S06.E17: The Train

[Jax7917]

2 minutes ago, ams1001 said:

LOL, I'm like that with music. Someone above mentioned how perfect the music was...I rarely notice it, even when it's a song I know, I won't remember that it was used. Someone will mention it and I won't even have any clue where in the episode it played.

The only time I really noticed the music on a show in a way that made me emotional was on One Tree Hill. They always put perfect songs with whatever the situation was. This show has been doing that too and that's when I start crying.

[Ohiopirate02]

6 minutes ago, TVForever said:

Don't get me wrong. I loved Jack, but let's be real. She and Jack were together for 17- 20 years when he died. She was with Miguel for maybe 40ish years? Are we to believe that Miguel was just a placeholder until she could get to be with Jack again for eternity? 

The show made sure Rebecca and Miguel were not together as long as her and Jack.  Rebecca and Jack's relationship has a very specific beginning and end with them meeting in December 1972 the night of the Immaculate Reception and Jack dying on Super Bowl Sunday 1998.  With the Rebecca-Miguel relationship, the show decided to go vague.  Rebecca and Miguel reconnect on Facebook in October 2008, but do not immediately start dating.  They do get married sometime in late 2011 or early 2012, and Miguel dies sometime between 2026 and 2030.  

[Jax7917]

14 minutes ago, TVForever said:

DAMN YOU SHOW.

Do they give Emmys for casting directors? Because throughout this whole series, this show has done a marvelous job with the Big Three at different ages with the different actors. I still have to stop myself from checking to see if Teenaged Beth is related to Adult Beth IRL.

Overall, I loved this episode, and thought it was a beautiful sendoff for Rebecca. My only quibble (and it's a minor one), is that Miguel got short shrift AGAIN. He told her she was his favorite person, and got a lovely smile in return, before being moved along. And at the end of it all, there was Jack. Of course.

Don't get me wrong. I loved Jack, but let's be real. She and Jack were together for 17- 20 years when he died. She was with Miguel for maybe 40ish years? Are we to believe that Miguel was just a placeholder until she could get to be with Jack again for eternity? 

Okay, so maybe it wasn't such a minor quibble.

Looking forward to next week. Get the tissues ready.

I thought the casting for everyone on this show young and old was great, the only one looks wise who's younger self in childhood and adolescence does not match the adult at all was Randall. He looked so different throughout the time periods and also his mannerisms were very different. The other two Pearsons were well-casted (especially Kate) and really everyone else including Randall's kids and Beth were too.

Miguel got robbed of a scene where Rebecca told him how thankful she was for having him and for having spent so many wonderful years with him, but I am thankful that the writers didn't make Miguel so insecure about not being "Jack" throughout the series. Their relationship was never about Jack and being a rebound. A rebound would have been the guy she was dating for a little while (Matt?). Rebecca and Miguel genuinely just fell in love through being such close friends and their relationship just flourished from there. I love that they were both making their relationship their own rather than living in the past.

[BC4ME]

13 hours ago, Kip Hackman said:

That got me, too. And I thought, "Damn, if I couldn't get through Beth's goodbye, how am I going to make it through the rest?"

But that turned out to be the only scene I got misty over. Weird.

Me too. And I have to say I just gasped out loud and ugly cried over Beth's whole speech. The rest was a let down I wasn't expecting after that.

Maybe I'm just an asshole. Or maybe it was the mood I was in or my expectations, but I spent a lot of this episode being annoyed instead of sad. Mostly over the Marcus family business and how she basically just ran by Miguel on the train. And that stupid lemonade out of lemons thing was cringey for me. 

I think the train idea was a good one but could've been better executed.

Most of my complaints have already been voiced here so I'll just say that I'm normally a big softie who cries easily and this just didn't hit home for me at all. In contrast, I loved the Miguel episode.

I'm sure this episode had many well done parts I'm under appreciating right now because of my over all irritation over parts of it. I'm sure the cast, crew, director and writers all worked very hard on this episode and there was a lot of pressure to do it justice. It appears there were many people who loved it. 

As an aside, Chrissy Metz has certainly seemed more athletic and light on her feet for the past few episodes than I would've guessed. Good for her if she's getting in better shape.   

