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S04.E04: Lowkey Losin' It

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The women get together to help Tiffany with her new baby girl; Issa struggles to finalize key details for the block party and turns to Molly to leverage Andrew's connections.

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Original air date: 5/3/20

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I don’t think it was that big of an ask. Not buying the friction because Molly was busy with work and Andrew made other plans, unless it was something that happened several times that they didn’t show.

Molly could have asked for Issa by saying “you don’t have to but my girl is desperate and ...”. Then Andrew wouldn’t necessarily feel pressured.

But they want to have this rift between Issa and Molly go on for a few more episodes.

Meanwhile Condola has gone MIA or is ghosting Issa just as this block party preparation goes into the final stretch.

No wonder Issa is rapping and talking to herself in the bathroom mirror.

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Issa was so good this episode.  This was the funniest she’s been since Broken Pussy, or maybe ever.  

The funniest part of the episode was when she was leaving Condola the voice message and she kept repeating “feedback” and saying she’s been dropping her D’s lately.  It was so awkward and true to life to get stuck in a loop leaving a message and not knowing how to hang up.

There was also, “Oh, your brother got shot?  <Pause> Do you still have access to his phone?  <Pause> Oh, that got shot too?”

And, “Oh, you’ve been saved?  No, I don’t have time this Sunday...”

She was really doing the most.  I love when she talks to herself in the mirror.  I don’t know if it was just Issa’s joie de vivre about life that flowed, even when the water dried up (that kid saying “how old are you?” was the icing on the cake), but Molly just came off as a sourpuss this episode.  

I have no idea why she felt like she was entitled to that parking spot, made a bunch of faces and snapped at Issa a bunch of times, like when Issa jokingly called her ‘Jada’ or when Molly thought Issa was leaving Tiffany’s house to be with Lawrence (when she wasn’t), or agreeing to try to make the contact, but changing her mind without a good explanation, but I just felt like Molly was being a straight-up bitch this episode.  It wasn’t as grey as it’s been in the past.  She and Issa really need to schedule time to just talk out their issues and put their friendship on ice until they do.

I think Molly may simply be too busy for Issa.  As I was watching this show, I realized that you can probably be really good at two of the following three things:  friendships, career, relationship, but not all three at once (I have no idea how mothers fit kids in there) and it looks like Molly is simply blocking out Issa, because right now, in this moment, her work and Andrew are the priority.  

I don’t know, though, maybe I’m reading into it too deeply, because I found that Kelli and Tiffany were ultra-casual when Issa and Molly told them about their respective problems.  When I used to have friends (I guess I sort of have my husband and my career and not many really good friends outside my family), I would have gotten into that shit really deep, so maybe they are able to juggle it all by keeping it more light and cute than sitting down and talking out every comment for an hour, which has been my experience with friends.  

Derek said “some teenage boy is going to try to finger fuck my baby someday” and I died laughing.  I bet every father has some horrid thought like that jump through his head when he has a daughter.  They say, with a boy, you have to worry about one penis, with a girl, you have to worry about them all. 

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Issa has been super self-absorbed this season and the timing of that ask to Molly was terrible considering she's blown off more serious talks multiple times now. However...I kind of think think this is a justifiable time to be obnoxious? Issa is trying to make an enormous life change, beginning with a huge social event that will make or break her brand. If that's not a time to be stressed and self-involved, I don't know when is. Issa also has little bandwidth or interest in being Molly's emotional therapist, which has been her historical role. I think Molly resents that change a little.

Molly just shot herself in the foot, because waiting to turn down Issa is going to look extremely vindictive. She's been pulling a Tiffany and (falsely) bragging about how solid her relationship with Andrew is, so Issa is absolutely going to interpret this as a huge snub. 

Realistic, but blah, at Derek's patriarchal fear of boys touching his daughter. God forbid he focus on raising a woman with a strong sense of self and sexual agency. 

 

Edited by rozen
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Watching Issa and Molly's "friendship" is like a slow motion train wreck.  It's just a snipe here, a side eye there...that's all they do now.

Issa came off the worse for that phone call.  It's not all on her to make the first move, but Issa was also the one who cancelled their meetup to talk on Thanksgiving.  Brushing off Molly like that was foul.  Especially for a favor.

Interesting perspectives on the phone call.  I'm sure Issa saw Molly as judging her for losing her headlining act, but Molly probably saw herself as checking to see if Issa had any legal rights to actually contest the headliner dropping out.  Like a contract or if any dues were already paid.  And it's worse if Issa had Condola handling all the details.

I think it's good that Molly didn't ask Andrew for help.  They're not in the honeymoon phase anymore, but not sure if Andrew is all in, either.

Side eyeing Derek with his speech.  I'm sure he's overflowing with genuine fatherly love, but you don't have to be someone's daughter/wife/sister/mother to deserve respect.

Damn, I'll be mad if Condola ghosted Issa.  I actually like Condola.   

This week's Wine Down was meh.  I'll hear Natasha Rothwell talk about anything, but Tiffany and Kelli have so little to do, so I wasn't really here for a talk about their relationship.  The stuff on Black women and childbirth was good, though.

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1 hour ago, LibertarianSlut said:

I have no idea why she felt like she was entitled to that parking spot, made a bunch of faces and snapped at Issa a bunch of times, like when Issa jokingly called her ‘Jada’ or when Molly thought Issa was leaving Tiffany’s house to be with Lawrence (when she wasn’t), or agreeing to try to make the contact, but changing her mind without a good explanation, but I just felt like Molly was being a straight-up bitch this episode

I agree. Molly is being hyper-sensitive to anything Issa says or does. That parking spot fight was BS. Issa was there first. If Molly is angry that Issa isn't doing a dance of joy to celebrate her relationship with Andrew, she needs to tell Issa that instead of snapping at her, making assumptions, and mm-hmm-ing about Lawrence. Have they both been busy and unavailable, yes. But Issa seems to be taking it in stride, while Molly is huffy.

 

1 hour ago, rozen said:

Realistic, but blah, at Derek's patriarchal fear of boys touching his daughter. God forbid he focus on raising a woman with a strong sense of self and sexual agency. 

Amen. So over this attitude.

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I loved Lawrence's uncomfortable reaction during that conversation.  That's your baby--not really the time to be talking about her in a sexual way.

Who was the phone call from when Issa got the "Do Not Answer" picture on her phone?

The parking spot stuff was BS.  Issa got there first and she was going in the proper way.  How do we know that?  Because once Issa left, Molly pulled forward to back in.

2 hours ago, scrb said:

Not buying the friction because Molly was busy with work and Andrew made other plans, unless it was something that happened several times that they didn’t show.

Are you talking about Andrew and Molly?  They didn't show it but they alluded to it when Andrew came over.  Molly said she had been busy with work but appreciated him coming over.  Then she went back to work. 

But I do side with Molly on not going to him for his contacts at that time.  Issa might not know the situation but part of the reason she doesn't know the situation is because she chastised Molly for sabotaging her relationships even though Molly had a legit concern about Andrew not opening up.  And when she called to ask for a favor in this episode, it was pretty clear Molly wanted to talk but Issa just breezed past that to ask the favor.  Even though Molly was giving her some good advice from a legal perspective.

Edited by Irlandesa
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Isn't Daniel a musician? Why hasn't Issa tried to reach out to him? Not to perform, but he may have contacts and could help in some way. Instead we're stuck with Lawrence trolling around offering nothing but trouble - seeing as, by association, he's the reason Condola is avoiding her. 

