S15.E06: Different Wives, Different Rules

[xwordfanatik]

1 hour ago, NoWhammies said:

Kody frequently expresses bafflement at why his family isn't very functional. All you have to do to find out, Kody, is look in the magic device God gave you to allow you to see the truth. He put it in your bathroom. It's called a mirror. 

I realized that the reason Kody is so much on the outs with Meri and Christine this season when in the past he and Meri are at least trying to be kind to each other, is that Meri and Christine were the two wives opposed to his gigantic plyg palace on prairie dog poop flats. Janelle was all in, and Robyn played the manipulative Robyn game when he proposed it. If you disagree with Kody or don't react outwardly or emotionally in exactly the way he wants, then he will demonize you unto the end of time because you victimized him. Fucking narcissist twit. Who the hell is mad because his kids still have jobs and are therefore going out in the public? Janelle will be the next wife out of Kody's favor, leaving only Robyn. Which is the way Robyn thinks it should have been all along. She should've been there from the beginning - but she wants the other sister wives in her kingdom to look in awe of her relationship with the golden haired man, do anything she asks of them, and give some legitimacy to her plyg princess dreams.

I've been rewatching all seasons over the past several weeks. When you watch one after the other without the space of a week in between and sometimes months between seasons, it all becomes starkly obvious. You can see his favoritism for Robyn's brood. You can see his lack of interest in Truely because she had the gall to be born when he wanted to be with Robyn. You can see all of Robyn's mechinations and manipulations, you can see all of the forgotten children (basically everyone who came after his oldest four excepting Robyn's kids). You can see how Kody and Robyn turned the tide against Meri (not all of it is undeserved - but understandable why Meri got so defensive when every time she said or did anything, Robyn and Kody would lead the entire gang of adults into jumping down her throat - she behaves like someone with complex PTSD or Cassandra syndrome who is unable to believe her own fillings or perceptions anymore because she has been so gaslighted as the fambily "scapegoat" or "identified patient"). You can see how the kids have parented themselves. You can see how Robyn systematically takes down one wife after another all while crying about "fambily culture". And if it's easy to see watching an episode or so a day over the course of several weeks, imagine what those poor kids see and understand living with it day after day.

Go rewatch the first season. It's so weird. Kody is this benign Winnie-the-Pooh voiced narrator (My name is Kody Brown...) with a big, benevolent smile as he roams joyfully through his huge plyg house in Lehi while having a chick on the side, and his wives have all been ordered to appear twinkly and happy. As each season passes, the masks slip a little more until their true ugliness is revealed. And Robyn's face gets wider and wider with each passing season until it eats up my entire screen, which seems oddly symbolic of her ego expanding as her stature within the fambily grows.

Stick a fork in them; they are done. The Brown fambily is a hugely dysfunctional cult lead by a toxic, passive-aggressive narcissist who uses psychological torture to try and beat each wife or non-Robyn offspring into submission when they don't feel and act exactly the way he wants them to. And by his side is his dark queen, Robyn, she of quivering lips, wide face, comma-shaped eyebrows, forehead wrinkled in her approximation of what care and worry must look like, and trembling chin (with nary a tear in sight) who wages (what she believes is) subtler psychological warfare on anyone who isn't part of her nuclear fambily by manipulative dry crying and whining about how all she wants is the whole fambily to be happy when really what she wants is the man, with everyone else her loyal subjects. And the forgotten children can see through the whole mess. Some have bought into it in order to stay safe and protected. Others are becoming more outwardly vocal about it. At some point, one of them is going to break ranks and tell all. My money is on Gabe, but Truely is a dark horse - it could be her.

I would love a tell-all from Gabe or Truely.  

Remember Kootie's first remark on the first show?  "I like marriage."  How the Dark Queen has changed all that.  Now he only likes it with her.

[Roslyn]

10 hours ago, itsadryheat said:

That's what I thought watching his histrionic plan to give it to the man State of Utah.

Super Victim/Vindictive Man Kody Brown wants REVENGE on Utah for all the wrongs those Mormons have inflicted on all the innocent plygs. He'll show them. They made him move is family to Las Vegas making him get stuck on the freeway for hours, in the dead of night like gypsy's, with three flat tires. He will go out of his way to get him one of those plyg tickets and then those Mormons better look out. He'll sue. And win. And it all will be filmed and added to the Kody Kronicles.

And Robyn will cry.

Once again, Kody can't seem to see the forest through the trees. To get issued this "polygamist parking ticket" he needs to live in Utah, purport to co-habitate with a spiritual wife, be caught and cited. So. Even if he and the whole famdamily move right back to Utah and park themselves in a 20 acre lot right next to the State Attorney General him/herself, he is STILL only co-habitating with a legally married wife and occasionally sleeping with other women who all agree to it.

They are NOT pulling over cars to randomly search for random polygamists.  It just so happens that is how they randomly caught Warren Jeffs.  However...at that time (I believe) Warren Jeffs had warrants for his arrest and was on the FBI's Top 10 most wanted list.

[LuvMyShows]

23 hours ago, itsadryheat said:

His glee over the Utah ruling seemed close to crazed. Calling a family meeting with 3 teenagers and a 4 and a 6 year old to announce the news. 

...and not being a part of sharing the wonderful news with Christine's family only reaffirmed whose family really matters.

2 hours ago, laurakaye said:

If Gabe gets little to no time with his father, he's learned to go without - and there's no way he's going to stay away from his girlfriend for a guy who only stops by out of a sense of duty.  These neglected kids of Kody's aren't stupid.  They know perfectly well where they stand, so why should they have to halt their lives - of which Kody has little to no knowledge - just on the off chance that he decides to drop by?

