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S01.E08: Two Fathers

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One other thing: her mother told the husband that it was none of his business (what she was doing with her boyfriend). She would have been right, if she wasn't supposed to be watching his daughters at the time. He had every right to be pissed that she wasn't actually watching them. 

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5 minutes ago, Anela said:

One other thing: her mother told the husband that it was none of his business (what she was doing with her boyfriend). She would have been right, if she wasn't supposed to be watching his daughters at the time. He had every right to be pissed that she wasn't actually watching them. 

I don't think she was supposed to be watching the kids, at least at that moment.  The girls had been at school.  It may very well have been that she was about to be watching them and was planning to get Leland out of the way before they got home.

But, then again, she was having sex in her daughter's office (which I didn't realize had a bed...)

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Damn this episode crystallized by dislike for both Kristen and the mother. The look of pure guilt on her face when she saw her husband was delicious. The mother may be under demonic influence but prior to that she was a pathetic go to as a responsible adult in the room. 

Get rid of the ridiculous sexual tension and delve deeper into the supernatural and this show has room to grow. Otherwise it is just another tired story.

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9 hours ago, For Cereals said:

The show is interesting, but I want it move faster before I get too invested and they kill it.

This season is thirteen episodes and it has already been renewed next year for another thirteen episodes.   I do agree that the pacing of this series (as well as many other series) is far too slow.  

At a minimum, Kristen should show a sense of urgency when it comes to her kids being alone with her mother.  Kristen seems to be off doing things without a care in the world.  She ought to know her mother well enough to know that her mother was going to still see Leland after Kristen asked her not to.  Kristen also ought to know that her mother is an irresponsible babysitter.

Kristen should be far more protective of her kids.

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4 hours ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

But, then again, she was having sex in her daughter's office (which I didn't realize had a bed...)

I don't know why she didn't have sex at her own apartment?  After that, go to Kristen's house and baby sit.  At least her version of babysitting.

I don't know why there would be a bed in Kristen's office.  We have seen Kristen's office before and I don't recall seeing a bed in it.

Another thing that bothers me is that Kristen's husband promised Sheryl that he wouldn't tell Kristen that she was still dating Leland.  I am sure Kristen won't tell her husband why she doesn't want her mother dating Leland.  I am also sure Kristen won't tell her husband about all of the weird things that have been going on while he was away.

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5 minutes ago, icemiser69 said:

Another thing that bothers me is that Kristen's husband promised Sheryl that he wouldn't tell Kristen that she was still dating Leland.  I am sure Kristen won't tell her husband why she doesn't want her mother dating Leland.  I am also sure Kristen won't tell her husband about all of the weird things that have been going on while he was away.

She might if he asks her about all of that stuff, which I imagine he will at some point, 'cause no doubt he's got a whole lotta questions about all the things his daughters have shared with him thus far. 

Regarding the way she raises her kids, there was that bit in...the pilot, wasn't it, that indicated that Kristen seemed to have kind of complicated feelings towards her kids, so I wonder if that doesn't subconsciously factor into the way she deals with them and whatnot. She sees her husband off doing what he wants to do, and she seems to long for that to some degree herself, hence going on these little adventures with the team. 

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4 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

I don't know why she didn't have sex at her own apartment?  After that, go to Kristen's house and baby sit.  At least her version of babysitting.

I don't know why there would be a bed in Kristen's office.  We have seen Kristen's office before and I don't recall seeing a bed in it.

Leland likely pushed it as office role play.  I don't think he controls Grandma, but it wouldn't surprise me if whatever demon thing he's got going makes it easier for him to nudge people into following their worst impulses.  

She's been presented a couple of times as resenting, a little, how much Kristen expects her watch (raise) the girls.  It would possibly appeal a little to her worst self to have fun in the place that Kristen works in, with someone Kristen doesn't approve of.

And since it's Kristen's office, there's the potential of all kinds of information that he'll find useful, later.  Plus, it gives him the chance to plant something that might contaminate the office--in supernatural shows (and real-life occult beliefs) there are all kinds of things he could draw or leave in a discrete spot that would corrupt the space, or the people in it.

