Bass

You know, it's interesting when speaking with some casual viewers who are not as obsesed with the show, who don't go online at all about the show (its surprising how the online community is so small compared to the vast amount of viewers who do not go online about the show) and who only look at it for purely entertainment purposes. Some thought they saw a familial unit between michonne and the Grimes, especially with the church scene with Carl and baby Judith, now they are confused about her relationship with Rick and kids because of Jessie and Rick and because she and Carl have not interacted in ASZ. Because of this, these particular casual viewers think maybe shes just a best friend? They still look at her as someone who is there for Rick, to watch his back and to protect his kids. Interestingly, they don't view Rick in quite the same way regarding Michonne, so yes this is treading dangerously close to black friend/mammy trope territory. Other casual viewers perception of Michonne since this last epospde is that she did the right thing subduing Rick. They don't like this crazytown Rick and wondered, will Michonne now be leader? And a few others perception of her is still the black chick with the sword who is by Ricks side to fight his battles (pretty much like a black female Daryl, Daryl is still real popular with the casuals). This viewpoint treads very close to black female warrior as weapon trope. These POVs are from casual viewers from my family, my job and club who have not read the comics and don't follow the show online. It's interesting to see their varied perceptions of Michonne from how she is portrayed so far on the show. Has anyone here had any similar input from casual viewers regarding Michonne?

@pete martell when speaking with casual viewers who a) dont go on the internet in regards to the show b) who watch the show for pure entertainment and not for anything deeper,, c) after watching the show, go about their business, it does not consume their lives, this was their POV: They think Rick is crazy and horny for Jessie. They think Jessie wants to be with Rick. Those that remember season 2 think this is Rick/Shane/Lori all over again, even with the abuse angle, with Pete as Rick with problem marriage and wife wanting to be with someone else, Rick as Shane cray cray over another mans wife and Jessie the wife two men fight over. They view Jessie as a damsel and distress. They view her and the townspeople as helpless and clueless and are confused as to how they survived so long. They are more concerned about daryl then jessie (yes Daryl is as popular among casuals as ever, LOL!) They want to know what Glenn is thinking about everything. They are more concerned about Maggie and whats going on with her than this Jessie. They want Michone to get her katana back and kick some ass. They enjoyed Michone clocking Rick and would not mind seeing her leading more until Rick stops acting crazy. Some have forgotten who Morgan is, but when you jar their memory, they get more excited about him then about Jessie. Now these are casual viewers from work and my club. Interesting, huh? What has your experience with casual viewers regarding the Pete/Jessie arc? There are some interesting pov cfrom them regarding Michone and Glenn too.

I'm going to take a chance and bare my soul on the internet. I am a victim of DA. He made me believe that I was worthless and that I was lucky he even wanted me. I took the physical and sexual abuse because I felt I deserved it, because he was better than me, and who else would want a piece of shit like me? But a family member of his noticed what was going on. He told me that I was worth more than everything in the world. He helped me to see that I was worth a better life. You know what? He helped me to find the strengh to walk away. Was my crazy SO not so accepting and tried to stop me? Yes, but I found my strength! The family member didn't "save" me or be my "white knight" he just helped me find the strength and self worth that I had in me. This is the issue I had with this storyline in the comics. The way Jessie is potrayed as needy and Rick is the "white knight". RK obviously writes this arc as a fanboy fantasy of DA and not someone who really unferstands it, just like the rape arc with michonne, both rape and DA were written purely from a comic fanboy perspective. I'm grateful the rape of michonne did not make it on screen, but perplexed as to not only why this JA arc did make it to TV, but also remixed in a way that made it just as unpalatable as it was in the comics. Key points: Jessie is not first introduced as DA vic, only as future LI. She is very comfortable with a shirtless stranger. (I would have felt uncomfortable y that a strange man I did not know answered the door half naked and would have kept my conversation short, especially since my abusive SO was living nearby) Rick immediately took to Jessie BEFORE HE KNEW she was abused, because, again the writers wanted to make sure it's established she's LI. So at the party when Rick kisses her, she does not shie away. (In that scenario, realistically speaking, I would have expressed some discomfort, and looked around after the kiss, to make sure my SO did not see what transpired between me and this man that just moved into the neighborhood). Remember, Jessie is still being portrayed as LI not DAV. Pete is initially viewed as just being an ass to Rick, not an abusive spouse. Later on, he shows signs of territorial to Rick, but then Rick also shows signs of territory to Pete regarding Jessie, so now its two guys swinging dicks about a women. Only after this do the writers FINALLY chose to showcase Pete as an abuser. (Because remember, its really about Rick and less about Jessie. My former abusivr SO would have been friendly with Rick, let him in the house, shoot the breeze over a beer, ask him a bunch of questions to find out what makes Rick tick, give him a pat on the back reasuring Rick that we had some problems but I was the love of his life. Then after closing the door, would promptly beat the sh*t out of me for accepting the intentions of a man I just met. But these TWD writers, do anyone of them even know anyone that was in an abusive relationship? Later on, when the writers finally get to Jessie, again, her abuse is shown strictly through Rick's perspective, but with a heavy emphasis on Rick's attraction being the driving factor. (Remember, the writers first introduce her as LI, not DAV). Even when she asks Rick if he will do this for anyone else, he says no, because it's her role as LI that is what drives him, the abuse is just the writers way of giving an excuse as to why we should be okay that an abused woman who is in a relationship with a violent man be willing to not only avail herself to another man suffering from severe PTSD which makes him just as violent. And to make matters worse, that she would also have sexual relationship with said man after he kills her husband. If lets say, instead of the family member, I met a guy who fought overseas and suffered severe PTSd. This man took a shine to me even though I was married. He confronts my husband because of his desire for me. He finds out about the abuse and says he will help me leave. He and my husband get into an altercation, the PTSD and violent behavior kicks in and he kills him. I feel grateful and proceed to have a sexual relationship with a VIOLENT MAN WHO KILLED MY ABUSIVE HUSBAND. First of all, if this happened to me in real life, the counselor in our support group would have gotten me emergency mental health treatment if I even entertained the idea of having sex with a violent man that killed my abusive husband. Second, a part of me would be horrified that he was killed. Yes, I was physically and sexually abused, but I never wanted him dead, I just wanted him to stop. I would NEVER START HAVING SEX WITH THE MAN WITH PTSD WHO KILLED MY HUSBAND. Knowing that most of the reason was because he wanted to get with me would just make it seem sordid and suspect to those on the outside looking in. Listen, the way this whole arc was remixed, just made Rick lookcrazy, look like a lech and the writers made Jessie more a damsel in distress spoils of war trope with the abuse angle thrown in in an attempt to give Rick and Jessie a credible reason for their behaviour. Well they failed. It was a poorly thought out, over the top comic book fantasy from a male perspective in the comic, and it is still a poorly thought out fantasy on the show. I'm appalled that so many are so accepting of this. But, it helps me to remember that TWD is just a zombie show plagued by bad, writing, bad editing, bad pacing, poor characterization and I can't expect these writers or the showrunner to do justice to deep societal subjects like rape, domestic abuse, characteization of POC, etc.

