Trepis

I agree; for whatever reason this situation has really had me thinking. Probably because when Kellee first mentioned how she hates being touched by strangers I remember thinking about how I could relate. But as the episodes carried on, I was constantly shown how different Kellee's life experience is from mine. I kept trying to think about how I would react , but its tricky because it's seems extremely unlikely just because Im a guy. Even when I think of it as a hypothetical , it doesnt really line up because it feels weird/awkward but still non sexual

Thank you for responding, I do appreciate there are two strong sides to this and I try to learn where ever I can. I do agree with Zeke ( I havent seen all the seasons so Im not sure who that is ) and I think at least as far as this board we are quite outraged. What bothered me the most was the moment at TC when Dan was making his weak ass BS 'I'm sorry if' speech every example he used was some incidental contact when he KNEW 1 He got a specific warning ( dang I wish we got to see this ) 2 Kellee outright asked him to stop intentional contact I've been trying to learn about what blind spots I might have when it comes to issues like this, I've got a cousin who is probably the smartest person I know ( 2 masters degrees before 30, ) and fifteen years my junior ; We had a talk over the summer and I asked her what her thoughts were on the subject. We had a great chat about privilege and subconscious sexism , two things that a 41yrd white male could be ignorant of. One of the things about subconscious sexism that really stuck was the idea that I should always stop and question a situation if I find myself thinking about making a decision on behalf of a woman without consulting her. The intent can be to help , but don't casually take away other peoples choices. in the thread about the episode where this all went down there was a comment that jumped out as a perfect example. The idea that womens bodies are property , we talk about how Dan wouldn't ever have touched the guys; I dont think he ever consciously thought ' I dont want to touch Deans hair' : the thought jsut never enters his mind. This is a really good point, I'm noddling this around for sure. Even considering what I said above, there are times that it is right ; the classic ' take car keys away from the person who had to many drinks' I just am thinking about if the stress of this game and hardship and stress of his presence is so much that it would make sense to make this decision for Kellee rather then asking her. It could very well be, I honestly dont think I have the life experience or perspective to determine . I remember thinking when they asked what she wants " She wants a fair f'ing shot! this game is her dream, its so fricking hard for so many reasons already and then she has this stacked against her. She either asked for him to go , possibly weakening her place in the game or she puts up with his presence . no matter what shes not getting the fair shot she deserves. I also remember having the sad thought that regardless of what happens with Dan, he's probably not the first Dan she's dealt with and not the last. Noura tacked on ' After I left them' right at the end of the sentence, I hadn't considered how it made her look, lol. now I think she tacked that on to recover ) Agreed on the second part, that transcript was enlighteningly horrible . How come a producer wasn't directly filming Dan from the moment of the warning and the very next touch bounce his ass.

Wow; glad to see Dan gone, doubt we will ever get the full details . When that card popped up that said it wasn't a player and not on camera I immediately thought he did something during a medical checkup. It's a time when he would be in close proximity to folks and likely not on camera as they tend to ask those 'how are you doing' questions . My next thought was awww, Dean wont talk the votes onto himself and then go home on a fake advantage. Elaine was doing good but she over played, that story should have been saved for the when she's final three because I'm sure a lot of folks realized they cant beat her right there. don't like Noura, anyone who searches bags gets on my dislike list but the shoe this was 100% pure grade A Bitch. there was nothing strategic about that. Her insulting Karishma to her face and ' They go back to their exes.......After I break up with them' does she expect guys she breaks up with to follow her around like lost puppies ( not going to be sad to see her. It's interesting how many folks think that production should have taken Dan off after Kellee said no, I disagree 1) If they remove Dan, Kellee gets voted off; Kellee sue's , says the reason she lost was because they removed her ally at a critical time even though she specifically said she did want that. Then CBS gets blasted for 'white knighting' her and not respecting her agency. I heard a saying a long time ago 'the problem with giving people a choice is sometimes they chose wrong' To be clear, I dont think Kellee 'chose wrong' . What this expression has always meant to me is if you believe someone deserves agency, then you have to respect their choices even if you wouldn't have done the same thing. They are making the right choice because it is their choice to make; The moment production decides 'This girl chose wrong, we better pull Dan to protect her' they are deciding to not respect her choice, and that's sexist.

