missysays

Perhaps AV and IGN did. I was thinking of the ones I read in Hollywood Reporter and LA Times. I thought while they mentioned that there are 10 episodes that they spoke mainly about the first few hours - meaning the two hour debut.

After watching this episode, I think the majority of the critics who damned the first two episodes as being flat storytelling with no character development didn't give it enough of a chance. For me, there was character development galore -especially amongst the secondary storylines. If you look more closely at the Tip storyline it's a complex layering of an adolescent who has been abused and possibly kidnapped their entire life. On top of it you might say it's an allegory about the struggle of a transgendered person. As someone mentioned earlier in the thread the moment when Tip doesn't know which bathroom to go to spells out in a nutshell what most transgendered people feel. Their gut tells them they are one thing but physical appearance and social norms says they have to behave in a different way. I was also impressed by the directing and acting of the actors who played bit parts in Tip's scenes. The waitress who walked up to Tip and warned him about covering up wasn't unkind. After her verbal warning, she gently and sympathetically touched Tip on his forearm. Also, the herbalist was also very kind in his revelation and warning to Tip about the true nature of the "medicine." The Wizard and Anna scenes were also interesting bc you don't expect him to be so sympathetic to her and to relate to her in some ways. Really great nuanced stuff in there. I hope the viewing audience continues to give the show a chance. Plus, it doesn't hurt that Dorothy and her Scarecrow are gorgeous to look at and have a great chemistry.

I wonder if that Wizard's guard is the equivalent of the Tin Man and we'll learn more about his backstory as the series goes on. He is part of the main cast group photo and his armor could be their allusion to the Tin Man just as the straw stuck on Lucas when he was on the cross was his Scarecrow nod. I am also hopeful that we haven't seen the last of Jack. He is also in the same cast group photo so he may be back later on. Contrast this with Mombi (the crazy witch who held Tip captive) who is not included in the group photo. Though I don't think we've seen the last of her either since she came back to life after Lucas "killed" her. This is all to say i continue to be intrigued by this show and this episode provided enough cliffhangers and questions to keep me going.

I think the jeweled gauntlets are supposed to be the ruby slippers and will come into play later on in the series too. That red dress was amazing though.

James continues to impress me week after week! The man intuitively understands what needs to be done in a dance and somehow is able to come out with it even when it's not natural to him. He is able to sense where he needs to be technically and also emotionally to make the performance spark. And above all- he somehow knows how to emotionally lead Sharna in the dances. I think he is the first celeb dance partner she's had who is her emotional equal. Plus, he's getting better technically each week. The couple turn that he had to do was so much smoother this week in comparison to week 1. He's amazing and I love to watch their chemistry together. I can see how Laurie won her matchup with Marilu but I'm not ready to give up on Marilu just yet. Last week in that Taxi foxtrot she made the most beautiful shapes- the way she angled her head, legs. Just gorgeous! And the music was soft and subtle enough that it allowed her room to breathe and show off her lines. This week the beginning of the dance in that spotlight was actually nice but then the music sped up and became too fast for her. Derek really needs to be smarter in selecting music for her and giving her pieces that allow her to show off what she does best- showing off her gorgeous posture and stretched legs. She's never going to place above Laurie if she's trying to fight her in the power and drive department. They need to be more strategic in their music and choreographic choices. Derek has the creativity to give Marilu intricate and interesting moves. Those two are my favorite so far.

When the "One Month Later..." was playing, I sort of wondered if Hopper and Joyce were going to explore a romantic relationship together. I half expected when he parked his car that he was parking it outside of Joyce's house and that he would show up as a fourth member of that holiday dinner that Joyce and her boys were having. I don't necessarily think they'd be the best match together but they do make a certain sense together in that their emotional wounds fit each other. Hope we get to find out more next season!

I sort of wondered if the other 10 subjects were dead or eliminated in some way since Eleven was the only one in the facility. She seemed to be the only one who survived the experiments that were run on them.

I was wondering if the Department of Energy or whatever government agency was in charge of Hawkins Labs had to shell out some sort of pay out for Joyce and her family and that's where the money came from to renovate the house. It did look like their old house- had the same door and exterior just completely refurbished. I mean it would make sense if they got a pay out - after all their agents planted a fake dead body and made it seem like her son was dead and the agents who were responsible caused havoc all over town before getting killed themselves. As for Jonathan's new camera it was a replacement present from Steve and Nancy. Steve asked Nancy when she came back to the living room if she got a chance to give it to Jonathan. It seems that he wanted to make amends. It's pretty clear though that Nancy and Jonathan aren't done and that they're relationship will continue to be explored in the next season (if they get one). Nancy has way more of a natural and intimate connection with Jonathan than she does with Steve. I loved their scenes together- they seem to really listen and think well together in a way that she doesn't with Steve. Even though it seems like she's chosen Steve I think it's really just for now and she and Jonathan will continue to grow their connection. I think one of the reasons why she "forgave" him so soon was because they had a common evil to fight together. But she wasn't ready to completely end her relationship with Steve and start up with Jonathan so she's taking it slow there. But you can tell that she's thinking about Jonathan and connected to him in a way that she's not with Steve. I also want to know why Hopper left the food for Elle in the woods. What does he know from his ride with the government agents that the rest of us don't? I was watching an interview with some of the producers of the show and they say that in the next two weeks they are going to meet with Netflix to see if they are greenlit for the second season and if so they're going straight into planning and mapping out of the next season. They seemed pretty confident it would happen because they were talking specifically about how this series is not meant to be an anthology and it's meant to continue the story with the same characters we've been introduced to in season 1. So if it continues we'll most likely get all of our questions answered- plus more!

