kieyra

Quoting myself because I've been rewatching season 1/2 (with mild prejudice) and Lip is doing everything from building remote credit card scanners to fixing up the weedmobile ice cream truck (because "he can fix anything") to being wooed by the college professor* to work on DoD contracts/defense projects. *That said, that college professor calls it early on: he tells Lip he's going to knock up some girl and spend the rest of his life a bitter shell due to not living up to his potential. Or words to that effect. Of course, when first watching the show I thought that meant I was supposed to root for Lip to eventually overcome the odds--not that it was supposed to be a thumbnail sketch of his entire arc.

Is Frank actually dead? (Can't bring myself to watch anymore.)

She later uses the house as collateral in a business loan for something or other, maybe it's that?

Yes to all of this. (I have a bunch of stuff I need to do today, but your post confirmed a lot of what I feel like the show didn't quite show us enough of, and it makes me want to sit around and work on fic instead.) On that note, does anyone know if we ever catch what 'dead cancer friend's' name actually was? (If not, maybe that's a little more evidence that they under-wrote Marcus a bit. Heck, I also think they under-wrote Joe, for that matter, given that he's obviously a tertiary love interest. Either they KNOW they're getting more seasons, or they wanted to make sure all the girls and women got a lot of screentime for a change. (Or both.) Can't argue too much there. Except Max. Max can get a little less screentime next season. JMO.)

I don't even know how I managed to stumble on it on Hulu--unfortunately I bet a lot of US viewers don't know it exists unless they're already Nicola Walker fans. Seems like it might have been a better fit for Netflix. I'm a little more than halfway through season 2, but got distracted by other things/shows. I think something about Christie turning into such a predictable kind of antagonist lost me a bit. I will end up watching the rest, though, especially since a third season is coming. To say nothing of Last Tango in Halifax, where she's literally a sheep farmer. 🙂

I forgot all about that. I also miss Svetlana and wish they hadn't made her go full villain.

Oof. I had never heard of this Hanks. But he has the kind of smirk you expect to see in an arrest mugshot.

I think it’s more a news “style” guide thing, particularly in print media, but still hanging on in news outlets that try to adhere to the old formats. Surnames are used preferentially once a subject’s full name has been introduced in the story. (I have absolutely no doubt that the searchers were calling for him by his first name.) ... that said, I just went to go see if my suspicions about style guides were correct, but the global news, Ottawa Citizen and CBC written coverage all refer to him as Jude or Jude Layton. I got nothin’.

I think they blackmailed him by having Debbie threaten to report him for sexual abuse. So he let them rent. But then he was going to sell because gentrification. After this it gets muddled, but I also sort of remember Drug Dealer Carl showing up with a duffel bag of money to buy the house. I don't know. The house has been through a lot.

Pet peeve of recent show names: The Map of a Million Big Little Tiny Pretty Perfect Things who are also Liars on Fire Everywhere and possibly In Boxes.

Listening to the audiobook of The Queen's Gambit. Not sure I will make it through this--don't care for the narrator. And while it's interesting to compare and contrast with the show, the breakdown of chess moves is explained in a pretty blow-by-blow fashion, which causes me to drift off. It was handled a bit differently in the show.

I know, right? Even let's set aside the behemoth that is Cyteen--her smaller space-marine type books would be fantastic limited serieses. (Hellburner, Rimrunners are two my favorite stand-alones.) ...but much like Pratchett (imo) someone would need to make sure the characters and casting were handled correctly, not just be like "ooh shiny spaceships and guns first, characterization second". From what I've seen of the thread, the most recent Stand was a real dog.

Thanks, awesome overall response. (And rings true, as both a 90s teen/YA and a former viewer of the OC.) I think your second sentence above may actually be what's triggered part of my obsession with this show and even the desire to write fic for it--I know there's something fundamentally broken about it and part of my brain wants to fix it. Because it could/should be better. Or I could actually do something more useful with my time. But hey, pandemic.

I will drop a link somewhere when I've got some chapters up on AO3. 🙂

Certain shows trigger a rewatch spiral for me. I didn't expect this to be one. But here we are. (I should rewatch S2 of Sex Ed sometime. I was v. distracted by the pandemic at the time.) Since you bring the show up, I'm super interested in your thoughts on the portrayal of 'teen sex issues' on Sex Ed vs G&G. Obviously a huge difference is UK vs Amurica, but I really feel like the messaging on G&G is muddled. (Although IIRC, there was some sketchy stuff w/r/t closeted guy whose name I don't remember and some consent issues in season 2 of Sex Ed.) Er, not that I'm assigning you a task. 🙂

Right there with you. I started out all "I see you, show, I know what you're doing with your Gilmore Girls references and your love triangles and whatever! I refuse to feel anything!" And now I've watched the whole thing three times and am writing fanfic.

The deconstruction/retconning of Lip is the number one reason I finally stopped watching. You can be an addict, self destructive, completely fucked up from your biblically dysfunctional family, but you don’t lose thirty IQ points and advanced mechanical engineering aptitude just because you’re a 25 (?) year old alcoholic.

I too get Hunter and Marcus’s names mixed up a lot. Which is weird because they’re not really similar names. Maybe Marcus just looks more like a Hunter and vice versa. I think he’s attractive when his hair is down. The shave/rooster pony look just pulls all the focus from his nice eyes/smile.

