Nanda

But obviously Owen feels superior to Riggs not the same. A guy who cheated on every single of his women! I remember him telling Cristina that his affair had been 'only sex' and was a 'mistake and every one could make mistakes. Now, with Riggs the tune is different, why on earth doesn't he sees what Riggs did to his sister as just sex and as a mistake, since himself is a serial cheater!!! When we are on the other end of the stick the thing tastes different. I don't know why this guy distances himself moraly from everyone, he feels he's above everyone independently of every sh*t he does. His behaviour is absurd. Honestly I don't know what the show is trying to do with this character, he's ruined beyond redemption.

Although at the time I too felt Crowen dinamic was unconfortable, many pieces didn't fit, I also felt it very rrrrrrromantic. Silly me! In the end nothing in that relashionship was healthy, they were quite toxic. ;)

RachelKM, I felt I wasn't contradicting myself. What I meant was, Amelia was in her right to not want such a task due to her own intrinsic fragility, due to her need and obligation to protect herself from down spiral, and this isn't selfisness it's a right one have. After all they are not married, dating is precisely for people to know each other and see if there's a possible future together. Note that I didn't call Amelia selfish but self-centered which are not the same nor did I acuse her of lack of character. As I was saying, although she was in her right to not want it, just like cristina, we can't fail to notice the difference in attitude between the two. Cristina shouldn't have attempted such a dangerous task either, but she did it anyways. And we all know how her neck suffered in his hands. She was markedly more courageous than Amelia and maybe loved or wanted him more IDK. I think the thoughts are not incompatible. Nor Cristina. If we are talking of a person who didn't have skills set or emotional tools to save Owen we are talking about Cristina. She made great progress over the time but she was emotionally atrophied. She used to work on a more superficial level regarding human relations bc she couldn't cope with the feelings . She was deeply wounded due to stress factors of her young years and to jump to such a demanding relationship, with such a demanding man was huge for her. So, IMO it's not fair comparing Cristina to a experienced swimmer while comparing Amelia to a person who can barely tread water. Amelia is a neurosurgeon, one of a hell demanding job and she hangs in there . Which means that she isn't a hothouse flower. Overall, what caught my atention was that Cristina stepped inside the bathtube and Amelia stepped out of the caravan and run for her life. Should she have done that? yes. Should Cris have done the same at the time? yes, he needs professional help, he has to recognize it first and then not to give up of therapy when he takes his women for granted. It's not their job to cure him with their love. But as I said in the end of the day Cristina tried, Amelia didn't. Cristina did overcome her doubts and fears bc she was thinking about him, Amelia didn't bc she was thinking about her. But thinking things in terms of herself it's her. Self-centered not necessarily selfish. Our human nature can't miss this even if there is a more complex explanation.

LOL. Hope I didn't traumatized you ;) I read your comparison btw Amelia and Cristina. Only ex-Crowen fans could notice the difference btw them so sharply as us :) When I saw the scene I thought : wow, what a stark difference btw these two!!! well, Owen do you really prefer kids with Amelia over Cris with no kids? But, no other woman will replicate the glamour that Cris offer to that relationship, ever. ​That said, I agree that Amelia shouldn't have stayed babysitting Owen nor should have Cristina, but this one had the balls to do it and felt he was worth it. Amelia clearly doesn't. Her thought process is always around her, she's insufferably self-centered, so it was not a surprise she reacted this way. Not that this time she is awfully wrong bc she needs to protect herself since she finally was made aware that Hunt is another energy sucking pit just like her. Because they are so alike she recognized the energy and run terrified. She she has struggled to know Hunt deeper for a long time unsuccefully bc everyone has been denying her acess to information. He has been keeping her at arms lenght, Mer refuses her information out of loyalty to Cristina and now she saw with her own eyes the real Owen. The truth and the reality that two messes may not be together was unbearable. Yes two different reactions from two different women.

I honestly don't remember anyone arguing that Owen had zero rights! I remember he trying to force her hand into keeping the baby against her will and then when he didn't get the last word, cheating on her out of revenge. I perceived that he felt that HE had zero rights bc he didn't overrule her. At the time what people were arguing was if she did take into consideration his opinion and proceeded with the abortion or not. She did take his opinion into consideration, she informed him about the pregnancy (she could avoid many problems with him but she chose to be honest), she gave him time to process the issue, she took time herself to process de issue in Mer's house, but in the end it was her decision. And it was that what enraged him and many fans who felt that she should have kept the child against herself and he should have had the last word. As he didn't have the last word the poor little thing had zero rights. Of course the father has the right to discuss the matter, give his opinions, show his feelings about the subject but in the end his the woman who decides her body's destiny NOT the man. We are not slaves nor animals owned by a master. Hence why that jackass wasn't allowed the asinine behavior he displayed afterwards. The problem I see here with April and Jackson is that I'm not sure April is not acting out of a feeling of pride, hurt or revenge or all of them. I felt the writers were dying to put her saying: you're not my husband, you have no saying in this. They were itching to create drama. Of course he's entitled to the middle ground of his opinion to be heard.

