psychoticstate
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Maybe an UO but this was my least favorite episode out of the series.
With Malcolm basically out of the action for the second half, his absence was truly felt. I think Max Irons did a stunning job throughout. When he had Christopher up against the wall and was saying he was going to kill him "as I did your father" (also his own father), I felt insanely anxious, even though I knew that Christopher would survive and he and Corrine would run off together. Very clever of Christopher to play along with Malcolm, take the money and say he was leaving so that he and Corrine would have money.
Why did the writers make Christopher a doctor? He was not. He wasn't able to use his education because he got it as Christopher Foxworth. In the book, I thought he sold insurance but he was actually in PR. Not sure why the writers felt they had to make him a doctor since it had zip to do with what transpired.
Paul Wesley did a great job as the creepy John Amos. He obviously had a case of the feels for Olivia but I didn't see his demise coming. In the book, he lusted after Corrine but they couldn't very well do that since JA didn't return here until after Corrine left. If JA had returned while Corrine was still there, he likely would have known that Olivia arranged for Malcolm's accident and certainly could have lorded that over her.
My biggest problem with this part was Olivia. WTH? I guess I just don't feel there was enough substance for why she became obsessively religious. The time was there -- in fact, it nearly dragged for me -- but it just didn't gel for me. Nella put it best when she pointed out that Olivia went from being controlled by one man (Malcolm) to another (JA). It didn't make sense that she would be such close friends with Nella, to the point of instructing Nella to call her Olivia, and then after JA being in the house (even for 8 years) she would then see Nella as inferior to her and want to be called Mrs. Foxworth. Olivia had been married to Malcolm for more than 30 years by then, I would assume, and he hadn't been able to break her and really, truly fundamentally change her so how did JA manage to do it? Maybe I could see the hardcore, obsessive turn to religion if it had happened immediately after she found out about Corrine and Christopher and they ran off. Especially if JA had been there and basically blamed Olivia for it all happening. Maybe. Or maybe if, like the book, Olivia had received notice that Joel was presumed dead. At that point, she would have nothing -- all of her children gone -- except a terrible marriage to a monster.
I also don't think we were given enough of a backstory to explain locking Corrine's children up in the attic. Again, if JA were there, I could see him making the suggestion, to lock them away, to prevent their evil from spreading, to get them to turn to God for forgiveness, etc. But why would Olivia do this? Was it her way to punish Corrine?
I wish we either had one more part or certain things had been eliminated from this portion so that we could see Corrine seeing Malcolm again and trying to win him over and realizing that she was going to have to choose between her children and the inheritance. I just felt seeing that box of rat poison and then hearing Corrine say that the children were only going to be locked up one night, at least that's what she told herself, wasn't enough.-
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On 7/27/2022 at 12:50 PM, Scarlett45 said:
These writers are AMAZING. I love what they have been doing. They have used this opportunity to really flesh out the characters and give real motivations to the actions.
What do we want to see for Saturday? I want more Nella- I want her to get some type of revenge on Malcolm. I want evil John Amos to start warping Olivia's mind. I want more of Corinne and Christopher falling in love and making the decision to leave everything behind to be together.
I would love to see what happened at FH after Christopher and Corrine left and how much Malcolm knew about their lives in Gladstone, PA. It would be interesting to see, also, if Christopher and/or Corrine had any contact with Olivia from the time they left until Corrine returned with the children. Corrine either said or inferred that she didn't in FITA but we know she was unreliable on certain things.
On 7/27/2022 at 1:18 PM, Daisy said:
I will have to say - Corrine and Christopher were dumb bunnies. you are having full on sexy times in the swan bedroom, you can't even kiss to make sure you can't be heard - hello. I will give them the benefit of the doubt because they didn't think anyone would be milling around but - again. they were loud.Right? They had very expansive grounds, including a chapel where Christopher "rescued" Corrine earlier. Why didn't they go there? They wouldn't have had to worry about Malcolm, Olivia or the servants.
15 hours ago, andromeda331 said:I think Corrine was lying to Cathy about trying to make the kids a little sick to sneak them out of the house. By that point I think she was just for killing her kids and moving on. She came up with a lot of different excuses to save her marriage to Bart and keep herself out of jail. None of them worked. But that is one thing I love about the books. Your never really sure who to believe. Corrine was unreliable in the first book with her version events that didn't line up in the Garden of Shadows. Was it when Andrew took over and forgot details or Corrine lying. She tried to claim Malcolm was terrible to her but that was a lie. After the first whipping Corrine was able to come and go as she wanted. But Olivia and Cathy were hardly reliable either. I do think Malcolm knew about the four kids. That part he added to his will about if it was ever proven Corrine had kids with her first husband or kids with Bart. That's so something he would do.
I still think that she was being truthful (the cheese may stand alone). Although Corrine was supposed to be around 35 at the time, she may emotionally have been closer to a teenager, especially living back under Malcolm's roof. She never had to account for anything growing up, as evidenced by her pregnancy, abortion, and then poisoning of Malcolm. As much as she felt suffocated by Malcolm, she also knew she could bat her eyes at him and get what she wanted. I could see her thinking that she could poison the children just enough to make them sick, without accounting for them being malnourished, undersized, lacking in Vitamin D, fresh air and sunshine, etc.
That doesn't excuse that she did intentionally poison them and it doesn't excuse that she allowed them to be locked up for years.
