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gonzosgirrl

S15.E10: The Heroes' Journey

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10 hours ago, Mrs. Stanwyck said:

It was a very quick line so it was easy to miss but Dean said something like "With that many monsters in one place, human bodies will be dropping".  They didn't go because monsters were killing monsters, they went because they thought humans would be getting killed too just because of the high concentration of monsters.

 

Preemptive hunting isn't in their job description though, and it's a slippery slope that they were supposed to have grown out of ages ago.
Besides like @PAForrest said they blew up dozens of people without having any idea who was in there ; humans, or harmless monsters that just enjoyed watching.

 

That part where Dean got kicked in the dick sure made up for it though !

Once Dabb's finished with this show there isn't even going to be a carcass to pick up.

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On 1/24/2020 at 10:30 PM, trudysmom said:

Anyone else notice the name of the store where Dean's card was rejected was "Beren's" something or other.   I don't usually catch stuff like that.

I don't usually catch stuff like that either, but I think it was practically the same shot that the credit for the guy named "Beren" popped up on the screen.  It was tough to miss.

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On 1/24/2020 at 9:52 PM, Castiels Cat said:

Barrow was the setting of the film Thirty Days of Night 

I know.  Because it's way the Hell up there in the Arctic Circle, so they get 24 hour days during the summer and 24 hour nights in the winter.  You could certainly go there if you had a plane, boat, or magical teleportation.  But any place between Barrow and some other human inhabited place would be in the wet and hostile Alaskan tundra.

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18 minutes ago, Ray Adverb said:

I don't usually catch stuff like that either, but I think it was practically the same shot that the credit for the guy named "Beren" popped up on the screen.  It was tough to miss.

Supernatural Wiki has a different explanation:

Dean goes shopping at "Berens' Kwik Trip," which is a reference to Charlie Berens and the comedy video series Manitowoc Minute. Production Designer Jerry Wanek is a fan of the show, and is also from Manitowoc, Wisconsin

😑

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On 1/25/2020 at 12:50 PM, Castiels Cat said:

Chuck wrote this episode. Stupid plot twists and on point lessons for the Winchesters are established clues to a s 15 written by Chuck very special episode.  He is just banging them out. Chuck is a hack.

It was in the episode. God hates us. Of course they have skills. They don't in this episode because God hates them. And yes... Garth is usually hapless and needs saving except he saves the day here.

For me the problem with the non-stop meta and Chuck's hard-on for Dean is that as a viewer one has to be asking oneself what is Dabb thinking. Dabb is making the last season a meta commentary on the creator hating his creations for misbehaving and in particular he is mad at Dean for not staying within his boundaries. It all seems very P.A. which is epitomized by Garth not naming a baby after Dean?!  

OK- But if UpChuck wrote this episode, then how will he not know that they are on their way to Barrow? If UpChuck wrote all of the dialogue, how can anything happen? Or did he write it in an improve way, where he set up the situation, then let them write the dialogue?

This is why I just can't wrap my head around what Drabb is doing with the show.

And his endless waterpistols are ruining me too.

On 1/26/2020 at 3:36 PM, Pondlass1 said:

The dance sequence was odd and out of place.  Dean would surely dream of a strip club or bar?  

OK- THAT'S THE SCENE I WOULD PAY FOR. Dean dancing around a pole.

On 1/27/2020 at 7:06 AM, Bergamot said:

But we already knew this about Dean and Sam! That they only ever had problems that were plot-relevant is not some amazing or clever insight on Dabb's part.

Here's what Garth, speaking as the writer's mouthpiece, says about the episode:

The thing is, having only plot-relevant problems does not make them "not normal" heroes, it makes them FICTIONAL. We only see the plot-relevant problems that Garth (or any other character) faces as well. We saw one of Garth's babies filling its diaper, because Dabb wanted to make a (stupid) joke about it, but we didn't watch the whole process of Garth changing the baby's diaper. Not because Garth is too heroic to have to change a diaper, but because it wasn't part of the story and Garth is not a real person -- he is a fictional character in a story. Just like we saw Sam making a mess by spilling things on the kitchen floor, but we didn't have to spend several minutes watching him clean up the floor, because that wasn't part of the story.

