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PAForrest

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Everything posted by PAForrest

  1. The MOMENT? Jeez, what was that supposed to be? Or was it mysteriously cut? Talk about delusion. Yeah, she does seem more than a little disingenuous at this point. Either she had a come to Jesus moment in her life, or she decided her shipping wasn't a good look for writing articles about fandom. For a long time I thought we (one-time shipper) might at best get - and it would have been best, honestly - a due South-like ending. Two friends hit the road on an adventure. Maybe Sam gets married and goes back to school or takes over the Bobby role, cAsstiel becomes human and decides to ride shotgun in the Impala to become a full-fledged hunter. With an ending along those lines - doesn't have to be that, but something like it - Destielers could fantasize and write fan fiction to their heart's content, and everyone else (like the regular viewing audience) could take it all at face value. Everyone is happy. Of course, that was when we had some decent writers, and there was a LOT more between the guys than there is now - one-sided declarations of BFF'ing notwithstanding.
  2. Probably would be, especially since I got the feeling she was still slightly pushing Destiel in this article at the same time she's slapping hands. Hm. But there are a lot of good points, and the bottom line is that it's all fun and games until the shipping fandom becomes as militant as neo-Nazis walking the streets with tiki-torches and AK-47s. There's a reason Destiel fandom is often referred to now as DestiHell. ITA that Misha bears a chunk of responsibility for riling up this particular faction of fandom, to point that they not only spend too much of their free time bashing Dean for not being a good submissive boyfriend, but also Jensen as if he is wholly in charge of whether or not Destiel becomes canon. For Chuckles' sake, if the man could get what he wanted for his character or the show overall, the series probably wouldn't be ending this year. I agree that the producers never technically baited Wincest, but I do believe we have enough instances in the early seasons where they make fun of it. Like when the guys are checking into the hotel in season 2's Playthings and the woman thinks they're a gay couple; or in season 3's A Very Supernatural Christmas when Dean insinuates that Sam is gay (and likely his BF) and is wanting a special wreath to decorate with when they're trying to track down a certain pagan plant; and then of course in season 4's The Monster at the End of This Book when Sam discovers the slash fandom about them and Dean disgustingly asks if those fans understand that they're brothers. Those examples are just off the top of my head, I'm sure there are a few more. The point being that Kripke and the writers knew about Wincest and, IMO, they'd periodically make fun of it. But they certainly never intended that it would become a real thing. In fact, I believe Jim Michaels shut down a Wincester hard at a con several years ago, essentially telling her she was delusional.
  3. In as much as there is a "writers room", which is not really, not since it was eliminated during Gamble's reign. If there was, they'd be talking to each other - but they don't. But yeah, Singer certainly gave Eugenie license to call shots along with Dabb the last few years. But it's obvious Dabb saw Berens as his second in command, and this season that role appears to have become official. They were the duo who were going to go off and conquer the CW with their spin-off - except in the end, not so much. Which, if you think about it, is a really damning statement from Pedowitz and the network that hands out spin-offs like they were 20% Off Bed, Bath, & Beyond coupons. Pedowitz tries very hard to keep fan bases from genre series to genre series, and there is no bigger fan base than that of Supernatural. And yet, it's clear he never had any interest in staying in the Dabb and Berens business, even though he knows he'll lose a goodly chunk of the fan base, if not most of it. Sure, Pedowitz is hoping that some fans will stick around to try JP's Walker, but it won't be the same. I think this time Singer will finally officially retire.
  4. I don't think Kripke is going to have anything to do with the finale, sadly. He's moved on. I believe Singer and Dabb ran the idea by him, he said fine, whatever, but Kripke's focus is on what he's doing right now. And that is disappointing because his name is still attached to the show and he still receives money from it. I understand he doesn't want to look backward, but this show will be his legacy whether he likes it or not, and you'd think he'd want it to go out strong. And it won't with Dabb and Berens driving the entire narrative. If they were good at their jobs, we'd be getting seasons 16/17. But I do think it says everything that when Danneel told Jensen to talk to someone about his concerns for the finale, he called Kripke, and not the current usual suspects.
