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Keywestclubkid

S01.E01: Welcome to Salt Lake City

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I was in Salt Lake City 8 years ago for a basketball game and it was very difficult finding a place that would serve booze.  We had to buy food first, and then we could order a drink.  I don't know what it is like now, but, all the liquor stores were owned by the state and the booze was expensive.  It may be completely different now, but I was surprised to see all the booze now.  Another memory of that city was, we saw so many good looking people.  I noticed most of the women at the game were  very stylish.  If anyone lives there, feel free to correct me on my facts.  We spent just one day and night in Salt Lake City.

I'll give this show some more time.  I love the mountains and the snow and these ladies seem harmless so far.   I also thought Heather looked manly.   She just has a very strong jaw line.  From the previews, the men on this show do not look camera shy.  I'm hoping for the best.

 

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44 minutes ago, Baltimore Betty said:

 Embarrassing is one thing but telling her child misinformation about getting aids from kissing a girl at this point in their lives is nuts, even the older son was saying that is not really accurate...I wonder what sort of sex ed she had. 

Oh definitely, I probably should have been more clear. I meant it was embarrassing in every possible way including how misinformed she sounded. Not sure it if she even knows the difference between HIV and AIDS. Also, the bit where she was asking him if girls have been sexting him felt like a scene that was manufactured for the cameras as opposed to it feeling like an organic conversation. 

I'm curious if the rest of Jen's family are still active LDS and whether or not there was any rift wrt her converting to Islam. 

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2 hours ago, Mahamid Frauded Me said:

I was thinking the same thing, he is an assistant coach which I would guess makes about 300K a year if that, so I too wondered where all the money comes from, and also for her to afford what 3 assistants ?  

If I remember this right, Jen has her own successful business, can’t remember what tho. Heathers ex was from a billionaire family thanks to somehow inheriting money via Howard Hughes. Must have gotten a good divorce settlement and now she has the spa. Lisa (I think) has a tequila business. One of them ( can’t remember which one) supplies clothes for celebrities. Can’t remember the rest or if they even said what their husbands do. 

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There’s been some posts online from current and former members of Mary’s church. If these accounts are true (and I have no reason to believe they’re not), then Mary and her husband/granddaddy are straight-up abusive cult leaders. I’ll post a link below to one particularly detailed post about Mary’s history and the church. It’s really terrifying stuff.

https://www.removeddit.com/r/BravoRealHousewives/comments/js96n5/the_tea_on_mary_and_her_granddaddy_husband_from/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

ETA: This is from a post one member/former member made on Reddit. The original poster got really freaked out about the church finding out and then deleted their account. This is a link to the original post, preserved via some internet magic I don’t completely understand.

Edited by MrsWitter
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7 minutes ago, MrsWitter said:

There’s been some posts online from current and former members of Mary’s church. If these accounts are true (and I have no reason to believe they’re not), then Mary and her husband/granddaddy are straight-up abusive cult leaders. I’ll post a link below to one particularly detailed post about Mary’s history and the church. It’s really terrifying stuff.

https://www.removeddit.com/r/BravoRealHousewives/comments/js96n5/the_tea_on_mary_and_her_granddaddy_husband_from/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

 

Well that got dark quick 

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So of course Bravo knows all this, and of course Bravo made a beeline to get Mary on the show.

It would be laughable except that there are probably elders and other vulnerable folks who are her victims. Honestly, even after only one episode, Mary seems a bit unstable to me.

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I think the reason Mary married her step grandfather was $$$$.   I think the man was also WAY younger than her grandmother.

I mean it's not like Mary married a blood relative or anything, and I get the feeling that some of these women might have married a blood relative.   She and her husband remind me of Father Divine and Mother Divine. 

Interesting that Mary was the only Black woman they could find to be on the show...makes me go hmmmm. 

I get a Welcome of Plathville" vibe from this show.  (Look, the cloning experiment worked!

Oh, and all these women have the same hairstyles.

Strange to see teenage girls getting facials.  

Edited by Neurochick
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Sounds like Mary is running a truly repugnant god-scam (for once, Bravo's cameras might be on the side of right revealing that) and her holy transformation has been... well, not just internal! She's been blinded by the laser light!

From the link MrsWitter posted: "Mary looks NOTHING like she did just a few short years ago. Her and bishop disappeared from the church for almost 3 years. All the time while they were gone, Bishop was calling into the church during church meetings, saying she was in New York in the hospital on her death bed with the same kind of huge boils that afflicted her grandmother and that they needed hundreds of thousands of dollars to perform the life saving surgeries she had so she wouldn't die. Finally, after those 3 years of further draining their congregation on their money, Mary showed up at the church with half the nose she had before, twice the cheeks, brand new eye lids, half the skin, a completely different rack of teeth, looking 100 shades lighter and had blonde hair. All the while she forbids her female followers from having blonde hair cause she says that it's a sin to try and look white. She claims that she had no work done and that she's been illuminated by God." 

"..the smell of hospitals as I suffered through the deep darkness of one elective cosmetic surgery after another!"

 

Edited by film noire
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6 minutes ago, film noire said:

as I suffered through the deep darkness of one elective cosmetic surgery after another!"

 

Her oder glands lol like how freaking vain and ridiculous is that? . A more invasive way of removing sweat glands or the nerves that trigger sweating is through surgery. A procedure called endoscopic sympathectomy uses small incisions and special tools to destroy the nerves in the chest that lead to the underarm sweat glands. The procedure is effective for 5 to 10 years.?...

 

lol it only last 10 years??

Edited by Keywestclubkid
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I'm ALL in for this show. 

I agree with the posters who said it is RHOBH meets RHONJ...and i'm hear for it. The casting is perfect.

Many of the other franchises are becoming a bit dull., so I'm happy that we have so new women.

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Well, they've got the scenery and the house porn covered! There is some real wealth on this show, and a whole lot of attitude.

A few first impressions:

Like others, It's going to take me an episode or 2 to keep Lisa and Meredith straight. 

Whitney reminds me of Kristen Taekman (RHNY). Time will tell if her voice gets on my nerves

So far, I like Heather, but there's something Kaitlyn Jenner about her (not that there's anything wrong with it). 

Who gets their "odor glands" removed? Is that a thing? I don't trust Mary, but she seems like she'll bring the ridiculousness, so she might be somewhat entertaining.

The son of the birthday girl (Meredith?) ? Please get off my screen.

 

 

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12 minutes ago, StatisticalOutlier said:

Whichever one had the vow renewal.  Or is that considered too obvious to be allowed as an entry?

