S05.E06: Wexler v. Goodman

[nodorothyparker]

Airdate 2020.03.23

Quote

Kim tries to pump the brakes on Jimmy's latest scheme, but it may be too late to stop Saul. Mike turns the heat up on Lalo as Nacho attempts to enlist support from above.

 

[Dianaofthehunt]

😲😲😲

[Atlanta]

I just got whiplash. 

[Dev F]

Woo! Called it! Right under the wire, too.

Loved the flashback teaser. Some eerily accurate casting on Baby Kim and her mom.

[rhys]

I so wanted to see the whole green screen commercial.

Edited March 24, 2020 by rhys

[ShadowFacts]

You could really see Bob Odenkirk the comedian in this one, and I was there for it.  Mike meticulously working for his version of justice, there for that, too.  Howard getting punked in front of Cliff and everyone, good stuff.  But Kim embracing the chaos of Jimmy and Kim, nooooooo.

[scenario]

I think it's about once every 5 or 10 years that a show really makes my jaw drop. Happened again. 

[MrWhyt]

I knew it was going to turn out that Saul would take it too far and make the case Saul vs. Kim and that would be the breaking point in their relationship, but i did not see that last line coming. Run away Kim, save yourself.

[Ohwell]

Dear Chuck: 

Wherever you are, I just want to take a moment to apologize for every negative thing I posted about you.  Tonight, I finally, totally, completely see why you couldn't stand your little brother and probably wished many times that you could have smothered him in his sleep with a pillow.  I now can see without question what an irredeemable, balding little rat bastard of a scumbag your little brother really is. 

The only thing you should have done before you kicked the bucket, was to apologize to Ernesto.      

Kim needs therapy.

[scenario]

4 minutes ago, Ohwell said:

Dear Chuck: 

Wherever you are, I just want to take a moment to apologize for every negative thing I posted about you.  Tonight, I finally, totally, completely see why you couldn't stand your little brother and probably wished many times that you could have smothered him in his sleep with a pillow.  I now can see without question what an irredeemable, balding little rat bastard of a scumbag your little brother really is. 

The only thing you should have done before you kicked the bucket, was to apologize to Ernesto.      

Kim needs therapy.

I still think that Jimmy could have been saved from himself years ago. Maybe up till the end of season 1 or so. Jimmy kept Saul under wraps long enough to get a law degree. If he could keep himself more or less under control for 5 or 6 years, he could go more. But Chuck wasn't able to help himself, never mind Jimmy. And Kim encourages Saul at every step whether she realizes it or not. 

There's no way now. That ship has long since sailed. He's full fledged Saul now. He's on the path to Gene and no one's going to stop him.  

[nodorothyparker]

No, Kim, no.  Many a smart woman has broken herself trying to save a man or a relationship that she already knew was past saving.  You were on the right track in your righteous anger at who he is now and what he did and then you chickened out at actually pulling the trigger.  You will come to regret that.  

Having watched the very gradual Jimmy to Saul descent for several years, it's really easy to forget just how crass Saul Goodman really was.

[scenario]

It seems like Kim's pattern was set young. She learned young to love people who were totally untrustworthy and to some extent abusive. The only person you can ever trust is yourself. She wouldn't know what to do with a truly warm, loving and supportive boyfriend. She'd just always be waiting for him to betray her. She expects it. She trusts Saul because she can't trust him. 

2 minutes ago, nodorothyparker said:

Having watched the very gradual Jimmy to Saul descent for several years, it's really easy to forget just how crass Saul Goodman really was.

Is. 

Jimmy's gone. 

[dwmarch]

Saul's car was worth $75 for a minute there!

Everything I know about social engineering I learned from Mike.

I don't remember Lalo killing an innocent bystander but that is probably because this show waits 87 years between seasons.

I thought at the end that Kim was going to say that Mesa Verde dumped her firm and her firm dumped her. I guess not though.

[scenario]

Just now, dwmarch said:

Saul's car was worth $75 for a minute there!

Everything I know about social engineering I learned from Mike.

I don't remember Lalo killing an innocent bystander but that is probably because this show waits 87 years between seasons.

I thought at the end that Kim was going to say that Mesa Verde dumped her firm and her firm dumped her. I guess not though.

Lalo killed the guy in the store behind the counter. Right after the climbing in the dropped ceiling scene. 

Don't remember many details. It was a while ago real time. 