But why was it framed that way in the first place, instead of mentioning the risk to Janelle if Gabe got the virus?  All they talked about was if Kody got it (and how it could infect the other households that he visits).  But according to the science, Janelle is more at risk if she develops covid, and she is in Gabe's own household so there would be far more likelihood that she would catch it from Gabe, than that an occasional visitor like Kody would.

15 hours ago, 80sBaby said:

This episode really irritated me. All they have been talking about is how they rarely see each other. All the fake distress about the virus disrupting their being together as a family was complete BS. 

Yes!  As I was watching, I kept thinking, "The producers know that we actually watch the show, right?", cause all season it's been about how they live their separate lives and rarely see each other.

And as mentioned already, the fakery and re-writing by Janelle of fambly history, to whitewash the very lengthy separation that she had from Kody, was insulting.

10 hours ago, itsadryheat said:

Super Victim/Vindictive Man Kody Brown wants REVENGE on Utah for all the wrongs those Mormons have inflicted on all the innocent plygs. He'll show them. They made him move is family to Las Vegas making him get stuck on the freeway for hours, in the dead of night like gypsy's, with three flat tires. He will go out of his way to get him one of those plyg tickets and then those Mormons better look out. He'll sue. And win. And it all will be filmed and added to the Kody Kronicles.

And Robyn will cry.

...and Kody is willing to literally mortgage the future of the entire family in order to fund this deranged revenge fantasy!

[monagatuna]

45 minutes ago, OdinO. said:

I think am in a "hetero-presenting" , not sure about that nomenclature, and we do adjust our public behavior. We don't PDA either. 

Do you do it for safety reasons? That was my point. Some people like PDA and some don't, but for the most part, same-race, opposite-gender couples get to have a choice. Not every couple does.

[ReadMeLattice]

@NoWhammies I wouldn’t be surprised if it was one of the middle ones or the younger ones like Truely. She seems like a spitfire and the poor thing is neglected almost more than any of them. For God’s sake, she almost died and it was Aspyn - not Christine or Kody - who ultimately decided she had to go to the hospital. 

It was also INCREDIBLY weird imo to hear Kody complaining about Mariah wanting to “save Grandma.” Hello! Janelle IS a grandma and her age and weight make her higher risk than anyone. Dismissing that risk was so hateful on his part - it’s like he didn’t even think of the actual risks to his own wives. Just the inconvenience to him. 

[NoWhammies]

1 minute ago, ReadMeLattice said:

@NoWhammies I wouldn’t be surprised if it was one of the middle ones or the younger ones like Truely. She seems like a spitfire and the poor thing is neglected almost more than any of them. For God’s sake, she almost died and it was Aspyn - not Christine or Kody - who ultimately decided she had to go to the hospital. 

Can you imagine being Truely and going back to see that episode as someone older and capable of understanding all that it means? Or of watching the episode of her birth with her dad smooching on Robyn while mom is laboring in the hospital? At some point, you know there's going to be a book that comes out called Growing Up Brown or Growing Up Plyg or something like that, and it's going to be from one of the forgotten ones. It's will be devastating for the adults, particularly Kodouche and Sobbyn. Heck - I am a writer and have ghost written books for people before. Maybe I should slip into Gabe's DMs and suggest it...

[itsadryheat]

3 hours ago, laurakaye said:

Did anyone notice the glass tchotchke cabinet during Kody's roundtable at Robyn's house?  I counted four shelves LOADED with figurines.  It looked like the display case at our local second hand shop.  Then I started scanning the background of her house and she's got even more crap on every available surface.  Hey, Robyn - just because you CAN cram another $50 Precious Moments or Willow Tree into that cabinet doesn't mean you SHOULD. 

I laugh about Meri shopping the holiday sales at Michael's but Robyn is just as bad, if not worse.

Thanks for bringing this up LK. I too was gobsmacked by the number of "collectibles" hoarded by frugal Robyn. Not a space to be seen. The massive amount loaded into those not cheap cabinets represent more of a problem than a hobby. Who even looks at those things. This from the woman who never had a crib for her first three kids. Kody and Robyn are HORRIBLE with money. Pretty obvious they believe this gravy train will chug along for a spiritual eternity. 

Blown away with that house. Like Kody would stay in Janelle's affordable housing with kids who do not "worship" him. I think Gabe should narrate the rest of the episodes.

[NoWhammies]

I recall in an earlier episode Kody saying something like, "I have two wives who really LOVE their things." It wasn't hard to recognize he was talking about Meri and Robyn.

[OdinO.]

49 minutes ago, monagatuna said:

Do you do it for safety reasons? That was my point. Some people like PDA and some don't, but for the most part, same-race, opposite-gender couples get to have a choice. Not every couple does.

I do it for decorum.

[Grifter Lives]

4 hours ago, LuvMyShows said:

...and not being a part of sharing the wonderful news with Christine's family only reaffirmed whose family really matters.

Exactly!  The only two families that were shown celebrating were the families with many daughters who could be potential sister wives.  We didn't see Janelle share the news with her children.  (All her older children have already flatly rejected any possibility of polygamous marriages.)  Yet, Janelle the convert was the one who explained that the Mormons banned polygamy in 1890 to gain statehood.  

Her math is wrong in her statement, "For 150 years, we've been felons."  First, there are 130 years between 2020 and 1890.  Second, the law that defined polygamy as "criminally injurious conduct" was on the books for 85 years.  Third, the Browns themselves have never been felons.  Utah opened an investigation into their family that it never pursued before closing it.  

Even dumber than Janelle's bad math were Robyn's describing the news as "fun and exciting," and Kody's chest-pounding about polygamous marriage licenses (with Robyn, loudly cheering him on).  They're how Janelle justifies repeatedly that she's the logical, rational one.

Kody in the 2017 march:

Edited March 23, 2021 by Grifter Lives

[WhatsUpDummy]

25 minutes ago, Grifter Lives said:

Kody in the 2017 march:

Oh yeah.  And when he saw some of the women from the Escaping Polygamy show were there counter-protesting and said he wished they would just shut up.  Asshole.

