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Celebrating 25 Years Of The West Wing

HalcyonDays

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    Ratings, Scheduling, and Watching for Cancellation/Renewal

    in Sleepy Hollow [V]

    From The Hollywood Reporter on Fox renewals:

     

    "Sources tell THR that talks are underway to bring back Sleepy Hollow."

     

    http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/lucifer-rosewood-renewed-second-seasons-881854

     

    mbjD3.gif

     

    Talks are good....talks are very good...(I still think they know). Basically, the final episode will make them decide whether to pull the trigger or not. If SH was truly done, they wouldn't bother with reporting about "talks".

     

    I think they're waiting to make the final decision until the finale airs tomorrow. I would feel more optimistic if they hadn't just renewed Lucifer. Plus, the last couple episodes have felt very final to me. 

     

    That's why everyone needs to watch the finale to boost those final numbers, tipping their hand in OUR favour.

     

    LOL Tom Mison is one snarky little shit LOL

     

    One of the reasons I love him.

    • Love 1

    Ratings, Scheduling, and Watching for Cancellation/Renewal

    in Sleepy Hollow [V]

    So basically you think the show is cancelled? That's depressing. *sigh*

     

    I'm wavering. My logical side is saying no while my hopeful optimistic side is saying yes. There is an argument for both TBH, but the logical is stronger. Makes me sad too, but you never know. Galavant was renewed by ABC even though low ratings (much lower than SH is now), and Forever was cancelled even though it was doing good. Both had other business reasons for the decision.

     

    There are a lot of pros for renewal:

     

    SH is 15 episodes away from syndication - FOX's other low-rated shows are all in the first year. FOX owns SH, which is a strong postive factor. They get Georgia filming tax incentives and have already spend the money to build the sets. Lucifer is dropping much more rapidly than expected (damn, I love that show), though both Lucifer and SH have good Live+7 DVR numbers. SH rises up to a 1.3-ish, aobut 4.6 million viewers. However, Lucifer bumps up to a 2.0-ish with ~6 million viewers. SH is on a Friday and doing fairly decent. SH apparently does really well overseas/in foreign markets. FOX has several pilots on the go, but who knows how many will survive. American Idol is finally done, so that is a lot of airtime that FOX needs to fill.

     

    And finally, because I think Campbell knew well in advance, I think that suddenly, he says there are cliffhangers boads well. I think he would have cut certain story lines to ensure proper closure of the show. His "I'm crossing my fingers, we'll know as soon as you know" BS is what it is to me - BS. The fact that certain storylines will be left open makes me do a double-take.

     

    I could (okay wish) see a 15-episode final season to allow syndication for the foreign markets.

    Beharie tweeting she didn't have to learn anymore lines.

    Interesting. When was this?

     

    A few weeks ago, when filming wrapped. She tweeted it out, got some panicky responses then quickly clarified "for the season". Tweets gone now though. I couldn't find it.

     

    ETA: Sorry, tumblr, not twitter. Tehateki got the post correct.

    • Love 1

    S03.E17: Delaware

    in Sleepy Hollow [V]

    I am such a big fat liar.  I sucked it up through the Tales! of! Katrina! that was S2...I surely can watch the finale.

     

    I will cut someone though if it is Danny & Abbie and SBR & Ich lurvefest and there is not another season.

     

    I haven't drank in about 9 years (alcohol no longer tasted good), but I might have to slam a bit of tequila to steel my nerves.

     

    Isn't that the bar to consider. We all suffered through Season 2's Katrina-mania. These season - and this episode - is nowhere near as hellish as that was. This episode was pretty decent actually.

     

    I'll have my wine (gonna treat myself to some good stuff) ready, as a farewell to the season and maybe even the show....

    • Love 3

    Ratings, Scheduling, and Watching for Cancellation/Renewal

    in Sleepy Hollow [V]

    HalcyonDays, what gave you a feeling that they already know which it is? Just interested in your thought processes.

     

    MissAlmond just gave an awesome example of when showrunners and stars know about it. Didn't know that about Mike and Molly, but not surprised.

     

    As for me, my thought processes involved just how most businesses may run and also some history for SH.

