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S12.E15: Retreat Ready

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37 minutes ago, psychoticstate said:

I actually hope these two decide not to stay together because they just aren't good together.  They may not be as surface toxic as Haley and Jake or Chris and anyone but eventually they will be. 

I actually think they are pretty toxic, just in a different way. He talks to her like she's a child, and she acts like one. It's not a good dynamic. Also, the alcohol fueled fights are not healthy, nor Virginia's refusal to wait until they are sober for serious discussions. Yet another thing they can't agree on.

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42 minutes ago, psychoticstate said:

Erik wants to live in his condo until they figure things out, Virginia is dead set against it for no apparent reason and has no solution. 

I think they have mentioned that his condo does not allow pets, so I totally understand why she doesn't want to go there.

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But he has Tex so pets should be allowed.  Virginia has stated that it's not good for her pets which is a different thing.  I think his condo is farther away from the couches upon which she crashes than is hers.  Therefore, his would be way too inconvenient...

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1 hour ago, psychoticstate said:

I don't know if I would say that.  I think if the experience had been bad, she wouldn't hesitate to say so (and would frankly make more sense than her "Jake likes the 80s?  Ewwwww!" or "Jake doesn't wear tennis shoes?  Marriage over!")   She has zero problems criticizing Jake to anyone and everyone about anything and everything so I think she would at least hint about it, if not come right out and say it.   

Neither of them said anything about it to the "experts" either. 

As far as not wanting to hear Jake relive anything, the fact is that Haley doesn't want to hear Jake, period.  She has said in at least two episodes now that she has tried but I've seen zero evidence of that.

I think Jake said he was done after Haley claimed she wanted alone time downstairs during the honeymoon and he discovered her hanging out and eating with the other couples. 

I don't blame him for that one bit.  Even if she ran into the other couples, she could have called upstairs to him and let him know -- or just gone upstairs and told him.  

See, I think Vincent will say yes.  Brianna should be on the fence.  He's too rigid and unmoving when it comes to certain things (where to live;  must have biological kids), he's very moody when he's put in a situation to try something new (something she enjoys doing), and he seems to have some champagne tastes on his Boone's Farm budget, while knocking Brianna for what she spends on clothing and hair.   I don't know.  I don't think he's a bad guy but I'm not sure that their differences won't tear them apart in the end.  Her goals seem to be traveling and having adventures and his goals seem to be a shit ton of kids and leaving a legacy.  Nothing wrong with either but they are not compatible and neither should have to change what they want to accommodate the other. 

I think if Ryan goes first and says he wants to stay together, Clara will agree, whether that is what she truly decided or not.  In that way, MAFS should really film each spouse separately with their decision and then play it when both are present, that way no one can change their mind and buckle under pressure.  

I think both Ryan and Clara are nice people but I'm not sure Ryan can give Clara what she most wants, which is a passionate sex life.  I find it interesting that they have apparently not discussed WHY Ryan is hesitant to take it to the next level, especially if they are having some kind of sex.  Does he think it's dirty?  Some other hang up?  Dr. Viv is supposedly the sex expert and even she wasn't exactly inquiring what the hold up is.  She should have seen big, huge red flags over Ryan's previous girlfriends waiting for two years and/or not having sex at all during that time.  What gives?   And if the "experts" knew that Ryan moved that incredibly slow, what were they thinking matching him with someone who admits she moves really fast?  

No surprise that both Jake and Haley will ask for a divorce.  I wonder if both of them will just let the shit fly on Decision Day.  I hope Jake does.  I think the only surprising thing would be that one or both of them hasn't already contacted an attorney.

Why even bother with Paige and Chris?  Paige should already have an attorney hired by now.  She's been "done" at least three times and we haven't had to see her or that tool she was convinced God sent her for the last several episodes so no need to see either of them on Decision Day.  

