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S02.E10: Where Do We Go From Here

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I thought I missed a huge scene between Perez and Nick discussing the chief and his possible involvement with the Greeks...but I don’t think I did.  There was no mention of him being a dirty cop.  

The money hidden in Judy’s paintings was a cool “happy ever after” plot device, but  I wondered how no one in the police dpt Noticed how heavy those paintings were.  They were medium sized canvas paintings with wooden frames. They don’t weigh much.  But addIng a few hundred dollars of stacked bricks to each one would make them considerably heavier than they should be, no?
 
I had a feeling as soon as I saw J & J driving the SUV that Jen’s stop sign (or possibly lack of one) would come into play.  I didn’t see Ben being the driver who hit them...I thought it would be Perez.

I don’t know who the actress is, but I’m not a fan of Judy’s love interest.  I’ve seen her in a few other things, and I just don’t think she can act.

Overall, I enjoyed S2.  I guess they semi- wrapped up most of the storylines in case S3 isn’t on the books.  I would like to see another season, but if it doesn’t happen, I can live with this ending.

 

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1 hour ago, BusyOctober said:

 There was no mention of him being a dirty cop.  

There was nothing explicit, but his sexism and racism certainly meant he wasn't a decent guy, so him being dirty wasn't a huge leap for me to make.

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Jen and Judy are not good criminals; why do they not destroy evidence.  Jen doesn't get rid of the bird, even after Henry finds it again.  Judy keeps the letters that likely have murder confessions in them.  They keep a dead body in a freezer that the kids have access to, then they give away the freezer, which likely has DNA evidence, instead of sterilizing it and taking it to the dump.  They hide cars in storage places that others have access to. They practically ask to get caught.

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23 hours ago, camom said:

Jen and Judy are not good criminals; why do they not destroy evidence.

But isn't that kind of the point of the series--otherwise decent, non-criminal women being forced to figure out how to cover up criminal acts that neither of them ever imagined doing? I'm pretty sure I would not have the first clue of how to cover up any kind of serious crime, because I am not a criminal and don't think like one.

Of course, that is not the only point of the series (friendship and dealing with grief are at least as important), but much of the humor comes from non-criminals trying to cover up criminal acts. 

Edited by Paloma · Reason: clarification
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23 hours ago, camom said:

Jen and Judy are not good criminals; why do they not destroy evidence.  Jen doesn't get rid of the bird, even after Henry finds it again.  Judy keeps the letters that likely have murder confessions in them.  They keep a dead body in a freezer that the kids have access to, then they give away the freezer, which likely has DNA evidence, instead of sterilizing it and taking it to the dump.  They hide cars in storage places that others have access to. They practically ask to get caught.

A lot of actual criminals aren't good at crime. If they were so many wouldn't get caught and be in jail. It would be more unrealistic for Judy and Jen to be skilled at covering up a major crime.

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39 minutes ago, Kel Varnsen said:

A lot of actual criminals aren't good at crime.

I remember reading an interview with a L&O writer, and he said that even when they "ripped from the headlines," they often had to add more to the crime because the criminals were stupidly careless and got caught quickly.

Judy and Jen's crimes weren't premeditated, so of course they didn't think about the aftermath. 

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A lot of actual criminals aren't good at crime.

Of course their crimes weren't premeditated and they aren't "real" criminals.  I'm just surprised at how careless they are with the coverup.  But then I can't imagine leaving the scene if I hit someone with my car, no matter who told me to.

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On 5/16/2020 at 8:47 AM, Chaos Theory said:

I know some people haven’t liked this season as much as the first because there wasn’t as much forward momentum but the show has never been about forward momentum.   At least for me it has been about the emotional stakes of a single act often times done in the heat of the moment.   Last season it was not stopping during a hit and run.  This season it was the murder / manslaughter of the man who killed one of the characters husband after an emotional confrontation.     Was it always logical?   Of course not.   These shows never are.

Well said. I can hand wave away the lack of logic, the coincidences and the unoriginal plot developments (twin brother, troublesome teen). I enjoyed S2 as much as S1. I appreciate the story they are telling about relationships and the destructive effect of lies, secrets and the inability to confront the truth. CA and LC are a joy to watch. 

