S11.E09: A Pretty Meltdown

[Shannah Banana]

25 minutes ago, Keywestclubkid said:

You mean during a conversation that she butted in on and basically told Crystal her view didn’t matter? That conversation? 

I mean the conversation where Sutton wrongly interrupted by saying they were past stereotyping.  Absolutely, she should have let Crystal finish what she wanted to say, but her point was that hopefully they had evolved past stereotyping anyone.  Crystal turned it into a throw down and it's been a throw down every since. 

[biakbiak]

2 minutes ago, Shannah Banana said:

I mean the conversation where Sutton wrongly interrupted by saying they were past stereotyping.  Absolutely, she should have let Crystal finish what she wanted to say, but her point was that hopefully they had evolved past stereotyping anyone. 

But that isn’t what she stated. She silenced her but then went on to moan that she was a victim of stereotyping equating the two experiences when they are not similar.

[Keywestclubkid]

14 minutes ago, Shannah Banana said:

I mean the conversation where Sutton wrongly interrupted by saying they were past stereotyping.  Absolutely, she should have let Crystal finish what she wanted to say, but her point was that hopefully they had evolved past stereotyping anyone.  Crystal turned it into a throw down and it's been a throw down every since. 

 It was a conversation about stereotypes and what POC go through....Sutton butted into it and  was basically implying that crystals experiences weren't valid because she doesn't see color.. it wasnt I hope the whole world is like me it was WELL I DONT SEE COLOR therefor there is no racism  ... And they weren't gonna talk about race ..then tried to turn it into her being the victim somehow in this ........ she tried to take over the whole conversation ... a conversation that she butted in on 

 

I feel like we are getting to far off topic of this episode really and we are gonna get in trouble so I am gonna end it here 

 

Edited July 15, 2021 by Keywestclubkid

[Cosmocrush]

1 hour ago, Hangin Out said:

Lovely.  I don’t know how Harry stays with her.

Ironically Rinna mentioned that same thing this season.   And then added that she gives amazing blow jobs.   😳

 

[RealHousewife]

1 minute ago, Cosmocrush said:

Ironically Rinna mentioned that same thing this season.   And then added that she gives amazing blow jobs.   😳

 

I mean, what else could it be? 

[Feech]

10 minutes ago, RealHousewife said:

I mean, what else could it be? 

She was a witness at one of his rapes and this is the only way to keep her quiet.

“Ask about the husband.”

[Talented Tenth]

I'm just trying to figure out how Crystal is being deemed a "mean girl" for correctly saying her privacy is violated and choosing not to engage in Sutton's craziness.  Even the other cast members have said Sutton was acting irrational or erratic.  Crystal is not doing anything to Sutton, so how is she "mean"?  Are people seeing themselves in Sutton or something?  Crystal is calm, cool and collected.  Sutton is always frazzled which is not anybody else's problem.

Edited July 15, 2021 by Talented Tenth

[ichbin]

Rinna could be replaced with one of those old-time cymbal banging monkey toys and nobody would notice.

In the streaming mascara scene Erika came across as though she was starring as herself in an SNL skit of the moment, y'know like when every time the camera cuts back to her the make-up mess is more exaggerated.  

 

[emmawoodhouse]

5 minutes ago, ichbin said:

Rinna could be replaced with one of those old-time cymbal banging monkey toys and nobody would notice.

In the streaming mascara scene Erika came across as though she was starring as herself in an SNL skit of the moment, y'know like when every time the camera cuts back to her the make-up mess is more exaggerated.  

 

Camille came in hot on Twitter, saying that Erika's mascara didn't run when they went snorkeling. There was more, but I only retained this particular jab. There's obviously no love lost there. 

[Hangin Out]

26 minutes ago, Feech said:

She was a witness at one of his rapes and this is the only way to keep her quiet.

“Ask about the husband.”

I’m asking.  What husband?  Besides, I heard he has a girlfriend in Canada.

Edited July 15, 2021 by Hangin Out

[truthaboutluv]

1 hour ago, Keywestclubkid said:

It was a conversation about stereotypes and what POC go through....Sutton butted into it and  was basically implying that crystals experiences weren't valid because she doesn't see color.. it wasnt I hope the whole world is like me it was WELL I DONT SEE COLOR therefor there is no racism  ... And they weren't gonna talk about race ..then tried to turn it into her being the victim somehow in this ........ she tried to take over the whole conversation ... a conversation that she butted in on 

Agree completely. Seriously, Crystal was literally responding to Kyle recounting her lunch with Garcelle where Garcelle explained to Kyle the racial connotations of her saying a black woman did not pay for something. In other words, the whole discussion at that moment was about racial context.