[Twopper]

16 hours ago, kitkat68 said:

I think the downfall of Kody and Meri started when they divorced so he could marry his true love, Robyn. I think it really hurt Meri, and she never let on how much it hurt. Then she ended up being catfished and that was used to put all the blame on her. 

Like @NoWhammies I have been binge-watchingk old episodes.  It is true that the cracks and inconsistencies are much more apparent if the shows are watched close together.  I can only handle a few a day, but even watching one each day without an intervening week makes a difference in how I see things.

I really wanted to ff thru the scenes about Meri and the possibility of another child, but I stuck with it and concluded this is where their foundation really begins to crack and split with Meri and Kody.   In an interview, she said she was going to tell him yes, but she couldn't after the way he answered her about what he thought.  But it rilly begins with Robyn butting in when Solomon is being birthed and offering her womb to carry Meri's baby.  To me this was just jumping the gun.  I could see someone saying something like 'I know you are considering another child.  I've been reading pregnancy stuff recently because I was preggers and I have seen a lot about IVF.  You might consider that.  If you try it, and it fails,  then I am here to say I would carry the baby for you if you weren't able."  or something.  This, to me, is very dark Robyn.   So this is a major hurt for Meri followed by having to give up her legal status to Robyn for no rilly great reason.  Then the catfish comes along and angers both Kody and Mariah.  And Kody's anger is magnified every time it get mentioned in the media or on the show. 

What I really want to see TLC do is get some people to do commentary on all the episodes that are sliced and diced to show all the inconsistencies.   They could start with the anthropologist who had the discussion at UNLV.  They could get Kollene, too, who escaped the FLDS. And each of the wives and Kody could comment separately and maybe a few of the married children. 

[Pingaponga]

One thing I have realized watching this is how much I have forgotten from the beginning of the pandemic. When someone (Robyn?) was talking about leaving your shopping in the cold for 24 hours to kill the virus, I remembered that we wiped all the groceries down with disinfectant wipes after grocery shopping. I had totally forgotten that we did that for a good couple of months, and man, I am so glad I'm not doing that any more.

But it got me thinking...we now know that someone like Janelle is at an increased risk of hospitalization/death because of her weight, but did we know that last March/April? Or was the assumption at the beginning that everyone was equally at risk? We definitely didn't know anything about long Covid then.

I'm just wondering how I would have interpreted their decisions a year ago, when this was all starting, rather than now, when hindsight is 2020.

[Grifter Lives]

7 hours ago, laurakaye said:

Did anyone notice the glass tchotchke cabinet during Kody's roundtable at Robyn's house?  I counted four shelves LOADED with figurines.  It looked like the display case at our local second hand shop.  Then I started scanning the background of her house and she's got even more crap on every available surface.  Hey, Robyn - just because you CAN cram another $50 Precious Moments or Willow Tree into that cabinet doesn't mean you SHOULD.  I laugh about Meri shopping the holiday sales at Michael's but Robyn is just as bad, if not worse.

 

4 hours ago, itsadryheat said:

Thanks for bringing this up LK. I too was gobsmacked by the number of "collectibles" hoarded by frugal Robyn. Not a space to be seen. The massive amount loaded into those not cheap cabinets represent more of a problem than a hobby. Who even looks at those things. This from the woman who never had a crib for her first three kids. Kody and Robyn are HORRIBLE with money. Pretty obvious they believe this gravy train will chug along for a spiritual eternity. 

Same with AuroranBreanna's room.  (Yes, I know that that Robyn would consider it child abuse if any of her children had to share a bedroom.)  All the walls, furniture and surfaces were covered in generic decorations and paintings of Jesus.  There was even a word art sign that said, "Breathe & Allow Things to Pass," for the sofa princess of panic attacks.  (There was another one, "I Am a Child of God," behind Kody.)  Only a few little photos looked authentic to a high schooler. Remember: They bought that house furnished, but Robyn insisted on getting rid of it to bring in their own. 

[Art Of Noiz]

5 hours ago, xwordfanatik said:

I would love a tell-all from Gabe or Truely.  

Remember Kootie's first remark on the first show?  "I like marriage."  How the Dark Queen has changed all that.  Now he only likes it with her.

I want the Prequel by David Preston Jessop. 

Bad. I want that bad.

[Grifter Lives]

2 minutes ago, Art Of Noiz said:

I want the Prequel by David Preston Jessop. 

Bad. I want that bad.

with intro by Adam Barber, Janelle's first husband & Meri's brother

[Just Wondering]

1 hour ago, Grifter Lives said:

Exactly!  The only two families that were shown celebrating were the families with many daughters who could be potential sister wives.  We didn't see Janelle share the news with her children.  (All her older children have already flatly rejected any possibility of polygamous marriages.)  Yet, Janelle the convert was the one who explained that the Mormons banned polygamy in 1890 to gain statehood.  

Her math is wrong in her statement, "For 150 years, we've been felons."  First, there are 130 years between 2020 and 1890.  Second, the law that defined polygamy as "criminally injurious conduct" was on the books for 85 years.  Third, the Browns themselves have never been felons.  Utah opened an investigation into their family that it never pursued before closing it.  

Even dumber than Janelle's bad math were Robyn's describing the news as "fun and exciting," and Kody's chest-pounding about polygamous marriage licenses (with Robyn, loudly cheering him on).  They're how Janelle justifies repeatedly that she's the logical, rational one.

Kody in the 2017 march:

Kody declaring himself a lover makes me think of how many nights his ladies went without a lover over the years. These folks practice polygamy according to the Bible, yet in Ecclesiastes it says, “Again, if two lie together, then they have heat: but how can one be warm alone?”  The only Biblical examples Kody and crew point to are the ones where the wives battle, the kids battle, and Jacob sends two of his least favorite wives first and second in a caravan going toward a possibly angry brother, and sends his favorite at the back of the caravan where she is safest. This should be enough to send every woman screaming into the void - from Kody’s beliefs.

