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S11. E15 Two Moms, Their Daughter, and a Baby

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I just don’t understand screaming on national TV either but the show that got to me was when Robyn was doing what women have been doing for hundreds of years without fanfare yuh huh and then she hosed down her midwife in bodily fluids I was like mmmmmm ok yeah sign me up for this !!!! NOPE NOPE NOPE

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I would like to know where Christine got the idea that people who live in monogamy don’t have family support. 

Evie is a beautiful baby.

I was surprised that Meri didn't make an appearance in this week's show.  I have a feeling that after what happened with Kody at the therapist, she is going to be MIA for a while. 

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4 minutes ago, Adeejay said:

I would like to know where Christine got the idea that people who live in monogamy don’t have family support. 

Evie is a beautiful baby.

I was surprised that Meri didn't make an appearance in this week's show.  I have a feeling that after what happened with Kody at the therapist, she is going to be MIA for a while. 

Meri and Robyn are pissed tonight that they weren’t shown. 

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37 minutes ago, LibertarianSlut said:

Oh my gosh, this birth got me so agitated, and I am so upset with the Browns!  

But before I talk about the epic muck up that was the birth, I need to comment on a few things:

  • Why are Kody and Robyn trying to qualify for a loan now?  They had 60 days.  They’re so stupid.  Their theatrics are so boring.  Where have I gone wrong in my life that every Sunday I eagerly await watching an unattractive couple apply for a personal loan?  
  • Kody, the prince, has to make an effort to look in on his minor children “almost daily” when his wives are away.  What an overachiever.  He was talking to Gabe as if he had positively just met him.  “So, uh, Gabriel, is it?  You’re planning on going to college?  This year?”  Good talk, dad.  

Christine was so ignorant in asking “what do monogamists do?” without any guile with regard to getting a woman through a birth.  She does realize that when Maddie is giving birth, she doesn’t have to be worried that Caleb won’t make it because he’s courting his fourth wife, right?   She doesn’t realize there are literally limitless combinations of friends/family/staff to support a monogamous couple having a baby?  I’m not even sure if she considers Maddie to be “monogamous,” because her mom is polygamous with her dad.  This is how intelligent and worldly I find Christine.  

Maddie described herself as “fat and bitchy.”  Who knew she had a crystal ball?!

She is so ignorant—she doesn’t want to have a baby at a hospital, because “hospitals are for emergencies” and “births aren’t emergencies”?  A.). Sometimes births are emergencies, as you will soon find out b.) the emergency room is for emergencies, and the maternity ward is not located in the emergency room, dummy.  I am kind of concerned that Maddie isn’t aware of these basic facts.  Maddie doesn’t want them to “strip her membrane,” which, I’m not even sure what that is, but Maddie says it’s painful, so she doesn’t want to do it, because she doesn’t want any “unnecessary pain”???  Baby girl, you are pretty much begging for pain that is unnecessary by giving birth at a birthing center, hel-lur...

The birthing coach—Lydia?—She was just as bad as the woman from last week.  I am really skeptical about their credentials.  They just leave everything up to the mom-to-be and they’re hesitant and they have no answers or plans other than patting her back and giving her damp cloths.  In other words, their approach to birthing is like Kody’s approach to...everything.  Christine was more useful.  She should have just had her at home.

I felt like Janelle had just as much trouble getting across the birthing center’s parking lot as Maddie did.  

Kody has officially eclipsed Caleb as more useful in an emergency.  Caleb was more concerned about breaking the speed limit than being there.  What a wussy; I cannot stand this man, and any reservation I had about why he got along so well with Kody have been cleared from my mind.  

So...baby didn’t have enough oxygen, and mama was in shock, but they wasted precious time waiting for the dang ambulance, when everything that they needed would have been at the hospital.  Does Maddie still find the hospital unnecessary, or have we learned something today?  

Janelle is just a liar.  They took Evie to the hospital “for a precaution” but she stayed three days?  I file lawsuits on behalf of hospitals, and NICUs are so expensive.  The room alone for the baby is $15k a night for one of my clients.  Doctors do not admit someone for three days for “a precaution”.  Janelle is just trying to cover her daughter’s selfish ego. 

Before the birth, they knew the child was missing bones but they didn’t know it was FATCO until after she was born, was what Maddie said in a talking head.  So they didn’t know that the lack of oxygen wasn’t related to the missing appendages until after she was born; they just knew she was missing bones, which, I’m just a lay person, but I would think if my unborn child was missing bones, she might have other parts of her that were missing or underdeveloped, such as pulmonary function.  Ergo, have your high-risk baby in a hospital next time, jerk.  They got very lucky.