So there's Crystal, trying to share her experience, to have this open dialogue with Kyle and the white woman who believes only her feelings are valid, rudely interjects, complete with fragile tears at the ready. And when Crystal tries to explain what point she's trying to make, said white woman doubles down some more because dammit, she is not here to hear about race because that's not who she is dammit. And then later makes it about her "pain of being from the South and the judgements she gets".

An excuse by the way that Crystal gives her grace for and proceeds to in her mind squash any issues between them. Until soon after when said fragile white woman decided to go off on her again for a gag she wasn't a part of. Oh yeah, Sutton has been such the victim of evil, evil, mean bully Crystal. 

 

Quote

But thats what I'm saying...she could just shrug and let it go every.single.time Sutton brings it up.  I'm not denying Crystal has a right to speak up for herself every.single.time Sutton brings it up though.

When the women all come back to the lounge chairs after placating Sutton's ego and everything is seemingly calm, Crystal very calmly and softly simply asks Sutton, "was there something specific I said that set you off" and Sutton harshly and coldly responds, "no it's just your presence". Like what the hell is Crystal supposed to do with that - "gee I'm sorry my existence offends you, I'll leave now," Nah, screw that. 

Erika actually quite clearly responds after Sutton says this, "okay, was that necessary" and the women all had a visible reaction. And Sutton quickly brought the waterworks back up again to defend herself claiming how the women can't expect her to be okay around someone who she doesn't care for.

Except she seemed more than okay before gifts came and she loudly and clearly went, "wait ya'll brought gifts", making it clear she didn't. For all her histrionic, playing the victim tears, "so emotional and fragile" Sutton has said some really harsh shit to Crystal and keeps going. But that's okay because Sutton's the real victim and Crystal a mean bully. 

 

37 minutes ago, emmawoodhouse said:

Camille came in hot on Twitter, saying that Erika's mascara didn't run when they went snorkeling. There was more, but I only retained this particular jab. There's obviously no love lost there. 

Well maybe because she could no longer afford the good quality stuff. 

Edited July 16, 2021 by truthaboutluv

[Starlight925]

Don't buy Erika's crocodile tears for one hot second.

Guaran-damn-teed she purposely wore non-waterproof mascara just for this episode.

I believe this was all carefully orchestrated by Tom & his team, and Erika is playing the soap opera part.  Remember when she was on Eileen's soap opera?  That was practice.

She's already setting up the "Tom is feeble" defense.  She made multiple references to how frail he is.  

Next stop:  Tom's mind is feeble too, the dementia defense.  Junior Soprano is clapping.

[emmawoodhouse]

5 minutes ago, Starlight925 said:

Don't buy Erika's crocodile tears for one hot second.

Guaran-damn-teed she purposely wore non-waterproof mascara just for this episode.

I believe this was all carefully orchestrated by Tom & his team, and Erika is playing the soap opera part.  Remember when she was on Eileen's soap opera?  That was practice.

She's already setting up the "Tom is feeble" defense.  She made multiple references to how frail he is.  

Next stop:  Tom's mind is feeble too, the dementia defense.  Junior Soprano is clapping.

So, he can't see or hear, but she drops him off at the office? 

Her stories have more holes than Swiss cheese. 🙄

[Thumper]

Horse is dead.  Horse is dead. Please.  Stawwwp!

[dmeets]

19 minutes ago, Thumper said:

Horse is dead.  Horse is dead. Please.  Stawwwp!

Blame Lisa and the Richards sisters for lighting the fuse at every event so that the same argument occurs every episode. Too bad for them that quarantine, the tabloids, and Fox News had other drama in mind… 😈

[eleanorofaquitaine]

2 hours ago, Shannah Banana said:

I'm actually quite impressed with Sutton, in spite of her need for some emotional help, has been able to stand the verbal abuse and not responded in like kind.  Ugly leather pants doesn't compare with the rude, self righteous name calling that she gets.  To me, when you start name calling, you've already showed me who you are and confident, it isn't.  THAT is the projection.  And since I'm beating this dead horse again (sorry Universe) let's not forget how Crystal really embellished the whole stupid scenario too.  I am always glad when someone stands up to a bully, however they do it, and Sutton is still standing. 

 

Your definition of "verbal abuse" seems to be "Crystal standing up to Sutton's aggression and not backing down from Sutton's fragile tears."  But I get it - Sutton's fragile tears work on some people. They probably work on most people. But I'm with Crystal in finding Sutton's weaponized fragility frustrating and not something I'm interested in defending or even being around. 

[Vanderboom]

42 minutes ago, Thumper said:

Horse is dead.  Horse is dead. Please.  Stawwwp!