Edited March 23, 2021 by Just Wondering

[Art Of Noiz]

8 minutes ago, Grifter Lives said:

with intro by Adam Barber, Janelle's first husband & Meri's brother

YAYUSSS!

[Just Wondering]

When Kody sat Robyn’s daughters down to announce the decriminalization of polygamy, I wondered how Kody would feel if one of them married a man who embraced polygamy but not the religious/faith aspects. Because those fellows would be lining up too.
Announce thAt to Aurora and Breana, Kody.

[Just Wondering]

21 minutes ago, Just Wondering said:

 

Edited March 23, 2021 by Just Wondering

[Art Of Noiz]

1 hour ago, Grifter Lives said:

with intro by Adam Barber, Janelle's first husband & Meri's brother

Another good one would be..the Teen Courtship. *I  Dodged a Bullet*

[MargeGunderson]

2 hours ago, Grifter Lives said:

Exactly!  The only two families that were shown celebrating were the families with many daughters who could be potential sister wives.  We didn't see Janelle share the news with her children.  (All her older children have already flatly rejected any possibility of polygamous marriages.)  Yet, Janelle the convert was the one who explained that the Mormons banned polygamy in 1890 to gain statehood.  

Her math is wrong in her statement, "For 150 years, we've been felons."  First, there are 130 years between 2020 and 1890.  Second, the law that defined polygamy as "criminally injurious conduct" was on the books for 85 years.  Third, the Browns themselves have never been felons.  Utah opened an investigation into their family that it never pursued before closing it.  

Even dumber than Janelle's bad math were Robyn's describing the news as "fun and exciting," and Kody's chest-pounding about polygamous marriage licenses (with Robyn, loudly cheering him on).  They're how Janelle justifies repeatedly that she's the logical, rational one.

Kody in the 2017 march:

Okay, that sign makes no sense. Why throw “lover” in there when husband covers it? Oh right, this is Kody......

[OdinO.]

1 hour ago, Pingaponga said:

One thing I have realized watching this is how much I have forgotten from the beginning of the pandemic. When someone (Robyn?) was talking about leaving your shopping in the cold for 24 hours to kill the virus, I remembered that we wiped all the groceries down with disinfectant wipes after grocery shopping. I had totally forgotten that we did that for a good couple of months, and man, I am so glad I'm not doing that any more.

But it got me thinking...we now know that someone like Janelle is at an increased risk of hospitalization/death because of her weight, but did we know that last March/April? Or was the assumption at the beginning that everyone was equally at risk? We definitely didn't know anything about long Covid then.

I'm just wondering how I would have interpreted their decisions a year ago, when this was all starting, rather than now, when hindsight is 2020.

It's more about the comorbidities of obesity that conveyed increased risk such as diabetes and hypertension. Not merely extra fat cells. It's entirely possible she has neither condition.

[Absolom]

Ratings:  1.424 M viewers and a .28 rating.  Thirteenth cable show of the day.

[iwantcookies]

It’s Kody’s world and we just live in it.

[Just Wondering]

21 hours ago, itsadryheat said:

Thanks for bringing this up LK. I too was gobsmacked by the number of "collectibles" hoarded by frugal Robyn. Not a space to be seen. The massive amount loaded into those not cheap cabinets represent more of a problem than a hobby. Who even looks at those things. This from the woman who never had a crib for her first three kids. Kody and Robyn are HORRIBLE with money. Pretty obvious they believe this gravy train will chug along for a spiritual eternity. 

Blown away with that house. Like Kody would stay in Janelle's affordable housing with kids who do not "worship" him. I think Gabe should narrate the rest of the episodes.

Great points.  I have a feeling Kody’s very own man cave is housed at Robyn’s. It has to be annoying visiting the lesser accommodations of Janelle and Christine - kind of like staying at hotels while traveling for work. Maybe it’s exactly the same. I don’t believe Janelle asked Kody to stay away though. I believe that decision was made along the same lines as Kody and Meri’s divorce. I keep wondering if the original marriages ALL busted up awhile back and Kody is just doing visitation with his remaining children, which would be one reason (among many) he and Robyn got the large house while J & C... did not.

But, y’all, if that’s what it looks like to win Kody all to yourself...

Imagine having all those other kids, even the grown ones, constantly maneuvering in and out looking for their daddy time, only now without the help of the other “wives”.  Then one would have to  watch those  “wives” traveling and relaxing on their kid-free days. This sounds so bad, I’ve almost talked myself out of believing Robyn would ever let this happen. 

Edited March 24, 2021 by Just Wondering

[laurakaye]

22 hours ago, xwordfanatik said:

Remember Kootie's first remark on the first show?  "I like marriage."  How the Dark Queen has changed all that.  Now he only likes it with her.

But will Robyn like being "sealed" (ick) to Kody for all eternity once the Big Three have peaced out?  My belief is that Robyn only likes being married to Kody because she gets to lord her superiority over all of her beloved sister wives.  If they all bail and she no longer has anyone bowing down to her, will she take a long look at the clown she's hitched her wagon to when they have to move into a one-bedroom house once TLC pulls the plug and regret her plans to overthrow this family?  And also wonder what the hell happened to her chin?  I certainly hope so.

 

22 hours ago, Roslyn said:

Once again, Kody can't seem to see the forest through the trees. To get issued this "polygamist parking ticket" he needs to live in Utah, purport to co-habitate with a spiritual wife, be caught and cited. So. Even if he and the whole famdamily move right back to Utah and park themselves in a 20 acre lot right next to the State Attorney General him/herself, he is STILL only co-habitating with a legally married wife and occasionally sleeping with other women who all agree to it.

