Show Spoilers and Book Talk

[Laurie]

On ‎2‎/‎25‎/‎2017 at 3:00 PM, DittyDotDot said:

So, what was John doing while Hal was overseeing the execution of the prisoners?

My recollection (without having the books in front of me) is that John wasn't officially part of the regiment during that time...just a younger brother tagging along...so he wasn't in the battle.  But I seem to recall that after the battle his brother sent him out with others to kill injured Highlanders.  I remember John recalling that he came to one guy and that guy had to help John pull the trigger.

[DittyDotDot]

1 hour ago, Laurie said:

My recollection (without having the books in front of me) is that John wasn't officially part of the regiment during that time...just a younger brother tagging along...so he wasn't in the battle.  But I seem to recall that after the battle his brother sent him out with others to kill injured Highlanders.  I remember John recalling that he came to one guy and that guy had to help John pull the trigger.

Thanks Laurie!

It's weird I still don't remember it. I usually will start to recall the scenes once someone starts giving me a few details. I do remember John wasn't officially part of the regiment, though, I think that was in one of the Lord John stories. And I do remember him talking about how he took to soldiering quite easily and naturally. I also recall him thinking about Hector a few times and their time together during the uprising. And, I remember that Hal made him look at Hector's body so that John could know he was gone. But, I always thought it was Prestonpans, for some reason. Weird.

[DittyDotDot]

11 minutes ago, Grashka said:

Perhaps you mixed Hector up with Dunsanys' son, Geneva and Isobel's brother? He was killed at Prestonpans.

Oh, that's very likely because I thought Hector was Geneva's brother... . That solves that mystery.

[lianau]

1 hour ago, Grashka said:

 Hmmm... Is it possible that "save Murtagh" campaign succeeded? 

If they have done that then I'm pretty sure the show is dead for me . It would completely alter Jamie's story line .

[DittyDotDot]

2 hours ago, Grashka said:

Something else occured to me regarding the new cast - I don't recall any announcement of Duncan Innes' casting. Which is rather odd since he first appears in Ardsmuir and then plays a significant role up to book 6. They have announced the casting of characters like Geneva and Isobel or even the young captain Leonard, who are only going to be featured in a handful of episodes (even though Geneva obviously impacts Jamie's life in a permanent way) so I would think Duncan should have been revealed a long time ago. Unless he won't be in the series at all because his role is replaced by someone else? Hmmm... Is it possible that "save Murtagh" campaign succeeded? 

Maybe they made merged a couple characters together and made a new character to fill Duncan's role? Somewhat like what they did with Angus and Rupert? I'm not sold on the idea of saving Murtagh, but I'm not totally against it either. It all depends on what they do with it, I guess.

[WatchrTina]

I speculated long ago that Murtagh could survive and fill the Duncan role.  I also speculated that he and Jamie could be reunited at Helwater Ardsmuir prison (each having believed the other was dead), only to be torn asunder again when everyone but Jamie was transported to America (which would give Jamie yet another reason to resent Lord John.)  If THAT had happened it would already have been filmed and I suspect the news would have leaked.  But I, for one, will be delighted if Jamie and Murtagh stumble across one another in America in Season 4 (or the last episode of Season 3.)

ETA: thanks for the correction toolazy

Edited March 13, 2017 by WatchrTina

[Clawdette]

I aw somewhere just today that a Scottish actor was cast for an unannounced role. I wondered if it might be Duncan but I can't remember where I saw this. Twitter maybe?  I'm looking. 

ETA:  found it. He's James McAnerney.  I can't copy the link from Twitter but it's from Dailyrecord.co.uk

Got it:  James McAnerney

Edited March 12, 2017 by Clawdette

[WatchrTina]

If he played Duncan he'd have to have been cast sooner because the Helwater Ardsmuir prison scenes have already been filmed.  They cast a Scottish actor but I'm sure he can do a British Accent (Sam did one in "A Princess for Christmas") so I suspect he might play the very young captain of the British ship that presses Claire into service.  

Edited March 13, 2017 by WatchrTina

[toolazy]

8 minutes ago, WatchrTina said:

If he played Duncan he'd have to have been cast sooner because the Helwater prison scenes have already been filmed.  They cast a Scottish actor but I'm sure he can do a British Accent (Sam did one in "A Princess for Christmas") so I suspect he might play the very young captain of the British ship that presses Claire into service.  

Helwater wasn't a prison - it was the estate where Jamie served as a groom.  

[Andorra]

James McArney's character name has been listed somewhere. I can't find it right now, but it wasn't Duncan Innes. I think he'll be one of the smugglers probably.