Liked Perez more and more as the show continued. Hope she and Nick are back for S3. Was a little disappointed that evil police chief/Greek Mafia leader was dealt with off screen. Since we never learned details about his dealings with Steve it makes sense but I wanted to see Nick/Perez enjoying his takedown.

I’m interested to see Ben’s role going forward. He obviously knows that Steve was murdered. At some point, the truth has to come out, right? Guess that Ben will have some secrets to hide, too. 

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On 5/10/2020 at 4:30 PM, preeya said:

Was the twins mother, the same actress from Six Feet Under?  If so, she's had some major work done on her face as she looks so much younger.

Funny, I kept thinking that Linda Cardellini looks so much younger here than she did years ago on Mad Men (which I happen to be concurrently watching). Whatever filter or makeup guru that’s happening here is a dream (not that she isn’t attractive in MM!)

I kept waiting for the show to unravel the mystery of how Jen manages to afford that fantastic house in Laguna. 

Edited by ladle
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On 5/24/2020 at 8:14 PM, chaifan said:

I felt like there's a whole plot on the editing room floor about the chief.  The only way the "we got him" text makes sense is if Nick and Perez were investigating him on their own, but we never even saw a hint of that. 

Agreed - it certainly was convenient for our heroines, but I don't recall even a hint of this plot-point last season or even this season.

Despite the soap-opera silliness, I was still entertained by this season because of the chemistry between the two leads. I enjoy both actresses and love how their characters play off of one another. I'll check out Season 3 whenever it lands!

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12 hours ago, ladle said:

I kept waiting for the show to unravel the mystery of how Jen manages to afford that fantastic house in Laguna. 

She was a successful real estate agent, her mother-in-law made the down payment, and her husband probably kicked in some bucks before he was killed.

Jen has said throughout the show that she's now having trouble paying the mortgage and other bills. (I know they used Judy's ill-gotten gains to repay the m-i-l, but I don't quite get if that affects the mortgage or just that down payment.)

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8 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

She was a successful real estate agent, her mother-in-law made the down payment, and her husband probably kicked in some bucks before he was killed.

Jen has said throughout the show that she's now having trouble paying the mortgage and other bills. (I know they used Judy's ill-gotten gains to repay the m-i-l, but I don't quite get if that affects the mortgage or just that down payment.)

My sense was that she was a mediocre real estate agent, her mother in law only helped with the down payment, and her husband was a stay-at-home parent before he died?  I can't even imagine how much a house like that in Laguna would cost.  

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21 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

 (I know they used Judy's ill-gotten gains to repay the m-i-l, but I don't quite get if that affects the mortgage or just that down payment.)

Didn't Jen say she wanted to sell the house and move into something more affordable? But the Mother in law shut that down because she had a stake in the house. Now Jen doesn't have to worry about that and can just sell the house and move into something smaller (and not the location of a murder). Plus even something half the size of that place would still probably be huge.

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My sense is that despite Jen's personality issues, when working with her former real estate partner, for a long time the two of them made lots of sales of multi-million dollar homes and consequently, many millions in commissions. Ted was a SAHD and didn't bring in much income.

MIL probably staked the purchase of the house to bolster her own image. 

Edited by Ashforth
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On 5/25/2020 at 9:05 AM, BusyOctober said:

I thought I missed a huge scene between Perez and Nick discussing the chief and his possible involvement with the Greeks...but I don’t think I did.  There was no mention of him being a dirty cop.  

We never saw a discussion between Perez or Nick about the chief being dirty. But we knew he was dirty ever since he threatened Judy at Steve's memorial for revealing Steve's money laundering.

On 5/24/2020 at 11:14 PM, chaifan said:

I felt like there's a whole plot on the editing room floor about the chief.  The only way the "we got him" text makes sense is if Nick and Perez were investigating him on their own, but we never even saw a hint of that.  Same with Nick's reaction when Judy told him to listen to the tape somewhere the chief couldn't hear.  He should have been all "what the what?", but instead he was more "ooohhhh, yeah, I get it".  So he knew prior to listening to the tape that the chief was dirty, or at least had strong suspicions.  Bottom line - that plot line had no bearing on anything else.  If you took it out it wouldn't have mattered.  So my guess is there was more that tied in more directly, and it got edited out for time.  Just a guess.   If that's not the case, then I just have to go back to sloppy writing. 

