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House Greyjoy: We Do Not Reave, Rove, Raid or Rape

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Yara must have gotten her smarts from her mother because Balon & Theon's words should be "What is Brain Dead Will Never Die".

Renly, Stannis and Joffrey were all fighting to protect the territorial integrity of the Seven Kingdoms.  So Balon attacks Robb Stark, the only other major player fighting, like Balon, to break-up the Seven Kingdoms.  Plus, the North offers much less rich pickings than going after the Lannister or Tyrell lands.  Smooth move Balon.

It's one thing for Theon to have broken his word to Robb.  But for the Iron Islands?  That's like defrauding your best friend to get your hands on a portajohn.  But having done that, the moment Theon captured Brann & Rickon, he should have taken them back to Pyke.

And "We Do Not Sow" is far too try hard.  It smacks of new money.  Of course, as lords of the biggest shithole in the Seven Kingdoms, it's not surprising that they're a little defensive.

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Agree that they aren't that bright, but my impression was that their choice to go after the north had to do with being butthurt about the events that lead to Theon being Ned's ward than strategy.

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Sure, they could have attacked Casterly Rock, but what would they even do with all that gold?  They don't buy things.

They could dump it in the ocean and be all, "haha your stupid economy is ruined now." Kind of an indirect version of invading and burning all the fields.

That actually could be an interesting scenario to play out. Westeros loses most of its currency reserves, the Essos banks flip out and won't help them anymore, they scramble to find some new standard only slightly more arbitrary than gold was for their own economy, ....

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I think that, in the books, House Greyjoy was originally founded by sailors who got tired of people making fun of them for being sailors. "Hey, I heard K-Mart is having a sale this weekend? Are you gonna put it on your boat?" That kind of stupid pun-based mockery. So one day, during a sports event, every time the score was tied, and some buffoon had to yell  "Make Greyjoy untie it!" or "Well, what do you expect, with all these sailors here. All they do all day is make sure things are tied... HAHAHA!"

Finally, it was enough already. The sailors got fed up with idiots making bad jokes about them, and they started kicking ass and taking over. The original motto was "House Greyjoy. We Do Knot. So?"

Unfortunately, subsequent generations have continuously misinterpreted its true meaning. Yara probably knows, but doesn't really bother correcting anybody, because being a pirate chick is kind of awesome.

Edited by CletusMusashi
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But having done that, the moment Theon captured Brann & Rickon, he should have taken them back to Pyke.

 

Yeah, that's the irony. If Theon had actually been a hardcore ironborn asshole he'd have no interest in holding a landlocked castle, would've burned it down himself and taken hostages and other valuables back to the islands. That'd be paying the iron price, and he would have escaped whole without meeting Ramsay. Instead he was still trying to be a Stark while loyal to his family. Remember how he promised to be as just a lord as Ned if the people obeyed him, as if they'd all actually yield peacefully? Then, when his men convince him to kill Rodrik, his mate gets out his own sword. Theon only got his sword out and pushed Dagmer away because Rodrik reminded him the man who passes the sentence should swing the sword.

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Even Yara's name is perfect. I can totally picture how the birth certificate got written up.

"King Balon, ye be havin' a wee pirate!"

'Yar!"

"And it be a wench!"

"Yar... uh..."

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^^ HA!

Anyone here a fan of Yara?  When last we saw her, she was shipping out with 50 of the Iron Islands best killers, off to rescue baby brother.

MLn36yi.gif

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Yeah, that's the irony. If Theon had actually been a hardcore ironborn asshole he'd have no interest in holding a landlocked castle, would've burned it down himself and taken hostages and other valuables back to the islands. That'd be paying the iron price, and he would have escaped whole without meeting Ramsay.

Sacking Winterfell = brilliant.  Trying to keep Winterfell = shockingly stupid.  Loot the place, take hostages, and get the hell outta there.  I would have loved the symmetry of Bran and Rickon being sent to Pyke after Theon was a prisoner of the Starks for so long.

Edited by GreyBunny

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That's what I mean, it was almost like Theon was trying to re-write his childhood with himself in charge. He compared himself to Bran and Rickon saying he was only a little boy when he was brought there, and he never tried to escape.

