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S15.E02: Felons No More

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7 minutes ago, Mothra said:

This wasn't the first time Kurly made his outraged speech against how dare the government interfere with what consenting adults do in the privacy of their bedrooms.  And I'm sure it won't be the last.

The problem is, his legal troubles (such as they are, or as he imagines them) don't have to do with what consenting adults are doing in the sack.  The problem is that *marriage* is not just a societal or religious state; it's a legal state in the US, and whether you're married or not makes a big difference in how we as individuals interact with our government, starting with taxes and continuing through (but not ending at) property ownership and inheritance laws.  I know Kurly knows this; why does he pretend we don't?

These are complicated and so far unsolvable problems.  Good for Robyn for mentioning abuse of women and children, but that's not what is upsetting Kurly and his pals. 

Exactly. Since polygamy undermines (to put it mildly) basic human rights, the government has to either keep it completely off the books or abolish marriage altogether due to the legal nightmare/headache it would cause. Not that Kody and Co. really want the freedom to legal marriage since it would deny polygamists the federal assistance Christine erroneously says they can’t get.  

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34 minutes ago, Tabbygirl521 said:

I despise Kody. 

I haven't in the past so much, but this current season seals the deal.  He is a total jerk to those (stupid) women and he finally admits it, but still expects THEM to work out their problems...the problem is HIM. 

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As far as receiving assistance goes: wouldn’t Christine and Janelle just be considered unmarried moms? So what if they name Kody as the dad and he’s legally married to someone else? Happens all the time. The problem for them is that he’d be on the hook to reimburse the state and we can’t have that.

I wonder if perhaps Joe D actually loves and respects his wives. That would help everyone live under one roof. 

Edited by Tabbygirl521
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7 hours ago, Meowwww said:

Wait.  So the Dargers live in Utah.  They were on tv, Papa Joe has campaigned for polygamy.  They didn’t get arrested or have to flee the state....

Right? And while we're on the subject..where was all this fear and concern when the Browns were traveling to Utah to look at wedding venues/attend the wedding of Mitch and Aspyn??? 

Gee, Kody, could a reason that your wives want to take separate cars on trips is because no one wants to be trapped inside a vehicle with your insane, agro energy? Exhausting.

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I was wondering about that when Christine said they get no handouts because they cannot register for anything without calling attn to their situation. Come on Christine, do you really expect us to believe Kurly and Janelle provided for 13 children and 4 adults with no help ?

That means that Christine actually looked into getting some type of welfare at some point, instead of getting a damn job or putting a stop to the baby train. I hate these people.

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, bichonblitz said:

Yeah, not believing that one. I think if he was making that kind of money combined with TLC money they would have 4 new homes on Coyote Pass by now. He also wouldn't have told Meri they didn't have the money to help her with a down payment on the B&B.  

even if true, I think he would have told Meri that.  He hates her. 

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28 minutes ago, deirdra said:

When they were still in Lehi, Christine mentioned that she used her foodstamps to do her part to add to the fambly pantry.  That is known as welfare fraud; taxpayers were funding foodstamps for the single mother and her 5.5 kids, not the baby daddy, his other two wives and 7 other kids.

Maybe they were afraid of being prosecuted for this, and that is why they left for Nevada.

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3 minutes ago, Teafortwo said:

Maybe they were afraid of being prosecuted for this, and that is why they left for Nevada.

That and a bunch of unpaid bills is my guess, but Kootie and his concubines cried persecution.

Edited by deirdra
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24 minutes ago, Kid said:

Kody is such a dick and let me count the ways:

1.  He pontificates that what adults do in their bedroom is no one else's business.  I happen to agree with that. However, be prepared to financially and emotionally support the crotch fruit that you produce in that bedroom.

2.  He speaks of his "wives" with utter contempt and derision.  And the look on his face when he talks about them is like he sucked a lemon.

3.  He considers himself the head of the family yet he blames everything that is wrong with the family on the women.  And , the one time that he grudgingly admits that the problem with the family may be his responsibility, his admission is strategically timed to happen when there is a third party around to say, "Oh no, that's not true."

4.  He treats the women like they are children. That scene packing the car is a perfect example. And the worst part is, they let him.  If  Christine wants to go in a separate car, she should just get in her car and drive away and leave him standing there flapping his gums.

I don't know how any of them can stand to be around him.

Absolutely.  I would not want to be squished into a car and would definitely take my own car if my so-called husband insisted on squishing everyone into one car.  