 

And because it is FICTIONAL- we don't see the ordinary mundane things because that stuff makes a BORING SHOW! I mean, yeah I say, I would watch So and So read a phone book. But in reality, I would be doing something else while listening to that, because BORING. You have 22 hours minus commercials to tell a season. You don't bother with, "And then Sam cooks and Dean eats. Or Dean spends a half hour of the 45 minutes waiting in a dentist's office because the dentist is behind. So, for a half hour, we watch Dean read a magazine. Meanwhile, Sam blows his nose, coughs, sneezes and sleeps for the whole 45 minutes because he has the flu. Two times, we hear him groan about being miserable.

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4 minutes ago, Bali said:

OK- But if UpChuck wrote this episode, then how will he not know that they are on their way to Barrow? If UpChuck wrote all of the dialogue, how can anything happen? Or did he write it in an improve way, where he set up the situation, then let them write the dialogue?

Exactly.  If he took away their "hero mojo" how are they going to get it back? Isn't that something he would control.  Even if they could get it back couldn't he jsut take it away again? This is just so monumentally stupid I want to tear my brain out.

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19 hours ago, Affogato said:

Well having bad oral hygiene and good teeth is good luck. A

Not necessarily. Dean has been shown to practice regular good oral hygeine minus dentist cleaning. He has been shown brushing and flossing more than once. He might have extremely strong enamel to keep the teeth healthy enough with his practices to avoid cavitites. Even if Dean was only shown to be doing that one time that is enough to establish that he, as the fictional character, does it consistently. So Dean having 17 cavities is directly a result of Chuck and nothing else.  It's not bad luck.  It's just stupid for the sake of stupid humor IMO. 

Nor does it change that Dean remains a hero not a superhero which he's never been. It's a flat out lie when Garth says "for the first time  ever" they are dealing with "normal" problems. He doesn't know them well enough to say that in the first place, and it just isn't true. Garth is the abnormal one because he has superstrength because he is a werewolf now. Was i supposed to see and ignore the irony or was it hypocrisy from Garth? Was i supposed to go "awww" becaise the werewolf with a heart of gold talks to the humans or something. Well, I didnt. I told Garth to shut up. (Yes I yelled at a fictional character to shut up.)

Which is what Dean and Sam should have done because Dean and Sam sew up up their own wounds to avoid the ER because they don't want to get caught or draw attention. Not because the don't get injured  ever. 

Its a false pretense that Dabb rolled out yet the boys are just not standing up and saying this is solely Chuck and call his bluff.   He could have had Dean or Sam speak up and say 'No, we have normal problems all the time, like fixing the Impala when necessary. And when Dean took Sam to the ER as a kid when Sam broke his arm. ' So on and so on.

It bothered me way more that the boys are just accepting that this is extremely bad luck. It also makes them look like fools.

 Dean's dancing is the only thing that actually made sense because he was under sedation and hallucinating. Maybe he always really liked dancing and so he did. I don't find that unbelievable at all. The rest is stupid. IMO

 

 

 

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6 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

Dean's dancing is the only thing that actually made sense because he was under sedation and hallucinating. Maybe he always really liked dancing and so he did. I don't find that unbelievable at all. The rest is stupid. IMO

OTOH, I can't imagine him even hallucinating tap dancing.  I don't think he's ever watched old 1930s musicals or seen Gene Kelly or Fred Astaire, much less wanted to emulate them.  

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1 hour ago, Bali said:

And his endless waterpistols are ruining me too.

I feel like Cas, I don't get this reference.  What are "endless waterpistols"?

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17 minutes ago, SueB said:

I feel like Cas, I don't get this reference.  What are "endless waterpistols"?

