LilyD

These are all confirmed? Do you have a complete list? Thx!

I’m trying to see how this show could possibly continue without Zach and Tori. Not that they were Oscar-worthy material, but they definitely managed to draw people in. Yep, often for the wrong reasons but hey, negative attention is still attention! Imagine a show with just Matt, Amy and their partners… is there even a story to be told from just that perspective? You’d need the bigger family for interesting interaction and content, but they’ve now all stepped away.

From experience in our own family, I can tell it is not as simple as people think . Yes, Jackson has serious issues with his legs and he will need more, preferably today. However, Jackson is a child and he hasn't reached his full height yet. It means that the effect of such excruciatingly painful and invasive surgeries is often only temporary, or very limited over time because the bones are still growing and the body is changing (Not to mention the time it takes to fully recover.) And that means a second surgery, which is going to be a nightmare to those kids as they know exactly what is coming this time... So yes, I fully understand why Tori dismissed this option at the time. You could wonder however, if more/other things could be done than they're currently doing... If only to limit his discomfort and possibly prevent it from getting worse.

Nope... There are a few people within that family who know next to nothing about respect or dignity for that matter.

Trainingsoutfits yes: It only makes sense to wash those yourself. Not too sure about the uniforms though. Even our local football club has set rules for this: All game uniforms are collected after the match and then washed in one batch. It keeps all the colors from fading, shirts from shrinking (some parents would use boiling water or even bleach to get the shirts cleaned) and we never end up with a kid missing a sock or shirt on game day as we have it all. As for the DCC: There really aren’t that many performances or jobs at all, and they don’t all require the white and blue uniform. Dry cleaning or professional washing should therefore not be an issue. And on the odd occasion it does, I’m sure they could figure a way around that.

Their treatment of the DCC has always been appalling. The Cowboys demanded a fulltime commitment and set a harsh set of rules they had to follow to stay on the team for hardly any pay. Only a few years back, they received a pretty big raise with a decent compensation for over time, but as far as I’m concerned, the pay is still mediocre. With that in mind, it doesn’t come as a surprise that they have to clean their own uniforms. Also, per Kelli’s own words: a DCC gets only one custom made uniform. If it tears, or no longer fits, they have to find a replacement from old uniforms they have in stock… That’s even more ridiculous than having to wash your own uniform!

Actually, that doesn’t surprise me. We’ve often talked about the DCC not really moving forward over the years. The old and worn choreographies for instance, the show group routines and uniforms that haven’t changed over the past 10 years or so, and a rather poor, not very professional website to name a few. You need to evolve if you want to stay on top of the game. I also firmly believe that the last couple of seasons of MTT discouraged professional girls from auditioning. All the drama… it sometimes looked like very cheap reality tv. Not to mention all those professional dancers with a great resume being butchered by Kelli & friends during the audition process….

Wasn’t it Garrison who converted to the LDS church? I seem to remember that one of the boys joined the LDS and that there were several pictures of him in a white shirt for his baptism? I found it rather interesting at the time as both Maddie and Mykelti explored that path years back, but neither were accepted for being part of the (in)famous Brown family…. I don’t know much about LDS other than that they believe that your soul/spirit lives on after death, and how depends on how you lived. The whole “planet-thing” seems a Brown (or maybe an AUB) thing.

I think this places TLC in a very difficult position: It’s either going to be gold with all the extra attention, or it’s going to create an immense backlash. My bet is on the latter. TLC wants drama, people want to see drama but that only goes that far… The Willis family and Duggars were cancelled because of sexual abuse. And now we have a family dealing with suicide and there are indications that the filming and possibly Kody and Robyn’s behaviour* played a part. TLC cannot be associated with that so I’m expecting a rather abrupt cancellation. *whether or not they did play a role in this: they’re guilty by default through their appalling behaviour toward the other kids over the years. The general public is just not going to accept their innocence, even if proven. People want a scape goat. I absolutely despise Kody but feel for him in this respect. He’s lost a son and will have to deal with this on top of it.

And even if you do manage to get away from it: SM posts will never ever truly disappear once it’s been put in the open. It will always come back to haunt you, especially when you’re least expecting it… and then it starts all over again!