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I mentioned the information below (from Wikipedia) in the live chat, because their crying about Kody's going to jail and their ongoing persecution was so fake, it was offensive.  Based on the size of the Chicken McNugget on Janelle's face and Joe Darger's mentioning legislation (not law), this episode had to be filmed about a year ago, pre-OVID, of course.

The Browns challenged Utah's criminal polygamy law in 2011 and prevailed in district court in 2013.  The US Court of Appeals ordered the case dismissed on standing in 2016, because the Browns had no credible fear of prosecution.  (Utah only prosecuted polygamy when there was evidence of victim or fraud.)  Polygamy was decriminalized in May 2020.

The show producers had contacted the Utah Attorney General's office months before the series was broadcast, in anticipation of legal scrutiny. The AG had not ruled out pursuing a case against the Brown fambly, but also stated the office did not have the resources to go after polygamists unless they are suspected of serious crimes such as child abuse or child trafficking.  Nobody in Utah had been prosecuted for practicing polygamy since 2001. 

In September 2010, on the day after the show's premiere, the Lehi police announced they were investigating Kody Brown and his wives for possible charges of bigamy, a 3rd degree felony, which carries a possible penalty of 20 years in prison for Kody and up to five years in prison for each wife.  The charges were dropped in 2012.

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Kody doesn’t annoy me any more than the wives do. So far, it’s Robyn and Christine who are irritating me.  I can imagine why Kody is frustrated. In their faith the husband is supposed to be the head of the home.  His wives ignore or laugh at him.  Yet he continues to support them in a style that none of them can really afford.   It doesn’t make a lot of sense.  I think Kody may be wondering how he can actually divorce these women, who he is not really married to.  If he does  that, they all can move back to Utah without fear of repercussions. 

Edited by SunnyBeBe
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4 hours ago, Shelbie said:

Kody looked  is angry and demented for most of  all of the episode. 

FTFY. 

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Last week, Kody asked the wives if they had married him/chosen this lifestyle because of love or because of religious commandment.

This week, there's a whole conversation about polygamy laws and Robyn argues the need to protect girls, etc.

I would argue that the law against polygamy is (hopefully) also protecting women who are entering plural marriages simply because they feel their religion commands them to do so. Although clearly the ban on polygamy isn't working very well.

What I have taken from these two episodes (besides the fact that Kody is an absolute idiot and this family as a whole is completely dysfunctional) is that entering a plural marriage because your church tells you to is a dumb thing to do. I have no idea where Utah currently stands on polygamy, but I understand where they are coming from.

Also, Kody? It's not just men who have days when they think their marriage is great and days when they think it's a disaster. I'm pretty sure this happens to every married person, whether they are male or female. What an assy thing to say.

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Just like the fundie Christian crowd, the men can get fat and lazy, but the women are expected to keep their girlish figure, even when they have baby after baby.  

Why, oh why, and how, how, do these women marry these patriarchal asshole men?  Get out of the cave, ladies.  

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18 hours ago, Just Wondering said:

Meri acting like Kody angrily unloaded on her while she was going pee pee.

That was very revealing of how warped her perception is and how raw her sense of (misplaced) persecution is.

6 hours ago, Adeejay said:

So, if Meri has cut her string to Kody, then I can’t help but wonder why she is still around. 

And that was very revealing of how much of a shit-stirrer and professional martyr she is.  There was absolutely no need to bring up anything about that in front of everyone, especially since it is so completely untrue.

6 hours ago, winsomeone said:

Why did Robyn get up from her chair and do that little jig? I missed what was said before she did that?

Robyn was reacting to Meri's shit-stirring that I referenced above, and said she was trying to make herself as big as possible to be a wall...implying to be a wall between Kody and Meri at that point.

8 hours ago, itsadryheat said:

He sure has lost that loving feeling and become nasty. His behavior during the packing scene seemed like he is afflicted with ADD, I wanted to pop a horse tranquilizer in his arm. His comments and the look on his face in the talking heads tell us everything we need to know about the realities of his "love needs to be multiplied not divided" dogma.

7 hours ago, Natalie68 said:

God he is an asshole.  His contempt for his wives is palpable and I do not know how they stand it.  

Those comments of his, along with the facial expressions and tone of voice, is absolutely the worst I can recall seeing from him in all my time watching the show.  And the bolded is the exact wording that I said out loud a few times while watching!

