calmly and respectfully stated her truth.  In my humble opinion the world needs more Mallorys in it.

I agree about Kyle.  I also think he was very impressed with Shaina's physical appearance and tried to push ahead with a relationship because he found her so physically appealing.  And even though I don't like Shaina's behavior in general (and I can't believe I'm defending her at all) I can understand being confused about how important  being the same in terms of faith really is.  She stated she had a past relationship with someone with a strong faith that turned into a very controlling situation and she stated hearing of people who were able to make marriages work even though they had different views about Christianity.  So the uncertainty seemed plausible to me.  I thought it was more that maybe there was no physical attraction for Shaina in regards to Kyle and she maybe didn't want to say that and so she blamed it on his views on faith.  I think that's why she kept thinking about Shane because it did seem like there were feelings of physical attraction for her there.  And I 100% agree her behavior was reprehensible which goes to show that just because you claim to be a person of faith does not make you a good person. 

[AnnaBaptist]

Holy cow, everyone is so repulsed by Shake. Even without their remarks, their body language says it all.

Does anyone else think that Shake is purposely going for the villain edit in order to get more attention? With every comment he made, he kept digging a deeper hole for himself. Nick and Vanessa looked like they wanted to punch his lights out. I think he loves that he gets a reaction from people, however negative. He has probably done this all his life, too. When his mother told him in a previous episode that Deepti deserves 100% respect, I got the impression that the mom has been to this rodeo before.

I am not a fan of Shayne, but I liked him more by the end of this episode. I get the impression that he will learn something from this experience and become a more mature person, whereas Shake seems hopeless to me.

[LemonLime]

The way everyone was going 'ufffff *eyeroll*' every time Shake opened his mouth was SO satisfying to watch. 

[NeenerNeener]

54 minutes ago, AnnaBaptist said:

Holy cow, everyone is so repulsed by Shake. Even without their remarks, their body language says it all.

What I found really surprising is that some of the other guys told Deepti what he'd been saying about her behind her back and warned her not to marry him. 

[Hpmec]

Some really astute comments here. Shake is an ass who wants to  make a name for himself on reality tv. He even admitted he didn't take this show seriously, and I think he was doing his best to play the villain because it would open up more opportunities. He really screwed the pooch on that one. He comes off as so mean spirited and self serving I doubt any casting director would be interested. 

Is Kyle really that clueless, saying he should have proposed to Deepti? Poor guy is just desperate to be in a relationship. Shaina has to be one of the biggest bullshitting phonies I've ever come across. When he asked her if his looks had something to do with her rejection, she out and out lied calling him a "handsome"person when she telegraphed from the get go after seeing him that she wasn't interested -- at all. Had the door opened up to reveal a Brad Pitt lookalike, she'd have had an entirely different reaction. Religion was just an excuse. She even backtracked a bit on that, saying she had a relationship with a Christian who was "controlling." So I have to assume what she's looking for is a smoking hot guy who sort of generically believes in God. Keep looking, Shaina. 

Nick and Danielle have already been to couples therapy to work on their issues. He did not look like a man in love, smitten with his wife. He looked more like a guy asking himself, "How the hell did I get involved in this, and how can I get out?" He stupidly married an emotionally unstable woman who would be beyond devastated if he walked out, which is destined to happen sooner or later. He probably won't be happy until he steps all the way out of the closet and starts living a more authentic life.

 

Edited March 4, 2022 by Hpmec

[Racj82]

2 hours ago, Blakeston said:

I just binge-watched the whole season. So much to say!

Deepti and Shake - I have no trouble believing what was said in the AMA Reddit about Shake asking for a villain edit. He clearly gets off on it. I won't be surprised if he shows up on Big Brother-style reality shows now. His goal all along may have been to set himself up for those opportunities - the casting people are always looking for villains.

I wish Nick and Vanessa had asked Deepti when her feelings for Shake dissolved. She seemed to enjoy his company even after Mexico, but she must have known by that point that he was talking shit about her.

Jarrette and Iyanna - They seem very sweet. I don't buy that Jarrette's conversation with Mallory was just inappropriate joking, though.

I think the most generous interpretation for Jarrette's behavior in that conversation was that he was still hurt by Mallory's rejection, and so he wanted to show her what she was missing. (Which certainly isn't great, but is better than him saying, "I wish I was with you instead of her.")

Mallory and Sal - We never really saw what was going on with them. I don't like that Sal was praised for his "I'm too much of a gentleman to talk about what happened" thing. That seemed like a cover for him to avoid telling the truth - which was that outside of the pods they never had much of a connection to begin with, and they both just stayed on the show for the exposure. (I hated agreeing with Shake, but I think he was right that they were being fake.)

Shayne and Natalie - I still have no idea what to make of Shayne. He obviously has a very ugly side, but is the sweet puppy dog side of him really genuine, or just an abuser's charming facade? I suspect it's genuine, but I can't say for sure.

I never thought I'd say this at the beginning of the season, but Shayne is completely fascinating. If he goes to rehab or therapy (and I absolutely think he should go to both), I'd love to be a fly on the wall. He has some deep, deep issues with shame. I also have to wonder how much losing his father just two months before filming had an effect on his moods and his use of substances.