[SHD]

1 hour ago, Dev F said:

Loved the flashback teaser. Some eerily accurate casting on Baby Kim and her mom.

Wait, wasn’t young Kim’s Mom played by Rhea?! I thought it was. If not, that was damn good casting!

[Blakeston]

Kim is straight-up lacking in humanity if she could see Kevin (and Paige and Rich) subjected to that and only be angry about what Jimmy did to her.

[Starchild]

Oh, Kim. Why?

[Dev F]

10 minutes ago, SHD said:

Wait, wasn’t young Kim’s Mom played by Rhea?! I thought it was. If not, that was damn good casting!

Nope, it's an actress named Beth Hoyt, but the resemblance is uncanny.

[SHD]

4 minutes ago, Dev F said:

Nope, it's an actress named Beth Hoyt, but the resemblance is uncanny.

Wow, thanks! 

[qtpye]

16 hours ago, ShadowFacts said:

You could really see Bob Odenkirk the comedian in this one, and I was there for it.  Mike meticulously working for his version of justice, there for that, too.  Howard getting punked in front of Cliff and everyone, good stuff.  But Kim embracing the chaos of Jimmy and Kim, nooooooo.

Oh my God...when the older lady said “This mother fucker showed me his balls!” and the commercial guy said “Yup” I almost died.

15 hours ago, MrWhyt said:

I knew it was going to turn out that Saul would take it too far and make the case Saul vs. Kim and that would be the breaking point in their relationship, but i did not see that last line coming. Run away Kim, save yourself.

 

15 hours ago, Ohwell said:

Dear Chuck: 

Wherever you are, I just want to take a moment to apologize for every negative thing I posted about you.  Tonight, I finally, totally, completely see why you couldn't stand your little brother and probably wished many times that you could have smothered him in his sleep with a pillow.  I now can see without question what an irredeemable, balding little rat bastard of a scumbag your little brother really is. 

The only thing you should have done before you kicked the bucket, was to apologize to Ernesto.      

Kim needs therapy.

 

15 hours ago, nodorothyparker said:

No, Kim, no.  Many a smart woman has broken herself trying to save a man or a relationship that she already knew was past saving.  You were on the right track in your righteous anger at who he is now and what he did and then you chickened out at actually pulling the trigger.  You will come to regret that.  

Having watched the very gradual Jimmy to Saul descent for several years, it's really easy to forget just how crass Saul Goodman really was.

 

15 hours ago, scenario said:

It seems like Kim's pattern was set young. She learned young to love people who were totally untrustworthy and to some extent abusive. The only person you can ever trust is yourself. She wouldn't know what to do with a truly warm, loving and supportive boyfriend. She'd just always be waiting for him to betray her. She expects it. She trusts Saul because she can't trust him. 

Is. 

Jimmy's gone. 

Sadly, I can believe it. So many professionally successful women make horrible choices when it comes to men. There is a pod cast that later became a mini series called Dirty John, which is a true story about a highly successful woman who ignores all the warnings and marries a conman...luckily Kim does not have any children.

I have a theory that is pure speculation.

My guess is that Jimmy does not marry Kim as his last act of humanity. He understands that marrying him will ruin her life. After he loses her, there is no one else to stop him from his most base instincts.

Edited March 24, 2020 by qtpye

[LittleIggy]

For some reason, I knew Kim was going to say “get married.”

[thuganomics85]

Holy shit!

Man, I'm still trying to comprehend those last thirty or so minutes.  It is just amazing how I can somehow both be impressed over how Jimmy pulled everything off and admire that ability, but hate how he went against Kim's request and basically used her to gain a victory that was really more about him.  The irony is that I really do think he deluded himself into thinking that he was helping her, and really thought it was just "part of the game" and that she would be happy about how it all came out.  But while he might have felt like with was selfless, it just comes off self-serving instead and like he really doesn't respect Kim.  And, again, I honestly don't think he meant to come off like that, but that's how it all came out.  All in all, it was masterful, but also masterfully scummy of him.

And yet... Kim just can't pull away, can she?  Just when it looked like she was possibly ready to end it for good, she instead pulls a potential marriage card?  She really just can't quit him, can she?  It is so frustrating to watch, but I suspect this was always how it was going to be with her.  I just hope she gets a wake-up call before it is too late.

Still, I won't lie: I loved the hell out of that video and I want them to release the entire thing online, dammit!