They are NOT pulling over cars to randomly search for random polygamists.  It just so happens that is how they randomly caught Warren Jeffs.  However...at that time (I believe) Warren Jeffs had warrants for his arrest and was on the FBI's Top 10 most wanted list.

Kody is a brainless twit.  He only wants to be actively persecuted for the publicity it would bring him.  He wants lights, sirens, and media coverage - but he wants it all to stop just short of someone actually cuffing him and throwing him in jell.  Maybe he'll move to Utah and then "forget" to pay a few parking tickets or run a blinking red light at 2 in the morning in order to get himself a rap sheet so that when he gets pulled over on that, he can say "Officer, do you not know who I am?  I have four wives!  FOUR!!  Persecution!  Persecutionnnnnnnnn!!"

 

17 hours ago, Grifter Lives said:

Same with AuroranBreanna's room.  (Yes, I know that that Robyn would consider it child abuse if any of her children had to share a bedroom.)  All the walls, furniture and surfaces were covered in generic decorations and paintings of Jesus.  There was even a word art sign that said, "Breathe & Allow Things to Pass," for the sofa princess of panic attacks.  (There was another one, "I Am a Child of God," behind Kody.)  Only a few little photos looked authentic to a high schooler. Remember: They bought that house furnished, but Robyn insisted on getting rid of it to bring in their own. 

I noticed that too!  She had a frame behind her bed with six windows in it for photos - only three of them were filled and two were pictures of Jesus, I think.  I was like - where's your pics of you and your friends?  Or your boyfriend?  Or the current hottie from Tiger Beat magazine?  Weird.

[laurakaye]

11 minutes ago, Just Wondering said:

I believe that decision was made along the same lines as Kody and Meri’s divorce.

Ooh, good point.  I can absolutely see Robyn planting seeds in Kody's pea-brain along the lines of "You know, Kody, Sol had RSV when he was a baby and I myself had pneumonia once when I was four years old...."  Maybe even whispering to him while he's asleep..."Sol....RSV.....me, your wife - pneumonia...." until Kody dropped enough anvil-sized hints on Janelle that she took the bait and banned Kody from her home.  I would not put anything past The Dark Queen.

Edited March 24, 2021 by laurakaye

[Shelbie]

In his own head Kody remains the most famous polygamist in history. I’m sure he believes that Utah is desperately afraid to take him on when in reality I’m sure that Utah has much bigger things to worry about.

His belief that he could even afford to hire lawyers and would win is delusional.

[Sandy W]

7 minutes ago, Shelbie said:

 

His belief that he could even afford to hire lawyers and would win is delusional.

He is delusional enough to believe that the most prestigious law firm in Utah would take on his case Pro Bono, simply for the opportunity to be associated with this polygamist "hero". 

[Elizzikra]

Quote

He is delusional enough to believe that the most prestigious law firm in Utah would take on his case Pro Bono, simply for the opportunity to be associated with this polygamist "hero". 

He would represent himself, believing that he's always the smartest guy in the room.

[MargeGunderson]

Kody definitely is a legend in his own mind.

[Twopper]

On 3/22/2021 at 2:36 PM, UsernameFatigue said:

I had to laugh at how horrified Kody was at the possibility of having the responsibility of a dog. This, the man who has 18 children, 15 that he fathered. Kody would no more be responsible for looking after a dog than he is for looking after his children. The real reason Kody doesn't want a dog in any house he inhabits is that he would view it as being competition. Kody must always be top dog. 

I've been watching older seasons and seeing a few episodes that I somehow missed.  There was one where Kody  had an old friend visit.  The four wives and the friend's wife Ava all took the kids to a zoo and left the "boys" to do something else. 

On the couch afterward Robyn says no to pets in her house.  There were cats in the house at Lehi, and they had the dog Drake.   Janelle has dogs now and it looks like Christine has at least one cat.   Meri has dogs, I think, but she doesn't count since he doesn't go over to her place.  

The anti-pet person isn't Kody.  It is Robyn.   Maybe he knows viewers mostly hate Robyn so he is pretending to be against house pets instead of her.    If Robyn were to tell the girls "no'' then people would hate her even more.

Well, that's my theory.

[itsadryheat]

Was Robyn always the dark queen or did she grow into that role?

I ask because her early years showed someone with a little spirit, smiled, wanted to be part of the "team". (I guess you could say this about all of them to an extent.) So was she always an opportunist, and her Lehi personality a cover to be unleashed when the time was right, emboldened by Kody's blind devotion.

For someone that gets what she wants, she sure does not look happy or healthy. Season after season she touted how important her sister wives relationships are to her.

Currently, her dour mug and dead attitude exudes Let Them Eat Cake.

[NoWhammies]

3 minutes ago, itsadryheat said:

Was Robyn always the dark queen or did she grow into that role?

I ask because her early years showed someone with a little spirit, smiled, wanted to be part of the "team". (I guess you could say this about all of them to an extent.) So was she always an opportunist, and her Lehi personality a cover to be unleashed when the time was right, emboldened by Kody's blind devotion.

For someone that gets what she wants, she sure does not look happy or healthy. Season after season she touted how important her sister wives relationships are to her.

Currently, her dour mug and dead attitude exudes Let Them Eat Cake.

Having recently rewatched earlier seasons, I suspect she was always the dark queen. Her little black heart saw an opportunity to get her wide, wide face on the teevee while getting someone to take care of her children and her house work (her sister wives because she's too pretty to cook) and someone else to take care of her bills (Kodouche and the fambily). The early on sweet countenance was for Kodouche and the viewing audience, as well as to keep the sister wives on board so she could continue to buy shit she wouldn't be able to afford on her own. And her legal marriage and anchor babies sealed her position, which is why the facade has been slipping. 

