S02.E16: Tats and Tias

[Bastet]

6 minutes ago, BeachDays said:

I do want Becky and Emilio to end up together, I think they are super cute together.  Of course it would depend on how they are written together in the future as well.  But I’m also the crazy person who still wants David and Darlene back together.

I'll suppress barfing at the thought of the latter to address the former. 

The Becky/Emilio/baby situation is the one area in which I think the show missed out by pretending Andy doesn't exist - for all the Roseanne/Darlene and Jackie/Becky parallels the Roseanne reboot set up and this series continued (although less obviously), Becky getting knocked up by a one night stand who lingered was the greatest potential for blatantly acknowledging the similarity.  The whole "we don't know each other - we just had that one date ... and, you know, the baby" thing of how you navigate co-parenting with a person you'd have never actively chosen to share such a connection.

While Jackie and Fred played out at an organic pace, in terms of slowly getting together and then inevitably breaking up when they realized they'd tried to create something that wasn't there, Becky and Emilio having feelings for each other was forced in a hurry in order to make his deportation more tragic than it was on its own.  So, on general principle, I'm not interested in revisiting that falsehood.

But, a pragmatic storyline in which Becky marries Emilio in the hopes of getting him a path back into the country, so he can better parent his child, that doesn't pretend it's more than that, I could possibly get behind.  And then whether, as they actually get to know each other, they try to partner romantically as well as co-parent, and whether that works - rather than, like Jackie and Fred, confirming they're not compatible in that way - is something I'd evaluate as it comes.

There's definite storyline potential.  I just don't really trust this series with nuance the way I did the original.

[geauxaway]

On 3/25/2020 at 2:41 PM, seacliffsal said:

I know Sara Gilbert really worked to get the reboot and is an executive producer, but Darlene shouldn't consistently be the center of the story IMO

It really says a lot that she, Sara, writes “poor folk” this way.  Apparently this is what Hollywood thinks of the blue collar crowd.  We all don’t have it THAT bad.  Some people do work hard, but also make good money.  And we also take a lot of pride in our work and our homes, possessions, etc.  It doesn’t have to all be doom and gloom ALL THE TIME.  

It’s not even relatable anymore.  Darlene is a complete asshole and she is the center of it all.  
 

As for Mark not appearing in this episode?  If you haven’t noticed they only trot him out when they have a Very Special Episode to put across.  Tonight the aunties served that purpose.  
 

I didn’t watch the last 2 weeks episodes but did watch this one.  At this point I’m desperate for anything on TV.

[Meushell]

Wow, the aunts were both horrible as people and as characters.

Believing that is Becky a seductive slut who carelessly got their nephew deported was so awful that it took away any sympathy they had. Expecting her to fix it, whiling conveniently forgetting that she and the baby need him more than they do, just hammered the point home. They are terrible people.

As characters, they are awful for perpetuating the stereotype that people talk in their native language to talk bad about others.

[MarthaEllisanne]

7 hours ago, geauxaway said:

It really says a lot that she, Sara, writes “poor folk” this way.

Agree. We've chatted about their bad decisions (the tattoos being the latest). All people make bad decisions at some point in their lives, usually when they are young. But most learn from bad decisions and make better choices the next time.  This family does not. It's as if they see the better choice as "the man" telling them what to do and they will not be told what to do so they go the other way.  Twenty years have passed. The Connors do have some advantages and skills that  indicate they should be doing better by now.  Would love to know what the heck has been going on the last 20 years. It is also interesting that Sara, who heads the show, allows her character to be so horrible.

[UYI]

8 hours ago, geauxaway said:

It really says a lot that she, Sara, writes “poor folk” this way.  Apparently this is what Hollywood thinks of the blue collar crowd.  