It sucks seeing a good fictional friendship disintegrate because it's all too real. The slow unraveling makes it worse. Issa and Molly just need to take a moment to talk it out. Oftentimes people do outgrow each other, but I don't think that's the case here. That things seem to be coming to a head at the halfway point of the season gives me hope that this will be resolved by the finale. 

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I found the parallels between Molly/Andrew and Issa/Molly in this one interesting.

Molly and Andrew are in a relationship.  Molly is in the midst of a difficult work situation that has a lot of pressure and requires a lot of her time, so she can;t give Andrew much of her attention right now.  She expects him to be ready when she's ready and is upset, thrown off balance when he isn't.

Issa and Molly are in a relationship.  Issa is in the midst of a time sensitive work crisis.  Added to that, their the relationship is off but neither has the time to give it the attention it needs.  But Issa does expect Molly to fall into their old groove when she needs it and is thrown off balance, badly, when Molly can't or won't.

While I think most of the blame of their offness lands squarely on Molly, I do think Issa was wrong to ask that favor Molly right now, especially since they can barely have a civil conversation.

Molly was right that that it is a bad idea to ask for a professional favor for Andrew.  it does muddy the waters of their relationship, especially with it being so new.  Although I doubt that Molly's motivations were that pure.  I still thinks she believes that Issa is a fuck up and she doesn't want to have dull her own shine by being any way a party to it. 

I also don't feel that her questioning of Issa about her headliner's contract was in the way of good legal advice.  She didn't actually give Issa any advice on what actually to do to get the headliner to honor the contract.  Just asking her if she had a contract in the first place.  Imo, Her questioning of Issa had just sounded really dismissive, like "duh, you should know this."   It had the tone of Issa being the one fucking up again.  But in that moment, Issa was in crisis mode.  Molly knows how the law works.  Having a contract is all well and good, but in order to enforce it you need resources and time.  Eventually Issa can sue him for breach, but right now she has flyers going out and she needs to salvage her block party. 

So they were both wrong here, but once again I feel that Molly is more wrong.  Kinda like that parking debacle.

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BTW looked like they may have telegraphed the return of Nathan at some point.

I don't think the parking space thing was a big deal, just to have a visual gag of them both trying to get into the spot.

Guess they really wanted to make use of the drone cameras this season.

Edited by scrb
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2 hours ago, DearEvette said:

I also don't feel that her questioning of Issa about her headliner's contract was in the way of good legal advice.  She didn't actually give Issa any advice on what actually to do to get the headliner to honor the contract.  Just asking her if she had a contract in the first place.  Imo, Her questioning of Issa had just sounded really dismissive, like "duh, you should know this."

It wasn't legal advice but it was from a legal perspective in that Issa does have some protections.  Frankly, from what we saw, Issa did go right into crisis mode.  She didn't talk about the contracts, penalties...etc.  She went right into "I need to find someone new now!"  And that is something she should be doing but she should also be applying pressure for the headliner to honor their contractual commitment.  Sometimes it takes a friend who is removed from the situation to bring the thought process back to 1 instead of jumping in on 10.

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8 minutes ago, scrb said:

BTW looked like they may have telegraphed the return of Nathan at some point.

YESS!!! I was so excited to hear his voice. I can’t remember if the Do Not Answer call was before or after that voicemail, but that call may have been Nathan. Maybe he’ll show up to the Block Party?? 🤞🏾

Speaking of, I need this to be a success for Issa! And no matter what trash-ass shit Issa does, I’m always gonna be Team Issa. Sorry not sorry, Molly.

Thank you, show, for not showing Kelli as she DEFINITELY drank that breast milk. Derek is like far too many men who realize the humanity of women only when they have daughters. 🙄 I know Tiffany is supposed to look new-mom-rough, but that blonde wig was ROOOOOUGH.

”I do got attitude.” 😂

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The call that Issa didn’t answer was from Trina, the pain the ass tenant with the mouthy kid.

 

The reveal of Simone was a great visual gag.  No planning at all.

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Molly committed the cardinal sin of parallel parking. You don't pretend like you're going to pull in head first just to block somebody trying to back in normally. People have gotten into physical altercations over doing that.

Did Kelli shade Tiffany's baby? 😮

But how the baby gonna look like Kelli tho? 🤔

I respect Molly for refusing to take advantage of her relationship with Andrew on Issa's behalf. I wonder though if Andrew has actually checked out and is seeing someone else behind her back.

It would seem Condola and Lawrence have broken up. What are the odds she'll return with a baby on board? There were several pointed remarks when he was at Tiffany and Derek's around the baby and stuff.

Edited by Joimiaroxeu
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11 hours ago, LibertarianSlut said:

There was also, “Oh, your brother got shot?  <Pause> Do you still have access to his phone?  <Pause> Oh, that got shot too?”

And, “Oh, you’ve been saved?  No, I don’t have time this Sunday...”

LOL.  Yeah.  This cracked me up.  That whole exchange was great.

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12 hours ago, Amethyst said:

Interesting perspectives on the phone call.  I'm sure Issa saw Molly as judging her for losing her headlining act, but Molly probably saw herself as checking to see if Issa had any legal rights to actually contest the headliner dropping out.  Like a contract or if any dues were already paid.  And it's worse if Issa had Condola handling all the details.

It was telling to me as well that Issa blithely said that her headliner had a contract. Either she wasn't keeping up on the legal side of things because that was Condola's job, or she fell off with the payments since Molly asked if Schoolboy Q was paid. 

I was also on Molly's side in regards to not hitting Andrew up for a favor. Not only are Issa and Molly in a rough spot with their friendship, but her and Andrew are shaky as well. They haven't been together that long for favor exchanges; especially considering he doesn't know Issa that well. He would really be doing it for Molly.

Also, Issa, you can't blow off your friend when she's trying to make conversation only for you to turn around and ask for a favor. I do like that the passive-aggressiveness isn't one sided. Both Molly and Issa are being silly. 

I do want Issa to win, though. I hope Condola didn't ghost her. It's suspect that she's MIA, but she doesn't seem the type to put her professional reputation in jeopardy just because she's mad at Lawrence. 

I'm sure plenty of girl dads have had that same conversation Derek had with Lawrence, but it's still blah AF to hear. It's disappointing when men only see a woman's humanity once he has a daughter. 

Edited by Sheenieb
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13 hours ago, scrb said:

I don’t think it was that big of an ask. Not buying the friction because Molly was busy with work and Andrew made other plans, unless it was something that happened several times that they didn’t show.

Molly could have asked for Issa by saying “you don’t have to but my girl is desperate and ...”. Then Andrew wouldn’t necessarily feel pressured.

But they want to have this rift between Issa and Molly go on for a few more episodes.

Meanwhile Condola has gone MIA or is ghosting Issa just as this block party preparation goes into the final stretch.

No wonder Issa is rapping and talking to herself in the bathroom mirror.

Molly has been passive aggressive.  It wasn't a big ask, but she was annoyed that issa had only called for a favor and she wasn't going to talk to issa about it. 

I don't think this was, for a second, about Molly's relationship with Andrew.  

1 hour ago, DearEvette said:

LOL.  Yeah.  This cracked me up.  That whole exchange was great.