I do remember in FITA that Chris and Cathy realized at some point during the first weeks that they would be locked up until Malcolm died. Obviously, they got this info from Corrine. I would assume that she figured that once Malcolm died, she would inherit, and the kids could come out of the attic. Once Malcolm died and she learned of the codicil, she probably had no idea what to do at first. Then she thought of the poison. While I do think that in her immature brain she figured she could sneak them out, she clearly never thought of how she would explain their presence to Bart Winslow or how they had been locked up for years.7 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:Word. But they were in the attic over 3yrs. WHAT was she thinking in the 2+ years they were locked up.
I am thinking Malcolm likely knew. Why put in a codicil about her having children with ANOTHER husband? Corinne was still somewhat young- 35 or so? Older, but still very much capable of landing a man who wanted biological children. That codicil was to punish her. In the 1950s a woman with no biological children was an object to be pitied. A seriously unfortunate member of society. And even with her money and beauty, there was a social attitude that men only married women for their uteruses, if she couldn't have children, her best chance at a new husband was an older guy who already had children.(he may have been handsome and rich though) Malcolm did that because money was his way to control people (cause no one liked him), it was a final "stick to to Corinne" as a punishment for running off with Christopher and disobeying him. I could 100% see the Malcolm as portrayed by Max Irons doing that.
That's a good point. John Amos probably wanted Corinne home so he could creep on her, but Corinne was hip to his ways and more savvy (being an adult woman)*. I could also see John Amos not realizing that Olivia was going to leave everything to Corinne ANYWAY, so it didn't matter! She would inherit from Malcolm first, OR from Olivia.
Do you think that Olivia wanted to lock the children away in part because she was jealous of Corinne for having 4 healthy children? Olivia had lost both of her children (in this mini series she knows Joel is alive, but he is lost to her for the time being, and being gay its not likely she is going to get grandchildren from him in the 1940s), and she always wanted more children after Joel. She was stuck married to that POS Malcolm, but her kids were her joy, and they were gone forever. I could see her being jealous of Corinne for being a mother still and also thinking if she would lock them away she didnt deserve them.
*of course anyone can be a victim of violence, but it's much easier to creep on someone without knowledge/suspicion of your intentions, like an adolescent.
I agree that the codicil was to punish her. Malcolm was probably still salty over the fact that she "chose" Christopher over him. She ran off and didn't return until Christopher died and then came back with her tail between her legs, so to speak. He did have her whipped and he continued to punish her while he was still alive by having her children locked up. It seems only natural that he would want to continue punishing her after he was dead.
I also wonder if he intended to force her hand and make a choice. Maybe he knew his daughter well enough to know that she would choose the money.
But honestly, did he truly think those children would stay locked up for the remainder of their lives? Or did he suspect that Corrine would harm them?3 hours ago, Daisy said:Honestly, I think it was because they trusted their mother. i mean no matter how hard/angry you are - you wanna believe that your mom is still your mom. Look how long it took Christopher to crack.
Exactly what I was going to say. They believed in their mother - at least until Cory died and during one of their excursions, found that Corrine and Bart had left FH. I think that's when Chris and Cathy truly realized they were on their own. They had no one besides their mother (and each other). When it became clear that she wasn't going to help them, they had to go.
I recall a part in FITA in which Cathy remembered looking back at FH after their escape and thinking she saw Olivia looking out the windows. It would be so very interesting, at least IMO, to see all this from Olivia's point of view.-
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26 minutes ago, TattleTeeny said:
Oh, I know about the will and all that. But report to whom? Reporting a dead (or "dead") kid doesn't negate that she had a kid; it does the exact opposite and confirms it. All that aside, you still wouldn't need to actually poison anyone to do this plan; you could just do the "leave house with kid" part. It's making me so mad all over again.
As I recall from the books, Malcolm knew all about the four children and it was his desire that the children remain locked up for the rest of their lives. So it's possible that Corrine knew that Malcolm knew and she figured if she said they had died, that would be the end of it.
Regardless, Corrine put her inheritance ahead of everything else. I get that it was the 1950s and she had not been trained to do anything but she had the ability to get a job as a receptionist if nothing else. She was allegedly going to secretarial school when the kids were first locked up, if she was being truthful. Fact is, once she got back into FH and started living the life again, she had no desire to leave it. She was awful.-
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Good Lord, I was on pins and needles during that episode. I was terrified that the title indicated that Harry would be killed. Thank goodness it was that old hag Mrs. Steiner instead (who should have known better, as I'd be willing to be she knew a lot of the Foxworth secrets.)
Joel and Harry sitting at the piano together and then kissing was stupid but I think a part of Joel wanted Malcolm to know. He knew he was a disappointment to his father (Mal was the businessman) and had probably been hearing for years about how he was a "sissy," etc. with his piano playing and his gentle nature. His subconscious may have been thinking well, just show him.
I was infuriated that Olivia would stand by and do nothing while Harry was taken into custody and beaten. Especially once Nella was pleading with her -- after everything Nella had done for Olivia, that was really inexcusable.
The scenes of Joel being subjected to shock therapy were devastating, as well as him suffering with seizures afterwards. Thank goodness Christopher knew the dirt on that horrible "hospital" and finally got Olivia into action.
I wonder if Malcolm is going to realize that Olivia's engagement ring is gone? You know he'll be pissed that she gave it to Joel to run off with.
