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Ms.Lulu

S03.E09 : This is Your Only First Concert

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Ethan and Olivia take steps to reconcile their marriage. Barry and Kim learn that they aren't invited to Moriah's gig, and Kim is forced to make a choice that is best for her, Moriah and Olivia.

Original Air Date Oct 12, 2021

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Kim is a manipulative c*ntwagon.

And Lydia eats it with a spoon too. She’s going to turn out just as bad learning from the masters.

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Just now, RedDelicious said:

Kim is a manipulative c*ntwagon.

Yep, saying she is going to go and no one is going to know.  Having Moriah say that she doesn't want to know.  You reap what you sow. 

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2 minutes ago, Ms.Lulu said:

Yep, saying she is going to go and no one is going to know.  Having Moriah say that she doesn't want to know.  You reap what you sow. 

No one is going to tell Kim Plath what to do and she’s only thinking of herself and what she wants. She’s not thinking about what Moriah wants. That power play with Lydia was sickening. She is right under Kim’s thumb.

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It was interesting that Barry suggested that it would be a bad idea, risky.  He says it is a no go.

Edited by Ms.Lulu
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I’m not up to speed on this crew. What’s the source of conflict between the mom (I guess that’s Kim) and Olivia?

Kim and her husband aren’t some flavor of religious wackazoids, are they? I see Kim is wearing a regular pair of jeans, which makes me think not…

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1 minute ago, Dianaofthehunt said:

I’m not up to speed on this crew. What’s the source of conflict between the mom (I guess that’s Kim) and Olivia?

Kim and her husband aren’t some flavor of religious wackazoids, are they? I see Kim is wearing a regular pair of jeans, which makes me think not…

Why yes they are.  Like the Duggars, they are Quiverfull.  They don't like Olivia.  And for a while Moriah and Micah were also estranged from their parents.

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Now we know, Kim and Barry told Olivia she was filled with evil spirits.  

That is unforgivable.

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I felt bad for Moriah, she was nervous enough without having to referee between her parents and Olivia. I think Kim is a horrible person and only wanted to be there to show she is in charge. However, I don’t think it would harm Olivia to just have Kim and Barry in the back watching their daughter. No one was putting Moriah first here. I have serious concerns about Max with the way he flirts with Micah all the time. I guess Moriah is too sheltered to pick up on that but it’s pretty obvious.

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I am seriously disgusted by Kim's behaviour.  Not only does she take her controlling toxic self to the concert & knowing there is huge conflict, she brings the family & the young daughter, KNOWING that it could get ugly.  She is a horrible mother & a horrible  human being.  I understand that it should not cause harm for her to be there, just listening, from someone else's car. The fact is  though, that she knew she was not supposed to be there. In Olivia's defense, just the presence of a toxic & uncaring control freak person can cause complete anxiety.  Olivia set her boundaries & Kim should NOT be there. That woman needs some serious help & soon. I have to give some small props to Barry for knowing better, but he has zero say anyways. 

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I think it’s pretty sad that most everyone on this forum misses the big picture here. Olivia is the controller. I have one of these girls in my family, a master manipulator. Kim is controlling, I can see this in the family. But Olivia is controlling her husband and his family. Ultimately tearing this family apart. Haven’t been in my son’s life for years because his wife is an Olivia. She proves every episode she has evil ways in her actions. No one should make a person choose family or them. How can everyone be so blind as to not see this? In the upcoming episode she gets a room with her husband she left for sticking up for her. Really? Shocker. There are all kinds of wrong in this family, I agree, but Olivia is putting the family at war. 

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I've always suspected that Kim was the reason for the vast majority of toxicity in the family and this episode underscored that. Barry has his problems for sure, but he doesn't spend time devising ways to wield sneaky, weird power over his children. I think he is more awkward and weak than calculating or malicious.

All of this perseverating and plotting over Moriah and her treacly nothing music and cringey makeup choices. I try to avoid regional stereotypes but is there seriously nothing better to do in south Georgia? 

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I saw a little last night, but couldn’t watch anymore. It’s just too sad.  It also brings back memories of control freak zealots from my own teen years.  Man, I hope these people can escape the toxicity. 