And if that wasn't enough, Jimmy is continuing to troll and embarrass Howard: either for the simple amusement of it or he really is still holding an actual grudge.  Really can't tell at this point.  It was fun seeing Clifford again!

Figured Mike was working some angle to set Lalo up, but it was equally masterful watching how Mike can work his magic during these situations, and how he can flip personas depending on who he is dealing with.  No wonder Gus wanted him on his team!

Loved the Mike/Nacho scene as well.

I swear, if the Emmy voters snub Rhea Seehorn again...

[Bryce Lynch]

2 hours ago, dwmarch said:

Everything I know about social engineering I learned from Mike Dave Clark.

FIFY

[TVFan17]

So... Kim is from Nebraska, or was in Nebraska as a child at some point?  I missed the first couple of minutes of the episode, but I have seen some comments (not here) indicating that there was a license plate with Nebraska on it during the young Kim segment.

If that's true... that's coincidental, seeing that we know who ends up at a Cinnabon in Nebraska down the road.  Or maybe it's not really a coincidence at all.  Hmm...

 

Edited to add:  I've now seen the first couple of minutes, with young Kim, and, yep... her mom has a Nebraska license plate.  Interesting!

Edited March 24, 2020 by TVFan17

[Irlandesa]

This episode was a lot of fun and also frustrating but I'm still not so sure that it makes me understand Kim anymore.

Kim had an unreliable mom.  Kim was willing to walk home when she saw her mom may have had too much to drink.  Why didn't Kim start walking sooner? 

But we also saw Kim didn't give in even when her mom was yelling at her.  The flashback didn't establish a pattern of Kim giving in so it's unclear why she's doing so now. 

[Bannon]

Way back when, it was pretty funny to watch Jimmy con greedy, larcenous, jerks he met in bars. Not really funny when one of the marks is Kim, even if does get 200k to an old woman who was ripped off by Kevin's dad decades earlier. Then again, if Kim is going to stick her head in the crocodile's jaws,  well, what come next is predictably tragic, in the classical sense. Really did appreciate the Kim flashback. Not everyone who suffered an abusive childhood pursues self destruction, but a lot do, and it is very sad.

Just as a change of pace from the pervasive sadness, I hope Mike can help Nacho and his dad to safety.

Edited March 24, 2020 by Bannon

[Bannon]

12 minutes ago, Irlandesa said:

This episode was a lot of fun and also frustrating but I'm still not so sure that it makes me understand Kim anymore.

Kim had an unreliable mom.  Kim was willing to walk home when she saw her mom may have had too much to drink.  Why didn't Kim start walking sooner? 

But we also saw Kim didn't give in even when her mom was yelling at her.  The flashback didn't establish a pattern of Kim giving in so it's unclear why she's doing so now. 

I thought it indicated a lot more than unreliability. It seemed pretty clear to me that young Kim was used to seeing her mom drunk, and a lot of chaos ensuing from that drunkeness.

My guess is that we have not seen Kim's mom for the last time.

10 minutes ago, Bannon said:

 

 

Edited March 24, 2020 by Bannon

[ruby24]

So, what I don't get about Kim's ultimatum is what exactly she thinks fixes the situation by them getting married. I get that she's self-destructive and dating her mother, etc. but would it really make her feel better about him if they got married? What does that mean to her, that she would be obligated to put up with his behavior if they were married, where as right now she's bugged by the fact that she feels she has a choice? That would mean marriage is a prison she's placing herself in. 

That part doesn't really make sense to me.

Also, does anyone know what the current year is on the show? Because it started in 2002, right?  A full six years before the events of Breaking Bad, and time moves pretty slowly each season, except for last season when that one montage spanned like 9 months. So, is it like 2004 or 2005? That's still a whole three years away from BB, so maybe Jimmy and Kim do get married. There's still lots of time for things to go south there (unless that theory that she was behind the scenes the whole time was correct, which I still kinda doubt, but I'd love it if they went there).

Edited March 24, 2020 by ruby24

[Lonesome Rhodes]

Cucumber water for the win!

Beyond my days of rooting for Jimmy being over, I found the logic of the scam of Kevin and his total capitulation to be weak.  Saul is already on super thin ice with the licensure committee.  Rich knows this.  He would crush Saul.  I truly love that G/G went there (Saul conning Kim) but the methodology was particularly problematic.  