  5. I honestly don't have a feeling one way or the other as to Dean dying or living. All I know is Jensen didn't like the ending, and I too feel like he'd be okay with Dean dying if it was a truly heroic death. If it was a stupid meaningless death, no, he'd hate that - and frankly so would the wider viewing audience. I know he kept his mouth shut and went along with the ending since everyone else seemed okay with it, but if Dabb came right out and pitched Dean dying a meaningless death, I'd think Jensen would have said something. There are other scenarios Jensen wouldn't like, but I just don't know what to think right now other than the fact that Jensen wasn't happy.
  6. Agreed. Most if not all of my fandom friends are ones who loved Castiel for years, loved the one-time relationship between Dean and Cas - be it shipping or simple friendship. But the bloom on the character has also been wilting for a few years, and now it's become white hot hatred. And they're all sad about that, but it is what it is. They despise the character and this is how we're going to go out of the series feeling. In fact, I'm now at the point where I think Sera Gamble was probably right, Castiel should have been written out in season six/seven. Her motivations were crap, and the way she tried to do it was worse. But hindsight being 20-20, I now feel like the character would have fared much better to have been eliminated after season five.
  7. I like your werecats idea. Totes adorbs! But, sure, I guess they were vamps, though I'm not sure Berens was entirely married to what monster they'd turned into. Either way, the guys thought it was silly and acted accordingly. LOL! However, you're absolutely right about the fact that whatever they turned into, Dean and Sam would have immediately done everything they could to either cure themselves, and failing that, would have tried to kill themselves or gone to Jody and/or Bobby to have one of them do it for them. No way in hell would they have chosen to remain monsters nor fight against the hunters trying to end them. That is what should have tipped off Sam that nothing Chuckles showed him could be trusted. He knows himself and Dean too well to buy that scenario.
  8. And if you focus mostly on Jensen, he was excellent in this episode - certainly better than the writing deserved, which is par for the course. I didn't dislike the brother moments either - loved the whole "Dean raised me" line. Thank you, it's about time! I didn't have any real problem with Jared's acting the way some folks did, especially in comparison to Asstiel walking around with a stick up his butt the entire time, even after Dean apologized. I also don't understand why Asstiel didn't go looking for Dean after supposedly being an off-screen badass. Was he really going to be that pissy that he'd trap them there forever if Dean didn't go looking for him? Seriously dude? Yeah, the Leviathans are after you - they're after Dean too. You still had to get out of there WITH Dean. Way not to be badass at all. Benny deserved a whole lot better than an off screen death. Waaaaaaaaah!!!!! I knew Ty wasn't going to be available for this episode, but Berens did him wrong regardless. Boo. I don't understand at all why Sam or anyone is supposed to believe what Chuckles showed Sam was definitive given the fact that Chuckles was rewriting what the hell ever just a few weeks ago at Becky's. Sam should have known that nothing he saw was written in stone - or even on paper. The one personal note of squee I got out of Chuckles' time trip was the fact that this particular Dean and Sam storyline ended on my birthday. LOL! Rob, of course, is playing this thankless role to the hilt, and I applaud his ability to make Chuckles watchable from appearance to appearance despite the character trashing. When Sam kissed Eileen at the end, it was literally the first time I detected a spark of chemistry between them. Is she supposed to come back? Of course, now that Jackie Poo Sue is returning, I guess the brothers can just go to Tijuana or some place to hang. Obviously they won't really be needed anymore. And I totally think the Js simply could not take the whole brothers as werewolves thing seriously at all. You can't blame them.
  9. When he first came back from the Empty, there was an expectation that it might not really be Castiel. Of course, that went nowhere, per usual, and he just further deteriorated into being a complete ass, and that was that. But if we had real writers with any kind of vision, it would have made so much sense that the real Castiel was dead and what came back was something different. Still sad to lose the friendship Dean and Cas used to have, and certainly still don't, but a storyline with some kind of possibility.