Danielle and Nick - I'm not buying for a second that it's been smooth sailing for them.

Nick sets off my gaydar so hard that I consider him one of the most obvious closet cases I've seen in a long time. Some closet cases are so deeply repressed that they can't even acknowledge to themselves that they feel same-sex attraction. But I don't think that's the case with Nick. My guess is that he's been with guys, and wants to come out, but he just can't bring himself to do it. If that's the case, marrying a woman (especially one with so many rejection issues) is truly awful of him.

And no matter how much Danielle works on herself, I think she's always going to have a ton of issues. I only know what I've seen on the show, and I know I'm not in a place to be able to diagnose any of these people in any way. But I will say that the behavior we've seen from Danielle on the show is about 1,000% consistent with Borderline Personality Disorder. Creating drama for the sake of creating drama, fear of abandonment, having the urge to push her lover away exactly when she needs him the most. Not to mention falling for a guy who clearly loves drama himself! I don't think anyone can be enough for her. Their whole relationship makes me deeply uncomfortable.

Kyle and Shaina - Ugh. Kyle really does seem to be as oblivious as he came across. If I were him, I wouldn't be holding out hope for Deepti to slide into his DMs. 

And Shaina seems like a very shallow, ignorant person who's nonetheless shrewd about using language like "taking full ownership" to make it sound like she's holding herself accountable, when she's just being self-serving. I can't believe she didn't get fully called out for her reprehensible comments to Shayne about how his relationship with Natalie was fake and a joke. I wish someone had asked her how Jesus would feel about her saying that.

Respectfully I must say that in my opinion there is way too much projection of this guy and that guy being "obviously gay" on these shows. Almost every season of shows like these there is someone that is "obviously gay" even though it almost never seems to pan out that way. Some men just carry themselves differently than others. It doesn't mean anything. 

[Racj82]

29 minutes ago, NeenerNeener said:

What I found really surprising is that some of the other guys told Deepti what he'd been saying about her behind her back and warned her not to marry him. 

I don't think that was surprising at all. It's been very clear that everyone loves Deepti. Between the guys constantly out Shake to their women in terms of what he said and how much time it got, either they were going to tell her or the women were.

I don't fuck with Shake really but I'm tired of people signing up for reality shows and then trying to form their own edits or keep secrets. You want to keep your dating life quiet, don't go own tv. You will be fine. So, I applauded him being like, let's stop with the bullshit and air it out.

My God Sal is boring.

[Chicago Redshirt]

46 minutes ago, Hpmec said:

Is Kyle really that clueless, saying he should have proposed to Deepti? Poor guy is just desperate to be in a relationship. Shaina has to be one of the biggest bullshitting phonies I've ever come across. When he asked her if his looks had something to do with her rejection, she out and out lied calling him a "handsome"person when she telegraphed from the get go after seeing him that she wasn't interested -- at all. Had the door opened up to reveal a Brad Pitt lookalike, she'd have had an entirely different reaction. Religion was just an excuse. She even backtracked a bit on that, saying she had a relationship with a Christian who was "controlling." So I have to assume what she's looking for is a smoking hot guy who sort of generically believes in God. Keep looking, Shaina.

We don't know much about what happened in the non-pairings, but for all we know, Kyle and Deepti did have chemistry in the pods. The notion that someone attracted to Shaina's personality  (or lack thereof) enough to propose to her would also be attracted to Deepti's personality enough to propose to her strikes me as a stretch, but what do I know?

I would say it's not a lie to say Kyle is a handsome person. I think by most conventional standards, he is. That of course doesn't mean that Shaina was attracted to him. or even that Shaina was actively turned off by how he looked. Basically all the main case on both sides are handsome or pretty. It's not backtracking to say that religion is important to her but that there was a Christian guy who wasn't good for her and so she thought (wrongly) giving a good-guy atheist a shot made sense. (Again, I absolutely think that Shaina accepted the proposal not because she was attracted to Kyle at all but because she wanted to either continue with the show generically or she wanted another shot at Shayne.)

 

[Chicago Redshirt]

Random impressions/lessons from the reunion:

Natalie was quietly furious and so didn't want to be there.

Either Shake simply cannot read a room, cannot edit himself, or gets off on being the villain (or all of the above). What kind of guy would blurt out that the only woman there he was physically attracted to was Vanessa? Normally, it seems unfair that each of them probably makes more for their hosting duties than most people make in a year, but each of them probably earned their pay for not kicking Shake's ass on camera.

The confession that Jarrette and Iyanna did the deed while in Mexico serves as a reminder that the reality powers that be can and do mess with us.

Iyanna looked a lot better with the braids and more curves in my superficial opinion.

Shaina's squinting was way more noticeable in the reunion for me.

