Ratings and Scheduling: Who's the fairest of them all?

[MelsW]

I'd add that the first few episodes (at least) were genuinely not good.

 

Agreed. I have watched every episode of OUAT original recipe. I was excited for and watched the OUAT: IW pilot and found the acting and writing to be atrocious. I am pretty sure I didn't make it through the full hour. For me (and also the few others I know who like OUAT and gave OUAT: IW a chance), it had nothing to do with timeslot and everything to do with the pilot being awful. There are too many good quality shows on TV, so many I don't have time to watch them all. I won't waste my time on a poorly acted and written 1 hour drama. No thanks.

[sharky]

Yea, I'm still checking tvbythenumbers, although it looks like the users there predicted better season premiere ratings than what is showing up so far. I do wonder how much they will lose or gain in the following weeks once the Frozen hype dies down and people are actually watching the episodes.

[prospazzinator]

SpoilerTV is now reporting a 3.4 in 18-49 rating. 

[Artsda]

It did great! Frozen effect worked.

 

9.3 million and 3.4. 

 

Even the special did good. 5 million and 1.5 

[retrograde]

I do wonder how much they will lose or gain in the following weeks once the Frozen hype dies down and people are actually watching the episodes.

Most of the reviews and comments I've read have been really positive about the Frozen stuff, so it will definitely bd interesting to see if that impacts the +7 ratings and then if latecomers then watch 4.02 live.

[Aliasscape]

My goodness:

 

3.4/10 9.34 million.

 

The full on Disney Frozen campaign worked really, really well.

[Artsda]

Once Upon a Time Hits 23-Month High

 

Go figure. Once Upon a Time‘s decision to incorporate the buzziest Disney characters in a great while paid off in the ratings on Sunday night, as the Season 4 premiere – drawing 9.4 million total viewers and a 3.4 demo rating, and earning a “B+” grade from TVLine readers — surged 11 and 31 percent versus last year’s opener.

That marks Once‘s best numbers since Nov. 4, 2012 (Season 2’s “Tallahassee”).

[sharky]

Wow. I expected a jump but that is a big jump. It will be interesting to see how long they can sustain this and if it will last past the next few episodes or the second half of the season.

[Emma]

Holy smokes. That's a bump up. Way to go show.

Now lets hope it keeps some of those viewers around.

Edited September 29, 2014 by Emma

[Dani-Ellie]

I totally just made it obvious that I was waiting for these numbers instead of working because I gasped out loud (and then explained why I gasped out loud, haha). Holy freakin' shit! Say what you will about the blatant cash grab by snagging Frozen, but it worked at least for a look-see. It'll be very interesting to see if this holds going forward.

[Aliasscape]

I figure on a drop next week but considering it was basically ALL Frozen stuff being advertised for next week, there's a good chance it won't be a drastic drop next week. Maybe a slow bleed. Yeah a lot of people who had to tune in just to see what live action Frozen looks like, and the kids who would have wanted to see probably have parents firmly in the right demos. Thankfully OUAT was smart enough this week not to drag out anything super evil and scary-looking that wasn't Frozen related that would have turned away the kids. They tried to make it super recognizable who the rest of the characters were, from the Beauty and the Beast dance to some "Mirror, Mirror on the wall" lines.

 

And it's true, it was a huge push for a season 4 show. A premiere party with tons of press, TV Guide Magazine cover, Disney store and Disneyworld/land handed out BUTTONS advertising this premiere. They weren't really going "Who loves fairy tales?" this time. It was "Look, Disney's Frozen on TV. Watch!"

 

Oh and trends of OUAT trended on twitter like the whole hour,one went number one worldwide and there were multiple other trends that showed up worldwide a little down the list simultaneously. This doesn't always usually improve ratings but it does reflect what everyone's apparently watching already.

Edited September 29, 2014 by Aliasscape

[Jean]

Well this just proves that Frozen really is a tour de force. Spin off coming perhaps?