[GeorgiaRai]

13 hours ago, Lovecat said:

Anyone else notice that Dr. K was polishing a glass behind the bar with a Terrible Towel, and that Jack’s coffee mugs (World’s Best Dad, with his picture on it, as well as one from Lundy, the company where he worked) were on display on shelves behind the bar?  Makes me wonder what other Easter eggs I missed…good thing I didn’t delete the episode!

I didn't catch it myself, but saw elsewhere that Jack's rain boots were there.

Edited May 18, 2022 by GeorgiaRai

[bluegirl147]

10 minutes ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

The show made sure Rebecca and Miguel were not together as long as her and Jack.  Rebecca and Jack's relationship has a very specific beginning and end with them meeting in December 1972 the night of the Immaculate Reception and Jack dying on Super Bowl Sunday 1998.  With the Rebecca-Miguel relationship, the show decided to go vague.  Rebecca and Miguel reconnect on Facebook in October 2008, but do not immediately start dating.  They do get married sometime in late 2011 or early 2012, and Miguel dies sometime between 2026 and 2030.  

For me it's not the quantity of time you spend with someone but the quality of time you spend with someone.  Whether the show wanted to acknowledge it or not Rebecca had two men who loved her.  Jack might have been the love of Rebecca's life but I think Rebecca was the love of Miguel's life.  And I think it's shitty they show her moving to the afterlife with very little regard for Miguel.  

[sara416]

One Easter Egg I didn't notice last night but read about this morning (and I can't remember where!) was that little Jack's red boots were on a shelf behind Miguel! 

3 minutes ago, GeorgiaRai said:

I didn't catch it myself, but saw elsewhere that Jack's rain boots wre there.

I read this this morning and teared up again. I can't believe I didn't notice this!

My theory on why MIguel got less time than everyone else was because the train was moving faster as it went on. The nurse mentioned that everything was moving quickly, and I believe William said something about the train moving fast now as well. She spent more time in the beginning with people and the visits at the end were more rushed, they were walking faster through the train and there wasn't time to stop. 

Edited May 18, 2022 by sara416
Posted at the same time as someone else

[izabella]

There was plenty of time to stop.  The writers just decided to make Miguel a brief non-entity in Rebecca's life as she left it.  I was very angry about his 30 second spot on the train.  The writers negated their years long relationship in 30 seconds without a word from Rebecca.

[Trillian]

25 minutes ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

The show made sure Rebecca and Miguel were not together as long as her and Jack.  Rebecca and Jack's relationship has a very specific beginning and end with them meeting in December 1972 the night of the Immaculate Reception and Jack dying on Super Bowl Sunday 1998.  With the Rebecca-Miguel relationship, the show decided to go vague.  Rebecca and Miguel reconnect on Facebook in October 2008, but do not immediately start dating.  They do get married sometime in late 2011 or early 2012, and Miguel dies sometime between 2026 and 2030.  

Rebecca and Miguel might not have been married as long as she and Jack were, but they were friends for a very long time, with their friendship becoming deeper and more meaningful after Jack died.  It’s like When Harry Met Sally: “it only took 3 months”; “well, 12 years and 3 months”. Miguel was in her life far longer than Jack was and the character deserved more than the quick brush-off on the train.

[Aloeonatable]

40 minutes ago, TVForever said:

Don't get me wrong. I loved Jack, but let's be real. She and Jack were together for 17- 20 years when he died. She was with Miguel for maybe 40ish years? Are we to believe that Miguel was just a placeholder until she could get to be with Jack again for eternity? 

Jack and Rebecca were married for at least 4-5 years before the Big Three were born and probably together a year or two before that. Jack died when the Big Three were 17, so I think Jack & Rebecca were together (a couple) for at least 24 years. Rebecca and Miguel were celebrating their 10th anniversary when little Jack was 3. I'm guessing they were only married about 15-16 years when Miguel died. They didn't even start to reconnect until Tess was born. Jack was Rebecca's true love, Miguel was her second love. 

