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S12.E14: I Expected a Little Better

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This writing a letter to your younger self experiment was a waste of the couples' time.  Clara wrote a long detailed emotional essay to herself, Ryan wrote a few sentences. But, at least he told his younger self he loved him! He can say it to at least one person....

I forgot what Haley and Jake wrote to themselves, because suddenly the conversation became all about a bracelet from the wedding day. On top of all their other issues, Jake has been waiting to see her wear or at least have the bracelet. And she's been wondering why he won't wear tennis shoes. At this point, I will just be glad for Decision Day so these two can go their separate ways.

Actually, I'll just be glad for Decision Day just so we can get this season over with. I hope Brianna and Vincent stay together, but as for the rest of them, it's a toss up.

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3 hours ago, Racj82 said:

All the complaining of Chris being on the show and them taking up too much camera time. 

What else was there to this show? This season anyway.

A bunch of boring ass couples with the same problems.  No resolutions. 

It could be fun or interesting in parts but woo boy.

Reality shows need shorter seasons. Most of them cannot sustain these long seasons.

 In no way did Chris make this show more enjoyable or more interesting. He's a slime ball. I don't like slime balls.

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8 hours ago, MyTwoCents said:

Amen!! Everything you said! I, too, would be miserable with him.

Also, Jake is 38? He should know better than to dress like that for a company function at a golf course. I’m surprised they let him on the course with a collarless shirt and cutoff blue jean shorts! 
Haley is younger and way more professional! If I were her, I’d die of embarrassment to take him to any work function.

Absolutely agree.  And he doesn't like her any more than she likes him.

8 hours ago, Devvie said:

What an ignorant and insulting thing to say. Those are not badges for learning how to tie a knot!  Erik shows way more interest in her high school sports than she did about his flying combat missions.  I loved that she said "I had to learn to be an adult very quickly" when she is the most immature woman on the show!  The first segment she cries because Erik isn't calling her family.  In the second segment she talks about how dysfunctional her family was and that she didn't speak to her dad for a long time. Even her friend thinks she's an idiot. I think her sober, pretty, put together friend should steal him.

Haley. Haley. Haley. He's right. She hurt him. He finally opens up and she gets defensive. Wow. That was hard to watch but major points to Jake. Shame on you, Haley. 

 

 

 

 I don't agree. I don't like Jake and I think she's kind of repulsed by him.  I find him repulsive myself.

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8 hours ago, LennieBriscoe said:

Oh, he's determined to show America just who Haley really is and has been: Uninvested from the git-go. Scornful. Insulting (a wedding gift of a $20 HAT?!). Indifferent. And above all, FAKE.

 I don't agree. I find Hailey is repulsed by him. I think I'd be repulsed by him.

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8 hours ago, gonecrackers said:

I'm glad Pepper pointed out that Jake has feelings, & that Haley lacks empathy. Yeah they never belonged together, but this has been a damaging experience for Jake in particular. She shut down & doesn't care at all about his feelings. He's still a human being.

 I think it all stems from the fact that she isn't attracted to him & doesn't like him. And I think she's upset that she slept with him on their honeymoon. She did it because she felt she should ...that's what she said. And she has regretted it, and it shows.

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8 hours ago, Silver Bells said:

If a guy goes to the trouble of picking out a gift, you better well appreciate it.  After that altercation, she gets that look on her face that he’s not even worth talking to and walks out in a huff.  She is a tough nut to crack, and mean.  Jake was just speaking his mind in a nice way that it hurt him, but of course she doesn’t want to hear the truth and walks out like a spoiled brat that she is.


 

 

  She went through the trouble of buying him the shirts and some other close camera why isn't he wearing them? I can see her point in how he dresses.  She is very stylish and I like the way she dresses. I would like some goofball who like the eighties and dresses with no style. That's not being superficial,  it's just an interest I have.

8 hours ago, gonecrackers said:

YES!!!

Her uppity, condescending attitude is immature & embarrassing for someone to be with or around.

👎👎👎👎👎

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7 hours ago, Silver Bells said:

The apple doesn’t fall far from the tree.  That Mother sounded like she spoiled the shit out of Haley.  Now she’ll probably throw the bracelet in Jakes face and make a big production out of it.  I’m afraid for him, lol.

Omg I don't agree!

9 hours ago, Airy2021 said:

I agree. People seem to really dislike Haley but Jake, to me, is super problematic. He has NO personality! None!! It’s soooooo frustrating. He’s one of the most boring guys to ever be on the show. 

YES!! I agree. 

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7 hours ago, DrewPaul2010 said:

Haley was pissed that Dr Pepper sided with Jake. I don't think it really matters at this point it would be like thinking rearranging the chairs on the Titanic is going to stop it from sinking.

Hang in there Jake you'll find lots of better woman.

 

 

Yup, you could see Haley's face fall when Dr. Pepper was critical of her showing no respect or care for Jake's feelings about the missing bracelet.

This was just a bad match and Jake will be fine with the right woman.

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9 hours ago, Spectator said:

I don’t blame Jake for being upset about the bracelet. For Haley to not even have it in her possession shows such a lack of appreciation. It was a thoughtful gift on an important day...even if it wasn’t her style, she should have at least made an effort to get it back and wear it once or twice. That’s the polite thing to do. Especially for someone who claims to be “trying so hard”.
 

When Jake brought it up she should have just owned it and apologized, but instead she got defensive and critical of Jake. She is straight out of Psych 101. She has an absolute inability to accept criticism, she feels compelled to fire back regardless of the strength of her argument and the bottom line is she simply has to win. Whether it’s at go carts, golf, the batting cages, even a simple argument...she needs to win. And as a result she loses sight of everything else. She got so wrapped up in the competition at the batting cages (so much so that she showed up early so she could practice by herself) that she completely lost sight of the real reason for the activity (to spend time together and have fun). And she completely missed the point that Jake was hurt by the fact that, based on her actions, it appeared that she didn’t care about his wedding gift, which he presumably further interpretEd as her not caring about the wedding, or about him. But she just wanted to point out whatever he did that she felt was on a par so she could one up him. 
 