Why on earth did Christopher and Corrine go into the swan bedroom?? At least if they had gone into her bedroom or his, should someone knock at the door, one of them could have hidden. Incredibly stupid. But the actors absolutely sold how infatuated they were with each other and how badly they were lusting for each other.
So Malcolm and Olivia actually have a moment of tenderness while burying Mrs. Steiner -- which surely will be forgotten once the romance of Christopher and Corrine is exposed.
I really look forward to next week, to see what the writers chose to do with wrapping this up. They have done an excellent job on transferring Garden of Shadows to the screen.3 hours ago, Kiki777 said:Hey maybe these script writers should be hired by the VCAndrews estate to ghost-write her books from now on!
From your keyboard to the VC Andrews estate!
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19 minutes ago, TattleTeeny said:
This has never made one bit of sense to me though! Why would she need to even slightly poison them in order to leave with them? And why would she have to pretend and report that they died? And to whom? If she wanted to take them out of there, she could have at any time without poison or fake deaths.
Corrine could not inherit if it were proven she had children by Christopher -- or anyone, apparently. So her "plan" was to poison them enough to make them sick, sneak them out and report back they died while having them elsewhere. Thereby (at least in her mind), keeping her children and keeping her inheritance.
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On 7/17/2022 at 2:05 PM, Chatty Cake said:
Am I the only one that hates the wedding episodes? I wish they would show all the weddings in one 2 hour episode.
I agree. I despise the "telling the families" episodes -- big, fat waste of time. Nothing but filler. And the choosing the dress episodes makes me mad because they always turn up their noses at the most flattering (IMO) and choose the one that's least flattering to me. There have been rare exceptions but overall, it seems to be all about bringing your boobs down the aisle on display. I get it's a first impression but I'd want for my groom to realize he's marrying me, not just my boobs.
I thought I was going to like Mitch but nope. He's clearly going to be a high maintenance, whiny little bitch. I don't like Krysten (not sure why) so maybe it's all good. I really, really dislike how she thought the best course of action was to tell her father on her wedding day that she's getting married. She said he lives across the country so he's coming from somewhere on the East Coast, planning to spend time with his daughter, who is actually getting married and then leaving for her honeymoon? A real shit move all around if you ask me. And definitely not right to put him in the spot in front of cameras. If she wanted to tell him in person, fly your ass out to him. I think though that she thought he would refuse to participate if she told him off camera. Pretty low, Krysten.
I think Miguel is an adorable dork. Lindy seems like she could be pretty dorky too so maybe it's a good match.
I thought Justin and Alexis were a good match -- until she announced to everyone that he's been celibate. NOT. COOL. Why would you do that? She doesn't know that he already said so in a TH. I would be furious if I were Justin - and that would turn me off.
Nate is clearly this season's Olajuwon. Of course I also thought the same of New Orleans' Woody and he surprised me. I think Stacia's dress looked really nice on her and probably the best choice this season.
Don't have much to say about Binh and Morgan since I FF'd through most of the filler.
If engagement rings are now part of it, why doesn't the show just have the women pick out their own rings (and the men as well) that way they get what they like?-
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3 minutes ago, njbchlover said:
Does anyone else get the feeling that Diana's house may be rented, or leased, just for filming? I was listening to her story about her miscarriage, and it seemed like she had only just moved to Beverly Hills or wherever she is living.
Did she sustain damage to her Malibu home that she evacuated from during the fires or was that the home she sold for 87 million, according to Rinna?
This home just seems so cold and impersonal, like a permanent rental home for temporary left coast residents.
Yep. It's definitely very cold and impersonal. Kind of like Diana.
I would think a home with all that glass and stairs would be a nightmare if you have a baby/toddler.-
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I'm not sure who I disliked more this episode - shit-stirring Kyle or lip-licking Diana. Congrats, Erika - you got a reprieve.
WTH is Kyle doing, telling Sutton not to touch Sheree after she pointed that bony finger in Sutton's face at Garcelle's party, put her hands on her, grabbed her and basically shook her? No, Kyle, you don't do that. Where I'm from, you're liable to get your ass kicked pulling that.
And it's clear that Kyle's main job is to stir shit up and pit people against each other because she has no other storyline, unless you count her eating a baked potato with Kathy. She sits Diana next to Sutton at her charity lunch, she has to jump in and get involved in everyone's business. I really cannot stand her (and I used to like her).
Confession time: I would have been fangirling all over Jamie Lee Curtis although I wouldn't have been calling a thermos "amazing" and "chic" like Dorit. Real it in, Dorito. But Jamie Lee is seriously awesome. How she can be friends with Kyle is beyond me.
Like others have said, I would have liked to know who else was donating to the hospital at Kyle's lunch. $25,000 is a nice contribution but isn't that like Mo's expenditure on pot? With all their money, it seems like it would be the equivalent of $50 to me. I would think Sutton would -- was that left on the cutting room floor? And what about Crystal? Wasn't she carrying around some ugly $100K handbag last season? She could clearly throw some coin at a good charity. Although maybe she is getting low on the dollars since she couldn't even wear a full dress to Diana's party. Fortunately for her though, Diana showed up in that black glittery monstrosity. WTF? Not only was it ugly, it was ill-fitting and hardly looked like something you'd wear to a festive holiday party. Her boy toy was wearing a burgundy or red suit; could she not coordinate? Could she not wear something in green or gold? Just ugh.
