S02.E08: The Morning After

[paulvdb]

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After a confrontation with Isabel, tensions rise with Benji and Victor. Mia learns troubling news.

 

[JustHereForFood]

Well, that was interesting. The Victor/Benji situation was quite similar to Felix/Lake, so I don't really have an answer, they both overreacted a bit, I guess. The break might do them good, but I hope they get back together. And no Victor/Rahim hookup in the meantime, pretty please.

I have to say, I was on Benji's side with the Isabel situation. Victor might like to believe she was freaked out the same way as she would be if he was with a girl, but let's not kid ourselves, Benji was right that she was reacting in a homophobic way. I was happy for her in the end though, when she told the priest off for scaring Adrian like that and for his words about Victor. I guess that's what she was missing this whole time, a more negative reaction from someone with her viewpoint that would make her reexamine if that line of thinking is what she really believes in.

And I'm sorry if I offend anyone, but coming from a very white and quite conservative and homophobic country, I am tired of this idea that white people have it easier with coming out these days (it is true in some places, but not everywhere) and that we should cut some slack specifically to people of color, if they take a long-ass time to come to terms with it, especially if they are religious. As we saw with Adrian and Pilar before that, they can easily accept the situation as it is. I hope this is the end of Isabel's "struggles" and that she is going to be supportive from now on.

I feel so sorry for Mia. She has been abandoned by both of her parents (in different ways) and we could see how hard it was for her to be honest with her father. I was surprised that he immediately told her that he is staying, I thought he would say he will think about it. And then the call in the end, Jesus! How does he plan to handle that, will he tell her immediately, or does he plan to wait until she is happier and then crush her? Btw, could Mia stay there on her own, if he moves? I know social services would not be happy about that, but they mentioned previously that she has been staying alone a lot for a while, so apparently her father doesn't care much about that and she seems quite capable to live alone. Would she need to get emancipated to do that, or would it be ok, as long as nobody alerts social services? Because I don't see how it would be any better to her to move with her father and his new family, away from all her friends, just to be ignored by her father in a different state.

[possibilities]

Speaking to the cultural issue, I think that, while it's true that coming out can be hard for white people, too, there is an added layer of complexity when you are in a minority, where you actually have additional layers of things to be negotiating in the world. When you are already in multiple categories of being discriminated against, you have more at stake when you lose part of your support system or are kicked out of your community. And there are just really different pressures and norms in different communities, whether or not they are living under minority pressure. I think that Benji is wrong to be harsh with Victor about how he's handling his mother, and I ALWAYS think it's wrong for white people to ignore their privilege and tell POC that they don't have to account for the effect of racism and how it impacts the lives of people other than themselves. 

What I don't understand is why Benji is all of a sudden so angry and impatient about this all. He started off understanding that it can be difficult and that you don't pressure people about how they handle the homophobia in their surroundings. Mia was actually a lot more respectful when Victor basically threw her under the bus when people were insulting her at school, and I think that shows that Benji really doesn't get it in a way that a person COULD get it, if they wanted to. And now Benji is really angry even when there's progress being made. It's one thing to want to talk about how hard it is to deal with the negativity, or how skeptical he is about whether Isabel will really change, but to blame Victor for it and not be open to how hard this is for Victor, too, just seems really shitty to me.

I get his frustration. I get his skepticism and his pain. But I don't get his absolute disgust and fury at Victor.

 

[festivus]

I'm so proud of Isabel right now. That was a big step for her and I'm on Victor's side with his argument with Benji. Benji had no right to out him to his little brother and while I can understand his frustration, that is Victor's mother. That is not for him to say how Victor deals with his family. I am on his side about being upset about Victor telling his business to Rahim though.

I'm gonna be honest that I'm really not rooting for them as a couple. There is too much of a lack of understanding between them. There's just something I dont like about Benji even though he's been really supportive about some things.

Poor Mia, this is gonna be devastating for her. She's such a sweet person, I hate seeing it.

On another note, I'm like okay y'all are worried about Victor having sex when his little brother is in the house but your daughter and the kid you're supposed to be watching are missing all night and nobody says a thing? Nope.