[Serena]

Some other demos from last night, because I find them interesting: among teen girls 12-17, OUAT got a 4.2; with older women 12-34 it did even better, 4.4. With boys 12-17 it didn't do as well, with 1.9.

[Dani-Ellie]

Do we know if the half-hours were reported anywhere? I'm just curious if there was any kind of drop at the half.

[kili]

Do we know if the half-hours were reported anywhere?

 

Those usually get released in the afternoon. These are just the overnights. Once usually stays the same or ticks up when the final ratings come in for the night (and does even better on the replay).

 

BTW Nielsen is going to start including online viewing to the ratings and given Once skews young, it could do well there too.

[Artsda]

Half-hours.

 

http://www.tvmediainsights.com/forum/forum/last-nights-ratings/

 

 

 

8:00 p.m.

ABC – Once Upon a Time (season premiere)
Viewers: 9.21 million (#3), A18-49: 3.3/10 (#3)

 

8:30 p.m.

ABC – Once Upon a Time (season premiere)
Viewers: 9.46 million (#3), A18-49: 3.5/ 9 (#2)

[Dani-Ellie]

Ooh, awesome, it went up at the half! That's definitely a good sign. Thank you! :)

[stealinghome]

Excellent for the show! Let's hope they can sustain. If the Frozen stuff continues to be quality (and also 50% of the show), I bet it will.

[KingOfHearts]

The Frozen stuff's reception seems to be a mixed bag on Facebook. Some people hated it, some people loved it. But on the flip side, it seems a lot of people who haven't seen the movie enjoyed it. The Frozen story on the show is pretty fresh, which a lot of viewers appreciate.

Edited September 29, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[RadioGirl27]

Well this just proves that Frozen really is a tour de force. Spin off coming perhaps?

If they take Hook with them so I can stop watching the mother show I'm all for it.

[sharky]

Some other demos from last night, because I find them interesting: among teen girls 12-17, OUAT got a 4.2; with older women 12-34 it did even better, 4.4. With boys 12-17 it didn't do as well, with 1.9.

The cutoff for "older" women is 34? Damn, I'm old. As for boys, I'm sure part of that is also football from last night. I doubt that will tick up much but again, I always wonder about when the show isn't competing against football. At the very least, DVR numbers should play a big role in the first half of this season.

[Featherhat]

They tried to make it super recognizable who the rest of the characters were, from the Beauty and the Beast dance to some "Mirror, Mirror on the wall" lines.

 

Yeah I also thought they were doing that as a hook to non regular OUAT watchers into other Disney motifs. The episode was also lighter than you might expect on in show mythology given what happened in the finale. Well that was partly because half of it was Frozen. I imagine Disney is frantically trying to figure out how to further "broaden" the Frozen franchise as we speak.

 

It is an impressive bump, it will definitely be interesting to see what happens next week. Almost certainly a drop but did people turn up soley because of a massive marketing campaign and disappear now the gimmick of live action Frozen has been played or did the writers succeed in convincing a lot of them to stick around?

[KingOfHearts]

 

The episode was also lighter than you might expect on in show mythology given what happened in the finale.

 

I thought it was much more lighthearted and funnier for the most part. It was more family-friendly. If it keeps the Frozen fans, then I'm cool with it. This show takes itself too seriously, anyway.

Edited September 29, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[Jean]

among teen girls 12-17, OUAT got a 4.2; with older women 12-34 it did even better, 4.4.

I had no idea the show skewed that young with the 12-17 demos. Or is this purely due to Frozen? They usually don't break down the demos unless there's a bragging point to be made.

This might explain the Twilight level of writing and stories. It would probably work even better if they focused on Charming and Hook 30 minutes an episode and have them walk around shirtless.

[Serena]

The show always skews very young. I vaguely remember a statistic from back in season 1 where they were saying Once was the number 1 show children 6-12 watched with their parents. When a child that young watches tv, an adult usually watches with them, and that adult is often in the "main" demo. I think with the show becoming darker/more fucked up/more confusing to follow for children and abandoning the "fairy tale of the week" format, they lost a lot of those children and thus, their parents and that accounted for the loss on demo. Or, the parents decided to DVR the show instead of watching live because of things like the village massacre. Once has always been strong in DVR and it would make sense if some of it were parents switching to delayed watching so they could first check if there any upsetting content.