     

    Firstly, there are so many things that a network has to consider, in terms of budgeting and contract negotiations.  First, the obvious actor contracts. Most likely Mison and Beharie (and LG, etc) are in standard 5-year contracts. But is there an option that can kick in season 4? These things needs to be negotiated and figure into budget numbers. Same with the crew, directors, etc. All of these people need to be around for filming and cost a certain amount. FOX needs to know those costs up front. Then filming locations - do they have a one year lease in the building where their sets are? What about equipment leases? Some may be already determined longer term contracts, but then FOX - if they have to break these - would consider what are those costs? Or do they need to be renegotiated, which factor into the cost. Ad revenue is another very important factor. FOX isn't going to wait till the last minute in hopes that ad companies will give them higher ad revenue. SH has been bang on consistent in ratings up till week 15. FOX wants to determine ad revenue when ratings are good to determine how much money they will get. This is where the ratings come into play. This takes time and negotiating. Then they have to look at filming tax incentives for the State of Georgia. What do they get this year, how will this benefit the budget. Then things like HULU broadcast deals, revenue from foreign markets, syndication deals, etc all have to be considered. SH just needs 15 episodes to hit that syndication sweetspot, compared to the other shows, so it has that a bit in it's favour. Also, who owns the show? It makes a difference. FOX owns SH, which is a benefit because all profit goes straight to FOX, not a third-party.

     

    All these numbers are crunched to figure out how much the show will cost in a season, and how much it will revenue it will earn, and what profit - if any - it will get.

     

    SH isn't the only show FOX is doing this with right. Second Chance, Lucifer, The Grinder, Grandfathered, The Guide to Surviving Life and Bordertown are all shows that also need a decision made at this time. That means if any of the above are being considered, it also takes time to do the above. However, most of these shows are mostly likely gone. Bones and Bordertown are in the danger zone, and SH is closest to that danger zone. Bones is renewed (shortened season), but only because it's been on so long and syndication reasons. However at the same time they will look at their profitable shows and decide if SH can survive one more season, maybe take a small loss (made up by other shows) and go from there. They may also decide to take SH budget and apply it to The X-Files, for example. It's all a numbers-crunching game.

     

    Also, none of these cast and crew (especially the high up ones) and going to want to sit around collecting unemployment hoping to get a renewal. They want to be looking for a new job.

     

    The show ends April 8th. There is no way that FOX can do all of the above in one month, to be ready to announce at the upfronts.

     

    Now for some history. Last year, the day FOX announced Goffman was gone, and Cliff Campbell was showrunner was literally the same week. Same day I think. Cliff tweeted he was "back in the saddle" the same day FOX announced renewal. FOX sure as heck didn't call CC that day and ask him to be showrunner and he readily agreed. CC and HR have to sit down and discuss his contract and get him to sign it, all while they are interviewing other potential showrunners. Why would you look for a showrunner, if you don't even know if the show is renewed/cancelled? It's also why around the same time that ABC announced Goffman would have a multiple show deal there. Again, Goffman knew he needed to look for another job probably by December. He also had to find a spot, do multiple interviews and negotiate the contract, sign the paperwork etc etc.

     

    Lesser reasons - Beharie tweeting she didn't have to learn anymore lines. Mison chopping his hair. Most telling - Joe killed off. He should have been kept for season 4. Shernold Edwards is onto a new job already.

     

    Also, actors and showrunners are experts at lying about things. First, Zach Appelman stating he knew he was to be killed of this year all along. He could be lying, but I am sure he knew it. Notice that never was hinted at by any cast until he was killed off.

     

    Same with Mison - he was asked this year about doing stuff in the off-season. He claimed he was contractally not allowed. I don't believe it. After the end of season 1, he was asked the same thing. His reply? He said he'd love to do some theatre maybe, but was too exhausted and just wanted time off. Which one is correct? I would expect the actors unions to push the networks to allow them (TV actors in general) to film stuff in the off-season. As long as the network approved the project, and it didn't interfere with SH filming there is no reason he - nor Beharie - couldn't do some extra work. Also, Lyndie Greenwood DID three guest roles between 2014 and 2016. If she's allowed, so would Mison and Beharie.

     

    They know, they are just not allowed to say it. MissAlmond gives an excellent example of another show where that exact same thing happened. Hope this gives you an idea of why I think what I do and that it makes sense.