For me, the biggest wildcard is Erik and Virginia.  I think they both like the idea of them being married but they both know they have some pretty unsurmountable problems.  Erik wants kids and pretty soon.  Virginia isn't sure if she ever does (and it's okay if she never does so shame on Pastor Cal for telling her that hey, everyone worries that they are going to eff up their kids before they have them!)  Virginia wants to party all the time and maybe she can squeeze Erik in there, in between her bar hops and crashes on the sofas of friends, but only if he meets her at the corner bar.  Erik wants to live in his condo until they figure things out, Virginia is dead set against it for no apparent reason and has no solution.  Erik is allergic to Virginia's cats and doesn't want them sleeping in the bed with them, Virginia refuses to bend on the issue. 

If they were dating, they'd be done by now.  They act like two people in their twenties in a dating relationship who fight, make up, fight again, make up, cry, yell, fight, make up.   To be like this a month into their relationship/marriage is not a good sign for a healthy, loving and lasting relationship.   If the "experts" were true experts, they would intervene and suggest to  Virginia that she needs rehab and some therapy to help her with anxiety and the issues she has with her upbringing.  

I actually hope these two decide not to stay together because they just aren't good together.  They may not be as surface toxic as Haley and Jake or Chris and anyone but eventually they will be.  

I think in the first season of the show they said that off camera, they take the spouses to separate rooms and get the answer, that way no one can change their answer at the last minute...no matter who goes first.

I have no idea if they still do this. 

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On 4/24/2021 at 6:54 PM, humbleopinion said:

Brides who got good edits despite not liking their grooms

Meka the Exasperated and If My Lips Are Moving I'm Lying... Michael

Olivia, I'm Too Good 4U and Brett, the role model for Jake to learn to be gracious

While Olivia got good edits from the show, the audience wasn't fooled by her.  We saw the game they were playing, trying to make Brett look back because he wouldn't be a party to their moronic ratings ploys.  Olivia lied about wanting to have children and once Brett realized that, it was all over.   

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On 4/24/2021 at 9:34 PM, Airy2021 said:

Karen wasn’t attracted to Miles. I didn’t even think she would stay married to him in the end. That relationship lasting still kind of shocks me!

ME TOO.  Every time a I see them on CouplesCam I think Phoney.

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On 4/28/2021 at 10:41 AM, JocelynCavanaugh said:

A lot of us prefer not to see spoilers, which is why the rule is not to mention them in episode threads. I hope people won’t keep alluding and dropping obvious hints that might as well be spoilers. It seems to keep happening no matter how many mod reminders are posted. 

I think the original poster was referring to some pretty surprising footage the show chose to show that revealed one of the couples' decision.  They've never done anything like that before, and I was shocked.  But it was not a spoiler....the show aired it at the end of an episode from about 4 weeks ago.

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2 minutes ago, JapMo said:

I think the original poster was referring to some pretty surprising footage the show chose to show that revealed one of the couples' decision.  They've never done anything like that before, and I was shocked.  But it was not a spoiler....the show aired it at the end of an episode from about 4 weeks ago.

I was speaking in general about some posters' tendency to get drunk on the power of knowing spoilers and make such obvious and heavy-handed hints that they might as well just announce what they know and see if the headpats materialize (e.g., "I heard that a certain handsome black groom whose name sounds like "teeth" chooses to divorce a beautiful black bride who made her whole identity about being a virgin who swallowed a quarter, but I don't want to say more because that might give it away.").

Even if they put comments like that in spoiler tags, other people quote and reply to them in the thread and it's a lost cause. I've had this happen a few times on here/Previously/TWOP. The mods do shut it down if they're warned in time, but obviously they can't catch everything. I've been the one to report it far more than I'd like. I was hoping to pre-empt that happening here by reminding others that some of us really, truly do NOT want spoilers, hints of spoilers, gleeful allusions to spoilers, or other forms of ruining this stupid show we've been too invested in for the past couple of months.