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The very idea that someone wants to impose boundaries makes Kim enraged. She smiles and gives justifications as to why it is her right to do exactly what she wants regardless of what her daughter wants.   Her wants are infinitely more important and she is pissed that her children won’t acknowledge that.
 

She proved once again why her adult children are leery or downright hostile about any deep relationship with her. 

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As the wise old Balloon Boy once said, “They did it for the show.”

While I believe there is tension between Olivia and Kim, I guarantee that this was amped up and scripted. I mean, you could see it coming light years away. 

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I’ve watched every episode… it’s like a train wreck that you can’t turn away from.  I wish Kim had gotten counseling BEFORE reproducing.  I felt so embarrassed for the children in season1 that they were SO ill prepared for life.  Olivia revealing the true reason she’s so traumatized by Kim is crucial.  Kim could have let Lydia go to Moriah’s gig and FaceTimed her - less drama for everyone.  I think her going was selfish.  But that’s her motive with everything. And poor socially awkward Barry🤦‍♀️.  

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I haven’t had the pleasure of watching last nights episode just yet but I always find it unsettling that Olivia sets the boundaries for the Plath family!

She would do well to start mending bridges in the relationship she has with her own family members and then concentrate on her falling apart marriage!

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13 hours ago, Ms.Lulu said:

Now we know, Kim and Barry told Olivia she was filled with evil spirits.  

That is unforgivable.

Just when I didn't think it was possible to dislike Kim more.....

I thought Barry was supposed to be the "headship" or whatev if they were Quiverfull.  Kim sure wears the pants in that family.  I don't think Barry is happy being on this show.  It's all Kim, all the time.

She had a great opportunity to be gracious and let Lydia take the younger girls while she and Barry stayed home.  But no, not Kim.  Then she said she wanted to be there and Moriah wanted her there.  Nope, not exactly.  If Moriah had not had Olivia in the band, Moriah would have wanted her.  Moriah didn't want her mom there because it would upset Olivia and she needed Olivia to play keyboard. She didn't want Olivia distracted.  I can't imagine Olivia not being really upset seeing Ethan prowling around looking for Ma Plath.  So both Olivia and Moriah are upset and distracted.   I have zero respect for the family "friends" that allowed Kim to hide in their car.

It was definitely a learning experience for Moriah about dealing with her parents.  The next time she has to go against them she needs to spend some time rehearsing what she is going to say, preferably with someone like Ethan or Michal playing the parents.   Too bad Lydia won't be any help.

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Like 99.9% of y'all, I am DISGUSTED by Kim's behavior but we've come to expect this deluded level of self aggrandizing behavior from her so we shouldn't be surprised, and yet we are. I think the pinnacle of gross was learning from Olivia that Kim and Barry called her 'filled with evil spirits' knowing full well what a devastating thing that is to say in their 'religion', and I use that word in the loosest sense because this is a cult not a religion. Fine line, yes, but there it is nonetheless. That Kim hid in the car was stupid as fuck. So stupid I had to actually write out the 'as fuck' part because 'AF' doesn't do her justice. This woman is a menace. What I am constantly shocked by is that she and her nitwit husband allow their younger daughters to sit in and listen to this family drama all the damn time. It's horrible! That little girl should never have gone to that gig, she's too young to be at a bar and grill and given Kim doesn't allow the kids to drink Coke or eat sugar, suddenly bringing them to a bar and grill is okey dokey? What the actual fuck?!?

This episode hit home how awful they've been to Olivia and why she is so wary of them. Good for her for keeping her boundaries with them. They've shown no growth towards respecting Olivia and in fact seem to have doubled down on  disrespecting her wishes. So fuck Kim. I'd say 'at least Barry stayed home' but I think he'd have gone if it weren't for Kim wanting to be the center of attention in this episode.