She needs to take a minute to stop and listen to what people are saying to her rather than just turning every conversation into a battle that she must win. Learning that skill would be invaluable in her next relationship (since obviously this one is a dead end). 

Love this post.  In the beginning I like all of them.  Then their personalities come out.  Haley made mince meat out of Jake in every area.  The bracelet was the final straw.  It was a beautiful gesture on a wedding day.  She could have put it on right then and there for the ceremony.  Instead, she cast it aside like it was nothing.  She has no heart.  She proved it every step of the way.  I noticed Jake was still wearing his wedding ring .. she is not anymore.  The look of disgust on her face when with him says it all.  He didn’t deserve that.  Does any man she goes with have to change his whole persona to her liking?  Seems that way.  She is nothing special.   That look on her face when with him looks like her head will explode.  The look of indifference and hate.

 

 

 

Edited by Silver Bells
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3 hours ago, antfitz said:

 In no way did Chris make this show more enjoyable or more interesting. He's a slime ball. I don't like slime balls.

To you. 

Chris and Paige gave attention to the show and created discussions/interest that the rest of the show doesn't give this season.

It would be great if we got interesting adults with conflicts that weren't absurd. 

I don't even miss Chris and Paige from a overall perspective. 

But, remove them and we got endless debate over bracelets and clothes.  Riveting this is not. 

At least with the other drama, I was interested. 

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If I was Jake's wife and saw that picture of him wearing pom pom shorts, I would have been cracking up for a good 20 minutes and playfully tease him about it. Haley does not know how to be a good sport. I'm team Jake about the bracelet,  he spent a lot of money on it and she was being disrespectful about his gift from day one. 

I don't think Vincent fully understands how dangerous high blood pressure is , especially during pregnancy.  They may need to meet with a Cardiologist who can explain the dangers of living with high blood pressure. 

Haley and Erik would have been this season's villains, if Chris wasn't around. 

Edited by spunky
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8 hours ago, DrewPaul2010 said:

Haley was pissed that Dr Pepper sided with Jake. I don't think it really matters at this point it would be like thinking rearranging the chairs on the Titanic is going to stop it from sinking.

Hang in there Jake you'll find lots of better woman.

 

 

Hopefully one of her single girlfriends.

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39 minutes ago, spunky said:

I don't think Vincent fully understands how dangerous high blood pressure is , especially during pregnancy.  They may need to meet with a Cardiologist who can explain the dangers of living with high blood pressure.

THIS!!!100%  Also, I have read that African-American women have higher mortality rates with pregnancy. I think Briana is right to be concerned and a bit fearful. In a previous post someone mentioned that she could/should take BP meds and would be okay or something to that effect. For her to be so young, not overweight, and/or a smoker, and have high blood pressure ( likely a familial trait), I'm certain that she's already under a doctor's care and taking medication for her hypertension. I wish her well. 

Personally, I think she can do way better than Vincent. He's super insecure and pouty. If Briana decides against pregnancy, he won't be happy. He didn't seem to want to consider adoption, which is his right, of course. IVF and surrogacy are expensive, but that's an option if bio children are desired. 

I blame the experts for pairing a couple where one wants kids yesterday and another is fearful and leaning towards much later.

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If Jake is such a good catch with women out there just waiting and slobbering to get to know him, then why hasn't he found one?  Yet, at 38, as a last resort, he's on MAFS.   I'm thinking Haley isn't the only woman who finds him odd and just flat out repulsive.   He needs to get a fucking clue about himself instead of acting butt hurt when things don't go his way.   

I find Chris to be repulsive for various reasons,  but I'll be glad when I no longer have to see Jake and his steak and egg, onion eating, looking down his nose like he smells a fart (his), churlish, cave man looking muscle bound ass is no longer on my tv screen. 

*whew* That felt good.  

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Clara has the patience of a saint . I’m not buying that Ryan isn’t having sex with her because they don’t have a connection , especially since every episode he says how connected they are and how great they are together . The same way I didn’t believe that Colton from the bachelor was straight and it came out yesterday that he’s not . 
I mean , Ryan and Clara are married , seem happy other than with intimacy ...there’s really no logical reason for him to be holding back . 
 

I think Haley and Jake are both equally bad . Haley is condescending and picking the guy apart non stop , but Jake truly has no personality . He constantly closes his eyes and nods his head , never asks questions or continues conversation , and is just very dry . I am not team Haley or team Jake . I predict they will both be single for years to come . 

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CORRECTION:  I did not realize the woman talking with V was her SIL! Whoever said Virginia looks like she stepped out of a swamp . . . BRILLIANT.  The difference in these two women is like a Before and After! V says "I'm such a trust person" Now most people would end here with "I trust people until they give me a reason not to"  Not Ms. V!  She ends with "so, like, you have to trust ME".  Here's the intro on her from the Lifetime website (my emphasis):

Virginia (26) hasn’t had the best relationships in the past, but she’s much stronger as a person and has learned from each failed partnership. She’s at a point in her life where she can confidently say she is prepared for marriage. Admitting that she has a history of self-sabotaging relationships, Virginia is ready to overcome her fears and commit to love.

Here's what it should say:  Virginia (26) wants what she wants when she wants it.

 

Haley. Way to make yourself look even worse.  And, yep, "that Mother".  If my kid (who is 26) did something so hurtful I would not enable them because I am his mom not his friend.  Haley cannot simultaneously say she's trying to communicate with Jake and then not empathize. Not that Jake is without flaws - cuz he would drive me crazy. 

