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S06.E08: The Door

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Airdate 2021.04.11

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A reunion with an old friend helps pull John Dorie out of his darkest moment yet. Back at Lawton, Virginia demands answers.

 

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That horrid kid shot John Dorie! 

Does anyone know here if the actor that plays Dorie has been casted to play on another show?

I unfortunately missed the first 15 or so minutes of tonight's episode. If I don't get too sleepy, I may try to sit up later to re-watch it.

Dorie is my favorite character - though I admit I was perturbed that the guy drove off and left June at the end of the last season. That doesn't mean I wanted him to get shot.  I hope they're not writing the Dorie character off the show.

Edit. Well, OK, I guess the actor got a part on another show or what not, seeing as how they turned him into a Zombie. 

He was my favorite character... one of the few reasons I enjoyed watching this show.

I hope June shoots that brat kid for this.

Edited by DrNowsWeightScale
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23 minutes ago, nodorothyparker said:

He's apparently been wanting to leave the show for awhile.

So yeah, this seems as good a place as any to get off with this particular show. Much of what remains is just insufferable.

 

Hmm. I read that article; thank you for that link. I wonder how honest he was being in stating his reasons for wanting to leave the show - his stated reasons seemed a bit vague.

The season they had the beer bottle shaped hot air balloon was an awful one (was that S5?), but I think the show's quality has rebounded since then, if that was his true concern. 

Dorie was one of the few things I liked about that show. I don't know if I'll still watch this one going forward - maybe watch long enough to see how the June character deals with the grieving process, and if she forgives the brat who shot Dorie or what. 

I've been getting bored with The Walking Dead franchise overall (regardless of which show, whether this one or the original one, or that other spin off) for the past year or two.

Edit: The actor who plays John Dorie is supposed to be on "Talking Dead" later tonight.

If I'm still up at that time, I will probably watch it.

Maybe he will explain to host Chris Hardwick more on that show why he wanted off "Fear The Walking Dead."

It makes me so sad his character is gone now. It was one of a few bright spots in my TV viewing. 

Edited by DrNowsWeightScale
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That kid is whack! She needs to be killed real good. 

John and June were my fave part of this show. Boo!!! 

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I'm going to miss Dorie. Best thing about this series. But that was some great writing. There was utter shock at Dorie being shot, but you wondered if Morgan made it maybe Dorie would too. I thought of Skyfall as he fell to the bottom of the lake and I had that burst of optimism as he swam up. I still felt hope when I heard him wheeze on the bank, but then the growl.

Satan's spawn has some real acting chops. She nailed being victim and villain all in one terrifying transformation. Morgan can only quietly accept the realization of what she has done. She knifed the first dude, shot his best friend and boldly tells him what he has to accept because she is the key. I wonder whose going to make her look at the flowers?

A well done episode.

 

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I haven't watched but I read spoilers.  Sorry, show, I'm done with you.  

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I finally felt some emotional pull which has been lacking for many years throughout this franchise. I am sorry he is no longer on the show, but I get it, all actors eventually want to move on, so I will continue to watch. These shows are winding down anyway, so all the characters will be gone from our minds soon enough.

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10 hours ago, nodorothyparker said:

He's apparently been wanting to leave the show for awhile.

So yeah, this seems as good a place as any to get off with this particular show. Much of what remains is just insufferable.

I don't know why he truly left the show, but I will miss him.  He was my favorite character.  We may never know why he left.  I don't care what the situation was, there isn't any upside in trashing a former employer or working environment.  That can affect future opportunities.  That is why it is always a good idea for a person exiting their job to keep their pie hole shut.  I have a great deal of respect for his character and as an actor.  The actor is a pure class act.  If he was happy with the gig, I don't think he would want to leave.

As for the episode itself, I guess Dakota is too stupid to understand that she is basically her sister.  Just a younger version.

 

Edited by icemiser69
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15 minutes ago, icemiser69 said:

We may never know why he left.

 

Actually, I think the article was pretty clear as to why he left. #1 he remarked that he was "not a kid anymore", that clearly indicates he's less interested in such physically demanding work. #2 he remarked he was feeling antsy in the role, that clearly indicates he felt his creativity was not getting the type of workout it needs to stay fresh and vital. He was not willing to just keep getting that steady paycheck (unlike Melissa McCarthy and Norman Reedus or Lennie James).