I love that Max has normal parents and honestly, Moriah is lucky to have him and his family. This show seems so OTT but I think it's one show that's not that scripted because you cannot fake the fear and anxiety in Olivia and Moriah's faces when they think Kim is there. Nor can you fake the pissed off demeanor of Micah at his mother disrespecting Moriah's wishes. Nor can you fake how upset and depressed Ethan is. These kids all need counseling, and by someone who understands the fundy world and what it's like to break free of it. Because this is a special set of circumstances that they're all dealing with.

Lastly, I did like that Olivia is trying to reach out to Ethan and connect as a couple. You can tell that she's really trying and that she's taking her counseling seriously. I hope that Ethan and she can work things out together. I think they'd be doing a lot better had their sick, twisted parents not moved to Cairo to make their lives miserable. That move alone is creepy as hell. Olivia and Ethan should just move to fucking California and be done with this shit. Bring Micah with them too.

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I apologize in advance if this bothers people, but I CANNOT stomach Kim.. She is such a narcissist who sees her daughter's gig as more about her than anyone.

To mention that Kim  wouldn't allow Mariah's siblings to go to her gig because she can't go is ridiculous. Ethan's parents were religiously/emotionally rude to Olivia and unsupportive. Perhaps now Olivias's first gig with Mariah will be as drama-free as possible, but nooooooo, Kim's feelings come before anyone else's.

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I can't decide if the drama is partially scripted or if Kim is just THAT DUMB.  How could she not realize that her big fat honking car wouldn't be obvious in the rather small parking lot at the gig?  And if you have the foresight to have 'a friend' meet you at the gig so you can hide out in the friend's car, why not just meet somewhere else and have the friend drive so your car isn't even there to be seen?  Stupid. 

Kim is so self absorbed, and Barry is apparently whipped enough to let her have her way regardless of whether it will screw up Moriah's "only first concert".  I swear, does Barry have any other facial expression than the dead eyed nervous half smile?  Blech to both of them.

Oh and Lydia pissed me off too.  When Moriah was at the house trying to let her parents know not to come to the concert she said something like, "Help me out Lydia" and Lydia just sat there silently.  WTF.

Edited by scorp01 · Reason: *
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1 hour ago, Twopper said:

Moriah didn't want her mom there because it would upset Olivia and she needed Olivia to play keyboard. She didn't want Olivia distracted.

Moriah did not do a good job explaining this to Evil Kim. Then again, she's a young girl that shouldn't have that burden on her shoulders. I wonder if this will cause Moriah to step back from Kim again. I was surprised Micah was with Ethan while looking for Kim. He's been trying to keep the peace with his parents lately but it looked like he was just as pissed off as Ethan. I think eventually these kids will learn there is no peace keeping with Kim and Barry. There will always be something to cause drama and dissention with them. 

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1 hour ago, scorp01 said:

I can't decide if the drama is partially scripted or if Kim is just THAT DUMB.

Oh and Lydia pissed me off too.  When Moriah was at the house trying to let her parents know not to come to the concert she said something like, "Help me out Lydia" and Lydia just sat there silently.  WTF.

Big Kim isn't dumb, she's a complete narcissist. Her narcissism rules her control issues, and narcs HATE to be outdone, outshone, or contradicted. There is no way in hell that Big Kim was going to stay away from that gig. She could have easily had someone like Moriah record the gig and then watched it later, but Big Kim had to make it all about her feeling "hurt," and we all know she wasn't hurt - she was outdone by Olivia/the kids who left her.

My dad's parents pulled this shit with my mom that Big Kim pulled with Olivia. As my grandparents were not religious, they pulled the "you're mentally ill" instead of "you're filled with evil spirits." My parents have been married for nearly 55 years and my grandparents have been dead for years, but my mom still brings up the narc manipulations that my grandparents pulled on her.

Lydia was smirking in the car on the way to the gig showed me that she's learning to be just as manipulative as Big Kim. Hopefully she realizes that this is a pretty shitty look and can switch out of it quickly.

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I live in Tallahassee. Tally Fish House and oyster bar is really a family friendly restaurant. The stage is between this and Hurricane Grill and wings. It is a place to bring kids. I’ve gone and enjoyed the outdoor music. 
I can’t figure out why they didn’t meet the friend elsewhere and drive in. The car seemed to be owned by a well know three generational photographer here. The studio is very close to the restaurants. 