 

Her claim bugged me so much that I wrote it down:

The only people who inherited Howard Hughes's estate were his relatives, because he died without a will.  He had no close relatives who survived him, so the heirs were a couple dozen cousins.  If the Gay family inherited any money from Hughes's estate, it would have to be because one (or more) of them was related to him, and there's no indication that's the case.  Just that Frank Gay was an executive for some of Hughes's companies.

As for Hughes loving the Mormons?  There was the famous "Mormon will," which was deemed to be a forgery.  And that did include a bunch of specific bequests, including 1/16 to the LDS church, as well as 1/16 to Melvin Dummar, the guy who claimed he picked up Hughes hitchhiking one time, the story of which was the basis for the movie Melvin and Howard.  And apparently the Mormon will included bequests to some Hughes company executives, which might have included Frank Gay (I can't find a copy of the document), but as I said, it was declared a forgery, and Hughes deemed to have died without a will.

So I don't see how Frank Gay could have inherited any money from the estate of Howard Hughes.  I'm puzzled why she would say such a thing.

 

 

I'm guessing that's the story her in-laws told her, and she never questioned it; maybe to divert from the actual source of their wealth? or it just makes a good story and impresses at parties.

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53 minutes ago, Neurochick said:

I think the man was also WAY younger than her grandmother.

"Twenty years her junior, Robert Cosby joined the Faith Temple congregation and married Rosemary Cosby when he was 22 years old. The two acted as co-pastors up until Rosemary Cosby's death, establishing another Faith Temple church in Indianapolis in 1982."

https://www.deseret.com/2000/1/27/19553698/natural-causes-claimed-church-founder

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I'm going to give this show a shot.  I like that these women have money and that most are married.  Seems like it will be a lot of drama.  Hopefully the hospital smell gate is over and isn't dragged out for the season.  

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2 hours ago, geauxaway said:

Including Chicago husband?  Because....yeah.  That one is dunzo.

I think that marriage was done BEFORE the show even started....(shades of Camille and Kelsey Grammer).   

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I really don't like Jen.  She reminds me of someone I knew in high school, pure poser.  No girl, you're not Black.

Mary's nuts, I mean coo coo for cocoa puffs nuts.  I'll cut her some slack though because if she had to marry her grandmother's second husband, that family must have been all kinds of messed up.  Sounds like grandma wanted to keep the ministry in the family.  

Now "hospital-gate."  First, did Jen tell Mary that her aunt had her legs amputated BEFORE Mary said she smelled like hospital?  Some people have VERY strong reactions to certain smells, not strange at all.  However, Mary didn't have to tell that to Jen

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1 hour ago, MrsWitter said:

There’s been some posts online from current and former members of Mary’s church. If these accounts are true (and I have no reason to believe they’re not), then Mary and her husband/granddaddy are straight-up abusive cult leaders. I’ll post a link below to one particularly detailed post about Mary’s history and the church. It’s really terrifying stuff.

https://www.removeddit.com/r/BravoRealHousewives/comments/js96n5/the_tea_on_mary_and_her_granddaddy_husband_from/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

ETA: This is from a post one member/former member made on Reddit. The original poster got really freaked out about the church finding out and then deleted their account. This is a link to the original post, preserved via some internet magic I don’t completely understand.

That article made me wince, why did Bravo think she would be good for this show, she essentially runs a cult.

When I heard about some of the HW's I thought I heard one of them had a church empire as in Church's Fried Chicken but was corrected and now I wish she had infact been some fried chicken queen instead of a fake prophet, mind fucker, stealer of people's money, shame on her.

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52 minutes ago, SweetieDarling said:

Who gets their "odor glands" removed? Is that a thing? I don't trust Mary, but she seems like she'll bring the ridiculousness, so she might be somewhat entertaining.

She strikes as someone who does not pay her self care bills as in she is seen in your nail salon so that should be payment enough.

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3 hours ago, JennyMominFL said:

So, i am 5 minutes in to episode one and I just watched a woman tell her son he can get AIDS from kissing someone. A someone who has lived with AIDS for 30 years may I just say, FUUUUUUUUCCCCCCKKKK!!!!!!!

I missed this, but omg!  Who said that???

 

3 hours ago, MrsWitter said:

There’s been some posts online from current and former members of Mary’s church. If these accounts are true (and I have no reason to believe they’re not), then Mary and her husband/granddaddy are straight-up abusive cult leaders. I’ll post a link below to one particularly detailed post about Mary’s history and the church. It’s really terrifying stuff.

https://www.removeddit.com/r/BravoRealHousewives/comments/js96n5/the_tea_on_mary_and_her_granddaddy_husband_from/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

ETA: This is from a post one member/former member made on Reddit. The original poster got really freaked out about the church finding out and then deleted their account. This is a link to the original post, preserved via some internet magic I don’t completely understand.

I can't open this page, anyone want to give the bullet points?

The very little I know about Mary disgusts me.

 

2 hours ago, Neurochick said:

 

Strange to see teenage girls getting facials.  

I have been getting facials since grade school, so that didn't faze me.  And if it is the family business, why not?  If the girls start getting injectables though...

 

1 hour ago, SweetieDarling said:

I'm guessing that's the story her in-laws told her, and she never questioned it; maybe to divert from the actual source of their wealth? or it just makes a good story and impresses at parties.

The in-laws are probably like CRAP she is on a reality show, people are going to look into this!

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I'm here for the whole Mormon angle. Much like NJ is helmed by Italian-Catholic women like Tre, I enjoy diving into a different religion and hearing the women talk about their experiences in the church and why they are or aren't still in. I also appreciated them diving into lineage and talking about whose ancestors came in covered wagons or bumped guys off for Howard Hughes. 

Heather is the standout. I see so many similarities between her and Vicki - big personalities who start out oddly relatable and can carry the show.

Jen is not for me. I love her house and appreciate what she's trying to bring, but it comes off like she read How to Make an Impression in Your First Housewives Episode and Become HBIC and she's been waiting her whole life to wear these clothes, deliver these lines, and create a reality TV persona. The crazy outfits, the heels in the snow, the yelling of Islamic prayer verses with "bitches" on the end - yes it's memorable but it's not authentic. She reminds me of Leah on NYC - manufactured and cringey. Sadly, Andy and a lot of viewers seem to be lapping up Leah and I hope the same doesn't happen with Jen because she'll eventually make this iteration unpalatable. 

Whitney.... so cute, so sweet, it can't be for real. Something is off there. I wonder if she's boring and producers just picked her for eye candy, or if something else is going on. We shall see.

Lisa is horrifying, pretty much on all fronts. I am already tired of her. Meredith is a sophisticated, much less grotesque version of Lisa. Here's hoping we only see Meredith next season. 

The less said about Grandfather Fucker the better.