Edited March 4, 2022 by Chicago Redshirt

[procrasstinator]

10 minutes ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

 

I would say it's not a lie to say Kyle is a handsome person. I think by most conventional standards, he is. That of course doesn't mean that Shaina was attracted to him. or even that Shaina was actively turned off by how he looked. Basically all the main case on both sides are handsome or pretty. It's not backtracking to say that religion is important to her but that there was a Christian guy who wasn't good for her and so she thought (wrongly) giving a good-guy atheist a shot made sense. (Again, I absolutely think that Shaina accepted the proposal not because she was attracted to Kyle at all but because she wanted to either continue with the show generically or she wanted another shot at Shayne.)

 

I think I remember a scene where Kyle was going on about Shaina being model pretty and saying something like he had to keep pursuing her because otherwise when would he ever have a shot again with someone so gorgeous.  So regardless of whether Kyle is perceived as an attractive man it seems like according to him Shaina is so attractive that she was out of his league.  I had the impression not that Kyle was not attractive enough to interest Shaina but maybe he was too eager to be with her because he found her so pretty and too insecure about his handsomeness and that was maybe a turn off for her.  He did seem quite shallow to me after he saw Shaina and he seemed to focus on her physical appearance a lot more than the "emotional connection" he made with her.

[procrasstinator]

7 minutes ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

 

Natalie was quietly furious and so didn't want to be there.

 

Yes I noticed that too.  She just stared-so intense- with no smile. 

[thejuicer]

2 hours ago, Hpmec said:

When he asked her if his looks had something to do with her rejection, she out and out lied calling him a "handsome"person when she telegraphed from the get go after seeing him that she wasn't interested -- at all. 

Shaina's reassurance that Kyle was a "handsome person" cracked me up and convinced me she does not believe that at all. It sounds like something a grandmother would say to her 10 year old grandson at church on a Sunday.

[Blakeston]

2 hours ago, Hpmec said:

Some really astute comments here. Shake is an ass who wants to  make a name for himself on reality tv. He even admitted he didn't take this show seriously, and I think he was doing his best to play the villain because it would open up more opportunities. He really screwed the pooch on that one. He comes off as so mean spirited and self serving I doubt any casting director would be interested. 

Unfortunately, I think Shake would be seen as an ideal villain for a competitive reality show. Or even another dating show. He knows how to give exactly the kind of outrageous sound bites that they're looking for.

2 hours ago, Racj82 said:

Respectfully I must say that in my opinion there is way too much projection of this guy and that guy being "obviously gay" on these shows. Almost every season of shows like these there is someone that is "obviously gay" even though it almost never seems to pan out that way. Some men just carry themselves differently than others. It doesn't mean anything. 

I know it can sound regressive to hear gay men talking about how someone "sounds gay," or "acts gay." However, gaydar has served us well for centuries!

None of us know anything about Nick's sexuality for sure. But it's not just his voice and mannerisms that are creating suspicions. The way his family acted about him bringing home a woman seemed like they had good reason to think it wouldn't work out. And his relationship with Danielle felt very passionless - it seemed to be more about him being her emotional caretaker than any desire for her on his part.

Also, on a side note, having OCD related to handwashing and bathing is extremely common among people who grew up having sexual impulses that they were uncomfortable with. Throw in the strict Catholic upbringing, and the black vest with the harness in his closet, and a female love interest who's a complete emotional mess, and he's hitting almost every closet case stereotype there is.

If he comes out, I won't be surprised. If he doesn't come out, we'll never know one way or the other.

[mirandroid]

2 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

Shaina's squinting was way more noticeable in the reunion for me.

YES. Girl, get your eyes checked.

Shayne is a walking raw nerve. Not sure if a reality show was the best move for him so soon after the death of his father. I was impressed/surprised that he told Deeps what Shake was saying behind her back, and it gives me hope that he might be ok despite all of this. Rooting for Jarrett and Iyanna, snoozing for Nick and Danielle, looking forward to the trainwreck of The Ultimatum.

[SoapDoc]

Whew. I think it would have been difficult to sit on that stage with all the emotional baggage there.

I literately felt all of Natalie and Shayne's emotions. I believe they love each other still. That doesn't mean that I think they should be together, but regret is going to hound them. I know Natalie says she doesn't like to think about it that way, but how can you not? We often regret something even when you know it was for the best and right now you can tell the wounds are still fresh for both of them. I bet they have tried to work it out more than once... And yes, I believe Shayne needs some maturity, be it from self-awareness or therapy. Natalie has her flaws too, but nothing merited her the verbal barrage Shayne gave her before the wedding.

Quote

Shayne is a walking raw nerve. Not sure if a reality show was the best move for him so soon after the death of his father.

mirandroid, this is a very good point that I keep forgetting to consider. Maybe his emotions around his father are making him appear more fragile than he actually is? He seems to show flashes of being a stand-up (if hyper) guy *as with Deepti).

I actually thought Shayne might swing on Shake when Shake grabbed him and said, "Shut up!"  Nick looked like he was ready to throw down too when Shake said he was attracted to Vanessa. I appreciated that there was no bloodshed.

I don't think Shake is nuanced enough to be the villain on another show. You have to have some self-awareness and some chill to be a villain. He seemed to exhibit that during most of the show. But since the show aired, he has been coming hard for everyone and been getting dragged regularly on Social Media. If everyone sees you coming, you can't sneak up on someone. And in that case, you have to be incredibly smooth to make the villain edit work. I am not sure he can do that.