Edited by Mari · Reason: Another thought.
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9 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

I don't know why she didn't have sex at her own apartment?  After that, go to Kristen's house and baby sit.  At least her version of babysitting.

I don't know why there would be a bed in Kristen's office.  We have seen Kristen's office before and I don't recall seeing a bed in it.

Another thing that bothers me is that Kristen's husband promised Sheryl that he wouldn't tell Kristen that she was still dating Leland.  I am sure Kristen won't tell her husband why she doesn't want her mother dating Leland.  I am also sure Kristen won't tell her husband about all of the weird things that have been going on while he was away.

The only thing I can come up with is that she had a hand-me-down couch in her office that was also a hide-a-bed?  That had sheets on it?

Or maybe she and the hubs had been having trouble before he went off to climb Everest and she was spending nights out there?  

In any case, it seems weird that either all of a sudden there is (conveniently) a bed in there OR this is how we find out there was always a bed in there.  These details...

As for the husband promising not to tell Sheryl's secret.  All he knows about the boyfriend is that Kristen doesn't like him.  Kristen might be a sort of critical spouse (again, we have never seen her actually be a spouse, so we don't know) and her randomly not liking someone isn't that strange to him.  It could also be that he bought the line Sheryl gave him about Kristen wanting her to stay single and, wanting Sheryl to figure less prominently in their lives, is willing to keep her new boyfriend a secret so that she's not around as much?

Edited by HazelEyes4325
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I think Leland is now really controlling Grandma a lot, not that she wasn't awful before but at this point she is likely half possessed.

I am shocked the dad actually showed up. I really thought the plot was going to be he bailed on her and she didn't tell anyone. I still wonder if it will turn out that they are only together for the kids, thus he is gone half the time bc he and Kristen can't stand each other.

My dream is the dad takes the kids and leaves lol.

I really really hate the Grandma and Leland story. 

This is the first time I saw chemistry with Kristen and David. 

I am very glad the scene in the field wasn't worse. I was picture sex with the devil, or childbirth and then sacrifice, all kinds of gross things. I guess it's still a network show thankfully.

The not!Kalinda woman is still irritating me. It's not her fault she's not Kalinda so I'm trying to get over it lol but she clearly looks like her and is styled- clothes hair- very similar to me. 

This was the first ep where from start to finish it seemed like craziness for the sake of it with virtually no point. But it's entertaining so I'm in.

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So hubby is home, and just like that, says goodbye to the monsters in that horrible game. I'm betting, all he did , was make them angry.

That's why I think he will be on Team Good (or at least be targeted by Leland, et al.) Having both him and David there could create an interesting tension. 

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I thought he was due home soon anyway.

He was, it was that he showed up without telling anyone he was coming back, that is weird and suspicious on show where we're supposed to take note of things that aren't "right". I stand by my take that the man is a dick and an apostasy for Satan. At least I hope he is because I hate his smug narcissism either way. 

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7 minutes ago, blixie said:

He was, it was that he showed up without telling anyone he was coming back, that is weird and suspicious on show where we're supposed to take note of things that aren't "right". I stand by my take that the man is a dick and an apostasy for Satan. At least I hope he is because I hate his smug narcissism either way. 

On 11/22/2019 at 2:06 PM, aquarian1 said:

I think it's quite normal to want to surprise family with an early return.  Presumably he also missed his family.

Nice skip this part of my post. that explains how this isn't weird or suspicious.  In the real world, this happens quite frequently.  Friends and family like to surprise each other with early returns like this.  (Heck, the news and media like to even film surprised reactions of military personnel returning early to surprise their families.)   There really is nothing weird about this at all.   I don't even think the show portrayed as a suspicious thing. They've been talking about him all along, how the kids miss him, how he's coming home soon.  I do agree, that while I see him as a force for good, it really is too early to tell, especially on this show.  I do think he'll play into the story more (or at least I hope he will). 