 

Note to Pastor Cal: Me thinks thou doth protest too much.  

 

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16 hours ago, gonecrackers said:

Why is Clara wearing a nightie on Unfiltered?

And you could tell she felt uncomfortable and knew it was too short the way she kept draping her hands, arms across her lap.  I saw her and thought:  girl forgot to put on her pants before the show. 

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Ryan and sex, Ryan and withholding  "I love you's" is all about controlling the relationship and calling every last shot. At least he's consistent about it – he also controlled the ceremony with that stupid blindfold nonsense. The weirdest part is his easygoing hipster persona, that guy is pretty tightly wound.

Am I the only person who finds it unintentionally hysterical that Jake and Haley would fight about an infinity bracelet for eternity? If only the whole thing wasn't so completely stupid and petty on everyone's part. But the arguing, it stretches into infinity, just like the bracelet!

Edited by Mrs. Button
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25 minutes ago, Devvie said:

Here's what it should say:  Virginia (26) wants what she wants when she wants it.

need to add: On the rocks.

I didn't see the whole show, but between what I did see and what I read, I did not miss much. Glad that Chris and Paige were not on. I wish they would also just skip anything with Horrible Haley and Jake, as well. They are also done and there is no reason to make them do those stupid activities, like the letter. Jake may not be everyone's cup of tea, but he is a man who did want to find love on this show. He went in for the right reasons. She did it to have a date since all her friends were married. She is so cold and unfeeling, even if she didn't like him and there was no chemistry, but it is just so hurtful to watch how she treats him. Even when Dr. Pepper gave her some feedback, and Haley even said that when she isn't comfortable, she shuts down; when she doesn't like something she shuts down. Her parents said that at the wedding; her friends told her that before the wedding - why the hell was she selected? Wasn't she labeled the picky bride? Haley knows that about herself, but doesn't apologize for it or try to improve. She is one of the many people this season who should not have been selected. I don't know how that happens, except for the asinine idea (per Pastor Cal) that it is just for Drama. I think that it was really sweet of Jake to present his new wife with a nice piece of jewelry, showing his hope for an eternity together. Wasted on her. She deserves nothing. If you don't like your match, there are mature ways to handle it.

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2 hours ago, spunky said:

If I was Jake's wife and saw that picture of him wearing pom pom shorts, I would have been cracking up for a good 20 minutes and playfully tease him about it. Haley does not know how to be a good sport. I'm team Jake about the bracelet,  he spent a lot of money on it and she was being disrespectful about his gift from day one. 

 

I think Jake wore those shorts as a joke, knowing it would be funny and ok.  My husband is a joker and it’s totally something he would do, had he thought it would be ok. I mean, he once had a t shirt printed with a big picture of his boss’s face and wore it to a meeting.  It was a big hit. 
I too would have been cracking up.  Haley was just disgusted.  I don’t see a problem with jeans and dress shoes though. 
I’m also team Jake on the bracelet thing.  It’s just rude of her. She sent it home with her mom?  Maybe I’m old, but a nice gift given by a spouse on a wedding day deserves to be treated as special. 
I also agree with the poster who said that a house trained dog who suddenly wakes you up in the middle of the night, then has another accident probably should be seen by the vet.  
VAs comment equating his combat ribbons to Boy Scouts...what an idiot.  Not cute at all.  But Erik can miss me with his comments about he knows what a marriage should be like.  He’s way too rigid.  He would drive me nuts.  

Edited by Meowwww · Reason: Too many commas
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15 hours ago, Crashcourse said:
5 hours ago, Mean Jeanne said:

These people are boring the hell out of me tonight.

And speaking of boring, enough already with the Haley hate. She got stuck with a guy she finds repulsive, and she’s been a lot nicer than a lot of people would be, myself included. I wouldn’t want to be with him either. It’s called chemistry people, it’s either there or it’s not.

Disagree.  Jake wasn't "repulsive" enough to keep Haley from sleeping with him in Vegas.  And regardless of why she doesn't care for him or find him attractive,  she should be a fucking adult about it.  Quit tearing apart his fondness for the 80s or the clothing and accessories he likes to wear.  Jake has given her several opportunities to just be up front with him and admit it's not there and never will be but she won't own up.  I suspect she doesn't want to be the "bad guy" but her words and actions are showing her to be just that. 

The problem isn't that they are different people -- the problem is that Haley decided almost immediately that Jake was not what she expected and wanted and that's the end of it.  That attitude could explain why she's been single for 7 years (and not by choice, according to her) and why she needed the MAFS "experts" to find her a match.  She comes off high maintenance, prissy, judgmental and completely unmoving.  In other words, a diva, to quote Jake. 

Ryan seems like a nice guy but he needs to be pinned down to exactly why he's not interested in having sex with Clara and if he ever will be.  If everything is great and their marriage is a 10, then why not?  I understand not wanting to be intimate on the wedding night and waiting past the honeymoon but they are 7 weeks in, with Decision Day looming.  

Eric and Virginia are a lost cause.  She needs therapy for everything in her life up to this point.  Eric is no prize but I don't think he signed up to be a babysitter or a designed driver.  Virginia may be 26 but she acts 14.  Eric's SIL sees the writing on the wall.  This match is doomed.  Abandon mission, Eric.

I like Brianna but I'm not sure about Vincent.  Do they really need an "expert" to discuss that Brianna wants Vincent to wake earlier than he usually does?  Seriously?  It worries me that when they were talking about children and Dr. Pepper asked about adopting, should pregnancy put Brianna at risk that Vincent did not immediately say Brianna's safety came first, period.  No, he looked concerned and then said he would have to think about that because he had never considered adoption.  What?  You shouldn't have to think on that at all.  Your wife should be so important to you that her safety is more important than biological children.    And yet another event where Vincent is going to pitch a tantrum because he's uncomfortable doing something he's never done before?  Seriously?  I think Brianna deserves better than this moody downer.