Oh, to have Kathy Hilton's life and bank accounts. I love that she has Christmas trees in every room. So much more fun and festive than Diana's sterile house.
BTW, I really liked Sutton's cream-colored suit that she wore to Kyle's lunch. Very pretty and flattering on her.
So I guess next week we'll find out who drunken Erika suggests a threesome to. She's embarrassing and exhausting and her nasal fry gets on my last good nerve.-
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1 hour ago, Scarlett45 said:
@CountryGirl I slightly disagree with your analysis of Corinne and Christopher being her first love. Getting wrapped up in lust, and having sex doesn’t mean you went through all of the emotional upheavals and psychological impact of a first love.
I don’t think Corinne ever loved or had deep emotional attachments to the guy she conceived with- she certainly was attracted to him and got swept up in that, but I don’t think it went any deeper than that. While women have different responses to terminating a pregnancy, I’m of the mind that because Corinne didn’t want to be pregnant or have a child with that guy, other than the physical discomfort it was more akin to a teeth cleaning. A procedure to deal with a circumstance she didn’t want.
Christopher she LOVED. She had just lost her beloved brother tragically- that’s an entirely different kettle of fish.
But we will have to see what they come up with this week!!!
1 hour ago, CountryGirl said:That's a fair assessment. I can agree that the guys she went out with before were more for fun, an escape, and yes, lust and all that entails, and she might have thought herself "in love" but it was never the real thing until Christopher came along.
I wonder how they will show Joel's "death." Will it be the skiing trip that monks rescued him from? Or something else. Christopher arrives after his "death," so the family is definitely at rock bottom at that point. I still have a hard time wrapping my head around the Joel of GoS with the one from SoY and the he found religion didn't really wash with me.
If Corinne has more of Malcolm in her than Alicia (and it certainly appears so), she was probably more in love with how attracted the motorcycle guy was to her than anything else. Do I think she loved Christopher? Yes, probably so. Did she love him as much as he loved her? Questionable. The money came before her children so . . .
As I've said I think about this way too much but we could ask the same question about Bart Winslow. Did she truly love him? Or did she marry him because she had to have somebody take care of her and adore her? And it appeared that Malcolm approved of Bart, although he did add that codicil in his will that Corinne could never have children and inherit and Bart said in POTW that he had desperately wanted children of his own (but was under the impression that Corinne couldn't have them).
Funny how when I first read FITA many, many years ago, and even on subsequent rereads, I despised Olivia and thought she was the most vile person in the book. Now it's a toss-up between Malcolm and Corinne.-
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7 hours ago, andromeda331 said:
I think Christopher Sr just charmed Malcolm like he charmed everyone. In the book he and Malcolm would talk business and Christopher seem to have some smarts about it. He probably also didn't see Christopher as a danger when hanging out with Corrine. More of the like when Joel or Mal would hang out with her.
I'm not sure why Alicia sent her son to them in the book. As others pointed out Malcolm threatened to hurt Christopher if she fought back. There's no doubt he would have too. Seeing how things went in Part II I can't see why she would after what Malcolm and Olivia did to her and Malcolm did kill her husband, his own father. Did she think Olivia would protect Christopher? Olivia seemed really strong when Alicia left, so maybe? I don't know.
I have one nitpik with Nella. Everything she said to Olivia was correct. But Olivia had no idea what she was getting into when she arrived at Foxworth Hall Nella did. Nella did nothing to warn her. Whether Olivia would have listened I don't know but she didn't. Olivia at least tried to get Alicia to leave before she knew about the pregnancy. Locking Alicia up was horrible but how else was that going play out? Malcolm was never going to let that baby go. Olivia at least made sure she left with her inheritance. Nella said nothing to warn Olivia when she arrived and then a vague one about Malcolm liking pretty things and Alicia.
I do think Corrine loved Christopher Sr and their kids. She willing gave up everything for him. While their house was nice it was no Foxworth Hall and all that wealth. That's what made her betrayel so much worse. Olivia poisoning the kids wouldn't be shocking given how she treated them. Corrine loved them and had been a good mom. Jillian didn't care about Leigh from the beginning only what her daughter could do for Jillian.
In the book,, if I recall correctly, Alicia was poor -- I think she lost any money she inherited from Garland in the stock market crash -- and dying of breast cancer. She had no family and I'm sure she remembered how much Olivia had loved Christopher. She probably felt that Christopher would have far more opportunities (that were rightfully his) going back to FH.
Nella did tell Olivia, somewhat, to be careful of Malcolm and told her very specifically to call her should anything happen. She couldn't very well tell her the whole story. Nella was a servant, Olivia was the new mistress of the house. Plus, women were expected to stay with their husbands, even if they were abusive rapists. Different times.
Speaking of Nella, once it was revealed that Malcolm's office had a secret door that led to the attic and the bedroom, it became understandable why Nella would not go up in the attic with Olivia when Olivia first arrived. As that wing was once servants' quarters, I imagine that Nella had stayed in that bedroom and Malcolm used that door to get to her and rape her. Poor Nella.
If the story continued into FITA territory, it would be interesting to see if Nella was still at FH. I definitely do not see her being okay with locking the kids away, unless there's some new twist to the story, like the children are being protected from Malcolm's knowledge of them, etc. Although I thought it was revealed that Malcolm knew about them all along thanks to a PI?
Anyhow, I look forward to part 3!-
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Were it not for Sutton and Garcelle, I would peace out of this mess.