 

Even the horse's ghost is trying to run away. While neither Sutton nor Crystal is perfect, their imperfections don't make it okay to insult them, invent suspicious motives, or disregard their emotions.

[Alonzo Mosely FBI]

Blah blah blah blah Lisa Rinna and her vintage dresses blah blah blah so what who cares.  Did you SEE that total TP,  Kleenex and paper towel hoard in her garage !!????

[chewycandy]

Crystal gave me so much life in the inappropriate awkward person scene. I love the way she asserts herself; she’s such a strong newbie. That aside I do like Sutton. I just want them to move on. 
 

PS Erika is sitting next to Sutton and reacts with a “wow” after Crystal delivered that line back in the season preview but I noticed she was muted in the actual episode. 

I was taken aback at Portia this season, I can’t believe she’s this old. I still picture her sassily telling Kyle to “buy it” for her. 

Edited July 16, 2021 by chewycandy

[endure]

11 hours ago, Persnickety1 said:

Because I'm old and skeptical, I never bought into the Tom and Erika "love story."

I always felt the two of them were just a few steps up from the Anna Nicole Smith/J. Howard Marshall pairing, totally transactional.  (Of course, now I see these two assholes were a few steps down from ANS and JHM, because I don't believe ANS or JHM ever embezzled from victims of tragedies).

I've no problems with consenting adults having transactional relationships, but I just rolled my eyes whenever Erika would wax poetic about the awesomeness of her marriage to Girardi and how much they loved each other.  

Honestly, I really don't care how he treated her within that marriage.  He wanted arm candy and she wanted limitless greenbacks.  They both got what they wanted from that marriage.  She put up with his indifference and he put up with her wild spending.    

I'd have at least a modicum of respect for Erika had she just said, "Hey, he wanted some arm candy and I wanted a luxurious lifestyle.  When I found out he could no longer hold up his part of our arrangement and legal woes were afoot, I bounced out of there like a goddamned rubber ball."  

Tacky as hell, but I believe it would at least probably be truthful.  

Seeing her change her version of the events every week is amusing, but not as amusing as I will find seeing her in cuffs and an orange jumpsuit.  *fingers crossed*

It is hilarious watching her cry, fret and overly dramatize her demise, not to mention her rewriting the history of their loving marriage.  I hope she faces criminal charges, at this point and time in the show she isn’t even going anywhere near her or his culpability  for what they’ve taken from their victims who put their trust in him.  It is so disgusting.  At her age and her very limited talent, I have to wonder what the future even holds for her,  a jail cell will be a lot smaller than her current tiny dwelling if that is in her future.  I bet she will write a book.  I wonder what her son thinks about all this?

 

Edited July 16, 2021 by endure

[hoodooznoodooz]

6 hours ago, Talented Tenth said:

I'm just trying to figure out how Crystal is being deemed a "mean girl" for correctly saying her privacy is violated and choosing not to engage in Sutton's craziness.  Even the other cast members have said Sutton was acting irrational or erratic.  Crystal is not doing anything to Sutton, so how is she "mean"?  Are people seeing themselves in Sutton or something?  Crystal is calm, cool and collected.  Sutton is always frazzled which is not anybody else's problem.

I like both Sutton and Crystal. But I think, at least twice now, Sutton was very upset, and Crystal laughed. Maybe it was nervous laughter, but a lot of people may think it comes across as mean. “Not yours” also seems kind of mean. Crystal usually seems very confident; many people will want to defend the one who seems weak and helpless.

Edited July 16, 2021 by hoodooznoodooz

[biakbiak]

9 minutes ago, hoodooznoodooz said:

Not yours” also seems kind of mean.

That was literally a direct response to Sutton asking her what “crazy planet she was from,” seems like a much nicer response than the question.

[Cosmocrush]

29 minutes ago, biakbiak said:

That was literally a direct response to Sutton asking her what “crazy planet she was from,” seems like a much nicer response than the question.

Actually at the time I said, "Oh good one" to Crystal's response.   That's usually the kind of comeback I wish  I had said after the fact.  

Edited July 16, 2021 by Cosmocrush

[RealHousewife]

5 hours ago, Feech said:

She was a witness at one of his rapes and this is the only way to keep her quiet.

“Ask about the husband.”

In all seriousness, that allegation is from pure gossip right? 

2 hours ago, chewycandy said:

I was taken aback at Portia this season, I can’t believe she’s this old. I still picture her sassily telling Kyle to “buy it” for her. 

Haha I know. Portia has literally grown up on camera. I remember thinking she was so cute season 1 with her curls and chubby cheeks. 