Why? I honestly don't understand why he wasn't entitled to a meltdown after what happened to him! That didn't make him gay, made him human. By this way of thinking, if I understood well, I find curious that no one in the show asked if Emily was gay or Bi! She speaks, walks, reacts emotionaly like a man (if we are stereotyping), has strong angular features, big nose, even her voice was masculine. She even didn't know how to cut the bread?!!! That one seems and walks like a duck. And no one seemed to question that!

Although may exist personal motives for one to hide his/her sexual orientation, overall I agree. In a country where same-sex mariage is legal why choose a woman to marry instead of another guy if he's gay?! Especialy in a liberal zone of the country as is where he lives. He could even raise a family there, i guess. Adoption , surrogate... So why put himself up for serious troubles in the future and run the risk his parents and everyone discover in the worst way? I don't get it!

Honestly, to me he didn't look like a duck at all! He struck me as a refined young man. That's why so many felt, me included, the insinuation came out of the blue and was certainly planted. I believe the editing with his friend was done like that on purpose to create sensationalism. I felt his friend was caught off guard. Who wouldn't if a verbal incontinent would have made a question like that in such a direct manner? I would be speechless! Maybe North American society is different from mine here in Europe. Here, she probably wouldn't be invited again, that's for sure. Put unhinged on that! If John looked like dark, this one seems kind of psycho. Now, we know why she's single.

I just saw the last episode and I'm asking myself why on earth was that gorgeousness of Mitch paired with that oddball of Emily who looks like his mother or his trans brother? I'm boggled! At first I thought there was something seriously wrong with her personality but as we had the chance to see more, it seemed more and more that she was a fake. That's why we saw him more and more puzzled with her. All that mistery around her is now explained. Thanks helloitsme, for posting that pearl. A wannabe actress. In his last talk to her he was totally right in everything he said. He was right expecting some loyalty from his wife. But that one is not marriage material. Now we see why she never wanted her family involved, she was never in it for the long haul. It was all a scheme, production connived. Emily, the production and her friend were all in it. Emily and her friend needed the 15 minutes to enhance their meteoric 'acting careers'. The editing was cheaply done to create drama around Mitch's sexuality. The guy is not gay, he's a metrossexual. I've seen more than my share of people mixing both types like if a man cares for his hair and his looks and doesn't spits on the ground, or does not beat his wife, or does not smell like horse he's gay! He seemed to be a very genuine guy who felt very natural and confortable in his skin and well mannered aswell. That's not 'gayness'. This was all fabricated in my opinion. And now after the show she gave she wants more air time and comes out trying to denigrate him. WOW! That only reiforces the cow she really is. Run Mitch run, you can do better than that, just be patient. You got lucky to get rid of her..and...used. Sorry. What wife in this world listening her friends humiliating her husband would not take a stand for him?! Only a cold cow. She seemed more interested in her friends than in her husband. She didn't support him, she didn't say to her filthmouth friend to tuck her tongue in her bag! She even refused to go back with him! What was there to chose?! Honestly everything seemed stagged. And then, four days without saying a word? Only a saint to endure such a thing and even wanting a clean slate and a new try with her?!. Poor guy! When he sat as an adult to talk and pointed out to her the obvious, she not only refused to admit any wrong, as she tried to turn the tide in her favor. Yeah, it was not his feelings which mattered, it was all about her, about her poor feelings!!! She couldn't even articulate, she didn't made sense at all bc she hadn't nothing to use in her defense thus the smirking. I can't say if she looked like as an insane brat or an emotionaly stunt idiot. He was right her speech didn't make sense at all as her behaviour. She's a self-serving egotistical piece.

By the same token Cris' absense (or absense of being mentioned) is jarring only when we see Merdith in situations where Cris really should be there or being mentioned. Cristina isn't in the show anymore but she's not dead. Look, you've the right to have your point of view which doesn't make it the universal truth neither does mine. I see Amelia as a blatant replacement of Cristina... and it is OK. What is not OK for me is the actress and the character. It's not a big deal, it is called a difference of opinion. You stand by yours and I stand by mine. We've to agree to disagree. End of it.

I'm sorry but I don't understand what is going on with all this 'doubleness'. I think I'm the second poster to get the post deleted when editing today too. ETA: I think I could fix the double or triple post.