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2 hours ago, Snow Apple said:
Also in the book, once teenage Christopher showed up, Malcolm was impressed with his intelligence and warmed up to him. I wonder if they will keep that in the movie or if Malcolm will treat Chris badly like all the others.
In the book, they became a happy family for a little while. Olivia and Malcolm even reached an understanding. Too bad Corrine and Christopher fell in love and of course the evil that is John Amos.
They should keep it in the movie. I mean, after all, Christopher is his half-brother and as horrible as Malcolm is (and he's horrible), he did lose his son. Seems like Christopher should be a quasi-replacement for Mal, which, as @Daisy pointed out, makes Christopher and Corinne's "betrayal" even worse.
I am thinking about this way too much but the only reason I can fathom for Corinne's pregnancy and abortion was to show this is the first (that we know of) time that Olivia covers up an action by Corinne. That was followed by poisoning Malcolm, which although not mentioned in the books, is actually pretty brilliant. One, it shows how really selfish and thoughtless Corinne was, even as a teenager. Her father doesn't want her going to a party and her solution is to poison him? Secondly, it's a fantastic forewarning of what's to come with her children and it makes perfect sense why she would think that poisoning them would make them just a little sick and she could carry them out and away from FH and report back they had died. After all, that's basically what happened when she poisoned Malcolm -- he got sick but then he recovered. Of course, she wasn't thinking that an adult man would react differently than children, and that she eventually uses arsenic with the children, not whatever plant she used with Malcolm.
I've also thought on the debate a few of you have had on whether Corinne truly loved Christopher. I'm on the fence here because I can see both sides. I'm sure she desperately wanted to get away from FH, especially after Mal died and then what happened with Joel (at least in the books). Christopher gave her that escape, plus he absolutely adored her. He put her on a pedestal and took over where Malcolm left off as far as indulging her. On the other hand, how she eventually treated her children and how she allowed them to be treated was incredibly disrespectful to Christopher's memory.
I know I said this before but I really hope that Lifetime will continue this with FITA through Olivia's eyes. There is still a lot to tell and since FITA was told from Cathy's perspective, there could be a lot going on downstairs we don't know. Heck, we saw Olivia again in POTW, so it could even go that far.
I have to say I really like what they've done with Olivia here and Jemima Rooper's portrayal. I don't hate Olivia or dislike her; I feel a great deal of sympathy for her. She really was a victim of circumstance (her father's death, leaving her nothing) and the times (wives were the property of their husbands and women generally just didn't leave their husbands.) I think it would be fascinating to see her emotions and thoughts when Corinne returns with her children.
Speaking of which, just a minor nitpick. It's been many years since I've read FITA but as I recall, Corinne and the children had to walk from the train station because a car arriving would possibly alert the servants. Once at FH, Olivia met them at a backdoor and ushered them in. When Alicia left ("for Philadelphia"), she returned in a car to the front of the house and came in through the front door. What?? As this was in the 1920s, that car should have been heard by everyone in the house. Not only did the cars make more noise but they were fairly isolated. You would think the butler would have heard and jumped up to see what was going on. I would also think the front doors of a house like that wouldn't exactly be quiet or subtle. Just a nitpick from me but it bugged me. I felt like it would have been better to have Alicia wait at the train station and have Olivia meet her and walk her back through the woods to FH -- much as her daughter and grandchildren would be forced to do one day. Oh well.-
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3 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:
Well that's disappointing. IMBD can be wrong. Why hire him and only give him two scenes??
Not only that but John Amos was a major part of why Olivia went so fanatically religious. I would have thought JA would have returned for Mal's funeral. That definitely would have been the place for seeds to be planted and then go full out once Joel allegedly died and Christopher and Corinne ran off .
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4 hours ago, Snow Apple said:
I believe Corrine genuinely loved Christopher Sr. but part of it was that he indulged her. Sure they didn't live like Foxworth Hall, but they spent beyond their means and Christopher allowed it. Remember after his death, they repossessed everything. They were nice enough to let her keep her wedding band, but Corrine told the children to not to make a peep about her engagement ring. So after at least 14-15 years, her engagement ring was still not paid off.
3 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:I was about to mention that, and you beat me to it. They were up to their EYEBALLS in debt. The cost of living was a lot less in the 1940s and 50s. A white man with a college education (Christopher didn't make it to med school, but he did finish college) could certainly support a wife and 4 kids in a typical middle class life, with a few luxuries and not be up to his EYEBALLS in debt. So no savings, no life insurance, and everything was purchased on credit.
Not that it wasn't Christopher's fault as well- I think after his mother died he felt so alone, and Corinne was all he had, so he wanted to keep her happy (especially knowing how much she gave up to be with him), always thinking there would be time to "make it up"
Regarding Corinne's engagement diamond, I think she put it away not necessarily because it wasn't paid for but because it may have been taken as an asset in order to go toward their debt.
I don't fault Corinne for not working when she was married to Chris, Sr. Remember, this would have been in the 1940s and 1950s. Women stayed home, took care of the house and children. Plus, she wasn't trained to do anything. Where I did fault her was by the time she returned to FH after Chris, Sr.'s death, she supposedly was going to secretarial school. She could have chosen to do anything but she was lazy, she was spoiled, she was entitled and she didn't want to work at or for anything.