 

1 hour ago, hoodooznoodooz said:

I like both Sutton and Crystal. But I think twice now, Sutton was very upset, and Crystal laughed. Maybe it was nervous laughter, but a lot of people may think it comes across as mean. “Not yours” also seems kind of mean. Crystal usually seems very confident; many people will want to defend the one who seems weak and helpless.

Honestly, they're probably two of the more decent people in the cast. The only other one who's not shady is Garcelle. 

[hoodooznoodooz]

Kathy should have named her dog “Kathy.”

[emmawoodhouse]

11 minutes ago, hoodooznoodooz said:

Kathy should have named her dog “Kathy.”

If the dog is male, the name Sue is genius. 😂

[endure]

On 7/14/2021 at 5:54 PM, CSunshine76 said:

So Erica has a story to tell, but can’t tell it yet? Um, okay. Sure you do. 

She will be writing a book 📚 

[Hiyo]

Quote

I am always glad when someone stands up to a bully, however they do it, and Sutton is still standing. 

Sutton is the bully in this case.

Quote

She came for Sutton when she snarled at her "are you THAT" girl. 

Wasn't that during the time when Crystal and Kyle were having a conversation that Sutton parachuted herself into?

Quote

Rinna being so bored and needing human interaction that she would stand outside peoples houses to get some attention and camera time

She knows how to keep that Bravo paycheck.

Quote

Absolutely, she should have let Crystal finish what she wanted to say, but her point was that hopefully they had evolved past stereotyping anyone.  Crystal turned it into a throw down and it's been a throw down every since. 

And Crystal rightly threw back implying that some people who say they "don't see color" are willfully ignoring that stereotyping still exists and happens.

Quote

If the dog is male, the name Sue is genius.

Given her portrayal on the show, I wouldn't be surprised if she didn't know the difference.

Edited July 16, 2021 by Hiyo

[Little Lady Back]

Oh the hypocrisy….

Sutton: I’m not going to make any kind of judgment (about Erica’s divorce) without knowing real facts.

Rinna: Well why would you? 

[Baltimore Betty]

7 hours ago, biakbiak said:

That was literally a direct response to Sutton asking her what “crazy planet she was from,” seems like a much nicer response than the question.

I feel like Crystal drew a line in the sand with that answer, I doubt we will ever see Crystal and Sutton being friends, it may be like Rinna and Kim, they can be in the same room together but the minute one of addresses the other things will be forever misconstrued and it will start another issue/fight.

[eleanorofaquitaine]

6 hours ago, RealHousewife said:

In all seriousness, that allegation is from pure gossip right? 

It is and IIRC, Julianne Phillips, who was the alleged victim, has denied it happened. 

[ladle]

I’m so confused by Erika. I’ve never been a big Erika fan, but I always did suspect she was reasonably intelligent/“street smart.” And certainly very image-conscious. So, when this all went down all she had to say was, “I am appalled if Tom did this, and I am mortified that people think I had anything to do with it. If this is true, my heart goes out to those poor families who are the real victims.” It’s not an admission of culpability, but it puts her in a sympathetic position and shows she has a heart. And maybe it’s just the editing, but her constant focus on herself and her financial “woes” is doing her absolutely no favors.

 

EDITED because oops! Omission and admission are different words.

Edited July 16, 2021 by ladle

[Hangin Out]

18 hours ago, oakville said:

It's not believable for Erika to say that she was clueless about Tom's legal problems when she accepted millions from him over the past few years. She has never come across as naive about business while she has been on the show.

She CLOSED HER EYES like lots of women do when the husband cheats with money or women.  Is she going to go back on the pole?  She’s too old to start over again with anything.  She’s not twenty anymore.  The way these women are coddling and and fake crying with her is ridiculous.  They are just happy it’s not them in this predicament.  I felt more sorry for Lisa Vanderpump and Denise Richards.  To me, Erika is cold and calculating.  The little kid was right .. “ bad man”.  (Or whatever he said).

 

 

 

 

[TattleTeeny]

Quote

 She’s too old to start over again with anything.  

She's only 50.

[ladle]

Unpopular opinion time!  

 

1) To me, the Erika situation is completely different from the LVP and Denise situations.  In both the LVP and Denise situations, the women, rightly or wrongly (and I'm not looking to re-litigate this, believe me!) felt that something was being done to them.  In LVP's case they felt she was manipulating storylines/the press/other HWs and in Denise's case they felt she was talking smack about them to Brandi/being a diva with production/calling them bad mothers (I honestly don't think they gave a shit who Denise did or did not sleep with).  Of course, they seized on these "flaws" and descended on both of these women like vultures on carrion, maybe because they thought it made for good TV (wrong: yawn) and probably because it kept the focus off their own misdoings (*cough* Dorit).  But in Erika's case, they're not really implicated or involved in whatever is happening with Tom.  [NOTE: I am NOT saying they were "right" to feel or react the way they did with LVP or Denise.  I am not defending the way those seasons went down.  I'm just pointing out how those situations were different from what's happening right now, which may explain why their reactions are more tempered.]  