  10. I agree with you and everyone else who have pointed out how Castiel's weak shit apologies in this scenario were chock full of "but"s and qualifiers from the jump, and so completely devoid of understanding or compassion for the pain his supposed friend was in given the murder of his mother, that they are rendered moot. And that's especially baffling given that Cas very much bears some fault for the heinous act that was the slaughtering of Mary Winchester. But he never owned up to his part in this person's death - and worse was never expected to, not by the writing, by the other characters, and certainly not by his fans. His biggest concern was always for Jack, the person who did the slaughtering, and never Dean or Mary. Of course Dean was always expectd to be the one person, the one and only man in this one-sided not-so-much relationship, that was going to have to apologize for no other reason than being human and having real emotions a normal person would have. And putting aside the writer's intentions, probably the biggest reason Dean is always the one who is forced to give these speeches is because Jensen is pretty much the only actor who can. And he nails it every single time, even now when the writing is entirely one-dimensional, sans anything remotely resembling shades or layers. Metatron was right about our resident angel - he's Asstiel. And that's sad to me because at one time I really liked the character, and I liked when he and Dean had a real relationship that was give and take on both sides. But that died a few years ago, and now it's reduced to one giving guy giving it his all, and the other guy taking and mostly not caring. I hate that.
  11. Good idea! And soooooo pretty! Pretty sure that's Alec, but it can also totally serve as a young Dean Winchester. Swoon!
  12. Unfortunately since fanservice for a very select few appears to be all these very weak-willed producers are wont to do, I'd no longer discount some pulled out of the ass Destiel-adjacent ending, which would very much suck in the hands of these producers/showrunners. And I say that as someone who long ago used to be a huge fan of Destiel. But at the same time I come from the old school of slash fiction where one didn't expect fan fiction to become canon. I mean, seriously, if you're looking for a canonical gay relationship to invest in, then watch a show that has a canonical gay relationship. They're out there, so why aren't you watching them? There are reasons I'm no longer a fan of Destiel, but primarily it's the fact that, as you said, these two guys don't really have a relationship anymore, and haven't for years. There's nothing special between them short of being two characters, among a variety of characters, who are on the same show. So yes, if Dabb decided to throw in some kind of Destiel-adjacent ending, it would very much come out of nowhere and be all weird. Which is probably why he'd do it because anything he does is going to be weird.
  13. I'm confused, I thought an Arrow spin-off was a done deal? Also I didn't hear about Melissa Benoist possibly not renewing her contract. Granted I don't keep up with those shows anymore, so I'm out of the loop. I do know some Smallville fans who are jazzed about the Supes & Lois series. The CW is a little baffling in the way they mass renew lots of series year after year that have no ratings at all - I mean like practically negative number ratings. And others, like iZombie, had to fight to stay on every year, or were canceled after a year, like Carver's Frequency. I sometimes wonder if Frequency was canceled because Carver himself lost interest and wanted to move onto Doom Patrol. He's also a consulting producer on Prodigal Son, so he's not wanting for work. I agree the CW is Walker's best shot for staying on the air. Yes, Pedowitz made it very clear he'd greenlight any series the Js wanted to work on, but I think Jensen is wanting to move on from the network. Of course, never say never.
  14. I think it's probably just a way to get Dean and Cas off screen for most of the episode since I'm assuming what passes for a plot will focus on Chuckles, Samantha, and Eileen. If the Drowning vid is any indication, Cas will find the stupid flower thing in about 20 seconds, and they'll skip back to the bunker to have a beer. Luckily The Good Place has returned, the spousal unit and I watch that together, so I have to dvr the episode anyway. This is one I'll need to read the reviews for first. Forewarned and all.
