SmashleyMcSlayin

Agreed, Roxanne has probably had a temper like this her whole life and therefore might not be sure how to manage anger when it comes up. But it should also be common sense to not blow up in a restaurant where other people are eating, in front of your young grandchild. A lot of people do argue in front of children though, so I recognize it isn’t quite as common sense as I’d like it to be.

Wow, I just got to Jenelle’s ceremony and you guys weren’t kidding about how dumb her veil looked.

Roxanne: “I don’t wanna be like that!” Then... don’t be like that?

Elizabeth’s head is like an unmashed potato

Wtf. Maybe she should take a break from guys since she gets pregnant any time a dude looks at her.

Waiting til the day before the wedding to lay a fuckton of sod. These people are so bright.

Does she have the intellectual capacity to track her cycles? Hell, I know she had May, but does she actually understand where babies come from?

Abuse is certainly one pathway by which people can come by BPD, but not the only way. What we refer to as an “invalidating environment” is the main pathway, and what this means is that the individual’s feelings and beliefs are made to feel untrue or questionable as a result of their environment and the people in it. Abuse can fall under that umbrella of an invalidating environment (e.g., sexual abuse by a family member - “I’m supposed to feel safe with this person but he hurt me”). Same with abandonment, and remember that Jenelle’s father left when she was young (“he’s supposed to love me but he left”). The invalidating environment can take other forms, such as a parent reacting badly when the child expresses emotions (e.g., “man up,” “stop crying or I’ll give you something to cry about”). I could believe that Barb might have created an invalidating environment for Jenelle in some ways. So you’re correct that most individuals with BPD have suffered abuse, but even if Jenelle experienced no physical or sexual abuse, I’m not dubious at all about her probably meeting criteria for the diagnosis. I have seen more than a few patients in my practice who have BPD and report no abuse background.

I read an article stating that Karine cheated with someone named Alex and that Pole and Karine have broken up. Anyone else heard this? https://www.google.com/amp/realityblurb.com/2017/10/13/before-the-90-day-fiance-paul-and-karine-break-up-update-spoiler/amp/

That’s true, they often occur together, or as I said above, the person may qualify for a diagnosis of one PD and also demonstrate features of others. As another poster said, PDs are grouped into clusters A, B, and C based on similarities between the diagnoses. NPD and BPD are both cluster B and thus can have a lot of similarity and overlap.

I would disagree with the poster above who describes Jenelle as dependent PD. Certainly she has features of that diagnosis, but her behavior is better explained by a diagnosis of borderline, which is characterized by idealization and devaluation of others (viewing them as either all good or all bad with little in between). Notice how there are times when she gets along fine with Barb and her boyfriends but can so quickly flip the switch to fighting with them and hating them. Other BPD symptoms: Impulsive/risky behavior, angry outbursts, identity confusion, mood swings. Sound familiar? Most people with personality disorders exhibit features of more than one, so again, Jenelle does have dependent PD features but it’s really not the best explanation for her behavior.

I definitely think that, as things stand now, you’re correct. My point is moreso that I think she’s an intelligent girl in a lot of ways, so if she was more self aware, she could make some major changes. But she’s not, so she won’t.

I’m a therapist and also believe she is borderline (obviously I’m not diagnosing someone I’ve never met, just my opinion). People with BPD are one of my favorite populations to work with because they can make huge progress when they really try. I wish Jenelle was motivated to make some changes. I think she could do really well in life if she would get some real help and take responsibility for herself.

There’s a whole forum for Before the 90 Days, bet you’d enjoy!

That’s exactly right. It’s how the system works. If everyone got reported because they’d maybe abuse their kids, CPS would be running around like chickens with their head a cut off (which, honestly, they already do) unable to assist children in truly dire circumstances, and a lot of people would be unnecessarily accused. And I am also sorry for what happened to you, orangeiguana. I can understand how the situation might make you really angry and emotional given your experience.

Except it wouldn’t be. As a mandated reporter, I can tell you that the criteria for CPS to investigate are pretty specific, and Molly moving in a boyfriend doesn’t meet the standard. There has to be some evidence of abuse or neglect: kids not being fed, allegations of sexual contact, bruising or other evidence of physical violence, etc.

I just think it’s a really dangerous mindset. In Evelyn’s situation, she went to Europe specifically to meet David, so I think she probably would’ve proceeded with the k1 process, sex or no sex, because she’s naive and thinks he’s her soulmate. I too think there’s value in teaching young people to wait until they’re mature enough to have sex, but I think pushing them to wait until they’re married is unrealistic. After I broke my engagement to the king of the douches, I decided I wasn’t waiting anymore because I had no idea when I’d get married and didn’t want to put myself in the same position again of having my judgment compromised about a potential marriage. I didn’t get married until I was 28 and was glad I didn’t feel in a rush anymore. I admit that sex is a dumb thing to rush into a marriage for, but well, young people can be dumb. I sure was. Better to teach them to be safe and smart about sex.

God, what a nightmare that would’ve been.

Thanks, me too. Certainly it can work the other way. I just sort of have a hate-on for purity culture given my experience, and I also think it gave me some hangups that continue to impact me at times in my (very wonderful!) marriage today.

The whole purity culture is disturbing to me, particularly as someone who grew up to believe I shouldn’t have sex until marriage. I ended up engaged at 22 to an abusive man. He didn’t become overtly abusive until after the engagement although there were red flags before, but “having” to wait for marriage to have sex caused me to ignore them and forge ahead. I don’t think no sex til marriage is the only driving force for Evelyn to do the K1, as that’s one of the only ways for her and David to be consistently together rather than doing a long distance relationship. But I think, as many other posters have said, that the sex is a big part of that, and it makes me sad given the experience I had. Edit: I should clarify that I did NOT marry the guy. Dodged a bullet there.

I don’t get the impression that she wants or enjoys being submissive but rather that she is so obsessed with this guy that she’ll do anything to be with him. She’s one of these naive, insecure young girls who is desperate to be in a relationship, and Andrrrei being a sexy mysterious (in her mind) European increases his appeal and her desperation. He could probably start doing all kinds of shitty abusive things and she’d stay with him.

Someone posted this on the 90DF Facebook, pretty good

I first read this as “marijuana sauce”

I really can’t imagine David yelling “feed me.” I can see him yelling a lot of things, but not that.

I think he does have a lower IQ but he also strikes me as someone who could potentially fall on the autism spectrum (awkwardness, trouble understanding social cues/situations, difficulty empathizing) with some social anxiety thrown in. (I’m a therapist)