For my money, the winner of the night was "do I look like a magician to you?" while dressed like a black Houdini.  "Do she?!" was an excellent follow up question. 

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1 hour ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

Molly committed the cardinal sin of parallel parking. You don't pretend like you're going to pull in head first just to block somebody trying to back in normally. People have gotten into physical altercations over doing that.

Did Kelli shade Tiffany's baby? 😮

But how the baby gonna look like Kelli tho? 🤔

I respect Molly for refusing to take advantage of her relationship with Andrew on Issa's behalf. I wonder though if Andrew has actually checked out and is seeing someone else behind her back.

It would seem Condola and Lawrence have broken up. What are the odds she'll return with a baby on board? There were several pointed remarks when he was at Tiffany and Derek's around the baby and stuff.

Yeah, Molly was in the wrong there.  But I guess it's more passive aggression.  She would have been livid if someone had scooped that space while she was parallel to the car in front of it.  

I don't think Molly refused to ask Andrew because of the sanctity of their relationship.  I think she refused because she was annoyed and felt that issa had used her.  

All Andrew could do is talk to the artist in question right?  He isn't being asked to strongarm him, so it seems like a fairly small ask.  If the artist doesn't want to do it, issa just goes back to the drawing board.  

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Issa and Molly just need to talk to each other so badly. Not about each other to their friends, but to each other, or else their friendship is going to go down in flames. Sometimes friendships just sort of wain as people grow apart, and thats sad, but it happens. This doesn't really seem to be the case though, I dont think that Issa and Molly are done with each other, just that they have all of these simmering issues that they wont deal with, and are now bubbling to the surface. 

I dont know for sure who is more at fault for these issues, but while I feel like Molly makes the most good points, I think she goes about them the wrong way and for the wrong reasons. She wasn't wrong that Issa should have gotten her headliner under contract, but she came off as so condescending about it, and she didn't exactly give her great legal advice on how to deal with the issue, just told her about how she fucked up. She made good points about why she didn't want to ask Andrew for a favor to help Issa with her block party. Mixing business with personal is always risky, especially when her relationship with Andrew is so new and she and Issa are on rocky ground now, but she, again, came off as so condescending, like Issa was stupid to even ask her, and her reasons for not asking Andrew seemed to be less about keeping her personal and professional lives apart, and more of her not wanting to work with Issa as a fellow young professional, and she prefers it when Molly is the one who is nailing everything and Issa is her messy friend who never grows up. There is so much resentment between the two of them, but I dont think that its too late for them to patch things up. 

Dont be so heteronormative Derek, you have no idea if your daughter will even be interested in boys. For all you know, it could be a teenage girl trying to finger fuck your daughter one day! For real though, that whole bit was funny in a super uncomfortable way, but its always annoying to see men that dont seem to recognize women as humans and not just bodies to try and bang until they have a daughter, like they cant see women as people until they can see them in relation to another man or themselves. I was right there with Lawrence that whole scene. Like, can we not talk about being wanting to fuck your infant daughter as she lays right there in her crib? 

Issa was on fire tonight! The mirror Issa telling her that she has her own stuff going on, and the whole "Your brother got shot? His phone got shot too?" bit was hilarious. 

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Please tell me if I'm way off but I've watched each episode and paid close attention so here goes. I get the impression that Issa is the designated "loser" of her friends group. I've seen on several occasions that the rest notice her choices both career and relationship wise and have a general awww if it makes you happy type attitude but they all seem to expect more of themselves then they do of her. 

So no I don't think it's a big ask for Molly to Andrew at all. At. All. I've done way mire for people not even my friends and it's not a big deal. Worse that happens is it doesn't work out so what.

Don't they see her trying?! Don't they all mess up sometimes? Don't we all? They're not helping they're not supporting and I suspect that if Issa had more career satisfaction and found a really great guy it would upset their order if things and I don't think that's being a good friend at all. 

 

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7 hours ago, funnygirl said:

Isn't Daniel a musician? Why hasn't Issa tried to reach out to him? Not to perform, but he may have contacts and could help in some way. Instead we're stuck with Lawrence trolling around offering nothing but trouble - seeing as, by association, he's the reason Condola is avoiding her. 

Word to all of this, especially Lawrence.   

It would make sense for Issa to contact Daniel.  But someone reminded me (Twitter maybe?) that Daniel pointed out Issa's user tendencies back in s2.  He said Issa used him for a quick fling, then again when she needed a place to stay.  So maybe that's why she didn't hit him up.

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16 hours ago, LibertarianSlut said:

I think Molly may simply be too busy for Issa.  As I was watching this show, I realized that you can probably be really good at two of the following three things:  friendships, career, relationship, but not all three at once (I have no idea how mothers fit kids in there) and it looks like Molly is simply blocking out Issa, because right now, in this moment, her work and Andrew are the priority.

I would agree, except that Molly has clearly been hanging out with and or talking to the other ladies in their friend group.  Molly made it a point to say to Issa that "they" (she, Tiffany, and Kellie) had decided the other day to keep the baby stuff "over there" this episode, and in a previous episode, all the ladies except for Issa knew about the samurai dick.  She's been very intentional about excluding Issa from some things.  

15 hours ago, rozen said:

Issa also has little bandwidth or interest in being Molly's emotional therapist, which has been her historical role. I think Molly resents that change a little.

 

15 hours ago, Amethyst said:

Issa came off the worse for that phone call.  It's not all on her to make the first move, but Issa was also the one who cancelled their meetup to talk on Thanksgiving.  Brushing off Molly like that was foul.  Especially for a favor.

I initially thought Issa came off worse too, but I don't now.  As many have said, it wasn't that big of an ask.  Also, when Issa called, she said she needed to talk about something and Molly IMMEDIATELY launched into her own life issues without bothering to ask Issa what was going on.  And @rozen called it correctly - Molly is used to Issa being her therapist and Molly doesn't like that that part of their relationship has changed.

25 minutes ago, Empress1 said:

I swear to God, all I want is a from-behind hug like Andrew gave Molly when he came over. Practicing social distancing when you're single IS TRASH. I promise y'all: when the coronavirus threat has passed I'm going to have a hoe phase. Issa won't have shit on me.

Word to ALL of this!

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1 hour ago, Empress1 said:

I think Kelli was supportive when Issa went to her for financial advice. Kelli couldn't wave a wand and fix Issa's financial issues but she expressed concern about them and made suggestions for what Issa could do long-term. I also think Kelli was supportive when Issa asked her about Molly this episode. ("Why I got a ticket?" "You scalped it" was hilarious.)

What's interesting to me about this "Issa is the loser friend" dynamic is that Issa wasn't doing badly when we first met her. She was in a long-term live-in relationship with a good dude. She didn't make a lot of money but I assume she worked in the non-profit world on purpose and knew she wouldn't make much going in. She and Molly were in similar "have I gone as far as I can go at my employer?" places in their jobs, having been there for some length of time - I don't get the sense that Issa had job-hopped or couldn't keep a job or anything. She and Molly really aren't that different; it's just that Molly makes more money. Both she and Issa made fucked-up choices when it came to their romantic relationships. If you think about it, Issa's professional rough patch was/is much shorter than Lawrence's in show-time, and she's somewhat pulled herself out it (though her credit is probably still fucked up).

Simone is one of my favorite names.