Overall, too many women, and way too much going on in the first episode. I need to get up early for work, Bravo, I do not have time for random hour and fifteen minute premieres that last past 11:00 p.m. Is that rerun of last week's RHOC truly necessary? Can't we put OC at 8 and SLC at 9 so I can get my beauty sleep? It's getting ridiculous that I'm losing sleep to watch this shit. 

My bf, whom I recently moved in with, has gotten a crash course in Ho-wives shows. After observing about 5 minutes of this one, he said, "All the women on these shows look plastic and annoying, but these women look like aliens and Bratz dolls procreated. They look like something that jumped out at me in last year's Halloween haunted house."

I laughed but then realized he's totally correct. 

Edited by thesupremediva1
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3 hours ago, StatisticalOutlier said:

So I don't see how Frank Gay could have inherited any money from the estate of Howard Hughes.  I'm puzzled why she would say such a thing.

Uh oh, the lies are already surfacing. 

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13 hours ago, swankie said:

I could be wrong, but she was probably boinking him long before granny died.  She just gives me that vibe.  

 

I know right?!  Her face looks like she might have been born a male.  She really looks like a man in drag.  Something about her jawline.  But she seams nice and I think I'm going to like her as the show goes on.

I’m so glad someone else said this. All I see in her is a man in drag. Maybe it’s a Mormon lineage trait? I know the jawline gets talked about a lot with the Mormon Sister Wives show.

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2 hours ago, heatherchandler said:

I can't open this page, anyone want to give the bullet points?

I’m going to try to paste the text from the link in a spoiler box. This is an account (re:Mary) from a member of her congregation.

Spoiler

This has been referred to in other posts but I didn’t see it posted in full. This is a comment left on an article from an apparent member of the congregation. Please delete if this is not allowed, I just thought this would be of interest for those whose can’t click around to the comment:

Most of my entire family was born into Faith Temple. What this article and I am sure that Bravo will forget to mention is that Mary had a husband before she married the bishop (1 year after her grandma died) His name is Dana Harris. When Mary's grandma "Mama" died in 1997, Bishop would be preaching and telling all the women in the church that they better leave him alone and not try getting with him. That God already sent Mary Martha to comfort him in his time of mourning. Mary Martha was spending so much time at his house right after that rumors started spreading quick.He would be preaching this from the pulpit, telling the church to quit gossiping and that she was "strictly comforting him." He would go on and say, "Her husband doesn't mind! Why do any of you?". He then shortly thereafter called Dana out in front of the entire church telling the congregation that he was allowing Mary Martha to divorce Dana cause Dana was forcing Mary Martha to perform unclean sex acts on him.(AKA oral sex.) Then he immediately kicked Dana out of the church. Shortly thereafter the Bishop called a family meeting with all of Mamas children including Mary Martha's mom Rozzie Cazares. He told all of the family that he needed them to pray on something that God was telling him and he wanted them all to pray to God and ask him for an answer Yes or No, without telling them what it was. Of course they all said, Yes, Bishop, God said yes. All of them except for Mary Martha's mom Rozzie. She said no. Then with the approval of most of his late wifes children, he told them all that God was telling him and Mary Martha to get married. Hence, that is how Mary Martha married her step Grand Daddie 1 year after her grandma died and became the first lady AND co pastor of Faith Temple Pentecostal Churches. Her Mom Rozzie, who was the choir director at the time, (a job that Mary Martha would take over after she left) was not having the marriage of her daughter to her own step dad so her and her husband Mark Cazares tried to take over the church and kick the Bishop out. That failed so they left the church and took over half of the congregation with her and started a new church called "Mamas Faith Temple. It is also in Salt Lake City. (Now she teaches that she is God, too... More on that next.)

What Bravo will almost surely forget to mention as well is that Mary Martha and the Bishop actively brainwash their congregation into believing that they are God on earth. That God came down and has taken over their bodies and that they are literally the saviors of the earth (alongside Jesus.) They call it the Revelation. Before Mama died it only pertained to her but after she died, Mary and Bishop have taught that it is on them now. They have the church members running around yelling back and forth to each other "Mary ISSSSSS God" and rolling around, speaking in tongues, going crazy over that nut job. Before Mary took over the church, the revelation was "Mama ISSSSS God", but now it's "Mary ISSSSSS God. And the ONLY way to be saved in that cult is to get that revelation and profess it at every chance you get. In secret and to each other, of course cause nobody wants the secret getting out to say,,, the creators of The Real Housewives, franchise.

Let that sink in.....

THEY PREACH THAT SHE IS GOD. THEY ARE CULT LEADERS AND SHE IS THE HEAD HONCHO OF THE WHOLE DAMN OPERATION.

Mary and Bishop justify it by saying that you're not worshiping her, you're worshiping the God inside of her. That they have let God take up his abode in them to the extent where they don't exist anymore and it's all God. People literally bow down and flail at her feet in church and worship them. If by chance you don't and are the odd man out you are immediately targeted and called out by her in front of everyone and the entire church will turn their back on you. You are told that you are an unbeliever and aren't "saved". You become an outcast. There is an internet broadcast of the churches sermons that you can find on Tunein under "The voice of gods ministries." It plays at 10am mountain time and now 10pm as well. Up until Bravo really started getting going with Mary's cast membership they would play clips of Mary claiming she has the "keys to the kingdom" and preaching to the effect that she was God incarnate. They would also edit clips of the old Pastor Mama preaching and Mary preaching intermittently so that Mama would be preaching half a sentence and they would cut to Mary finishing it. Half the time you would get confused if you were listening to Mama or her for short bursts. This is a classic manipulation technique to back up their claim that the Revelation has been passed on to Mary and she is now the word of God. I've noticed that over the last few months they have put a halt to that and are strictly playing Mamas sermons and twice a day at that. Likely because they don't want the world knowing the secret teachings of the church. Also because church members aren't being barraged, beat up, belittled and brainwashed in person every Sunday anymore with COVID, so they are picking at straws trying to hold onto the last "stick with it till the end" members and their paychecks. Gotta keep that money coming in! Mary and Bishop demand that all of the church (CULT) members have their cell phones on them 24/7 to be at their beck and call and if they do not answer when they call, they are silenced and ridiculed and humiliated in church. Members are not allowed to date or marry without the explicit approval of Mary and the Bishop. Then they decide who they can date or marry! They are forbidden from talking to their family members that have left the church. They are not allowed to have internet access, go to the movies, etc. Basically any and all activiites they do besides work have to do with church. Also, all members are required to confess any "sins" that they believe they commit to Mary and Bishop and suffer the consequences of their judgment. They control every aspect of their flocks lives. Mind control to the extreme!