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8 hours ago, Sandy W said:

It would have made more sense to rotate drivers when stopping for potty breaks, that way, Robyn could have rode "shotgun" for Christine or Meri when it was their turn at the wheel.  Kody did say that he was under pressure to return home as he had 'Business' to attend to and I found it interesting that with a 16 hour round trip plus at least 3 hour filming time, there must have been an overnight stop at a motel along the way but there was no mention made of that or the room assignments and sleeping arrangements.  Even if Kody had borrowed Robyn's She-Ra cape and drove both ways straight through, the camera crew would not have been expected or even allowed to do so.

 

 

Janelle said they got in about 11 pm the night before and we all know Robyn and Kody were in a room together. 

I loved them saying they could have been arrested if Kody got pulled over. Yeah, that seems credible. Maybe if they were all drunk and he was driving 130 MPH. 

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I feel like it’s weird.  All of a sudden they are worried about the child brides and abuse etc.  Back in the day, they ignored this to be all Rah Rah polygamy must be legal!   
It’s a huge turn for this season and one that always bugged me.  
Ugh.  
And Meri feels hopeful.  
 

Edited by Meowwww
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12 hours ago, TurtlePower said:

One word: YAWN! 

Are they trying to bore the crap out of us? And I feel like the whole flat tire thing was a director drama set up. It just felt fake. This show is becoming so.......boring. 

Becoming? 😂

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7 hours ago, Tabbygirl521 said:

I despise Kody. 

Same! He reminds me of a rodeo clown. But crankier.

4 hours ago, Teafortwo said:

Maybe they were afraid of being prosecuted for this, and that is why they left for Nevada.

Yes! That was my understanding, from reading earlier blogs, etc.

Edited by Art Of Noiz · Reason: Duplicate
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18 hours ago, CocoPuffs said:

Lol. Not gonna lie. I’m out. I watched the first episode but when I saw it was mostly a rehash (just like the eleventy billion episodes before it), I quit. I didn’t even watch last night’s show. Like many of the much wiser COLs of this board, I’m just going to read here for recaps. They are great!

The more of us that do this (not watch but get the info here), the sooner this shit show gets cancelled and Meri, Christine and Janelle can start their new show “Life After Sister Wives!”  And Kootie and Sobbin can start looking for the perfect trailer to live in, with dual masters and enough bedrooms for each child and her parents.  I CANNOT WAIT!

Edited by HighlandWarriorGrl
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1 hour ago, CocoPuffs said:

Like many of the much wiser COLs of this board, I’m just going to read here for recaps. They are great!

Welcome to the Can't Watch or Will Destroy Our Mental Health But Worship Those Who Take One for the Team COL Club.

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4 minutes ago, HighlandWarriorGrl said:

The more of us that do this (not watch but get the info here), the sooner this shit show gets cancelled and Meri, Christine and Janelle can start their new show “Life After Sister Wives!”  And Kootie and Sobbin can start looking for the perfect trailer to live in, with dual masters and enough bedrooms for each child and her parents.  I CANNOT WAIT,

Yeah. There might be a spinoff starring only Robyn. Living my why: How to repurpose shipping crates into compound homes. 

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15 hours ago, Grifter Lives said:

...the Lehi police announced they were investigating Kody Brown and his wives for possible charges of bigamy, a 3rd degree felony, which carries a possible penalty of 20 years in prison for Kody and up to five years in prison for each wife. 

Sounds like that Wiki article needs a correction. The third degree felony sentencing matrix for a first offender is 0-5 years. Always has been.

2nd degree is 1-15 years and 1st degree is 5-life.

Edited by suomi · Reason: clarity
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10 hours ago, bichonblitz said:

Yeah, not believing that one. I think if he was making that kind of money combined with TLC money they would have 4 new homes on Coyote Pass by now. He also wouldn't have told Meri they didn't have the money to help her with a down payment on the B&B.  

And Christine wouldn’t have had to ask fans for surgery money.  

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What a pointless episode.  Absolutely nothing new to see here.  Do they really think we’re dying to see more road trips to visit people who’ve been on the show before?  They need to start picking it up, this wasn’t even snark worthy, it was just BORING. 

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3 minutes ago, Kbo said:

What a pointless episode.  Absolutely nothing new to see here.  Do they really think we’re dying to see more road trips to visit people who’ve been on the show before?  They need to start picking it up, this wasn’t even snark worthy, it was just BORING. 

I'd have rather seen Kolleen Snow and Kristen Decker again! 

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I have some more random thoughts.