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1 hour ago, bichonblitz said:

Moriah did not do a good job explaining this to Evil Kim. Then again, she's a young girl that shouldn't have that burden on her shoulders. I wonder if this will cause Moriah to step back from Kim again. I was surprised Micah was with Ethan while looking for Kim. He's been trying to keep the peace with his parents lately but it looked like he was just as pissed off as Ethan. I think eventually these kids will learn there is no peace keeping with Kim and Barry. There will always be something to cause drama and dissention with them. 

Yeah, I have no idea why Moriah even told her psycho parents about this gig. They wouldn't have known had she not told them. Here's an idea, DON'T drive to their house and DON'T tell them you're having a gig. Invite them when it's okay to invite them. Period, end of story.

53 minutes ago, lightninggirl said:

Big Kim isn't dumb, she's a complete narcissist. Her narcissism rules her control issues, and narcs HATE to be outdone, outshone, or contradicted. There is no way in hell that Big Kim was going to stay away from that gig. She could have easily had someone like Moriah record the gig and then watched it later, but Big Kim had to make it all about her feeling "hurt," and we all know she wasn't hurt - she was outdone by Olivia/the kids who left her.

My dad's parents pulled this shit with my mom that Big Kim pulled with Olivia. As my grandparents were not religious, they pulled the "you're mentally ill" instead of "you're filled with evil spirits." My parents have been married for nearly 55 years and my grandparents have been dead for years, but my mom still brings up the narc manipulations that my grandparents pulled on her.

Lydia was smirking in the car on the way to the gig showed me that she's learning to be just as manipulative as Big Kim. Hopefully she realizes that this is a pretty shitty look and can switch out of it quickly.

Exactly! She could have sent Lydia to film it with her phone and they could have watched it at home and still have been able to hear and see her performance without disrespecting her wishes, though to be fair, Moriah did not shut Kim down when she smirkily said, "What if you can't see me there? tee hee..."

Lydia pissed me off too this episode, I'm done with her. She wants to suck up to Kim, go right ahead! She has enough siblings living away from the creepy parents that can clue her in on what real life is about but she chooses to write post its to God in her prayer closet. WTAF?! I hope Moriah has learned that Lydia is not her ally, just as I hope Micah realizes that there's no changing his psycho mother.

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As a mother you have to think about your children first not yourself.  Kim is a narcissus and has some real mental health issues.  I feel bad for all her kids.  

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1 hour ago, gingerella said:

Yeah, I have no idea why Moriah even told her psycho parents about this gig. They wouldn't have known had she not told them. Here's an idea, DON'T drive to their house and DON'T tell them you're having a gig. Invite them when it's okay to invite them. Period, end of story.

Exactly! She could have sent Lydia to film it with her phone and they could have watched it at home and still have been able to hear and see her performance without disrespecting her wishes, though to be fair, Moriah did not shut Kim down when she smirkily said, "What if you can't see me there? tee hee..."

Lydia pissed me off too this episode, I'm done with her. She wants to suck up to Kim, go right ahead! She has enough siblings living away from the creepy parents that can clue her in on what real life is about but she chooses to write post its to God in her prayer closet. WTAF?! I hope Moriah has learned that Lydia is not her ally, just as I hope Micah realizes that there's no changing his psycho mother.

Yes, this is why I think it’s enhanced by scripting. Too much just doesn’t make sense. I am getting the feeling that production doesn’t GAF if they make things worse by stirring the pot. It’s bad enough already. 

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Was this Micah’s first gig as well? Besides the fam band?

Olivia seems to get off on Ethan getting all protective. “I missed you, let’s get a room!” She is manipulating him. (I still like her though??)

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Yep, I agree with ya'll.  Kim's a narcissist.   You can just see the GLEE in her eyes when confronted with a boundary.  Narcs LOVE boundaries.  They love to push through them.  It's a power play.  

Kim intentionally parked her car for all to see.  Again...it's about power...it's about keeping her prey off kilter and uncomfortable.  