Man, that guy already had such screwed-up identity issues before becoming Reek. His honorable captivity was a disaster any which way since it was based on the false idea that Theon was a valuable asset as Balon's rightful heir.

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Yeah, that's the irony. If Theon had actually been a hardcore ironborn asshole he'd have no interest in holding a landlocked castle, would've burned it down himself and taken hostages and other valuables back to the islands. That'd be paying the iron price, and he would have escaped whole without meeting Ramsay. Instead he was still trying to be a Stark while loyal to his family.

 

Yep - it was Theon's identity issues that screwed him over.  He has the massive headfuck of growing up with the Starks and wanting to be loved and accepted by them, yet always knowing at the back of his head that he is a hostage, and there to be executed should Balon step out of line.  On one hand, they treat him kindly, on the the other, there's always those little reminders that he doesn't belong.

Then he goes home to try and become an Ironborn, and they reject and mock him - telling him he's too much of a Stark.

When he decides on his plan, it's a hopeless mish-mash of Greyjoy and Stark.  Attack Winterfell, but then try to stay and rule.  Tries to be Ned when executing Cassell and fails completely.  Can't bring himself to kill Bran and Rickon. 

Like you say, it's a confused attempt to rewrite his identity.  Sacking Winterfell proves himself a Greyjoy.  Staying to rule it makes him Ned Stark's real son.

I feel really bad for Theon.  I hate what he's done, but you can see how and why he did it.

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2 usurpers down, 1 to go. You're a dead squid walking, Balon. Well, I guess it's 3 usurpers down, but shadowassasin took Renly before he even got a burning leech.

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The most underwhelming and boring House of Season 4

 

The only thing distinctive about the unseen Balon is that he's the only one of Stannis's leeches still alive.  But he's unable to hold on to his conquests.  It's pretty bad when you can't even get supplies to them so they're dying of malnutrition.

 

Yara's attack on the Dreadfort was a wet squib.  Allegedly she took the 50 best killers from the Iron Islands, and presumably took the best of those to infiltrate the Dreadfort.  Yet they couldn't even take out the unarmored Ramsay and the minimally armored guards.

 

Theon S4 was better than his S3, but he was still pretty dull.  I keep hoping he and Ramsay are GoT's answer to Jessie & Todd from Breaking Bad, but I'm not holding my breath.

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For me House Lannister was the most underwhelming, sad to say.

 

Greyjoy isn't really a House on the show, as we barely see Yara and Balon apparently moved to a retirement community offcamera.

 

I think Theon actually had the most consistent material of almost anyone in season 4. Admittedly he didn't have very much, but what he did have was a chance to see the various sides of Theon and Reek, to see how broken Theon is, yet to see the conflict still bubbling up in him. 

 

The bath scene and the scene where he began falling apart when the guy in Moat Cailin called him a woman were two of my very favorites of the entire season. Alfie was incredible. And the shot of Theon riding the horse, holding the white flag, was breathtaking.

Edited by Pete Martell

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B.Cogs has done some interviews mentioning Yara's disastrous rescue mission, and he says she made a calculated decision not to kill Ramsay after realizing Reek was a lost cause, because Ramsay still had plenty of men to fight hers after he was dead and there was no reason to start that fighting again if their mission had already failed. Of course, none of that was communicated onscreen and it just looked like she was scared of Ramsay's hounds, and you'd think she could at least just change the mission from freeing Theon to saving him by putting him out of his misery. I wonder if Meera Reed defending her little brother with an axe was an unintentional similarly, but in that case where the little brother was euthanized, it was made clear Jojen's role in the story was over anyway, that his relevance to the plot only extended to getting Bran to creepy tree dude, so I have to believe Theon was kept alive for a reason. So far, all the major deaths have had plot significance, so it stands to reason the opposite holds true too, and I don't think reason is just to have more torture porn, Theon's identity crisis has always been well written so even that isn't purely senseless, the 3.07 pre-penectomy sequence was the only one I thought was just gratuitous.

