GoldenHera

Whew, this show. I am a fan of grim-dark series so the melancholy and abject horribleness of some of these characters does not put me off. Rue is a fascinating character and I am interested in watching her spiraling addiction. Nate is fucking terrifying. Jules seems very lovely, very vulnerable, and bound to be seriously hurt. One thing that sticks out to me in this show is the absence of parents. I realize we are focused on the teens but even when we catch glimpses of the parents (like Cassie's mom and Nate's dad) the actual parenting shown is subpar. This, more than anything, rings the most true to life for me. I know The Media likes to describe this generation as being the product of 'helicopter parents,' but I have seen so much more hands-off, bordering on negligent, raised by YouTube parenting. Not to say that this is everyone, but along the two extremes, I see more of the later than the former. Rue and Jules' parents are probably the best and they are clearly out of their depth. I think this is ascribing a lot of forethought to the actions of an insecure teenager. This is only the second episode, but we have not seen these kids thinking critically about their future. They seem very id-driven. And honestly, that may be a reflection of growing up during the Great Recession and with a Climate Apocalypse approaching.

Rick and Michonne's relationship is definitely not Hollywood. How many black women are paired with the white lead in TV and movies? Not many, and especially not darker skinned black women. I'd also say Tara and Denise aren't the "hot lesbian couple" that may be considered Hollywood either. From a character perspective, I could understand why Carol hasn't sought out romance. Considering the emotional distress she's been in (dealing with an abusive husband, losing an abusive husband, losing her daughter, murdering her surrogate daughter), I could see her not being interested in making herself vulnerable to another intense emotional relationship.

This show is interesting in that virtually all the main characters are selfish, immature people. It's hard to watch, yet I'm still compelled by the characters. Raquel--who I thought would be a more virtuous character--has fallen into the selfishness of the Pferffermans. Her relationship with Josh is doomed to fail, even if they last for years and years. Eventually Josh will blame her for preventing him from having a closer relationship with his son. I can't blame her for wanting to have a more conventional/traditional family life, but she never wanted Josh to have a parental relationship with his son and that is wrong. Josh would have been a terrible parent to Colton--and honestly I'm glad he went back to his family--but I doubt he'll be a better parent to his and Raquel's child.

Not to belabor a point but, that's not the Rick Grimes TWD audience has been shown the last six seasons. The scene could have been a lot more organic if, say, Rick decided everyone should stay in a central location until they figured out a strategy to thin the herd. They would have all been under one roof, and Rick and Jessie could have had their moment while both were on the lookout. With walkers at the door and a strange group of murderous nomads lurking, the actions we saw Rick take make no sense to the character we have been shown. I agree and disagree with the lack of relationships on the show. On the one hand, yes it's the end of the world, why wouldn't more people just say 'to hell with it all,' and screw any and every willing partner. On the other, I know when I'm stressed, sex is the last thing on my mind. After getting through the tough shit, absolutely! But CDB are in a feedback loop of stress, threats to life and limb and starvation. I'm not surprised at all with the lack of ~sexitimes~ Oh Maggie, I know eventually humanity needs to procreate but now? She said before that she wasn't scared to have a baby. I wonder if that has changed now that she is actually with child.

He was very possessive of Enid and has a hankering for violence. I guess he is his father's son. Also, the kid who plays Ron is such a bad actor. All of those hand gestures...

Regarding their respective children, it is bad behavior on both parts. However, considering the threat at the gates, it's off and this is completely out of character for Rick. You're telling me that Rick Grimes, the man that bit the neck out of a dude threatening to assault Carl, the man that could barely sleep without patrolling when he first entered Alexandria, is going to be off macking when there are hundreds of walkers threatening to bang down the gates and devour everyone inside. The Rick we saw two weeks ago in the RV was PANICKED, the Rick running for his life at the beginning of the episode was PANICKED. Now he is chilled enough for make out time? I just have a hard time believing he wouldn't be pacing in front of Carl and Judith with his gun out for most of the night. I can't imagine him leaving their side for one second at a time like this. I so agree TexasChic, when Maggie was just flailing I was confused. I know she couldn't grip one of its arms but she had been in stickier situations without the level of panic she expressed. Was that supposed to be a side effect of her pregnancy?

Oy. Rick and Jessie together is odd given the circumstances. He killed her husband days ago and her sons are clearly traumatized by the event. The pacing on this one seems a bit odd. Actually, the pacing on the whole episode seemed odd. No Carol, no Michonne, no Carl/Rick interaction. Way too Alexandrian centered, none of them are very interesting. I am not here for Deanna's nonsense. Someone put her out of her misery already. Uh, just an idea, can't they use that sewer exit to go out and thin the walker herd. Alternatively, it would be a lovely way for some Wolves to sneak in.

While I am skeptical that Pete is 100% the abuser given the evidence, I never considered that both parents are shady. It's entirely possible...I'd also like to throw older brother Ron into the mix. In the scene in which Carl is introduced to the teenage gang, some on the board mentioned Ron's possessive hand on Enid. Maybe he pushed Sam around a bit. I'm reaching but, I just want this to be more than the pedestrian story line it appears. Good point lulee. I think we can't take anything said on TTD by Hardwicke as law. I was given the impression that he is not privy to extensive spoilers of the show. He's just speculating like the rest of us.