[wonderwoman]

21 minutes ago, BC4ME said:

Maybe I'm just an asshole. Or maybe it was the mood I was in or my expectations, but I spent a lot of this episode being annoyed instead of sad. Mostly over the Marcus family business and how she basically just ran by Miguel on the train. And that stupid lemonade out of lemons thing was cringey for me. 

let’s sit together. 

[bluegirl147]

Just now, wonderwoman said:

let’s sit together. 

Can I join you.  I've never been overly moved by anything on this show.  I have however been disappointed and sometimes outright pissed at this show.  

Rebecca loved Jack.  I get it. I understand he was the love of her life. The father of her children.  But it's not like she cloaked herself in black and waited to die for 25 years just so she could be with him again.  Maybe Miguel didn't give her butterflies or whatever but they were married and had a meaningful life together.   If someone had watched this episode and knew nothing about the characters they would not have known Miguel was Rebecca's husband.  If Rebecca had met Jack and he was with a little boy who was Kyle I would have been OK with that.  But to have Rebecca just float by Miguel on her way to her "one true love" or as Sophie put it a love story for the ages just really bothers me.  

[Ohiopirate02]

2 minutes ago, Aloeonatable said:

Jack and Rebecca were married for at least 4-5 years before the Big Three were born and probably together a year or two before that. Jack died when the Big Three were 17, so I think Jack & Rebecca were together (a couple) for at least 24 years. Rebecca and Miguel were celebrating their 10th anniversary when little Jack was 3. I'm guessing they were only married about 15-16 years when Miguel died. They didn't even start to reconnect until Tess was born. Jack was Rebecca's true love, Miguel was her second love. 

Exactly.  I also want to add that the only reason Rebecca-Miguel happened was because Jack died.  Their marriage didn't end because one party wanted to separate, they were not given a choice.  Part of Rebecca has always loved Jack and mourns him.  Miguel knew this when he first got together with Rebecca.  Their marriage was a different sort of marriage.  

[DanaK]

Once thing I'm confused about in regards to Deja being pregnant, if this episode was 10 years from the present, why is she only now getting pregnant for the first time and the first of Randall's kids having a baby? You would think within those 10 years, Deja at least would have had a baby before then given she was at least 18 in our present. If she became a doctor as I recall, maybe going to med school and establishing herself had her put off motherhood

[izabella]

14 minutes ago, Trillian said:

Rebecca and Miguel might not have been married as long as she and Jack were, but they were friends for a very long time, with their friendship becoming deeper and more meaningful after Jack died.  It’s like When Harry Met Sally: “it only took 3 months”; “well, 12 years and 3 months”. Miguel was in her life far longer than Jack was and the character deserved more than the quick brush-off on the train.

And the ONLY reason Miguel was not in her life for 10 years before reconnecting on Facebook was KEVIN shut him down.  Had he not moved to Houston after that, he and Rebecca would have gotten together and married far sooner.

Edited May 18, 2022 by izabella

[Lovecat]

12 minutes ago, Trillian said:

Rebecca and Miguel might not have been married as long as she and Jack were, but they were friends for a very long time, with their friendship becoming deeper and more meaningful after Jack died.  It’s like When Harry Met Sally: “it only took 3 months”; “well, 12 years and 3 months”. Miguel was in her life far longer than Jack was and the character deserved more than the quick brush-off on the train.

Right?  I've known my husband since we were 11 years old, but I am his second wife; our friendship didn't turn romantic until after his first wife died, and we were married 36 years to the day we first met (first day of 7th grade; he sat behind me in homeroom).  I like to think we'll get more than 30 seconds' face time on "the train."

[Cristofle]

33 minutes ago, bluegirl147 said:

Jack might have been the love of Rebecca's life but I think Rebecca was the love of Miguel's life. 

This is true, and it's maybe a little sad/bittersweet for Miguel, but it's not really Rebecca's fault. She didn't choose to not be with Jack. He died. Whatever anyone else thinks might have happened in their marriage, in her mind, they had gotten past the hard parts and if he hadn't died they would have grown old together. Furthermore, Miguel knew all this better than almost anyone. He knew that to some extent, he was signing up to be second place. Miguel wasn't manipulated or lied to at any point. He decided that it was okay that he was the one she loved after she couldn't be with Jack anymore. Given that, I can't see it as a betrayal of Miguel that at the end of this train, she was heading where she wanted to be the most - back with Jack. She feels how she feels, and she was never dishonest about that.