As long as we don't get an announcement for Duncan Innes, I'm hopeful they will save Murtagh and I would be delighted. Duncan Lacroix has made the character so much better than the book character and he's my favorite after Jamie and Claire. I would be very sad if we lost him.

A clue might be: Duncan's beard comes and goes lately. He had it until after the Ardsmuir scenes were filmed, but then shaved. Right now it is growing back and could be in the right length at the end of the current block in SA. So maybe there's hope? I won't give up on it until the opposite is proven!

[Dust Bunny]

I love Duncan Lacroix's Murtagh, but I really want Murtagh to die and stay dead (as harsh as that sounds). I really want the Culloden stakes to say harsh. I'm kind of tired of so many shows having cheap stakes, where things don't matter and have ultimate repercussions.

War is hell. People die. Clans are destroyed. This is reality.

Yes, this is a TV show and book series. But Culloden really happened. And I look what's happening in our world - USA unrest, Brexit, Syria, Russia, North Korea, Philippines... We need to learn from our past. Actions have repercussions. War is hell. People die. "Clans" are destroyed. This is reality.

Kill Murtagh.

Edited March 17, 2017 by Dust Bunny

[Dust Bunny]

I can't stop watching the fake rifle hit on the right side of the shot. I don't know who those two extras are, but now, whenever I see that scene, I'll think of them.

Having those shots on top of each other makes me think of younger Jamie as his baby Bree is born. Sigh. I hope we get to see that shot of Jamie holding baby Willie. He didn't get to hold baby Faith either. :(

Edited April 3, 2017 by Dust Bunny

[toolazy]

The first time I watched that promo I thought that was Geillis in that room with Jamie but no. I think it's Geneva.  Five months. Cripes. 

[Nidratime]

Diana Gabaldon and her husband (I think) are visiting the set in South Africa and Diana wrote the following Facebook post about it:

[WatchrTina]

@Outlander_STARZ on Twitter posted a link to Instagram where some behind-the-scenes photos from South Africa have been posted.  There aren't really any spoilers but this seemed like the safest place to post the link.

https://www.instagram.com/outlander_starz/

[Dust Bunny]

I'm really intrigued by Claire's sailing costume. It does seem practical, with ocean winds whipping around. Makes me reevaluate what she might wear, come the Ridge in season 4. 

[DittyDotDot]

1 hour ago, WatchrTina said:

@Outlander_STARZ on Twitter posted a link to Instagram where some behind-the-scenes photos from South Africa have been posted.  There aren't really any spoilers but this seemed like the safest place to post the link.

https://www.instagram.com/outlander_starz/

This one cracked me the hell up:

[WatchrTina]

3 hours ago, Dust Bunny said:

I'm really intrigued by Claire's sailing costume. It does seem practical, with ocean winds whipping around.

Do you mean the grey cape?  Don't you think it looks a bit . . . modern?  :)  There have been other behind-the-scenes photos posted of her wearing that so my theory is that is what she was wearing when she came back through the stones.  I think it's a 1960s coat.  And I do not envy Caitriona having to wear it in the hot South African sun while pretending to be on a ship that's just left cold & rainy Scotland.

Edited April 4, 2017 by WatchrTina

[DittyDotDot]

So, I'm guessing those are stills from when wee Ian gets captured? Jamie's arm is in a sling, presumably from the gunshot wound and they're on the coast...so, the heavy garments make sense in that context, but I feel for Sam and Cait having to wear all that crap in South African heat.

[Dust Bunny]

Quote

Do you mean the grey cape?  Don't you think it looks a bit . . . modern?  :)  There have been other behind-the-scenes photos posted of her wearing that so my theory is that is what she was wearing when she came back through the stones.  I think it's a 1960s coat.  And I do not envy Caitriona having to wear it in the hot South African sun while pretending to be on a ship that's just left cold & rainy Scotland.

No, from the photo from the recent Instagram where she's holding the coffee (unless that's the same costume?). It's almost the look I was expecting from Bree in season 4, sans men's coat.

Edited April 5, 2017 by Dust Bunny

[Petunia846]

Hmm. I'm sure they can pull off NC in Scotland, but those pictures don't really look like NC to me. The stone color is wrong and it's not forested enough. Obviously those aren't official pictures though. I'm sure they'll figure things out.

The higher elevations in the mountains here are probably a pretty similar temperature range, but I suspect we get more sunshine than Scotland does.

Here are some pictures from a park nearby. It's not quite the Smoky Mountains, but we're close. The park always makes me think of the Ridge. Of course everyone is going to have their own image of what the Ridge looks like, so they're never going to win. Lallybroch is not really what I imagined, but you get used to it.