So basically, he was bored and feeling physically worn out. Good for him for valuing his creativity and physical well being over this show.

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I posted a story in the Media thread that made it sound like it was very much a show-dictated decision, yet at the same time repeated his quote about not being a spring chicken and having other stuff he wanted to do. So who knows? I'm getting the sense that both ends knew he was brought in to reboot the series and wasn't likely to be a longtimer. I just know the show is going to be all the poorer for it as Dillahunt/John brought a wry gravitas to even some of the sillier plotting,

As far as the episode itself, making the shitty teenager Morgan's rescuer should be the death knell for the popular theory that Madison is somehow still out there and is the one who saved him. The show already has a tedious teenage girl who killed a main group member that everyone was supposed to just get over. They don't need another one.

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1 hour ago, diebartdie said:

he remarked he was feeling antsy in the role, that clearly indicates he felt his creativity was not getting the type of workout it needs to stay fresh and vital. He was not willing to just keep getting that steady paycheck

I think this is the main thing. Isn't this the longest that Dillahunt has worked on any one project? He just seems like one of those actors who values quality over quantity and likes to take on a lot of different challenges. 

Still, I loved John and will miss him a lot.

 

1 hour ago, nodorothyparker said:

As far as the episode itself, making the shitty teenager Morgan's rescuer should be the death knell for the popular theory that Madison is somehow still out there and is the one who saved him. 

I'm one of those. While Dakota (whom I never trusted) was reciting that note and convincing Morgan she rescued him, she was simultaneously convincing me that it wasn't Madison who did it. I think I was more disappointed then Morgan lol.

Still, that doesn't mean Madison is not still out there. Yes, I'm dying hard.

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1 hour ago, diebartdie said:

Actually, I think the article was pretty clear as to why he left. #1 he remarked that he was "not a kid anymore", that clearly indicates he's less interested in such physically demanding work. #2 he remarked he was feeling antsy in the role, that clearly indicates he felt his creativity was not getting the type of workout it needs to stay fresh and vital. He was not willing to just keep getting that steady paycheck (unlike Melissa McCarthy and Norman Reedus or Lennie James).

So basically, he was bored and feeling physically worn out. Good for him for valuing his creativity and physical well being over this show.

I think it is more complicated than that, just my opinion, nothing more than that.  When people leave jobs, in general there is more to it than the reason or reasons given.  I have known people who have hated their jobs, and when they were asked by the new job interviewer why they left their previous job, they were smart enough not to say that they hated where they were working.

1 hour ago, nodorothyparker said:

As far as the episode itself, making the shitty teenager Morgan's rescuer should be the death knell for the popular theory that Madison is somehow still out there and is the one who saved him. The show already has a tedious teenage girl who killed a main group member that everyone was supposed to just get over. They don't need another one.

I am doing the Snoopy Happy Dance now that that theory has been put to rest.

 

Edited by icemiser69
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9 minutes ago, Starchild said:

Still, that doesn't mean Madison is not still out there. Yes, I'm dying hard.

Probably off somewhere taking acting lessons.  The first time around she couldn't act her way out of a paper bag.

I hope June "takes care of" Dakota right away.

I thought the interaction in the cabin between June and Ginny was a bit strange.  It looked like June had some control over Ginny when she kept telling her that she wanted more people searching for John, and yet when Ginny was talking to Morgan, Ginny sounded like she was in total control.

Edited by icemiser69
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The dynamic between them seemed to shift into something a little closer to equals when June saved her life by chopping off her hand. 

John turned June from a runner into someone who takes a stand. I hope losing him hardens her into a fighter. Although first she's probably going to feel some guilt about not running away with him. If she had he'd probably still be alive.

Dakota needs to pay. It already bugs me that Alicia didn't banish Charlie for killing her brother. But fine, she was just a little kid so Alicia took the high road. Dakota is old enough to face the consequences of her actions, as well as being substantially more ruthless than Charlie was. Morgan, as pragmatic as he is now, must know he can't bring someone like that back to his new home.

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So John abandoned June, and then was about to off himself?  Given his character development, I just don't see him leaving her.  Seems like another out of nowhere plot point by the writers to move the story along.

