Partly
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Posts posted by Partly
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35 minutes ago, SueB said:
Which makes me wonder about Billie -- if Dean had just gone with her, even though he was ultimately revived (and thus revivable) -- was she cheating? Is that something they are allowed to to? Take a soul before they are technically dead?
A bigger question: if a person can refuse to be reaped and become a ghost, how could Billie reap Dean and Sam and toss them into the big empty? Couldn't they just refuse and become ghosts? Do the other reapers just voluntarily leave them stay when they could, what, drag them out of this world against their will?
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18 minutes ago, rue721 said:
Yes, agree completely. I had even forgotten about John flipping out at Sam for not shooting him.
If Sam had been the one possessed, do you think John would have killed him?!
Of course not. In this case, I think John (much like Dean OFTEN does) sees himself as the expendable one. He wasn't necessary for Dean and Sam to survive if the demon was gone. He was willing to die as long as the he could take the Demon with him. His entire life after Mary's death -- well, once he discovered the "truth is out there" -- was to keep Dean and Sam safe.
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48 minutes ago, ahrtee said:
So, yeah, John knew that something was after Sam for a long time. In rewatching Dead Man's Blood today, you could (theoretically, in hindsight) see when John *wanted* to tell Sam something (when Sam asked why John got so mad when Sam wanted to go to college, and John said, "all I could think about was that you'd be alone. Vulnerable." )
Thanks! I didn't think I imagined that! I just haven't watched the first season for quite a while I sense rewatch in my future.
5 hours ago, catrox14 said:Speaking of in 2.1, if John was able to sell his soul for Dean's life, that implies that Dean really did die at some point right? I mean a crossroads demon can't make a deal for an undead soul, can they?
He was making a deal for John's soul who wasn't dead. Dean wasn't dead because he hadn't been reaped yet. As Dean demonstrated when Death made him a reaper and Dean refused to reap the girl and as it was shown when the reapers were missing, you have to be reaped to die. YED kept the reaper from doing her job.
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1 hour ago, catrox14 said:
Like I always say, John Winchester is a contradictory fuck.
Which is, IMO, why he is such a great character. It would have been easy to write him as a complete SOB, not caring about his kids or even being outright abusive. However, they made him complicated, as is the boys relationships with him. Far more interesting. Far more real.
3 minutes ago, Myrelle said:I doubt that they will open the can of worms that Adam would represent, but he(ironically, along with John, in some ways) IS the poster child for the reason that this kind of knowledge should have been shared.
Wasn't part of the reason that John kept moving around, kept training Sam and Dean? Because John knew (or at least suspected) that something was still after Sam? It could just be headcannon as I wrote a fic that included that though but I seem to recall that John was afraid that the "thing they were chasing" was still after Sam. If John know Sam and Dean were in danger and kept them moving and training them to keep them safe (even though it didn't keep the demons away from Sam), he wouldn't have felt the same need to do that with Adam who had not supernatural baddies after him.
Not excuses or apologies, just reasons for his actions.
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5 hours ago, rue721 said:
Thinking about it now, I bet Mary won't be happy to hear about any of that now. She might be seriously pissed off at John after all!
Maybe.
However, John did all of it because he saw his wife die horrifically, pinned to the ceiling and bleeding on their baby's crib, right before busting into flames and starting a fire that almost killed his entire family.
Now when Mary saw John die, killed by her demon-possessed father, she made a deal with that same demon that actually led up to the events that John witnessed and marked Sam with demon blood.
Not really sure she has the right to cast stones at John.
In all honesty, my view of John is less harsh than yours appears to be. To quote one of my favorite lines "Life is a terrible thing to happen to someone". And John'a qualifies as terrible.
I see him as lost to this war-footing he suddenly found himself on, having to protect his children from forces he doesn't understand and that most people don't believe in.
I'm not sure there was any good way for him to deal with everything, just bad choices with unpredictable consequences. I think that's something Mary should understand.
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41 minutes ago, catrox14 said:
I think Dean understands intellectually that John did the best he could, but still feels deep inside it was fucked up
Absolutely. You just have to look at that dialogue to see that: On an emotional level (at this point) Dean blames John for Mary's death - "He's the one who let Mom die". It's a very natural extension of his 4-year-old-self's belief that his Dad can do anything. I love that Dean well-and-truly believed his dad to be a superhero who could do anything and that belief fed that hidden and ignored hatred that the "superhero" couldn't save the person most important to them all.
Then you add to it the fact that, when he goes back in time, Dean sees first hand that it was his dad had no chance at of saving Mary and, in fact, Mary had a hand in her own demise. He suddenly has this knowledge that his dad wasn't even close to the hunter that Dean grew up with. Trying to reconcile the knowledge that John-in-the-past was just as much a victim as Dean and Sam just adds to the conflicting emotions that he has regarding his dad.