I did not need the backstory of Kim's abusive upbringing.  Nothing can adequately explain or "justify" insanity.  It just is.  The stark contrast of the Kim who just got away with her latest dipping of toes in the river Styx was powerful.  She seemed strong and confident and ready to kick some serious legal butt for a boss who clearly likes and respects her (he shouldn't, but he does).  As the sun sets, she decides to do a Triple Lindy into wickedness.  What a nut job she is.

I appreciated the lack of joy expressed by Odenkirk as he was overseeing his prank of Howard and the bonus of Cliff being there to witness it.  It's a kind of hell when the drug of choice stops working for an addict.  This was a great depiction of such, imo.  I am less sanguine as to the misplaced hatred and transference by Goodman on to Howard.  Here, too, a nut job.

The Nacho/Mike dynamic was crackling.  Nacho may have simply been desperate.  yet, I took away a sense of a budding mentor/mentee.  Each knows the other is fully capable of atrocity.  They also each have a code the other respects.  Mike's handling of the librarian was an oasis of humanity.  It really is too bad that life overwhelmed Mike and he chose evil.  When he wants to be, he is winning.  I also had a whole Lalo fun (sorry) watching that arrest.  You just couldn't leave things be, could you, Lalo?  Eat it.

All in all, this was a phenomenal episode.  A gift.  

Edited March 24, 2020 by Lonesome Rhodes

[shapeshifter]

8 hours ago, qtpye said:

My guess is that Jimmy does not marry Kim as his last act of humanity. He understands that marrying him will ruin her life. After, he loses her there is no one else to stop him from his most base instincts.

This seems the best case scenario at this point. 
 

 

8 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

I swear, if the Emmy voters snub Rhea Seehorn again

The Emmy and other awards givers always seem unwarrantedly reluctant to consider any spinoffs, likely because they presume a lack of originality. Ironically, this show —especially with this episode— is possibly the most original show to date.

 

7 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

Kim had an unreliable mom.  Kim was willing to walk home when she saw her mom may have had too much to drink.  Why didn't Kim start walking sooner?

This demonstrates the origin of Kim’s eternal hope that people can change for the better. 
 

 

6 hours ago, ruby24 said:

So, what I don't get about Kim's ultimatum is what exactly she thinks fixes the situation by them getting married

Seriously. Maybe she thinks getting married means he can’t hurt her without hurting himself, but, if so, she’s wrong in thinking he won’t hurt himself.  

 

I wonder if there was a voice coach working with both young Kimmie and her Mom, because the mimicking of Kim’s speech patterns and cadence really brought those scenes to life. 
ETA: And this too!

2 hours ago, GussieK said:

She really nailed the look in Kim’s eye and the way she holds her jaw and purses her lips. 

Edited March 24, 2020 by shapeshifter

[EtheltoTillie]

52 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

 

I wonder if there was a voice coach working with both young Kimmie and her Mom, because the mimicking of Kim’s speech patterns and cadence really brought those scenes to life. 

She really nailed the look in Kim’s eye and the way she holds her jaw and purses her lips. 

[JudyObscure]

4 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

This episode was a lot of fun and also frustrating but I'm still not so sure that it makes me understand Kim anymore.

Kim had an unreliable mom.  Kim was willing to walk home when she saw her mom may have had too much to drink.  Why didn't Kim start walking sooner? 

But we also saw Kim didn't give in even when her mom was yelling at her.  The flashback didn't establish a pattern of Kim giving in so it's unclear why she's doing so now. 

We didn't see how Kim's relationship with her mother ended.  I'm wondering if Kim carries a load of guilt about giving up on her mom at some point, and Jimmy is her attempt to rewrite history by not giving up on someone she loves.

[Bryce Lynch]

Definitely the biggest plot moving episode of the season.

I loved the Mike, Fring and Nacho stuff.  I had kind of stopped caring about what happened to Mike and Fring, but this episode sucked me back in.

I love when Mike is scheming and being Dave Clark, instead of feeling sorry for himself.

Fring going on the offensive against Lalo was also refreshing.  

I had always assumed Lalo must have been in prison, when Walt and Jesse threatened Saul in the desert in BB, and this episode seems to confirm it.

I guess Mike empathizes with Nacho over Fring having a gun to his father's head because Hector essentially had the Cousins put a gun to Kaylee's head.

I thought the Saul scam was pretty well done.  Yes, there were some potential holes in it, but I think if Kevin fought him it would be mutually assured destruction.  Kevin sensed that Saul was crazy enough to launch his nukes and gave in to demands that weren't too outrageous, especially the copyright infringement part.