I swear to God, all I want is a from-behind hug like Andrew gave Molly when he came over. Practicing social distancing when you're single IS TRASH. I promise y'all: when the coronavirus threat has passed I'm going to have a hoe phase. Issa won't have shit on me.

I liked that Molly used her words and told Andrew she wasn't used to really having to integrate a man into her day to day so she didn't really know how to do it. She's getting better at communicating. 

LOL, they had a recent skit about that on SNL.  

I think that issa and everyone in the friend group has their place or role.  I'd never thought about how the dynamic would change if issa was no longer the lovable loser of the group.  So I think @DiabLOL has an interesting point.  

To the degree that success is measured by money and position, issa is probably the least successful.  

Also, I think Andrew is beautiful, but he has an odd colored tooth in the front and now I can't stop seeing it.  

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1 hour ago, Amethyst said:

Word to all of this, especially Lawrence.   

It would make sense for Issa to contact Daniel.  But someone reminded me (Twitter maybe?) that Daniel pointed out Issa's user tendencies back in s2.  He said Issa used him for a quick fling, then again when she needed a place to stay.  So maybe that's why she didn't hit him up.

LOL, I don't know, if you're at the point of calling someone whose brother got shot, and died, and you're asking if they have his Rolodex....it might be time to swallow that pride! 

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Molly could have brought it to Andrew not so much as a "favor" but as a potential opportunity for one of the artists. 

Issa and Molly are both being passive-aggressive, but so far, neither has done anything that would be irredeemable. 

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18 hours ago, LibertarianSlut said:

Issa was so good this episode.  This was the funniest she’s been since Broken Pussy, or maybe ever.  

The funniest part of the episode was when she was leaving Condola the voice message and she kept repeating “feedback” and saying she’s been dropping her D’s lately.  It was so awkward and true to life to get stuck in a loop leaving a message and not knowing how to hang up.

There was also, “Oh, your brother got shot?  <Pause> Do you still have access to his phone?  <Pause> Oh, that got shot too?”

And, “Oh, you’ve been saved?  No, I don’t have time this Sunday...”

She was really doing the most.  I love when she talks to herself in the mirror.  I don’t know if it was just Issa’s joie de vivre about life that flowed, even when the water dried up (that kid saying “how old are you?” was the icing on the cake), but Molly just came off as a sourpuss this episode.  

I have no idea why she felt like she was entitled to that parking spot, made a bunch of faces and snapped at Issa a bunch of times, like when Issa jokingly called her ‘Jada’ or when Molly thought Issa was leaving Tiffany’s house to be with Lawrence (when she wasn’t), or agreeing to try to make the contact, but changing her mind without a good explanation, but I just felt like Molly was being a straight-up bitch this episode.  It wasn’t as grey as it’s been in the past.  She and Issa really need to schedule time to just talk out their issues and put their friendship on ice until they do.

I think Molly may simply be too busy for Issa.  As I was watching this show, I realized that you can probably be really good at two of the following three things:  friendships, career, relationship, but not all three at once (I have no idea how mothers fit kids in there) and it looks like Molly is simply blocking out Issa, because right now, in this moment, her work and Andrew are the priority.  

I don’t know, though, maybe I’m reading into it too deeply, because I found that Kelli and Tiffany were ultra-casual when Issa and Molly told them about their respective problems.  When I used to have friends (I guess I sort of have my husband and my career and not many really good friends outside my family), I would have gotten into that shit really deep, so maybe they are able to juggle it all by keeping it more light and cute than sitting down and talking out every comment for an hour, which has been my experience with friends.  

Derek said “some teenage boy is going to try to finger fuck my baby someday” and I died laughing.  I bet every father has some horrid thought like that jump through his head when he has a daughter.  They say, with a boy, you have to worry about one penis, with a girl, you have to worry about them all. 

 

18 hours ago, rozen said:

Issa has been super self-absorbed this season and the timing of that ask to Molly was terrible considering she's blown off more serious talks multiple times now. However...I kind of think think this is a justifiable time to be obnoxious? Issa is trying to make an enormous life change, beginning with a huge social event that will make or break her brand. If that's not a time to be stressed and self-involved, I don't know when is. Issa also has little bandwidth or interest in being Molly's emotional therapist, which has been her historical role. I think Molly resents that change a little.

Molly just shot herself in the foot, because waiting to turn down Issa is going to look extremely vindictive. She's been pulling a Tiffany and (falsely) bragging about how solid her relationship with Andrew is, so Issa is absolutely going to interpret this as a huge snub. 

Realistic, but blah, at Derek's patriarchal fear of boys touching his daughter. God forbid he focus on raising a woman with a strong sense of self and sexual agency. 

 

 

7 hours ago, link417 said:

YESS!!! I was so excited to hear his voice. I can’t remember if the Do Not Answer call was before or after that voicemail, but that call may have been Nathan. Maybe he’ll show up to the Block Party?? 🤞🏾

Speaking of, I need this to be a success for Issa! And no matter what trash-ass shit Issa does, I’m always gonna be Team Issa. Sorry not sorry, Molly.

Thank you, show, for not showing Kelli as she DEFINITELY drank that breast milk. Derek is like far too many men who realize the humanity of women only when they have daughters. 🙄 I know Tiffany is supposed to look new-mom-rough, but that blonde wig was ROOOOOUGH.

”I do got attitude.” 😂

 

6 hours ago, Sheenieb said:

It was telling to me as well that Issa blithely said that her headliner had a contract. Either she wasn't keeping up on the legal side of things because that was Condola's job, or she fell off with the payments since Molly asked if Schoolboy Q was paid. 

I was also on Molly's side in regards to not hitting Andrew up for a favor. Not only are Issa and Molly in a rough spot with their friendship, but her and Andrew are shaky as well. They haven't been together that long for favor exchanges; especially considering he doesn't know Issa that well. He would really be doing it for Molly.

Also, Issa, you can't blow off your friend when she's trying to make conversation only for you to turn around and ask for a favor. I do like that the passive-aggressiveness isn't one sided. Both Molly and Issa are being silly. 

I do want Issa to win, though. I hope Condola didn't ghost her. It's suspect that she's MIA, but she doesn't seem the type to put her professional reputation in jeopardy just because she's mad at Lawrence. 

I'm sure plenty of girl dads have had that same conversation Derek had with Lawrence, but it's still blah AF to hear. It's disappointing when men only see a woman's humanity once he has a daughter. 

 

5 hours ago, RealReality said:

Yeah, Molly was in the wrong there.  But I guess it's more passive aggression.  She would have been livid if someone had scooped that space while she was parallel to the car in front of it.  

I don't think Molly refused to ask Andrew because of the sanctity of their relationship.  I think she refused because she was annoyed and felt that issa had used her.  

All Andrew could do is talk to the artist in question right?  He isn't being asked to strongarm him, so it seems like a fairly small ask.  If the artist doesn't want to do it, issa just goes back to the drawing board.  

 

4 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

Issa and Molly just need to talk to each other so badly. Not about each other to their friends, but to each other, or else their friendship is going to go down in flames. Sometimes friendships just sort of wain as people grow apart, and thats sad, but it happens. This doesn't really seem to be the case though, I dont think that Issa and Molly are done with each other, just that they have all of these simmering issues that they wont deal with, and are now bubbling to the surface. 