And even if we fanwank that Nick and Perez had discussed their desire to bring down the chief, how would Perez have known that the "we got him!" text was specifically about the Steve Woods disappearance?

The text should have said something like, "The chief is just as dirty as we thought. There's evidence tying him to the Steve Woods murder!"

I really enjoyed season one of this series, and was extremely impressed by how many crazy twists they were able to work into the plot without seeming completely forced. But honestly, this season just seemed like a messy afterthought.

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On 5/12/2020 at 12:05 AM, marshmallows said:

Does anyone on this forum ever like the shows they comment on? Just a general theme I have observed in the multiple shows I go in to read about.

I loved this season. I was actually surprised at how good it was especially after coming off of such a solid and near perfect first season.

I would 10/10 recommend this show to anyone who likes dark humor.

It is funny that Laguna Beach seems to only have like 10 people in it when we all know the population is much larger and all these coincidences probably wouldn't happen. But, it's fiction not real life. I liked all the twists and coincidences TV shows love to do. It helps push the story along and create more drama. It's fun.

Loved all of the cliffhangers. They are going to have so much to work with for s3. Hopefully they can get back to filming soon.

I loved this season too!  I loved that she gets hit by a drunk Ben who then runs away, setting up the next season cat and mouse.  I didn't know how they could actually have a season 3 but that makes it interesting.  

The thing that bugs me the most about this show is Judy's hair. 

Also, I love James Marsden so much.  I would totally do him.

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On 5/27/2020 at 8:58 PM, ladle said:

Funny, I kept thinking that Linda Cardellini looks so much younger here than she did years ago on Mad Men (which I happen to be concurrently watching). Whatever filter or makeup guru that’s happening here is a dream (not that she isn’t attractive in MM!)

 

She looked AWFUL in Mad Men.  I think she looks bad in this too; I hate the hairstyle.  I think she needs a softer style; her face is hard to me.

blogs-the-feed-mad-men-linda-cardellini-

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I will say on re-watch, Jen doesn't hold up as well.  I love Christina Applegate but you do start to tired of her character Jen!

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I can't tell if this episode was a tie up all the plot points for a two season and done show or if a set up for a third season. If it is the latter, I hope to heck that they ditch croaky no mouth movements Michelle and expand Nick. He was perfect this whole season and I wish he had been used more. 

I don't care if there are only 8 people in Laguna, CA. I am along for the ride and not getting into the specifics of "real life" not being portrayed.

 

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True, there wasn't a scene where Nick and Perez sat down and specifically laid all their plans out to us regarding the chief but they definitely did show them making quick comments to each other that gave the impression that they knew something was going on. Perez would also obviously put away her files quickly when the chief came over. It was in either episode 8 or 9, I can't remember, but it stuck out to me because I assumed pinning the murder on the chief would be Jen's way out. Also Judy had given Nick the file and told him to listen away from the chief so that he couldn't hear his own voice. I think you could also tell by the look on his face during that scene that he wasn't surprised to hear that the chief was dirty but was excited to hear he might finally have the evidence.

Anyway, I really liked this season and am excited to see where they go next.

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On 5/12/2020 at 12:05 AM, marshmallows said:

Does anyone on this forum ever like the shows they comment on? Just a general theme I have observed in the multiple shows I go in to read about.

I’ve noticed this too.  When people like shows they tend to be far less vocal about it but bad shows there are pages and pages of people complaining about how baaaad it is.   I think people just like to snark about shows but there comes a point where snarking gets out of hand and sometimes it is nice to have places where you want to talk with other people about shows you genuinely like and I genuinely like this show.  

Edited by Chaos Theory
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On 5/17/2020 at 6:27 PM, RedInk said:

I think Judy will cling to anyone who shows even a tiny bit of kindness toward her...Jen hit the nail on the head when she tore into her. Judy even whispered "I love you" the morning after her first night with what's-her-name. That character trait even taints her relationship with Jen & the kids for me.  She's pathologically needy & loves everyone, so what's real? 

I think what's real is that she loves Jen more than any other person. She was able to say no to her mother because Jen told her she should learn how to say no and Judy avoided the worst by saying no at the right moment. She's aware she's too nice and that's why she gets in trouble all the time. That's what she told Michelle's ex girlfriend, the cop. 