I WAS surprised, I've said before, that Miguel's moment was as brief as it was (also, there was something a little off about the tone, especially on Rebecca's end in the beginning, although I thought she looked like part of her wished she could stay a little longer right before she left). But I wasn't surprised that her ultimate afterlife endgame was Jack. Even re: the amount of time mentioned elsewhere - as others have said, she WAS with Jack for a long time, so it wasn't exactly a brief love affair, but even if it had been briefer, the amount of time isn't everything. It's how you feel during that time. Jack was the love of her life. 

[GeorgiaRai]

I feel there must be some significance to the fact that there were people and memories going through Rebecca's mind as she progressed through the train cars, yet Jack only appeared after she actually died.  The kids & Miguel were definitely on her heart, hence their presence on the moving train, and other people & memories were evoked as family members spoke to her, or as she overheard them sharing stories of the past.  But no Jack until she not only entered the caboose car, but closed her eyes to "rest."

I don't know.  It seems like this means something, I just haven't settled yet on what. 

[Pallas]

3 minutes ago, GeorgiaRai said:

But no Jack until she not only entered the caboose car, but closed her eyes to "rest."

Jack completes the circle: he's where the carousel stops, more or less. Everyone else Rebecca met after Jack, and knew because of Jack. 

[AriAu]

Anyone else think that "Circle Game" was just a little too on the nose as a song choice given the sidewalk chalk and the 4 Square and the Pin the Tail on The Donkey?

[survivinmt]

I missed some of the speeches (Annie's I guess) because of an Amber alert in my area. Seemed ironic somehow.

I have a sister who is on her third marriage - and he is the love of her life. He is also on his third marriage and loves my sister dearly - but his first wife and mother of his children is still his "life love", although she died of cancer. So I think that for whatever reasons, there can be multiple loves of your life. I don't think we need to rate them. And I think after death there be so much love to go around that we will laugh about who loves who "more". 

I agree with those that think that, yes, Mandy Moore is beautiful, but she looked weird on the train to me. Pretty dress. But weirdly tart-ish makeup. And yes, oddly wide-eyed. But I am amazed with the casting people Not only very close in looks, but mannerisms and attitude. 

Good job, people.

PS Has anyone EVER played Pin the Tail on the Donkey when NOT at a party?

[Evie]

3 hours ago, Cristofle said:

I would never have expected Miguel to trump Jack - for better or worse, this show has been clear and consistent in prioritizing Jack and Rebecca's story. Even when Rebecca was first diagnosed, what was haunting her at the end of that episode was the idea of forgetting that Jack loved her. I think she definitely loved Miguel, but I think if you'd asked her, in her heart she would believe that Jack was the love of her life. And I also wasn't surprised it was Jack alone at the end, without bringing Kyle into it. It's probably not especially emotionally realistic, but at the end of the day, Kyle has barely been mentioned on the show in years and this was not a moment for a surprise twist - this was a moment of bringing us to what they'd been building to, which was Rebecca ultimately going home to Jack. Still, I was a little surprised that Miguel and Rebecca didn't really EXCHANGE words while she talked with Dr. K (who I really like!) for a fairly long time. 

Yeah, I think Rebecca and Miguel had a deep and meaningful love but Jack was the love of her life. Plus, he was the father of her kids, and as was hammered home, this was Rebecca's journey as a mother. I'm not bothered by Jack waiting for her at the end, but I would have made Miguel the conductor (I don't like William though) or at least had him be the older Miguel she fell in love with. His words felt weird to me coming from younger Miguel lol.

So yeah, I do wish the show had given him more time but hopefully, we all have our own afterlife trains, and Rebecca was at the end of his. 

Edited May 18, 2022 by Evie

[Jax7917]

There was enough room on the bed for both Miguel and Jack, just saying !