I can't fault the younger kids for what they say and do.  Kim uses them as pawns (in the narc world it's called "flying monkeys"...like in the Wizard of Oz...those who do you bidding).  In a narc family like that, you can see the kids almost throwing each other under the bus to avoid the rath of Kim on them.

Kim speaks of her adult children as though they are children.  It seems poor Olivia stumbled into the kingdom of Kim and stole one of her minions.

Gawd...that woman makes my skin crawl. 

 

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18 hours ago, JocelynCavanaugh said:

All of this perseverating and plotting over Moriah and her treacly nothing music and cringey makeup choices. I try to avoid regional stereotypes but is there seriously nothing better to do in south Georgia? 

This episode was so “Donna Martin Graduates!” that I felt slightly angry at myself for actually watching it. The trouble in teen town drama, the ominous music, the will-she-or-won’t she, all felt like some discarded episode of Swans Crossing. I felt like I was eavesdropping in a high school cafeteria. Max seemed to be the only logical person in saying, “hey, maybe let it go for now?” Which Ethan seemed to agree with at first, but then couldn’t wait to run and tell Moriah and Olivia that Kim was there. Did we even hear a performance? I think I heard Moriah whisper one breathy off-key note. 

Did I also miss where they explained what happened to Max’s leg? 

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So Olivia just tickled to death that once again Ethan disrespected his parents invites him to get a room for the the night!

Olivia just keeps stirring the pot. Ethan looks like a jackass running through the parking lot doing Olivias bidding. 
 

Max parents there but Moriah s are not invited because if Moriah invited her mom and dad then Olivia would not play keyboard and we know Moriah can’t afford to pay one!

Go away Olivia just go away and let this family be!

On another note. Moriah can’t sing. She’s a horrible vocalist!

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My two cents:

If someone told me that I was filled with evil spirits I would never associate with them again. I would leave a party, a store, a commitment if they attempted to insert themselves in my life.  I would not cause a scene and I would not acknowledge them.

If someone told me that my husband was filled with evil spirits I would never associate with them again.  I would have even stronger feelings than if they said I was filled with evil spirits.  

I don't blame Olivia for setting boundaries.  At the beginning of the band conversation she was upfront," I'll be in the band if Kim isn't at the show.  And I have no problem if you tell me that you want them there.  I am happy to step aside.  Your choice."   Moriah chose Olivia rather than Kim.

Regarding Ethan protecting Olivia, I have no problem with that.  I think the original accusation made it crystal clear to Ethan that his mother was a master manipulator who wants to stay at the center of her children's lives.  Kim wants to come before her kid's partners in terms of priority.  I don't believe it should work that way.  We all get to be the stars in our own life stories.  Our parents are just supporting roles.

So Ethan's anger is just as much for himself as it is protecting Olivia.

On a separate note, Lydia is a Kim minion (Kiminion?), and a weird one at that.  She has moved away from the long skirts and scenes in the prayer closet to more form fitting clothes and a good bit of make up. I hope she marries early and leaves the show.  I wish her health and happiness away from TV.

Edited by Ms.Lulu
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1 hour ago, MarCap said:

Olivia sets her OWN boundaries, she has no say in the daily living of the Plath family, that is all KIM, as Kim controls that! If her family is as toxic as Kim is, why should she ever mend bridges? We only have & should have control over our  own actions, beliefs & behaviours. We cannot change toxic & controlling people, so we set boundaries & have to, that is healthy.  Those boundaries need to be respected.  

Thank you, I wasn't going to bother but you said it way better than I could have! Ethan is lucky to have someone like Olivia, who comes from a similar damaging background, but who is trying hard to heal herself and create a normal, non-fundy life for herself and her husband. Ethan sees that I think, he's just very averse to change. 

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The Plath family seemed to be just cruising along until Olivia entered the picture. 

They may have different beliefs than we do but their family and their business. 

There are many different families. Amish, Quaker, Fundamentalists, Seventh Day Adventist, Baptist and Catholic.  

We may not agree with their way of living but it’s their choice to live as they believe. 

