wknt3
-
Posts
2.4k -
Joined
Content Type
Blogs
Gallery
Downloads
Discussion
Posts posted by wknt3
-
-
On 4/11/2024 at 11:12 PM, Xeliou66 said:
One of the worst SVU episodes ever. Period. Just an hour of St Olivia worship with Benson being more unbearable than ever complete with Mariska’s horrible overacting. The plot was just a sidebar to the Benson worship - just pure cringeworthy awfulness from start to finish. Benson saving the day, Benson taking it personally, Benson in another hostage situation, Benson threatening a suspect and coercing a confession and it gets glossed over and we’re still supposed to think Benson is some kind of hero instead of a loon who is unfit for duty, and worst of all the Benson/Noah discussions to give Benson more drama and allowing her to play super mommy. The worship and complete focus on St Olivia has reached its all time high this season and is dragging down the show terribly. And as if this week wasn’t bad enough, next week we are in for round 2 of Benson taking it personally.
I feel like this is slightly overstated. The Benson worship was just as bad and probably worse in Season 18 and there have been previous episodes that have been equally and more Mariska publicly gratifying herself in a much more horrific way than any of Munch's various subway weenie waggers that kept him in court for just about every episode Cragen was in for 3 seasons. "Something Happened" comes to mind as does the whole Mariska as a literal angel scene. And I would say most of Season 18's episodes were worse and there has been enough utter crap in the last decade that this probably doesn't crack the bottom 10.
QuoteJust pure awfulness from start to finish, and it looks like we are in for more of it next week. Just a horrible, cringeworthy episode that was 100% a Benson circle jerk.
And this is probably slightly understated so I guess it all balances out.
-
3
-
-
On 4/12/2024 at 6:37 PM, marc20 said:
One note....this revival has little to no sense of humor, a pretty major component and plus of the original
although points last night for the writer who had within minutes the detectives saying "put down the burrito" and then "put down the "weapon" (I forgot what he had)
A sense of humor is a big part of real world police work too. I think there is still some snark and one liners, but unfortunately this another problem that I suspect is caused by NBC/Dick Wolf mandates and not anything that could be fixed bringing in new writers or a new showrunner. TPTB want the new shows to be more like present day SVU than the original run and there is very little humor there these days since the lead does not have the chops to pull it off. Also they like to show us the crime in the opening scene instead of discovering the body during stereotypical NYC moments that were often little comedic gems. The other big opportunity for comedy was during witness interviews and those have been dramatically pared back because it saves money on hiring actors for those small speaking roles - which I strongly suspect is a big reason for almost entirely eliminating the cold openings where passers by find the dead body too. Where it is a matter of weak writing is on the legal side although part of that is also structural with less time for anything not essential to advancing the plot and a seeming reluctance to have the same number of recurring experts and distinctive arraignment judges which is where a lot of the courtroom humor came from.-
7
-
-
6 hours ago, shapeshifter said:
Yes. Pretty much the same writing for Maroun as for Serena Southerlyn, especially in this episode.
But if this is Maroun's swan song, her penultimate line cannot be:Can it?
-----
* Serena Southerlyn departed L&O mid-season in "Ain't No Love" (S15.E13, aired January 12, 2005).
Isn't it obvious which way they would go?
Spoiler"Is this because I'm Lebanese?"
-
1
-
12
-
-
14 hours ago, EtheltoTillie said:
I want a dollar for every time Benson says “it’s not your fault.” I’d be as rich as Moneybags.
Yeah I don't know where she got the idea she could just keep repeating that and get acclaim and awards. Or maybe I do...
-
1
-
4
-
-
The Good:
Carisi. He did a good job making Benson seem almost relatable and human and kept my eye rolls from reaching a full 360 degrees.
Bruno and Velasco. I would have liked to have seen them given more material, but it is always nice to see SVU detectives acting like investigators instead of advocates or therapists.
The guest cast. A good job all around in elevating the material and keeping things on track. It would have been really easy to veer into scenery chewing or simply phone it in, but everyone delivered.
The Bad:
The opening scene. As if clumsily done Benoah isn't bad enough we have it as a reason to drag up some of the worst of past Benson stories so Mariska can whisper and make constipated faces while talking like a third rate writer's idea of a second rate therapist. Along with a thematic link that is about as subtle as a slegehammer to the face and equally enjoyable.Mariska as director. Every time she directs she manages to amaze even a cynical jaded viewer like me that what we usually see is Mariska being dialed back by her collaborators. It would be like finding out that Lady Gaga's stylist has a whole book of outfit proposals they rejected as too far out there...
