call me ishmael

I think that Daisy clearly handled the end in a very mature way. She was helped by the fact that Joey couldn’t lie to save his life but still…a lot of others would have missed the anvils dropping everywhere during their date. But it doesn’t make me love her. She very thoughtfully managed to make the final rose ceremony and the finale about her even though it was Kelsey’s day and Joey and Kelsey’s night. She reminded me of a bridesmaid or best man announcing their engagement at their friend’s wedding dinner because they “wanted to add to the festivities.” And since Daisy “chose” herself it was even better for her. Jenn got 5 minutes or something as a result.

What struck me about this episode was that, except for addressing the racist hatred Rachel has been getting, it was a big nothing burger. Sure it was fun to have Lea and Sydney called on their stuff, and the two of them plus Jess clearly forgot that there were cameras. And given that no one seemed to support them in their claims against Maria you could see them trying to recalibrate their programming. But otherwise? We learned that Kelsey didn’t think through her note (and/or got manipulated by her producer). Is anyone shocked? About the only thing else newsworthy was that the final three were nice to each other.

Okay I am going to try one more time and then we can just agree to disagree 😎 On one side you have a deeply insecure person who has been drinking too much and who is really worried (especially because of Jessica) that her fiancé isn't attracted to her. In the midst of an argument she screws up. Is that wrong and was Jimmy right to consider that a deal breaker? Sure. On the other side, you have a show's production which has all sorts of film to choose from, an enormous amount of time to decide what to include, likely knows that this was a violation (do we really think that Jimmy didn't tell his producer), is aware that it will mess up two people's lives (who weren't main cast members), and sits down and rationally decides: 'hey it will help ratings so let's include this and watch all the fallout on social media." Which one of those two do you think is more blameworthy? I don't care for Chelsea but she made a drunken error. Netflix made a calculated decision.

See this is where we disagree, and not just because judge Judy is a travesty. I’m not defending Chelsea (something I haven’t done all season). Chelsea did Chelsea. No one made the show say “Chelsea violated confidence so let’s make sure Jimmy’s friend suffers from her actions.” The show decided to do that when they knew from one of the others (Jimmy) that it wasn’t cool. I’m not surprised they did that. They are In it for ratings and controversy and embarrassment gets ratings. But don’t then turn around and go on about how this isn’t about entertainment and how important it is to take account of people’s lives. I’m surprised that people seem to want to minimize the responsibility of the show for their editing choices.

I don't think anyone is expecting the show to care about the woman's privacy which is why Jimmy told Chelsea off-camera, asked her not to mention it on-camera and felt betrayed when she brought it up during an on-camera argument I wasn’t expecting the show to care. I was just saying that’s it’s rich for Nick to be lecturing Trevor about real life implications when the show doesn’t care. Sure, let’s run the risk of messing up someone not on the show’s life for the sake of plot consistency.

Hypocrisy thy name is Lachey! I thought it was priceless when they went off on Sarah Ann for saying it was entertainment. I mean, for that to be true, you’d have to have a situation where production edited the film to highlight the most confrontational and difficult moments, only cover the people who had the most dramatic story lines, have a producer with them to push them, keep the booze flowing…. Oh, wait 🤔 And did it not dawn on anyone there that while yes, it was pretty horrible for Chelsea to violate Jimmy’s confidence, it was the show that chose to put that in the episode? I agree that the point of the Trevor and Sarah Ann sections was to warn off future attempts. The clear message is Love is Blind can use you, you can’t use Love is Blind.

Oh that’s an interesting idea. I had assumed we would wait but let’s keep fingers crossed for your version.

I feel bad for Rachel. First, she hurts her face, then you basically get forgotten for the rest of the episode, and then with the cliffhanger you have no shot at WTA. If she is third, she doesn’t come back till an episode that is clearly about others.

I wonder if it would be possible for Clay and AD’s mothers to take over from the experts on Married at First Sight. That show might have a chance then.

Exactly. How can you claim that you deserve to be an "expert" because of your professional role and then say you can't be expected to be professional on the show. You can't have it both ways (except on Lifetime I guess).