I guess...that’s it?  No Meri for the finale.  How fitting.  I guess I’ll just see these losers again in a bunch of months when they are holding their hands out for some TLC stymie cash.

*It’s Easter, so I managed to go this entire post without one swear word.  Who knew it was possible not to cuss out the Browns on a weekly basis?!?*

Yes, because we are normal people.  If our unborn child had missing bones, we would definitely go to the hospital to give birth, not to a birthing center with falsely-glib techs.  

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1 minute ago, Meowwww said:

Yes, because we are normal people.  If our unborn child had missing bones, we would definitely go to the hospital to give birth, not to a birthing center with falsely-glib techs.  

I think based on their facial expressions, they knew they were in over their heads. 

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Just now, kicotan said:

My suspension of disbelief finally broke tonight for multiple reasons including but not limited to:

  1. the midwife actually said she believes that sometimes babies “wait” for the right person to be in the room before making their entrance into the world.
  2. Janelle, Christine and Maddie all extoll the virtue of sitting in the bathtub as a way for Maddie to control/slow the labor process.
  3. Maddie bitches about the prospect of “unnecessary” pain.
  4. Robyn begrudgingly accepts the horrible fate that she will soon be a homeowner.
  5. Christine and Janelle yuck it up stereotyping monogamists as ALL the same.

Le sigh.

So much crap.  They are lucky Evie lived.  

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So we know Maddie gave birth on August 20 2019. Just curious does anyone follow Meri on Facebook or Instagram? Just curious if Meri was really working so hard that week like Janelle said or if she was just hanging out with friends and wasn’t invited or wanted in NC. 

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1 hour ago, LibertarianSlut said:

She doesn’t realize there are literally limitless combinations of friends/family/staff to support a monogamous couple having a baby?  I’m not even sure if she considers Maddie to be “monogamous,” because her mom is polygamous with her dad.

 Maddie is not in a monogamous marriage because her father  and her husband are about as loving as her father and three of his wives.   That is probably why Christine is confused.  You know - Kody's fifth wife - Caleb.

Edited by Kyanight
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1 hour ago, Adeejay said:

I would like to know where Christine got the idea that people who live in monogamy don’t have family support. 

Right?  And it's such a generalization for Christine and Janelle to say that polygamists have this huge loving support group because the TWO of THEM are close like that.  There are plenty of sister wives who wouldn't want some of their sister wives there at the birth of their baby if they were last women on earth.  They would give birth alone, instead!   It's ridiculous how they love to speak for the entire "world of polygamy" as if THEY are the elected elite of this eclectic group of people.

1 hour ago, Meowwww said:

Meri and Robyn are pissed tonight that they weren’t shown. 

Unfortunately Robyn WAS shown as she and Kody did their Mcmansion pursuit together.

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1 hour ago, Kyanight said:

And it's such a generalization for Christine and Janelle to say that polygamists have this huge loving support group because the TWO of THEM are close like that. ether.

I had to chuckle at Christine and Janelle feigning surprise that monogamous couples have wives who want to check in with their 'husbands'? We don't think to do that, says Christine. We just do what we had planned.

Sorry ladies, I call BS. You want me to believe you all were doing what you ladies wanted, with no thought to chuckle-head, when you suddenly moved all your kids to inconvenient homes in Flagstaff, while hemorrhaging excessive amounts of money every month?

Edited by Chalby
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1 hour ago, Meowwww said:

So much crap.  They are lucky Evie lived.  

And Maddie doesn't appear to realize that 3 hours of labour is what most women pray for, no matter how intensive. None of my four kids made their entrance prior to 12 hours, thank you very much. 

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1 hour ago, NotinKansasanymore said:

So we know Maddie gave birth on August 20 2019. Just curious does anyone follow Meri on Facebook or Instagram? Just curious if Meri was really working so hard that week like Janelle said or if she was just hanging out with friends and wasn’t invited or wanted in NC. 