[Dust Bunny]

I was amazed at how diverse Scotland's landscape was. There was a forest by Blair Castle that seemed to show up out of nowhere. It looks a bit like your second picture, Petunia846.

On the one hand, I'm glad they're sticking with Scotland, to boost the economy and support local jobs.

On the other hand, and the article addresses it, I wonder what this will do to the land. Stirling is gorgeous. I'm sure the contracts, as the article suggest, will cover the nitty-gritty of land preservation. (And I can guess how filming can be much more preferable for land conservation than quarrying.) Still, one of my favorite parts of Scotland is how wild and untouched so much of it is. With the recent collaboration of TravelAdvisor and VisitScotland, I'm already worried too much tourism will lead to what's happened to American national parks. The cool places are now packed with people. 

The producers love Scotland, so I'm sure the show will honor and protect the land. I guess I'm just hoping that fans will honor it too. #keepScotlandwild

Edited April 9, 2017 by Dust Bunny

[DittyDotDot]

10 hours ago, Grashka said:

I wonder how they are going to handle the differences of climat and wildlife between Scotland and North Carolina.

Buffalo!! ;)

I know, I know, they'll do it in post production, but that was the first thing that popped into my head when I read "wildlife." 

[Starla]

I have the good fortune to live next to Frasers Ridge, which according to Diana is around Grandfather Mountain between Blowing Rock and Linville, NC. I agree the pics posted above do not look much like it. However, I have visited some places in Scotland that were strikingly similar to this area, including the rocky rivers, trees, and other vegetation, so I think they can get something close. The hard part will be the huge granite boulders and cliff faces, and the rhododendron thickets, which I believe Roger gets stuck in somewhere around book four. 

I was hiking at Grandfather Mountain yesterday and took the first photo below on my way home. It is the eastern side of the mountain, taken from the Blue Ridge Parkway. I believe this is the area Diana has designated as Frasers Ridge. I took the other two on previous hikes... some granite boulders near the top of the mountain, and a trail cut through a rhododendron thicket. (Sorry the images being a bit grainy and washed out. I believe the forum is compressing them on upload).

[Clawdette]

I live in the North Carolina foothills.  To me, the first episode of season one has a scene that most resembles Tar Heel terrain. When Claire is fleeing from the skirmish and then encounters Black Jack, this has the look of NC mountains. 

Another scene is in the Garrison Commander episode when Dougal takes Claire to the sulphur stream that serves as a lie detector. 

It's hard to compare Scotland's 1700s mountains to North Carolina's 1700 landscape, but in current times we are much greener. 

[WatchrTina]

On 4/9/2017 at 2:49 PM, Petunia846 said:

Lallybroch is not really what I imagined, but you get used to it.

That's a really good point.  I had forgotten how much TV Lallybroch does not match my mental picture of the place but after an initial jolt ("Wait, it's 3 stories tall and looks rather like a small castle?") I forgot about that disconnect and fell in love with the place.  I also fell in love with Graham MacTavish as as the definitely-not-bald-in-the-book Dougal.  So a few geographically inappropriate trees on the ridge won't phase me.

But they'll have to import some wild turkeys for Brianna to hunt.

Edited April 11, 2017 by WatchrTina

[Clawdette]

I posted about Sunday night's trailer teaser in the Media thread but since this link has pictures, I'll put it here.

April 16th Trailer announcement and two photos

Edited April 13, 2017 by Clawdette

[toolazy]

Maybe he's on the way to Balriggan to get married. 

[katville]

He looks believably older in that picture. It blows my mind how they did that.

[Petunia846]

You guys.

Is it bad that I was most excited by that shot at the end that's just a paper that says A. Malcolm Printer and Bookseller? Eeee.

Edited April 17, 2017 by Petunia846

[katville]

So excited! How are we going to wait all summer?

[pootlus]

September seems like a long way away - and that's even before S3 makes its way onto a format that I can get hold of in Australia. Why can't we get simultaneous worldwide releases? Wouldn't Starz rather have the 20-odd dollars I'm going to give to Google?

[Dust Bunny]

I just got a friend addicted to the show. She binged it 2 weeks ago, and she's already craving season 3. She's going to start the books soon. It's the first time I've brought in a new Outlander viewer-soon-to-be-reader. Fun feeling. 

September seems a long way away, but time goes way too fast. I figure Droughtlander is an opportunity to try a new hobby or two. "Use the time," as the insomnia episode from "Family Ties" said. 

Or listen to Voyager 4 times in row.

Edited April 18, 2017 by Dust Bunny

[ruby24]

Are they still filming Season 3 right now? And are all the episodes written, because I'm sort of worried about the impact of the potential writers strike.