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Nice skip this part of my post. that explains how this isn't weird or suspicious

On any other show? Yes. On one called "Evil"? No. 

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On 11/23/2019 at 2:56 PM, msrachelj said:

But Bens call to Davids phone got thru no probs?! 

Kristen's 911 call probably showed "no service" because that's what she saw when she was tripping balls over that demon baby.

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7 hours ago, ketose said:

Kristen's 911 call probably showed "no service" because that's what she saw when she was tripping balls over that demon baby.

Yeah, I don't think we can take anything in the demon baby scene seriously.  

But, as for the general cell service issue.  I did find it strange that Kristen's phone was without service but David's was fine.  My hubs pointed out that it could have been as simple as they were on different carriers.  True, but I still think it's a little sloppy in the writing department.  

Of course, I found this entire episode a little sloppy.

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7 hours ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

Yeah, I don't think we can take anything in the demon baby scene seriously.  

But, as for the general cell service issue.  I did find it strange that Kristen's phone was without service but David's was fine.  My hubs pointed out that it could have been as simple as they were on different carriers.  True, but I still think it's a little sloppy in the writing department.  

Of course, I found this entire episode a little sloppy.

In the late 90's early 2000's, a lot of lazy writers got by on the "my battery's dead" trope before everyone kept a charger in their car. 

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On 11/24/2019 at 3:07 AM, icemiser69 said:

t least her version of babysitting.

drinking wine and browsing internet in the other room while the kids run wild with The Ring girl and the bedroom monster

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On 11/26/2019 at 11:40 AM, HazelEyes4325 said:

I did find it strange that Kristen's phone was without service but David's was fine.  My hubs pointed out that it could have been as simple as they were on different carriers.  True, but I still think it's a little sloppy in the writing department.  

I didn't have a problem with Kristen's cell phone not getting service but David's working.  It could be that Kristen's phone didn't work because of her location on the property, i.e., in the corn field.  When my husband and I moved to our current house, our cell phones only worked at the end of the driveway/by the road, and not at our house (800 feet back from the road [we had to switch carriers]).  There's a grocery store I go to where my cell phone works in most of the store, but not in certain spots within the store.  It happens.

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5 hours ago, SweetSable said:

I didn't have a problem with Kristen's cell phone not getting service but David's working.  It could be that Kristen's phone didn't work because of her location on the property, i.e., in the corn field.  

I probably wouldn't have had an issue with the phones, except the show made a point that Kristen had no service and it ended up being an important plot point, with her husband not able to reach her.  That, coupled with the fact that Ben's call to David wasn't especially important to the plot--Ben could have had the same conversation in the mirror and it would have been just as effective--did make it all seem sloppy to me.

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1 hour ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

I probably wouldn't have had an issue with the phones, except the show made a point that Kristen had no service and it ended up being an important plot point, with her husband not able to reach her.  That, coupled with the fact that Ben's call to David wasn't especially important to the plot--Ben could have had the same conversation in the mirror and it would have been just as effective--did make it all seem sloppy to me.

I wondered about that too, but where I live, my dad can't always get cell service when he's making deliveries in Amish country - he's said a few times, that if he had something like Verizon, he would probably receive more calls down there.  I was going to say that if they have different cell providers, that might work, but I can't see her going the cheaper route for phone service, even with four kids to look after. 

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2 hours ago, Dowel Jones said:

Well, obviously, The Phone Company has been taken over by demons.  That explains everything.

That assumes there was a time when demons didn't control the Phone Company.

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11 hours ago, ketose said:

That assumes there was a time when demons didn't control the Phone Company.

Well, if we are in the same world as "Person of Interest," then The Machine controls the phone company and Evil Mr. Finch (Michael Emerson) is its father. 😉

I sure hope God sends a friend request to the guy who helps people on Sunday nights! 