[trudyj]

I have to do the "long time lurker; first time (in ages) poster" thing (I always follow and love everyone's comments on the episodes!) to raise a couple of things:

1. I think everyone complaining about Kate's career VASTLY overemphasizes how big a deal "curriculum development" is. Her getting her undergrad and masters degree in the time allotted is a bit of a stretch, but curriculum development is usually done by committees, and a competent and passionate educator with a strong interest in curriculum, especially in a specialized field like music education for the blind, could easily end up on committees designing state curricula ... and if it's something she's good at and interested in, it doesn't seem a big stretch to me that she could be part of a group presenting on the curriculum they developed, at an international conference or something. To me (probably because I've worked my whole career in education) it seems much less of a stretch than Randall going from city councillor to state senator in the same period of time, and it's never "shown" how he did that either -- seems odd to me that people are so puzzled by Kate's career moves and not by Randall's.

2. In the minority here, I liked the Marcus storyline. It's something this show has often done -- taken a character outside the story, teased us to as to how they link into the main story. Sometimes (like the guy who lived with Randall's mother) it's a character who ends up tying into the main characters' personal stories, but other times (like with the guy who developed the technology that allowed them to use videocalling during the pandemic!), it's a more tangential connection that touches on our characters' lives. This was kind of both, since Marcus had that hospital connection where the doctor saving his life missed saving Jack's (I did question why there were so few doctors in a big-city hospital), but also the Alzheimer's thing. I didn't think Marcus was going to "cure" Alzheimer's; I assumed we were supposed to conclude that his research had contributed to developing the drugs that gave Rebecca a few more good years with her family, as seen last season and earlier this season.

3. The train metaphor was lovely but the discussion over Jack vs Miguel on the train really emphasizes the problem with a very literal view of the afterlife when it comes to people who have been widowed and happily remarried. You either have to imagine a sexless afterlife or a polyamorous one -- a philosophical conundrum people have been wrestling with for at least 2000 years if the Bible is anything to go by. I thought from a storytelling perspective, the years with Miguel and the depth of their love for each other got due attention in the Miguel episode, but Rebecca's deathbed scene was definitely going to bring her back to her first love and the father of her children.

[peeayebee]

15 hours ago, Quickbeam said:

I am completely embarrassed to say this but I was getting Malik and Marcus jumbled up as in who is Deja’s baby daddy.

I am completely embarrassed to say that I forgot Malik's name, so I was thinking that Marcus was her old boyfriend. And then I was confused about the limp caused by the car accident. One thing that would have helped me out is if the writers had given the guy a name that doesn't begin with M. 

I was so stuck in the belief that Marcus was Deja's boyfriend that I didn't pick up at the end that he was a different guy from Malik. I guess I need to rewatch the ending, but I was still wondering why Malik wasn't limping. Argh! And when was it mentioned that Malik owned a restaurant?

 

14 hours ago, GeorgiaRai said:

FYI, I’m  sure she said it but we were out of earshot:  “Yes, Toby. I absolutely like you better than Phillip.”  

Actually, what Rebecca said was, "Who?"

 

13 hours ago, Bulldog said:

I continue to be impressed with the casting of older Deja.  She even has the younger version's cadence of speaking down pat. 

Her voice is so much like younger Deja's. Excellent voice work by this actress.

 

10 hours ago, Mediocre Gatsby said:

I was coming back to say this about Beth's scene -- that was the best one for me, too. 

The plaque said "Caboose car," I believe. 

That shot was so dark on my TV screen that I didn't realize there was a plaque there.

 

5 hours ago, Haleth said:

(Marcus didn't cure Alzheimers, he developed a treatment that helped prolong Rebecca's life.)

Is this clear in the timeline? I guess I didn't pay close enuf attention to Marcus's age. He was younger than the Pearson kids when Jack died. I don't remember how old he looked when he received the accolades for his Alzheimers work. So I suppose Rebecca could still have been alive at that point. Can anyone clarify this?

Like others, I wasn't pleased with the Marcus family story. It was too distracting.

I did like the whole train business. I may have to go back and look for the Easter eggs of mementos from Rebecca's life.

My first thought when Rebecca told William she was waiting for someone was that it was Jack. It took me a while to realize it was Kate. Duh.