I dont know for sure who is more at fault for these issues, but while I feel like Molly makes the most good points, I think she goes about them the wrong way and for the wrong reasons. She wasn't wrong that Issa should have gotten her headliner under contract, but she came off as so condescending about it, and she didn't exactly give her great legal advice on how to deal with the issue, just told her about how she fucked up. She made good points about why she didn't want to ask Andrew for a favor to help Issa with her block party. Mixing business with personal is always risky, especially when her relationship with Andrew is so new and she and Issa are on rocky ground now, but she, again, came off as so condescending, like Issa was stupid to even ask her, and her reasons for not asking Andrew seemed to be less about keeping her personal and professional lives apart, and more of her not wanting to work with Issa as a fellow young professional, and she prefers it when Molly is the one who is nailing everything and Issa is her messy friend who never grows up. There is so much resentment between the two of them, but I dont think that its too late for them to patch things up. 

Dont be so heteronormative Derek, you have no idea if your daughter will even be interested in boys. For all you know, it could be a teenage girl trying to finger fuck your daughter one day! For real though, that whole bit was funny in a super uncomfortable way, but its always annoying to see men that dont seem to recognize women as humans and not just bodies to try and bang until they have a daughter, like they cant see women as people until they can see them in relation to another man or themselves. I was right there with Lawrence that whole scene. Like, can we not talk about being wanting to fuck your infant daughter as she lays right there in her crib? 

Issa was on fire tonight! The mirror Issa telling her that she has her own stuff going on, and the whole "Your brother got shot? His phone got shot too?" bit was hilarious. 

 

4 hours ago, DiabLOL said:

Please tell me if I'm way off but I've watched each episode and paid close attention so here goes. I get the impression that Issa is the designated "loser" of her friends group. I've seen on several occasions that the rest notice her choices both career and relationship wise and have a general awww if it makes you happy type attitude but they all seem to expect more of themselves then they do of her. 

So no I don't think it's a big ask for Molly to Andrew at all. At. All. I've done way mire for people not even my friends and it's not a big deal. Worse that happens is it doesn't work out so what.

Don't they see her trying?! Don't they all mess up sometimes? Don't we all? They're not helping they're not supporting and I suspect that if Issa had more career satisfaction and found a really great guy it would upset their order if things and I don't think that's being a good friend at all. 

 

 

2 hours ago, RealReality said:

LOL, they had a recent skit about that on SNL.  

I think that issa and everyone in the friend group has their place or role.  I'd never thought about how the dynamic would change if issa was no longer the lovable loser of the group.  So I think @DiabLOL has an interesting point.  

To the degree that success is measured by money and position, issa is probably the least successful.  

Also, I think Andrew is beautiful, but he has an odd colored tooth in the front and now I can't stop seeing it.  

Word to what everybody is saying about Tiffany’s husband. It’s not like we women look at all guys as dicks to jump on and then as soon as we have a son start screaming that nobody better jump on his dick.

I do think that the friend group does love and care about each other but it’s like Molly kind of needs Issa to be the Omega. She is a high achieving competitive person and she probably does compare herself to others.

lets look:

Tiffany is too much but she has a successful career, loving husband, and a beautiful baby

Kelli had a successful career and probably a fantastic sex life. Kelli is always going to be the life of the party.

If Issa gets her professional life together then that is going to put her on Molly’s level.

Issa is also to blame because she is too passive. She doesn’t communicate. Issa could not tell unemployed Lawrence to get a job in 5 years so she passively aggressively cheats on him with a guy she doesn’t really care about. She blew off talking to Molly at Thanksgiving because she can’t stand confronting problems head on.

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3 hours ago, luckyroll3 said:

I initially thought Issa came off worse too, but I don't now.  As many have said, it wasn't that big of an ask.  Also, when Issa called, she said she needed to talk about something and Molly IMMEDIATELY launched into her own life issues without bothering to ask Issa what was going on.  

After watching the scene again, I can see how Molly came off as being a jerk on the phone, although I don't think she was trying to be one.  She clearly thought something was up if the headliner dropped suddenly, but Issa was so rushed and cagey and didn't explain anything else.  And honestly, I've been the Issa in this situation, where you don't want to explain the problem, you just want it fixed.  Because it means admitting the part where you messed up, if you actually did.  No matter what, it's embarrassing.  I don't think Issa wanted to ask for Molly's help anyway.  Molly was the least supportive of her friends when it came to the block party.

Still, Molly's a lawyer, so the prying and by-the-book questions made sense.  She may have thought she could help Issa somehow, if there was a legal situation involved.  But Issa cut Molly off and asked her to work her magic by speaking to Andrew.  Molly was probably offended that anything she had to offer was irrelevant and Issa only needed a hook up.  Again, perspective.  Molly sees Issa as coming to her for help when Issa blew off the important talk they really needed, Issa sees Molly as lecturing her again for her mistakes.

I just realized that any growth Molly is showing is only with Andrew.  She's making an effort to communicate, be more flexible, and less judgmental.  But she needs to do that with Issa, too.  And possibly her family.

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Re: Daniel,

As fine as he is, and as much as I wanna see him again, that ship sailed last season when he smugly told Issa, "I always have to rush in to save you." That was the sentence that made her turn down head, sex, and free room and board. She ain't calling him.

Speaking of fine...Bennett? I want him in it. I don't care if it's Kelly, Molly, Issa, or Ahmal. Somebody needs to climb that before the season ends.

P.S. his name is Norman Towns. You're welcome.

Edited by ridethemaverick
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5 hours ago, luckyroll3 said:

 

I initially thought Issa came off worse too, but I don't now.  As many have said, it wasn't that big of an ask.  Also, when Issa called, she said she needed to talk about something and Molly IMMEDIATELY launched into her own life issues without bothering to ask Issa what was going on.  And @rozen called it correctly - Molly is used to Issa being her therapist and Molly doesn't like that that part of their relationship has changed.

 

This was my first thought about their conversation.  Molly was annoyed Issa called to talk about her problems, but she tried to hijack the call to talk about hers ( and not their friendship issues,  just her personal ones...lol).    Issa then turns the conversation back to her issues and got annoyed when Molly implies the artist dropping situation was her fault.   Even if that wasn’t Molly’s intent, given their recent tensions it definitely came across that way.

While I can  understand Molly wanting to protect her relationship, it’s interesting this is where she chose to draw her line.   We saw her blow Andrew off for work, multiple times, and to hang with her girls. We saw Andrew express his concerns that their schedules weren’t compatible.   Just not sure how Issa’s ask relates to protecting her relationship.   
 


 

 

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6 hours ago, Empress1 said:

I swear to God, all I want is a from-behind hug like Andrew gave Molly when he came over. Practicing social distancing when you're single IS TRASH. I promise y'all: when the coronavirus threat has passed I'm going to have a hoe phase. Issa won't have shit on me.

Yoooooooo, I might have to start my own hoe-tation™️ when this is over! In these streets like 🤸🏾‍♀️

I call dibs on the metro-ATL area, though — I love my PT fam, but I ain’t tryna be Pogo Sisters 🥴 

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You all are probably right, but the questions Molly asked (albeit in a clipped manner) seemed like what you'd ask a client who had a potential breach of contract case.  

IIRC, in these situations you cannot force the particular artist to perform, but you can possible get an injunction to bar them from performing anywhere else. Or, if there is one, you can threaten them with the non performance clause.  

Molly may have been annoyed that instead of reading the contract to see if there was a solution there the first thing she did was come to Molly for a fix.  