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Weird, weird, episode.  Looks like all sorts of good and evil are being set in play.  I LIKE Kristen's husband - so far, he seems like a decent guy, but I guess more will be revealed.  What raised my eyebrows was that he was only supposed to have been away for 3 months.   Prior to that reveal, I was under the impression that the guy had been gone for like a year or more.   I mean really - Kristen already has the hots for David when her husband has been away for a whole 3 months.  Wow - good thing she isnt a military spouse!  Maybe as others here have said - there is some, uh, tension in the marriage and that's why her eyes are wandering.  

And I'm still wondering about the sigil (?) that Kristen found in just one of the red books that Leland gave her daughters.   Is this to signify that one of the girls is a demon and seeing the sigil would flag her memories of being a demon ... or something?   And the thing at the commune about the sigil David's father uses made no sense - the father says one thing; the pregnant wife says another, and then the father says something else - huh?   I'm thinking maybe the writers were tripping along with David, Kristen, and the rest of the commune.    And that birth scene - oh my God - it gave me nightmares - horrible.   

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On 11/26/2019 at 8:40 AM, HazelEyes4325 said:

Yeah, I don't think we can take anything in the demon baby scene seriously.  

But, as for the general cell service issue.  I did find it strange that Kristen's phone was without service but David's was fine.  My hubs pointed out that it could have been as simple as they were on different carriers.  True, but I still think it's a little sloppy in the writing department.  

Of course, I found this entire episode a little sloppy.

I don't find the service issues that weird.  At my mother in laws ranch, you can't make a phone call from her house, but go outside and stand by a tree near the shop, and bang, you got service.  And just randomly inside the house, you will get a text.  Walk a half km up the driveway to my brother in laws house and bingo, you've got service again.

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On 11/23/2019 at 1:29 PM, icemiser69 said:

The Don Knotts' movie, The Ghost and Mr. Chicken, scares the crap out of me.  Knotts can really sell it when it comes to acting scared.   I get scared, because I can see how scared Luther Heggs (Don Knotts) is, along with the creepy bloody keyed organ playing with no one at the organ.

Attaboy, Luther!

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I'm just catching up on this show so I'm late to the party, but I really hated this episode. As others have pointed out, there were way too many plot points, and I thought the art commune characters were very stereotypical and poorly written. However, I liked the dad's explanation of why he was using the symbol. It was extremely thoughtful and meaningful.

I thought I was going to hate Kristen's husband because of how the characters previously talked about him being selfish, etc. As soon as he started ripping on Kristen's mom, he instantly won me over. There are not enough adjectives in the English language for me to accurately describe the hate I have for Kristen's mom. I can only imagine what she was like as an actual mother when Kristen was a child; I'm sure she was just as narcissistic then. Kristen probably started climbing mountains because there was not enough distance on flat land to get away from the forking nightmare that is her mother.

Finally, I really love Aasif Mandvi on this show. Poor Ben; the things he'll do to get laid. He deserves better!

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On 11/22/2019 at 4:31 PM, rhys said:

Could the underground railroad have gone as far north as NY? Explaining both Annie Commerce & my ignorance.

The underground railroad went all the way to canada. That's what it was for.

I was surprised that Kristen's husband actually showed up. Most of the time, absentee spouses never show up at all, dying hundreds or thousands of miles away

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On 11/22/2019 at 12:43 PM, teddysmom said:

I love the Little Women movie with Winona Ryder and them all chattering never bugged me like these girls.  It's like they have 2 speeds, asleep and talking non stop all at the same time. 

I've never hated tv kids as much I hate these non stop talking over each other all the time kids.

So dad comes home and I'm wondering if he's really dad or demon dad? He sure didn't look like someone that just got off the tallest mountain peak in the world.

I'm not getting into the lusting of David and Kristen. I mean David knew going into being a priest it meant no women right? So if he can't control himself with a women he's only known for a few weeks what the heck is he going to do when he's a priest. Same with Kristen, your husband has only been gone for 3 months, I know it's a long time but military wives/husbands go longer without seeing each other so if you can't get through 3 months then you don't have a marriage in the first place.