2) Also, I'm just thinking about how I would react if a friend or even a co-worker I'd known for a few years were involved in something like this, and I'd probably respond the same way!  My immediate response would not be "Oh wow, guess she must have swindled orphans!"  I'd probably say something similar about how this is not the person I know.  And, even as a viewer of this episode, I can easily believe Erika didn't know about this!  My husband is a lawyer too and I have no idea what he does at work all day apart from what he tells me.  And when we were buying a house, I had to sign a million things and I didn't always read everything thoroughly because my husband is a lawyer and I trust his eye.  And I'd like to think I'm a fairly intelligent person.  So-- and I say this as a person who has no love for Erika -- I can 100% believe she didn't know what was going on (or at least was willfully ignorant/didn't want to know).  However, I also 100% can believe that she found out before the rest of the world did and it's connected to her leaving Tom.  

3) I believe the "Mean Tom" stories that Erika is telling now.  If I had to guess, I don't think that's why she left him but I believe those anecdotes are at least rooted in truth.  He does not seem like a swell guy.  Seems like she was willing to put up with it in a transactional way as long as the money was rolling in, though.  

4) Another potentially unpopular (?) opinion: I feel for Portia!  Yes, she is a child who has immense privilege.  And Kyle can be a self-centered mean girl/shit-stirrer but I believe she loves her girls fiercely and in this case, as a mother, I completely get where she's coming from!  I don't think it's as simple as Portia should sit around in her big house and be thankful she's not homeless or hungry.  Yes, she should be thankful!  But!  This pandemic has had physical and psychological repercussions for children and adults alike and, while I only have younger children, I've heard from friends that it's actually been worse on their teens than the younger kids.  I do wish anyone on this show -- anyone at all! -- would recognize their privilege in comparison to many Americans during the pandemic (Emily on O.C. did!  *golf clap*!), but I can't fault Portia for reacting poorly to a global pandemic or Kyle for being concerned about her.  I can, however, fault Kyle for that awful banana-colored dress she's wearing in some of the interstices.    

4) The subtext for this whole episode is that a dangerous virus was passed around because these folks were making a silly reality show, and that is really icky.  I hope all cast and crew, and anyone they may have passed this to, are okay and have no lasting effects.  But then I'm probably also culpable because I'm watching this... so, pass the popcorn, I guess? 

[eleanorofaquitaine]

I actually agree with most of what you are saying, @ladle. I don't believe that Erika is as innocent as she is portraying herself, but I actually can't really blame the other ladies for not believing the stories, at least initially.  If I were friends with someone (or even "friends"), I think I would be hard pressed to believe that my friend was swindling people until I saw more proof.  I wouldn't expect them to start holding Erika's feet to the fire, at least in the initial phase of hearing the story.

And yeah, I also agree that Tom isn't a great guy and probably was dismissive of Erika at times.  Obviously, the guy who swindles widows and orphans isn't that good of a person and I can believe he is the kind of guy who thinks that the world should bow down to his needs.

I just think that Erika's is pushing the narrative way too hard because, basically, she has something to hide. But I think you are probably correct that much of what she's saying is true. It's just that until she had a reason to make him the bad guy, she pretended like he was a hero. It's difficult to swallow. 

[Alonzo Mosely FBI]

On 7/14/2021 at 10:41 PM, endure said:

OMG the drama from Erica is hilarious and trying to act vulnerable too is pretty funny, she seems too concerned about people thinking her divorce is a sham.  Loved the mascara streaming down her face, that must prove it lol. She is beside herself.  Is there a go fund me for her?

THIS! Jeeeezus the gall of this woman the makeup running down the face and not trying to wipe it was the tears of a clown. The story morphed from she is divorcing, she didn't know, he's a cow, to he's got cognitive problems in one episode. I laughed! She is NOT a good actress.

[Pondlass1]

Not one ounce of empathy or humanity exists in Erika’s heart. The muddy tears are for HER predicament, not Tom’s victims.  I think the snobbish bitch she’s always presented is the true self.

The housewives will drop her like a lead balloon if she goes down.

I admit I watch for the silly narcissists and their obscene wealth, but not at the expense of cheated victims. What of them, Erika?  
 