BTW, Val didn't choreograph that number himself. Jenna and Alan Salazar did- according to Alan's IG. https://www.instagram.com/p/BDzp17voLOV/ I sort of doubt that Val has ever choreographed any of his contemporary numbers. I think he gets help every time he has to do that dance style. I don't think he has enough contemporary dance vocabulary to be able to construct a well formed contemporary dance. Not that his dance with Ginger tonight was all that great. So not sure why he was gushing about it on Twitter. My favorite dance of the night belonged to Mark and Paige. What a fantastic way to create a new take on a Paso that also reflects her specialty. Mark's creativity has been hitting the mark time after time. I hope he gets an Emmy nod this next year. To me, the front runners are Wanya and Nyle. Nyle bc he's attacking every single dance he's given and Wanya bc he's feeling every dance he's been given. They are worthy finalists- i hope they make it through injury free until the very end.

I totally agree with this! I think that the showrunners in general have so many other irons in their fire -- using Flash to launch other shows (LOT), referring to comic book story arcs and characters that the first characters to be sacrificed are always the female characters. They try to make it up but when they do it's almost like they're cramming something in and it doesn't feel as natural as the other male characters' development and character arcs. Her scenes mourning Eddie should have been something they included much earlier in the season. They felt really crammed into this past episode. I think Candice's natural likability though is something that comes across even with the lack of screen time and her connection with Grant (when they allow them to have scenes) is palpable. So that helps a little bit. She's been filming quite a bit in the episodes leading up to the finale so hopefully they are making up for lost time by giving her more character development and integration into the overall story arc. Things are already much better than last season in that she's at least a part of the group scenes at Star Labs and she's included in the episode lead-ins where Barry talks about being helped by his friends at Star Labs and they've selected a clip with Iris working with Caitlyn and Cisco. And even in the Trajectory episode, she was at the crime scene in the morning before Barry and Joe get there and share with them some intel - so she's definitely a part of the Flash's investigative team. That's a step in a positive direction!

Yup! But I think that he doesn't have to be as boyish as he was in season 1 bc I think that Barry as a character has been through too much in the past 2 seasons to truly recapture that innocence he had in season 1 but he can feel happiness again! That's why I liked him on Supergirl- he was fun but also mature. He wasn't completely as he was in season 1 - he was a slightly more grown-up version of himself. I liked that you could see his experience and everything he's had to work through there on his face but along with it was an ease about him - like the heavy burden he'd been carrying around had finally fallen off his shoulders. He hasn't forgotten about everything he's been through but he's come out from the other side wiser and ready for happiness again.

Not sure where to talk about this...but I love how the Barry on Supergirl all of a sudden has his smarts back. I know he's got Cisco, Caitlyn, and Wells but there he's inventing things super buffered ear buds and writing algorithms that can hone in on electrical power all in one episode. Wish he could get a little of that mojo back on his own show.

It looks like after next week's Flash Back episode that they are going to skip another week before they pick up with new eps again. Groan!!! And then yes miss yet another one somewhere in there before playing out the rest of the season.

Hahahahahahaha!!!!!

I think everyone's (my own included) frustrations about continuity and consistency of the way the Barry/Iris love story is developed is in part due to the writers never having time to give Iris' PoV. You get Barry's PoV on their relationship sort of... He's been the good trouper since she told him late in season 1 that she loves Eddie and wants to be with him. He goes back in time to "save his mother" with the full knowledge that he was too late with Iris in their current timeline and that she's in a committed relationship with Eddie. Throughout the first part of season 2, he's operating under that same scenario- except now he and Iris have the added weight of Eddie's death and Barry's guilt hanging between them. He does allude in passing to Patty not being the same as Iris but even Joe is telling him to move on and give a new girl a chance. So he does just that- he tries to date Patty all the while keeping her at arms length and not letting her fully into his "real" life as the Flash. He does almost succeed in burying his feelings for Iris until the mission to Earth-2. He's completely ripped out of the carefully reconstructed life he made for himself and reminded of his "love" for Iris again- whether on Earth-1 or Earth-2. I'm thinking in particular of that scene right before E-2 Iris goes with Cisco to confront Killer Frost and Deathstorm when E-2 Iris grabs his chin and says 'i love you' he says it back in this way like all the effort he's made moving on from her was for nothing bc on this different Earth it all comes sliding back down on him. And in King Shark you see him dealing with it again even if it's not said out loud. Even when he tells Iris and Joe that E-2 Barry and Iris were married he tells the story that "we" were married and E-2 Joe didn't like "me" he can't differentiate. It's greater than just the love story/ it's also E-2 Joe's death but it's all intertwined for Barry and you sense that his feelings for Iris has come back into his consciousness. That side look he gives her after he lets slip that they're married on the other Earth. But Iris... she gets none of the same opportunity to express herself and her feelings- about Barry or even about Eddie's death. You see her surprise and pause when Barry tells her that they're married on E-2 but you don't know what she's thinking. Iris in general since the start of the show hasn't been given too many opportunities for you to know what her PoV is. The only two times you do know her feelings are once right before the tsunami hits when she admits her feelings for Barry and then once and only once as a voiceover intro in the episode when she learns that Barry is the Flash. I think as someone mentioned further up this thread that Iris' interactions with Scott her new editor will finally allow her a chance to reflect on her state of mind about Eddie and Barry and then she'll be ready to move forward with her emotional life. It's a pity that it takes another male to serve as a catalyst for her emotional advancement but I guess better that than nothing else but Iris silently emoting but not given any dialogue to speak. That was one of the things I hated about the scene when Barry admits to Iris his feelings for the first time in season 1. The scene itself was beautifully acted by both of the actors but the fact that Iris is mute throughout the entire thing always makes me roll my eyes. Hopefully it's not just her agency that she regains in some of the later episodes of season 2 but her voice (literally!) as well.