 

This might explain the Twilight level of writing and stories. It would probably work even better if they focused on Charming and Hook 30 minutes an episode and have them walk around shirtless.

I wouldn't be mad at that. Can they also mud wrestle?

[FurryFury]

I'd take shirtless Hook and Charming over the endless hours of Regina's tears, any day.

[Emma]

Again waiting for tvbythenumbers to post them but many are saying on spoilertv that Once went up to a 3.7 in the key demo.

Edited September 30, 2014 by Emma

[Serena]

Here's TVByTheNumbers (via bragging ABC press release). Those are almost Scandal numbers!

[Artsda]

It went up even more! 

[Jean]

 

Can they also mud wrestle?

Sure. A&E clearly don't know their demos even if they write at that level. Some head honcho should get on their butts. Once just never seemed like a teen soap from the CW show to me even if it was based on Disney princesses and whatnot. Clearly I was wrong. At least for S1, post S1 I can see it descending to Vampire Diaries level, with less hotter people.

 

With those numbers and if Frozen keeps it up, I'm going to be fervently chanting for a Frozen/Charmings/Emma/Rumple spinoff. Make it happen Frozen fans!

[Featherhat]

Sure. A&E clearly don't know their demos even if they write at that level. Some head honcho should get on their butts. Once just never seemed like a teen soap from the CW show to me even if it was based on Disney princesses and whatnot. Clearly I was wrong. At least for S1, post S1 I can see it descending to Vampire Diaries level, with less hotter people.

 

I don't see it being particularly CW. It's always been very sappily romantic with romantic obstacles (Kathryn, Baelfire vs Hook) ABC has always done melodrama, although not usually this young skewing. 

 

They went with OUAT instead of a more grown up version (Fables) because of the Disney vault and being about to use it to create "synergy" between all the brands which inevitably involves both younger demos, those parents looking for something to watch with their kids that isn't on Disney Channel and people looking for some nostalgia. The quality of the writing has dropped since S1 but that's not because they didn't know how young it might skew, a lot of serialised genre type shows run out of stream quickly. 

[stealinghome]

The quality of the writing has dropped since S1 but that's not because they didn't know how young it might skew, a lot of serialised genre type shows run out of stream quickly.

I don't disagree that the show is creatively bankrupt, but I think there was a deliberate (and noticeable) effort to start writing for a younger audience starting in S2. Hell, starting in S2, we've gotten blood-free swordfights!

[Aliasscape]

So now it's the best ratings since the season 2 premiere. Goodness. Adjustments up by more than a tenth are so rare.

 

I seriously wonder how they're gonna take the risk of packing up all the Frozen characters at the winter finale and having little reason for a lot of those viewers to return in the spring. But even so, if they do hold as only as slow bleed, the half season ratings average may push renewal numbers anyway.

 

Also there was this interview with Ben Affleck on Jimmy Fallon last night and he was talking about how as a parent being so sick of watching Frozen (even his 2 year old son demanding to watch it) that he's always looking for something shorter to watch Frozen related. It had me thinking, I wonder how many parents, sick of a year of the same movie, were like I will totally park it with my kid in front of Once Upon a Time over watching that movie for the zillionth time. Elsa, Anna, Kristoff, Sven, Marshmallow and no singing!

Edited September 30, 2014 by Aliasscape

[sharky]

So now it's the best ratings since the season 2 premiere. Goodness. Adjustments up by more than a tenth are so rare.

 

I seriously wonder how they're gonna take the risk of packing up all the Frozen characters at the winter finale and having little reason for a lot of those viewers to return in the spring. But even so, if they do hold as only as slow bleed, the half season ratings average may push renewal numbers anyway.