Edited April 18, 2017 by ruby24

[Clawdette]

Sam said somewhere (Twitter?) a few days ago that they had three more Season 3 episodes to shoot.  Then the actors would have a short break before starting Season 4.

[Dust Bunny]

I'm listening to Davina Porter's reading of Voyager (again). I really hope they cut the angry-sex-after-Laoghaire-shows-up-that-is-quite-close-to-rape scene. I hate that scene. Hearing it, I just think "What is wrong with you, Diana?" I hope they just verbally fight, Jenny interrupts, Jamie walks away, etc.

The other scene that always bugs me is when Jamie throws his pregnant daughter around to show her she couldn't stop her rapist. He's a farmer and is watching a cow having trouble calving. That soon-to-be-grandbaby is already his blood. What the hell. It's like something out of "Gone with the Wind."

Sometime adaptations can be good.

[lianau]

1 hour ago, Dust Bunny said:

 

The other scene that always bugs me is when Jamie throws his pregnant daughter around to show her she couldn't stop her rapist. He's a farmer and is watching a cow having trouble calving. That soon-to-be-grandbaby is already his blood. What the hell. It's like something out of "Gone with the Wind."

 

Really ?  I love that scene , for me that's sort of the moment when Jamie and Brianna start being father and daughter . Up until that moment they were always using Claire as their mediator and translator and tried to  present a "nice and perfect" image to each other  . Here they ripped it all apart and connected on an emotional level for the first time .

[Dust Bunny]

7 hours ago, lianau said:

Really ?  I love that scene , for me that's sort of the moment when Jamie and Brianna start being father and daughter . Up until that moment they were always using Claire as their mediator and translator and tried to  present a "nice and perfect" image to each other  . Here they ripped it all apart and connected on an emotional level for the first time .

I like the scene; I agree that it's a nice bonding between Jamie and Bree. I dislike the physical moment. Jamie could have hurt her or the child. I get the point of it: to show Brianna she couldn't over-power Bonnet. But I've always pictured it being just short of violent. 

[DittyDotDot]

1 hour ago, Dust Bunny said:

I like the scene; I agree that it's a nice bonding between Jamie and Bree. I dislike the physical moment. Jamie could have hurt her or the child. I get the point of it: to show Brianna she couldn't over-power Bonnet. But I've always pictured it being just short of violent. 

I think it has to be just short of violent for Brianna to understand what Jamie was trying to show her. I never thought the child was in any actual danger, though, but that might be harder to convey on-screen. I thought it was clear Jamie was doing the minimum violence necessary to make his point that it didn't matter what Brianna did; it wasn't her fault and there was no amount of violence she could've done that would've stopped Bonnet.

I would never call the the angry sex at Lallybroch rape because, to me, it is written as a fight between two people using sex instead of words; I thought Diana was clear in the writing it was both of them escalating and pushing each other's buttons. And, I thought it was important because it's the first time Claire and Jamie are truly honest with each other after they're reunited. But, it will be a fine line for them to walk in trying to show it a mutual fight since the visual with probably give the impression it's rape regardless.

I think it will be easier for them to show the scene of Brianna and Jamie because of the dialogue that comes after should make it clear to viewers that Jamie wasn't trying to hurt Brianna, or the baby, but trying to help her understand that being raped was not her fault. But, again, the visual of it all might be too powerful for some people to hang in there until the talk at the end?

Judging by how they've handled some of the other controversial scenes from the books, I can understand your wariness Dust Bunny. Back at the beginning I would've said I hoped they didn't shy away from any of the "uglier" scenes--I think they're important parts of the story, myself, and without them the story isn't quite the same--however, TV is a different medium and some things just don't translate to screen as well as they do in writing. So, maybe they should walk a wider berth around some of these scenes?

[Dust Bunny]

1 hour ago, DittyDotDot said:

I think it has to be just short of violent for Brianna to understand what Jamie was trying to show her. I never thought the child was in any actual danger, though, but that might be harder to convey on-screen. I thought it was clear Jamie was doing the minimum violence necessary to make his point that it didn't matter what Brianna did; it wasn't her fault and there was no amount of violence she could've done that would've stopped Bonnet.

I would never call the the angry sex at Lallybroch rape because, to me, it is written as a fight between two people using sex instead of words; I thought Diana was clear in the writing it was both of them escalating and pushing each other's buttons. And, I thought it was important because it's the first time Claire and Jamie are truly honest with each other after they're reunited. But, it will be a fine line for them to walk in trying to show it a mutual fight since the visual with probably give the impression it's rape regardless.