I think Jarette and Iyanna have a real shot at making it work. I am glad Nick and Danielle are still together, but I still think they will crash and burn at some point. Hopefully, before they have any kids.

And how cool is it to be the one person on the show that everyone would ride or die for (except Shake)? Go Deepti, go!

 

Edited March 4, 2022 by SoapDoc
I had more points to make...

[Racj82]

3 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

Random impressions/lessons from the reunion:

Natalie was quietly furious and so didn't want to be there.

Either Shake simply cannot read a room, cannot edit himself, or gets off on being the villain (or all of the above). What kind of guy would blurt out that the only woman there he was physically attracted to was Vanessa? Normally, it seems unfair that each of them probably makes more for their hosting duties than most people make in a year, but each of them probably earned their pay for not kicking Shake's ass on camera.

The confession that Jarrette and Iyanna did the deed while in Mexico serves as a reminder that the reality powers that be can and do mess with us.

Iyanna looked a lot better with the braids and more curves in my superficial opinion.

Shaina's squinting was way more noticeable in the reunion for me.

Shaina looks like she has a permanent who farted? Look on her face. I hate it.

Also, it's more about what people on reality shows do not the show itself because people love creating their own narratives. They do and say things when the cameras aren't around and then after filming a whole bunch of other shit comes out.

Edited March 4, 2022 by Racj82

[DearEvette]

Can't help it, it is cheesy, but I liked the color coordination of the married couples. 

Shake's entire shtick this whole reunion is "let me interrupt everyone, let me speak for you, and let me be an asshole while doing it."

I am sure he thinks he was being provocative and clever and it may seem like he is enjoying his villain role, but honestly, I am getting the same energy here that I got when Deepti said no at the wedding.  Like at the wedding, he put on this big front to minimize being  embarrassed that she said no, it really feels like here he is putting on a front and leaning into the villain thing as if to say 'I wanted this all along' but there is an air about him that he realizing he is reading the room wrong and really isn't all there for it. Also he flat out contradicted his whole "Before I find out if you are good in bed, I want to find out if you are good in the head" statement.  He talked himself into a circle and exposed himself as a liar.

What a contrast to Sal and Natalie who obviously did not see this as some big game.  Natalie was visibly unhappy the whole time.  Her face reminded me of her mom's face during the wedding. And Sal seems like he was coming to terms with his own hurt as well. To me it felt like out of everyone, the both of them felt like they were the most hurt/disappointed but were not willing to play it out for tv. 

Deepti was just so done! I an glad that people were telling her about how Shake was talking behind her back.  And if what we saw was watered down, I shudder to think what he was really doing or saying.

I was not big on Iyanna & Jarrette but I am glad they seem to be making it work.  I loved that her anger was toward Jarette and not Mallory. Too many women would displace their anger on the other woman while giving their guy a pass.  I glad to hear they are finding their balance, it has to be hard to be an extreme introvert married to an extreme extrovert.  Officially rooting for them to make it in the long haul.

And I was very skeptical of Danille and Nick.  Like I said in the Weddings thread, I hope they prove me wrong.  So far they are,  so good for them as well.

Shaina's eye squints are meme worthy. 

Interesting to hear Kyle mention he should've married Deepti.  Again, as I mentioned in the Weddings thread, it is a shame the show decided to craft certain narratives while other interesting ones were also happening  that they completely left on the cutting room floor.  The way he said it, it sounds like Kyle and Deepti may have dated in the pods?  He is definitely in touch with her post show -- they are quite chummy on SM.

[Zuleikha]

34 minutes ago, SoapDoc said:

I literately felt all of Natalie and Shayne's emotions. I believe they love each other still.

I agree. Their love comes across as very real. But I think what Natalie said in the wedding episode is true. Sometimes love is not enough. But it is so, so painful to watch.

I think Shayne is probably a fun and generally kind-hearted person. I can see what draws Natalie to him, which I could not understand at all in the first two episodes. But he never learned the tools he needs to for managing his negative emotions. He's more like a toddler who has to physicalize all of the emotions than a typical adult. I think if he found a competent therapist, he could possibly develop the tools he needs to make a relationship with Natalie work, but I think it would be better for Natalie to move on as quickly as she can. I don't think the odds are good that Shayne will get the tools he needs.

I am very curious about Sal/Mallory. It feels like their whole story happened off screen, and they don't have enough incentive to reveal it for us. This is the mature, adult way to do things, but of course, it sucks for us as the audience to have so many questions left unanswered.

I am very happy for Deepti's growth, but I will always wonder how she could have stayed enthusiastic about Shake for as long as she did. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

57 minutes ago, mirandroid said:

YES. Girl, get your eyes checked.

Shayne is a walking raw nerve. Not sure if a reality show was the best move for him so soon after the death of his father. I was impressed/surprised that he told Deeps what Shake was saying behind her back, and it gives me hope that he might be ok despite all of this. Rooting for Jarrett and Iyanna, snoozing for Nick and Danielle, looking forward to the trainwreck of The Ultimatum.