But you all are right, she was probably just asking those questions to point out that issa had fucked up. 

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11 hours ago, ridethemaverick said:

Re: Daniel,

As fine as he is, and as much as I wanna see him again, that ship sailed last season when he smugly told Issa, "I always have to rush in to save you." That was the sentence that made her turn down head, sex, and free room and board. She ain't calling him.

Speaking of fine...Bennett? I want him in it. I don't care if it's Kelly, Molly, Issa, or Ahmal. Somebody needs to climb that before the season ends.

P.S. his name is Norman Towns. You're welcome.

I want it to be Kelli because that would be wonderful and unexpected. 

I remember how delighted I was when I watched waiting to exhale and Gregory Hines character started hitting on Gloria.  I'm not even sure if I thought he was that cute but I cheered that relationship on the entire movie. 

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First of all, Issa was the one who had that parking spot. Everyone knows you can't pull forward into a spot when you're parallel parking unless it's gigantic. Molly was the one being an asshole.

Molly deciding not to ask Andrew to see if that artist was available was a multilevel insult to Issa. She clearly was mad that Issa called to ask her a favor so part of her decision was just plain pettiness.

I think that what she told Issa about not wanting to mix these parts of her lives together was true but the underlying reason is that she thinks Issa is a fuck up and that if she gets Andrew to help Issa and then something goes wrong (the assumption being that Issa will do something wrong), it will screw things up between Molly and Andrew. So it's not just Molly refusing to help Issa when she desperately needs it (which is bad enough). It's that she doesn't trust Issa not to fuck this up somehow.

On 5/3/2020 at 10:32 PM, rozen said:

Realistic, but blah, at Derek's patriarchal fear of boys touching his daughter. God forbid he focus on raising a woman with a strong sense of self and sexual agency. 

In addition, blah to men who don't realize that being an asshole to women is a problem until they have a daughter. Apparently it's not possible to see the people with vaginas as human beings who deserve to be treated decently until you have a daughter. The fact that some men can't or won't see that until they have a daughter of their own is gross.

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On 5/4/2020 at 1:56 AM, Amethyst said:

Watching Issa and Molly's "friendship" is like a slow motion train wreck.  It's just a snipe here, a side eye there...that's all they do now.

Female friendships....they're like minefields. One unintentional wrong step and......BOOM!!!

Tiffany annoys me. She strikes me as one of those vapid designer bag chicks who had a kid because all the celebrities were. She's shallow, self-centered and clueless.

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On 5/4/2020 at 3:37 PM, Amethyst said:

Word to all of this, especially Lawrence.   

It would make sense for Issa to contact Daniel.  But someone reminded me (Twitter maybe?) that Daniel pointed out Issa's user tendencies back in s2.  He said Issa used him for a quick fling, then again when she needed a place to stay.  So maybe that's why she didn't hit him up.

I might be the only one, but I actually liked Daniel and thought he was nice to Issa. (None of Houston boys flakiness—I cant remember his name).  Could have been a perfectly good rebound relationship, even if not long-term. I was hoping she was going to call him for help and give us a few episodes of their great chemistry together. 

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4 hours ago, BrooklynRat said:

I might be the only one, but I actually liked Daniel and thought he was nice to Issa. (None of Houston boys flakiness—I cant remember his name).  Could have been a perfectly good rebound relationship, even if not long-term. I was hoping she was going to call him for help and give us a few episodes of their great chemistry together. 

Nanceford

 

😉

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On 5/5/2020 at 9:51 AM, RealReality said:

You all are probably right, but the questions Molly asked (albeit in a clipped manner) seemed like what you'd ask a client who had a potential breach of contract case.  

IIRC, in these situations you cannot force the particular artist to perform, but you can possible get an injunction to bar them from performing anywhere else. Or, if there is one, you can threaten them with the non performance clause.  

Molly may have been annoyed that instead of reading the contract to see if there was a solution there the first thing she did was come to Molly for a fix.  

But you all are right, she was probably just asking those questions to point out that issa had fucked up. 

I see two issues here, and probably a bunch of sub-issues.  But the two issues I see are 1.) getting talent for the block party and; 2) what Issa should have/could have done with the first act.  I don’t think Molly realized that.  

I’m a lawyer and it’s exactly right that the court won’t order specific performance, so in short order Issa’s problem was that she needed a headliner.  I think exercising legal remedies against the nonperforming act was not the immediate point.  It’s like if the DJ cancels at your wedding.  You’re not thinking how you can force them to play, you’re like, “where the hell do I get another DJ?”  It was in that vein, I think, that Issa was calling Molly—because Andrew worked at Live Nation, and she thought he had contacts.  I think the argument can be made that if anyone wasn’t looking at the big picture, it was Molly, not Issa.  Issa wasn’t asking Molly, “as a lawyer, what are my options?”  That’s a whole other conversation for another time IMO.

If Molly didn’t want to pass the question onto Andrew for fear that Issa would fuck things up with the new act and put Andrew’s credibility with the act at stake, Molly would have been ok to refuse, I think.  What I probably would have done if I were Molly would be to tell Andrew exactly what the situation was and see what he had to say.  He might say that there is this great band that’s dying to catch a break and it’s great, or he might take a pass, which would also be fine.

I also understand that Molly may have been caught off guard by the question, said yes to mollify, reflected, and realized she didn’t want to ask Andrew, but then I think it was on her to get back to Issa immediately.  I have the unfortunate habit of saying yes before mulling things over, but it usually takes less than an hour for me to say, “oh, hey, I know I agreed to A, but it’s actually not feasible because of B, so we can either do C or not do it at all.”  That’s the right thing to do.  If Molly was taking Issa’s needs seriously, I don’t think it would have taken her a day to reneg.  

I think Issa and Molly are both being written slightly outside the realm of their normal personalities, in order to heighten the drama (last episode, it was so irresponsible for Issa to cancel pie during the time pie is served) and this episode Molly was being insatiably rude.  I think we could have the same effect with less punitive action.  I thought Issa and Molly going to Kelli and Tiffany separately got the point across perfectly.  

As far as the legal part of the issue, I do have friends and family come to me from time to time, usually about a real property contract, and what I do like clockwork is have them email me the contract, I read it, I email them back with bullet points of what they should look at/what sticks out at me, and then I tell them this is not my area of practice, and I strongly advise them to spend the few hundred dollars to hire the lawyer to help draw up the contract.  I am nowhere near as busy as Molly though.  I don’t think she owes Issa any free legal advice whatsoever, unless Issa is using her building manager privileges to get Molly free cable or something.  

I have a feeling that the band Issa hired was probably small-time, so she could attempt to enjoin them from playing elsewhere that night, which could possibly have caused the band to play for Issa’s block party, rather than not playing at all, but this gets really dicey.  Professional artists can be really difficult to work with, and if Issa did this, the band could find a way to undermine their own performance if they wanted to spite her, and if I were Molly, I really wouldn’t be willing to wade into that pool with a friend (as opposed to a client).