Ghoulina, I think Carol actually said this when Pete was closing the door. I agree TigerLynx, she told Rick that they needed his group. I just don't think she realized how much they did. We don't know how long its been since Deanna had been outside those walls. It's possible the only intel of how the world looks right now is from Aaron and her dearly departed coward Aidan. That's a very limited scope so I can see how she would believe ASZ needs a boost not a complete overhaul. Rick's group is single-handedly showing that ASZ is extremely lucky and completely ill equipped to survive the ZA. That's going to be incredibly scary for her and the rest of the community.

Black men and blonde females are not the same and have not been treated the same on this show. As for 'not seeing color,' I just...I won't comment on that line of thought. I think Deanna expressing resistance to putting another CDB member in power is justified. They are the new war hardened people in town, yes, but not everyone in ASZ is Tobin. I'm sure there will be some people stepping forward to question why all these new people are suddenly running the town. Deanna mentioned they haven't taken in new people recently with the last being Enid 8-9 months ago (I could be wrong on that.) Considering Enid isn't old enough to be in charge of anything, that is a huge chunk of time in which familiar ASZers have been in charge. The sudden switch could certainly jar people, especially considering Sasha's (justified) outburst at the party and now Aidan's death. FPP's words notwithstanding, the group does seem like they have brought death and destruction to ASZ.

I'll play devil's advocate here. Pete has clearly been shown as two things 1. a lover of booze and 2. socially awkward. Acting squirrelly is not evidence that Pete is beating his wife and child. It is evidence, along with Sam asking for a gun, that something bad is happening in the Anderson household. Had Carol gone to Rick and said, 'Look something is up with that family, we need to investigate,' I would be 1000% Team Carol. But she didn't. She made a huge (and possibly dangerous) assumption based on her own experience. I don't fault her for it, after all she went through, the ghost of Ed will haunt her forever. But being the judge, jury and executioner of a man she's known for one week with flimsy circumstantial evidence, that's wrong. Re: The Owl Sculpture: Harbinger of Society's Demise, I think we were all robbed of CDB's reaction when Rick explains that he spent the day interrogating ASZers looking for the culprit of a metal sculpture smashing. Could you imagine Sasha's face? Comedy gold. TWD's issue was that there seemed to be a black man quota. One black man would die and then another would be introduced, making it seem as though only one black man could be allowed on the series for an extended amount of time. It has never been an issue of how many different races are killed per episode. It's fine if you don't care, but some of us like to think critically about media.

It's interesting that you see him as legitimately giving ASZ a chance. To me it seems as though he is waiting for the other shoe to drop. He, Carol and Daryl don't seem to trust the place, that's why they had their club meeting outside the walls about stealing guns. I thought it was especially telling when Rick said, 'the others want to try,' as if the three amigos aren't ready to try just yet. I get it, they haven't been safe since the start of the ZA, and their paranoia has served them well since. But, if this place is legit, that paranoia might get them booted.

I would be with you if Rick and Jessie's first scene wasn't a meet cute. The set up for romance is there. I just hope Rick doesn't destroy CDB's chance at happiness in ASZ by creating problems with Pete. As I said upthread, I'll take the town doctor over the new guy in town any day.

This was quite the episode. It's great to see all the various interpretations of the Rick/Jessie/Pete dynamic. I think it's interesting that many people have noted that Pete may be abusive. I'm wondering if that is because, taken at face value, his relationship with Jessie doesn't seem too tumultuous. I'll have to rewatch for the signs that she flinched/pulled away from him. It seems we all agree on one thing though, Rick is loosing his damn mind. We may be seeing potential signs of discord in the Jessie/Pete relationship, but can they be trusted. They are being shown through an unstable person's viewpoint. What if Pete is a stand up guy who's marriage is just a bit rocky and Rick incorrectly reads him as dangerous because he has forgotten that not everyone is a threat. The end scene of Rick reaching for his gun when seeing Pete reminded me of Shane watching Rick through the rifle. Personally, I do not want to see Jessie and Rick get together simply because it will be disastrous for CDB. Pete is the only doctor in an idyllic community in the Zombie Apocalypse. If some new dude rolls into town looking to threaten him, new dude and his crew would have to kick rocks.

I don't think there are any architects or professors of architecture in this forum and yet multiple people have pointed out the issues with having support beams outside the walls. The most likely reason is that Deanna's husband didn't consider protecting the community from a guerrilla style attack by the living. I'm not sure how long after they landed in the development that construction on the walls began, but remember, the belief was that the Army was coming back. Maybe they thought the walls were temporary until the government regained control. They are also in a pretty secluded area, down a back road that, depending on how new the development is, might not be listed on any maps. Also, it's clear that Deanna and Aaron/Eric are now thinking about the threat of the living. Aaron and Eric don't tell people where the development is and drive newcomers to their home (most likely in the RV and I would bet they'd try to keep most new recruits occupied with eating/bathing/resting in order to not see the direct route to ASZ). Since Abraham is on construction, there are clearly some additions being made. I'd assume they are related to protective infrastructure and not simply making additions to the McMansions. We also have only spent one episode with the community. We don't know how many people are available for this type of manual labor. Having watched this show since its premiere and being a connoisseur of zombie flicks (as is most of the forum, I'd assume) we know what should be done. But the people of ASZ are a)unfamiliar with zombies (even pretend ones) and b) not particularly knowledgeable about the devolution that has occurred outside their walls. I'd give them a slight break until we see more.