I was soooooooooo impressed with both Jarrett and Shayne for doing this  .  I felt so much goodwill for Shayne and then he backtracked it by being so needy for Natalie's apologies.  He needs major therapy.

[violet and green]

4 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

Natalie was quietly furious and so didn't want to be there.

She was very angry at one point re Deepti and expressed that anger to Shake, and also in a more constrained way to Shaina very early on when talking about the pods.

But the rest of the time she looked deeply, deeply sad. It hurt to watch.

I wish N & V had lassoed in Shake a lot more. He kept interrupting and causing answers to be truncated and subjects of interest sidetracked and never returned to. I'd have liked them to bring Ole Squinty to account for her conversation on the beach about Natalie, for one thing.

I still like Shayne, but man he is fucked up.

[jird]

54 minutes ago, DearEvette said:

  I loved that her anger was toward Jarette and not Mallory. Too many women would displace their anger on the other woman while giving their guy a pass.  

Yes! That was my favorite part, besides Vanessa having none of Shake's nonsense. I loved Iyanna saying that Mallory doesn't owe her anything, Jarrette is the one who made a commitment to her. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

All of the men go up in my estimation because of their reactions to Shake.
Shake saying that he was attracted to Vanessa - Shayne's incredulous reaction was so so funny.

Then when Shake was saying he's a villain, on this show for your amusement, one of the guys in the background almost in a whiny, concerned voice says "Are you okay?"  I think it was Sal, or maybe Kyle.  So fucking funny!

So funny how Jarrett called Shake out for being fake AND superficial!  I think that Shake kind of charmed some of the guys at first but then they all realized the kind of person he is.

Edited March 5, 2022 by Ms Blue Jay

[DearEvette]

1 hour ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

I was soooooooooo impressed with both Jarrett and Shayne for doing this  .  I felt so much goodwill for Shayne and then he backtracked it by being so needy for Natalie's apologies.  He needs major therapy.

So much this.  I waffle on Shayne so much.  My opinion of him see-sawed throughout the season and I was left disliking him intensely after the wedding episode.  But outside of what I feel are abnormally high levels of requiring constant affirmation, I don't think he is as terrible as he comes off sometimes.  There is a kernel of decency there and a level of self awareness that seems to be missing in Shake, for instance.  The fact that he told Deepti about Shake says a lot about him.  I finally came to the conclusion that he and Natalie are just too hurt by each other and can't navigate it healthily but they really did love each other.  I felt bad for him when he said 'I just feel so sad.'  He came off as such a broseph  but at least he took this whole thing seriously. 

[Empress1]

Looks:

Unpopular opinion: I like Iyanna's pixie cut better than her braids (I loved her pixie cut). Deepti was dressed for a totally different event than the rest of them. And what was Shayne wearing? No socks, shirt open to his waist? (Also, Shayne, close your damn mouth. His mouth was hanging open half the time.) Danielle's hair color is too dark for her (I think it's darker than it was on the show; her roots were showing). Mallory looked (is) beautiful, although I prefer her hair curly. Nick Lachey is aging really well.

43 minutes ago, violet and green said:

But the rest of the time [Natalie] looked deeply, deeply sad. It hurt to watch.

She really did. Except when she gave a "here this motherfucker goes" look when Shake interrupted Shayne for the first time.

3 hours ago, SoapDoc said:

I believe they love each other still. That doesn't mean that I think they should be together, but regret is going to hound them.

Yeah, they totally still love each other. Natalie loves that man. I was actually affected by how affected they clearly still are. I didn't fully buy that Shayne was 100% during the season, but seeing how hurt he is not being with her, I buy it now. There was a point when she started crying when Nick asked why Shayne was upset and Shayne said it hurt him to see Natalie sad.

Shayne's love language is words of affirmation. We saw it in the season - he would say stuff like "do you think I'm pretty?" and she would play it off as a joke, but he wasn't joking. He needs verbal reassurance. When Natalie was crying he said "You said I'm a good guy just now, I want you to say those kinds of things." I don't know if Natalie got that (she didn't on the show).

5 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

Shaina's squinting was way more noticeable in the reunion for me.

Me too. I don't know if she genuinely is struggling with her vision (no shade, my vision is trash) or if she thinks it makes her look deep (it doesn't), but she was squinting a lot.

Shake is a dick but I do think he was right about Shaina wanting to stay on the show.

I felt bad for Sal, and it was tacky of Mallory to apologize to Iyanna but not Sal. And it seems like they had more trouble than we were shown.

[spunky]

I think Iyana spoke for most of us when she told Shake "We all would love it if you would just shut up in general." He's beyond unbearable.

Nick Lachey:"You treat animals, we're human beings.  Now I see why you don't treat human beings." 😂

ETA: You can tell no one the cast likes Shake. 

Edited March 5, 2022 by spunky

[Empress1]

1 hour ago, DearEvette said:

I felt bad for him when he said 'I just feel so sad.'  He came off as such a broseph  but at least he took this whole thing seriously. 