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On 4/28/2021 at 3:45 PM, psychoticstate said:

I don't know if I would say that.  I think if the experience had been bad, she wouldn't hesitate to say so (and would frankly make more sense than her "Jake likes the 80s?  Ewwwww!" or "Jake doesn't wear tennis shoes?  Marriage over!")   She has zero problems criticizing Jake to anyone and everyone about anything and everything so I think she would at least hint about it, if not come right out and say it.   

Neither of them said anything about it to the "experts" either. 

See, that's the one thing Haley has been consistent about.....she has not revealed either on camera or to the experts what the real reason is that she doesn't like Jake.  It's only because Jake kept saying she seemed to distance herself right after they had sex that has led most of us to feel it was something about his lovemaking that completely turned her off.  

Listening to her excuses and quibbles about Jake only reinforced to me that it was indeed the one night of sex that ended everything for her.  She doesn't want to humiliate the guy on national tv by saying he's lousy in bed, but her squirming and not making eye contact with Dr. Pepper and coming up with really phony excuses and then reluctantly promising to try again, only to break that promise almost immediately, made it pretty obvious in my mind that she was trying her best not to say it.  

But by trying to be a decent person and not hurt Jake, she's made herself look pretty bad.  She keeps saying how hard she's tried but she's been done since the honeymoon.  She doesn't want to look like a bad guy, but Jake's pissed her off with his less than charming personality so maybe now she's like 'f*ck it'...he doesn't deserve my silence'.  I wouldn't be surprised if she told all the other wives the down low on Jake the Snake.

 

 

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5 hours ago, JapMo said:

See, that's the one thing Haley has been consistent about.....she has not revealed either on camera or to the experts what the real reason is that she doesn't like Jake.  It's only because Jake kept saying she seemed to distance herself right after they had sex that has led most of us to feel it was something about his lovemaking that completely turned her off.  

Listening to her excuses and quibbles about Jake only reinforced to me that it was indeed the one night of sex that ended everything for her.  She doesn't want to humiliate the guy on national tv by saying he's lousy in bed, but her squirming and not making eye contact with Dr. Pepper and coming up with really phony excuses and then reluctantly promising to try again, only to break that promise almost immediately, made it pretty obvious in my mind that she was trying her best not to say it.  

But by trying to be a decent person and not hurt Jake, she's made herself look pretty bad.  She keeps saying how hard she's tried but she's been done since the honeymoon.  She doesn't want to look like a bad guy, but Jake's pissed her off with his less than charming personality so maybe now she's like 'f*ck it'...he doesn't deserve my silence'.  I wouldn't be surprised if she told all the other wives the down low on Jake the Snake.

 

 

I agree.

I do not think she was bowled over by Jake at the altar but she seemed game to try. It was the sex that made her totally shut down. It does not necessarily mean Jake is bad in bed but he obviously just did not do it for her.

It is kind of like every MAFS groom gives a standard reaction of finding their bride beautiful at the altar but we know some of them were disappointed (I think even Chris commented on how Paige had a nice figure). The grooms know if they say, " I do not like the way she looks" it will just make them look bad (something probably to do with every woman is beautiful on her wedding day).

Hailey knows if she confesses that she just not like the sex, it is only going to make HER look bad. However, pretending to "try" is just making her look very fake and cold.

She is in a no win situation but this is what she signed up for.

Speaking of wedding day first impressions....can anyone tell me why the Hell relatively decent looking men like Jake and Ryan would go to their wedding day with the ugliest haircuts possible? Jake looks much better now that his hair is growing in and Ryan's head still looks like an elfin bikini wax.

Why do that to yourself on the day you are trying to impress your new bride? I refuse to believe either man thought they looked "good".

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We've complained about the lousy matchups the experts have made, but in regard to Jake & Hailey, I don't think they did a bad job.  I don't think their 10 year age difference was a problem for Hailey.  They both really wanted to get married and said they would do anything to make it work.  At 39 and 29, they aren't kids....they've been around the block and were not going to be super picky about looks, money, etc. 

So with that in mind, to me this was the best match out of the 5.  That it crashed and burned not too long after the dumpster fire marriage of Paige & Chris is pretty surprising.  