I really do like a larger pool of potential team members to draw from, but this feels like another episode where they don't seem to be really making the best match of characters to story. Why not have the experienced profiler with a deep personal connection to kidnapped girls work this instead having the gratuitous second captain there to look concerned? Especially when the queen bee is so insecure that the other captain can't be wearing her badge at the crime scene like all the detectives and the extras because it would make Benson seem less special?Speaking of bad stories from the past as we were during the opening I don't think we ever need another hostage situation on SVU. At least nobody died and Benson never fired her weapon, so I guess that's a win?
So after all of the various lectures Benson has given everyone she can torture a subject into confessing and it's OK because it's "for the victims"? And when we do acknowledge that there was an issue there she can just blow off everyone pointing it out and we're supposed to move on?
The previews. Back to Maddie? Seriously???
Overall this is yet another good plot idea that never reached its' potential because it had to devote so much time to Mariska's creative autoeroticism. At least she didn't try to make herself into an actual avenging angel ascending to heaven this time so I guess we're making some progress?-
9
-
-
22 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:
Episode description from DirectTV.com:
QuoteWhen a congressman's aide is found dead after testifying in a corruption case, Shaw and Riley discover the suspect may be someone close to home; as Price solidifies his case against the defendant, Baxter proposes they go after an accomplice as well
What is the over/under for life expectancy of anyone closely associated with a politician taking the subway from or to Hudson University in the current run of Law & Order? 2 minutes? 3?-
1
-
1
-
10
-
-
20 hours ago, Pete Martell said:
A more detailed dress report:
I forgot the pre-tape soon after it aired, but Kaia Gerber has a number of SNL ties -...she dated Pete Davidson ...
Does that really count as an SNL tie at this point? I mean I think fewer people have taken the NBC Rockefeller Center tour...-
2
-
-
2 hours ago, Sake614 said:
So as if Mariska’s ego wasn’t big enough, the NY MTA just entered a licensing deal with Wolf to sell an SVU metrocard.
Wow. I guess we know that whatever other failings the writing may have, trading positive portrayals for sponsorship isn't one of them. I mean this is only slightly less surprising than finding out one of the local colleges is rebranding as Hudson University for a week...-
1
-
3
-
-
On 3/15/2024 at 12:35 PM, AnimeMania said:4 hours ago, Affogato said:
Can’t scare me. I’ve seen worse tickets.
Me too...
-
1
-
4
-
-
Moving this over from the episode thread as it's really more general discussion -
On 3/29/2024 at 5:50 PM, dttruman said:I have so many question, but I think we may never get answers to some of them. Has Wolf given Hargitay the keys to the SVU show? If not, how much clout does she have or what is she guaranteed? Does she have to bring in each show under budget to keep her character as the main one each week? Can the Benson character take two weeks off to see how it effects the ratings or does it need to be a whole month?
On 3/30/2024 at 10:13 AM, Zaffy said:I didn't really have a problem with "Saint Olivia", but now she has become insufferable. The writing is really bad and the acting as well. And I do not get it, I know Mariska can act well.
Maybe they have market research we do not know about and follow what "the audience wants", dunno, it is just bad.
Yes they do have market research. There is a certain percentage of the viewers that have stuck around to see how Benson's story turns out. I know it has been mentioned in past articles. We also know that it is out there because NBC execs have previously said publicly that they were waiting to sign a contract before renewing the series. And because Dick Wolf does not let any actor get so much money and become bigger than the show without some hard evidence that it is needed.
As far as the extent of her power and influence it does have limits. NBC is only willing to spend so much on the show, even if it is the number 1 scripted drama on NBC and Peacock (yes, yes bar so low it's on the ground etc.) and they did realize after Season 18 that they needed to provide a variety of plots even if Mariska had a certain focus on particular types of sexual abuse and power dynamics that she wanted to portray almost exclusively. The biggest limit on her creative influence is the showrunner and the budgetary constraints. Chernuchin and especially Leight have strong track records and influence on their own and pushed back a bit. Without that we find that it's all Benson all the time. As far as budget is concerned - budgets are not really her concern and don't seem to interest her except in being the highest paid actress on network television. Which is why it is one of the few real limits to her influence - budgets get tighter and her salary keeps rising which meant for example KG had to go even if Mariska wanted her to stay. And that they can't do too much to make Benson into an action hero. Dick Wolf is not going to spend his own money to keep Mariska happy. And money is the reason that no matter what we will not see a significant decrease in her screen time. She simply gets paid too much to sit on the bench (insert Mets joke here) and they don't really have any alternative unless Meloni ends up free...-
3
-
1
-
-
On 2/6/2024 at 10:19 AM, tennisgurl said:
She doesn't need an after work drink, she needs a therapist.