caught this one last night; meh, still trying to decide if Im going to stick with this season. I dont like seeing Dan's face :( part of me wants to see him get voted off , but another part of me says who cares. This is just a stupid game show, it wont make a difference in real life. I realized last night that even though I have 'hated' players in the past ( the Dan / Will guys ; Reem was absolutely miserable . The Jock assholes who poured water on their fire ) I guess deep down I've always thought these folks could be playing a character and might be different in real life. That helps me enjoy Survivor, every story needs a villain and it's great when the villain gets their comeuppance Dan's not the same, everytime I see him on screen and Kellee on the jury it's like a great big reminder about real life. Real life is shitty, real life is unfair , good people in real life get mistreated and bad people get rewarded. Even if he gets crap at the reunion ; the reality is Kellee will likely have to deal with guys like him her entire life, thats shitty

I'm behind on my survivor watching, just caught this episode over the weekend. I've never had an emotional reaction to survivor beyond the normal excited / disappointed with who gets voted off . This episode was a whole different thing. In the first episode when Kellee was explaining how she didn't like being touched it really resonated with me ; I even explain to others that its a me issue just like she did. It's way more complicated then that obviously , even I can't necessarily quantify every possible physical interaction and know if I will be uncomfortable or not. In fact, the same behavior from two different folks can have wildly different responses ; If I run into my cousin and a friend on the street and my cousin gives me a hug, perfectly comfortable ; If the friend tried to hug me next, different feeling. I notice as I'm reading through this thread that several folks are trying to divide physical contact into 'sexual' and 'non-sexual' this to me is a rabbit hole. The physiological response that I feel with unwanted contact is the same whether or not the contact rises to some definition of sexual. The whole core of my body feels cold inside, my stomach knots up, my heart races and I start sweating. As I watched the episode it dawned on me that even though I have the same boundaries as Kellee with regards to physical contact, I have had a totally different life experience because I'm male. I felt a genuine sadness for her thinking about what life is like for her; having the behavior continue after they talked infuriates me ; do you need to scream in someones face DONT F***ING TOUCH ; It's not about thats how some folks are. I don't buy that because I've never had to tell someone twice; As I watch I can't help but ask 'how would I react' and when I do it becomes incredibly apparent how unequal women get treated. ' How would I react to Dan checking my hair for sand' - Umm, did you just touch my hair ?!? Seriously, what the hell ? 'How would I react to Dan checking my hair for sand AGAIN , after I told him not too' - I got nothing, I cannot imagine a guy doing this. I have trouble imagining it happening the first time, but I can't envision someone not respecting my wishes. 'How would I react to Dan touching my toes O.o' - 'Sorry I kicked you in the face but I thought I felt a bug on my foot; seriously though man, what the fuck were you doing to my foot that was creepy af ' I've always known culture and society have socio-norms regarding personal space and since I prefer more space I need to speak up on occasion but I never stopped to think about how much more women are subjected to every day.

There was a brief conversation the first night after Tribal when they saw the three jury members. They correctly concluded that a) The three jury members where still living on the Extinction island, and b) that Kieth and Wendy were missing because they chose to quit. This is a rough season ( what should have been an exciting tribal was still a bit meh for me ; I think the reason is tribal only matters if someone leaves the game, with this set up all your really doing is voting someone on to the other tribe. When Aubrey leaves the game ( assuming she doesn't win her way back in ) it wont have been the incredible blindside by Victoria that sent her home, it will be that she didn't win the challenge. Same for Julia, this craziest tribal ever! didn't cost her the game, she's still going to be there week after week. And if/when she leaves, it will be that she lost a challenge. I don't think I saw the seasons with outcast island or redemption island, but I imagine I would have felt the same with those. When survivor goes from 'You have to survive every tribal one way or another or You Cannot Win! ' to 'Even if you fail at tribal, if you can win one specific challenge it then that tribal didn't matter' it's really not the same game (