There is a certain level of irony to the fact that Sara's most famous role is on the show with perhaps TV's most famous working class family, because in real life, she grew up in a VERY well off Hollywood family--obviously her older half-siblings are Melissa and Jonathan Gilbert from Little House on the Prairie (their dad was the late actor Paul Gilbert, Sara's is their former stepfather Harold Abeles--Sara was born Sara Rebecca Abeles, but took the last name "Gilbert" professionally once she started acting), but her maternal grandfather was Harry Crane, who created The Honeymooners (a show itself known for its portrayal of working class people--so, you know, MORE irony). Alison Arngrim, who played Nellie Oleson on Little House, wrote in her autobiography, Confessions of a Prairie Bitch, about how going over to spend the night at Melissa's house was like entering an entirely different universe for her growing up--unlike Alison, who grew up with eternally struggling actors as parents who were constantly renting one house or apartment after another, Melissa and her family lived in a HUGE Hollywood type home, complete with a maid.

All of this to say--given how Sara has spent her entire life in and around Hollywood, it doesn't surprise me, despite her signature role, that there's some disconnect in how she portrays working class people. 

Edited March 28, 2020 by UYI

[iMonrey]

Quote

All of this to say--given how Sara has spent her entire life in and around Hollywood, it doesn't surprise me, despite her signature role, that there's some disconnect in how she portrays working class people. 

To be clear, Sara Gilbert does not write this show.

But yeah, the writers don't seem to understand how money works. I guess if you've never had to worry about money that's to be expected. But Darlene, Becky and Jackie seem to be getting by without having any money. Dan works but doesn't seem to care that both his daughters and his grandchildren are basically sponging off of him without contributing anything. Prior to opening the Lunch Box are we to believe Jackie actually got by as a "life coach?" In Lanford? 

Things cost money. Rent costs money. Phones cost money. These people seem to have all the basic things even without having money. 

Then again, this show is not unique in that respect. There are plenty of TV shows that have unrealistic portrayals of financial situations. The difference is that The Conners is rooted in a blue collar lifestyle and has made its reputation as a representation of that.

[UYI]

39 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

To be clear, Sara Gilbert does not write this show.

 

Has she not had any role as a writer at all since the show came back? I will say though, what an EP does can vary from show to show: some have a lot of creative control, others are more "hands off" and let the writers do their own thing.  Based on what we see on the show, I tend to think she falls more into the former category, with mixed results  (I do think her obviously--understandable, it's her character, but often tiring--bias towards Darlene is clear). 

 

Edited March 28, 2020 by UYI

[rmontro]

1 hour ago, UYI said:

Alison Arngrim, who played Nellie Oleson on Little House, wrote in her autobiography, Confessions of a Prairie Bitch, about how going over to spend the night at Melissa's house was like entering an entirely different universe for her growing up

Confessions of a Prairie Bitch, that is hilarious, that may be the best book title I've ever heard.

But thanks for running down Sara's Hollywood ties.  I knew she was Melissa Gilbert's sister, but I wasn't aware of the other stuff.  Sometimes it seems like even a big town like LA can seem small, there are so many involved in the entertainment industry.  

[Bastet]

Unlike with the original series, this time around I don't think there is a single executive producer, and maybe not even anyone in the writers room, who has ever been working class.  It shows.

[mythoughtis]

Darlene just doesn’t seem realistic to me at all as the writers deal with her now.   She had some common sense growing up.  She has none now.   She’s a writer,  everyone and their brother are writing Kindle Unlimited books.  Why isn’t she? 

Edited March 29, 2020 by mythoughtis

[nokat]

15 hours ago, Meushell said:

As characters, they are awful for perpetuating the stereotype that people talk in their native language to talk bad about others.

It was so bad in that regard.  It may be true to an extent, but they made it a farce, and with the fat baby.
 

Just now, nokat said:

It was so bad in that regard.  It may be true to an extent, but they made it a farce, and with the fat baby.

 

Plenty of examples of people talking shit in front of someone they don't know understands their language.
 

[Oosala]

On 3/25/2020 at 4:55 PM, MissLucas said:

the two aunts from catholic cliché hell

heh