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2 minutes ago, Demented Daisy said:
This isn't going to be a shortened season, is it? Nah, probably not....
Would they shorten the season or rearrange episodes to accommodate family obligations?
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5 hours ago, rue721 said:
Sam doesn't know this woman at all and knows he's a stranger to her
They are all strangers.
Knowing your mother at 4-years-old is not knowing her at all. Hell, knowing your mother at 14 isn't knowing her at all. You can't really understand your parents until you adult for a while, until you walk in there shoes and deal with them as adults -- and they deal with you as an adult.. Knowing your child at 4-years-old isn't knowing them either. The "he was such a good baby" or "OMG she was a terror when she was three" doesn't translate into adulthood -- and we should be thankful for that because we were all jerks at some point growing up. If we're lucky, we get the chance to leave that behind and be judged based on who we are right now.
5 minutes ago, DittyDotDot said:I don't mean to say Dean doesn't still have some daddy issues, but I think, short of John showing up so Dean can address them, Dean's at a place of peace with John right now
I agree with this. I also think Jensen's statement about wanting Dean to be able to address some issues with John may have a great deal to do with his own growing family -- having kids greatly influences your relationships with your own parents. It makes you see things differently and understand their circumstances. Jensen may just be expressing a desire to show that type of change in Dean. Now Dean doesn't have kids, but all the hell that he's been through, all the different choices he's made, all the crap he's contributed too and all the crap he's helped stop gives him a different perspective and I'm sure that there are a lot of things that he would be able to talk to John about.
More interesting, at least to me, would be what John would think about all of this. Everything that's happened to his boys, the choices they've made, the men they've become. Mary is, basically, a blank slate but John had a history, a personality and a hell of a lot of baggage. In many ways, the boys never had an adult-to-adult relationship with John and I think that could be part of what Jensen would like to explore with his remark.
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I've liked that the boys views of John have evolved over time, with both of them viewing him in less black and white terms, but for any true resolution John would have to be present. It will be interesting to get Mary's view of John, however, I'm pretty sure trash-talking John would be a very poor character trait, especially since she had kept so many secrets from him, secrets that really, seriously affected him after her death.
And it would really be a terrible thing to do to Dean and Sam.
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1 hour ago, Moose135 said:
The difference is that those eight were elected to the office of Vice President. Ford was appointed VP after Agnew resigned, and became President after Nixon resigned. He is the only one not elected either POTUS/VPOTUS.
I had a friend who insisted that VPs are never elected, they just get brought along. It's not a completely wrong idea, you vote for the Presidential candidate, not the VP. I've never heard of anyone who voted for a Presidential candidate they didn't like just to get in a VP they did.
1 hour ago, OtterMommy said:But the drug dealing older son is just drama that I don't think this show needs.
I willing to see where they go with it. After all, the child of a "unimportant" cabinet member who is selling some drugs is a totally different animal than the son of a President who is selling drugs. Even if he would be adult about it and confess and swear off ever doing it again, the fact that he did it and people KNOW that he did can be a huge complication for President Kirkman. Although with people (White House aides/speech writer's none-the-less) openly saying that the President was nothing but a "glorified real-estate agent", I'm pretty sure Kirkman doesn't need any more things to make the transition difficult.
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1 hour ago, bearcatfan said:
If ever there was a case where network interference ruined a show, it's Sliders.
So true! It was such a good show until it completely threw away it's concept.
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1 hour ago, VCRTracking said:
Damn, Ezra hasn't just gotten better now, he's gotten scary.
Yes. Which is good because the Jedi would be damn scary -- even when they are the good guys.
1 hour ago, VCRTracking said:Tom Baker as the Bendu was awesome.
I KNEW I recognized the voice!
I'm not a huge Star Wars nerd, so I'm always behind on the trivia of who's who and the geeky joy of having minor characters show up. What I really love about this series is that you don't HAVE to be that deeply involved in the universe to enjoy the show. It's well written and allows the "casual" fan to be invested without feeling that they are missing something!
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Evil double post of bad cell connection! There is nothing to see here.
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17 minutes ago, Boopsahoy said:
But, what is he redeeming himself for? HE didn't let out the Darkness Sam did.
I think placing blame is pointless because you could say that it was ultimately Dean's taking of the mark that made it necessary to release Darkness. And so on and so on. In the end it's their fault for existing -- Mary and John's fault for having them -- or God's fault for creating the universe. Whatever.
My opinion (probably unpopular) is that there is no blame to be laid only consequences to be faced.
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3 hours ago, ahrtee said:
However, while Sam completed his act of redemption, Dean was prevented from doing his. Or maybe he hasn't completed his arc yet
He did complete it. In fact, what better end for a redemptive arc could there be then using forgiveness and letting go of past wrongs to stop evil. Seems the entire point of redemption. And not only did Dean express these but he conveyed it to the big bad evil and she understood it. Seems like a great redemptive ending to me.