Just go ahead and bring on Decision Day, show.  I think Brianna and Vincent will choose to stay together.  I'm leaning towards Clara and Ryan choosing to stay together, although I don't think it will last.  I'm on the fence with Eric and Virginia.  I think Eric wants to fight for it since he's been divorced but Virginia may realize that she wants to party more than being married to a father figure.  Jake and Haley are so obviously done.  I hope Jake lays it on all the table.  I don't understand why MAFS is even bringing Paige and Chris back on D-Day since they've been done.    

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2 hours ago, spunky said:

If I was Jake's wife and saw that picture of him wearing pom pom shorts, I would have been cracking up for a good 20 minutes and playfully tease him about it. Haley does not know how to be a good sport. I'm team Jake about the bracelet,  he spent a lot of money on it and she was being disrespectful about his gift from day one. 

Last night I was comparing them and the good sport thing to Steph and AJ from Philly. S+AJ are competitive, but it's all in fun and they support each others' victories. Haley is just a really bad sport, so no wonder that Jake was throwing it back at her with the mini golf and strictly counting strokes,

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So, it finally hit me-Chris thought Paige was below his standards and Haley thought Jake was below her standards, so....they should have been matched to each other!

For whatever reason, I really grew to dislike Haley this episode.  It probably started when she told us that she went to the batting cages early to practice, then ridiculed Jake because she had more hits than he did while wearing "dress" shoes.  Then her attitude while losing at putt-putt being all "well, you should win something..." as if she was intentionally letting him win.  She sees this whole relationship as a competition.  And, once again, when someone else dare criticize her instead of agreeing with her criticisms of Jake, she gets frustrated and shuts down.  She totally expects every single person to agree with her and when told she needs to change she just can't process it.  By no means do I think Jake is blameless in this horrible match, but I think he has made some effort and he hasn't criticized/ridiculed every single thing about Haley.

I just couldn't believe that Virginia demeaned Erik's military ribbons so casually.  Well, she may not respect the military but that doesn't mean she should make a direction relationship between the military ribbons and Boy Scout merit badges.  I was a girl scout, but even back then I would have known that there was a huge difference in the ribbons/badges (although I did love earning new badges...).  I was very disappointed that Pepper did not bring up Virginia's drinking as I think that impacts a lot of their arguments and why Erik tries to be controlling.  Virginia flat out refused to not drink when they were having discussions/arguments and that was what Pepper told Erik to bring up to Virginia, so Pepper needs to get on board and start addressing some of Virginia's drinking issues (Erik doesn't have to be there, she could address it one-on-one).  And boo-hoo that her parents weren't there for her senior night basketball game.  A lot of us were unable to have our parents at important school events and we have moved on.

Oh, and it was rich of Pastor Cal on unfiltered to say that declaring the marriage over because Virginia didn't want to have children was "ridiculous" (and with scorn in his tone) when that is one of the BIGGEST deal-breakers in real life.  

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2 hours ago, Jax7917 said:

Jake truly has no personality . He constantly closes his eyes and nods his head , never asks questions or continues conversation

If you watch Unfiltered you would see this is not true. He is very well spoken and funny. That photo was hilarious! Is he an extrovert? No! He works in IT and is a self-described computer nerd! That doesn't mean he has no personality! I think the closing his eyes and nodding is because he is exhausted having to deal with Haley and he's just over it. Frankly, they both bring out the worst in each other.

 

1 hour ago, psychoticstate said:

I did note that when the issue of Jake's footwear was brought up and how terrible it is that Jake has the audacity to not wear tennis shoes, Haley was looking at Dr. Pepper like "See?  This ranks right up there with chopping up people with an axe!  You have paired me up with Ted Bundy!"  

Just imagine her reaction if she had been paired with Bennett last season! She would have had a stroke over the yellow sleep dress, and probably every other thing he wore......

1 hour ago, psychoticstate said:

I also noted that Haley was gleeful over the fact that she hit the ball 8 times out of 10 in the batting cage versus Jake's twice out of 20.  She really rubbed that in his face -- but most certainly did not like it when he beat her at putt-putt, although he didn't appear to be rubbing it in her face.

So she's a sore winner AND a sore loser. Fun!

1 hour ago, Devvie said:

Haley. Way to make yourself look even worse.  And, yep, "that Mother". 

Yes, and telling her she looks really pretty. I think we know why Haley thinks she's better than Jake........

48 minutes ago, psychoticstate said:

Ryan seems like a nice guy but he needs to be pinned down to exactly why he's not interested in having sex with Clara and if he ever will be. 

100%. Pastor Cal just nodding to whatever Clara was spouting about how wonderful her and Ryan's relationship is, and Pepper not forcing the issue. I don't get it. These two are playing a good game here, but it's not going to last long term even if they say yes on D-Day.

57 minutes ago, Meowwww said:

VAs comment equating his combat ribbons to Boy Scouts...what an idiot.  

Erik handled that better than I think any of the military men in my life would. I died when she said that. That was straight up offensive, but she is clearly ignorant.

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2 hours ago, Crashcourse said:

If Jake is such a good catch with women out there just waiting and slobbering to get to know him, then why hasn't he found one?  Yet, at 38, as a last resort, he's on MAFS.   I'm thinking Haley isn't the only woman who finds him odd and just flat out repulsive.   He needs to get a fucking clue about himself instead of acting butt hurt when things don't go his way.   