Exactly - I was calling him a bro all along and he is still 100% not my type, but he took this much more seriously than I gave him credit for.

Here's a "where are they now."

Edited March 5, 2022 by Empress1

[Ms Blue Jay]

1 hour ago, Empress1 said:

Shayne's love language is words of affirmation. We saw it in the season - he would say stuff like "do you think I'm pretty?" and she would play it off as a joke, but he wasn't joking. He needs verbal reassurance. When Natalie was crying he said "You said I'm a good guy just now, I want you to say those kinds of things." I don't know if Natalie got that (she didn't on the show).

I think that everyone gets that, including Natalie.  But Shayne takes it way too far.  Before he can demand that, he needs to do way more work on himself.  What I see from him now is that he thinks he can be emotionally abusive and then turn around and demand apologies and words of affirmation.  Love language doesn't work that way at all!  Once you become emotionally abusive, you can't demand anything and your needs go out the window.  Sorry.

[DearEvette]

Oh... one thing I forgot to mention which I thought was very interesting... Kyle brought up the issue with Shayne expecting Shayna to be in the pod but it was Natalie.  He started to question how that could happen and for a split second it seemed like he was trying to intimate that there was some producer manipulation.  A couple of people started to pipe up as if they wanted to question that as well.  But Nick and Vanessa shut that down with a quickness.  I found it interesting that they allowed Shake to blather on and interrupt and redirect the conversation on several occasions but this line of questioning by Kyle got an abrupt move along.

[Ms Blue Jay]

3 minutes ago, DearEvette said:

Oh... one thing I forgot to mention which I thought was very interesting... Kyle brought up the issue with Shayne expecting Shayna to be in the pod but it was Natalie.  He started to question how that could happen and for a split second it seemed like he was trying to intimate that there was some producer manipulation.  A couple of people started to pipe up as if they wanted to question that as well.  But Nick and Vanessa shut that down with a quickness.  I found it interesting that they allowed Shake to blather on and interrupt and redirect the conversation on several occasions but this line of questioning by Kyle got an abrupt move along.

Yes yes yes yes I noticed that.  Also Kyle brought up how Shaina was even allowed to have a meeting with Shayne after he already proposed to Natalie.

[GracieK]

Shayne has an obvious drug problem in addition to being abusive. I truly don’t understand the affection for him or the desire to see Natalie work it out with him. When she was crying and saying she knew that she was at fault for “pushing him to that point” my heart broke and I just thought “girl no”.  You don’t have to accept any ownership over someone’s shitty behavior or poor emotional outbursts. Just because Shayne needs constant validation doesn’t mean Natalie has to accept some blame when he verbally torments her and claims to hate her. She really should cut all ties with him and move on. He’s a tweaker who will make a mess of her well put together life. 
 

Also I believe Shayne and Shaina slept together and agreed to keep it on the DL. I think Shayne was freaked out and worried Shaina was going to spill the beans. 

Edited March 5, 2022 by GracieK

[LuvMyShows]

7 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

Iyanna looked a lot better with the braids and more curves in my superficial opinion.

1 hour ago, Empress1 said:

Unpopular opinion: I like Iyanna's pixie cut better than her braids (I loved her pixie cut).

I was not a fan of the braids.  From what we saw on the show, the pixie cut seemed to suit her personality more than the braids. 

4 hours ago, DearEvette said:

I loved that her anger was toward Jarette and not Mallory. Too many women would displace their anger on the other woman while giving their guy a pass.  

3 hours ago, jird said:

Yes! That was my favorite part, besides Vanessa having none of Shake's nonsense. I loved Iyanna saying that Mallory doesn't owe her anything, Jarrette is the one who made a commitment to her. 

I was soooo excited by her saying that, that I ran to my husband in the other room and told him all about it.  I have never, and I mean NEVER, seen that on TV.  And every time we do see the woman go off on the other woman and just give her husband a pass, I lose my damn mind!

7 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

Shaina's squinting was way more noticeable in the reunion for me.

And unfortunately for her, what goes along with her squint, is that uber-ugly lip protrusion thing she does, which I think that she thinks is a sexy pout, but it looks like a giant bee-stung frown.

1 hour ago, Empress1 said:

Deepti was dressed for a totally different event than the rest of them.

Don't call me Shake, but that was a very unflattering dress that she was wearing.  At the very end, when she first got up off the couch, the slit in her dress was very unfortunately placed and really appeared as though she had gained a significant amount of weight.

1 hour ago, Empress1 said:

Mallory looked (is) beautiful, although I prefer her hair curly.

Curlier hair for the win!

1 hour ago, Empress1 said:

Danielle's hair color is too dark for her (I think it's darker than it was on the show; her roots were showing). 

Interestingly, it looked like she had lost some weight since the end of the season, back to the weight she had been at the start of the season.

1 hour ago, Empress1 said:

Nick Lachey is aging really well.

My husband walked past and said he looked weird.  I agree and was trying to figure out why...maybe he had too much make-up on?

[Empress1]

I don’t know about his makeup but he’s pushing 50. Full head of hair, still in shape. He looks good. (He’s short though. I’ve seen both the Lacheys in person.)