Yes if one leaves the circle they may struggle with differences but that happens. Religious and ethnic!

With that said Olivia left her own family after directing change in them, married a Fundy guy and inflicted all kinds of drama on his family trying to change them  

I predict the marriage will not last and eventually Ethan will make amends with his family members. 

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2 hours ago, Jeanne222 said:

The Plath family seemed to be just cruising along until Olivia entered the picture. 

They may have different beliefs than we do but their family and their business. 

There are many different families. Amish, Quaker, Fundamentalists, Seventh Day Adventist, Baptist and Catholic.  

We may not agree with their way of living but it’s their choice to live as they believe. 

Yes if one leaves the circle they may struggle with differences but that happens. Religious and ethnic!

With that said Olivia left her own family after directing change in them, married a Fundy guy and inflicted all kinds of drama on his family trying to change them  

I predict the marriage will not last and eventually Ethan will make amends with his family members. 

Sorry to totally disagree, as you have the right to feel as you do. Cruising along? With their parents self inflicted beliefs?  Did Moriah seem happy to you before she bolted? Did Micah?  Ethan wanted a different life & he loves Olivia.  It is hard to go from a controlled childhood to being independent & especially at their ages!  How does one blame Olivia, does she have some kind of powerful wand....oh you must think so! She is so young, Kim is older & should know better!  Olivia is also a victim of a toxic, controlling family. Ethan, Olivia, Micah & Moriah are adults & have the RIGHT to say "No More!' This family was not ever cruising along, those children were & are controlled until they submit or crash & burn in Kim's eyes & holy, does she ever help to make that happen.  So unhealthy & pretty disgusting.  If a family CHOOSES, together to live a certain way, then fine, but it NOT okay to demand this!!!! I predict that this young couple will try so hard to make their relationship work.   

*Added* ~ who cares if she can sing, she is doing what she loves & free to do so!  Good luck to her, she can write her own future now, away from her prison (Kim & Barry). Go Moriah! :-) 

Edited by MarCap
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8 hours ago, Ms.Lulu said:

 Kim wants to come before her kid's partners in terms of priority.

I don't know, Kim confuses me because she seems fine with Moriah's relationship and likes her boyfriend. 

There's something about Olivia I don't like. Can't pinpoint it yet but she rubs me the wrong way. I hope Ethan finds a great girl that really loves him. This marriage is too much of a struggle. 

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Just watched this episode this morning. At this point, Kim's level of twat-waffleness isn't even shocking.

 

Although, I am a bit shocked about the Plath's supposed commitment to fundamentalism. In fundamental homes, the husband/father is the head of the family, and what he says is the last word. It's pretty obvious that Kim packs Barry's balls around in her purse and makes all the decisions. 

Edit: 
Forgot to point out how on brand it was for Olivia to talk about what is best for "her parents" when talking to Moriah. She's bought into Kim's bullshit so much that she can't even feign support for someone who doesn't let Kim go balls deep in everything they do.

Edited by JayDub1987
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18 hours ago, bichonblitz said:

Moriah did not do a good job explaining this to Evil Kim. Then again, she's a young girl that shouldn't have that burden on her shoulders. I wonder if this will cause Moriah to step back from Kim again. I was surprised Micah was with Ethan while looking for Kim. He's been trying to keep the peace with his parents lately but it looked like he was just as pissed off as Ethan. I think eventually these kids will learn there is no peace keeping with Kim and Barry. There will always be something to cause drama and dissention with them. 

Moriah was raised by evil Kim and I get the impression that she is very afraid to push any buttons, knowing what will happen if her mother gets angry.  I noticed that, knowing full well that it was her and Barry who were unwelcome, Kim kept asking if Moriah wanted her 'family' there and Moriah, when asked, always answered that she did want 'family' there.  Obviously, Kim knew what the sticking point was and she knew that Moriah was too intimidated to ever specify that it was Kim and Barry who couldn't come.  I also noticed that Moriah never said that she WANTED Kim there, not in the moment and not in her talking heads.  I wouldn't be surprised if she wasn't just a little relieved that she could put it on Olivia; Kim makes everything all about her and I could see Moriah not wanting her around to suck all the air out of her moment. The fact that Kim immediately shot down the notion of Lydia going along with some of the younger kids as not being fair to HER, when Moriah had specifically mentioned wanting them to come, made it pretty clear that the whole thing was all about Kim and her need to control all of her kids.