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12 hours ago, Iguessnot said:

I wonder whose going to make her look at the flowers?

I hope it's Carol!  

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John Dorie was my favorite character here and I liked the love between him and June. I think at this point I like this show better than the parent show so I am now looking forward to both Virginia and Dakota getting killed. 

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John Dorie was my favorite across all things WD including Glen. Dakota (as far as I'm concerned) is the Negan of FTWD. They can't fix this. They live in a lawless society and her sister is the leader. So she killed a guy? No one would have done a damn thing about it so what was the point of killing of John that way? No one cared about the guy who died except John. John dying was sad but I could have gotten past it had they killed him some other way.  It was pointless.

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Ugh, never liked or trusted Dakota.  Frigging psycho.  Unfortunately if she dies, because she's a kid on this show, it won't be painful or drawn out.

I did like John - I like most of the characters on this one - but I don't feel terribly sad because we saw so little of him previously.  With the cast spread out and not being in each episode, it's harder for me to feel much for them.  GD is a good actor so he sold Dorie's sadness and feelings of loss which did make it more poignant that when he decided he wanted to live after all, it was too late.

I did like the zombies under the truck's wheel though I think we've seen something similar.  This show does a better job with the zombies than the mother ship does.

Ginny knows Dakota is a psycho and has been covering for her, that's what made her be the way she is, etc etc.   I've always liked Morgan but have would loved him 1000% if he had whacked Dakota.  I bet the show wants Ginny to do it.

Props to the show for killing a loved character.  That's the second surprise it's managed for me, the first being Nick getting killed.

Aw, John.  OK, I'm a little sad.  Why didn't you stay with June?  You loved each other, you could have talked it out. 

*tiny sniff*

ETA: nice of the show to feature John in the opening title card.  *sniffs again*

 

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11 hours ago, diebartdie said:

Actually, I think the article was pretty clear as to why he left. #1 he remarked that he was "not a kid anymore", that clearly indicates he's less interested in such physically demanding work. #2 he remarked he was feeling antsy in the role, that clearly indicates he felt his creativity was not getting the type of workout it needs to stay fresh and vital. He was not willing to just keep getting that steady paycheck (unlike Melissa McCarthy and Norman Reedus or Lennie James).

So basically, he was bored and feeling physically worn out. Good for him for valuing his creativity and physical well being over this show.

Did you mean Melissa McBride? She plays Carol. 😄

I read his comments, but to me, they were sort of vague-ish, or not very forth-right, as though he's dancing around the subject because he doesn't want to come right out and say why he would want off their show.

I did read in other articles that it was a mutual thing - it was a show choice, the writers thought it would make the show better moving forward, yet other articles said the actor was saddened and surprised but deferred to the show writer's choices, etc.

This is from the site "Comic book TV"-

Quote

Dillahunt went on to explain Dorie's death was part personal request to move on, part creative story decision.

I think that the Dorie character is one of the best characters not just in the Walking Dead franchise, but in any recent movie or TV franchise over-all.

While the Dorie character was on the show, they (as I remarked on previous threads months ago) either ignored him - there were times in some seasons when he was not on the show for 3 to 4 episodes in a row!! -
Or, he'd be on the show, but his character was a "background prop," like a chair or table.

He'd just be standing around in the background as other characters in the foreground did all the talking and action.

The show didn't give Dorie much to do, very little character arc stuff, other than the one season when he and June kept saying to each other how guilty they felt that they found true love in the apocalypse while everyone else was miserable. That really was a lame storyline. 

I did not fully see Dorie's death coming, but... honestly, I have felt something wonky and very weird was going on with his character for a long time now, so I did wonder what was up.

He spent much of season 4 frantically tracking June to find her.

So I found it very, very odd and out of character when at the end of last season he just suddenly peeled off in his car and left her to go by the cabin by himself.

That part seemed horribly out of character for him, as did the suicidal ideation.

There were other little tid bits like that in the last season or two with the John Dorie character that seemed weird and "off" to me.

When I saw a news headline months ago that the actor was going to be in a zombie movie this summer, plus the odd behavior of his character on "Fear," I did briefly wonder if the actor was wanting off the "Fear" show, and the show was laying ground work to kill him off.