I think it will be easier for them to show the scene of Brianna and Jamie because of the dialogue that comes after should make it clear to viewers that Jamie wasn't trying to hurt Brianna, or the baby, but trying to help her understand that being raped was not her fault. But, again, the visual of it all might be too powerful for some people to hang in there until the talk at the end?

Judging by how they've handled some of the other controversial scenes from the books, I can understand your wariness Dust Bunny. Back at the beginning I would've said I hoped they didn't shy away from any of the "uglier" scenes--I think they're important parts of the story, myself, and without them the story isn't quite the same--however, TV is a different medium and some things just don't translate to screen as well as they do in writing. So, maybe they should walk a wider berth around some of these scenes?

Well said. I like the idea of wider berth.

In general, I'd like the ratio of bliss/joy to angst/pain higher than it's been. We had, what, 10 minutes of Lallybroch in season 2 (which included several shots from season 1). Don't get me wrong, the tragedy of Culloden needs to be shown (I've posted about that before), and the 20 year separation is vital and valuable to the story. And I absolutely love experiencing Jamie's journey. But then I want them to dwell in the joy of reunion. I want a shot of them catching up on the ship, little moments like that. We've lost little moments in the first two seasons to focus on things like "The Garrison Commander". And it doesn't have to be Jamie and Claire. I loved the scene of Fergus and Murtagh discussing women. More of that.

[DittyDotDot]

31 minutes ago, Dust Bunny said:

Well said. I like the idea of wider berth.

In general, I'd like the ratio of bliss/joy to angst/pain higher than it's been. We had, what, 10 minutes of Lallybroch in season 2 (which included several shots from season 1). Don't get me wrong, the tragedy of Culloden needs to be shown (I've posted about that before), and the 20 year separation is vital and valuable to the story. And I absolutely love experiencing Jamie's journey. But then I want them to dwell in the joy of reunion. I want a shot of them catching up on the ship, little moments like that. We've lost little moments in the first two seasons to focus on things like "The Garrison Commander". And it doesn't have to be Jamie and Claire. I loved the scene of Fergus and Murtagh discussing women. More of that.

That's a good point. The books detail a lot of love and warmth mixed in with the horror and heartbreak, I'm not sure the show has conveyed the love and warmth?  I mean, if I didn't read the books would I understand why Claire would want to go back to the 1700s?

Perhaps the show had gotten too wrapped up in embracing the uglier and grittier parts they forgot there needs to be balance to the story?

[Nire]

I also wasn't a fan of the angry sex scene and think not being in Claire's head will make it seem a lot like rape.

[toolazy]

On 4/17/2017 at 8:39 PM, ruby24 said:

Are they still filming Season 3 right now? And are all the episodes written, because I'm sort of worried about the impact of the potential writers strike.

On Twitter, Maril Davis said that there all of the scripts are pretty much written so they don't expect the writers strike to affect season 3.

[theschnauzers]

I'm posting this image here because David Berry's facial hair seems in and of itself to be a spoiler, as based on Voyager, these last few episodes would clearly include Lord John Grey

David Berry's self portrait this weekend at an event with facial hair

[Nidratime]

Short little interview with Diana regarding Season 3 filming:

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/tvandshowbiz/1006280/outlander-sam-heughan-diana-gabaldon-seasick/

[Petunia846]

So Jaime is going to be seasick. Weren't we wondering about that for some reason?

[toolazy]

7 hours ago, Petunia846 said:

So Jaime is going to be seasick. Weren't we wondering about that for some reason?

Is it Jamie who is going to be seasick or is it Sam who is seasick? 

[Petunia846]

Well she was talking about him having to keep the fake puke in his mouth until it was time to spit it out, so definitely Jamie, but it sounded like also Sam. (Which is slightly amusing. Poor guy.)

[toolazy]

17 hours ago, Petunia846 said:

Well she was talking about him having to keep the fake puke in his mouth until it was time to spit it out, so definitely Jamie, but it sounded like also Sam. (Which is slightly amusing. Poor guy.)

Oh, good point.  I figured that they weren't going to deal with Jamie's seasickness since he was fine on the boat to France.  

[DittyDotDot]

1 hour ago, WatchrTina said:

Hmmmm.  I've just spotted that others have figured out how to imbed a twitter image in this board.  Let's see if I can figure out how to do it too.

If you click on the down arrow at the top of the tweet, select the option "copy link to tweet" and then copy the link that pops up, paste it here and TADAH!! ;)

 

 

ETA: Looks like Cait has a rope tied around her. Looks like they may have shot the scene of Claire getting swept into the water and Jamie goes in after her last?

Edited June 16, 2017 by DittyDotDot