Let me also say this... Mary looks NOTHING like she did just a few short years ago. Her and bishop disappeared from the church for almost 3 years. All the time while they were gone, Bishop was calling into the church during church meetings, saying she was in New York in the hospital on her death bed with the same kind of huge boils that afflicted her grandmother and that they needed hundreds of thousands of dollars to perform the life saving surgeries she had so she wouldn't die. Finally, after those 3 years of further draining their congregation on their money, Mary showed up at the church with half the nose she had before, twice the cheeks, brand new eye lids, half the skin, a completely different rack of teeth, looking 100 shades lighter and had blonde hair. All the while she forbids her female followers from having blonde hair cause she says that it's a sin to try and look white. She claims that she had no work done and that she's been illuminated by God. Yes, Mary and the Bishop have 2 churches and a number of other businesses but it has nothing to do with personal success and everything to do with the funneling of tithe money plus lies, deception, brain washing and psychological terror. Most of their members are on food stamps because Mary and bishop demand nearly half of their income and they say that it is called "A Love Offering". She travels the world in Versace and Chanel while making fun of her members in front of the congregation for wearing clothing from Ross... What a mind fuck when you are too poor to buy anything because your pastor has you on some whack belief that she is God on earth, forces you to give her most of the money that you make and then makes fun of you for coming to church dressed in the best thing that you can afford and says you have a jealous demon against her in your heart. <--- Actually happened, btw!

Some will say that Faith Temple has always been a cult, some will say it became one after Mary Martha's grandma, Mama died and Bishop and Mary took over. I guess that is up for debate. There is one thing that is for sure now though and that is that Faith Temple as it stands today is absolutely, 100% a cult and Mary Martha Cosby is the ring leader that terrorizes it's members with the threat of eternal damnation if they so much as look at her in a way she sees unpleasant. Her and the bishop are single handedly responsible for ruining countless lives and tearing families apart with their ministry of evil and I personally hope that the world sees her for what she is when this airs. That she is exposed for the fraud that she is and that everyone gets privy to the fact that she is a deceitful, homophobic, bigot, criminal that brainwashes her congregation into believing that she is God on earth. Ask any past member. They'll all back this up with mirroring experiences. The reason why so many people have not spoken out yet is because they are God fearing, genuinely good people who's lives could literally be turned upside down by her and him if they do. People are afraid of losing their church friends and loved ones. I was for the longest time too and will probably do so for this... But not anymore.. If she is going to be as bold as she is thinking she can put on a fake facade to the whole world about who she is, I and I know thousands of other ex members are here to stand up to that B.S.

Oh and one final thing. She wasn't forced into marrying anybody. I would be surprised if her and Bishop weren't screwing before Mama died. I can't prove it but I would definitely be surprised and you can be damn sure that her grandmother is gonna whoop her naughty little butt before she burns in hell for all the lives she's ruined and wicked acts she's committed.

 

 

Just now, MrsWitter said:

 

I’m going to try to paste the text from the link in a spoiler box. This is an account (re:Mary)  from a member of her congregation.

  Reveal spoiler

This has been referred to in other posts but I didn’t see it posted in full. This is a comment left on an article from an apparent member of the congregation. Please delete if this is not allowed, I just thought this would be of interest for those whose can’t click around to the comment:

Most of my entire family was born into Faith Temple. What this article and I am sure that Bravo will forget to mention is that Mary had a husband before she married the bishop (1 year after her grandma died) His name is Dana Harris. When Mary's grandma "Mama" died in 1997, Bishop would be preaching and telling all the women in the church that they better leave him alone and not try getting with him. That God already sent Mary Martha to comfort him in his time of mourning. Mary Martha was spending so much time at his house right after that rumors started spreading quick.He would be preaching this from the pulpit, telling the church to quit gossiping and that she was "strictly comforting him." He would go on and say, "Her husband doesn't mind! Why do any of you?". He then shortly thereafter called Dana out in front of the entire church telling the congregation that he was allowing Mary Martha to divorce Dana cause Dana was forcing Mary Martha to perform unclean sex acts on him.(AKA oral sex.) Then he immediately kicked Dana out of the church. Shortly thereafter the Bishop called a family meeting with all of Mamas children including Mary Martha's mom Rozzie Cazares. He told all of the family that he needed them to pray on something that God was telling him and he wanted them all to pray to God and ask him for an answer Yes or No, without telling them what it was. Of course they all said, Yes, Bishop, God said yes. All of them except for Mary Martha's mom Rozzie. She said no. Then with the approval of most of his late wifes children, he told them all that God was telling him and Mary Martha to get married. Hence, that is how Mary Martha married her step Grand Daddie 1 year after her grandma died and became the first lady AND co pastor of Faith Temple Pentecostal Churches. Her Mom Rozzie, who was the choir director at the time, (a job that Mary Martha would take over after she left) was not having the marriage of her daughter to her own step dad so her and her husband Mark Cazares tried to take over the church and kick the Bishop out. That failed so they left the church and took over half of the congregation with her and started a new church called "Mamas Faith Temple. It is also in Salt Lake City. (Now she teaches that she is God, too... More on that next.)

What Bravo will almost surely forget to mention as well is that Mary Martha and the Bishop actively brainwash their congregation into believing that they are God on earth. That God came down and has taken over their bodies and that they are literally the saviors of the earth (alongside Jesus.) They call it the Revelation. Before Mama died it only pertained to her but after she died, Mary and Bishop have taught that it is on them now. They have the church members running around yelling back and forth to each other "Mary ISSSSSS God" and rolling around, speaking in tongues, going crazy over that nut job. Before Mary took over the church, the revelation was "Mama ISSSSS God", but now it's "Mary ISSSSSS God. And the ONLY way to be saved in that cult is to get that revelation and profess it at every chance you get. In secret and to each other, of course cause nobody wants the secret getting out to say,,, the creators of The Real Housewives, franchise.

Let that sink in.....

THEY PREACH THAT SHE IS GOD. THEY ARE CULT LEADERS AND SHE IS THE HEAD HONCHO OF THE WHOLE DAMN OPERATION.