[laurakaye]

1 hour ago, itsadryheat said:

Was Robyn always the dark queen or did she grow into that role?

ALWAYS.

As far as I'm concerned, she cemented her position when she allowed Kody to try and slam the door on the camera person when she and Kody stepped outside for a quick "forbidden" snog while Christine was attempting to push baby Truely out of her womb.  If Robyn were really "go team Sister Wives go!" she wouldn't have done that.  And the fact that she did it with a smile tells me that it was far from the first time she'd played sneaky-sneak with Kody behind her sister-wives' backs.  Make no mistake, Kody is a massive, massive tool for wasting even one extra second trying to get some Robyn action before heading to the hospital to be with Christine, but I have to believe that he was so enamored of Robyn that had she said, "No, Kody!  No pre-marital shenanigans!" he would've obeyed like a good little lapdog.  It all started to go downhill from there.  Her 287-part plan had been hatched.

[NoWhammies]

Plus, if you watch all of Robyn's tearful moments (of which there are many), she makes the facial expressions and vocal afflictions of "crying" but nary a tear forms in her tiny dry eyes or rolls down her extra-wide face to land on her lumpy neck.

Edited March 24, 2021 by NoWhammies

[Granny58]

On 3/22/2021 at 11:27 PM, kitkat68 said:

I think the downfall of Kody and Meri started when they divorced so he could marry his true love, Robyn. I think it really hurt Meri, and she never let on how much it hurt. Then she ended up being catfished and that was used to put all the blame on her. 

agreed.  I am one of the few who didn't fault Meri through the catfishing, because of how hurt and lonely she must have been.  

[NoWhammies]

2 hours ago, Granny58 said:

agreed.  I am one of the few who didn't fault Meri through the catfishing, because of how hurt and lonely she must have been.  

Putting on my therapist hat. I'll apologize for my armchair diagnosis. I know many of you dislike those - but I do have the background and education in family therapy (I am not a practicing family therapist) to make at least an educated guess. I'd be unable to make an actual diagnosis from anything I see on TV, but as the Brown fambily masks have slipped over the years of this show, there are breadcrumbs that point in a certain direction. I've been rewatching all seasons from the start with that in mind, because I actually find it a fascinating case study into a type of family dysfunction that most people would never even get a peek into. Disclaimer: this is not a professional diagnosis nor is it intended to be one. It is merely observations and supposition based on my understanding of human behavior.

What I think we're seeing is textbook family dysfunction, amplified significantly due to family size, polygamy, cultural and religious pressure, conditioning, and Kody's and Robyn's undiagnosed personality disorders.

Meri definitely has personal issues she needs to work out, but so do we all. Her defensive and dysfunctional behaviors have amplified over the years, and understandably so. The catfishing was a cry for help and an attempt to find a solution to feeling trapped in something that suddenly stopped working for her. It was magical thinking; Meri believed it was her out, and she probably believed God sent her the opportunity. When it turned out that it was all a sham, it must've felt to her just another slap in the face from God.

Add to that the fact that, for all her life, Meri was led to believe that if one doesn't do well in polygamy, it is due to a personal weakness and inability to subjugate oneself to God's will. Imagine how disorienting that must feel, to be told all your life that "keep sweet' philosophy, and to believe that if polygamy feels personally uncomfortable, it's because of YOU - because God entrusted this to you and dammit, you're fucking it up (I firmly believe Fucking It Up should be a diagnosis in the DSM-5). Add to that the religious tenet (or tenant as the Brown family likes to call it) that spirit babies wait in Heaven to come to moms along with Meri's fertility issues, and I can imagine that in Meri's mind, she feels somehow unworthy or as if she has failed in her duty and must, therefore, be in some way offensive to God. In other words, it's highly likely that Meri believes that Heavenly Father hates her, and because of her religious background, she can't find any other possible explanation for that. And she is terrified others will arrive at that conclusion, as well, so she as she puts it, builds walls in hopes that others won't notice that she is somehow displeasing to God.

I believe Meri also suffers from CPTSD (complex PTSD - often the result of being on the receiving end of years of narcissistic abuse). Watch her in family gatherings; she's afraid to speak because she no longer trusts her own instincts, and she doesn't feel safe using her voice, which leads to her defensive outbursts and attempts to control every situation with passive aggression or outright aggression. With that being said, Robyn zeroed in on Meri as her chief rival and has slowly whispered in everyone's ear everything she sees as "wrong" with Meri while acting to Meri's face like she loooooooovvvvvvveeees her. So Robyn has been quietly sewing the seeds of discord among the entire family with a smile on her face and a gently furrowed brow of "concern." When you watch Robyn in talking heads, you'll see that the gently furrowed brow is one of her go-to moves of manipulation (along with the affects of crying minus the tears). It's how she deflects from her own duplicity. 

I believe Robyn was so threatened by Meri's first and legal wife status, that she has waged a stealth bitch campaign (Stealth Bitch should also be in the DSM-5) from the very beginning. Why? Because SHE should have been there since the start, not Meri. Hell, it was her opening line, and as someone rightly pointed out, it's popped out in some seriously dysfunctional ways over the years like the highly inappropriate and damaging purity speech and the super craptastic drawing she had made of Kootie and the kids (thumbs up, Robyn!).

The clues are often subtle (but not always), but they are there. Robyn has succeeded in making Meri the family scapegoat (or identified patient) who then becomes the perceived source of all fambily dysfunction. Kootie was the first to buy into this scapegoating, but you can specifically see it from many of the family adults now, including all three other wives, Meri herself, Maddie, and Mariah. They can scapegoat Meri and deflect from their own dysfunction and cognitive dissonance arising from how their religion says this should all go versus their own personal experience. 