I think we’ve seen enough to know that these are “adults” under the influence of a dominant mom. I mean, a 20-year-old that had to be held and comforted to have her ears pierced?? I won’t mention any more examples… Assuming they were not there: Sol seems a very sweet and sensitive boy but shielding him from such situations will potentially do more harm than good. And the same goes for 8-year-old Ari. Garrison was their (half) sibling. Sol is 13… he is not a little child anymore. In my book (and where I’m from)there is literally no excuse for excluding kids that age from memorial services of close relatives. (Unless, of course there is a serious medical or mental issue that has to be taken into consideration)

We have no way of knowing what Garrison was thinking. His dad’s behaviour may have played a big role, but I doubt it was the only reason. He seemed to have indicated that the tv show also took its toll on him, and that too was not just on Kody but on all the adults and TLC who loved the drama that was so easily given to them. And who knows what other troubling thoughts occurred to him and for how long? A suicide is complex and contrary to popular belief, very hard to prevent. Kody is a despicable human being who made some horrible and unforgivable mistakes. Yet, I don’t think it is fair to put the blame (solely)on him, or assume that Janelle feels like that.

Wait... were Robyn's kids absent? Are you serious? For once I'm speechless....

The past five years of SW have been absolutely distasteful: The way Kody treated the others was sickening and the entire world was witnessing a family fighting and falling apart. Such things should not be filmed and broadcast when kids are involved. If anything, I hope TLC will never sink as low with a reality show again as they did here. As a viewer, I hated it and stopped watching it because it was too awful to watch. To the kids, who likely had no say in it at all, it must have been too personal, too painful and traumatic and it was all brought out in the open by their parents, for the entire world to see. I'm not against reality shows, but it is time we set some boundaries, particularly when kids are involved. As for SW, they should have stopped this show years ago. Please do it now, for Garrison and his siblings....

As per suggestion of @General DaysI'm dropping my comments about Garrison's memorial service in this thread. Janelle looks absolutely devastated, it literally made me cry again. I was so glad to see that Hunter sat next to her to comfort her as much as he could despite his own grief. I'm very worried about Gabe, he seems completely locked away in his own world, trying to deal with this loss and trauma... I actually don't want to snark when the family is dealing with such a tremendous loss but I will a little ( I'm very sorry) Tony got me seriously pissed off with keeping his hat on during that ceremony. As a military wife, I'll just say that it is not done in such ceremonies, nor any military ceremony for that matter. It shows of no respect or proper decorum. As for Kody having three people between him and the mother of his child... Let's hope it was Janelle's wish to have her mother and Hunter near to comfort her. But it is so sad that not even the loss of a child can't (temporarily)bring Kody closer to the mother of his child.

True, we didn’t really know him. And like @Orcinus orca pointed out, we only saw the bits the producers wanted us to see and the stories may not be as we think they are. But we did see them all grow up, albeit from a distance. And that bit* was very real. A 10-year-old growing up over the years; the young boy messing about carefree with his siblings back in Lehi, the teen finding his feet in Vegas and the young man trying to build a life of his own in Flagstaff. Of course we all feel affected by his death. How could we not? * not meaning some of the obviously re enacted scenes like holiday gatherings, but the bits in between; their every day life, the casual interactions, the brotherly banters etc.

That’s the thing… we didn’t know him, yet we did… I was thinking about it the other day: We’ve witnessed his life as of the age of 10 (I think?) and watched him grow from a young boy to a handsome, caring and amazing young man. And because of that, we all feel we got to know them all a little on a “personal” level.

Sadly, it happens a lot and it's often the father who moves on with an entire new family or his step children. My father completely ignored my graduation but sat front and center at my step brother's...But I agree it is very hard to understand how Kody could do just that, like you said. You go on because you have to. Your life has come to a complete stop but the world around you hasn't. They'll drag you along with commitments, expectations etc. It can be a pain, but also comforting as it temporarily distracts you from pain. I'm wondering about the future of the show too. For the Brown kids, I hope this is it; and that they certainly won't use Garrison's death for the show, how could they? But these are the Brown parents; they* have shown us again and again how low they can go to keep the show running.... * particularly Kody and Robyn of course

She must have had a job of some sorts when she was on her own in that rental far, far away in the first few episodes?? How else would she be paying for the rent and food? Kody must have been absolutely fine with having her around fulltime doing nothing. He also approved of Meri quitting jobs for no reason and working only part time when the family could use every dollar they could find. I have wondered about that a lot, why didn't he ask them both to work more? Was it because he either ignored any financial hardship and let the wives deal with that? Or, when Robyn arrived, was he counting on TLC bringing in the big bucks and felt no need to pressure into working?