Dabb's constant cannon changes

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I'll give the episode a 7--like others i'd rather the boys be bad ass BUT I find it a nice light episode.  I DO NOT think at all this episode destroys Dean and Sam from the beginning.   It simply means the boys are NOT self-creating...they were especially made to be great heroes--why the cupids specifically set up their family lines.  Subtracting their greatness shows the greatness they were born with.

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25 minutes ago, ahrtee said:

OTOH, I can't imagine him even hallucinating tap dancing.  I don't think he's ever watched old 1930s musicals or seen Gene Kelly or Fred Astaire, much less wanted to emulate them.  

I've watched a lot of Gene Kelly and Fred Astaire on free tv.  Growing up didn't have cable.  Now the real question why on earth did they decided to write this sequence?

The issue with this ep, is that if you really think about it, nothing connects well with the other eps.  It feels like it is in a vacuum and trying to figure out why they did what they did ruins what little enjoyment you might have gotten out of it.  I honestly don't think it is designed to think about anything.  It's the pure fluff fanfiction.  Nothing to think about, and if you like the stupid over the top humor...30% might love it.

Over thinking it, looking for reasons just destroys it.  Since they aren't really following cannon other than Dean would watch old shows on tv.  So maybe during one of his recovering moments from an hunt.  There has been times that Dean has liked songs that he said he hated. 

If they had set this up better it could be interesting.  The dilemma have the boys ever done anything that was just them or are they just following the script.  Was it skill sets that they had developed or had Chuck provided a little nudge so the boys could win over impossible odds.

If they hadn't lost all of their skill sets, if they had almost won then lost at the last bit it might have been more interesting...  Not sure they can make this work even with better writers...I've already deleted the ep so not even one I care to watch again.  I doubt I'll even look at season 14 and 15 again.  Trying to ride it out to the end but if they had signed on for more, I would have just stopped watching.

I'm ignoring what this ep is trying to say since it isn't making any kind of sense.  I do that with fanfiction too.  I won't allow this one ep to destroy who the boys are.  Human heroes trying to overcome huge obstacles that most normal folks would never take on.

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46 minutes ago, Jakes said:

I'll give the episode a 7--like others i'd rather the boys be bad ass BUT I find it a nice light episode.  I DO NOT think at all this episode destroys Dean and Sam from the beginning.   It simply means the boys are NOT self-creating...they were especially made to be great heroes--why the cupids specifically set up their family lines.  Subtracting their greatness shows the greatness they were born with.

Going by this episode they were born as incompetent yokels who, despite growing up in the hunting life, never picked up even the slightest skills, like lock-picking, mechanical skills or fighting skills. That was all because Chuck wrote it for them. Nothing they learned or accomplished themselves.  

C-list sidekicks like Garth are naturally superior to them once Chuck doesn`t write them as "heroes" anymore. 

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2 hours ago, catrox14 said:

Not necessarily. Dean has been shown to practice regular good oral hygeine minus dentist cleaning. He has been shown brushing and flossing more than once.

Not to mention, have any of these people actually seen Jensen grin or laugh? His teeth are perfection, all the way to the back (including the dental work he's had done).  You can literally see this when they zoom in.

I'd also like to reiterate: if I ever leave a dentist's office after fillings with a mouthful of bloody gauze, somebody is getting sued.

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2 hours ago, ahrtee said:

OTOH, I can't imagine him even hallucinating tap dancing.  I don't think he's ever watched old 1930s musicals or seen Gene Kelly or Fred Astaire, much less wanted to emulate them.  

IDK. 

Dean constantly surprises, so watching those old movies when there was nothing else on or when he was bored by the usual stuff on tv-I can easily see it-and yup, I can even see him fantasizing about doing some tap dancing a la Gene Kelly.

So the dream sequence worked even within the framework of the episode for me, but even if it hadn't, I'd still call it the only good thing about this mess/ drek that Dabb tried to pass off as an episode.