[GracieK]

Shake is obviously a complete douchebag but I did agree with him regarding spilling all the tea.. Sal’s intimation that there was something dramatic that happened that we didn’t see with Mallory is a bitch move in my opinion. It leaves it up to the viewer to fill in the blanks. It’s like Megan Markle revealing that one of the royals made racist remarks but won’t say who - either be honest and forthright or don’t say anything at all. Half the story just leads to unfair speculation. Also I think Vanessa looooooved it when Shake made that remark about only finding her attractive.. but I’m not the biggest fan of Vanessa. 
 

I also prefer Iyanna’s pixie cut and Mallory’s curly hair. 
 

I hope Deepti finds someone who will respect and uplift her. Also hated her dress on the reunion though. Still bummed that she wasted that gorgeous wedding dress on Shake. 

[Zuleikha]

Sal’s intimation that there was something dramatic that happened that we didn’t see with Mallory is a bitch move in my opinion.

I also thought it was interesting that the cast shut down Shake so fast for bringing up both Jarrette and Sal's ex-girlfriend. I would actually have liked for Sal and Mallory to have answered about how true/false that was. I don't think Mallory had unresolved feelings for Jarrette--she did pick Sal over him in the first place after all--but I wonder if Sal may had unresolved insecurities.

The ex situation was also much more disruptive/scary than the show portrayed, and it's logical that it could have affected Mallory.  

[Chicago Redshirt]

17 minutes ago, Zuleikha said:

The ex situation was also much more disruptive/scary than the show portrayed, and it's logical that it could have affected Mallory.  

What was the situation?

[Zuleikha]

The tl;dr from the live is that the ex was unhappy with Sal's decision to do the show and found crew members associated with it to follow on social media. I forget the exact details, but the ex ended up engaging with people in a disruptive enough fashion for it to be something where Sal (or maybe Sal's sister) was asked what the deal was with the person. The actual visit of the ex to the sister's house was a much more upsetting incident than shown. The ex at one point made a comment about her brother having a gun and not being afraid to use it to Sal's sister, who understood this comment to be a veiled threat against Sal. 

[jackjill89]

I think Shaina's squinting/pursed lips combo is her "listening face." I don't think she has a problem with her sight at all. I think she believes it makes her look like she's paying attention and truly listening to what people are saying. In reality, it makes her look ridiculous.

My daughter and I imitate it all the time as a joke. We tried to count the times she made the face tonight, but lost count. It was pretty much any time they showed her and she wasn't talking. 

I loved Vanessa's take down of Shake. It was epic. 

[Irlandesa]

3 hours ago, GracieK said:

Also I believe Shayne and Shaina slept together and agreed to keep it on the DL. I think Shayne was freaked out and worried Shaina was going to spill the beans. 

I  don't think they hooked up.   This was filmed before the finale aired but after the first nine episodes had been shown to the public. I suspect he had read the "Shayne hooked up Shaina" speculating people did online and just wasn't here for that line of questioning after just having a heavily emotional conversation about his relationship with Natalie.

14 hours ago, AnnaBaptist said:

Does anyone else think that Shake is purposely going for the villain edit in order to get more attention?

I think the judgmental and objective way he spoke of Deepti was probably very reflective of how he is and speaks about women.  It was shown to us in the pods.  He didn't seem thrilled the other guys ratted him out to not only Deepti but the public.  And he even did little things like telling Kyle he'd "facilitate" a relationship between Kyle and Deepti as if he has any sway over who Deepti dates. He's not in the position to facilitate a sandwich delivery to Deepti much less arrange a relationship.  Then he went scorched earth on Kyle after the reunion as if he were a jealous ex. 

His reasoning kept changing tonight about why he went on the show.  First he says it wasn't meant to be taken seriously even though 2 got married and a third couple has a very deep connection. And it was pretty clear Deepti took the process seriously.  Then he backtracks and says he wanted an emotional connection but also the physical matters the most.  Vanessa was right, he was on the wrong show. 

I think he vacillates between wanting to defend his position in the spirit of "honesty" but Deepti is right that he lacks the self-awareness to realize when he crossed the line.

12 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

Again, I absolutely think that Shaina accepted the proposal not because she was attracted to Kyle at all but because she wanted to either continue with the show generically or she wanted another shot at Shayne.

I definitely thought the TV thing at first but if TV were her ultimate goal, I suspect she would have dragged things out---sort of the way I think Sal and Mallory did. 

10 hours ago, Blakeston said:

I know it can sound regressive to hear gay men talking about how someone "sounds gay," or "acts gay." However, gaydar has served us well for centuries!

Also, on a side note, having OCD related to handwashing and bathing is extremely common among people who grew up having sexual impulses that they were uncomfortable with. Throw in the strict Catholic upbringing, and the black vest with the harness in his closet, and a female love interest who's a complete emotional mess, and he's hitting almost every closet case stereotype there is.