Mary and Bishop justify it by saying that you're not worshiping her, you're worshiping the God inside of her. That they have let God take up his abode in them to the extent where they don't exist anymore and it's all God. People literally bow down and flail at her feet in church and worship them. If by chance you don't and are the odd man out you are immediately targeted and called out by her in front of everyone and the entire church will turn their back on you. You are told that you are an unbeliever and aren't "saved". You become an outcast. There is an internet broadcast of the churches sermons that you can find on Tunein under "The voice of gods ministries." It plays at 10am mountain time and now 10pm as well. Up until Bravo really started getting going with Mary's cast membership they would play clips of Mary claiming she has the "keys to the kingdom" and preaching to the effect that she was God incarnate. They would also edit clips of the old Pastor Mama preaching and Mary preaching intermittently so that Mama would be preaching half a sentence and they would cut to Mary finishing it. Half the time you would get confused if you were listening to Mama or her for short bursts. This is a classic manipulation technique to back up their claim that the Revelation has been passed on to Mary and she is now the word of God. I've noticed that over the last few months they have put a halt to that and are strictly playing Mamas sermons and twice a day at that. Likely because they don't want the world knowing the secret teachings of the church. Also because church members aren't being barraged, beat up, belittled and brainwashed in person every Sunday anymore with COVID, so they are picking at straws trying to hold onto the last "stick with it till the end" members and their paychecks. Gotta keep that money coming in! Mary and Bishop demand that all of the church (CULT) members have their cell phones on them 24/7 to be at their beck and call and if they do not answer when they call, they are silenced and ridiculed and humiliated in church. Members are not allowed to date or marry without the explicit approval of Mary and the Bishop. Then they decide who they can date or marry! They are forbidden from talking to their family members that have left the church. They are not allowed to have internet access, go to the movies, etc. Basically any and all activiites they do besides work have to do with church. Also, all members are required to confess any "sins" that they believe they commit to Mary and Bishop and suffer the consequences of their judgment. They control every aspect of their flocks lives. Mind control to the extreme!

Let me also say this... Mary looks NOTHING like she did just a few short years ago. Her and bishop disappeared from the church for almost 3 years. All the time while they were gone, Bishop was calling into the church during church meetings, saying she was in New York in the hospital on her death bed with the same kind of huge boils that afflicted her grandmother and that they needed hundreds of thousands of dollars to perform the life saving surgeries she had so she wouldn't die. Finally, after those 3 years of further draining their congregation on their money, Mary showed up at the church with half the nose she had before, twice the cheeks, brand new eye lids, half the skin, a completely different rack of teeth, looking 100 shades lighter and had blonde hair. All the while she forbids her female followers from having blonde hair cause she says that it's a sin to try and look white. She claims that she had no work done and that she's been illuminated by God. Yes, Mary and the Bishop have 2 churches and a number of other businesses but it has nothing to do with personal success and everything to do with the funneling of tithe money plus lies, deception, brain washing and psychological terror. Most of their members are on food stamps because Mary and bishop demand nearly half of their income and they say that it is called "A Love Offering". She travels the world in Versace and Chanel while making fun of her members in front of the congregation for wearing clothing from Ross... What a mind fuck when you are too poor to buy anything because your pastor has you on some whack belief that she is God on earth, forces you to give her most of the money that you make and then makes fun of you for coming to church dressed in the best thing that you can afford and says you have a jealous demon against her in your heart. <--- Actually happened, btw!

Some will say that Faith Temple has always been a cult, some will say it became one after Mary Martha's grandma, Mama died and Bishop and Mary took over. I guess that is up for debate. There is one thing that is for sure now though and that is that Faith Temple as it stands today is absolutely, 100% a cult and Mary Martha Cosby is the ring leader that terrorizes it's members with the threat of eternal damnation if they so much as look at her in a way she sees unpleasant. Her and the bishop are single handedly responsible for ruining countless lives and tearing families apart with their ministry of evil and I personally hope that the world sees her for what she is when this airs. That she is exposed for the fraud that she is and that everyone gets privy to the fact that she is a deceitful, homophobic, bigot, criminal that brainwashes her congregation into believing that she is God on earth. Ask any past member. They'll all back this up with mirroring experiences. The reason why so many people have not spoken out yet is because they are God fearing, genuinely good people who's lives could literally be turned upside down by her and him if they do. People are afraid of losing their church friends and loved ones. I was for the longest time too and will probably do so for this... But not anymore.. If she is going to be as bold as she is thinking she can put on a fake facade to the whole world about who she is, I and I know thousands of other ex members are here to stand up to that B.S.

Oh and one final thing. She wasn't forced into marrying anybody. I would be surprised if her and Bishop weren't screwing before Mama died. I can't prove it but I would definitely be surprised and you can be damn sure that her grandmother is gonna whoop her naughty little butt before she burns in hell for all the lives she's ruined and wicked acts she's committed.

 

 

ETA: I can’t fix the double boxes on this post via mobile, but hopefully you can access the info via the spoiler tag!

Edited by MrsWitter
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I really, really, really dislike Jen, she reminds me of girls I knew in college, posers with a capital P.  I am very aware of her shtick. 

I think Bravo added Mary because they didn't want this franchise to be lily white, but ugh, what a choice. 

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39 minutes ago, MrsWitter said:

 

I’m going to try to paste the text from the link in a spoiler box. This is an account (re:Mary) from a member of her congregation.

  Hide contents

This has been referred to in other posts but I didn’t see it posted in full. This is a comment left on an article from an apparent member of the congregation. Please delete if this is not allowed, I just thought this would be of interest for those whose can’t click around to the comment:

Most of my entire family was born into Faith Temple. What this article and I am sure that Bravo will forget to mention is that Mary had a husband before she married the bishop (1 year after her grandma died) His name is Dana Harris. When Mary's grandma "Mama" died in 1997, Bishop would be preaching and telling all the women in the church that they better leave him alone and not try getting with him. That God already sent Mary Martha to comfort him in his time of mourning. Mary Martha was spending so much time at his house right after that rumors started spreading quick.He would be preaching this from the pulpit, telling the church to quit gossiping and that she was "strictly comforting him." He would go on and say, "Her husband doesn't mind! Why do any of you?". He then shortly thereafter called Dana out in front of the entire church telling the congregation that he was allowing Mary Martha to divorce Dana cause Dana was forcing Mary Martha to perform unclean sex acts on him.(AKA oral sex.) Then he immediately kicked Dana out of the church. Shortly thereafter the Bishop called a family meeting with all of Mamas children including Mary Martha's mom Rozzie Cazares. He told all of the family that he needed them to pray on something that God was telling him and he wanted them all to pray to God and ask him for an answer Yes or No, without telling them what it was. Of course they all said, Yes, Bishop, God said yes. All of them except for Mary Martha's mom Rozzie. She said no. Then with the approval of most of his late wifes children, he told them all that God was telling him and Mary Martha to get married. Hence, that is how Mary Martha married her step Grand Daddie 1 year after her grandma died and became the first lady AND co pastor of Faith Temple Pentecostal Churches. Her Mom Rozzie, who was the choir director at the time, (a job that Mary Martha would take over after she left) was not having the marriage of her daughter to her own step dad so her and her husband Mark Cazares tried to take over the church and kick the Bishop out. That failed so they left the church and took over half of the congregation with her and started a new church called "Mamas Faith Temple. It is also in Salt Lake City. (Now she teaches that she is God, too... More on that next.)