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Ok detective time! On 19th August 2019 she posted she was on a flight somewhere. I call bullshit and say that this post was a cover story for this very moment, when everyone looked back and wondered why she wasn’t in North Carolina. Meri damage control - ‘Couldn’t be at the birth, was travelling for work y’all! Busy busy!’... there’s no mention of where she was flying to or from which is UNHEARD of for Meri - She loves to post about where she’s going or coming from over social media often in advance (to sell the pyramid scheme dream of being a globe trotter), she went to Chicago earlier in the month and Oregan later in the month, but there’s only Flagstaff posts either side of this ‘flight post’ within a few days and she slips up and mentions in the comments she’s getting her hair at hairdressers done the very next day (so on the 20th - Evie’s birthday) which would surely be in Flag. I speculate she lied to save face about not being asked or not wanting to go and made up travel excuse. I’ll bet that plane picture posted is from her Chicago flight home, a week or two earlier 😂 

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Geez, you guys.  Well, minority opinion, but I cannot give Madison any criticism for hollering and grunting in pain during her labor or her choice to go without an epidural.  I chose natural births because my midwife explained to me that sometimes an epidural will impair your ability to push.  

Clearly, the birthing center had a relationship with the hospital. Maddie chose the birthing center in lieu of a HOME BIRTH.  So she had experienced midwives and medical apparatus at the ready.  Remember Robyn's home births where she squelched every moan like a "good girl" with Grandad looking on, and the birth where Ari broke her shoulder?

Minority opinion 2, it is good that Caleb drove safely. 

Madison seems to me to be very bright, articulate and knowledgeable-- and she is in a monogamous relationship.  I see nothing to criticize or snark on.

Edited by Just Carol
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On 4/6/2020 at 8:49 PM, Joan of Argh said:

And that's why it's better to have the baby at the hospital in the first place. 🙄

They already knew that Evie K had health problems

Say what? What episode did I miss? What was said to make you realize Evie had skeletal problems? Or are you referring to Evie not utilizing her lungs independently? How did I entirely miss this discussion?

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On 4/8/2020 at 7:39 PM, albarino said:

^^This.  So much this.  As I understand it, the baby was special needs since the ultrasound identifying her rare condition was diagnosed.  

Once again, I cannot believe I missed this entire conversation re: the baby's health. I don't believe FATCO is considered a high risk pregnancy, despite it being a rare condition. Evie was 8 lbs 12 oz which is a very healthy weight for delivery and she was not premature.

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On 4/9/2020 at 2:40 PM, xwordfanatik said:

Who can forget Axel Rose's birth, with Maddie screaming, "I CANNNNN'T?"  

Oh come on now... Fess up! What woman in labour HASN'T screamed out, "NO! PUT IT BACK! I CHANGED MY MIND. I WON'T!" I can proudly share that I didn't scream all that in the first 3 hours... I was too busy pretending I could take the pain. (Hour 6 - "Mr Epidural... Where are you?")

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47 minutes ago, Chalby said:

Say what? What episode did I miss? What was said to make you realize Evie had skeletal problems? Or are you referring to Evie not utilizing her lungs independently? How did I entirely miss this discussion?

You can clearly see some of her deformities on the sonogram and Maddie said they knew ahead of time, they just didn't know how bad it was.

That should have been enough to chose a hospital delivery but the hospital wouldn't allow TLC cameras and Maddie / Caleb wanted the money... So off to a birthing center they went.

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1 hour ago, Joan of Argh said:

You can clearly see some of her deformities on the sonogram and Maddie said they knew ahead of time, they just didn't know how bad it was.

Once again, I sure must be zoning out while watching. I know she's missing a fibula, has some toes fused and ribs, and 3 digits on each hand? Head and facial features are regular, mental capacity is fine, femurs bowed? But I did not hear them talk of missing bone(s). I just figured her delivery is regular because Evie is such a healthy weight and size and not premature. And the birthing center has a close connection to hospital. But it makes sense that the lungs were slow to inflate with fused ribs. Thank goodness for our medical progress. Before ventilators and ultrasounds and genetic testing, I gather these babies did not live long past delivery which explains why this occurrence is 5 to 20 per every million. I have no issue with Maddie and the midwife's decision to use birthing centre. Clearly they knew what was coming and were comfortable with the situation. The ambulance didn't even turn on their lights.

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Did the birthing center have a pediatrician on staff?  Who told them she was missing a fibula and had fused ribs?  If Evie did not have breathing difficulty, would they have taken her home without knowing the extent of her FATCO symptoms?  I don’t understand what they were thinking, except for $$$ for filming the birth. 