 

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18 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Not to mention, have any of these people actually seen Jensen grin or laugh? His teeth are perfection, all the way to the back (including the dental work he's had done).  You can literally see this when they zoom in.

I'd also like to reiterate: if I ever leave a dentist's office after fillings with a mouthful of bloody gauze, somebody is getting sued.

That`s par of the course now. Jensen/Dean looks like he looks and we still get an abundance of old/ugly jokes. SPN is the weirdest CW show like that. I watch a lot and none of the others ever once pretended that the hot people on it are not hot since people do have eyes.

The whole getting 17 fillings was once again totally hyperbolic. You wouldn`t happily munch down food soon after. You`d be in pain, no matter what. That is what actually would happen to normal people. Not them forgetting their lock-picking skills.

Dabb`s own construct doesn`t even hold up to an internal logic. Things are still terribly convenient whenever they need to be.    

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They have shown dean watching the stooges on his laptop... IMO its pretty similar physical comedy /even if you just allow yourself to be directed through the greatest hits by youtube's recommendations you'd eventually end up at "Make 'em laugh" and then you end up at Gene Kelly lol

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8 hours ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Dean Winchester would 100% be a Renaissance man given half the chance. Fight me.

I think him being a renaissance man on top of being a righteous man and the perfect older brother and the favorite of an angel and an expert killer/fighter and a nerdy, relatable fanboy would be a bit of an overkill, lol.

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14 hours ago, catrox14 said:

Dean's dancing is the only thing that actually made sense because he was under sedation and hallucinating. Maybe he always really liked dancing and so he did. I don't find that unbelievable at all. The rest is stupid. IMO

Or maybe he always hated this type of choreographed dancing (the ballet shoes episode...) and it was more like a bad trip.

I only watched this one scene on youtube, and Dean did not really seem to be enjoying himself, at least not right from the start.

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I'm not nearly as critical of TV as a lot of people in these forums.

But I absolutely hated this episode.

I actually like meta stuff. A lot. But this was absurd beyond the point of being enjoyable.

Completely negating the entire past episodes? WTF?

Now I'M pissed.

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2 hours ago, FierceCritter said:

I'm not nearly as critical of TV as a lot of people in these forums.

But I absolutely hated this episode.

I actually like meta stuff. A lot. But this was absurd beyond the point of being enjoyable.

Completely negating the entire past episodes? WTF?

Now I'M pissed.

Welcome to the club. I believe it will be growing even larger until they finally put the final nail in the coffin. So sad...

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On 1/28/2020 at 11:53 AM, SueB said:

I feel like Cas, I don't get this reference.  What are "endless waterpistols"?

It's  Bali's term for "NUcanon". You had to have been there. I believe the thinking is we are so far off of canon it's "water pistols".

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On 1/28/2020 at 11:29 AM, catrox14 said:

Dean's dancing is the only thing that actually made sense because he was under sedation and hallucinating. Maybe he always really liked dancing and so he did.

Dean liking dancing and maybe wanting to dance is canon as per "Out With the Old." But if they really wanted to go full canon, it would've been ballet dancing. That's maybe a bit more technical though than tap dancing (? - I'm not a dancer, so not entirely sure of that.) Also generally the female ballet dancer is featured whereas with tap, it's more often a male dancer who is featured. So that may be why they went with tap.

On 1/29/2020 at 1:37 AM, juppschmitz said:

Or maybe he always hated this type of choreographed dancing (the ballet shoes episode...) and it was more like a bad trip.

Dean was shown to like dancing in that episode. He claimed mainly to be heavily influenced by "Black Swan," but also admitted to wanting to put on the shoes himself. And the shoes kept "following" him and enticing him by changing to his size.

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I had this weird thought that is 100% wrong but I was watching Dean's tap dancing scene again (the only scene worth watching) and my mind immediately jumped to a way that scene could be significant in the fight against Chuck.