When Randall said that he and Kevin were going to go in last and that he wanted to get it right, I was afraid that Rebecca would pass before they saw her.

One of my favorite lines from this ep. From Beth: I married you so I wouldn't have to learn all the big words.

I also liked when William told Rebecca that when something makes you sad when it ends, then it must have been pretty wonderful when it happened. 

[Nancybeth]

I'm usually a fan of Mandy Moore and I've loved her on this show, but I don't know what that super wide eyed, almost dumb look she was doing last night was all about. It was like she was very much AN ACTOR ACTING all of the sudden, and didn't have the natural effect that her performance usually has. It totally threw me off. Like girl, relax your face a little! 

I enjoyed the introduction of the new family / storyline and then realizing at the end how everything tied together, because that's been what this show has been doing since it started!  Remember the S4 premiere when we spent half the episode being introduced to Cassie and Malik and future Jack and we weren't sure exactly who they were or how they were tied to the Pearsons? 

I don't think in any way it was some kind of a "back door pilot" for a show featuring Dule Hill as the father, because Dule Hill is already playing a dad over on ABC's "Wonder Years" reboot. At the time this was shot he would have had no idea whether or not they were being renewed and he wouldn't have been free to commit to another show. I also had to laugh that he is the second former "West Wing" cast member (Josh Malina was the first) to suddenly show up and be involved in a car crash.

Lastly, I have no clue why Kate got such an overt last-minute character redemption arc...hot second husband, astounding career growth, jetting over to London to tell them how to...teach music to blind children? That's an incredibly specific curriculum. Anyway, most of it seems vastly out of character for the Kate we've gotten to know over the run of this show. I'll even accept Randall's meteoric political rise before I buy that Kate is a world-famous educator. Why did they need / want to keep Chrissy Metz away from Rebecca's final death scenes for so long? Hell, she could have just been on the other side of the country and it would have had the safe effect. I'm baffled about the choices that have been made.

[wonderwoman]

21 minutes ago, AriAu said:

Anyone else think that "Circle Game" was just a little too on the nose as a song choice given the sidewalk chalk and the 4 Square and the Pin the Tail on The Donkey?

as i said up thread: i thought the entire episode was more than a little too on the nose.

[Trillian]

10 minutes ago, Evie said:

Yeah, I think Rebecca and Miguel had a deep and meaningful love but Jack was the love of her life. Plus, he was the father of her kids, and as was hammered home, this was Rebecca's journey as a mother. I'm not bothered by Jack waiting for her at the end, but I would have made Miguel the conductor (I don't like William though) or at least had him be the older Miguel she fell in love with. His words felt weird to me coming from younger Miguel lol. 

The show was always going to go with Jack at the end and there are good plot reasons for that, I agree. I don’t think anyone is suggesting that it should have ended with Miguel and only Miguel, or even Miguel being more “important” than Jack. It’s the short shrift he got that rankles me, and I suspect others. I like your idea that he should have been the conductor, but, then again, I don’t like William either. He was too much of the trope discussed here. I frankly think he wasn’t important enough in Rebecca’s life to have taken such a central role in her journey to the afterlife. I could see him being that with Beth, since they formed a close bond, but not Rebecca. 

[hoosiergirl]

I think maybe if when Rebecca was walking through the train, if she had seen a version of herself with Miguel, like snuggling or holding hands and looking content, that might have done it for me. If some version of Miguel is happy in the afterlife with some version of Rebecca, then I’m ok with that. But if he’s spending eternity alone…well then booooo. 

Edited May 18, 2022 by hoosiergirl

[chitowngirl]

Beside “Caboose” being the word Rebecca couldn’t remember, one of the kids was reading the Little Golden Book “Caboose” that Rebecca’s dad read to her. Which started the whole caboose story.

[Notabug]

4 hours ago, SummerDreams said:

He didn't but why would they have him say that? In my ears it sounds like him saying exactly what you said. That he could have done something had he been there. It seems like a weird thing to imply one episode before the end.