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31 minutes ago, JapMo said:

We've complained about the lousy matchups the experts have made, but in regard to Jake & Hailey, I don't think they did a bad job.  I don't think their 10 year age difference was a problem for Hailey.  They both really wanted to get married and said they would do anything to make it work.  At 39 and 29, they aren't kids....they've been around the block and were not going to be super picky about looks, money, etc. 

So with that in mind, to me this was the best match out of the 5.  That it crashed and burned not too long after the dumpster fire marriage of Paige & Chris is pretty surprising.  

well, they she lied because, obviously, those things really did matter to her more than she had admitted in her interviews

 

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2 hours ago, JapMo said:

they've been around the block and were not going to be super picky about looks, money, etc. 

Haley specifically said that she is VERY picky, makes her decisions quickly, and then shuts down. I still think that the only reason she wanted to be married is that all of her friends are and she was tired of not having a partner for activities and weddings. She does not appear to be a warm or kind person. Of course, we did not see her before her last relationship, which she is still dealing with (and why she shouldn't have been selected for the show).

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I said at the very beginning that I couldn't figure out why Jake and Haley were matched as they seemed to have nothing in common but being dog owners (and even there it caused conflict). I'm still of that opinion. We've seen them do activities like batting cages and mini golf, but even those didn't seem enjoyable because Haley made them all about the competition and winning. I really don't get why they were put together except I guess they were both eager to be married. I suppose they could have ended up attracted to each other and willing to work things out but that would've been despite the experts and not because of them.

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On 5/2/2021 at 10:12 PM, qtpye said:

Speaking of wedding day first impressions....can anyone tell me why the Hell relatively decent looking men like Jake and Ryan would go to their wedding day with the ugliest haircuts possible?

Because there isn't time to grow their hair.  I think they only have two weeks between finding out they are chosen and the wedding.  Since they both have part of their head shaved - it would be impossible to grow out in time.  I agree on their hair!  Jake looks like he's got that military thing going on and Ryan... well, it's just odd.  That said, even with time, they might think their hair is hot stuff!  

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57 minutes ago, Devvie said:

Because there isn't time to grow their hair.  I think they only have two weeks between finding out they are chosen and the wedding.  Since they both have part of their head shaved - it would be impossible to grow out in time.  I agree on their hair!  Jake looks like he's got that military thing going on and Ryan... well, it's just odd.  That said, even with time, they might think their hair is hot stuff!  

The thing is, when my husband goes for a haircut he always looks good (he has beautiful hair). Even with two weeks notice his hair would be on point, particularly for his wedding day.

Jake just probably got unlucky and the person took too much off. Some men look great bald or with a shaved head but Jake's face needs hair.

Ryan is probably going for some sort of cool hipster vibe (and failing) to make his straight laced personality more interesting.

 

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I have been disappointed in this season's iteration of the show and remember why I stopped watching for a couple of seasons. There used to be more substantive conversations about basic life details of things like budget and chore distribution, etc. that happen in traditional relationships. The "experts" have always been a little questionable but, this season is the worst and they are barely providing any guidance. 

Production's involvement in storylines and edits also used to be less obvious. They seem ham-fisted this year and I will give them a little tiny pass because we have all seen more of this stuff and it requires the behind the scenes to be much more talented than when reality tv was newer. 

Based on the cast, it appears the process to be on the show is more of a barometer of whether a person wants what they think they want in a partner more than whether a specific couple can make it work. So much of what is shown makes it seem like these people are just delusional about themselves and their needs more than they are having problems picking a suitable partner in their given city.

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On 4/24/2021 at 6:11 PM, Hangin Out said:

Does anyone remember what episode Jake had them all over to his house?

yes I remember they saw his house and saw his basement. They sat on the beach he made in his backyard. I know they had stuff to drink. I don't know who made it or who brought it.  And they were pretty amazed at what he had created in his backyard. There was something about the corgis. I don't remember who had never seen Corgis before, may be Bri.  

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