What Bravo will almost surely forget to mention as well is that Mary Martha and the Bishop actively brainwash their congregation into believing that they are God on earth. That God came down and has taken over their bodies and that they are literally the saviors of the earth (alongside Jesus.) They call it the Revelation. Before Mama died it only pertained to her but after she died, Mary and Bishop have taught that it is on them now. They have the church members running around yelling back and forth to each other "Mary ISSSSSS God" and rolling around, speaking in tongues, going crazy over that nut job. Before Mary took over the church, the revelation was "Mama ISSSSS God", but now it's "Mary ISSSSSS God. And the ONLY way to be saved in that cult is to get that revelation and profess it at every chance you get. In secret and to each other, of course cause nobody wants the secret getting out to say,,, the creators of The Real Housewives, franchise.

Let that sink in.....

THEY PREACH THAT SHE IS GOD. THEY ARE CULT LEADERS AND SHE IS THE HEAD HONCHO OF THE WHOLE DAMN OPERATION.

Mary and Bishop justify it by saying that you're not worshiping her, you're worshiping the God inside of her. That they have let God take up his abode in them to the extent where they don't exist anymore and it's all God. People literally bow down and flail at her feet in church and worship them. If by chance you don't and are the odd man out you are immediately targeted and called out by her in front of everyone and the entire church will turn their back on you. You are told that you are an unbeliever and aren't "saved". You become an outcast. There is an internet broadcast of the churches sermons that you can find on Tunein under "The voice of gods ministries." It plays at 10am mountain time and now 10pm as well. Up until Bravo really started getting going with Mary's cast membership they would play clips of Mary claiming she has the "keys to the kingdom" and preaching to the effect that she was God incarnate. They would also edit clips of the old Pastor Mama preaching and Mary preaching intermittently so that Mama would be preaching half a sentence and they would cut to Mary finishing it. Half the time you would get confused if you were listening to Mama or her for short bursts. This is a classic manipulation technique to back up their claim that the Revelation has been passed on to Mary and she is now the word of God. I've noticed that over the last few months they have put a halt to that and are strictly playing Mamas sermons and twice a day at that. Likely because they don't want the world knowing the secret teachings of the church. Also because church members aren't being barraged, beat up, belittled and brainwashed in person every Sunday anymore with COVID, so they are picking at straws trying to hold onto the last "stick with it till the end" members and their paychecks. Gotta keep that money coming in! Mary and Bishop demand that all of the church (CULT) members have their cell phones on them 24/7 to be at their beck and call and if they do not answer when they call, they are silenced and ridiculed and humiliated in church. Members are not allowed to date or marry without the explicit approval of Mary and the Bishop. Then they decide who they can date or marry! They are forbidden from talking to their family members that have left the church. They are not allowed to have internet access, go to the movies, etc. Basically any and all activiites they do besides work have to do with church. Also, all members are required to confess any "sins" that they believe they commit to Mary and Bishop and suffer the consequences of their judgment. They control every aspect of their flocks lives. Mind control to the extreme!

Let me also say this... Mary looks NOTHING like she did just a few short years ago. Her and bishop disappeared from the church for almost 3 years. All the time while they were gone, Bishop was calling into the church during church meetings, saying she was in New York in the hospital on her death bed with the same kind of huge boils that afflicted her grandmother and that they needed hundreds of thousands of dollars to perform the life saving surgeries she had so she wouldn't die. Finally, after those 3 years of further draining their congregation on their money, Mary showed up at the church with half the nose she had before, twice the cheeks, brand new eye lids, half the skin, a completely different rack of teeth, looking 100 shades lighter and had blonde hair. All the while she forbids her female followers from having blonde hair cause she says that it's a sin to try and look white. She claims that she had no work done and that she's been illuminated by God. Yes, Mary and the Bishop have 2 churches and a number of other businesses but it has nothing to do with personal success and everything to do with the funneling of tithe money plus lies, deception, brain washing and psychological terror. Most of their members are on food stamps because Mary and bishop demand nearly half of their income and they say that it is called "A Love Offering". She travels the world in Versace and Chanel while making fun of her members in front of the congregation for wearing clothing from Ross... What a mind fuck when you are too poor to buy anything because your pastor has you on some whack belief that she is God on earth, forces you to give her most of the money that you make and then makes fun of you for coming to church dressed in the best thing that you can afford and says you have a jealous demon against her in your heart. <--- Actually happened, btw!

Some will say that Faith Temple has always been a cult, some will say it became one after Mary Martha's grandma, Mama died and Bishop and Mary took over. I guess that is up for debate. There is one thing that is for sure now though and that is that Faith Temple as it stands today is absolutely, 100% a cult and Mary Martha Cosby is the ring leader that terrorizes it's members with the threat of eternal damnation if they so much as look at her in a way she sees unpleasant. Her and the bishop are single handedly responsible for ruining countless lives and tearing families apart with their ministry of evil and I personally hope that the world sees her for what she is when this airs. That she is exposed for the fraud that she is and that everyone gets privy to the fact that she is a deceitful, homophobic, bigot, criminal that brainwashes her congregation into believing that she is God on earth. Ask any past member. They'll all back this up with mirroring experiences. The reason why so many people have not spoken out yet is because they are God fearing, genuinely good people who's lives could literally be turned upside down by her and him if they do. People are afraid of losing their church friends and loved ones. I was for the longest time too and will probably do so for this... But not anymore.. If she is going to be as bold as she is thinking she can put on a fake facade to the whole world about who she is, I and I know thousands of other ex members are here to stand up to that B.S.

Oh and one final thing. She wasn't forced into marrying anybody. I would be surprised if her and Bishop weren't screwing before Mama died. I can't prove it but I would definitely be surprised and you can be damn sure that her grandmother is gonna whoop her naughty little butt before she burns in hell for all the lives she's ruined and wicked acts she's committed.

 

 

ETA: I can’t fix the double boxes on this post via mobile, but hopefully you can access the info via the spoiler tag!

WOW!  Thank you x 100000 for this!  It’s like Scientology with the intimidation, etc.  The money aspect... oof.  I don’t understand how Bravo could hire her knowing all of this.  They must have vetted her.  

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2 hours ago, thesupremediva1 said:

Jen is not for me. I love her house and appreciate what she's trying to bring, but it comes off like she read How to Make an Impression in Your First Housewives Episode and Become HBIC and she's been waiting her whole life to wear these clothes, deliver these lines, and create a reality TV persona. The crazy outfits, the heels in the snow, the yelling of Islamic prayer verses with "bitches" on the end - yes it's memorable but it's not authentic. She reminds me of Leah on NYC - manufactured and cringey. Sadly, Andy and a lot of viewers seem to be lapping up Leah and I hope the same doesn't happen with Jen because she'll eventually make this iteration unpalatable. 