And yes, Christopher Foxworth finished college but when he and Corinne ran off to get married and be Dollangangers, he had to deny his education, which is why he sold insurance, I believe. Another driving force behind Chris, Jr. and his desire to study and be a doctor.
I am thoroughly enjoying this series. I love how we are seeing glimpses of how very much Corinne was Malcolm's daughter, even as a teenager. Like others, I didn't understand why the pregnancy storyline was there; it added nothing to the plot. From reading the books, I always assumed that Corinne had been very sheltered by Malcolm and Christopher was the first boy, other than her brothers, that she was truly allowed to be alone with.
Max Irons and Jemima Rooper are fantastic and I wouldn't be mad if they continued with FITA from Olivia's perspective.-
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I am truly going to miss seeing Colin and Marcos on my tv every Monday evening. The hotness and the accents started my week right.
So Daisy is the ultimate prize? Why? Because she drinks like a sailor? I don't get it. Of course, I also don't get why Daisy drinks like a sailor on every crew night out, gets so drunk she allegedly doesn't remember everything and then wakes the next morning with a terrible hangover. In my early twenties, I could shake off a hangover fairly easily but by the time you hit 30 or so, it's not so easy and you generally learn that drinking to that extent is not a great idea. Obviously Daisy hasn't gotten that memo. Nor has Gary.
So Gary was way into Scarlett two weeks ago and now he's just "see ya" and that's that? Um, okay.
Of course Ashley thinks she's being so cool by being dismissive of Gary but then she points out how she's being dismissive, which obliterates any cool factor associated with it and makes her seem more like a 14-year-old.
Thanks so much, production, for making sure we got another gross drunk Ashley eating scene. Good Lord, that girl is nasty when she drunk eats. Was it Colin that said she ate like a caveman? About right. She's lucky she didn't slam a tit in that panini maker and grill it up by accident.
I guess Glenn didn't need crew, other than Gary, since the boat was already in Spain?
Can someone more intelligent than I am please explain why they have the crew depart the boat one at a time? Surely if they were all headed to the airport, they'd go together, right?-
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Dr. Viv's face the entire time Alyssa and Chris were on stage was everything. And Dr. Viv has receipts!
Alyssa is so full of shit, not wanting to explain why the experts let her down, not wanting to explain what was wrong with Chris, not wanting to explain what her core values are. Because all three are nonexistent. She has no excuse other than she's a shallow mean girl who is all about appearances and who decided never to give Chris a chance based solely on his looks (of which there is nothing wrong).
I wish Chris the best. He truly does seem like a genuinely nice man.-
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14 hours ago, charming said:
I hope the insurance agents are comparing their payout to PK to make sure it lines up with the new story about only some handbags and watches being stolen.
I don't know about PK and Dorito but my insurance company can refuse to pay out if you have an alarm system and you don't activate it.
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It seems a sacrilege to have such a classic nod to Gone With the Wind (Scarlett and Ashley) on a Bravo reality show. Anyhow . . .
If I were a nicer person and Ashley hadn't been such a conniving little shitbag throughout the season, I would feel sorry for her. But since she was and I'm not, I don't. Not only are Scarlett's boobs just about as big as Ashley's (although I think they're surgically enhanced), she's physically prettier and so far has a much nicer personality. Somewhere in the UK, Tom sits with a pint and laughs his ass off at "guys my age are so immature" Ashley as she acts about 14.
Gary must be having flashbacks to Sydney. He needs to talk to Ashley one on one, tell her he is not interested in anything other than being friends without benefits and/or assault and make it very clear that nothing is happening between them again, whether consensual or drunken. Of course, the way these idiots drink, anything is possible.
Daisy finally did the right thing in making Ashley and Scarlett junior stews. Ashley only wants the title for bragging rights and to be able to boss someone around. Her work ethic is pretty shitty -- and she can't read a room for jack with her nonstop questioning about who was going to be the second stew. Someone shove some spaghetti in her mouth so she will shut up.
Speaking of which, that was one of the most repulsive scenes I have ever viewed. Seeing that the spaghetti was in a pretty large Tupperware type bowl, I would assume it wasn't just Ashley's portion but leftovers for everyone. And she ate right out of it, with food falling from her mouth back into the bowl. Frigging disgusting. Not only is she a skank but she's a skank with no manners. Ugh.
I'm glad that Kelsie told Daisy that Ashley was gunning for Scarlett. Hopefully Daisy will keep her eyes on the situation.
Not surprised that the previews show Scarlett kissing Gary. Who hasn't kissed Gary?
I like Barnaby. He's not traditionally handsome but he's a hard worker, has an amazing British accent and seems like a pretty nice guy. His flat "okay" to Ashley after she ranted about Gary's car driving into her garage, Gary ignoring her and how she didn't need him was gold. Don't change, Barnaby.
Colin continues to be awesome, and I absolutely love Marcos.-
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4 hours ago, NaughtyKitty said:
I was shocked (well, not really) when Ashley made the comment about having sex with Gary to the new DH. Wow.
Ashley is clearly hedging her bets. If she doesn't get another shot with Gary and/or the new stew catches Barnaby's interest, she wants to make sure that Barnaby knows her vajayjay is open for business. I expect her to announce during their night out following this horrendous charter that she's horny. Everyone except Barnaby has heard it at least two or three times by now; got to add him to the club.
These charter guests are vile. I wouldn't think it would help Dr. Nipples' reputation for her to be so drunk that not only her boob is falling out of her top but she admits that the entire first day on the boat is a blur and she doesn't recall any of Marcos' amazing dinner.