[Coptop77]

Really glad we were spared from any histrionics from Kyle regarding her Covid diagnosis. I I fully expected a Shannon Bedor-like meltdown but it seems production must have cut it for more Erika Jayne drama. These current and recent housewives seasons are mind boggling to watch.. Portia can’t hug her sister yet the women get together and socialize without a mask in sight and then their inevitable covid diagnoses happen and it just perfectly illustrates why it all became so bad. 

[Boo Boo]

1 hour ago, Hangin Out said:

She CLOSED HER EYES like lots of women do when the husband cheats with money or women.  Is she going to go back on the pole?  She’s too old to start over again with anything.  She’s not twenty anymore.  The way these women are coddling and and fake crying with her is ridiculous.  They are just happy it’s not them in this predicament.  I felt more sorry for Lisa Vanderpump and Denise Richards.  To me, Erika is cold and calculating.  The little kid was right .. “ bad man”.  (Or whatever he said).

 

 

 

 

She was probably thankful someone else was fucking him so she didn't have to!

I mean, now that I'm past menopause and don't want sex, I'm considering finding a side piece for my boyfriend.

[Castina]

1 hour ago, ladle said:

I’m so confused by Erika. I’ve never been a big Erika fan, but I always did suspect she was reasonably intelligent/“street smart.” And certainly very image-conscious. So, when this all went down all she had to say was, “I am appalled if Tom did this, and I am mortified that people think I had anything to do with it. If this is true, my heart goes out to those poor families who are the real victims.” It’s not an omission of culpability, but it puts her in a sympathetic position and shows she has a heart. And maybe it’s just the editing, but her constant focus on herself and her financial “woes” is doing her absolutely no favors.

Exactly.  And if we are to believe what she was selling the other ladies about the reason she left and filed for divorce she could say something like that without even touching on anything specific to the case for legal reasons.  

But she is all over the place and that mascara scene with Kyle is a production manipulation and does not fit the timeframe.  I am convinced of it.  It seemed as out of place as the Brandi scene so it had me googling timelines here and I would bet my house on it that was filmed sometime well AFTER the new year.  In the current timeline they are selling us it happens before December 18 (the date Erika posts old texts of Tom having an affair) but at the tale end of Kyle having Covid (which she had at least November 27 to December 5).  And likely before December 14 because that is the date their assets were frozen so you would think that is a topic.  Both of those seem to be topics in next weeks episode.  

What was happening in that timeframe outside production was Erika and Tom being sued on December 2 that their divorce is a sham to hide assets.  That fits with the zoom conversation we see in the episode.  On December 14 Tom is held in civil contempt for declining to explain why he couldn't pay $2 million to victims.  Then their assets are frozen. 

So what is going on in their world is people are saying it's a sham, they are trying to hide assets so Erika posts texts of Tom and that judge on December 18 in what one has to assume was their attempt to prove that the divorce is real.   

But the mascara scene would have Erika dropping seeds before she posts those cheating texts that poor Tom was loosing it and she was worried about him.  That just doesn't make sense to me for that to be done in that order.  I mean in between convincing people Tom was cold af to her, controlling, dismissive AND telling the world he cheated on her she is also crying to Kyle that she is really worried about him and he is losing his capacities?  

LOL

[Boo Boo]

1 hour ago, ladle said:

Unpopular opinion time!  

 

1) To me, the Erika situation is completely different from the LVP and Denise situations.  In both the LVP and Denise situations, the women, rightly or wrongly (and I'm not looking to re-litigate this, believe me!) felt that something was being done to them.  In LVP's case they felt she was manipulating storylines/the press/other HWs and in Denise's case they felt she was talking smack about them to Brandi/being a diva with production/calling them bad mothers (I honestly don't think they gave a shit who Denise did or did not sleep with).  Of course, they seized on these "flaws" and descended on both of these women like vultures on carrion, maybe because they thought it made for good TV (wrong: yawn) and probably because it kept the focus off their own misdoings (*cough* Dorit).  But in Erika's case, they're not really implicated or involved in whatever is happening with Tom.  [NOTE: I am NOT saying they were "right" to feel or react the way they did with LVP or Denise.  I am not defending the way those seasons went down.  I'm just pointing out how those situations were different from what's happening right now, which may explain why their reactions are more tempered.]  

2) Also, I'm just thinking about how I would react if a friend or even a co-worker I'd known for a few years were involved in something like this, and I'd probably respond the same way!  My immediate response would not be "Oh wow, guess she must have swindled orphans!"  I'd probably say something similar about how this is not the person I know.  And, even as a viewer of this episode, I can easily believe Erika didn't know about this!  My husband is a lawyer too and I have no idea what he does at work all day apart from what he tells me.  And when we were buying a house, I had to sign a million things and I didn't always read everything thoroughly because my husband is a lawyer and I trust his eye.  And I'd like to think I'm a fairly intelligent person.  So-- and I say this as a person who has no love for Erika -- I can 100% believe she didn't know what was going on (or at least was willfully ignorant/didn't want to know).  However, I also 100% can believe that she found out before the rest of the world did and it's connected to her leaving Tom.  