Meri loved Robyn and feels she invited Robyn into the fambily. She most likely did this in an attempt to appease God, who she was already sure was mad at her or found her unworthy. Bringing in Robyn was an attempt to make her worthy in God's eyes and in Kootie's. On the surface, Robyn expresses love and gratitude to Meri for doing this while scheming for Meri's downfall underneath. So Meri is experiencing cognitive dissonance. The dysfunctional way humans psychologically attempt to resolve cognitive dissonance is through rationalization and justification, and Meri lacks the psychological tools or understanding to deal with these things in a healthy manner. Viewed through that lens, Meri's behavior, defensiveness, and victimhood are a natural reaction of someone who is poorly psychologically equipped to handle Robyn's machinations.

Robyn has many observable tools of deceit that serve to deflect from her behaviors: faux empathy, crying (or pretending to), martyrdom, fake soft sweetness, faux concern with her furrowed brow - the list goes on and on. The fambily eats that shit up with a spoon rather than recognizing what's actually happening because it's easier to see Meri as bad than to acknowledge they have welcomed someone dangerous into their fold. 

What you're seeing is family dysfunction, magnified large. I think Nancy has actually done as good of a job as she can with these people, but they are all so blind to their own dysfunction due to their cultural and religious influences that Nancy is missing some tools to truly help them, and I doubt they'd be willing to be called on their shit (should be a therapeutic term IMHO) anyway. Meri is the product of years of manipulation, gaslighting (true gaslighting, not the pop psych crap people point out as gaslighting these days), misogyny, and religious indoctrination. I have great compassion for her while still acknowledging that she does some super fucked up shit in response to her situation.

I feel like I should be embarrassed that I have thought this deeply about it, but I own my own dysfunction so there you go!

Edited March 24, 2021 by NoWhammies
Edited to add a disclaimer

[65mickey]

48 minutes ago, Granny58 said:

agreed.  I am one of the few who didn't fault Meri through the catfishing, because of how hurt and lonely she must have been.  

I felt the same way. Put most anyone in the situation that Kody and Robyn put Meri in and the reaction would have been the same. Meri was looking for  attention and affection and yes love because her husband pretty much kicked her to the curb to marry Robyn. 

[waterytart]

22 hours ago, Just Wondering said:

Kody declaring himself a lover

Ew.

[Just Wondering]

4 hours ago, itsadryheat said:

Was Robyn always the dark queen or did she grow into that role?

I ask because her early years showed someone with a little spirit, smiled, wanted to be part of the "team". (I guess you could say this about all of them to an extent.) So was she always an opportunist, and her Lehi personality a cover to be unleashed when the time was right, emboldened by Kody's blind devotion.

For someone that gets what she wants, she sure does not look happy or healthy. Season after season she touted how important her sister wives relationships are to her.

Currently, her dour mug and dead attitude exudes Let Them Eat Cake.

I agree with your analysis of Robyn’s demeanor at first.
She truly may have gained her eventual confidence from Kody’s unconditional, passionate love for her. Like the love of a desert King, heady! 😜

Robyn had all the support she needed in her husband, so why continue to take crap from the serfs, who were situationally weak and unfit to rule after years of unresolved resentment, constant loss, unrelenting inequality, and bad taste in men. As Kody’s second in command, Robyn just naturally began treating the others the way Kody did. They deserved no better. 
And, after all, they did receive magnanimous crumbs from her charger. 
 

[Onceafan]

I caught up on the most recent episodes, and had 7 pages of notes jotted down just for Kody. To avoid a very long post on every red flag and issue that I identified with him, I'll just start with the biggest I saw. Counselor hat on....

Kody: Fair weathered, projective identification with emotional blackmail tendencies,

Projective identification:

It is a type of controlled manipulation that Kody often uses on his wives that leads them to act in a way that justifies in his own mind, his negative attitude and behavior towards them. Let’s take Kody being on his phone consistently when he is over at Christine’s residence, or what we usually refer to as the silent treatment.

Whenever a spouse withdraws or becomes non communicative for long periods of time it signals to the other that there is a problem in the relationship, leaving in this case Christine to wonder “what did she do wrong to upset him?” This leads to two possible outcomes, both which play into Kody’s manipulation.

The first is the spouse, Christine, will try to cater to the silent person in anyway possible, just to keep the peace and get things back to normal, since she knows there are competitive households that she is up against.   I saw this when Christine mentioned that she has spoken to Kody about his schedules with the wives, but he gets annoyed and angry, so she just tries not to think about it or mention it to him anymore.

In this case, her valid concern over the inequality of time he spends with her was silenced by her attempt to placate him. Therefore the problem/concern is never really resolved, and Kody continues to use a withdrawal of communication as a manipulation tactic to control his own schedule or other desires.

This type of manipulation ties into his emotional blackmail tendencies with his wives. He is able to control the amount of communication, attention, time, and affection that each wife receives, leading to a reward/punishment emotional shutoff power dynamic. Kody has other wives, or resources if you will, to have his emotional and physical needs met, while each wife’s needs are solely dependent upon him.  This control dynamic allows him to be fair weathered in his marriages, leaving the wives to learn that they themselves are responsible for any negative outcomes in the marriage because they did not comply to Kody’s desire of not wanting to be burdened but to visit an always happy always devoted household when it is their designated time.  

The second outcome that usually occurs from the silent treatment, is that the spouse, in this case Christine, becomes upset by that behavior, loses composure, and can launch a verbal altercation.  In projective identification, Kody would then use Christine’s reactional behavioral response, not his own, as his justification to not want to spend time with her, which then gives him the freedom of either leaving that residence to go to another that is being more compliant, or stonewalling her in his time there. 

Sorry, I tried to make this as short as possible, With Kody, I could just go on and on.

 

[NoWhammies]

12 minutes ago, Onceafan said:

I caught up on the most recent episodes, and had 7 pages of notes jotted down just for Kody. To avoid a very long post on every red flag and issue that I identified with him, I'll just start with the biggest I saw. Counselor hat on....