When I was watching that Wild Hearts Can't be Broken video that was linked in the fan fiction thread, with bits of Dean dancing in between being controlled.  It made me think of that old movie, Village of The Damned. 

Its an old movie staring Christopher Reeve and Kristy Alley about a group of alien children who  can read peoples thoughts and control their actions.  I'll spoiler tag the next part. 

In the movie

Spoiler

Christopher Reeve's character thought of a brick wall when the kids tried to control him.  They couldn't read his mind or break through to control him.  So ultimately he ended up being the only one able to stop the children,    So what if Dean tries something similar.  Here he is moving freely and tapping the beat of his own song.  When God wants to control him, he thinks about himself dancing, and doing this own thing.  The eqivalent of the brick wall, something God can't stop or break, and it allows Dean to get close enough to kill God. 

 

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On 2/3/2020 at 8:57 PM, ILoveReading said:

I had this weird thought that is 100% wrong but I was watching Dean's tap dancing scene again (the only scene worth watching) and my mind immediately jumped to a way that scene could be significant in the fight against Chuck.

When I was watching that Wild Hearts Can't be Broken video that was linked in the fan fiction thread, with bits of Dean dancing in between being controlled.  It made me think of that old movie, Village of The Damned. 

Its an old movie staring Christopher Reeve and Kristy Alley about a group of alien children who  can read peoples thoughts and control their actions.  I'll spoiler tag the next part. 

In the movie

  Hide contents

Christopher Reeve's character thought of a brick wall when the kids tried to control him.  They couldn't read his mind or break through to control him.  So ultimately he ended up being the only one able to stop the children,    So what if Dean tries something similar.  Here he is moving freely and tapping the beat of his own song.  When God wants to control him, he thinks about himself dancing, and doing this own thing.  The eqivalent of the brick wall, something God can't stop or break, and it allows Dean to get close enough to kill God. 

 

Dean's already been shown to not follow the script.  That's why Chuck is obsessed with him however I do like this idea.

Edited by Castiels Cat

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On 1/31/2020 at 6:45 PM, AwesomO4000 said:

I'm not a dancer, so not entirely sure of that.) Also generally the female ballet dancer is featured whereas with tap, it's more often a male dancer who is featured. So that may be why they went with tap.

Some tap steps are easy to learn.  Some take time.  The music wouldn't have fit ballet but it did fit tap.  Depends on who they wanted Dean to have his role model for, Fred Astaire or Gene Kelly, my guess would be more Fred.  For me, the tap dance was the best moment and I don't think it would have landed as ballet.

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38 minutes ago, 7kstar said:

Some tap steps are easy to learn.  Some take time.  The music wouldn't have fit ballet but it did fit tap.  Depends on who they wanted Dean to have his role model for, Fred Astaire or Gene Kelly, my guess would be more Fred.  For me, the tap dance was the best moment and I don't think it would have landed as ballet.

I thought he used moves from both of them: the windmill movement – – where he circled around with his arms outstretched – – was Kelly-ish and the dancing with the lamp was Astaire-ish.

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Ok....not that I could really take the episode seriously to begin with, but....if they’re going to send the boys on a road trip to Alaska maybe do all of five seconds of research and pick two Alaskan towns that you can actually drive to. Because neither Barrow nor Kotzebue are on the road system. Nor is there a road between Kotzebue and Barrow. And please, please do not ever say the word “Kotzebue” again until you learn how to pronounce it correctly.

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Just getting around to watching this episode now.  I am woefully behind this season.  But it must have been a long enough break between this and the last episode I watched, because I was able to just enjoy this for what it was, a fluff episode.  It's always good to see Garth, and I looked at this more in line of Bad Day at Black Rock...not just "normal" but cursed.  Even Baby caught it. 

We'll see what happens in the next episode, but I didn't take this to mean that the last 15 years had been a joke, and that Sam and Dean are not skilled hunters.  I think this is just more of Chuck screwing with their heads more than anything else.  But it made me laugh so I'm going to call it a win.

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