I find Chris to be repulsive for various reasons,  but I'll be glad when I no longer have to see Jake and his steak and egg, onion eating, looking down his nose like he smells a fart (his), churlish, cave man looking muscle bound ass is no longer on my tv screen. 

*whew* That felt good.  

If Haley is such a catch, why is she on this show?  Why didn’t some nice good looking intelligent man not snap her up and marry her.  Jake is a quiet guy that loves his house and is satisfied.  Haley likes to drink at bars and hang with her girlfriends . To each his own.  A quiet guy is better than a big mouth blowhard braggart like Chris.  I’ll bet she found fault with every date she’s had so far, so resorted to the experts.  Getting married was a bad idea.  She should have went to a Matchmaker and saw the person first.  Amen.

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2 hours ago, psychoticstate said:

And regardless of why she doesn't care for him or find him attractive,  she should be a fucking adult about it.  Quit tearing apart his fondness for the 80s or the clothing and accessories he likes to wear.  Jake has given her several opportunities to just be up front with him and admit it's not there and never will be but she won't own up.  I suspect she doesn't want to be the "bad guy" but her words and actions are showing her to be just that. 

I didn't finish the episode (I got bored; most of these people are unlikable) but I agree with this. She looks MUCH worse than she would if she had just agreed with him from the get that she wasn't into him. It reminds me of Luke and Kate from Philly - Kate told Luke straight up that she didn't think she was doing it for him and she clearly wasn't, and he insisted that he was into her yet treated her like shit. Chris has done similar things with his "I'm becoming spiritually attracted to you" nonsense. Just say "I'm not into you. Take care and good luck" and keep it moving.

Instead, Haley tries to prove that she has reason not to be into him, really derisively - she mocks everything he does, and she tells her friends and the experts "See? He wears ugly shirts!" (And her friends and the experts are like "... And?" which cracks me up.) And she still insists that they can salvage this to not look like the bad guy on TV, I suspect, and if she would just be a grown woman about it and say, "you know what, you're right for someone, it's just not me," she'd come off as much better. She's nasty.

People here keep saying they find him repulsive. I don't agree, but whatever - but if someone you found repulsive gave you an out, wouldn't you take it? (Which is why Philly Kate should have been out when Luke told her he was "repulsed and dead inside" after they had sex the first time. At BEST, you get to "I'm not repulsed by you anymore," which ... I mean, everyone deserves better than that.) We know it's possible to end the marriage early because there's a precedent set by now, in this show's 12th season. If Haley is so repulsed by Jake, she should just tell him a version of that and cut it loose. Or Jake should say "You're not particularly nice, no thank you" and cut it loose.

Edited by Empress1
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3 hours ago, ECM1231 said:

THIS!!!100%  Also, I have read that African-American women have higher mortality rates with pregnancy. I think Briana is right to be concerned and a bit fearful. In a previous post someone mentioned that she could/should take BP meds and would be okay or something to that effect. For her to be so young, not overweight, and/or a smoker, and have high blood pressure ( likely a familial trait), I'm certain that she's already under a doctor's care and taking medication for her hypertension. I wish her well. 

Personally, I think she can do way better than Vincent. He's super insecure and pouty. If Briana decides against pregnancy, he won't be happy. He didn't seem to want to consider adoption, which is his right, of course. IVF and surrogacy are expensive, but that's an option if bio children are desired. 

I blame the experts for pairing a couple where one wants kids yesterday and another is fearful and leaning towards much later.

She said on unfiltered that her high BP was genetics on both sides. There are certain medications that her doctor can prescribe where she can safely get pregnant.  She said she wanted to wait 2-3 years,  which is reasonable.  I don't understand what his rush is. I'm sure he hasn't thought about the possibility of him being infertile. I agree she could do so much better,  but is probably settling for the potential of who he could be.

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13 hours ago, Spectator said:

I don’t blame Jake for being upset about the bracelet. For Haley to not even have it in her possession shows such a lack of appreciation. It was a thoughtful gift on an important day...even if it wasn’t her style, she should have at least made an effort to get it back and wear it once or twice. That’s the polite thing to do. Especially for someone who claims to be “trying so hard”.

Let's not forget that he was all over her about the bracelet on the honeymoon, only days into the marriage.  They even showed the clip of that in this episode.  That's a little early to be carping on a lack of appreciation, especially when she had a real explanation for not having it in her possession, which he just would not accept.  Once again even as early as the honeymoon this guy did nothing but create straw man arguments making her the bad guy and him the victim.  During the honeymoon she may have been sincere about the bracelet, but his reaction at that time would only have further alienated her from him.  Then yeah, I can understand why she wouldn't be so keen on getting it back to him.  Her attitude would have been, "Well, if he's just going to continue to read the absolute WORST into my intentions, why should I WANT to get it back?!" 

 

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1 hour ago, Meowwww said:

I think Jake wore those shorts as a joke, knowing it would be funny and ok.  My husband is a joker and it’s totally something he would do, had he thought it would be ok. I mean, he once had a t shirt printed with a big picture of his boss’s face and wore it to a meeting.  It was a big hit. 
I too would have been cracking up.  Haley was just disgusted.  I don’t see a problem with jeans and dress shoes though. 
I’m also team Jake on the bracelet thing.  It’s just rude of her. She sent it home with her mom?  Maybe I’m old, but a nice gift given by a spouse on a wedding day deserves to be treated as special. 
I also agree with the poster who said that a house trained dog who suddenly wakes you up in the middle of the night, then has another accident probably should be seen by the vet.  
VAs comment equating his combat ribbons to Boy Scouts...what an idiot.  Not cute at all.  But Erik can miss me with his comments about he knows what a marriage should be like.  He’s way too rigid.  He would drive me nuts.  

Maybe it's a cultural thing for me, but I was thought to appreciate any gift I was given.  The fact that she didn't even take it out of the box before the wedding says a lot. 