I have to do some digging but is that jump looking kind of normal for shows this season? I want to say Nielsen is including more "stuff" in the ratings this year like DVR and streaming numbers, which may account for the increase. And yea, I thought that was a big jump too.

 

As for the Frozen characters, I wouldn't be surprised if Disney has no problem taking them back at the end of this half season. There's apparently going to be another Frozen cartoon so I'm assuming Disney is fine with taking back the storyline from Once since they'll just have it somewhere else then instead. That's also why I'm not sure they would ever consider a Frozen spin-off. TV is great, sure, but movies are merchandise are where the real money is at.

[Serena]

DVR and streaming numbers come later. They usually release Live+3 and Live+7 DVR numbers - it's too early for that. Streaming as well, ABC puts up the episode for streaming the day after - so I'm guessing the numbers will come out at least a week after that.

[RadioGirl27]

I seriously wonder how they're gonna take the risk of packing up all the Frozen characters at the winter finale and having little reason for a lot of those viewers to return in the spring. But even so, if they do hold as only as slow bleed, the half season ratings average may push renewal numbers anyway.

The longer the Frozen characters stay, the bigger the opportunity to mess with them is. Frozen is right now very important for Disney, more than OUAT has never been, so I can't see them letting the show keep the Frozen characters to destroy them in the altar of Regina, not even if the ratings are this good all the half season (something I doubt).

[Aliasscape]

I have to do some digging but is that jump looking kind of normal for shows this season? I want to say Nielsen is including more "stuff" in the ratings this year like DVR and streaming numbers, which may account for the increase. And yea, I thought that was a big jump too.

 

 

I'm only talking about Live + SD preliminary vs.  Live + SD final numbers. Yes major adjustments can take place when you look at Live + 3 or Live + 7 numbers. And those are definitely happening for all shows. But the difference between preliminary live + SD (which only includes DVR until 3am the same night and is before any official streaming source has been put up) usually only adjust up or down by one tenth. 3 tenths isn't common.

[KingOfHearts]

https://twitter.com/AdamHorowitzLA/status/517011510938587136

 

Adam's tweet:

 

Final #OnceUponATime Sunday ratings are in -- a 3.7 demo and 10.2 million viewers!  Highest in 2 yrs!  Thank you all so much!  #OnceIsFrozen

Edited September 30, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[sharky]

I'm only talking about Live + SD preliminary vs.  Live + SD final numbers. Yes major adjustments can take place when you look at Live + 3 or Live + 7 numbers. And those are definitely happening for all shows. But the difference between preliminary live + SD (which only includes DVR until 3am the same night and is before any official streaming source has been put up) usually only adjust up or down by one tenth. 3 tenths isn't common.

So the adjustment isn't just based on the live viewing then? The DVR up to 3am to adjust could easily be a factor then considering Brooklyn 99 debuted and football was on. I wonder if people either watched B99 first and then watched the episode right after that.

[FurryFury]

Complete off topic, but Brooklyn 99 was awesome that night. If I were watching live, I'd take it over Once any day. Really funny and cute and and even romance is done well, which is a rare sight these days.

 

I'm a bit wary that Adam and Eddy will think that the increased ratings mean their writing is fine and dandy and will continue to build the show around Regina's tears with requisite 5 minutes of Charmings per episode.

Edited September 30, 2014 by FurryFury

[RadioGirl27]

I'm a bit wary that Adam and Eddy will think that the increased ratings mean their writing is fine and dandy and will continue to build the show around Regina's tears with requisite 5 minutes of Charmings per episode.

This is a scary thought :-( Because the part of the episode that was their responsibility was crap, and only the Frozen stuff was good (God, I don't recognize myself). Anyway, it was the premiere. We should wait a couple of weeks to see if the ratings stay high.

[stealinghome]

Because the part of the episode that was their responsibility was crap, and only the Frozen stuff was good (God, I don't recognize myself).