Edited by GrannySmith
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29 minutes ago, geej said:

I have never seen anything on this show that i can truly appreciate until i watched last night's. The way maddie spoke about how to raise a child with birth defects touched my heart in ways perhaps only someone that has similar birth defects can. I was born with 2 fingers on each hand and no forearms.(my bff told me once, "geej? none of us have 4 arms). I was born many decades(gasp) ago when similar babies were born were left to die(did you see that episode on "Call the Midwife"?.) My poor mother had a terrible time with strangers telling her i was too ugly to be in public, and she should have let me die, other rejections from even close family.(I looked a lot like shirley temple.)

I was lucky to be raised by parents that let me bloom, blossum, be me. Back in the early 60's public schools tried to keep me out, even tho i needed little extra attention and had no issues of brain malfunctions .

As i grew up and started to learn something was 'wrong' with me, it was only the public that gave me hard times. It was only the public that taught me something was "wrong" not different.

My cute 'liddle' arms never held me back.(well if i had wanted to be an acrobat, or bank robber, maybe).

I ended up growing up to be very outgoing, kinda funny,friendly  person. I see that GORGEOUS baby doing wonderfully also. People these days are so accepting, kids are more worldly  in how everyone has differences, and generally speaking it is a far more accepting place  and time to grow up "different". 

There is a HUGE difference in being born a certain way, than loosing a limb, sight, etc later in life.it means i never knew anything different. I learned to tie my shoes at the same time, but in a different way.  I never mourned the loss of fingers or length of arms since i never knew differently.

Only thing i wished my folks would have known to tell me early on is:" people stare at movie stars too". 

This got more personal than the thread normally is used for, but i am SO impressed with maddie and caleb's attitude.

Don't confuse that with my feelings of  their irresponsibility in going to a cut rate birthing center.

 

Thanks for sharing your experience with us. 

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Before the birth, they knew the child was missing bones but they didn’t know it was FATCO until after she was born, was what Maddie said in a talking head.  So they didn’t know that the lack of oxygen wasn’t related to the missing appendages until after she was born; they just knew she was missing bones, which, I’m just a lay person, but I would think if my unborn child was missing bones, she might have other parts of her that were missing or underdeveloped, such as pulmonary function.  Ergo, have your high-risk baby in a hospital next time, jerk.  They got very lucky.

My personal feeling on this is that when the baby wasn't in the right position during early labor and because the baby was diagnosed with birth defects before birth, the birthing center should have been legally barred from accepting Maddie as a patient. In those circumstances, they should be required to send her to the hospital. Only a complete idiot goes to the birthing center when your baby is missing bones and you don't know the exact cause or the full extent of the problem. Not to mention that Axel's birth seemed less than smooth, so problems should have been anticipated.

 

 

 

 

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I canceled the recording of this episode if that says anything. A birth as the finale? Boring. 

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Can someone remind me of what Maddie said Evangeline stood for?  I know Evie was for Caleb's mother.  Then, Ge for Janelle, but, what about the rest?  

I think you guys have pretty much covered it, concerning the  birth situation.  It wasn't as scary as I had expected.  Glad Evie is okay.  The worst part for me was Robyn with her whining.  I'm so done with her. 

No way Caleb could speed on I-40 during rush hour.  It's a solid 30 mph stop and roll, if you're lucky.  lol  

I am curious as to what they will have in store for next season. I think there's plenty of drama left in that family.  

Edited by SunnyBeBe
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8 hours ago, Chalby said:

I am very pleased with Maddie and Caleb's decision to share Evie's diagnosis for two reasons. First, it introduced me to FATCO which I had never heard of before and second, Evie's diagnosis is so rare that just by sharing her condition, the couple has brought this congenital diagnosis to the attention of thousands of people and (hopefully) will allow doctors and scientists further study the condition to help future parents.

I researched FATCO and the information is very interesting (and very difficult reading). I actually think Evie may have a milder form of FATCO called Fuhrmann Syndrome (given her fibula was affected along with toes/fingers). I also admit that I have been obsessed with various conditions caused by spontaneous genetic mutation ever since my grandchild was born with OI (Osteo Imperfecta). 

As soon as one is told a condition is genetic, the families immediately wonder "who is a carrier" within each parent's  family tree. Imagine my surprise when we learned no one had the gene, nor had it been evidenced in any generation. For whatever reason, our couple spontaneously mutated a new genetic "code" (for lack of better vocabulary). And our darling little grandchild will need to be aware that there is now a chance of passing this newly created gene/chromosome/ or whatever it's called onto any children they have in the future. 