3) I believe the "Mean Tom" stories that Erika is telling now.  If I had to guess, I don't think that's why she left him but I believe those anecdotes are at least rooted in truth.  He does not seem like a swell guy.  Seems like she was willing to put up with it in a transactional way as long as the money was rolling in, though.  

4) Another potentially unpopular (?) opinion: I feel for Portia!  Yes, she is a child who has immense privilege.  And Kyle can be a self-centered mean girl/shit-stirrer but I believe she loves her girls fiercely and in this case, as a mother, I completely get where she's coming from!  I don't think it's as simple as Portia should sit around in her big house and be thankful she's not homeless or hungry.  Yes, she should be thankful!  But!  This pandemic has had physical and psychological repercussions for children and adults alike and, while I only have younger children, I've heard from friends that it's actually been worse on their teens than the younger kids.  I do wish anyone on this show -- anyone at all! -- would recognize their privilege in comparison to many Americans during the pandemic (Emily on O.C. did!  *golf clap*!), but I can't fault Portia for reacting poorly to a global pandemic or Kyle for being concerned about her.  I can, however, fault Kyle for that awful banana-colored dress she's wearing in some of the interstices.    

4) The subtext for this whole episode is that a dangerous virus was passed around because these folks were making a silly reality show, and that is really icky.  I hope all cast and crew, and anyone they may have passed this to, are okay and have no lasting effects.  But then I'm probably also culpable because I'm watching this... so, pass the popcorn, I guess? 

I agree with all of this.

Unless I thought a coworker was completely shady, I probably would be like, "she didn't know."  Particularly if the husband was a famous attorney whose lawsuit was the subject covered in Erin Brockovich!  I would assume she just figured it was money from his work, good investments.

I could def believe the "mean Tom" stories based on that LVP dinner and he was an ass.  The problem it's all coming out now, not more of a long trickle of stories.  But if she was bitching about him on TV while married, there probably would be hell to pay.

On Portia, I thought she was overacting the crying jag when her sister came home, but now that the oversleeping and missing classes -- that's extreme depression.  While many of us didn't really mind being home more, for kids it was probably hell on earth -- even if they live in a mansion and have all the luxuries.

The uncertainty of it all -- even now with Delta strain -- is still very scary.  The toll it has taken on our children is probably immeasurable.

 

[endure]

9 hours ago, Alonzo Mosely FBI said:

THIS! Jeeeezus the gall of this woman the makeup running down the face and not trying to wipe it was the tears of a clown. The story morphed from she is divorcing, she didn't know, he's a cow, to he's got cognitive problems in one episode. I laughed! She is NOT a good actress.

She is such a narcissist she takes acting to a whole other level, this season we haven’t seen her usual tough arrogant broad shtick she usually personifies. I believe it’s all an act with her.  I would love to see Youtube  ~ The Body Panel analyze her body language 😂

Edited July 16, 2021 by endure

[Persnickety1]

36 minutes ago, Castina said:

Exactly.  And if we are to believe what she was selling the other ladies about the reason she left and filed for divorce she could say something like that without even touching on anything specific to the case for legal reasons.  

But she is all over the place and that mascara scene with Kyle is a production manipulation and does not fit the timeframe.  I am convinced of it.  It seemed as out of place as the Brandi scene so it had me googling timelines here and I would bet my house on it that was filmed sometime well AFTER the new year.  In the current timeline they are selling us it happens before December 18 (the date Erika posts old texts of Tom having an affair) but at the tale end of Kyle having Covid (which she had at least November 27 to December 5).  And likely before December 14 because that is the date their assets were frozen so you would think that is a topic.  Both of those seem to be topics in next weeks episode.  

What was happening in that timeframe outside production was Erika and Tom being sued on December 2 that their divorce is a sham to hide assets.  That fits with the zoom conversation we see in the episode.  On December 14 Tom is held in civil contempt for declining to explain why he couldn't pay $2 million to victims.  Then their assets are frozen. 

So what is going on in their world is people are saying it's a sham, they are trying to hide assets so Erika posts texts of Tom and that judge on December 18 in what one has to assume was their attempt to prove that the divorce is real.   

But the mascara scene would have Erika dropping seeds before she posts those cheating texts that poor Tom was loosing it and she was worried about him.  That just doesn't make sense to me for that to be done in that order.  I mean in between convincing people Tom was cold af to her, controlling, dismissive AND telling the world he cheated on her she is also crying to Kyle that she is really worried about him and he is losing his capacities?  