I guess all I’m saying is that I think Molly was using her legal acumen to rub Issa’s nose in it, while it wouldn’t be helpful, because any act can refuse to perform at any time.  So why belabor it right now, while the block party is a month away and they’re both incredibly busy?  Right now is the time to find another act.  If Issa wants to bring the act to small claims court after the fact, she can, and that is another time I think it would be a bad idea for Molly to be Issa’s lawyer, because she can’t devote to it the time it deserves, and Issa could wind up resenting Molly if she lost.  The only thing Molly should do is warn Issa that there is a statute of limitations if she wants to sue, and she should talk to her lawyer about that.  I don’t know enough about LA municipal law to determine whether Issa would have a cause of action with or without a written contract, so I doubt Molly is in a position to make the determination when she has so much else going on, and this doesn’t appear to be her area of practice.

If I’m right that Issa was only asking for the entertainment hook-up, not legal advice, I think it was passive-aggressive for Molly to supply one but not the other.  It’s like if my best friend was a doctor and her husband was in marketing, and I called her to see if someone from his agency would talk to me about marketing my energy drink, and my friend started lecturing me on the dangers of caffeine.  It’s not really the point.  She doesn’t have to enable it, but the conversation about the relative merits of the health of the drink is something to be had at a different time.  

If Molly didn’t offer to check Issa’s contracts for the block party as a friend before the fact, she shouldn’t lecture after the fact.  And I think it’s completely up to her to decide what to do about talking to Andrew—agreeing or refusing wouldn’t be wrong—but just be straight with Issa.  

I think this is about Molly being wary of Issa having a professional success, especially with Andrew’s help, when Molly is struggling with her own professional success and her own relationship with Andrew, so there’s that.  It’s a really interesting, complex situation that the writers thought up, and I think it could be conveyed beautifully without tons of drama.  The fact that they can make a block party snafu so watchable says a lot about the writing and the performances.  

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1 hour ago, LibertarianSlut said:

I see two issues here, and probably a bunch of sub-issues.  But the two issues I see are 1.) getting talent for the block party and; 2) what Issa should have/could have done with the first act.  I don’t think Molly realized that.  

I’m a lawyer and it’s exactly right that the court won’t order specific performance, so in short order Issa’s problem was that she needed a headliner.  I think exercising legal remedies against the nonperforming act was not the immediate point.  It’s like if the DJ cancels at your wedding.  You’re not thinking how you can force them to play, you’re like, “where the hell do I get another DJ?”  It was in that vein, I think, that Issa was calling Molly—because Andrew worked at Live Nation, and she thought he had contacts.  I think the argument can be made that if anyone wasn’t looking at the big picture, it was Molly, not Issa.  Issa wasn’t asking Molly, “as a lawyer, what are my options?”  That’s a whole other conversation for another time IMO.

If Molly didn’t want to pass the question onto Andrew for fear that Issa would fuck things up with the new act and put Andrew’s credibility with the act at stake, Molly would have been ok to refuse, I think.  What I probably would have done if I were Molly would be to tell Andrew exactly what the situation was and see what he had to say.  He might say that there is this great band that’s dying to catch a break and it’s great, or he might take a pass, which would also be fine.

I also understand that Molly may have been caught off guard by the question, said yes to mollify, reflected, and realized she didn’t want to ask Andrew, but then I think it was on her to get back to Issa immediately.  I have the unfortunate habit of saying yes before mulling things over, but it usually takes less than an hour for me to say, “oh, hey, I know I agreed to A, but it’s actually not feasible because of B, so we can either do C or not do it at all.”  That’s the right thing to do.  If Molly was taking Issa’s needs seriously, I don’t think it would have taken her a day to reneg.  

I think Issa and Molly are both being written slightly outside the realm of their normal personalities, in order to heighten the drama (last episode, it was so irresponsible for Issa to cancel pie during the time pie is served) and this episode Molly was being insatiably rude.  I think we could have the same effect with less punitive action.  I thought Issa and Molly going to Kelli and Tiffany separately got the point across perfectly.  

As far as the legal part of the issue, I do have friends and family come to me from time to time, usually about a real property contract, and what I do like clockwork is have them email me the contract, I read it, I email them back with bullet points of what they should look at/what sticks out at me, and then I tell them this is not my area of practice, and I strongly advise them to spend the few hundred dollars to hire the lawyer to help draw up the contract.  I am nowhere near as busy as Molly though.  I don’t think she owes Issa any free legal advice whatsoever, unless Issa is using her building manager privileges to get Molly free cable or something.  

I have a feeling that the band Issa hired was probably small-time, so she could attempt to enjoin them from playing elsewhere that night, which could possibly have caused the band to play for Issa’s block party, rather than not playing at all, but this gets really dicey.  Professional artists can be really difficult to work with, and if Issa did this, the band could find a way to undermine their own performance if they wanted to spite her, and if I were Molly, I really wouldn’t be willing to wade into that pool with a friend (as opposed to a client).

I guess all I’m saying is that I think Molly was using her legal acumen to rub Issa’s nose in it, while it wouldn’t be helpful, because any act can refuse to perform at any time.  So why belabor it right now, while the block party is a month away and they’re both incredibly busy?  Right now is the time to find another act.  If Issa wants to bring the act to small claims court after the fact, she can, and that is another time I think it would be a bad idea for Molly to be Issa’s lawyer, because she can’t devote to it the time it deserves, and Issa could wind up resenting Molly if she lost.  The only thing Molly should do is warn Issa that there is a statute of limitations if she wants to sue, and she should talk to her lawyer about that.  I don’t know enough about LA municipal law to determine whether Issa would have a cause of action with or without a written contract, so I doubt Molly is in a position to make the determination when she has so much else going on, and this doesn’t appear to be her area of practice.

If I’m right that Issa was only asking for the entertainment hook-up, not legal advice, I think it was passive-aggressive for Molly to supply one but not the other.  It’s like if my best friend was a doctor and her husband was in marketing, and I called her to see if someone from his agency would talk to me about marketing my energy drink, and my friend started lecturing me on the dangers of caffeine.  It’s not really the point.  She doesn’t have to enable it, but the conversation about the relative merits of the health of the drink is something to be had at a different time.  

If Molly didn’t offer to check Issa’s contracts for the block party as a friend before the fact, she shouldn’t lecture after the fact.  And I think it’s completely up to her to decide what to do about talking to Andrew—agreeing or refusing wouldn’t be wrong—but just be straight with Issa.  

I think this is about Molly being wary of Issa having a professional success, especially with Andrew’s help, when Molly is struggling with her own professional success and her own relationship with Andrew, so there’s that.  It’s a really interesting, complex situation that the writers thought up, and I think it could be conveyed beautifully without tons of drama.  The fact that they can make a block party snafu so watchable says a lot about the writing and the performances.  

I agree, though I'd say that perhaps, if I were to give the most charitable read possible to Molly's actions....she maybe could have been looking for a way for issa to save her act pretty quickly.  

If a few legal words like "liquidated damages" and "injunction" can scare this guy back into line than problem maybe solved.  Its possible he is just blowing this off for....who knows what....an ice cream social.  

Of course, realistically, issa isn't going to do any of that.  And none of that is going to happen in a month.  But she could maybe get some traction if she threatens it.  

I agree that issa was only asking for the entertainment hook up.  From my POV....I'd have asked because I don't see how it puts Andrews reputation at jeopardy really.  He is going to present it to someone and it's not going to be a Beyonce.  

Also, i'd consider the personality of the person I was asking.  Andrew seems laid back, happy to help and adult enough not to blame Molly for issa. 

Molly could have asked with like zero pressure.  She could have asked with 17,000 disclaimers about how issa can be messy.  