But then I dismissed that and thought, "Nah, surely not!"

That character was one of the best things about that show, and they totally wasted his character, other than the wonderful "Laura" episode. That character deserved better storylines and more screen time. 

I really wish the show had left his fate murky, like they did with the Maggie Greene character on the original show (in real life, that actress wanted off to be on another show, they wrote her off TWD - but not by killing off her character!!, she left, but then later came back because the other show tanked in the ratings and was pulled).

That way, if the actor wanted back on, even briefly in the future, it would be do-able.

But they flat out turned Dorie all the way zombie, and unless they plan on telling us that was all a bad dream of June's, he cannot come back to the show again. 

I really think they short-changed a wonderful character, not just by killing him off, but by under-utilizing him in the past, or usually giving him really dippy, asinine storylines. 😟

Edited by DrNowsWeightScale
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9 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

...I hope June "takes care of" Dakota right away.

I could turn out to be totally wrong about this, of course, but my feeling is they want to set up some kind of redemption arc for Dakota, or do a "forgiveness" arc, via June.

What I mean is, before Dakota shot John on the overpass/bridge, John saw she was a messed up kid, very distorted sense of morality, and he was wanting to stick around and mentor her, so she wouldn't turn into a bad person. 

That signaled to me that whether it's June or Morgan or whomever, that the show may be planning on having one or more storylines where John's wife, June, and his friends learn to forgive the little weasel for having shot and killed John. They may try to turn the kid around to be a better person.

I'm predicting something like that will happen, but as I said, I could be completely wrong. 

John wanted to help the kid, so I wouldn't be surprised to see the show write June, Morgan, etc, in such a way that they try to achieve John's final wishes of helping redeem the kid, even if they are doing it un-knowingly, since they weren't on the bridge to hear the conversation between the two.

As Dorie was my favorite character, I am all for little Dakota being zombie chow now. 😠

Edited by DrNowsWeightScale
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Here's a question: since Dakota is such a sociopathic little shit willing to kill to get her way, why doesn't she just kill her sister, instead of trying to convince someone else to do it for her? 

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Well, I'm out.

Clicked out of AMC as soon as he went into the water.

Only tuned back in because I saw on a YouTube channel that there was more that came after.

I'm done.
 

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15 hours ago, DrNowsWeightScale said:

I could turn out to be totally wrong about this, of course, but my feeling is they want to set up some kind of redemption arc for Dakota, or do a "forgiveness" arc, via June.

What I mean is, before Dakota shot John on the overpass/bridge, John saw she was a messed up kid, very distorted sense of morality, and he was wanting to stick around and mentor her, so she wouldn't turn into a bad person. 

That signaled to me that whether it's June or Morgan or whomever, that the show may be planning on having one or more storylines where John's wife, June, and his friends learn to forgive the little weasel for having shot and killed John. They may try to turn the kid around to be a better person.

I'm predicting something like that will happen, but as I said, I could be completely wrong. 

John wanted to help the kid, so I wouldn't be surprised to see the show write June, Morgan, etc, in such a way that they try to achieve John's final wishes of helping redeem the kid, even if they are doing it un-knowingly, since they weren't on the bridge to hear the conversation between the two.

As Dorie was my favorite character, I am all for little Dakota being zombie chow now. 😠

I hope not. John was willing to mentor her, but he was also trying to negotiate for his life. While it's possible to come to terms with the first murder, she killed Dorie when he offered her a way out. She would have killed Morgan if his hands weren't so swift.  They need to smile in her face while using her as a bargaining chip, then dispose of her. We'll have to see whose up for the job--besides Daniel of course.

 

 

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On 4/12/2021 at 8:54 AM, nodorothyparker said:

I posted a story in the Media thread that made it sound like it was very much a show-dictated decision, yet at the same time repeated his quote about not being a spring chicken and having other stuff he wanted to do. So who knows?

Part of both, maybe?  I haven’t watched FTWD in years - but it’s under the same umbrella as the rest of the TWD franchise, and it sounds for all the world like Production Dale’d him:

  1. The actor portraying a relatively popular character in the series wants to walk.
  2. Not wanting to lose the character, TPTB try to talk the actor out of it.
  3. Actor says “Tell you what; I won’t walk immediately, but you better come up with an exit strategy PDQ or I will.”
  4. Pissed off at the actor’s obstinance, Production kills off the actor in such a way as to permanently eliminate any possibility of the character’s return.