LOL

Spoiler

Your breakdown of the timeline has me curious.  I'm now wondering at what point in this season's airing did Erika's attorney(s) want to bounce because she wasn't being truthful about her assets.  I wonder if they saw how many assets she was flaunting on the show yet hadn't told them about those assets.  Hmmmm.  

 

[chlban]

4 hours ago, Little Lady Back said:

Oh the hypocrisy….

Sutton: I’m not going to make any kind of judgment (about Erica’s divorce) without knowing real facts.

Rinna: Well why would you? 

Maybe they need to contact Brandi and find out what the facts are. I mean they all believe in the word according to Brandi. Why believe victims and attorneys, when Brandi is just a text away?

Edited July 16, 2021 by chlban

[izabella]

29 minutes ago, Boo Boo said:

Unless I thought a coworker was completely shady, I probably would be like, "she didn't know."  Particularly if the husband was a famous attorney whose lawsuit was the subject covered in Erin Brockovich!  I would assume she just figured it was money from his work, good investments.

My question is what makes any of them believe their co-worker Erica isn't shady?  I've thought she was shady, cold and aggressive from the start.  I have no problem believing she was all-in on whatever shady shit Tom pulled because Ms. Pat the Puss was all about the fakety-fake-fake bullshit.  I mean, she left her son behind to seek her fortune in Vegas.  How can anyone trust a person who can betray their own child and leave them behind in order to enrich only herself?

Edited July 16, 2021 by izabella

[Persnickety1]

9 minutes ago, izabella said:

My question is what makes any of them believe their co-worker Erica isn't shady?  I've thought she was shady, cold and aggressive from the start.  I have no problem believing she was all-in on whatever shady shit Tom pulled because Ms. Pat the Puss was all about the fakety-fake-fake bullshit.  I mean, she left her son behind to seek her fortune in Vegas.  How can anyone trust a person who can betray their own child and leave them behind in order to enrich only herself?

I've never understood why any of these women wanted to be actual friends with Erika.  She's aloof, cold, distant, and if criticized at all (no matter how minor), she strikes like a pissed off rattlesnake.  I wouldn't want to be her "friend."  

I know the other women have to work with her and being cordial with a co-worker is fine, but they're really going overboard with the "Oh golly gee, Miss Erika, I just KNOW you would never be capable of this!"

I think they kiss her ass beyond the pale because they're afraid she'll open their closet doors and drag the skeletons out into the daylight.  Who knows what some of them might have confided in her.  

(This doesn't include Garcelle.  I don't think she has any skeletons to speak of in her closet so I'm hoping she will be the one to hold Erika's feet to the fire.  I'm not sure about Sutton's closeted skeletons.  I just don't think Sutton has the required social skills to drag anybody's bullshit out in the harsh light of day.)  

[ladle]

1 hour ago, eleanorofaquitaine said:

I actually agree with most of what you are saying, @ladle. I don't believe that Erika is as innocent as she is portraying herself, but I actually can't really blame the other ladies for not believing the stories, at least initially.  If I were friends with someone (or even "friends"), I think I would be hard pressed to believe that my friend was swindling people until I saw more proof.  I wouldn't expect them to start holding Erika's feet to the fire, at least in the initial phase of hearing the story.

And yeah, I also agree that Tom isn't a great guy and probably was dismissive of Erika at times.  Obviously, the guy who swindles widows and orphans isn't that good of a person and I can believe he is the kind of guy who thinks that the world should bow down to his needs.

I just think that Erika's is pushing the narrative way too hard because, basically, she has something to hide. But I think you are probably correct that much of what she's saying is true. It's just that until she had a reason to make him the bad guy, she pretended like he was a hero. It's difficult to swallow. 

Oh, I totally agree that she’s pushing that narrative now because it serves her! But, I’m just saying (and you seem to agree!) that it’s likely not a completely bullshit narrative.

Edited to clarify that I specifically mean the narrative about Tom treating her poorly.

Edited July 16, 2021 by ladle

[Hangin Out]

1 hour ago, Boo Boo said:

She was probably thankful someone else was fucking him so she didn't have to!

I mean, now that I'm past menopause and don't want sex, I'm considering finding a side piece for my boyfriend.

No need .. they slow down too.

[MissFeatherbottom]

The more I think of Erika's fake mascara tears, the more it pisses me off! How can anyone feel sorry for her when she has shown no sympathy to the people/families whose money was taken from them? Her tears are because she is no longer going to have the lifestyle she thought she earned/deserved, so yeah I am not feeling any sympathy for her.