    • Love 1

    TWD Season 7 Anticipation - Evil Cliffhanger from Hell

    in S07

    Checking out this thread while there's still little chance of a serious spoiler ... Halcyon Days, I think those of us who prefer to stay spoiler free can just keep to the Speculation without Spoilers thread. Traffic there is usually pretty light. So I think it can absorb any spoiler-free Season 7 spec.

     

    Yeah, that's fine, if that's what everyone wants. If you guys want a completely separate Season 7 Speculation thread sans spoilers, I can do that too. Speculation without Spoilers does have less traffic, so it could stay there.

     

    As long as we do it in a way that help prevent spoilers, I'm good!

    • Love 1

    S02.E01: Monster - Pre-Air Speculation and Live-Chat

    in Fear The Walking Dead

    Here is your Pre-Air Speculation and Live Chat thread for S02.E01: Monster your commenting enjoyment!

     

    This thread will close at 10:00 pm, after which you can head on over to the episode thread S02.E01: Monster

     

    DO NOT post any Walking Dead spoilers in here. For any Walking Dead discussion, go HERE.

     

    Enjoy the episode, have fun commenting and as always, please be respectful and civil to your fellow commenters!

    S15.E13: 6 Chefs Compete

    in Hell's Kitchen

    Episode synopsis: The remaining six chefs must rely on their loved ones to complete Chef Ramsay's Branzino dish; the winning team will be awarded a day at a luxurious spa while the losers have to clean the entire dormitory.

    TWD Season 7 Anticipation - Evil Cliffhanger from Hell

    in S07

    Abraham.

     

    I think it's Abraham. He had that sweet and emotional goodbye scene with Eugene - who hugged him.

    He was all mellow and actually said to Sasha he wanted to start a family.

    Abraham's story has come full circle. He lost his family, lost his mind, made getting Eugene to Washington his priority, lost that mission, lost his mind again, found it, and finally made peace with truly wanting a life with Sasha and not Rosita, and made peace with ASZ and the realities in the zombie apocalypse.

     

    Also, he's the biggest of the bunch. Negan needs to keep the others in line to basically serve him. Kill off the potentially threatening "muscle", and leave what he perceives are the smaller, "weaker" members of the gang to do his bidding.

    • Love 7

    Unpopular Opinions: All Alone in Purgatory

    in Sleepy Hollow [V]

    I'm right here with you, to a point. Even if we don't get a S4 I don't want to see Abbie and Crane declaring their love and kissing in the finale. If it did happen I'd likely be cheering like the rest of the Ichabbie shippers. But in reality, if their relationship turned romantic in the finale it would seem cheap and contrived, considering Abbie is not giving any indication at.all. that she's even remotely in love with Crane. It would not make a lick of sense for her to suddenly have an epiphany and as a result dump Daniel and run to Crane to declare her love. That scenario would work only if we'd actually seen Abbie fighting her romantic feelings for Crane, which we have not or we get a time jump that shows them already together. 

    If the show was on long enough for Abbie and Crane to be lusty, coupley and "date" cause we know they'd never get a real date with the never ending parade of monsters they'd face, I'd be okay with a declaration of love. But I agree, marriage might be a bit much, a proposal maybe, but babies absolutely not. I have no interest in seeing them go there on the show. 

     

    That;s why I don't want to see the "I Love you". If either one utters it - yes even Crane - it cheapens the whole thing. As you said, Abbie definately has shown little to no sign of thinking of Crane as so much more. Crane, yes, but even him declaring he "loves Abbie" in whatever flowery way, would be meaningless to me and to Abbie.

     

    I know many fans are hoping beyond hope there is a kiss, hence the UO.

     

    Besides, most of us, when daying, have has passionate and intimate relations (kissing or otherwise) with a partner without having said the words ILU. I want that for Ichabbie too, because it's realistic to me. They will say it, but right now it's meaningless fandom bait without any substance. That's why I don't want it. Along with the babies and the cutesy little white picket fence scenario - they already have the white picket porch - that's good for me.

     

    But it becomes an unpopular opinion in a way, based on what I've read elsewhere and just half of the Ichabbie fanfic out there literally is:

     

    Crane: "Hello Lieutenant. How is my friend?"