I am not sure I bought Kim's reaction.  When she was seemingly angrily taking articles of clothes off, back at the apartment, I thought she might surprise us by revealing that Saul scamming her made her horny, and jumping him.

But, when she talked out the situation rationally and then suddenly came to the conclusion that maybe they should get married, I didn't really buy it.  

I wonder if there was any to Kim being a cello player and Chuck's wife Rebecca being a violinist.  Probably not, the cello was probably just something heavy for Kim to lug home.

I guess we know Kim's eviction story she told Acker was true, or based upon a true story.

 

 

 

 

[Ed-]

Saul seems to still act like (Slippin') Jimmy, but only while alone with Kim. So that's like 1 hour per day of Jimmy, the rest being Saul.

I hope it does not go towards a naive plot that would be something like Saul making a huge party with blackjack and hookers, and in the morning Kim finds Saul in bed with them. Saul is apologetic and throws the classic "it's no big deal", Kim says "fine, no rules then" and goes out with Howard. Since Saul has made quite a bit of effort to sabotage Howard, he cannot take it and goes 99.9% Saul. Further catalysts could be the financial crisis with Howard and/or Kim going bankrupt, then Kim would go to Nebraska to eventually meet Gene. Or, Saul doesn't want to take Lalo's job, and Lalo threatens Kim. Saul offers Kim the vacuum cleaner guy, Kim refuses, and is sent to Belize. Even after her departure, I see Saul doing something atrocious that makes him go 100% Saul.

[Ellaria]

8 hours ago, nodorothyparker said:

No, Kim, no.  Many a smart woman has broken herself trying to save a man or a relationship that she already knew was past saving.  You were on the right track in your righteous anger at who he is now and what he did and then you chickened out at actually pulling the trigger.  You will come to regret that.  

Having watched the very gradual Jimmy to Saul descent for several years, it's really easy to forget just how crass Saul Goodman really was.

Excellent post! I gasped when she uttered the word "married." No - just no.

Odenkirk is incredible in this role and it causes me to overlook how merciless Saul can be. It is always about him. 

7 hours ago, Blakeston said:

Kim is straight-up lacking in humanity if she could see Kevin (and Paige and Rich) subjected to that and only be angry about what Jimmy did to her.

I think that Kim's reactions are complicated. She believes that there is humanity left in Jimmy. She believes that he loves her - or values their relationship - more than the scams and petty take-downs. She was a willing participant in the initial efforts to aid Acker. Did she really believe that Jimmy would back off? 

6 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

And if that wasn't enough, Jimmy is continuing to troll and embarrass Howard: either for the simple amusement of it or he really is still holding an actual grudge.  Really can't tell at this point.  

There have been a lot of truly horrible people in the BCS/BB universe but Howard isn't one of them. These "pranks" are childish.

5 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

This episode was a lot of fun and also frustrating but I'm still not so sure that it makes me understand Kim anymore.

Yes - I continue to be frustrated with her characterization. I want her to walk away before it gets worse.

[PeterPirate]

I suppose we've seen the last of Brenda's dad, but it was good to see Cliff again.  Although I don't think it would take more than 10 seconds for Howard to figure out who sent the two women to prank him.  If he was on the ball, he would take a picture of them, get their names, and look for their court records to find Saul was their attorney.  And for that matter, why was Howard meeting with Cliff?  

The "Bitsui will get reparations" line was a nice touch.  Somewhat oddly, the actor who plays Victor is named Jeremiah Bitsui.  

6 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

This episode was a lot of fun and also frustrating but I'm still not so sure that it makes me understand Kim anymore.

Kim had an unreliable mom.  Kim was willing to walk home when she saw her mom may have had too much to drink.  Why didn't Kim start walking sooner? 

But we also saw Kim didn't give in even when her mom was yelling at her.  The flashback didn't establish a pattern of Kim giving in so it's unclear why she's doing so now. 

I was thinking exactly that.  Maybe the message was that Kim walked home, and not to the nearest police station to become a foster child.  And at the end of the episode, she's about to make a home with another unreliable person.

Although--and I might be in the minority here--I think Jimmy in this episode was the opposite of Kim's mom.  He went the extra mile to get her out of a tough situation with Rich (even though she didn't appreciate it at first).  So maybe the message is she wouldn't get in the car with her mom, but she will hitch up with Jimmy.  

[ShadowFacts]

35 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

I guess Mike empathizes with Nacho over Fring having a gun to his father's head because Hector essentially had the Cousins put a gun to Kaylee's head.