I fell behind a bit on the show but got all caught up this week ; what a wonderful episode , in a wonderful season. So many great cast members this year, Christian, Gabby ( She is totally an elf! I agree with whoever came up with that, or maybe shes a pixie :) ) Mike is great on screen, John seems like a very down to earth guy for a celebrity. I also think this cast really plays well off each other. I didn't love Dan at first, but his interaction with Christian and John is entertaining, and gotta give him points for good game play with the second idol. in so far as he knew to get out and look right away and used his existing knowledge of what to look for to his advantage. Of course, finding idols and using idols well are not the same thing. Even Natalie and Angelina were 'entertainingly evil' last night ; the contrast to Dan Foley is strong for me, with him I didn't want to see or hear from him. When he was on screen , I just wanted to skip the scene. His desperate need to write his own character for all eternity was not enjoyable to watch. Angelina was really mercenary in her focus on getting herself a jacket but also clever enough to get Natalie to do the dirty work. Natalie's abrasiveness seems to come from ego / arrogance; .Angelina made use of those very traits to make Natalie her patsy , and Natalie's absolute certainty that she could do no wrong blinded her to the fact that she got used. This was good TV, I enjoyed watching it play out , I really wasn't certain who was going which makes me happy :) Also, thanks to everyone chiming in I now know more about eggs then I ever did before

Sweet, Im from Calgary :) Unfortunately, I can see John going right after the merge. Like you say, as soon as his alliance feels they dont need him, they will see him as a challenge threat and get booted. Thinking about the first challenge , the physical part seemed pretty scripted ; didn't really leave any room for Parkour + Creative thinking to present a unique solution. I wonder if for liability reasons they are required to structure the physical challenges and not allow much out of the box solutions. I think it would be great to see some challenges that are more free form and let the teams create their own solutions.

Thank you , I really appreciate you taking the time to explain this. Of all the possible reasons to have so many stage names, I would not have guessed it was copy write related. I did a little reading about the Lucha Underground, never heard of it before this, its interesting how different leagues have different approaches to the story telling. I remember Bret Hart for sure, I actually think he is from my city, but I might be mis remembering that. Looking forward to cheering for him on the Goliath team. re-watched the episode last night with my wife and she laughed at his antics as well. He's got so many years working in front of a live crowd and improvising to entertain I bet those skills will help him gel with his tribe. His Achilles heel could be calories, but there have been many contestants that had strong builds and didnt collapse from lack of calories

Thanks for this list; so far I like this guy and I hope he keeps entertaining. and I hope he has more names to list off, haha. I also appreciate the quick run down on how Wrestling works ; I was vaguely aware that it is more athletic entertainment then genuine athletic competition but never really knew what was determined before hand. Quick wrestling question if you don't mind , why does he have so many different names ? is that a common thing these days ? When I watched as a kid we had guys like Hulk Hogan, Jake the Snake, The Undertaker ... as far as I recall they only had one stage name, but maybe I am mis remembering . Thanks

found that list, thank you. some of those names are hilarious . I hope he does more lists on the show,

Hi Everybody :) lurked here last season , decided to join the conversation this season as shows are funner when you have folks to talk about them with :) Overall great first episode. Several things that I loved specifically - 90 minutes without trying to jam two eliminations into it was a great way to introduce everyone. I noticed that so many different folks got their own talking head , but I didnt count. cool to know everyone got to say something. - interesting contrast between Pat and Natalie. Pat asked his team who had building skills, then took the lead as he was confident in his abilities . Natalie seemed like she tried to take the lead because she was insecure in her ability to contribute physically. In both cases their decision to make themselves a leader was noticed by their tribes but Pat's leadership was more accepted because of the results , where as Natalie didn't create tangible results so it seemed like she may have created more resentment. I do respect that Natalie did her best to bring her strengths to the build, she feels her leadership is the most valuable thing she has to contribute so she tried to lead. - I think I'm going to love Christian, unless I end up hating him lol. I know folks like him in real life and they are some of my closest friends, folks that I can go PURE nerd on and they match me word for word, with their own enthusiasm and nerdyness. My only hesitation is I got the briefest impression that he might be somewhat 'in character' when he was doing his talking heads. either way I think Im going to enjoy him on screen -Mr Wrestler and all his names; It like , hes a bit pompous , but hes self aware about being pompous , which makes it charming . His self awareness was great and I got a good vibe from him. Remember Debbie who always had a different job title for her talking heads ? I think it would be great if they used those wrestler names during his talking heads like Johnny ' Tushie' Mondo onetime then Johnny ' America' Mondo the next time and on and on . ( I dont remember the exact names ) Regarding the theme, mixed feelings. I find many of the themes forced and dont add much . I thought it was funny when Jeff 'randomly' picked two folks to ask about their backgrounds to help us understand the division. I did wonder how that would play out if he had asked Christian about his background compared to Allison, looking forward to the season so far,