MV007

And Liz is a front-runner at this point. Ladies and Gentlemen BB17.

I think a strong argument can be made that Shelli is a single player with no strong allies especially should Vanessa leave. Whereas, if Vanessa stays she has three to four strong allies in the Austwins and Steve. The problem with keeping Vanessa isn't so much about the decision in a vacuum of who to keep between these two. It's the fact that it it will tell us that ADC still don't completely understand that Vanessa is in an alliance with Austwins.

I think choosing to evict shelli over vanessa is a bad decision for reasons that ADC are clearly unaware of. Vanessa is the glue that holds her side together. Despite Austin's recent misgivings, I think he would always go with Vanessa if he has a choice. Vanessa also has strong ties to the twins. It's unclear at this point what her relationship with Steve will be going forward but I believe that if she wanted she could get him in her back pocket again. Without Vanessa, Steve has nobody aside from the useless Johnny Mac. Austin and the twins are less powerful without Vanessa. I also think Shelli would distance herself from Austin and the twins if Vanessa left. She actually was friends with ADC and I think that relationship had more of a chance of being salvageable then James and company believed.

He's acting like he's going to stay though because everyone told him he's going to stay. I find Clay incredibly boring and I hate this showmance but I feel like he's gone above and beyond what he should have. It will get interesting if he ever gets wind of either Shelli's campaign or that the vote is actually in question. The only thing that can save this showmance for me is for it to blow up in an epic fight before one is evicted.

I'd argue that it was a great season too just based on how memorable it was. Whether you hate the Donatos or not, the season cannot be forgotten. But back to this season, I just read that Shelli is suspicious that Clay is trying to stay because he asked her to contact his family. This woman is throwing her showmance under the bus and then tries to claim its the other way around. Say what you will about Clay but he's practically begging people to evict him and they are all telling him they won't. But for some reason Shelli thinks he shouldn't believe that he's staying?

I agree that 6S is falling apart. I guess for me, when I think of an alliance I think of a group of people collectively sharing information and strategizing together. This happened for 6S. For the most part they all knew what the plan was at all times. It was an alliance of convenience and at the first hint of dissension it dissolved but they did make plans together. On the other hand Freaks and Geeks had members who were simply not apart of any decision making process. Essentially F&G were an alliance in name only. They never collectively did anything.

I wouldn't consider Freaks and Geeks to be a real alliance. They are a group of people with a name who share information but ultimately Steve has not been a party to any decision making. He tells Vanessa things and Vanessa in turn tells him how to vote so he doesn't look like an idiot. But at no point was Steve ever involved in the decision making process to evict Dayvonne, Jason or Jeff. His opinion holds no weight with anyone when it comes to nominations. I think 6th sense has been the only real group that had a true alliance and as we can see that was somewhat tenuous. Regardless, they consulted with each other and made plans together with them all knowing all of the information. In the "Freaks and Geeks" "alliance" Steve only knows what they tell him and thats not all that much. With that said, Steve can now fill a void as people get eliminated and the alliance could truly form.

I want Shelli to leave because that will cause more chaos. If Shelli stays then I think her and Vanessa keep 6th sense alive and retain Becky/Jmac/Steve. That means this is just a one week reprieve for ADC and I'd rather see the game turn on its head. Maybe that doesn't happen either way but I think its much more likely with Clay around the Shelli.

I don't really see this here. Does Meg like Clay? Sure, I'm not convinced its anything more then a friendship but yea she likes him. Becky is just an idiot and the others haven't shown much of an interest. I think they all see Clay as someone that is much more malleable to their wishes then Shelli and thats why they want to keep him.

They sat in a room together and Vanessa created an alliance. They even named it Dark Moon. Was it naive of Jackie to believe this alliance meant anything? Sure, but an alliance was created and Vanessa/Clay/Shelli did break said alliance.

I thought she had a little more intelligence behind her thought. Meg was making the point that at least one of them will stay so why piss that person off even more

Jason is currently asleep at 1:30 in the afternoon the day of his eviction. And he wonders why he's going home.

I have a different opinion on Becky. I think she may be someone who is a bit meaner and shallow than she lets on. Some of her comments about Johnny Mac are a little weird to me. When he's not around she says she would never go for a guy like that. And thats fine, but it's just the way she says it. It's insulting. She talks about how good looking all of her dates are. She even had a conversation with Jason where Jason talked about he didn't need the person he was with to have a good body. Her immediate response was to say she needed the whole package. And I think she's been able to hide this catty/shallow part of herself because of where she is in the game and the fact that nobody talks to her.

When I did a quick search, I found that Vanessa had some really good years about 5 or 6 years ago or so. But really hasn't done much of anything lately. In fact, I found that she was no longer sponsored and her yearly earnings were pretty insubstantial.

I think the idea here is that Audrey has exhibited really odd behavior and also takes drugs. She has issues. Whether someone wants to judge her negatively for that is something else but I think it's a fair observation to say that what we have seen on screen is pretty weird.

I don't think getting rid of Audrey is bad for anyone's game. She's a grenade and could go off at any time and destroy everyone around her. She's completely unreliable. You can't work with someone like that. The only reason I'd keep her is if I were a massive target.

Sorry, I didn't mean them individually. I was wondering if their showmance had a fanbase.

Do clay and shelli have fans? I feel like the general audience loved jeff and jordan. And Brendan and Rachel were very polarizing. I feel like clay and shelli have been "meh" in terms of their showmance.

I think the issue is that nobody is talking about targeting them at this point. I think most would agree that Johnny Mac hasn't had much of a choice at this point but to play along. But he hasn't exactly said he'd seek revenge. By most accounts he seems willing to accept this role and keep working with them. He has not completely come to the conclusion that he's low man on the totem pole yet.

But how dense could you be that after having been nominated 4 times, including twice directly by Shelli, not pulled off the block with the POV this week and not understand that you are expendable to these people?

Peach, I just wanted to say that your self-loathing is endlessly entertaining and you are not alone in that feeling.

I agree with that. But I think that is unfair. Didn't it take a long time for Jen to get a penalty vote when she was skirting the rules? I can't quite remember. And without trying to be sexist or offensive, but knowing it could be perceived that way, Julia is much more entertaining in that silent gif then any other time I've seen her in the house.

I agree that fairness has never been a consideration for this show or others like it. I do think there is a difference though in twists that favor certain house guests and constructing rules that one house guest is allowed to not follow. If they want to announce a twist where Audrey can do whatever she wants then that would be fine. But that has not happened. The show has detailed, written rules which all of the house guests have access to and Audrey is not following them.

My only thinking would be that if this is a rouse, Production does have a motive to play along. She brings the drama and I'm sure TPTB want her to remain in the house, maybe especially, if this is all a rouse. All I'm saying is that if this were a rouse, I wouldn't put it past production to play along.

I never know whether to give any of these house guests credit for their machinations. Is Audrey playing some game here? Or is she just an immature brat? I don't know and I don't think her DR sessions will ever completely tell the story.