Jeffrey DeMunn (Dale Horvath) got the same treatment when he wanted to leave TWD after TPTB fired his friend Frank Darabont.  Production fought like everything to keep DeMunn on the show, but DeMunn made it clear he was leaving regardless - at which point his character (who according to the graphic novel canon should have survived until at least S5) was killed off in S2 in such a way as to absolutely obliterate any chance of the character’s (or the actor’s) return.

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2 hours ago, Iguessnot said:

I hope not. John was willing to mentor her, but he was also trying to negotiate for his life. While it's possible to come to terms with the first murder, she killed Dorie when he offered her a way out. She would have killed Morgan if his hands weren't so swift.  They need to smile in her face while using her as a bargaining chip, then dispose of her. We'll have to see whose up for the job--besides Daniel of course.

 

 

I'm wondering if maybe the show is setting up the Dakota character to be a sociopath, mentally unstable (if they're not going for a redemption plot).

On the original TWD show, Carol had to tell that one kid to "look at the flowers" before shooting her... Carol ascertained that the kid was not safe to have around, because she was out of touch with reality and was a danger to those around her. 

Could be the same situation with Dakota?

But we did already have a forgiveness plot earlier on "Fear," where Alicia chose to forgive Charlie for shooting her brother. I don't know if the show wants to repeat that or not.

I'm so sad that John Dorie is gone. They could've done so much more with that character. 

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So we were teased with John wanting to commit suicide only to be interrupted by walkers walked off the river. And then this little shit shot him? And let me guess, Dakota will be a regular in Morgan's group just like Charlie did after killing Nick. John-June romance is the greatest love story in the whole franchise followed closely by Maggie-Glenn.

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On 4/17/2021 at 1:47 PM, TV Anonymous said:

So we were teased with John wanting to commit suicide only to be interrupted by walkers walked off the river. And then this little shit shot him? And let me guess, Dakota will be a regular in Morgan's group just like Charlie did after killing Nick. John-June romance is the greatest love story in the whole franchise followed closely by Maggie-Glenn.

I'm a John Dorie fan girl, so I miss him.
I definitely think the show mis-used his character (usually putting him in really ridiculous story lines), when they weren't entirely ignoring him altogether (back in season 5, his character was entirely absent for about three or four entire episodes in a row. )

Whether the actor wanted off, or the show writers wrote him off, it's not good for the show, IMO. 

I think John's turn to suicidal ideation was a bit out of character.
Well, when he was introduced to the show at first, we learn that he was driven to seclusion in that cabin after he felt guilty about shooting and killing a robber, but...
Overall, he seemed to be an optimistic and positive character, traits that are sorely lacking on all the Walking Dead shows.

Yes, I know it's the Zombie Apocalypse, so things are not going to be sunshine and lollipops 24 hours a day all the time, but, seldom do any of the characters on these shows display any attempts at hope, no joking, no levity. As a viewer, it's rather difficult to believe that nobody would ever seek to lighten the mood by cracking jokes once in a while, etc.

Dorie was a unique character.
Occasionally the Strand character can be interesting or original, but I felt that Dorie was the only really original one.
The rest seem so flat or card-board cut-out. 

I agree with the TV critic at Forbes who wrote a review of the latest Fear episode last night that Fear has too many characters in their ensemble now, and out of the remaining 1 billion characters they have left (now that John Dorie is gone), there are no character worth caring about.

None of the other characters stand out or are completely compelling
(though I do think most of the actors are doing a phenomenal job of acting on the show - the show writers are not giving them great story lines).

They had some interesting possibilities for the June character after John died, but I'm afraid they've squandered that already! 

Edit. It will be interesting to see what the show writers do with Dakota in the future. I'm still wondering if they're going to pull a Charlie repeat here and have Dakota become a reformed person, etc. I currently cannot stand her for having shot John for no good reason, the little jerk.

(But the actress does to a wonderful job of acting, IMO.)

Edited by DrNowsWeightScale

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