Erik is a controlling mess. He needs to stick to flying and controlling his dog. Neither he nor Virginia are marriage material. 

1 hour ago, theartandsound said:

Last night I was comparing them and the good sport thing to Steph and AJ from Philly. S+AJ are competitive, but it's all in fun and they support each others' victories. Haley is just a really bad sport, so no wonder that Jake was throwing it back at her with the mini golf and strictly counting strokes,

Haley is a few steps away from being Chris in female form.

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16 hours ago, Airy2021 said:

Exactly!! I don’t really have any feelings towards Haley either way but I DO think people seem to find her to be the villain when it’s obvious these two personalities are just SOOOOOOOO not compatible. 

I agree, and if anyone wants to know the reason why I haven't been posting in this thread very much this season, it's because I'm tired of the villainization of Haley.  I think it's often mean spirited and over the line.  Neither of these people deserve that.  Even if they were the two nicest people in the world (which they aren't) they would still not be a match.  Period, the end.  I don't care how Jake or Haley dresses.  I don't think they are bad people, but I do wonder why both of them are still single, especially Jake at his age.  There must be issues there.  He always has this look on his face like he has an axe to grind because he's convinced that he gets the same poor treatment from women every time.  He can't see what he's doing to sabotage himself.  Haley has no communication skills.  She can't even defend herself and comes off as aloof and superior.  She isn't very easy to connect with, despite what she thinks about herself.  She also can't see herself and how she sabotages herself.  You would think that at some point both of these people would look in the mirror and figure out what THEY are doing to put people off and why they haven't been successful at finding a relationship.  At this point I really think both of them should probably have been put on the new "MAFS Unmatchables" series rather than on this show.

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17 hours ago, LennieBriscoe said:

Jake's been making some double entendres ("It's all about the smooth stroke") swooshing right over Haley's head. Or maybe I have a dirty mind, heh. 

So she even had to mock him AS A KID. "Nice bowl cut." Grrrrrrr....

I may have said this before, but I’ll say it again.  Haley belongs with Erik.  She could sit shot gun and fly with him and travel all over.  He’ll entertain her with his bullshit as he’s smarter than her.

Everyone here should watch Unfiltered.  Haley is a different person.  She smiles and laughs the whole time.  So charming.  On the show, she’s crabby, rude and condescending when around Jake.  Always criticizing Jakes clothes, hair, shoes, shirts, everything.

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My God, Haley is absolutely insufferable.  Self-esteem is great and all, but she clearly has an extremely high opinion of herself and she’s not shy about expressing it.  There is such a nasty, mean girl vibe with her.  I saw it from week two, but it’s off the charts now.  Who cares if Jake wears dress shoes and jeans to a batting cage?  Is it a little different?  Sure, but leave the man alone about something.  Everything doesn’t have to be a big, critical discussion (complete with her facial expressions), the only purpose of which is to systematically break him down and rub his nose in her opinion that she is too good for him.  Even when she tells her stories about her childhood, it is very obvious that she thinks she’s slumming it with him.  They’re absolutely not compatible, but Jake seems to be trying much harder to at least soldier through and wait it out- politely.  I will elect not to even mention the bracelet because it’s all been said.

This season is such a bust all around. 

Edited by Suzy Rhapsody
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5 minutes ago, Suzy Rhapsody said:

Jake seems to be trying much harder to at least solider through politely and wait it out.

Yeah, but this is not okay with her either - she keeps saying he never asks her anything about herself as proof that she is "trying" but he is not, but why should he try when she's made it abundantly clear that it's not happening. Her version of trying is meeting for outings where she has a crap attitude whether she wins or loses, and then leaving with the film crew. There is no reason to put any effort into getting to know a woman that will shortly be returning to stranger status because let's be honest, these two won't even be friends when this is over. They have approximately zero in common.

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1 hour ago, Empress1 said:

People here keep saying they find him repulsive. I don't agree, but whatever - but if someone you found repulsive gave you an out, wouldn't you take it? (Which is why Philly Kate should have been out when Luke told her he was "repulsed and dead inside" after they had sex the first time. At BEST, you get to "I'm not repulsed by you anymore," which ... I mean, everyone deserves better than that.) We know it's possible to end the marriage early because there's a precedent set by now, in this show's 12th season. If Haley is so repulsed by Jake, she should just tell him a version of that and cut it loose. Or Jake should say "You're not particularly nice, no thank you" and cut it loose.

I agree that Haley should have told him after the wedding night of probably drunken sex, that she didn't think they were a good match.  Or use the "it's not you, it's me" fallback.  In any event, she should have said something instead of dragging this out.  

Me? I would've been running for the exit.  😱  Contract be damned.   

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I get it, I was expecting a little better too. I stopped watching several weeks ago and just catch up here. 
 Maybe Ryan can join Colton on his Netflix special 

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12 minutes ago, Suzy Rhapsody said:

My God, Haley is absolutely insufferable.  Self-esteem is great and all, but she clearly has an extremely high opinion of herself and she’s not shy about expressing it.  There is such a nasty, mean girl vibe with her.  I saw it from week two, but it’s off the charts now.  Who cares if Jake wears dress shoes and jeans to a batting cage?  Is it a little different?  Sure, but leave the man alone about something.  Everything doesn’t have to be a big, critical discussion (complete with her facial expressions), the only purpose of which is to systematically break him down and rub his nose in her opinion that she is too good for him.  Even when she tells her stories about her childhood, it is very obvious that she thinks she’s slumming it with him.  They’re absolutely not compatible, but Jake seems to be trying much harder to at least soldier through and wait it out- politely.  I will elect not to even mention the bracelet because it’s all been said.

This season is such a bust all around. 