First,  I was struck by how Janelle just seems almost bubbly. Loquacious! I wonder if she's taking anti depressants. Its really a change in her. 

Second..at the Darger lunch, it showed Kody and Joe, standing back, arms folded, cheesin', watching all the wives (Except ROBYN) prepare meal. Ok, yeah, I know men still do that, but Geez guys, yall are being filmed. 

Robyn. Can't step up and offer to slice a tomato? Somehow I doubt you helped clean up kitchen. But thanks for the wall dance, sssweetie.

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2 hours ago, CocoPuffs said:

Lol. Not gonna lie. I’m out. I watched the first episode but when I saw it was mostly a rehash (just like the eleventy billion episodes before it), I quit. I didn’t even watch last night’s show. Like many of the much wiser COLs of this board, I’m just going to read here for recaps. They are great!

Shoot, I don't even have cable TV anymore. I'm just fine with Netflix and Prime along with the free local TV news station at the moment. I sure as HELL am not going to pay extra just to watch the Browns do a lame, un-funny version of Bing Crosby, Bob Hope, and Dorothy Lamour's "Road" films.  

Between this forum and the "Surviving Sister Wives" podcast, I'm totally fine.

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Kurly is SO angry and persecuted this season. He hinted at it last year in the episode with the wife beater.  Why the toddler meltdowns getting the car packed? Why the macho man fear of being seen in a van? Why don’t your wives get along? You’ve been playing them against each other for years, genius. The verbal and mental abuse he showers on Meri and Christine would make me homicidal. Meri thinks he needs to spend more time playing with fellow plygs, but there aren’t many in Flagstaff. Joe’s family seems less drama driven. Their house is set up to support their lifestyle. I don’t believe Joe likes Kurly that much and sees him for the showboat he is. Christine is angry and on the attack, and just not hearing anything that sounds like living in one house. Robin has realized she is not in the relationship she thought she was getting. Kurly is no prince, and she and her kids showed up too late to be part of the original family. Meri has been phoning it  in for years now.  Janelle just keeps rolling along. Brown chaos plus menopause has killed this crew. Stick a fork in them, they’re done,

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3 hours ago, Art Of Noiz said:

I'd have rather seen Kolleen Snow and Kristen Decker again! 

At this point I miss Sam. 

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So did Joe shave off his beard during their visit?  That was strange!  Can you imagine visiting somebody and have them do a transformation while you're there???

So let's figure out sleeping arrangements at the motel!  Kody and Robin in one room...maybe.  Or did Kody get his own room?

The wives could share two rooms.  Two and two.  But since they are terrible at sharing and Meri just won't share because she's never been treated fairly  and Christine has made it clear she's not sharing living arrangements my guess is they got five rooms and TLC paid in a modest motel!

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12 hours ago, Granny58 said:

I haven't in the past so much, but this current season seals the deal.  He is a total jerk to those (stupid) women and he finally admits it, but still expects THEM to work out their problems...the problem is HIM. 

I always hope the wives inform Kodoofus they've resolved their issues by agreeing he's the problem, and he needs to leave for good within 24 hours.

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I watched most of the episode. I need to still watch the last 20 minutes or so. But two episodes into the new season, I am once again already losing interest. The whole thing seems contrived, just like last season. They go to Utah to visit a polygamist family living in Utah, and then whine about how dangerous it would be living as a polygamous family in Utah. Except that other family had least one TLC special of their own, because I remember them from before. And I'm pretty sure it's been a very long time since anything was arrested for just polygamy and no other related crimes, so Janelle claiming she's afraid to be pulled over for speeding because they'll be arrested for polygamy is crap. 

Also, how many times can we really watch Kody throwing Christine under the bus over the one house thing? Even if she agreed, it is questionable whether could afford a house like that or get zoning approval for it. The other family had a normal sized house and lived together in it. 

Somebody come get me when one of the wives actually leaves. Until then, I'll be over here watching 90 Day Fiance and Dr. Phil.

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6 hours ago, Jeanne222 said:

So let's figure out sleeping arrangements at the motel!  Kody and Robin in one room...maybe.  Or did Kody get his own room?

The wives could share two rooms.  Two and two.  But since they are terrible at sharing and Meri just won't share because she's never been treated fairly  and Christine has made it clear she's not sharing living arrangements my guess is they got five rooms and TLC paid in a modest motel!