I apologize because I didn't express myself properly. What I meant was that Cris wasn't physically present in this ordeal contrary to what happened in Derek's funeral. And that's kind of the point. Mer could have died and nothing from or to Cristina? If the show tried to make the point that Mer is enlarging her village beyond Cristina by integrating other people, they failed epically because, they forgot to include Cristina in the said village. We hadn't to see Cristina in Seattle, just a mention of her, but Amelia was much more important. We had to endure her ranting about how she felt, and how a 'victim' she was ( not Mer) but not even a single word about a woman that was so important in Mer's life. Cris is past , Amelia the future. But the audience could. The other Docs aren't deaf nor is Alex. And absolutely no one, including Alex in that last talk with Mer, not making a remark about Cristina seems very implausible to me unless there's an agenda behind. To me it seems Shonda's cutting with the past once and for all even if that means to shut down the assumption upon the show was based (Mer and Cris were the love story of the show). And that is not new. Since the minute Amelia entered the show she already had her suit tailored, it was too obvious she was there to replace Cristina as Owen's lover and Mer's sister to the point of hurting the eyes. They even have chosen a feisty actress to not risk her not measure up to Sandra and her Cristina. Pity they couldn't recreate the same excitement Crowen elicit once as couple. The writers out of imagination or maybe not, copied all Crowen love scenes to the level of stupidity and made Owen and Amelia reproduce them to the level of embarrassment. In the current SL, they resurrected Owen's PTSD, and we've Amelia wanting to know, to help, to be included and of course being left out, excluded by him just like he used to do with his ex-wife. Different character same tune. I can't blame anyone to not pay attention to this SL. The proof that Amelia is trying to fight for a place next to Mer as her sister is the current SL which has started last season. After Cristina left someone had to take that role. Alex did but just partially . Shonda needs a woman bc for her, a relationship btw women are more valuable.God damn does the chosen one had to be that insufferable piece of insignificance? And hereupon I've to congratulate the poster that had the courage to point out that Amelia is not only a rehab addict, she's a narcissist. Maybe not to a full content but I agree the way the writers are writing her here on Grey's that she shows traits of this personality disorder. Fully agree.

Keep dreaming. The overall message of the episode, if I understood correctly, was that Mer doesn't have just one person (Cris), she has a village (Alex, all the other docs...and...dear Amelia). I think that since Sandra Oh left, Shonda has been itching to make this transition. Leaving Cristina in the past. And as you saw, Cristina wasn't definately there for Mer as in the funeral of Derek. Who was there? The others and Amelia who came to the show to substitute Cristina. Not even a mention to her soulmate???!!! So, she's not going anywhere soon, to my chagrin.

At this point I'm not sure if you're writing to me anymore bc I never said I think he's a monster. In fact I've stated several times that I don't think he's purely evil or the worst man in the universe. I understand he's human and has human flaws. However some flaws impact more some people while they don't have that much importance for others. His flaws irritates me more than other characters and I recognize they have them too. Why? Because I relate to Cristina therefore to her SL, including her mates and bc they collide with life values I hold as important. That's why I analyze him more closely than others. He's in my aim bc of that. And the fact that other characters might also be flawed doesn't mean he his allowed to flaunt his bc if one of the other characters would throw himself to a pit he wouldn't follow him for sure. We don't have to score the bar by the lowest point. Yes, writers gave the impression that he was a self-righteous hero criticizing and belittling others around, and KMK portrayed his character as being exactly that, and then they deconstructed the character to the ground, to the point of him being the opposite he was shown to be at the beginning. We didn't need him to be a hero, just a normal guy who's growing up through his ordeals. Instead we get a chauvinist in his 40's stuck in his teens who refuses to grow up and treats women repeatedly like sh*t behind a caring, kind, sweet puppy eyes facade. We can't be blamed for seeing him under the light the writers wrote him for 'scandal'(drama) purposes! No, he's not a rapist, murderer and we're not evaluating him from the psychopath point of view but he's far from being good mate material and it's from that point that I evaluate him. As a man he lets a lot to desire, he lacks. And, of course I agree to disagree. That's why we're here and why it's fun.

I don't see he drowning his sorrows in a productive way I see him recurrently fleeing from facing his problems. And for me that's not the way to grow to maturity. I see that as a problem, as in fact he recognized in his talk with Amelia. It's the first step finally! Fleeing or taking drugs are two different ways of not facing reality, of making people dwell in the safe Neptunian haze of unreality. They're both unhealthy. Obviously that drugs add another layer of unhealthy. Physically. And yes, the feeling of being needed can be very addictive for some, therefore very rewarding. But once more makes me very suspicious about that selfless/hero mode they throw consistently in our direction.