  15. Since the Js (most likely Jensen) pulled the plug on Dabb's watch, even if especially while they were being courted by Pedowitz to stay, I always thought the unsaid caveat about being open to coming back for a tv movie or whatever was that Dabb would not be involved. In Jensen's mind, probably almost none of the current production staff would be involved. I mean, you don't come right out and tell fans you'd love to bring back writers from the past for a last season if you're super duper happy with the staff you have. But, oh boy, I've said it over and over and over again that Dabb resented the hell out of the show, which is why he's scorching the earth on his way out the door. You don't refer to your current job as a "problem" if you love it. He doesn't, and that's what I don't understand about Dabb's fans. Forget the mind-numbing superficiality and just plain ol' bad writing, zero canon and/or follow through. A lot of average viewers are perfectly happy with that. Just flip through your channel guide one day, it's obvious. But to love a showrunner who outright hates the show he's in charge of, one that you supposedly really like, is practically Orwellian.
  16. I half wonder if Benny is mentioned by Dean, but never actually seen. It's pretty much what I've been expecting, especially when Jensen talked about how hard it was for Ty to shoot the one day on episode #4 because he's so busy shooting other stuff. If Benny was in the episode, I'd think Jensen would have been more enthusiastic about it, because he loves Ty and the character. As it stands, this episode is not one of the 3-4 episodes Jensen has talked about liking.
  17. Yeah, the "kinda" makes it sound kinda-not really. Probably shooting in the same woods. Just as well because in the hands of Dabb and Berens, it wouldn't be good. Jensen did it best and it should probably end there.
  18. Gee, another J2 (especially Jensen) lite episode. And that's different from every other week, how?
  19. We already know Pedowitz doesn't care about Dabb or Berens or probably even Singer. If he did, he would have been a tad bit more interested in taking a chance on one of their piss poor spin-off attempts. But IMO I think Pedowitz had made it clear he was never genuinely interested in anything SPN-adjacent without the Js involved. Given that Pedowitz admitted there was more than one meeting with the guys trying to get them to change their minds, and with at least two more seasons on the table, you know someone had to have really reached his limit to say "no more".
  20. This all makes me sad. And it's all so in your face that Dabb fans really have to tap dance fast and furiously to try and explain away the blatant bias against this one character. It was pretty clear that Dabb's #1 goal as showrunner was to attempt to wipe out Dean's place in the universe, if not his popularity. And that's a really stupid counterintuitive position for a showrunner to take WRT a massively popular character without whom you wouldn't have the job of showrunner in the first place. Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face.
  21. Jensen has said more than once that his primary interest is in acting. Sure, he can do voice work and direction, and he'll do both again at some point. But he made it clear at one of the recent cons that the meetings in LA were for future acting roles.
  22. Even though it's past time, it did feel weird not to see Supernatural among the usual mass CW renewals. An online pal with some ties to folks in the industry stated, after the announcement was made, that were it not for the decision to call it quits, the CW had seasons 16 & 17 on the table for the show. Not surprising. While I'm excited to see what's next for Jensen, I know I'll miss Dean Winchester a lot. He'll always be one of my absolute favorite fictional characters, and that will never change.
  23. Evil is excellent, and it comes back tonight on CBS. Though given that the midseason finale ended on a cliffhanger (ack!), tonight's episode wouldn't be the best to start with. Got to go back and start at the beginning.
  24. Yeah, there are a lot of tables in that room, and the cameras usually focus on the ones toward the front because that's where the nominees and A-listers are sitting. I thought they probably just went to the parties, but I think the photo of him and KN was taken before the event started.
  25. We know part of the reason he was in LA was for meetings, which he stated earlier, at one of the recent cons, he was going to have. I'm certain the GG attendance and parties were indicative of networking, which is what he should be focused on now. I approve! And I do think the choice of studio parties was calculated. As for fashion, those two always look stunning, together and individually. Yeah, the see-through dress wasn't my favorite. However, Danneel rocked it, as very few women could. I loved Jensen's stylishly modern gray suit choice, and of course you can't go wrong with a basic black tux. Swoon!
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