Honestly, should Daisy be surprised that she's going to be exhausted and not getting enough sleep? Even with the most easygoing guests, having only two stews is guaranteeing exhaustion on the interior side. I feel badly for Marcos, as these 11 pm dinners mean he gets very little sleep.
I guess since Barnaby is very competent, Gary has to find fault with Kelsie?-
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So this past weekend I marathoned this entire pathetic season, after these episodes sitting on my DVR for months. Where to begin?
Why do these women (and a few men) act so shocked that the person they "knew" behind bars is a completely different person when free? Well, no shit. First, they are on their best behavior to get things from you -- if they acted a fool straight out of the gate, they wouldn't get anything. At least not from most. Secondly, most of them are on their best (or better) behavior so they can get out (although some of them clearly want back in). And thirdly, they are institutionalized. I shouldn't be, since I watch reality trash like this, but am shocked at how these "civilians" don't seem to realize that their inmates, particularly the ones with long stretches, become institutionalized.
Let's take Antoine and Harry to start. Antoine went in at what? 17? He's clearly emotionally stuck there, if not younger. Harry is as well. They are both thoroughly ungrateful little shitbags who don't understand why the world doesn't revolve around them and have an unhealthy and greatly engorged opinion of themselves. I find them both pretty repulsive, both in behavior and appearance. Indie and Lacey could each do better than scraping the bottom of this particular clown barrel.
Lacey, at least, appears to recognize that Antoine hasn't lived out in the world as an adult and has zero concept on how the real world works. Other than complaining, all we've seen him do is hit a few golf balls, pout about Lacey not buying him a car, add a new, equally ugly tattoo, to his existing collection, and smoke weed. What a winner! Why isn't he looking for a job? I get that a convicted felon with butt-ugly face tattoos probably makes things difficult but surely there's got to be something. His sense of entitlement is galling. Lacey should kick him out and send him back to his mother, who is clearly no prize. She too seems to think that Antoine is something special (newsflash: he's not) and even though she's been diagnosed with liver failure, she's still chugging away. I can't imagine it will be long before Antoine is back in the pokey.
While one part of me feels sorry for Harry because his childhood and upbringing was clearly terrible and he has had problems for years, he is now an adult and needs to take accountability. Indie is not responsible for what his mother did or didn't do and his sisters aren't his keepers. He acts so surprised and annoyed that he has to check in with his PO. That's what happens when you commit aggravated kidnapping and go to prison, dumb ass. I have zero idea how he got Indie to move to Ohio for him and Halfway House Terry to lose her job over him because at least IMO he looks as if bathing is not at the top of his priority list. I swear, between him and Chicklet Raydeen, I feel like the funk is seeping through my television.
Indie is an absolute moron. Harry has demeaned her, told her he's cheating on her, left his sister's house for a week to live with Halfway House Terri and she's seen the texts between the two of them and she's still there? WHY? He's made it very clear he doesn't care about her or her daughter. I don't think he even cares about himself very much. He needs therapy, pronto. If I had to guess, I would suspect if therapy was ever broached with him, he'd shoot it down and claim he's taken care of his own issues. I fully expect him to be back behind bars shortly, if he's not already there.
Indie's mom should at least take Indie's daughter back to Maryland. If Indie wants to continue to fuck up her own life, fine but do not do that to your child's life.
Raydeen's Chicklet teeth absolutely terrify me. I'm shocked that I haven't had any nightmares about them. Is the single female situation so dire in that part of Texas that Rick is willing to be humiliated by a meth-ed out (at least former, surely) convict? His roommate (Ramona?) certainly has Chicklet's number and I'm here for it. I found it hilarious that Chicklet tried to tell Ramona she was done having a conversation with her and indicated that Ramona should leave -- while standing on Rick and Ramona's front porch. Bitch, you're at her house. If you're done, take your bony ass on out of there. And yeah, $650 "isn't bad" for a jacket. No, it's not, when you're not paying for it. Someone needs to let Rick in on a little secret called Walmart and Target. That's where he should have been buying her undies and jacket. I still cannot believe he dropped over $700 on underwear for that ungrateful little witch.
Speaking of witches, Tiffany was about as transparent as they come. Clearly she was all into Kurtis until Kevin clocked him and he was down for the count. Then suddenly it caused her to think (probably should have been a local news headline because I have a feeling that Tiffany and thinking don't meet often). Not that I feel sorry for Kevin because he's clearly a douche and the only thing he has going for him are nice cars (how does he afford them) and cute dogs. Tiffany is/was using Kevin and Kevin was using Tiffany to get back at or something regarding his crazy ex (or should I say "ex") Kayla. Kayla should be worrying more about getting all the paint on her car to match instead of what and who Kevin is doing.
Kaylah (not to be confused with crazy Kayla) deserves better than Mr. Clean Martel. As soon as he started in that first night about how she should be doing his laundry and cleaning the kitchen and nitpicking everything, I would have packed up, turned in the apartment keys, broken the lease, and left. She stuck by him for THIRTEEN YEARS and this is how he's treating her? No. Absolutely not. Kaylah has way more going for her than he has going for him. And then to ignore the fact that she's hungry and would like to eat because he wants to go get a haircut? Screw you, dude. She should not have come back. Go to the apartment, pack everything up, turn in the keys and break the lease.