I remember when Danai was first introduced on TTD with one of the writers. He was asked his thoughts on Michonne. His response, 'What's more awesome then a black chick with dreads and a sword!" I cringed. Even Danai was subdued. Yep, that is who was writing for michonne. Even in an interview, when responding to criticism from fans about her character being perceived as an angry snarling mute, Danai indicated she did approach the writers and asked 'can she talk now, and they said nope". She tried to be lighthearted about it, but you could tell the issue with the writing did concern her. Like in the scene when she finally breaks down and tells Rick about Maggie and Glenn, she says a young guy and a pretty girl. A black woman does not talk like that! She wouldn't look at maggie and think, "oh, shes pretty" no, she would say, "I saw a an asian guy and his girlfriend". And the scene when she is talking to Tyreese and he grills her about the governor and she says she does not know why she is still angry. But she did know! As an articulate AA female, she would express why because she wants him to hear her. But, of course, the writers did not understand this, and so her dialogue in the show has been peppered with this lack of perception. @KJ4ever, in terms of her having a romance with Rick, that would be even more detrimental to her character, because it will be all about Rick, just like it is now. When you look at what most of the fans like about Michonne now, what you mostly get is "i like her relationship with Carl" "I like that she is there for Rick" "I like her, Rick and Carl as a family unit", "I like that she is smiling more when she is with Rick and Carl, etc. Most fans hardly mention her character development in Season 4 because there was very little. Season 4 was mostly for CAROL'S DEVELOPMENT AND ARC, just like season 3 was mostly for ANDREA'S DEVELOPMENT AND ARC. Michonne's arc in season 5? To get Rick to ASZ. And a romance with Rick? She would just be reduced to a prop for Rick's manpain and angst. Danai is an award winning playwright, she has won awards for writing strong womens characters without the tropes and cliches. The TWD writers have yet to be recognized for their writing. And the reasons are quite obvious.

As for Jessie, she is not a character in her own right, she is written to serve as a catalyst for Rick. This particular tropes sells millions of romance novels a year and is a very popular trope among the graphic novel genre as well with guys. This is why many viewers do not have a problem with Rick a)killing Pete outright (because let's be honest the writers have not done a very good job showing why Pete is so extremely dangerous in order to contemplate straight-up murder) b)Jessie sleeping with the man that killed her husband (because, remember, with this particular trope, that's Rick's reward and shes grateful. Plus, she's considered beautiful and sweet, and its Rick, so she gets a pass.) c) Many viewers use Rick as an avatar and Rick getting the beautiful girl resonates with them. The same with viewers that relate and see themselves in Jessie, so her giving of herself to Rick resonates with them as well. Now these tropes are even much, much older and even harder to not be influenced by. Now, I hope that the writers will prove me wrong regarding Jessie and Michonne. Heck, I desperately hope that they have some creative trick up their sleeve. But, I am not optimistic, already Michonne's dev is still trope driven, Jessie is nothing more than a plot device, Rick is in crazytown development wash and repeat, and Pete is your run of the mill cardboard cutout. If the writers repeat past history, the whole Pete/Jessie/Rick with some Michonne thrown in will just be another sordid cliche.

It was not shippers that brought out Ricohonne, it was the writers. They chose to hinge Michonne's development on Rick's and Carl, with a certain degree of closeness that can be misconstrued as some level of intimacy. But TWD writers are known for using tropes when writing for characters. But I recognized the Black Friend/Mammy/Black Weapon trope immediately in season 4 with Michonne. This particular trope has been used for so long in cinema that it has been ingrained in our collective consciousness that we tend to celebrate it as positive character development for an AA character in relation to the white character. People are so used to this depiction of AA female characters that they readily embrace it. The only way for the writers to rectify this is to give Michonne her OWN ARC SEPARATE FROM RICK, and her own love interest where she could showcase her feminine sensual side, and not just as Rick's wet blanket and weapon there to protect his kids.