Just came across this again. Truly a reminder that when it comes to this show to be careful what you wish for...-
1
-
4
-
-
On 3/25/2024 at 12:22 PM, Xeliou66 said:
Exactly what I was about to say - I really miss Dr Huang and the psych insights he provided. It’s a shame he’s gone and they haven’t bothered to replace him in any way.
But now they have - twice! The squad has an FBI agent plus they have Rollins as a brilliant criminal profiler. That's just as good. Right? Right? Why are you all giving me that look?
-
1
-
4
-
-
The Good:
Bruno! It's a shame that budget fuckery is keeping us from getting Kevin Kane full time. Both the character and the actor make every episode better than those without him.
The COTW. A solid story with a good old school team investigation. Nothing flashy, but nothing too overdone or repetitive.
Carisi. It is nice to see an ADA who is not the bad guy for wanting to be able to prosecute the offenders and to have him as an ally, but independent. Separate yet equally important if you will.
No therapy scene! Are we finally done with Maddie?The Bad:
Speaking as we were about budget fuckery - it's an all hands on deck situation with "forced OT" but Velasco is MIA? Especially on a case where a Latino presence would be useful? And they can't even bother to give us a "Munch is in court" line of dialogue to explain? Or give the new girls something more substantial to do? It would seem from a creative and budget standpoint we'd be better off with Velasco this week and maybe bring in the replacements for another episode.
Mariska. Boy was there a lot of whispered platitudes and constipated faces this week. All in the service of Benson as savior once again who can turn cure mental illness with just the power of her empathy.
Speaking of BS (Benson Stuff) that ending was vomit inducing and did a lot to squander the good will that built up. If it wasn't bad enough that we had to be sure everyone knew that Benson healed everyone we had to suffer through her blathering about angels and how art is turning your suffering into beauty?
Overall this was another meh episode. A lot of solid bits, but also a lot of wasted potential as they were too busy servicing the star's ego to actually tell the interesting story that was there. It served mostly as a reminder that nobody is bothering to even try to reign in Mariska and that Hate Crimes would be much better than what they are putting on the air and deciding to pick a fight over casting and issues based story telling with Dick Wolf is a monumentally stupid idea.
-
13
-
-
-
On 3/16/2024 at 1:02 PM, Sake614 said:
I don’t know about anyone else but I was getting dizzy watching the shrink wave he finger back and forth like that. And then I was afraid the whole fucking episode was going to be Liv in therapy. In which case I was just going to delete it.
23 hours ago, Shelbie said:If I was in therapy this would drive me crazy.
But then you would need more therapy. It's all about building customer loyalty...-
2
-
-
On 3/16/2024 at 2:06 PM, Xeliou66 said:
I wonder if the show is preparing to wrap up soon and that’s why they are bringing back faces from St Olivia’s past and why they’ve ramped up the St O worship to an all time high. As much as I would love to see SVU without St Olivia, that won’t happen, Mariska pretty much is the show now unfortunately. But I do wonder if they are planning on calling it quits soon. I think we would know if this would be the last season but I wonder if next season will be the final one.
Unfortunately as much as I would love the idea of a grand sendoff next year I think it is more likely simply a matter of incompetence and ego. This is still the top scripted drama on NBC and Peacock (yes it's damning with faint praise, but still..) and there doesn't seem to be a successor in place with Organized Crime still in turmoil and the mothership being forced to become more like the zombified corpse of SVU. If they seem to be setting up Meloni coming back or actually put Hate Crimes into production I'd be thinking endgame, but this feels to me more like there nobody left able or willing to standup to Mariska when she comes up with ideas like "we should really explore Benson's psyche this season." and say "We have explored it already. Mapped and charted. Established settlements. Committed ethnic cleansing against the natives. Had our claims recognized by treaty and international conference. Dealt with the independence movement and decolonization years ago." and moved on to something actually new. If next year is the final season it will mean that NBC can't come to an agreement on a new contract with Mariska and I doubt Dick Wolf would allow them to start laying the groundwork already.-
2
-
-
16 minutes ago, ML89 said:
I am a Mike Post fan - I've bought his albums, watched his interview with the TV Archives (which I highly recommend if you're a TV history fan), I wrote a paper on Mike Post. Someone needs to tell him to tone it down or whoever is telling him to make the music that overbearing needs to be told to tone it down. If it's the sound mix doing that, it needs to stop yesterday.