It's not a bad thing to love everyone, what's bad is those people being so mean to her just because she's a nice person. what's bad is Steve being so mean to her and that scene where the cop makes Judy listen to what he last told her again. I don't think Judy is needy. She may have said "I love you" but notice she didn't say it to Michelle. Also when that one left she didn't cry or act like it was the end of the world. So I don't think she really loved her even if she said so in that moment. She can loses everyone but at the end of the day Jen is the one that can hurt her the most. 

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On 5/11/2020 at 11:05 PM, marshmallows said:

Does anyone on this forum ever like the shows they comment on? Just a general theme I have observed in the multiple shows I go in to read about.

I loved this season. I was actually surprised at how good it was especially after coming off of such a solid and near perfect first season.

I just binged this season and came here to see what people thought. I'm really glad I didn't read here during watching because it might have soured the whole thing for me. It kind of makes me wonder what other shows I would've enjoyed more if I didn't look up internet discussions on them.

On 5/12/2020 at 4:32 PM, talktoomuch said:

Primetimer is the corporate reboot of a site called Television Without Pity. The aim was in the title and the tagline: "Spare the snark, spoil the network." No show was spared the snark, even shows we loved. Many of us followed when the site transitioned to PTV. And...we brought our snark with us.

Like many here, I was also a regular on TWoP, and Mighty Big TV before that. "Without Pity" was not actually a mandate, just a tongue-in-cheek ethos. There was always a difference between totally ragging on a trash heap show and humorously tweaking on a show that most did really like.

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On 5/28/2020 at 9:10 AM, ladle said:

I can't even imagine how much a house like that in Laguna would cost.  

It's hard to say exactly, since not much on the MLS looks like that one -- most are modern/contemporary, not on flat lots, and many have ocean views. For a 4/3 or bigger, the prices seem to range from $1.9 million to $12 million. This 4/5 that's 3,800 square feet with a pool and pool house looks the most like Jen's of any I saw, and it's listed for $8.2 million. 

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One of the things I liked seeing this season was how Charlie slowly began to like both Judy and Ben. He seemed genuinely sad when Ben told him to take care of his mom.

On 5/27/2020 at 5:58 PM, ladle said:

Funny, I kept thinking that Linda Cardellini looks so much younger here than she did years ago on Mad Men (which I happen to be concurrently watching). Whatever filter or makeup guru that’s happening here is a dream (not that she isn’t attractive in MM!)

I kept thinking about how she barely looks older than when she was on Freaks & Geeks. She was some very fine lines when she smiles but other than that, she looks exactly the same as she did when she was Lindsay Weir 20 years ago!

@JocelynCavanaugh just seeing your profile picture made me hear "BRINDA" in my head.

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On 5/15/2020 at 6:42 PM, dubbel zout said:

Budding serial killer.

Perez also had a personal grudge against the chief, as did the other cop, so it was probably a lot more satisfying to take him down. 

I hope Jen can get her money back from Parker. I wonder if we'll see her again.

I don't think the dog had found Steve yet; it was just shorthand for the inevitable discovery. 

I thought the phone call and the reaction leading to the accident was the results of the notification after some coroner identified the remains.. If a detective could go out alone low budget, to recover a body with no CSI team or search dogs that department could also just just use a phone call.

With something like 30 minutes an episode instead of the 40 something most network shows of this type run at corners will be cut

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On 5/25/2020 at 8:05 AM, BusyOctober said:

The money hidden in Judy’s paintings was a cool “happy ever after” plot device, but  I wondered how no one in the police dpt Noticed how heavy those paintings were.  They were medium sized canvas paintings with wooden frames. They don’t weigh much.  But addIng a few hundred dollars of stacked bricks to each one would make them considerably heavier than they should be, no?
 

And that money would be shifting around as the paintings were moved from where they were seized, into an evidence room, into Perez's car, etc.  At some point someone should have thought hey, there's something inside this backing.  

It took me a long time to get through this season; in this time of pandemic I find myself filled with anger so often that there were periods of time I just couldn't watch Jen and her rage.

I thought a better ending would have been to leave us wondering whether one or both of them were dead or not.  

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