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B.Cogs has done some interviews mentioning Yara's disastrous rescue mission, and he says she made a calculated decision not to kill Ramsay after realizing Reek was a lost cause, because Ramsay still had plenty of men to fight hers after he was dead and there was no reason to start that fighting again if their mission had already failed. Of course, none of that was communicated onscreen and it just looked like she was scared of Ramsay's hounds, and you'd think she could at least just change the mission from freeing Theon to saving him by putting him out of his misery.

That's interesting. I agree it didn't come across on screen at all.

Did Yara know who Ramsay was, or was he just some random crazy shirtless dude to her? Just wondering why she didn't try to capture him.

I wonder if Meera Reed defending her little brother with an axe was an unintentional similarly, but in that case where the little brother was euthanized, it was made clear Jojen's role in the story was over anyway, that his relevance to the plot only extended to getting Bran to creepy tree dude, so I have to believe Theon was kept alive for a reason. So far, all the major deaths have had plot significance, so it stands to reason the opposite holds true too, and I don't think reason is just to have more torture porn, Theon's identity crisis has always been well written so even that isn't purely senseless, the 3.07 pre-penectomy sequence was the only one I thought was just gratuitous.

I'm assuming Theon/Reek is going to metaphorically blow up at some point, I just don't know in whose face or faces. Perhaps the failed rescue mission was a foreshadowing of that.

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Did Yara know who Ramsay was, or was he just some random crazy shirtless dude to her? Just wondering why she didn't try to capture him.

 

She knew Ramsay was in command and is crazy and a crazy shirtless dude acted like he was in command, so she probably figured it out. However, I think there were two reasons why she didn't try to capture him. The first one is that it would've been even harder to capture him than to kill him, and the problem of then having to fight all the Bolton men would've still been there, possibly even worse - they might stop fighting if he's dead, but sure as hell not when he's getting captured. And this was more of a SWAT team than an army - the mission was to get in and out as fast and silent as possible, not to conquer the whole fortress. The second reason is that he was still Ramsay Snow, not Bolton, at that time, so what value did he really have in her eyes? Overall, not really worth it.

 

In that light, it also makes sense why she didn't just drag Theon/Reek with her: They had to get out fast and without making much noise, and that would've been near impossible if they had to take him by force. Still, they failed to get that across onscreen.

 

I'm assuming Theon/Reek is going to metaphorically blow up at some point, I just don't know in whose face or faces. Perhaps the failed rescue mission was a foreshadowing of that.

 

I was sure he'd turn against Ramsay in this past season because Ramsay's plan of having him play Theon again was one that could've had backfired easily. What I'm taking from this is that Ramsay was right - the transformation from Theon to Reek is complete and Reek is indeed absolutely loyal to Ramsay and we as an audience have to take them as two personas. So no, I don't think Reek will blow up. Eventually, he'll have to, otherwise this story arc would be incredibly pointless, but he will have to be turned back into Theon before that and it probably won't happen on his initiative. His own sister couldn't make him do that, but I guess someone else will succeed. Maybe one of the Starks. In whose faces will he blow up? The obvious answer would be Ramsay and then maybe Roose and/or Balon Greyjoy. The ovious answer usually isn't the right one on this show, though.

Edited by Conan Troutman

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I'm rewatching S6 and definitely, Alfie Allen needs an Emmy because I was rooting for Theon Turncloak every fucking second he was on screen. I'm glad I've loved Yara and Gemma Whelan's portrayal from the start and first UO, I'll take Theon/Yara sibling relationship waaay over Jon/Sansa. But...

second UO, Euron? I hope he won't be a main player since he's the misstep of the season for me. I didn't need him to be a carbon copy of Book!Euron but he suffers -imo of course- from a complete lack of gravitas. He was more akin to Robert Baratheon midway in his reign than to the haunted haunting deeply creepy Marilyn Manson lookalike I kind of imagined Euron was. I didn't feel the evil simmering under the surface like there was  in Joffrey and Ramsay. It was like getting Viking Obelix instead, to be honest.

I know the actor is supposed to be good, but honestly with the few episodes left I kind of hope for a quick Dorne 6x01-like ending for the Ironborns, except for those already on Dany's side.

Edited by Happy Harpy
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