I hope that Branwyn won't be this season's Goddess. Fortunately, Chazz appears to be worlds ahead of Clint. He seems like a nice guy (although five marriages, including Branwyn, is worrisome) so he may get trampled on. Branwyn's daughter needs to cool her jets and take a few seats. Chazz just paid for you to get your hair styled (looked the same to me), as well as your mom, to the tune of over $500 (ridiculous) so have a little bit of respect. I know that my bank, if I don't notify them of being out of town, will decline any suspicious looking charge or an abnormally large charge. I'm willing to bet that's what happened. Branwyn clearly is not into Chazz at all. And here comes Branwyn's daughter with the guilt trip. Did Branwyn never consider this before agreeing to marry Chazz and move to Kentucky?
I am giving Branwyn's friend Jessica the side eye for bringing her EX-BOYFRIEND WHO GOT HER TOSSED INTO THE SLAMMER to her prison release/wedding day. WTF? Huge red flag right there. I have a suspicion this won't end well for Chazz. At least he has his cat.
I almost forget Chance and Tayler. Only remember because Chazz and Chance are close. Tayler's laugh is highly, highly annoying, as is Chance's issue with pictures of Tayler's ex being up. The dude died and he is the father of her daughters so Chance needs to back away from that one. Do those girls have free reign of the house or are there producer shenanigans going on? Seems like we see them running around screaming, unchaperoned and apparently high on sugar the majority of the time. Maybe Tayler should be paying more attention to them instead of moving a convict into the house that she doesn't know? Just saying.
Will be interesting to see what happens on the season finale. And by that, I mean how many inmates go back to prison.
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5 hours ago, Baltimore Betty said:
I could text you after my weekly Tuesday Night Supper Club, referred to as the TNSC, every Tuesday I have a friend over for an elaborate dinner and we drink a bottle of Prosecco, hilarity ensues and a lot of giggling but no hooking up and no weird mind games either.
Thanks, Betty -- you're a pal!
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How am I supposed to start my week appropriately without the drunken hijinks of BD?
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1 hour ago, Crazydoxielady said:
Your hilarious! She’s not a “star” and she’s not a “model” either. She’s what the Brits would call a “round heeled slag.”
I love British slang so much!
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14 hours ago, lcarolynl said:
I bolded the part that I disagree with.The problem with binge drinking isn’t the hangovers, it’s the obnoxious behavior that ruins a fun outing for everyone. Everyone was hostage to Gabriella at that villa dinner. I’ve been there and it’s not cool.
But Daisy’s a fun drunk, laughing, dancing, and Irish dancing for the crowd.The rest that’s not bolded? I just enjoy reading all the different ways people here are trashing the human trash receptacle, Ashley.
To the friend of Ashley’s family, I’m so sorry. Any fan of Below Deck has seen plenty of ill advised couplings but Ashley is a nasty piece of work and in a category all her own.
And now she has an Only Fans page? Someone must pay to see what she’s selling and report back!I guess what makes me irate about the hangovers is they bitch and moan about it, like they had nothing to do with it. And some of the times, they wake hung over and new guests are coming aboard within a few hours. I don't know how their intoxication isn't a liability. I guess it would be in the non-Bravo BD world.
Apparently Ashley is/has been a cam girl so I would imagine she's had an Only Fans page for a while.
I agree with the above poster(s) who mentioned already hating the new charter guests. Anyone who has on their preference sheet that they need to be addressed as Dr. So-and-So is clearly going to be a major PITA. And just in time for being down one, possibly two, people!5 hours ago, iMonrey said:Can you think of a single time when a Chief Stew has successfully managed the shenanigans of their second and third stews, on any of the BD shows, ever? I can't. And I think that's because production doesn't want them to. They want the drama and they are the ones who probably stir the shit up in the first place.
Hmmm . . . has Kate ever done that? If anyone has, it would probably be her. But yes, I have no doubt that production wants the drama.
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Lifetime's VC Andrews Movies Topic (Flowers In The Attic, The Dollangangers, The Casteels, etc) - General Discussion
in Lifetime's VC Andrews Movies Topic (Flowers In The Attic, The Dollangangers, The Casteels, etc)
Exactly. She should have realized that JA's version of God and religion was complete b.s. after he did that.
Regarding Christopher, I really wish they had cut away from some of the more "draggier" moments (like Olivia burning all the furnishings - WTH?) and shown how he and Corrine got into such financial dire straits. It could have been something as simple as Christopher coming home from work and discovering that Corrine had new furniture delivered or her asking him about purchasing new things and he deciding that okay, he'll have plenty of time to pay them off.
If you haven't read the books, all you get is the scene of movers taking things and then Corrine supposedly in a crappy part of town -- the last part of which did not happen in the books. I think it would have gone much further to have at least one scene as I mentioned above and then maybe a scene of Corrine going through bills after Christopher's death and realizing that they didn't own anything at all. Based on this series, they would have been living in that house for at least 13 years (they moved in when Chris was a baby). Surely they would have some equity in it - unless the house had a second mortgage and/or any equity was taken to pay off other debts.
And from what we know of Corrine, at least book Corrine, she didn't have to hit rock bottom (i.e., moving into a bad, rundown part of town) before reaching out to Olivia. She needed someone to take care of her and as soon as Christopher was gone, she wouldn't have known what to do. Unless of course Lifetime is going to do another limited series on FITA and we see a very different side to Corrine.