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1 hour ago, ProfCrash said:
When the time comes to forcefully remove their protectee, the SS does not dick around. The person moves and moves quickly, normally with a series of bodies over them so that the Protectee cannot be hit. Just look at some of the footage from the few times that SS has moved a Protectee in public. It is not comfortable or slow.
Maybe all the good Secret Service guys were caught in the explosion and Kirkman had the ones who were demoted due to prostitution and drug scandals.
The lack of "real" in the details usually doesn't bother me as long as it is done to further character and plot. So far they've struck a good balance for me.
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17 minutes ago, oakville said:
Isn't it possible to be domestic terrorists working with Iran?
For storytelling purposes, there has to be a domestic connection. It makes the threat more intimate and, quite frankly, much harder to defend against. Who you can trust, who you can't trust, who you have to work with even though you don't trust them -- this is all great storytelling material. Since I'm hoping that the show focuses on Kirkman and his personal struggles to maintain who he is while rising to the Presidency amid this horrific attack, there has to be domestic connects for it to be personal and immediate. External enemies don't provide the same emotional impact.
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2 hours ago, theredhead77 said:
Disclaimer: I'd watch Keifer read the dictionary on a PPV and I'm easily entertained when it comes to TV shows.
As far as I'm concerned Kirkman can be a quiet, reserved man with a bunch of ink under his clothes. I loved the established [seemingly] happy home life. Hopefully there is no affair, secret second family or other crap thrown in the mix. Not all dramas need family drama too.
Keifer can pull off soft spoken yet powerful. It will be interesting watch Kirkland struggle to keep his do-the-right-thing moral compass in the midst his new situation.
This.
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4 hours ago, Moose135 said:
Magnum had a daughter? Was it the kid from Three Men and a Baby? In any case, this sounds awful.
Lily was his daughter with Michelle. Some of the very best episodes of the series focused on Michelle, what happened between them and Magnum dealing with the aftermath. The final episode of Magnum reunited him and his daughter. And I actually think that it sounds wonderful.
I love the idea that they are going to focus on Lily for several reasons. 1) it's not a reboot so all the things that happened in Magnum will real in this new show. That makes me happy. 2) I love that the lead is a woman. Granted I think they may mimic the dynamics in the original show, but it was a good dynamic, so I'm okay with that. 3) I'm not sure how I feel about expanding into international espionage and giving her the background of being disgraced, but I would be willing to give it a chance. 4)Oddly enough, I like the idea that she took the nickname "Tommy".
I'm really surprised that it took this long to get a "second generation" off an 80s show, rather than a direct reboot. Then again, not a lot of 80's action shows had kids...
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4 hours ago, numbnut said:
He did do nerdy early in his career (he was great in Promised Land with Meg Ryan, who didn't play a nice girl for once).
He did nerdy just recently in Touch. I think he does well as mild-mannered until pushed, then he can be tough. Its great seeing that transformation.
5 hours ago, Constantinople said:What happens if mild mannered high school chemistry teacher Walter White suddenly becomes President of the United States?
I think this is the most interesting aspect of the show. We always expect polite and unassuming people to be unable to be tough when the situation calls, especially when dealing with politics. However, I'm hoping that Kirkman gets to have his polite and unassuming persona as his true self and not have it be a social construct hiding a power-crazed sociopath. In fact, I'd like to see him struggle with the apparent need to present a more aggressive/less polite persona in order to be taken seriously.
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18 minutes ago, pcta said:
Hope it is domestic, nonislamic terrorism.
It's always domestic, nonislamic terrorism. Even 24, it was more often domestic and nonislamic. And, if it wasn't, the driving force was always domestic and non-Islamic.
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17 minutes ago, catrox14 said:
I would laugh if he and Sam were posing as members of the band in some way. That would be amusing.
Dean would make an excellent roadie. And, if Dean was in charge of cover stories, he would get Sam in as hairdresser -- or something equally ridiculous. Of course, they both could double as security.
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1 minute ago, catrox14 said:
I don't know what St. Vinnie's is...
Sorry! It's St. Vincent De Paul. An organization that takes donations and resells items in a thrift store. In my little small town they also provide food pantry and free medical care. Seems like a place hunters would use.
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3 minutes ago, MysteryGuest said:
I don't know why he's wearing it, but it looks pretty good on him, so I have no complaints...
True. But both the boys look good in anything (or nothing). I'm easy that way.
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John Winchester: Daddy Dearest
in Supernatural
Absolutely. Of course, John is the poster boy for the saying "Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get you." John's problem was when he started to get paranoid and feel that there were evil things that are out to get him and his family -- it turned out to be FAR WORSE than he thought.
Was John paranoid and secretive? Absolutely. He had more than enough reason to be.