What the heck kind of drug were they on? And how much did they take.

I know I'm late in the game here but I'm just now watching it on Netflix. I don't know if the show even has a second season but it doesn't matter I'm out after this one. I thought Michael E could keep me watching but sadly he can't . 

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2 hours ago, foxfreakinmulder said:

I know it's a long time but military wives/husbands go longer without seeing each other so if you can't get through 3 months then you don't have a marriage in the first place.

OMG this. Not a military wife but military kid. Dad would be sent on assignments lasting anywhere from 1 week to a full year and in his entire 24-year career I never heard one word of complaint from my mom (no male “friends” hanging around either), and it never once occurred to me to reproach him. If he missed something because he was out on maneuvers, well, I knew he’d be home soon to read bedtime stories or take me to swimming practice/flute lessons again. That’s just how it was. 

I adore Aasif Mandvi in this role and I really want to root for Mike Colter after Netflix short-changed him with Luke Cage, but damn, show. I am really tired of the priest-in-forbidden-romance trope. I’d retcon 2-3 kids out of existence (the extras were, I dunno, a demonic hallucination?), take away the romance and the drugs, let Kristen be in a solid marriage, and focus on the main prophecy/her mother’s corruption. But the corruption story would have to be resolved quickly because at this point I just want Grandma to be drop-kicked off the nearest skyscraper.

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On 11/23/2019 at 4:53 PM, HazelEyes4325 said:

I don't know if this was intentional in the show or, as my husband claims, bad editing.  In the scene right before Ben and the girlfriend (forgot her name, also keep thinking she's Idina Menzel...) and Ben is trying to justify the weirdness.  In one shot, the woman is sort of reclining on her left side, Ben seems to notice her necklace (there is a close up on the necklace) and then the camera  goes back to a bumbling Ben for a moment.  When it returns to the woman, she is sitting up in the bed, to the right of where she was in the previous shot.  Then, the camera goes back to Ben and, when it returns to the woman, she's back reclining on her left side.  I made the hubs rewind this about three times trying to figure it out.  He insists it was just a bad editing job, but it seems too deliberate to me.  Is the woman switching between the two sisters?

Just catching up with this show on Netflix, and this scene really bothered me also. I think/hope it was intentional, to suggest that the "attached to the arm" sister was real and affecting Vanessa's behavior.

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On 12/20/2019 at 9:15 AM, Catfi9ht said:

I thought I was going to hate Kristen's husband because of how the characters previously talked about him being selfish, etc. As soon as he started ripping on Kristen's mom, he instantly won me over. There are not enough adjectives in the English language for me to accurately describe the hate I have for Kristen's mom.

Same here. 

On 11/25/2019 at 2:00 PM, aquarian1 said:

In the real world, this happens quite frequently.  Friends and family like to surprise each other with early returns like this.  (Heck, the news and media like to even film surprised reactions of military personnel returning early to surprise their families.)   There really is nothing weird about this at all.   I don't even think the show portrayed as a suspicious thing. They've been talking about him all along, how the kids miss him, how he's coming home soon.  I do agree, that while I see him as a force for good, it really is too early to tell, especially on this show.  I do think he'll play into the story more (or at least I hope he will). 

Agree with this, too. Maybe it's because of the character played by the actor on the Australian series Glitch, but I am giving him the benefit of the doubt. Like Ben, he comes across as no-nonsense and not susceptible to fear about creepy things. I hope those qualities enable him to protect his daughters and not be corrupted by Leland or other demons that are already in the house. 

 

On 11/26/2019 at 11:40 AM, HazelEyes4325 said:
On 11/26/2019 at 4:37 AM, ketose said:

Kristen's 911 call probably showed "no service" because that's what she saw when she was tripping balls over that demon baby.

Yeah, I don't think we can take anything in the demon baby scene seriously.  

I'm sure Kristen was hallucinating the demon baby scene. I was mostly laughing through it and after seeing what the baby looked like, thought it was going to be named George (the same demon haunting Kristen's nightmares).

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