If Andrew met issa, if Molly has talked about issa than Andrew has some idea of her flaws already.  

Molly seems willing to barely consider the effect her actions will have on her relationship, how is this the one thing that she is worried would mess it up?

I kinda understand and sympathize with her because issa has been fairly unsupportive of the relationship.  From that perspective, I could see being like "you don't even approve of our relationship or think it's serious and now you want me to ask him for a favor? Pffffft"

And i certainly can see how it would all be set against a background of not wanting to see issa succeed professionally.  And to some degree I think issa is kinda invested in having her single friend who can keep a good job, but can't keep a man.  

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13 hours ago, RealReality said:

I kinda understand and sympathize with her because issa has been fairly unsupportive of the relationship.  From that perspective, I could see being like "you don't even approve of our relationship or think it's serious and now you want me to ask him for a favor? Pffffft"

I agreed with everything you posted except this part.  I think Issa is very supportive of their relationship.  From the beginning, she's been pushing Molly to give Andrew a chance and see where they could go.  What I think she's not supportive of is the belief that Molly can actually change and grow into someone who can have/work on a healthy relationship.  It's interesting because all the shit that Molly would typically pull in her romantic relationships, she's actually pulling in her relationship with Issa.  And Issa's not helping by constantly pointing out all the things that Molly has done wrong in the past, even given their "let's keep it real and hold each other accountable" mindset.  Sometimes your friends just want to feel supported; they're both feeling that AND simultaneously missing that point during their interactions over the past few months. 

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On 5/4/2020 at 2:46 AM, mrsbagnet said:

Molly is being hyper-sensitive to anything Issa says or does. That parking spot fight was BS. Issa was there first. If Molly is angry that Issa isn't doing a dance of joy to celebrate her relationship with Andrew, she needs to tell Issa that instead of snapping at her, making assumptions, and mm-hmm-ing about Lawrence. Have they both been busy and unavailable, yes. But Issa seems to be taking it in stride, while Molly is huffy.

It is so interesting because this is actually in character.  My husband caught this episode with me and liked the show (he hadn't watched it before) so he went back and started at the beginning.  I have been watching S1 with him this week.

In s1 Molly and Issa had two pretty interesting fights.  One, a fairly minor one,  right in the pilot ep and one really terrible one in the penultimate ep of the season.

In both cases, the argument began with Molly being hyper-sensitive about something Issa said or did and in both cases it was, imo, a case of displaced anger.  Something she was herself sensitive about and took something off-hand/unthinking Issa did and blew it up.

In ep 1, Issa did that 'Broken Pussy' rap in the club after having joked about the term with Molly.  The way the episode plays out it is clear that Issa kinda just did the open mic rap about a concept she had thought up and found funny.  Molly took it as a joke about her.  To compound it, she said out loud to Jered (whom she had just met and had been vibing with) 'This is about me!'  Later in the car she blows up at Issa and blames Issa for Jered leaving because of the rap -- never mind Jered would have never known it had any association with Molly if herself hadn't said anything.  It was a short, fairly snotty fight with Molly doing all the attacking and Issa saying nothing really.  It is over with a bit later when Issa shows up at Molly's door with chips and ice cream and an apologetic look.

The second fight is Ep 7 is a lot worse.  It is during Issa's fundraiser, a night of triumph for her.  Molly is telling her about an old friend she ran into who was espousing the wonders of therapy.  Whereupon Issa off-handedly says therapy might be a good thing.  Molly immediately got  offended and acted cold and pissy with Issa all night.  Even being rude to one of Issa's work contacts.  When Issa confronted her later about it, Molly basically said 'how dare you say I need therapy when you're just as fucked up as me.'  And then they both pulled out the big guns.  Issa did a great rundown of Molly's relationship thirst (frankly she was right given what we had seen of Molly that season).  But Molly did a great takedown of Issa's cheating with Daniel, ending with a snarly 'Bitch you don't deserve Lawrence."

That fight lasted the entire next episode with Molly not thawing until Kelli and Tiffany drunkenly and inadvertently co-signed on Issa's assessment of Molly's relationship problems and Issa coming to Molly's defense.  But it made Molly realize that her relationship self-sabotage was glaring and  it was how others see her too, not just Issa.

What I  also found very interesting, in addition to both arguments being precipitated by Molly being hypersensitive, is that in each one Issa is the one that holds out the olive branch.  She is the one who seeks to heal the breach, sometimes persistently, even in the face of constant rebuffs by Molly.  Molly never makes the first move.

So in light of those two incidents, this puts a new spin on this current argument.  It seems like Molly is still in the pattern of waiting for Issa to make the apologetic move and take the "blame" for their estrangement.  And since Issa isn't doing that, they are still off.  It is like it doesn't occur to Molly to make the first move.  So when Issa calls her, Molly immediately jumps into their old pattern thinking Issa is calling to hold out that branch,and launches into her relationship woes, but Issa isn't doing that and that throws Molly off even more. 

It'll be interesting to see if that really is a pattern in S2 and S3 or if this is just a callback.

 

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8 hours ago, luckyroll3 said:

I agreed with everything you posted except this part.  I think Issa is very supportive of their relationship.  From the beginning, she's been pushing Molly to give Andrew a chance and see where they could go.  What I think she's not supportive of is the belief that Molly can actually change and grow into someone who can have/work on a healthy relationship.  It's interesting because all the shit that Molly would typically pull in her romantic relationships, she's actually pulling in her relationship with Issa.  And Issa's not helping by constantly pointing out all the things that Molly has done wrong in the past, even given their "let's keep it real and hold each other accountable" mindset.  Sometimes your friends just want to feel supported; they're both feeling that AND simultaneously missing that point during their interactions over the past few months. 

LOL, you are likely right.  I sometimes get a general vibe based on like zero real facts.  It felt like issa was critical of the relationship and wasn't taking it very seriously when Molly was gushing at Tiffany's house.*  But my short term memory likely doesn't stretch back very far.  

* In issas defense, Molly was being a little obnoxious/insufferable - but again could just be the passive aggression. 

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I'm always so late to this discussion because I don't have HBO and have to watch the show later on my brother's Xfinity stream (yep I'm trifling). I truly appreciate all the thoughtful breakdowns as I mull this Issa/Molly drama. Especially the retrospective by @DearEvette and Mr. Dear Evette.

This hits so close to home because I have 30+ year friendships that have been through these kinds of growing pains. There is no one who can be as supportive but also as unwilling to see how you've changed as long term friends and family. I feel like we're seeing that on both sides of the Issa/Molly friendship. 

Both have built the friendship on a foundation of Issa being good at relationships and Molly being good at professional success. Neither really knows how to see and acknowledge that the other is changing in those dynamics. Those changes are making them at the least uncomfortable, at the most wary about the other's motivations, and overall concerned that maybe their friendship isn't built to last. Add to that the facts that they won't even talk about it and the microaggressions against one another and...well, this. I agree with whomever said this is well-written, true to life and fascinating. 

OAN I hate that Condola is now seemingly ghosting Issa when she needs her most. Apparently she is struggling with handling the reality of dating her new friend/business mentee's ex now that she is questioning whether he'd rather still be with Issa. I always hate that line of questioning because it is what it is. Issa did cheat and Lawrence did leave her. If Condola is worried about him wishing he could go back, she probably should have nipped things in the bud as soon as she found out who he was, how long he dated her new buddy and how recently they broke up.

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