While I agree with you it is unfortunately not going to change as it is one of those elements that is almost certainly being imposed from above to "modernize" the show (like showing the crime more often than not and all those foot chases) and make it more like present day SVU which also does the same thing with the background music in the sound mix as do a number of other current procedurals. I would also bet that they do it because beating the viewer over the head with the musical cues lets you cut corners in a lot of other areas. Why use time and money you don't have any more for transitions and another edit when you can just turn up the volume on the music?-
3
-
-
6 hours ago, torqy said:
I can't help but think of Joan Jett when I see Jet. Some meta inside joke?
Maybe you just love rock 'n' roll?
-
1
-
5
-
-
The Good:
The COTW. It was old school SVU even down to the classic trope of finding a reason to have them working a case that there is absolutely no way they should be handling.The guest cast. Some solid performances that helped sell some material that was otherwise in the danger zone of being too overwrought for serious drama, but not enough to work as camp.
Carisi. I wish we had gotten more of him, but what we had was pretty good.
Fin. Especially for being actually allowed to call out Benson a bit!
The Bad:
We're still doing the whole therapy thing? Because we don't have enough of Benson feeling sorry for herself. And the flashback just serves to remind us of how far we have fallen.While I like the actress they still haven't quite figured out what the heck to do with another Captain in the squad and seem to want to have it all ways at once. She is a veteran cop and investigator who can barely handle bodies and blood. But Fin is wrong to not immediately warm up to her because girl power and all which Benson understands. But Benson also treats her like a rookie because we don't know how to write exposition without Benson giving orders and being the only one who knows what they are doing.
Mariska's ego. Speaking of Benson being a know it all jerk - if we are going to look to old episodes why not watch the rest and learn how you can have your leading characters front and center without doing everything themselves? Or at least some semblance of working together? The tech in the garage shouldn't have let that car "accidentally" slip a bit when Benson charged in.
Overall this was a by the numbers plot, solid yet unspectacular, but it could have still been a good episode, if some of the time that was devoted to the further beatification of Olivia Benson was spent actually examining the moral complexities hinted at and then left for a couple lines of dialogue in the bar scene, or maybe going somewhere with a victim/perp who falls outside of the usual for the series? What is the point of bringing us therapy sessions with a protagonist who can never be truly wrong or grow? It is apparent that everything Chernuchin and Leight did to try to find ways to channel and contain Mariska's ego has been flushed and we are rapidly heading back to season 18 levels of All Benson All The Time. At least TPTB do seem to have learned some lessons about still doing different types of cases to show us why Benson is always right and will always save the special victims...
-
6
-
-
On 3/6/2024 at 9:34 AM, paigow said:
How can supply ships and Palpatine visit Tantiss if its co-ordinates are hidden? What was there before?
On 3/6/2024 at 10:08 PM, frenchtoast said:I believe there was a mention of relaying the coordinates to the Emperor's shuttle at a certain relay point or something. So it may not be widely known.
I remember hearing that too. Of course Palpatine can always use one of the many MacGuffin grade GPS (Galactic Position Sith) system artifacts/doohickeys that the bad guys seem to have in abundance... -
11 hours ago, wknt3 said:
The Executive ADA has always been the second in command in the L&Overse going back to at least early in Jack's run (I don't think it was ever clearly laid out during the Stone years although Greevey did remark he was a higher up back in one of the pilots IIRC). So if they wanted to give TG a little breathing room and pinch some pennies this was nice continuity.
10 hours ago, Raja said:When they came to the I'm acting DA scene I immediately thought that he couldn't be the only Executive, like an Executive Officer on a ship in New York County we see 20 something murders a year which he does alone, not counting SVU and other cases. I remember when they threw Linus Roche's Cutter an episode on SVU it did seem like he got promoted from EADA to a chief of the DA's Special Victims unit.
Yes but that was SVU where working with Benson is automatically a promotion no matter what your position is. Seriously though it was Warren Leight writing (who has pretty much gone on record saying he doesn't give a crap about the legal side of the franchise) and there was a lot of material there about the DA's office that has been handwaved away like the evil "new DA".
8 hours ago, dubbel zout said:QuoteAnd if Price was acting DA then why wasn't ADA Maroun the lead prosecutor on what looked like a straight forward case with the murder weapon in hands of the suspect a few hours after the crime.
