bearcatfan

The mods did have to come into this thread though, although no one used that particular word. I'm not going to get into the details but it was a little brutal in here. Isn't there a thread in these forums where you can ask questions of the book readers? I would suggest that anyone who is on the fence about coming back for a second season because of a particular fear, ask a book reader. That way you can maybe have you concerns alleviated without being completely spoiled.

Since I have book 1 ready to go on vacation with me, I'll likely be in the book thread. I also was spoiled, mainly from the promotion they did before the 2nd half of the season started. That's what got me to watch and I remember all of them saying that the end of the season was "dark." It wasn't until the Lollybroch episode when Jamie talked about BJR's proposition that I had an idea of what was going to happen. Then I saw all of the warnings in the media prior to the Wentworth episode so that confirmed it.

The author has stated that she said that because (I'm paraphrasing here) that it was the scenes would be the most intense and demanding scenes for an actor to do as well as being the incident that changes Jamie for the rest of the series and she wanted to see how he would perform, knowing that he could do it. It should also be pointed out that Sam responded by saying that he looked forward to it himself. Obviously he didn't want to be actually tortured and raped but looked forward to the challenge those scenes would present.

She says "as Jamie calls it, love-making." That's completely different than her referring to it as love-making.

So because he moaned and felt pleasure, that means it wasn't rape? Of course he felt pleasure, an orgasm is pleasurable. The build up is pleasurable. That doesn't mean that it wasn't rape. He felt shame because of it. Suggesting that because he felt pleasure means that it was meant to be some sort of slash porn fic is an insult to all those rape survivors who had similar experiences in feeling pleasure during the rape because an orgasm is a physical response.

I disagree about that synopsis. It appears that Matt doesn't understand a few things. First, just because Jamie had an orgasm does not mean he enjoyed it. It actually not that uncommon for people to orgasm during rape and it leaves them confused, ashamed and guilty. Second, It is possible for people to be happy about something but still be dealing with a trauma. Just because he's happy about the baby (still thought his reaction was muted) does not mean he's generally happy. I must have a different definition of gratuitous than some. To me, gratuitous would be showing the rape of a minor character which we can then forget about. Why would you show the rape of a minor character unless you wanted to show the rape and not have to deal with the aftermath? That was not the case here. It happened to a major character and the show dealt with the aftermath. Jamie decided to live, mostly because Claire said she would die if he did, but that doesn't mean all is well. Even on the boat talking to Claire you could see in his face that he wasn't over it. It's interesting, all the articles I saw comparing GoT to OL and how they handled rape in the past 2 weeks praised OL, and these people mostly saw both episodes, including this one. Most said SH deserved an Emmy nomination, if not the award outright. I also watch The Walking Dead. It's not always fun to watch, but it makes me think and feel. Sometimes those feelings are good, sometimes they aren't. I find the concept of how people react in intense situations fascinating. In OL, I like the relationships. This episode was not easy to watch. I felt squeamish throughout many of the scenes. I did find them to be incredibly well acted and I felt that the depth of love between Jamie and Claire to be apparent. Jamie took the abuse to save Claire. Then, once Claire says she would die if he did, well, he decides that he's not going to let Claire die and if that means he has to try to live, he will. Claire risked her own well being to save Jamie. Obviously I'm in the minority here. I'll be back to see how Jamie heals, what the 2 of them do to try to stop Culloden and how will that effect them when they aren't successful.

Just because Jamie no longer wants to die does not mean he's over it or healed. He just no longer wants to die. As the reason he wanted to die was not the rape itself, but the fact that Jack tried to poison Jamie's memories of Claire, using his love for her to get Jamie to react how he wanted, she is the only one who could fix that part. That's what finally broke Jamie, not the rape. He had to know from Claire that she forgave him for responding, even though there was nothing to forgive. His face still looked haunted to me while he was sitting in that boat. His reaction to the news of Claire's pregnancy also appeared muted. I don't think he's fine. He clearly has the physical effects based on the way he was moving. Truthfully, most shows gloss over the after effects of rape. Outlander didn't.

My vaccination scar is also on my upper arm. The left one. I'm not sure when they stopped giving the vaccine but we looked for the scar on my daughter's arm because I was sure she had it, but she doesn't have one. She's 29. Small pox has been eradicated globally so the vaccination is no longer necessary. Unfortunately due to the anti-vaccination movement I doubt we will get to the point soon where we can eliminate any other diseases. I thought the theory was that Claire had heard the phrase during WWII while caring for American soldiers. I imagine that in combat they send the wounded to whatever medical facility was closest. That doesn't explain why Geillis would recognize the phrase, but maybe why Claire would.

