pinguina

I think any loss of a child is painful and a long awaited baby dying in utero (spelling?) can be just as painful. My sister lost her son in her final trimester (around seven months). It was so sad to see her and her husband in such pain. But they buried their baby with just a priest present. They felt that although both sides of family were sad for them and wanted to support them,They just wanted each other, their faith and the parish priest at the service. I have had other friends and family lose a baby through miscarriage but never saw a full blown funeral for them such as M & J had. I guess the people I know just wanted to be private and this couple wants everyone to know their loss. BTW my sister and her husband now have a two sons and a daughter :)

Regarding the wearing of pants: I remember back in the day, my mom wore pants for the first time - she only wore them around the house and my dad was not happy Keep in mind that my dad was a bit old school from Mexico as was my mom. She was just tired of being careful of doing things around the house that had her dress flapping and as she said to my dad, (but in Spanish) "I think I'm old enough to choose my own clothes." After a while she wore them "just to the store" "just to a neighbor's house". My dad got used to them :) My mom a traditional Hispanic woman from MEXICO decided what she wanted to wear despite knowing that my father and my grandmother would not approve. Can't these grown married women decide for themselves? Side note - wearing pants under a dress? When I was a kid we (girls) would wear shorts under our dresses in elementary school so we could get on the climbing bars and monkey bars at school. But never pants! PLUS ... Why can't their clothes coordinate? (a blouse that actually matches or coordinates with a skirt) It drives me a bit crazy to see such mismatched clothes - Reminds me when my girls would pick out their own clothes to wear. But they were three and four years old.

Josiah is my favorite too! I hope that the courtship is long.... My friend from high school dated her then boyfriend starting at 16. They go married about 7 years later, she was 23 and he was 24. They have been married over 25 years. So I think if they do wait and are not pressured to get married, they might have a shot of being more mature, actually knowing each other, shared experiences, and in a way growing up together. BTW - I was kind of offended that in the video Jill said "Spanish people" We are not all from Spain! There is a great deal of diversity among Spanish speaking people. Even words in from one Spanish speaking country that are in Spanish can mean something else in another Spanish speaking country. (Think English from England different than American English or Australian English.) AND "Spanish Places"??

Code switching is also used depending on who you are talking with. I talk to my colleagues differently than when I am doing a presentation. Which is different than when I am speaking to friends. My speech can also change depending which friends I am talking to - work friends vs. longtime friends; straight English vs. Spangllish. Most people do this unconsciously; they adjust their speech pattern, vocabulary, and syntax to fit the social situation they are in.

I noticed that Jill has a new adjective to add to her vocabulary - CRAZY. She used it several times and passed it on to her "buddies". Question - She is married now and she is still in charge of a buddy group? I thought that according to their belief system, her husband is supposed to be the be all and end all of her existence. Although, I did like that Derrick seems not to mind too much the time that her brothers and sisters (not buddies) spend with them.Her buddy group says the new baby will be part of their group? Really?

In the Catholic Church, you cannot remarry in the church if you are divorced. I think that it is not generally approved of and you cannot receive Communion if you remarry and your ex is still alive. However, you can get an annulment through the Church. It does take time (any where from two to five years - which is quick because I remember that in the past it could take five or more years) and must be based on that it was not a true marriage because one (or both) in the marriage lied or misled the other upon marriage. Example: one tells spouse he/she is willing to have children but does not have them deliberately - this happened to my friend and his marriage was annulled it took about three years. Also it takes a lot of paper work, both spouses have to get (I believe) about 5 people who witnessed how the marriage played out from "courting" to wedding to the marriage itself to fill out a questioniare (spelling?) regarding the marriage. The form is about three pages long and requires answering each question on separate papers. It must also be notarized and sent to the diocese. Sorry I went on about this - it just caught my attention because I know a couple of people who did this and it was a process.

I think the older ones seem to be functionally literate. The younger ones? This is really a hot topic for me because I truly believe children should be literate. They should be able to read literature or informational text and come away with some kind of opinion, connection, new information, or just simple enjoyment about what they read. They should be able to write a clear paragraph to fit the occasion or task with correct grammar and punctuation and clearly express their thoughts verbally. Oh, how it bothers me to hear them say, "Me and __..." "Can I..." " It went good". Jessa was a task master, just checking that everyone was doing what they were supposed to be doing, Their mother should have been involved in lessons, assessments, and progress (yeah, right)

Wow! Eleven and starting fourth grade?? When I saw him with flashcards (stuff my third graders have been working on consistently all year - some are finishing their "twelves" and starting division facts) , he seemed a little older but by over two years? - some of my students are 8 going on 9, others just turned 9. When I saw this I couldn't help but wonder "What about reading level? Science units? Social Studies units? Writing skills?" (My third graders are working on three paragraph opinions, narratives, and explanatory writing.) I've known some people who do not value formal education but their children are still learning through explicit experiences, specific lessons (using money at the store, measuring things, etc), indirect lessons. This family seems to not care about any type of learning (let's not count their learning from professionals) - what will happen when they are no longer on television? If they lose their property? If the "head" of the house dies? What will they all do? How will they support themselves?