Yes, but for the life of me I can't remember why Georgia insisted she go on it. It's before Georgia catches Marcus coming through the bedroom window, and I think before Ginny admits to any sexual interaction with Hunter. Was it because of the shoplifting thing? (If so ... why?) I feel like it happens pretty early on in the show. Ginny also gets some credit for getting plan B the next day. But yeah, everyone's pretending STIs don't exist I guess. Which brings me to another observation about the show and the kids in particular. There's this weird conflict between 'sex positive, lap dances at parties, omg gonna lose my virginity!!!11' and also: 'ew, gross, masturbation'. (And no condoms in sight.) The show's messaging could be a little better. It doesn't have to be an obvious PSA, but ...

Hunter would be a great and compelling character in another show. His fatal flaw here is that he treats Ginny like a queen even though he has absolutely no idea who she really is (not that she does herself). Fails to pick up on the fact that she’s totally faking it with him. Well, and he tolerates a LOT from his racist/sexist bros. At least he had the self-respect to push back on her during the “oppression Olympics”, and to cut her loose when he realized the truth. Not sure I want to see him in season 2 unless they get him a worthier love interest. 🙂 My mind drifts off every time Paul is onscreen. He’s naptime for me. It is what it is. I like Joe a lot, but I need a little more of him and his interior life. He’s a too-quiet Luke for now. Norah is both the least interesting and most well-adjusted of MANG. So she’s a good balancing influence.

I’ve mentioned this before elsewhere, but I think they will need to retcon Georgia’s serial killer status a bit if they want this show to have legs. Abby spec: I’ve watched the whole series a few times now, and on each viewing I catch something else that makes me think she’s, at minimum, gay or bisexual, and probably in love with Max. She’s also pretty fucked up—heavy drinking, acting out, occasionally violent (slapping Ginny), occasionally attention-seeking in very unhealthy ways, etc. They also write interesting little pieces of very dry humor for her, that is usually lost behind other dialogue. I find her the most interesting member of MANG, but don’t necessarily like her. I’d like to see her character get more focus next season, and maybe work out some of her shit. Actress is fantastic. Ginny: the character of Ginny is not well served on rewatch. She gets more aggravating each time. I’d like that addressed, too—some examination of why she lacks much in the way of moral character. There really isn’t a lot of excuse for the way she treated Hunter, or the way she treats her mother. She’s trapped in two worlds in many ways, I do get that, but there’s a basic “right vs wrong” thing that she lacks. She comes across as self centered and spoiled. Give us more layers, show. Other: I hope we stick with mostly the same cast and NO NEW LOVE interests for Georgia or Ginny, but I would be happy if they jettison Press and Brodie, the two racist/sexist dbags who are seemingly part of Hunter’s group and also look like they’re 30.

Are Georgia and Joe the real endgame? Is Abby secretly in love with Max? Does Ginny need a major attitude adjustment and a box of condoms before she can be allowed to date again? Discuss here.

Third rewatch thoughts: --Ginny and her choices get worse on every viewing. I was it wasn't true, but it is. (Conversely: she also gets slapped two different times in the show, including by her own mother. No one else gets slapped. It's a little weird.) --I forgot that Abby goes full on villain at the end. Girl has some issues. Might type more in Spec thread. --Once you know the full deal with Marcus, he becomes more sympathetic over the show's arc, but still, starting him off as 'pretty dickhead' in the pilot was a bit of a cheat (and the kind of thing I hate about pretty dickheads in my shows). --Thanks to some other posters' observations, I paid a lot more attention to Ellen and Clint's shenanigans. Delightful. Clint must be part of where Max got her sense of humor. --Max: Ok, I concede: she is exhausting. --I still love Georgia (and the actress) but am not convinced she's not a teeny tiny bit of a sociopath. They've got to retcon away from serial killer if they want to keep the show going. JMO. My best guess is someone pitched Gilmore Girls x Shonda Rhimes + more teen storylines, plugged it into a computer, and this is what it spit out ... including the murder plots.

Ok, third rewatch of series, second time actually watching the Ginny/Marcus hookup. What is going on there, with the dry humping? I wouldn’t say I go out of my way to seek out shows with a bunch of sexy time, particularly teen sexy time, but in the last year I’ve seen, for example, Sex Education, Normal People, Euphoria. So the full gamut of porny comical, (sex Ed), hyper realistic with a world-class intimacy coordinator (Normal People), and Seriously Dark Shit (Euphoria). To say nothing of the full range of semi realistic to completely ridiculous adult sex scenes in various shows. But I cannot figure out what I’m supposed to be taking away from this ... fully clothed ...extended grinding ... that they’re doing. Or at least, why it makes up 95% of their “climactic” sex scene. And like, almost zero kissing. Maybe the end of the show was filmed during COVID19? The show in general shies away from getting very explicit, which is fine, but this prolonged lap dance thing is just an odd thing to focus the whole encounter on. Particularly the lingering shots of Ginny’s butt. It’s like, too much and not enough at the same time. Yes, I feel a little weird spending this much time thinking about it. It’s just strange and discordant. As far as it being a retcon or a cheat that Marcus was a virgin the first time, I don’t know, after a couple of rewatches, their first sex scene is obviously pretty awkward for both of them. But on the flip side, there are multiple mentions of him “hooking up” with Padma ... although those mentions happen later in the show. Don’t know. (The lack of protection on both sides does make them both seem pretty dumb, for seemingly educated 21st-century kids.) Oh, and can someone take a crack at explaining to me why Ginny is absolutely not allowed to date her friend’s brother? Why would this destroy Max, exactly?