She'd have lost the case.
-
1
-
1
-
-
12 hours ago, ML89 said:
Nolan is acting district attorney? Was everyone else on vacation or out sick?
The Executive ADA has always been the second in command in the L&Overse going back to at least early in Jack's run (I don't think it was ever clearly laid out during the Stone years although Greevey did remark he was a higher up back in one of the pilots IIRC). So if they wanted to give TG a little breathing room and pinch some pennies this was nice continuity.
10 hours ago, txhorns79 said:The episode reminded me a little of that episode from the original where the defendant puts on a "black rage" defense. I want to say that many of the arguments made in that episode, which I think is nearly 30 years or so old, were used here as well.
I was reminded too. Unfortunately the headlines they are ripping from haven't changed that much either...
-
6
-
1
-
-
The Good:
The COTW. A solid investigation with the squad all working together and everything progressing naturally with no glaring short cuts or loose ends. It felt a lot like old school SVU with a mix of investigative methods and interrogation tactics and not just one investigator and a couple cops doing a bit of leg work.The new blood. I still can't forget how ridiculous it is that we have gone from not being able to a uni wtaching the door anymore to Major Crimes levels of staffing with 2 captains questioning a suspect and an FBI agent on call (was McGrath not just a d-bag, but embezzling as well? Maybe IAB should be looking at that instead of going off looking to back on the street?), but it is nice having an actual team feeling and allowing cast to have the week off without leaving nobody running the store.
Bruno. The best addition to this series in ages. He fits nicely into the Fin/Munch mold without being a carbon copy and has had more development as an extra than any main cast member since Carisi.
No Maddie. Addition by subtraction.
The Bad:
Even if the Benson worship has toned down, the writers still feel the need to have her as the expert and source of all authority, even for people who aren't actually working for her. They should go back and watch some old episodes to see how a CO can work with a consulting FBI agent. For instance asking if they can use their connections to expedite a VICAP search instead of it being their idea and order.The weird stylized lighting and set designs they have gone with over the last decade or so really looked off here. Every scene in the school came off like they were on a bad green screen.
The ending. Between the whole Ladies Social Club vibe it's a bad idea to have the ending based on Mariska's ability to convey nuanced emotions via facial expression.
Overall this was a solid episode, even a good one. I think a whole series devoted to the concept of an elite squad investigated sexually based offenses might actually work better than one devoted to the life and mind of one commanding officer. Who could have figured?
-
10
-
-
2 hours ago, gesundheit said:
Well this should be... bizarre!
Rockefeller Center will turn into an SVU-immersive experience
The area will temporarily be renamed "Olivia Benson Plaza."
QuoteThe unofficial area renaming is part of a wider activation that will last two days, March 14 and March 15 from 10am to 6pm, and will include complimentary coffee and tea beverages at the Benson & Co. Coffee truck
Let me guess - the Iced-Tea will be really good, and the Peter Scone-ivino will look great, but you only get tiny servings because they insist that what you really want is more of the Captain Liv Flat White...
-
3
-
S25.E09: Children of Wolves
in Law & Order: SVU
I am not going to go back and rewatch Season 18 to find specific examples as I don't hate myself that much, but I think even astute viewers such as yourself forget how terrible it was as only a few episodes such as "Imposter" were memorably bad. Something like 17 were the same plot and Benson was doing almost all of the investigative work, plus the scripts were even worse than this as far as plot mechanics were concerned - it wasn't even that they took short cuts to get from A to B while focusing on Benson, things just happened and you couldn't even figure out what might have been cut as too expensive or not focused on St. Liv. This week feels like pages were not shot or lost in the edit - repeatedly in my Season 18 posts I mention that it felt like the script was a rough draft where there wasn't even a blank to fill in and figure out what was missing.
I guess my argument is that the Season 18 episodes were worse, both because of how repetitive they were (I see I went relatively easy on "Imposter" as after the last few episodes of Season 17 and the first couple episodes I was relieved to see an episode that was unquely bad ) and because they were probably even more Benson-centric with her lecturing the squad and the brass, doing more of the legwork herself, and not having anyone challenge her at all - the scene where Carsisi points out that she went too far for example would not have happened or she would told off Barba and they would have presented him as wrong. Perhaps in time I may agree that this is a standout bad episode, but right now it just seems like a mere D/D- episode that is more proof that they have lost control of Mariska again and that there are many equally bad or worse pieces of crap SVU has put out in the past 7 or 8 years.