Yes, and I also got the fact of the father-son dynamic in reverse -- Nacho has put his father in mortal danger, unintentionally, and Mike sees that he ultimately put his own son in danger with his advice regarding the dirty cops.  Even though he thinks Nacho is stupid he would like to prevent a fatal outcome for the father. That will be great if he pulls it off.

15 minutes ago, Ellaria Sand said:

There have been a lot of truly horrible people in the BCS/BB universe but Howard isn't one of them. These "pranks" are childish.

Yes, I agree, I don't like what he did to Howard, but I somehow enjoyed the spectacle of the ladies' floor show in the sedate restaurant, juvenile as it was.  Pretty much of what Saul did in this episode was on the arrested development side of the spectrum.  Kim would have to be horribly embarrassed in front of Kevin, Paige, and Rich just having a boyfriend like that, let alone the damage he did to her client. 

[chick binewski]

6 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

Kim had an unreliable mom.  Kim was willing to walk home when she saw her mom may have had too much to drink.  Why didn't Kim start walking sooner? 

But we also saw Kim didn't give in even when her mom was yelling at her.  The flashback didn't establish a pattern of Kim giving in so it's unclear why she's doing so now. 

 

2 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

This demonstrates the origin of Kim’s eternal hope that people can change for the better. 

Thinking back on the opening (and the stellar choice & direction of the young actress), Kim already seems to have her underlying sense of practicality. Yet she waited and waited even though she knew what the outcome would be. And for good measure was told by the person who disappointed her (again) "you never listen!".

We understand a child holding reasonable expectations to an grown-up who will not meet them. And, to a degree, repeating that pattern into adulthood. But Kim's story has now taken a Scorpion annd the Frog turn and I'm dreading what's in store.

[shapeshifter]

52 minutes ago, PeterPirate said:

The "Bitsui will get reparations" line was a nice touch.  Somewhat oddly, the actor who plays Victor is named Jeremiah Bitsui.

Good catch! Wikipedia and Google indicate that both the actor Jeremiah Bitsui and the poet Sherwin Bitsui are descendants of tribes indigenous to that area. 

 

 

58 minutes ago, ShadowFacts said:

the father-son dynamic in reverse -- Nacho has put his father in mortal danger, unintentionally, and Mike sees that he ultimately put his own son in danger with his advice regarding the dirty cops

So Mike might be seeking personal redemption by assisting Nacho in saving his father’s life. 
 

 

[Pike Ludwell]

The stunts with Howard have been totally uncalled for at this point and really contribute to making Saul into an unsympathetic character - a psychopath, basically.

Edited March 24, 2020 by Pike Ludwell

[Bryce Lynch]

1 hour ago, PeterPirate said:

I suppose we've seen the last of Brenda's dad, but it was good to see Cliff again.  Although I don't think it would take more than 10 seconds for Howard to figure out who sent the two women to prank him.  If he was on the ball, he would take a picture of them, get their names, and look for their court records to find Saul was their attorney.  And for that matter, why was Howard meeting with Cliff?  

The "Bitsui will get reparations" line was a nice touch.  Somewhat oddly, the actor who plays Victor is named Jeremiah Bitsui.  

I was thinking exactly that.  Maybe the message was that Kim walked home, and not to the nearest police station to become a foster child.  And at the end of the episode, she's about to make a home with another unreliable person.

Although--and I might be in the minority here--I think Jimmy in this episode was the opposite of Kim's mom.  He went the extra mile to get her out of a tough situation with Rich (even though she didn't appreciate it at first).  So maybe the message is she wouldn't get in the car with her mom, but she will hitch up with Jimmy.  

I was wondering if Howard and Cliff were meeting to discuss the Sandpiper case.  We haven't heard anything about it recently, and I would think they should be close to a settlement (and a nice paycheck for Saul) by now.

S&C is defense council for Sandpiper.  I wonder if Kim might do something unscrupulous to assist D&M and HHM in the case against her firm's big client, to help Saul get a huge check.   She has already shown a willingness to screw over Kevin and Paige, who really made her career. 

She has no direct relationship with Sandpiper and it is genuinely a scummy company for defrauding elderly residents.   I don't think it would be difficult for Saul to convince Kim that screwing over Sandpiper would be a justifiable use of their super powers.  