 

[PWHCHCH]

are we just ignoring the fact that Adrian is clearly a friend of Dorothy too?

[Harvey]

On 6/17/2021 at 5:29 AM, festivus said:

I'm so proud of Isabel right now. That was a big step for her and I'm on Victor's side with his argument with Benji. Benji had no right to out him to his little brother and while I can understand his frustration, that is Victor's mother. That is not for him to say how Victor deals with his family. I am on his side about being upset about Victor telling his business to Rahim though.

I'm gonna be honest that I'm really not rooting for them as a couple. There is too much of a lack of understanding between them. There's just something I dont like about Benji even though he's been really supportive about some things.

Poor Mia, this is gonna be devastating for her. She's such a sweet person, I hate seeing it.

On another note, I'm like okay y'all are worried about Victor having sex when his little brother is in the house but your daughter and the kid you're supposed to be watching are missing all night and nobody says a thing? Nope.

 

Victor doesn't deserve Benji. Benji was completely patient and accepting of Victor's problems, and that is also what the actors had to say on the matter in interviews:

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"Benji kind of has to coach him through that and be like the most understanding, most kind, most sweet boyfriend ever, but in the same token that kind of puts a strain on their relationship" Michael Cimino aka the actor playing Victor

Then Victor plays the race card, like no white person ever had religious parents that were homophobic/not accepting, and downplaying Benji's coming out, as if his father was accepting and didn't take him to a strip club to "turn" him straight, which by the way, is far worse than having one parent struggle to accept you (Isabel)  at the beginning and now is, and the other being accepting from the start (Armando), especially when you're surrounded by accepting people; other family members (Pilar, Adrian, Armando), friends (Lake, Mia, Felix), and also SIMON to help you.

[Scarlett45]

On 6/16/2021 at 11:04 AM, possibilities said:

Speaking to the cultural issue, I think that, while it's true that coming out can be hard for white people, too, there is an added layer of complexity when you are in a minority, where you actually have additional layers of things to be negotiating in the world. When you are already in multiple categories of being discriminated against, you have more at stake when you lose part of your support system or are kicked out of your community. And there are just really different pressures and norms in different communities, whether or not they are living under minority pressure. I think that Benji is wrong to be harsh with Victor about how he's handling his mother, and I ALWAYS think it's wrong for white people to ignore their privilege and tell POC that they don't have to account for the effect of racism and how it impacts the lives of people other than themselves. 

So well said. I agree with you. Intersectionality is very much a thing. I understand why Benji is upset, but truthfully Isabel doesn’t owe HIM anything outside of human decency. He isn’t her son. He did come into her home and have sex in her house- he and Victor broke house rules. (I am assuming Pilar isn’t to have people in her room either) I am a 35 years old woman I wouldn’t dare bring a man into my Mom’s home and have sex with him (cultural expectations), much less at 16/17. So Benji needs to stay in his place. 
 

Yeah I got what Rahim and Victor were talking about- in many families of color you do NOT talk to your parents/elders like they are your peers. You don’t just say whatever you feel like saying in any tone you feel like using, you can disagree but you remember your place. Again, I’m 35 and I wouldn’t cop that tone with my significant other’s parent. I did have to pull the “I was taught to respect my elders.”  card in a very calm tone with my 88 yrs old cousin (over the hoarding issue in my own family) which she knew meant some choice words. 
 

“Glad you found your french toast.”- Adrian (that boy is too precious!!)

On 8/7/2021 at 3:54 AM, PWHCHCH said:

are we just ignoring the fact that Adrian is clearly a friend of Dorothy too?

In season one there were hints that the parents/grandparents thought Adrian might be gay, but Adrian is still so young, and I think they are subverting the trope and Adrian will just be a straight guy that fits into a lot of gay stereotypes (while Victor is a gay guy that fits straight stereotypes). 
 

If Mia doesn’t want to go to CA could her Dad make arrangements for her to have a guardian and stay in ATL until she goes to college? That doesn’t seem unreasonable. 
 

 

Shallow Bus- The actor that plays Rahim is so facially blessed. It’s like the gods carved his face.