I think he does the same thing in reverse to her.  The two of them are constantly sideswiping each other with the veiled insults and it started very early.  In this episode he called her a "diva" for not wanting to swim or something like that at the age of 4, which is not atypical for what is basically a toddler.  There are many more examples - I just think people tend to filter out the ones they don't want to acknowledge.  I think if you started a drinking game for each time either one of them hurls thinly and not-so-thinly veiled insults at the other they would be pretty evenly matched.

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2 minutes ago, Ilovepie said:

Yeah, but this is not okay with her either - she keeps saying he never asks her anything about herself as proof that she is "trying" but he is not, but why should he try when she's made it abundantly clear that it's not happening. Her version of trying is meeting for outings where she has a crap attitude whether she wins or loses, and then leaving with the film crew. There is no reason to put any effort into getting to know a woman that will shortly be returning to stranger status because let's be honest, these two won't even be friends when this is over. They have approximately zero in common.

I agree.  I think when I said that he’s just trying to soldier through, I was saying that he’s making more of an effort to maintain a certain level of common courtesy in their interactions while the season winds down, but I really don’t see her doing the same.  I’ll be glad when this season is over. 

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1 hour ago, Empress1 said:

I didn't finish the episode (I got bored; most of these people are unlikable) but I agree with this. She looks MUCH worse than she would if she had just agreed with him from the get that she wasn't into him. It reminds me of Luke and Kate from Philly - Kate told Luke straight up that she didn't think she was doing it for him and she clearly wasn't, and he insisted that he was into her yet treated her like shit. Chris has done similar things with his "I'm becoming spiritually attracted to you" nonsense. Just say "I'm not into you. Take care and good luck" and keep it moving.

Instead, Haley tries to prove that she has reason not to be into him, really derisively - she mocks everything he does, and she tells her friends and the experts "See? He wears ugly shirts!" (And her friends and the experts are like "... And?" which cracks me up.) And she still insists that they can salvage this to not look like the bad guy on TV, I suspect, and if she would just be a grown woman about it and say, "you know what, you're right for someone, it's just not me," she'd come off as much better. She's nasty.

People here keep saying they find him repulsive. I don't agree, but whatever - but if someone you found repulsive gave you an out, wouldn't you take it? (Which is why Philly Kate should have been out when Luke told her he was "repulsed and dead inside" after they had sex the first time. At BEST, you get to "I'm not repulsed by you anymore," which ... I mean, everyone deserves better than that.) We know it's possible to end the marriage early because there's a precedent set by now, in this show's 12th season. If Haley is so repulsed by Jake, she should just tell him a version of that and cut it loose. Or Jake should say "You're not particularly nice, no thank you" and cut it loose.

I’m watching again.  Wherever they are, she is pissy.  He’s trying to talk nice to her.  At the put put golf, she was mad that he was winning.  She made fun of his hair in his pictures.  This girl knocks him at every turn.  I’m surprised he doesn’t just tell her to go F herself.  How much shit does he have to take?  She thinks who the hell she is.  Cut it already.  She is one nasty woman, and a phony to boot.  Like she says .. if she doesn’t like something or someone, she walks away.  Nice.  Now walk away from your marriage., and pity to the next guy.

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BUT he [Chris] must be able to hide most of it in interviews. 

He wasn't able to hide it in any scene on this show. So I'm going with they knew what they were getting and they got the train wreck drama they wanted. He self-identified as a loser at the wedding.

Brianna knows the mortality statistics of African American women. Vincent should do his homework. Now.

As for Jake and Haley, I don't watch Unfiltered, so I can only go by what I see here. And I imagine they were matched so that neither of them would be out there torturing any other singles. 

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1 hour ago, Yeah No said:

I agree, and if anyone wants to know the reason why I haven't been posting in this thread very much this season, it's because I'm tired of the villainization of Haley.  I think it's often mean spirited and over the line.  Neither of these people deserve that.  Even if they were the two nicest people in the world (which they aren't) they would still not be a match.  Period, the end.  I don't care how Jake or Haley dresses.  I don't think they are bad people, but I do wonder why both of them are still single, especially Jake at his age.  There must be issues there.  He always has this look on his face like he has an axe to grind because he's convinced that he gets the same poor treatment from women every time.  He can't see what he's doing to sabotage himself.  Haley has no communication skills.  She can't even defend herself and comes off as aloof and superior.  She isn't very easy to connect with, despite what she thinks about herself.  She also can't see herself and how she sabotages herself.  You would think that at some point both of these people would look in the mirror and figure out what THEY are doing to put people off and why they haven't been successful at finding a relationship.  At this point I really think both of them should probably have been put on the new "MAFS Unmatchables" series rather than on this show.

Yes to a lot of things.  The thing I don’t agree with is thinking someone has a  relationship problem because they are single at 38.  Some people have hobbies that keep them busy, or are concentrating on their job, or taking care of an elderly family member.  It doesn’t necessarily mean they have a problem because they are 38 and not married.  It may just mean they didn’t feel the need for someone yet.  Lots of people are very content staying single.  Less haggles.  Some may suddenly realize they want children after all and look for a partner.

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8 minutes ago, Silver Bells said:

Yes to a lot of things.  The thing I don’t agree with is thinking someone has a  relationship problem because they are single at 38.  Some people have hobbies that keep them busy, or are concentrating on their job, or taking care of an elderly family member.  It doesn’t necessarily mean they have a problem because they are 38 and not married.  It may just mean they didn’t feel the need for someone yet.  Lots of people are very content staying single.  Less haggles.  Some may suddenly realize they want children after all and look for a partner.

Fair point, but IMO usually if people aren't interested in a relationship before a "certain age" (and both of them are past that) they usually never really are.  All of those external distractions are just excuses.  Like the women who say they don't want kids because of their career.  If it was that important to them the career wouldn't get in the way, they'd find a way to make both work.