[Dev F]

3 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

Maybe she thinks getting married means he can’t hurt her without hurting himself, but, if so, she’s wrong in thinking he won’t hurt himself.

Spousal privilege. Any private communications between them for the duration of their marriage would be protected from disclosure. If Kim can't trust that Jimmy won't involve her in something shady again, it's the only other way to ensure that she won't have to lie under oath for him. It's basically the saddest possible reason for two people to get married.

Edited March 24, 2020 by Dev F

[shapeshifter]

4 minutes ago, Dev F said:

Spousal privilege. Any private communications between them would be protected from disclosure for the duration of their marriage. If Kim can't trust that Jimmy won't involve her in something shady again, it's the only other way to ensure that she won't have to lie under oath for him. It's basically the saddest possible reason for two people to get married.

Oh. Wow. I can’t believe the rest of us missed this.  But really. Shouldn’t the term “Spousal privilege” have been thrown out there with Kim’s proposal? Hrmph. I think VG would not have left that out for the next episode. 🤨

[GreekGeek]

4 minutes ago, Dev F said:

Spousal privilege. Any private communications between them would be protected from disclosure for the duration of their marriage. If Kim can't trust that Jimmy won't involve her in something shady again, it's the only other way to ensure that she won't have to lie under oath for him. It's basically the saddest possible reason for two people to get married.

Spousal privilege was my first thought too. I expected it to come up at some point, but the biggest surprise was that the "proposal" came from Kim rather than Jimmy.

[NoReally]

I was surprised that the settlement Saul wanted from Mesa Verde was so reasonable.

Thought for sure he asked for $4 million thinking he'd finally settle for $2 million, which Acker would happily take in exchange for moving. On the other hand, Acker has been portrayed as someone who might turn down $10 million for his little house.

[Bannon]

44 minutes ago, Pike Ludwell said:

The stunts with Howard have been totally uncalled for at this point and really contribute to making Saul into an unsympathetic character - a psychopath, basically.

The Kim flashback at the beginning? To me makes Kim look odd and unreasonable. I  say this understanding how it can be harshly thrown back at me that the mom had a few drinks!! Kim acted reasonable!! Who would get in the car with a parent who'd had a few drinks!! She was so late!! Kim had a right to be POd!! But, in reality it was ridiculous to walk 3 miles at night carrying a heavy cello. Don't punish yourself. It was a rural area with very little traffic. Just ride with the mother, get home, and discuss it.

I highly suspect young Kim has dealt with the effects of her mom's drinking more than a few times. The child actor, in my view, really nailed the role of a kid dealing with a parent's alcoholism.

As awful a person as Jimmy has become, I really disagree that he is a psychopath or sociopath. 

[JudyObscure]

2 hours ago, Ellaria Sand said:

There have been a lot of truly horrible people in the BCS/BB universe but Howard isn't one of them. These "pranks" are childish.

 I also don't believe those two ladies would be that good at acting their parts and remembering their lines.  I would have believed it more if they had paused and looked at each other or giggled a few times.

It's probably just me, but my ears flinched a little when Kevin's father said Mesa Verde was the place to "grow your money."  I think he would have said something like increase your money, it just sounded very 2020 to me.

Kim or her mother should have thought of at least putting the cello in the car.

[shapeshifter]

Did everyone notice that Kim's ponytail was droopy/straighter in this episode?

 

 

[MrWhyt]

2 hours ago, PeterPirate said:

The "Bitsui will get reparations" line was a nice touch.  Somewhat oddly, the actor who plays Victor is named Jeremiah Bitsui. 

not super odd, the character was named after the actor's daughter

[Bannon]

33 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

I was wondering if Howard and Cliff were meeting to discuss the Sandpiper case.  We haven't heard anything about it recently, and I would think they should be close to a settlement (and a nice paycheck for Saul) by now.

S&C is defense council for Sandpiper.  I wonder if Kim might do something unscrupulous to assist D&M and HHM in the case against her firm's big client, to help Saul get a huge check.   She has already shown a willingness to screw over Kevin and Paige, who really made her career. 

She has no direct relationship with Sandpiper and it is genuinely a scummy company for defrauding elderly residents.   I don't think it would be difficult for Saul to convince Kim that screwing over Sandpiper would be a justifiable use of their super powers.  

That would be an interesting callback. I also find it interesting that Schweikert has really been portrayed as the most consistently competent manager of all the lawyerly managerial types in this show. His handling of Kim's outburst was really smart. What do the writers have planned for him?