The problem with gaydar is that it's pretty binary.  I also find it hard to believe that he's so deeply closeted he'd run out and marry a woman and prominently display leather gear (is that what the harness was?) to be seen on TV.  Speaking of stereotypes, I also find it hard to believe that his family lamenting his doomed relationship because they think he's gay. 

I'm glad they're in therapy.  That seems like a smart move after such a short dating process.

After last week, I thought Jarrette and Iyanna were really cute but I was suspicious with Jarrette's overly demonstrative loving on the couch.

As for The Ultimatum, that show just feels like a recipe for murder.

 

 

[Ms Blue Jay]

Being OCD about showering and handwashing is also common in a pandemic. 🙄  I'm 100% on Nick's side and not his dirty family's side when it comes to that.  Gay or not publicly mocking your son for being "OCD about cleanliness" is a really odd choice to make.

Edited March 5, 2022 by Ms Blue Jay

[dingochick]

18 hours ago, Hpmec said:

Shaina has to be one of the biggest bullshitting phonies I've ever come across

I know it’s late but I read that as “one of the biggest bullshitting ponies” and now I am in hysterics.

[NeenerNeener]

9 hours ago, GracieK said:

I hope Deepti finds someone who will respect and uplift her. Also hated her dress on the reunion though. Still bummed that she wasted that gorgeous wedding dress on Shake. 

I asked my co-worker about wearing that lehenga again after the wedding was called off. She said it could be repurposed for other occasions. I imagine Deepti could mix and match the pieces with other tops and skirts.

ETA: I like the idea of Deepti and Kyle dating. He seems the opposite of Shake.

Edited March 5, 2022 by NeenerNeener

[Blakeston]

6 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Being OCD about showering and handwashing is also common in a pandemic. 🙄  I'm 100% on Nick's side and not his dirty family's side when it comes to that.  Gay or not publicly mocking your son for being "OCD about cleanliness" is a really odd choice to make.

Nick's family members were definitely jerks. I took the comments about bathing to be the sisters complaining that he spent too much time in the bathroom growing up, and then Nick threw in the OCD/handwashing comment himself.

If I were him, I wouldn't have spent enough time with them since the pandemic started for them to know that I was taking longer showers!

9 hours ago, Zuleikha said:

The tl;dr from the live is that the ex was unhappy with Sal's decision to do the show and found crew members associated with it to follow on social media. I forget the exact details, but the ex ended up engaging with people in a disruptive enough fashion for it to be something where Sal (or maybe Sal's sister) was asked what the deal was with the person. The actual visit of the ex to the sister's house was a much more upsetting incident than shown. The ex at one point made a comment about her brother having a gun and not being afraid to use it to Sal's sister, who understood this comment to be a veiled threat against Sal. 

This explains a lot. I can see the other participants applauding Sal for refusing to talk about this on air.

I wouldn't be surprised if Mallory had an off-camera conversation with Sal fairly soon after meeting him in person, where she said that she wanted to take things slowly, and that getting married in a month was off the table.

[NeenerNeener]

7 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

As for The Ultimatum, that show just feels like a recipe for murder.

Yes it does, but I'm going to need something to scratch my Love is Blind/Joe Millionaire itch. I've already watched the Japanese version. The Brazil version of LIB will have to do until April 6th, and maybe I'll do a rewatch of the first season of American LIB.

[DearEvette]

30 minutes ago, Blakeston said:

This explains a lot. I can see the other participants applauding Sal for refusing to talk about this on air.

Honestly I don't blame Sal for not talking about that.  Neither he nor Mallory was present and it wasn't filmed as part of the show when the ex showed up at the sisters' house.  I think it is nice that some of them managed to maintain some boundaries.  That nobody knew that Jarette and Iyanna had sex in Mexico, for instance. 

This reunion was messy and buzzy tv but I wish N&V had gone more into some of the stuff they did with the S1 reunion.  Like, it would have been nice to find out here that Kyle was Deepti's #2.  Or to ask their impressions on seeing everyone in person in the first time.  I wanted more of what they were all doing now.  How did their friends and families receive the show after it aired.  How did they feel about their portrayal.  It was just really unfocused and wanted to rehash the Netflix curated storylines.  It would have been nice to know if there was anything important to them that NF didn't show.  I think that is why it was nice to hear that Jarette and Shayne told Deepti about Shake. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

The show obviously really wanted Iyanna and Jarrett to reveal that and I think it's weird.  Did I&J specifically ask Vanessa to ask that question?  Would Vanessa have dared ask it without their permission?

[funnygirl]

16 hours ago, DearEvette said:

Oh... one thing I forgot to mention which I thought was very interesting... Kyle brought up the issue with Shayne expecting Shayna to be in the pod but it was Natalie.  He started to question how that could happen and for a split second it seemed like he was trying to intimate that there was some producer manipulation.  A couple of people started to pipe up as if they wanted to question that as well.  But Nick and Vanessa shut that down with a quickness.  I found it interesting that they allowed Shake to blather on and interrupt and redirect the conversation on several occasions but this line of questioning by Kyle got an abrupt move along.

I noticed that, too. 

Here's the thing about reality tv: it is over-produced and there is not a lot of reality to it.