I agree with this 100%; you’re spot-on about how Jen was waiting for a Housewife show.  I too find her unpalatable, not unlike Leah.  Good comparison.  Jen is not head bitch in charge of this show.  If anyone is, at this point, it’s Heather.  Jen wants it too much that it’s off-putting.

After having had almost 24 hours to digest this and watching WWHL, I decided that I despise Jen.  Nothing she can do is going to get me to change my mind about that.  (Technically, if Jen were to do an entire personality transplant and get her ass beat onscreen by another cast member like Candiace over on Potomac, I could theoretically feel sympathy for her and start accepting her, which is the way I feel about Candiace, but anything short of that, Jen is dead to me). 

These women are aggressively stupid, but it’s not obvious, which is a strange combination.  On WWHL, Andy asked Meredith what she thought about Jen throwing a party for her that was more for Jen, and Meredith said that she wasn’t going to “kick” a gift horse in the mouth, which is a malapropism, but it was a well-meant statement, and Jen started going right in on Meredith, reading her...when Meredith was trying to be nice.

Meredith also fumbled a really easy question about her son’s impression of the show, as if she was being asked to solve for cold fusion or something.

Lisa, whom I said I liked, had a scarily hard time following Andy’s game of “agree or disagree” (actually, they all did), and she said she “loves” Bethenny Frankel, so I’m going to have to go back and rethink that one.  

Mary didn’t seem lucid.  

Whitney, I’m not liking her as much as I thought I did.  She also seemed to have a really difficult time rendering an opinion on basic shit.  Also, she’s not as pretty as I thought I was.  I think the footage of this show is about two years old, because it was announced forever ago, and I don’t think she’s aged well in the intervening years.  Meredith and Lisa—even if their personalities are questionable—are both over a decade older than Whitney, and that’s hard to believe.  They all look the same age to me—late thirties—when Whitney is early thirties and the other two are mid-late forties.  

2 hours ago, thesupremediva1 said:

Bravo, I do not have time for random hour and fifteen minute premieres that last past 11:00 p.m. Is that rerun of last week's RHOC truly necessary? Can't we put OC at 8 and SLC at 9 so I can get my beauty sleep? It's getting ridiculous that I'm losing sleep to watch this shit

Exactly!  I think Bravo should start airing new shows at 8, especially if they’re doing a “double feature.”  Their stuff is just not that good that we should have to wait hours for it.  On nights when I have a Bravo show on, my husband and I like to watch a movie afterward.  It’s my way of apologizing for making him watch this shit with me.  Now Bravo just went and blew that whole equation.  Thanks, Bravo.  And don’t even get me started about how they are now promoting After Shows in addition to WWHL, which is the after show.  Do they think they’re offering Masterpiece Theatre over here, or a bunch of super-cheap-to-produce shows about women with more Botox than brains?

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10 hours ago, Baltimore Betty said:

OMG! I could not really take that look in in that brief scene, at first I thought it was Whitney from SC then I thought he was a fun guy who like to wear odd wigs at his daughter's vow renewal...I bet there is an interesting story with that one.

He's a hairdresser and that is his real hair!

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I don't think you'd see any real active Mormons on this show.  The one who is the convert from Judaism and sells tequilas--she's already on thin ice, as they're not allowed to drink. That's why she's calling herself Mormon 2.0. 

I've been interested in the Mormons for years, as I am interested in cults.  This started when I read a long piece in the New Yorker about 35 years ago that explained their ancestry research and proxy baptisms.  (That's why we have Ancestry.com.)  I've seen the famous South Park episode.  I have not seen the Book of Mormon.  I follow an exMormon thread on Reddit.

Last year the "prophet" announced that they could no longer call themselves Mormons.  They have to spell out the whole name: member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.  This is another one of the quirky beliefs/customs of this "high demand" religion.  They are kept busy constantly with meetings and tasks.  Don't forget they have to tithe.  That's why I don't think any serious practicing Mormons would appear on this show.  The Bishop would get to them and they might lose their Temple recommend.  There's a lot of judgmentalism.

I have been to SLC twice to visit someone who used to live there. I visited Temple Square and saw all the stuff they use to try to proselytize to visitors.  Beautiful scenery, really just amazing.  If you love skiing, you would not believe how quickly you can get to the magnificent slopes. 

Edited by GussieK
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Other than Whitney and Mary, I’m having a hard time remembering who is who.  After all the procedures start to melt together and everyone starts to look alike.  This may be too OTT for me...

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13 minutes ago, LibertarianSlut said:

After having had almost 24 hours to digest this and watching WWHL, I decided that I despise Jen.

 

13 minutes ago, LibertarianSlut said:

Mary didn’t seem lucid.  

These two can suck the air out of a room. Hope they don't get the attention they appear to be seeking because it won't be entertaining.  I agree with you about Jen.  That performance on WWHL was too, too much on all counts.  Yeah, Mary seemed to be struggling with whatever it was that she was attempting to portray. 

This group really reminds me of The Real Housewives of Melbourne, down to Jen being another Pettifleur.  Same OTT demeanor and fashion sense.  Same LOOK AT ME vibe.  They even had a snobby brunette and a tough looking blonde with a skin center.  

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7 hours ago, MrsWitter said:

There’s been some posts online from current and former members of Mary’s church. If these accounts are true (and I have no reason to believe they’re not), then Mary and her husband/granddaddy are straight-up abusive cult leaders. I’ll post a link below to one particularly detailed post about Mary’s history and the church. It’s really terrifying stuff.

https://www.removeddit.com/r/BravoRealHousewives/comments/js96n5/the_tea_on_mary_and_her_granddaddy_husband_from/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

ETA: This is from a post one member/former member made on Reddit. The original poster got really freaked out about the church finding out and then deleted their account. This is a link to the original post, preserved via some internet magic I don’t completely understand.

I read this on Reddit and I can honestly say that her marrying her step granddad is the LEAST of the shady things Mary does.  I'm mortified about their cult and how she uses all that donated money to buy designer clothes, plastic surgery and more.  I only hope some of the cult members watch this show and the reality of the situation wakes them up.

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1 hour ago, heatherchandler said:

WOW!  Thank you x 100000 for this!  It’s like Scientology with the intimidation, etc.  The money aspect... oof.  I don’t understand how Bravo could hire her knowing all of this.  They must have vetted her.  

I'm sure it was a deliberate choice by Bravo-- for ratings!

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Someone asked about divorce earlier.  I am not an authority, but I know that if you have a Temple marriage, you are supposedly sealed for eternity.  There's a  lot of hypocrisy, as people do get divorced, and sometimes remarried, but no one really explains what happens to the spouse you were sealed with . . .