To be fair, most reviews of the episode I've seen have stated that pretty bluntly. If Adam and Eddie take into account those reviews (which we all know they don't), it should be pretty clear to them that the ratings bump is all Frozen, and that they still need to step their Storybrooke writing game up. I do think it will be really interesting to see how the ratings do over the course of the half-season.

 

Also, I have to agree that no Frozen spin-off is coming simply because I can't imagine Disney wants to expend that much energy into making sure Kitsis and Horowitz don't mess it up (and let's be real, that would be a lot of energy necessary). It's pretty apparently that they're keeping a tight leash on Once's use of the Frozen characters/the show's Frozen storyline in general. For 11 episodes of free publicity, I can see why Disney would think that was worth it. For an indefinite live-action show, when they apparently have their own TV show in the pipe and another movie coming out? No way. I can see them letting Elsa/Anna/Kristoff make the occasional guest appearance, totally, but I can't see them staying on as even semi-regulars (Grumpy, Granny), nor a spin-off.

[Jean]

They're doing a side Broadway show no? I guess it would depend on how much they want to saturate the market. Oversaturation could be a worry for them in which case yeah no spinoff. But I don't know, the 2 actresses are really perfect as Elsa/Anna that I would be tempted. They don't have to bill it as a spin off and just hand off the characters to someone they choose as show runners.

 

 

Did anyone catch the credits? I didn't and will not watch the entire episode but was there any new names that might suggest that they're giving some kind of credit to a company guy? I know the WGA rules are complicated so I don't know if just consulting or overseeing things will garner a credit but just out of curiousity.

[KAOS Agent]

I would hope that A&E are well aware that the bump is all Frozen getting eyes on their show and not the continuing storylines of their regular characters. There's no way Disney lets them have the characters for any longer than this arc, so their job is now to up their game to encourage Frozen fans to stick around. I'd expect episode 2's ratings to drop quite a bit. Just as an aside, I'm sure that Anna left before her wedding because Disney wants the wedding to be a part of some future Frozen sequel and having it have already occurred on Once would not work for them. 

[Camera One]

I don't think A&E has a clue that 3B sucked.  Everything NOT "Frozen" in the Season 4 finale sucked in exactly the same ways, but these ratings will make them pat themselves on the back, and pretty much delay any sort of self-realization of the flaws of the show until a future ratings tank, or not even then.

Edited October 1, 2014 by Camera One

[Mathius]

I don't think A&E has a clue that 3B sucked.  Everything NOT "Frozen" in the Season 4 finale sucked in exactly the same ways, but these ratings will make them pat themselves on the back, and pretty much delay any sort of self-realization of the flaws of the show until a future ratings tank, or not even then.

I hated 3B too, but to play devil's advocate: flaws are subjective. Just because you, I and a subset of fans consider certain aspects of the show and 3B in particular to be flaws doesn't mean that there aren't other subsets of fans who don't and who enjoyed 3B, so Adam and Eddy probably wouldn't really be doing much good listening to our complaints.

Also, they'd likely brush it off as rantings of fans who are angry that Neal died, since those fans are some of the ones that keep on pestering them online to this day.

[Souris]

Just as an aside, I'm sure that Anna left before her wedding because Disney wants the wedding to be a part of some future Frozen sequel and having it have already occurred on Once would not work for them. 

 

I figured exactly the same thing. They're not going to let Once one-up them on the actual Anna-Kristoff wedding.

[Mitch]

I don't think A&E has a clue that 3B sucked.

 

It is subjective as I though 3B was the best the show has been since Season 1 (the after Curse Breaking was such a let down and so uncreative that even with Cora running around I thought it sucked.) They were back in Storybrooke, a mystery villain for the characters, Regina being bitchy but not a psycho, Rump in a cage, etc.

 

I think I will get sick of the Frozen folks soon but right now its a jolt for the show.

[Mathius]

And you're entitled to that opinion. I really, really, REALLY disagree, but you're entitled to it regardless. :)

[Serena]

ABC has decided to delay the "America's Funniest Home Videos" premiere (which airs before Once) one week and re-air the season 4 premiere before episode 402 instead.