As for Kim telling Lydia, who is at least 17, that she wasn't allowed to attend the concert without her; well that just shows how tight the reins are in that family.  There was no reason other than spite for that order.

3 minutes ago, JayDub1987 said:

Just watched this episode this morning. At this point, Kim's level of twat-waffleness isn't even shocking.

 

Although, I am a bit shocked about the Plath's supposed commitment to fundamentalism. In fundamental homes, the husband/father is the head of the family, and what he says is the last word. It's pretty obvious that Kim packs Barry's balls around in her purse and makes all the decisions. 

There are a lot of fundy families where this is the case.  They pay lip service to the male headship, but, when you watch them in action, it is mama who rules the roost.

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1 minute ago, Rootbeer said:

There are a lot of fundy families where this is the case.  They pay lip service to the male headship, but, when you watch them in action, it is mama who rules the roost.

That truly intrigues me, as it's simply not the case in my hometown. Most of the Plath-like families that I know have a completely subservient nature to the male. In fact, it goes so far as when/if the father/husband has died, the oldest son becomes the head of the family. 

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6 minutes ago, JayDub1987 said:

That truly intrigues me, as it's simply not the case in my hometown. Most of the Plath-like families that I know have a completely subservient nature to the male. In fact, it goes so far as when/if the father/husband has died, the oldest son becomes the head of the family. 

I'll bet that is the case to the outside world, and the women are fine with stuff like not wearing pants or not speaking at church or not having jobs outside the home.  However, there are all sorts of fundies, both men and women.  While Kim might be fine with letting the men run the church services and preach, and fine with forcing her daughters to wear dresses while she doesn't, it is obvious that, when it comes to the family, she has all the voice.  Barry is passive and sits there while she decides what their opinion is on any topic.  The Duggars are another example although not as extreme.  If you ever watched the show, they are all about the male headship; but, then, when you see the families in action, Michelle Duggar has a lot of control.  Jessa Duggar carries her husband's nuts in her purse; he has no say in anything.  Yet, they profess that they believe in Biblical headship and the man being the leader of the family.

People can present one face to the world and then be completely different behind closed doors.

Edited by Rootbeer
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On 10/12/2021 at 11:12 PM, Madding crowd said:

I felt bad for Moriah, she was nervous enough without having to referee between her parents and Olivia. I think Kim is a horrible person and only wanted to be there to show she is in charge. However, I don’t think it would harm Olivia to just have Kim and Barry in the back watching their daughter. No one was putting Moriah first here. I have serious concerns about Max with the way he flirts with Micah all the time. I guess Moriah is too sheltered to pick up on that but it’s pretty obvious.

I have been in Olivia’s shoes before. Just knowing someone is there, and worse yet, see them would put me into a full blown panic attack. No amount of logic or trying to put someone else first, is going to overcome that level of anxiety. 

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Kim: "I've never told you that you can't be friends with Olivia and hang out with her."

Bullshit. This woman is such a conniving cuntmuffin that she can't even keep track of her own dictatorship. 

(Sorry, I should've condensed all my thoughts to one post, but I'm kinda rehashing the episode in my head lol) 

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2 minutes ago, JayDub1987 said:

Kim: "I've never told you that you can't be friends with Olivia and hang out with her."

Bullshit. This woman is such a conniving cuntmuffin that she can't even keep track of her own dictatorship. 

(Sorry, I should've condensed all my thoughts to one post, but I'm kinda rehashing the episode in my head lol) 

Yes, Kim has a very selective memory.  She doesn't tell her adult daughter, living out on her own who she can associate with; she just interrogates her, bullies her and makes her miserable if she associates with someone Kim doesn't like.  I just hope Moriah sees this situation for what it really is and that her mother doesn't get to call the shots anymore.  

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