Just a few thoughts about the wedding: - I really liked the sand thing, we do unity candle. Each set of parents light a candle to represent the bride and groom. During the ceremony, the couple take their candles and light one (blowing out their individual candles) to represent their new life together. - I don't think I have ever seen their father kiss any of the children. Just seemed weird or maybe in my family we are just affectionate. - Ben and Jessa just smiling as they looked at each other - Jessa's wedding dress, simple, elegant, perfect for her. - I hated that they run down the aisle after the ceremony, strange - The reception: cheap, poorly planned, WHAT NO FOOD! I have gone to weddings that have been on a super small budget to a wedding that was over $100,000; All of them had some very yummy food (at one both moms, all the aunts, and grandmothers made the food - best food ever!). - Genuine emotion from Jinger, Jessa, Ben, and even Jim Bob - Michelle not so much (I think she tried to squeeze out some tears - didn't work) - One of the boys "filming" - dumb - Ben's mom (Guinn?) so sweet, thoughtful, and just genuine - Finally, the advice - reminds me of when years ago videographer would film wedding guests giving best wishes and advice to the couple (as if the single friends could give any coherent sound advice after the open bar) Here's hoping the next wedding is just as special, awesome, sweet as can be!

This lack of interest/opportunity/disdain for reading is just so wrong to me. I love getting lost in a book and growing up I went everywhere and everywhen by reading a book! There are so much good literature and such a wonderful variety of books that can spark the imagination. I tell my students that a book is better than any movie because you can make the pictures in your head better than any movie can. This lack of interest in literature makes the children in this family poorer. My niece was in second grade last year and we were discussing (yes, she can have a discussion about good books!) "The Little Princess". As we compared out favorite parts and how they made us feel sad, happy, nervous; she said, "Sometimes I forget that the people in the book are not real and I wonder what happens to them next." (overly proud aunt of her insightful currently eight year old niece). The children and twenty-somethings in this family have lost so much by being denied access to so many wonderful stories. I don't know how they can be unaware of "The Wizard of Oz" "Hardy Boys" "Wind in the Willows" "Winnie the Pooh" "Paddington" "Chronicles of Narnia" and so many more!! This lack on curiosity about what is between the covers of books is just (to me, at least) so many kinds of wrong.

Coming from a Hispanic family, as a girl, I had more rules to follow than my brothers. HOWEVER, I remember my father specifically telling me all through school, "You can be anything. What do you want to learn/be?" as well as, "When you go to college..." Always WHEN never IF! I would see my non-Hispanic friends having and doing things that I would never think of doing. Because despite the rules and restrictions that I had growing up, it came to a point that my parents had to trust that they had instilled morals and good judgement in me. This consistently led me (even now as a college educated, fully employed, independent, responsible adult) to always think, "How will doing X affect me? Affect my perception of myself? How my parents look at me?" So looking at these particular parents, how can they not trust their children to do "the right thing" , "make the right choice" if they have such a strong belief system? Don't they have faith in what they say they strongly believe and what they say they have taught their children? Or as some have said, is it just a big control issue, getting pleasure over being in charge of every aspect of another person's (or in this case 17 + people - even the allegedly grown-up married ones) life and life choices? The biggest sadness to me is that their children have no opportunity to explore the world (even though they have seen more of the world than I have). It's not even the lack of an education (because there are so many ways to explore ones strengths and interests) it's that they have denied their children opportunities to be the best of who they are. It just makes me feel so sad for them. The choice to make their own decisions and learn from their mistakes is a crucial part of growing up.

Did anyone notice that Ben's father said, "We trained him right"? (or something like that?) I don't know it just seemed wrong. I have heard parents say, "We've taught him/her" or "We hope we raised him/her right so he/she will be a good person." But TRAINED? Uh - just no. Also - I didn't think that the Duggers knew how to play any team sports.

Hi! I've been looking at this forum for quite a while but this is the first time I have participated in the dialogue. What Anna said about holidays (specifically special Muslim "holidays") shows she really does not know how days are chosen as "no school' days. As someone said upthread, It really has to do attendance. Schools receive money based on how many students are present. In my district we have the whole week of Thanksgiving off. Why? Because so many students are absent. The students go out of town with their families, stay home to help prepare, whatever - they are not in school. The district has the discretion to choose what days are "no school" days. The same thing with Good Friday. We have a very large population of Catholics. So what day do they get off in addition to Spring Break? Good Friday of course! Attendance is low because it is a day to pray, meditate, attend special mass. Do I teach that to my students? Of course not. To be honest, I just think to myself, "An extra day to rest!" The way the school year is structured is different from one district to another. My friend teaches at a different district than I do, and her days "off" are sometimes different than mine. Again it has to do with daily attendance. We just have to make sure our school year adds up to 183 days for the year. To get back to Anna, I guess what bothers me is her children don't go to school (much less public schools) AND she doesn't live in New York - So it wouldn't affect her even if she did send her children to school!