Marie Osmond was married, got divorced, married someone else, then they got divorced, and she remarried the first husband!!!  You can tell I watch too much TV of all kinds.

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10 hours ago, Mahamid Frauded Me said:

I was thinking the same thing, he is an assistant coach which I would guess makes about 300K a year if that, so I too wondered where all the money comes from, and also for her to afford what 3 assistants ?  I am not sure I dig any of these women, something is off and can't quite put my finger on it. At this point, I don't find any of them likeable.

College football coaches can earn in the millions. Then there’s bonuses.  

10 hours ago, njbchlover said:

He reminded me of Seth Aaron, a designer that was on Project Runway a few years ago!!  I want to know more about that Dad....interesting backstory, I'm sure!  

image.png.25bc3a0ff397d8ba29574e48adcf51ee.png

I thought the exact same thing!

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9 hours ago, Baltimore Betty said:

 

Can we start a betting pool about which marriage will be done because of this show? 

Well.  Since vow renewals are the kiss of death on the Housewives shows .... I would say Whitney.  

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28 minutes ago, GussieK said:

Someone asked about divorce earlier.  I am not an authority, but I know that if you have a Temple marriage, you are supposedly sealed for eternity.  There's a  lot of hypocrisy, as people do get divorced, and sometimes remarried, but no one really explains what happens to the spouse you were sealed with . . .

Marie Osmond was married, got divorced, married someone else, then they got divorced, and she remarried the first husband!!!  You can tell I watch too much TV of all kinds.

Women can be unsealed and resealed to another man. Not sure how difficult it is. 

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8 hours ago, watcherwoman said:

I was in Salt Lake City 8 years ago for a basketball game and it was very difficult finding a place that would serve booze.  We had to buy food first, and then we could order a drink.  I don't know what it is like now, but, all the liquor stores were owned by the state and the booze was expensive.  It may be completely different now, but I was surprised to see all the booze now.  Another memory of that city was, we saw so many good looking people.  I noticed most of the women at the game were  very stylish.  If anyone lives there, feel free to correct me on my facts.  We spent just one day and night in Salt Lake City.

I'll give this show some more time.  I love the mountains and the snow and these ladies seem harmless so far.   I also thought Heather looked manly.   She just has a very strong jaw line.  From the previews, the men on this show do not look camera shy.  I'm hoping for the best.

 

I'm in. Great scenery, great house porn, women that actually have money. I was so bored with this weeks OC, I just could not make it through the recording, so I moved onto this and was pretty fascinated. Married to step-grandpa is definitely the creepiest thing I have seen on BRAVO and I have been watching since the very first episode of the very first franchise, so that is saying something. Still, I'm in.

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45 minutes ago, ichbin said:

This group really reminds me of The Real Housewives of Melbourne, down to Jen being another Pettifleur.  Same OTT demeanor and fashion sense.  Same LOOK AT ME vibe.  They even had a snobby brunette and a tough looking blonde with a skin center.  

Nailed it!  This is like a poor man’s version of Melbourne, because those bitches were (are? I haven’t watched the show since Bravo last aired it in ‘16) so rich.  But it’s like the Melbourne from hell, because we have Jen who is exactly like Pettifleur, but there’s no Gina, Chyka, or even a Gamble, just Pettifleur and a bunch of versions of Lydia.  Damn, at this point in the game, I’d even take a Janet or a Jackie.  

This is random, but I find topless men with bow ties serving drinks at parties to be perhaps one of the tackiest, most pretentious things ever, so just one more reason to disapprove of Jen.  To bring yet another Housewives franchise into this, that was right out of the Real Housewives of Cheshire playbook.  

I don’t think I will run out of reasons to dislike Jen.  

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7 hours ago, Keywestclubkid said:

Her oder glands lol like how freaking vain and ridiculous is that? . A more invasive way of removing sweat glands or the nerves that trigger sweating is through surgery. A procedure called endoscopic sympathectomy uses small incisions and special tools to destroy the nerves in the chest that lead to the underarm sweat glands. The procedure is effective for 5 to 10 years.?...

 

lol it only last 10 years??

She's totally lying. She left for NYC & got extensive plastic surgery w/ the church's funds. She looks completely different.

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30 minutes ago, LibertarianSlut said:

This is random, but I find topless men with bow ties serving drinks at parties to be perhaps one of the tackiest, most pretentious things ever, so just one more reason to disapprove of Jen.

I could swear I remember Jen saying that one of the shirtless guys was her nephew or something.

 

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1 hour ago, SemiCharmedLife said:

I read this on Reddit and I can honestly say that her marrying her step granddad is the LEAST of the shady things Mary does.  I'm mortified about their cult and how she uses all that donated money to buy designer clothes, plastic surgery and more.  I only hope some of the cult members watch this show and the reality of the situation wakes them up.

I’m hoping the same thing. Sociopathic manipulators and frauds have a propensity to push things too far. The safer thing for Mary’s scheme would probably have been not going on Housewives. With increased attention comes increased scrutiny (I hope). Keeping my fingers crossed that this move blows up in her face.

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9 hours ago, watcherwoman said:

I was in Salt Lake City 8 years ago for a basketball game and it was very difficult finding a place that would serve booze.  We had to buy food first, and then we could order a drink.  I don't know what it is like now, but, all the liquor stores were owned by the state and the booze was expensive.  It may be completely different now, but I was surprised to see all the booze now.  Another memory of that city was, we saw so many good looking people.  I noticed most of the women at the game were  very stylish.  If anyone lives there, feel free to correct me on my facts.  We spent just one day and night in Salt Lake City.

I'll give this show some more time.  I love the mountains and the snow and these ladies seem harmless so far.   I also thought Heather looked manly.   She just has a very strong jaw line.  From the previews, the men on this show do not look camera shy.  I'm hoping for the best.

 

The liquor laws have changed a bit since you’ve been here. It’s a little more relaxed I guess but it’s still a fairly regulated state. 
 

But people who complain about not being able to drink in Utah baffle me. There are tons of bars in downtown SLC. The drinks are measured so you’re not getting a triple rum and coke, but they don’t forbid you from ordering three single drinks instead 😂
 

Anyway, I’m here because I live in Park City and I like seeing local stuff on TV. The two women who live in Park City actually don’t have that “grand” of homes for the area. (I don’t either, not trying to invite myself on the show lol). I’ve just been to some homes here that blow my mind, but they’re second or third homes and people rarely use them. It’s so gross when I think about it. But maybe I’m just jealous. 
 

Also Whitney is what all the Mormon girls under 40 strive to look like, and a lot achieve, and Heather is what most of them end up looking like after kids and whatnot. Not in a bad way, just giving some stereotype context for everyone. 😂

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