This trip shows how little TLC spends on and values the Browns.  They drove in one car overstuffed with suitcases and random running shoes.  Meri should have said that she needed to drive herself because she was going to spend an extra day or two to check in on her inn, and Christine should have claimed that she was tacking on a visit to Aspyn or Mykelti, just to avoid that miserable car ride to and from Utah.  

Imagine the original carpool: Christine, Meri and Janelle would have been crammed in one backseat for 8 hours.  They probably wouldn't fit.  (I noticed how big Christine was in her 7-minute Darger hug.)  The older children must have watched the younger children in Flagstaff while the adults were away.  I wonder if Robyn's children were self-contained, or if Christine's daughters had to babysit.

Also, how does Kurly think that he can look cool driving down the highway: windows down, wind blowing off his hairplugs and ruining his curls?  And, does Robyn sleep until noon on trips? 

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10 hours ago, Art Of Noiz said:

 

Second..at the Darger lunch, it showed Kody and Joe, standing back, arms folded, cheesin', watching all the wives (Except ROBYN) prepare meal. Ok, yeah, I know men still do that, but Geez guys, yall are being filmed. 

Robyn. Can't step up and offer to slice a tomato? Somehow I doubt you helped clean up kitchen. But thanks for the wall dance, sssweetie.

Robyn is too pretty to cook.

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4 hours ago, Kellyee said:

I watched most of the episode. I need to still watch the last 20 minutes or so. But two episodes into the new season, I am once again already losing interest. The whole thing seems contrived, just like last season. They go to Utah to visit a polygamist family living in Utah, and then whine about how dangerous it would be living as a polygamous family in Utah. Except that other family had least one TLC special of their own, because I remember them from before. And I'm pretty sure it's been a very long time since anything was arrested for just polygamy and no other related crimes, so Janelle claiming she's afraid to be pulled over for speeding because they'll be arrested for polygamy is crap. 

The Dargers not only had a one-off TLC show (as I recall the family opted out of going for a series based on the turmoil filming would be in their lives) but they've published at least one book (prior to the Browns' NYT bestseller), been on news shows talking about their lifestyle any number of times (20/20 for example), run at least one REAL business, have prominently been lobbying for polygamy rights (it was the Dargers, not the Browns, who showed up at the court dates for the Browns' ultimately failed lawsuit) and Papa Joe even ran for mayor (I think) of his town.  Also, they were on two past episodes of SW already. 

So yeah, they aren't afraid. 

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20 hours ago, Mothra said:

The problem is, his legal troubles (such as they are, or as he imagines them) don't have to do with what consenting adults are doing in the sack. 

Exactly.  Kody can rest well knowing that the government does not care that two of his wives are sound asleep, one is softly weeping and one is doing online research about bananas while he's in their bedrooms.

 

20 hours ago, Shelbie said:

IME most women become less able to tolerate bullshit and far bolder about voicing their opinions as they age and start peri menopause. 

So much this.  The hot flashes suck but man, is it freeing to say whatever I want and however I want.  My husband still isn't sure what happened, lol.  I see this happening with Christine mostly.  I think she plainly sees what the rest of us see but isn't sure how to fix it without losing the TLC money she so desperately needs, for things like food, shelter and her children's surgeries. 

 

19 hours ago, Tabbygirl521 said:

Joe Darger seems like much less of a dick than Kody, so maybe that’s why their lives seem less fraught. 

To me, he has an underlying mean and controlling streak - as opposed to Kody, who has the mean streak but controls his life as well as a ringleader in a room full of drunk clowns.

 

16 hours ago, JenMcSnark said:

Absolutely.  I would not want to be squished into a car and would definitely take my own car if my so-called husband insisted on squishing everyone into one car.  

Imagine the smell...sorry, but seriously.  Fritos, hair gel, sweaty caveman, tears, AquaNet, lots of damp polyester and probably some Axe body spray?  No thank you.

 

13 hours ago, Shelbie said:

They want to be arrested. They want to be persecuted. It would guarantee another couple of seasons.

THIS.  Kody is not special if he's not being persecuted.  I think he loves to ride the line of being openly plyg and wanting the attention, but only the right kind of attention - the "whoa, dude!  Four women!  You da man!" kind, not the "you have the right to remain silent" kind.  Although at this point, maybe a stint in jell would be the vacation away from these shrewish harpies that he's been dreaming of for years.

 

8 hours ago, Tabbygirl521 said:

At this point I miss Sam. 

Sooner or later, you're all going to come around to my point of view - Never!  Enough!  Catfish!

 

Edited by laurakaye
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