Kody: Fair weathered, projective identification with emotional blackmail tendencies,

Projective identification:

It is a type of controlled manipulation that Kody often uses on his wives that leads them to act in a way that justifies in his own mind, his negative attitude and behavior towards them. Let’s take Kody being on his phone consistently when he is over at Christine’s residence, or what we usually refer to as the silent treatment.

Whenever a spouse withdraws or becomes non communicative for long periods of time it signals to the other that there is a problem in the relationship, leaving in this case Christine to wonder “what did she do wrong to upset him?” This leads to two possible outcomes, both which play into Kody’s manipulation.

The first is the spouse, Christine, will try to cater to the silent person in anyway possible, just to keep the peace and get things back to normal, since she knows there are competitive households that she is up against.   I saw this when Christine mentioned that she has spoken to Kody about his schedules with the wives, but he gets annoyed and angry, so she just tries not to think about it or mention it to him anymore.

In this case, her valid concern over the inequality of time he spends with her was silenced by her attempt to placate him. Therefore the problem/concern is never really resolved, and Kody continues to use a withdrawal of communication as a manipulation tactic to control his own schedule or other desires.

This type of manipulation ties into his emotional blackmail tendencies with his wives. He is able to control the amount of communication, attention, time, and affection that each wife receives, leading to a reward/punishment emotional shutoff power dynamic. Kody has other wives, or resources if you will, to have his emotional and physical needs met, while each wife’s needs are solely dependent upon him.  This control dynamic allows him to be fair weathered in his marriages, leaving the wives to learn that they themselves are responsible for any negative outcomes in the marriage because they did not comply to Kody’s desire of not wanting to be burdened but to visit an always happy always devoted household when it is their designated time.  

The second outcome that usually occurs from the silent treatment, is that the spouse, in this case Christine, becomes upset by that behavior, loses composure, and can launch a verbal altercation.  In projective identification, Kody would then use Christine’s reactional behavioral response, not his own, as his justification to not want to spend time with her, which then gives him the freedom of either leaving that residence to go to another that is being more compliant, or stonewalling her in his time there. 

Sorry, I tried to make this as short as possible, With Kody, I could just go on and on.

 

Part of me would love to get a peek at that big fat file Nancy has on them...

[Granny58]

On 3/23/2021 at 4:43 PM, Twopper said:

But it rilly begins with Robyn butting in when Solomon is being birthed and offering her womb to carry Meri's baby.  To me this was just jumping the gun.  I could see someone saying something like 'I know you are considering another child.  I've been reading pregnancy stuff recently because I was preggers and I have seen a lot about IVF.  You might consider that.  If you try it, and it fails,  then I am here to say I would carry the baby for you if you weren't able."  or something.  This, to me, is very dark Robyn.  

you're less cynical than me because you see it as an actual offer.  To me, a person who has dealt with fertility issues, it struck me as a stealth way of saying "see, I'm fertile and you're not."  Who the hell offers their uterus as they're giving birth (or shortly afterwards) for crying out loud.  IMO, it was cruel, not generous.  

[itsadryheat]

20 minutes ago, Onceafan said:

Kody’s desire of not wanting to be burdened but to visit an always happy always devoted household when it is their designated time

One of the many problems created by Kody's perpetual chaos is, it appears, there is no "designated time". At least according to Christine. Apparently we are supposed to believe his pop ins, when and if they happen, are enough to sustain plyg adult and child relationships. I guess that works if one is afflicted with stockholm syndrome, are checked out, leading a double life, and/or using or manipulating the pop in. Healthy people cannot live a healthy life in a state of chaos. Which is one of Kody Brown's super powers.

His comment this season about not believing in polygamy anymore is very interesting. Why would he say this after publicly touting this stupid, disrespectful lifestyle for years? Could he be saying this as a result of the separate housing? That can't be, he doesn't even like 3 of them or their housing. He only has this show and that Flagstaff Palace with the queen because of polygamy.

Rewatching previous seasons is like watching a different show. I wish they would live in one house, or TLC ditches Kody and the queen, and gives us the ExSisterWives of  Kody Brown.

[Twopper]

1 hour ago, Granny58 said:

you're less cynical than me because you see it as an actual offer.  To me, a person who has dealt with fertility issues, it struck me as a stealth way of saying "see, I'm fertile and you're not."  Who the hell offers their uterus as they're giving birth (or shortly afterwards) for crying out loud.  IMO, it was cruel, not generous.  

I agree with you.  I think I should have put "offer" in quotes.   It was just Robyn also wedging herself into Meri's relationship with Kody.

[Rabbit Hutch]

On 3/23/2021 at 11:06 AM, itsadryheat said:

Thanks for bringing this up LK. I too was gobsmacked by the number of "collectibles" hoarded by frugal Robyn. Not a space to be seen. The massive amount loaded into those not cheap cabinets represent more of a problem than a hobby...

 

I noted with interest that one small wall had no less than 3 paintings on it, one atop another.  I did briefly wonder if they were originals or not before the camera moved on..

[Sandy W]

11 minutes ago, Rabbit Hutch said:

I noted with interest that one small wall had no less than 3 paintings on it, one atop another.  I did briefly wonder if they were originals or not before the camera moved on..

Remember when Meri was trying to get back in good grace after the CF incident, she painted her "fillin's" for each of the wives.  Maybe Janelle and Christine left theirs on the table and Robyn snatched them up, just to prove what a compassionate SW she is.

[absolutelyido]

So, Janelle, Gabe and Savannah are sitting outside in lawn chairs lamenting how they can't see Kody because of the pandemic. Because apparently it didn't occur to anyone that Kody could come by and pull up a lawn chair 10 feet away and be perfectly safe.