I believe BJR is obsessed with Jamie because he was unable to break him when he was whipped, twice. He focused on that when relaying the story to Claire, how Jamie didn't make a sound during the whipping. That seemed to infuriate him, which is why he wasn't pacing himself any longer. It just so happens that the attempted rape of Jenny occurred at Jamie's first whipping. He hasn't seemed to focus on her since that time. At first, his interest in Claire was because he was trying to get dirt on Dougal and the gang raising funds for the Jacobite army. If she had ratted them out, it's likely that he wouldn't have tried anything further with her. Then when BJR found out her husband was Jamie, well, that changed matters. I'm not saying there isn't an element of sexual obsession there, but I think the bigger part is wanting to break this man who wouldn't be broken.

Maybe upset and disgust were too strong, however, if you didn't care to see it, then it bothered you. I find it sad that people are bothered by a breast shown expressing milk. This is why women are still asked to breastfeed their child in a toilet stall.

People are really upset about the breast milk scene? I for one would have wondered what she was doing about her engorged breasts if it wasn't shown! I can't believe in this day and age people are still disgusted about breasts being used for their actual purpose. The Canadian audience is in a tizzy because that scene was edited out. I found it incredibly realistic (even if the milk stream wasn't) and was happy that it happened. We've actually seen people peeing as well. Black Jack fondling his penis in order to rape a character is fine, skin peeling off during a whipping scene is fine but a new mother relieving breast engorgement is a problem? Would it have been a problem if she was shown breastfeeding her baby? Do you get upset seeing mothers nurse their children in public? Breastfeeding is a fact of life and I'm saddened that there are still women who finds this disturbing.

I'm pretty sure Claire has no intention of marrying Dougal. I think she only said that to get Dougal to stop trying to persuade her and get to the rescuing. She knows Jamie would tell her to go back to Craig Na Dun.

This is why I don't buy that they was nothing that occurred during Charlie's rehearsals that would have made entertaining packages. I've heard that Charlie is always like this, maybe not to the extreme that he was today, but usually teasing and joking. There's a reason that Meryl is pretty quick with the comebacks; she's had plenty of practice at it over the years!

Meryl and Charlie said that was one of the main reasons for doing the show, raising the profile of figure skating in general and ice dancing on particular. I'm glad that it's seemed to work, at least in the short term. Maybe a few of those will become real fans of skating.

Yes, Meryl and Charlie did it right. How many country/western themed ODs were there that year? Most teams decided to put on cowboy hats and skate to country music. The Aboriginal still makes me retch. How they didn't realize it was offensive is unexplainable. The Bollywood was the highlight and is my all time favorite OD.

I imagine the reason she doesn't wear shoes while dancing is because most of prosthetics she's using are not meant to have shoes. The swimming ones for example.

Most people who wear prosthetic legs do wear shoes. My ex had to bring in the shoes he was going to wear and they formed the foot with the shoe in mind. That was 30 years ago but I imagine the process hasn't changed too much.

Poor Meryl, she went from "are you and Charlie dating?" to "are you and Maks dating?!"

Ariana Grande is on a show on Nickelodeon with the actress who played Sam on iCarly (if you know your Nick shows). She sang at the VMAs last year and brought the house down with her ballad. The media concentrated on the Miley fiasco but Ariana was fantastic. I didn't watch the show but saw her song on Yahoo. I think she's one thing they've gotten right tonight. The local Top 40 station plays that song constantly.

A prop malfunction!

Maybe I'm not reading enough into what Maks said but it sounded to me how he was saying she was resilient and he liked she was in the finals. I'm sure some more cynical people may say that's because she's easy to beat but I think that was opposite of what he was saying. She's been underestimated and is still here.

In an interview I read today with Conrad Green, he had this to say about the casting of Meryl and Charlie: Were you quite intent on casting Meryl and Charlie as a packaged deal? We wanted to try and get both because we thought it would be an interesting dynamic to have two people who've been together suddenly separated in that way, and to see how that played out. But you can only go for a story if there's some element of truth to it, and with Charlie and Meryl's relationship, it just wasn't there, that sense of competition. They're both rooting for each other. He also claims that there wasn't stuff that was left out for Charlie, or at least stuff that they could show without revealing too much. I don't know how much of that I believe. Here's the link to the entire article: http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/dancing-stars-showrunner-conrad-green-705569

I don't know if Meryl was underscored as much as Nene and others were over scored. Actually, Candace was underscored for a long time, and once Nene left, they started over scoring her.

My oldest daughter actually did and she thought the boy band wars were ridiculous. She went to a BB concert wearing a N*SYNC t-shirt, or it might have been the N*SYNC concert wearing a BB t-shirt. Either way, she thought the response was hilarious. I'm sure the guys weren't at war. I forgot about Menudo but then, I wasn't a fan. I didn't realize Ricky Martin was a member until I googled them!

There were no boy bands when I was of an appropriate age unless you count Duran Duran.