For Fuhrmann syndrome, it sounds like once it is discovered, there's 25% chance of having Fuhrmann, 50% of carrying the genetic code, and 25% of neither carrying it or developing it.

This is all very fascinating and thanks to Maddie and Caleb for teaching me something interesting enough that I was willing to dig deep through my recollections of biology.

I'm glad they shared, too.  Little Evie might have to learn to do some things differently, but she'll figure things out.  OI runs in my mom's family; I'm hoping your grandbaby has one of the milder types.  While I don't have OI (my mom doesn't), we have our own genetic (probably) surprise because we don't have any family history of Crohn's, but 2 of my 3 kids have it.  You just never know!

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Last night's show really upset me.  I am just very thankful that everything worked out ok.  Thank God it did because it could have also gone the other direction so very quickly.

Poor little Axel having to listen to his mother's agonizing screams.  He was there in the room while Maddie was still in the tub sobbing and screaming.

All in all a very disturbing episode.  Thank God it all worked out in the long run  

Did the hospital keep Evie for 3 days because of her breathing issues or because of the FATCO syndrome

 

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How exactly do you do a whole year of high school in one summer?  My daughter was watching and commented that she wished she could do that.  I have NEVER heard of anyone in our school district being allowed to do that.  Is it a Flagstaff thing?

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I canceled the recording of this episode if that says anything. A birth as the finale? Boring. 

They had nothing else to cap off the season with. There has been no progress on Coyote Pass. If even a single shovel had touched the ground between when they began filming that season and last night, they would have shown it. So we know it's going nowhere. Meri and Kody still hate each other, and the Robyn Pray for a Rental thing only goes so far. Janelle and Christine are too compliant to provide a story line at this point. So they had to focus on the birth. They're becoming the Duggars, filming weddings and births to eat up screen time.

 

 

 

 

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9 hours ago, Chalby said:

Once again, I cannot believe I missed this entire conversation re: the baby's health. I don't believe FATCO is considered a high risk pregnancy, despite it being a rare condition. Evie was 8 lbs 12 oz which is a very healthy weight for delivery and she was not premature.

Being a healthy birth weight is not a guarantee of a good outcome, not by a long shot, IMO. And vice versa. My oldest was low birth weight  (4lbs and some change...oligohydramnios) but had good Apgars, was in the regular nursery and went home with me as planned. I think that as soon as something was detected on the ultrasound, plans should have been made for a hospital delivery, just in case. 

Also, is it safe for a laboring mom to be squatting in a filthy bathtub ? 🤮

Love all the Gabe comments. It was on the tip of his tongue to tell Kody to hit the bricks....

Kodi ? Maddie, please.....

 

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14 minutes ago, Chris Knight said:

Kodi ? Maddie, please.....

She's probably hoping Daddy will pay more attention to her than Caleb & Axelbrush.

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Evie is a beautiful baby.

That she is...

Quote

How exactly do you do a whole year of high school in one summer?  My daughter was watching and commented that she wished she could do that.  I have NEVER heard of anyone in our school district being allowed to do that.  Is it a Flagstaff thing?

I guess it depends on how many credits you have remaining to complete. We have online classes here over the summer and most kids use them to get ahead or take courses they don't have room for in their schedules during the regular year but I don't know anyone who graduated a year early.

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10 hours ago, Chalby said:

As soon as one is told a condition is genetic, the families immediately wonder "who is a carrier" within each parent's  family tree.

In the world of polygamy, the family tree looks more like a wreath.  It's surprising they don't have more genetic issues, since the parents are often related to some degree.

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12 hours ago, Lady of nod said:

 

I don't think I've ever had anything positive to say about these people up until now. It was nice to see Janelle and Christine supporting each other. They may be the only two who actually do like each other

 

I have my reservations about this family, however, there are moments when I just love them. They are usually parenting moments. The first that comes to mind is the family’s acceptance of their lesbian daughter.   They continue to support their daughter and her wife to be.  Same with their older children.   

 

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18 minutes ago, bichonblitz said:

Hey, Janelle, your Prince Charming doesn't even know your son Gabe. 

To be fair, I also graduated high school in three years. Hold a Master Degree.  Neither of my parents could tell you how I did it, what my degree is in nor what I did for a living. And my dad had only one wife and two kids.   

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What is wrong with Robyn ? She always looks like she just threw up. This show is really running on fumes. 

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