Kody Meri and Janelle all worked pre- Sister Wives. Meri had lots of different jobs and said she would regularly quit jobs to simply join Kody whenever he went on business trips (Janelle was never invited) She worked part time for a trophy engraving business when Sister Wives aired and was then asked to resign. The MLMs were never addressed in the show. Don't know when they first started with that. I suppose TLC didn't want them to use the show for cheap and easy marketing, which makes sense. Janelle worked fulltime in sales when SW aired. I don't think she quit until they left Lehi, but am not sure about this. Both she and Christine then got their real estate license but I don't think Janelle did more than attempting to sell the Vegas homes. As far as I remember, Christine didn't do anything at all with it. As for Christine: This is confusing. They always said she cared for all of the kids on a full time basis while the others were out working. But there's also the story of her working at night where Aspyn had to look after the others. (I believe that was connected to something about Kody who never really seemed to care much for his kids with Christine. Not even when they apparently were home alone.

TLC apparently doesn't want them to discuss their other ventures on the show because of the sensitivity and controversy that surrounds MLMs and Kody's gun business. (Or turn the show in one long commercial for Liv or Plexus) That may explain the shady and sketchy conversations about it. And I do understand the family's attitude and unwillingness to help Meri out. She wanted a bunch of cash but really didn't have a decent business plan in place. She couldn't even answer a simple question like how she'd run an inn hundreds of miles away while living in Vegas. And then there was the matter of Meri wanting the family cash for the inn while denying the family any involvement or insight into her business. I can see how that rubbed them the wrong way. It was family money she'd be using after all.

Re. the AirBnB: Am I the only one who had to frown a little and think about Meri when reading about Christine's new business venture? Sure it's a free country and Christine doesn't owe anything to Meri. She can do whatever she wants but Meri was the one who started an inn/airbnb and used the show as a means to lure people in. I'm not pro-Meri, she could take a leaf or two out of Christine's book when it comes to the interiors of the rooms (the rooms in Lizzie's look terrible!) but if someone who used to be close to me so blindly copied my business model and started a similar venture not that far away from me (it's only about 270 miles, yes I looked it up!) I'd definitely be mad to say the least!

I think we all agree that there is something seriously wrong with this guy. The things you mention could indicate ADHD, especially when you take his restless (almost frantic) behaviour into consideration. Just check a random episode from the Utah or Vegas era and you'll see. Having said that, I also think that being an autocratic polygamist head of a large family partly made him the way you described. Whatever he cooked up, was executed by the wives. Whatever he decided, happened. Whether it was marrying Robyn or moving house a 100 times. So he could easily abandon a plan and come up with something else. He didn't have to pay attention or finish anything he started, it was done for him. This type of behaviour also gave him a huge sense of power. I'm sure it fed his already inflated personality and made him the despicable narcissist we see on tv.

It has been discussed a few times over the years on this forum. And from what I can see, the only thing that has changed (and only fairly recently) is a reluctant acceptance of African American DCCs sporting their natural hair (but I have a gut feeling that wigs are still encouraged behind the scenes...) Honestly, I cannot see other things change in the immediate future and definitely not with Kelli and Judy in charge. Those two are firmly stuck in the past, whether it's the never changing DCC uniform (apart from the shorter shorts), their stereotypical DCC type or the over-used Thunderstruck Routine.

Talking about an increased body weight and discussions about a perfect body in general has become a bit of a mine field over the past few years. There is an increased awareness of the damages it does to people. It wouldn't surprise me if this is the main reason for deleting Victoria's scenes? Which leaves me wondering about other past episodes....There are loads of examples of Kelli being rude and often unfair toward girls. Will all those episodes be edited? What will this mean for(possible) future episodes of MTT? Weight, stocky builds, think thighs were all easy excuses for Kelli to rid of unwanted TCC's. Many of these girls were grossly mistreated over weight or "body issues" for the sake of drama television. Hopefully, a new series will be a big improvement regarding this and focus more on other, more interesting aspects of the journey toward becoming a DCC.