I’m glad to see that I’m not the only one whose 🤯 whenever the “experts” start yelling at people to reflect on their mistakes and work on themselves. They make poor matches, say the exact same things year in and year out, never admit error, and then pretend that it’s surprising that so few couples work. Expert heal thyself.

I don’t see this at all. There is nothing that I saw in Maria’s behavior that would lead me to credit Lea or Sydney. They were accusing her of being nasty and belittling other women. What happened the last two weeks was someone who clearly hasn’t got a lot of experience but whose father probably gives second chances to not realizing that she didn’t have that sort of privilege in the bachelor. She acted like Joey should keep giving her do overs.

I think I must have watched a different episode. I think that Jeremay and Sarah Ann were probably lying about what happened that night. But I think AD was way out of bounds. She was in fact interrogating SA and didn’t really want to hear any answers. She just wanted to be the voice of morality. It really wasn’t her position to be doing that. I used to be a big fan. Now I think she is likes to lord it over people. As far as Laura and Jeremay are concerned, he should have just left if he didn’t want to be with her and not tried to lie about it. His mother had his number. But I wouldn’t want to be with Laura. She was constantly criticizing and undermining him. I thought her parents were really interesting because it was clear that they knew she never thought anyone was good enough for her. And while she thought he should “protect her heart” she didn’t seem to realize it goes both ways. Her telling him off was as much about her feeling she looked bad as any real commitment as far as I can tell. They are both well rid of the other. I still think jimmy is trying not to look bad. He didn’t want to deal with Jessica’s daughter. But both he and Chelsea protest too much about how much they like each other.

I think that we can all agree that Jessica shouldn't have been there. I can never understand these parents who leave their kids and think that--best case scenario--they are going to come home and say "Hi I'm back with your new dad/mom!" But I also think that she had good reason to be angry with Jimmy. It was pretty clear from his initial reaction that he wasn't signing on to be her daughter's father and he should just have said so. I guess he thought it would make him look like a heel but he should have been honest. And plenty of people don't want to be a step parent. Of course, now he is expecting to get engaged to a Megan Fox lookalike. I wonder if he will ever realize that he dumped the one who could reasonably say she looks like Megan Fox.

You might be right but I’m skeptical. Especially with the way she keeps flipping around “maybe” “oh I’m getting there” oh I’m falling, oh maybe. It’s like she knows how to keep Joey on a string. but who knows.

I don't quite agree. I think that she is pretty insecure and that the extroversion is a cover. Her mistake was in not recognizing that Joey is also insecure and needs the women to reassure him rather than the other way around. And she didn't know that Daisy had been playing the "do I love you? Maayybee" card the night before. She needed reassurance and he wasn't in a place to give it to her. I don't think it was quite as thought through as her being manipulative. I think she was melting from the pressure. But it was a bad look and really cost her even if she got the rose.

This makes me wonder if Daisy was there for the "wrong reasons." She may have just been angling for the bachelorette all along but he didn't let her go at the appropriate time.

I thought that what made that especially ironic was that Jessica looks more like Megan Fox than does Chelsea. You have to wonder what jimmy will think when he sees them.

I think she probably made a mistake coming on the show given her legitimate concerns about having kids. But I think she was right to leave when she realized the different schedules. Does anyone know why Kaitlyn had to walk down the street by herself when Lea got to hop into a limo 🤔

You know one other thing may be that Maria is “ancient” and they can’t understand why Joey is interested. After all, the whole thing with Syd Vicious started because Maria didn’t think that being 31 was so horrible. If Sydney and Lea didn’t think that it was, they wouldn’t have acted as if Madina was right to worry about it. So they can’t imagine how someone practically on the Golden Bachelorette could be attractive.

Given all the nonsense about her age, i wonder if they will pick Madina as the first Golden Bachelorette.

Maybe one of the dates will have all the women searching for a falcon.

I think that Sydney Vicious overestimates how much he is into her.

But if she apologized how would there be drama????? I think that all of these contestants think that if you apologize to anyone but the lead it will be used against you as proof that you are a horrible person.

@ApprenticeFan do you mean she self eliminates at FRC or is eliminated. I can’t get through the pop ups at RS