I think both Jake and Haley can be accused of being people for whom the idea of a relationship is more appealing to them than the actuality.  They may be under pressure from family or just have expectations of themselves that don't match the reality of who they really are.  Neither one of them look to me like people that really, really want to be with someone.

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Haley is 28, and I don't consider her being past a "certain age" in finding a mate.   I know a few women in their late 20s who haven't found a mate and I don't find that strange at all.  Jake, 10 years older at 38, is a different story.   Not necessarily unusual, but his situation is different from Haley's IMO. 

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21 minutes ago, Silver Bells said:

Yes to a lot of things.  The thing I don’t agree with is thinking someone has a  relationship problem because they are single at 38.  Some people have hobbies that keep them busy, or are concentrating on their job, or taking care of an elderly family member.  It doesn’t necessarily mean they have a problem because they are 38 and not married.  It may just mean they didn’t feel the need for someone yet.  Lots of people are very content staying single.  Less haggles.  Some may suddenly realize they want children after all and look for a partner.

Sometimes people just don't find a person to marry on a prescribed timeline. I'm over 30 and not married; there's nothing wrong with me. I'm just not married. Also, the idea that 38 is too old to be single is region-specific - a 38-year-old single man isn't weird in NYC and other places in the urban northeast. Most of my married friends were over 30 when they married. Societally we really need to normalize finding love at any age (see also: career success. I just read about a 70-year-old man defending his dissertation and I think that is amazing), or not finding it at all. Sometimes people don't get married.

The idea that people, men or women, are washed up or fundamentally flawed if they don't find a spouse before a certain age is ... gross, to me, because it speaks to the way society prioritizes marriage above all else. It's more socially acceptable to be divorced than to never have been married; I think that's fucked up. My brother's godmother never married or had kids; she's a wonderful person with a full, happy life. She's traveled the world, she had a career she loved, she has decades-long friendships (including with my mom!), she helped take care of her parents when they needed it, she has hobbies. Her not being married is a very small part of who she is.

The pressure to find someone on a prescribed timeline has had people out here making terrible decisions that can't be changed (e.g. having a kid with someone awful) or that take a lot of time and money to change (divorce). I know the biological clock is real, but honestly, I know two women who became single parents by choice (adoption through foster care and via sperm bank), and they're much happier than the women I know who were like, well, it's probably not going to work but I don't have time to start over, so here we are. 

Jake has bought into it - he's like "this is my last chance to find love before 40," but for one, no it isn't; this is clearly not going to work out so he'll have another year or two to keep looking. And second, if he finds love at 41 or 45 or 50, so what? It's not less valuable. He might think "I wish I had more time with you," but that doesn't mean whatever love he finds is somehow lesser because he found it after a certain age.

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1 hour ago, Ilovepie said:

Yeah, but this is not okay with her either - she keeps saying he never asks her anything about herself as proof that she is "trying" but he is not, but why should he try when she's made it abundantly clear that it's not happening. Her version of trying is meeting for outings where she has a crap attitude whether she wins or loses, and then leaving with the film crew. There is no reason to put any effort into getting to know a woman that will shortly be returning to stranger status because let's be honest, these two won't even be friends when this is over. They have approximately zero in common.

Jake has been pretty nice considering she’s been a horror since day one.  At least he has respect and feelings.  She won’t be happy until she gets the final dig.  The bracelet.  Maybe she preferred a necklace.  Of diamonds.  If my husband gave me an infinity bracelet before going down the aisle, I would have put it on immediately.  It takes two seconds.  It was a beautiful gesture on his part.  This is a person who is never satisfied with anything.  Never mind his shoes, house and the eighties.  This girl needs a shrink ASAP.

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23 minutes ago, Empress1 said:

Sometimes people just don't find a person to marry on a prescribed timeline. I'm over 30 and not married; there's nothing wrong with me. I'm just not married. Also, the idea that 38 is too old to be single is region-specific - a 38-year-old single man isn't weird in NYC and other places in the urban northeast. Most of my married friends were over 30 when they married. Societally we really need to normalize finding love at any age (see also: career success. I just read about a 70-year-old man defending his dissertation and I think that is amazing), or not finding it at all. Sometimes people don't get married.

The idea that people, men or women, are washed up or fundamentally flawed if they don't find a spouse before a certain age is ... gross, to me, because it speaks to the way society prioritizes marriage above all else. It's more socially acceptable to be divorced than to never have been married; I think that's fucked up. My brother's godmother never married or had kids; she's a wonderful person with a full, happy life. She's traveled the world, she had a career she loved, she has decades-long friendships (including with my mom!), she helped take care of her parents when they needed it, she has hobbies. Her not being married is a very small part of who she is.

The pressure to find someone on a prescribed timeline has had people out here making terrible decisions that can't be changed (e.g. having a kid with someone awful) or that take a lot of time and money to change (divorce). I know the biological clock is real, but honestly, I know two women who became single parents by choice (adoption through foster care and via sperm bank), and they're much happier than the women I know who were like, well, it's probably not going to work but I don't have time to start over, so here we are. 

Jake has bought into it - he's like "this is my last chance to find love before 40," but for one, no it isn't; this is clearly not going to work out so he'll have another year or two to keep looking. And second, if he finds love at 41 or 45 or 50, so what? It's not less valuable. He might think "I wish I had more time with you," but that doesn't mean whatever love he finds is somehow lesser because he found it after a certain age.

Absolutely.  I know couples who married for the first time in their forties.  38 is not abnormal.  Personally, I find him cute with a personality.  He spoke very nice on Unfiltered and looked good.  Repulsive is a very strong word.  Bet he’ll have plenty of dates after this show.  I wish him the best of everything.

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