    Abbie: "Hey Crane. Not bad. Let's kill a demon."

    Crane: "Agreed."

     

    *Ichabbie almost die in demon attack.*

    Ichabbie look at each other, winded. Suddenly, they run into each others arms...

     

    Abbie" I love you!"

    Crane, "As I love you!"

     

    /kissing ensues

     

    Sorry, not realistic and there is no prior connection besides the bond (as weird as that is to say). Not saying the fic is bad at all, it's just jarring in it's sudden 180 in the characters behaviours. If we have a season 4, like you said, I want to see the connection.

     

    Unpopular Opinion (due to a change that's popped up the last two weeks): If there is a season 4 - I WILL be watching.

    • Love 1

    S06.E16: Last Day On Earth

    in S06

    Everyone - since there is a long seven months of discussion that we can all have about season 7, I've created a thread just for that:
     
    TWD Season 7 Anticipation - Evil Cliffhanger from Hell

     

    This thread should be for discussio  n of the events of the actual episode. Go to the above thread to discuss what you think will happen in season 7. Also, suggest a better thread title too! Thanks!

     

    ETA: Would help if the link actually worked...

    • Love 4

    TWD Season 7 Anticipation - Evil Cliffhanger from Hell

    in S07

    Everyone,

     

    Since we left season 6 with a major cliffhanger no thanks to Negan, Lucille and Gimple/Kirkman, Carol all shot up and some shady looking people clad in hockey(?) pads confronting Morgan and Carol, there is a lot of discuss and about seven months of time to discuss it. So instead of filling up the episode thread, THIS thread will be dedicated to discussing the end of season 6, what you think will happen, and all of the grumbling anticipation you all have for October.

     

    Yes, we have the Watch Duty thread, but it'll be a long time before we get anything that resembles a spoiler to discuss and I except a fair amount of season 7 specific discussion.

     

    Note the spoiler tag. Spoilers be here. All Spoilers. If people want a thread to discuss season 7 without spoilers I can do that (just want to see if there is a need). Anticipate Away!!

    Unpopular Opinions: All Alone in Purgatory

    in Sleepy Hollow [V]

    that Sophie is Crane and Abbie’s daughter and she knows this

     

    I've seen this theory floating around a lot so it's actually a pretty popular opinion...possible, but Sophie doesn't quite act like it. If Ichabod and Abbie were her parents, you'd think she'd discourage her mother from dating Danny? Unless that is what is supposed to happen and if Sophie interferes, then messing with timelines, course of history, etc etc.

     

    There is only one more episode. Too much going on to include that plot line too.

     

    Unpopular Opinion. I'm perfectly fine if Ichabbie don't kiss this final episode, or declare their love for each other, but ONLY if we get a season 4 and they start to explore the romantic side of Ichabbie.

     

    Another UO: I do not want any boringly typical trope romantic declarations of "I Love You" when we haven't even seen these two date!! In fact, I hope they never say it on the show. And no babies. Ever. I want to see Ichabod and Abbie navigate the world as a couple, not married, not pregnant. Swoony in love/lust absolutely. I want the lusty teasing, the flirting, the dates, etc - basically the fun part of a relationship - which most people experience in the beginning. Since they already act "married", it would be awesome for them to in a way go backwards and explore them dating. Especially Crane learning how dating works 21st century style.

     

    And again - no marriage, no proposal (well, maybe this) and no babies.

    • Love 1

    Ratings, Scheduling, and Watching for Cancellation/Renewal

    in Sleepy Hollow [V]

    Fox specifically said last year that they are not going to base their decisions on Nielsen ratings anymore and they don't care at all about Nielsen ratings!

     

    What they said and what they actually do are two completely separate things. They are going to look at everything. Cost of production (including crew/cast salaries), existing actor contracts (if they expire), ad revenues, overseas numbers, Georgia filming tax incentives, expected syndication returns, pilot reviews/costs, status of their other currently airing shows, etc etc. Nielsen is one small piece of the puzzle but it will be considered - just not as heavily weighted anymore.

     

    FOX already knows if they will renewal SH or not - it's just a matter of announcing it.

    • Love 2
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