At the point when Jack died, there wasn't any way for the doctor to know about his pre-existing cardiac disease, I imagine that came with the autopsy.  I think it is just human nature that the doctor felt like, if he had been there, maybe he could've done something that might've saved Jack and he was sorry he hadn't had that chance.  Just normal regret at a sad outcome.

[watch2much]

I liked the show.  a little disappointed Miguel was so quick, but other than that, I was fine with everything else.  I was glad Deja and Malik are together....it's just a TV show after all.

[Dminches]

46 minutes ago, Nancybeth said:

I'm usually a fan of Mandy Moore and I've loved her on this show, but I don't know what that super wide eyed, almost dumb look she was doing last night was all about. It was like she was very much AN ACTOR ACTING all of the sudden, and didn't have the natural effect that her performance usually has. It totally threw me off. Like girl, relax your face a little! 

 

Excellent points.  The episode did a disservice to both Rebecca and Mandy.

 

[SummerDreams]

I thought that Kate looked way better without make up on.

I watched a preview of the finale and I think I'm ready to let these people go.

[PRgal]

I'm trying to figure out the timeline for Marcus.  Marcus is probably a good 7-8 years younger than the Big 3, which would put him somewhere in his 40s when Rebecca dies.  Considering how long it takes to get to that kind of award winning level, it's unlikely he would have developed a drug that Rebecca was supposed to be part of a trial for in 2020 or so.  A early to mid 30-something would be, at most, in the middle of their career in that kind of research.  Unless he's some sort of genius, of course.  

[tennisgurl]

I actually went into this episode wondering if they would play The Circle Game, its the perfect song for this episode and as Rebecca is a big Joni Mitchel fan, it totally makes sense to play it. They were clearly holding off on using it for the whole show, keeping it in their pocket for this one. 

Using the train to get to see tons of the younger versions of characters interacting with older versions was a nice narrative concept. For some reason, I loved seeing young Beth the most, smiling up at Rebecca as she talks about everything she learned from her. 

I too would have liked more Miguel. I guess they figured that we just had a whole Miguel episode so we didn't need a whole bunch, but I think he deserved more than just one scene with his wife of several decades. I don't mind her ending with Jack though, that's always where this train would end.

[HelloooKitty]

54 minutes ago, chitowngirl said:

Beside “Caboose” being the word Rebecca couldn’t remember, one of the kids was reading the Little Golden Book “Caboose” that Rebecca’s dad read to her. Which started the whole caboose story.

Beth was reading it and set it aside as she spoke to Rebecca. 

[Rammchick]

3 hours ago, izabella said:

Malik always wanted to be a chef.  Which does not explain why he went to Harvard instead of a culinary institute, but it does explain why he has a restaurant.

Thanks, I didn't remember that.

[Boo Boo]

By big groan in this episode beyond Kate being an international teacher superstar was that the kid who lived while Jack dies had his whole family mantra be the words of the irreplaceable evidently Jack Pearson AND then goes on to cure Alzheimer's, the same disease Rebecca dies from.

It's too Seinfeld circle-ish.  

[GeorgiaRai]

I think Rebecca looked & acted unusual because the circumstances were unusual!  This wasn't Rebecca on a train; it was Rebecca's mind creating images based on reality and fantasy.  The wide-eyed wonder seemed appropriate to me, especially considering how long her dementia has had her locked away.  And her clothing and make up was IMO, a projection of what she saw as her most beautiful self.  It wasn't meant to look natural, because the whole experience was supernatural.

I liked this take about Miguel (from Reddit but shared by Good Housekeeping, which who knew was still a thing?)

• I feel like a lot of people are missing the fact that all of this was going on inside Rebecca’s head, in the mind of someone with Alzheimer’s. In a way, she’s her own unreliable narrator, and her recollection of the last few years of her life is unfortunately non-existent. She’s not the late 70s-aged version of herself; she’s Rebecca at her prime. All of the people she sees actually manifest as they would have been at that time. Of course Miguel gets short shrift - he was only ever Jack’s friend in the time frame in which she sees herself. The big three appear as adults, but her flash of recognition seems more palpable when she sees them as children and young adults. William symbolizes the confusion and self-flagellation that came with keeping secrets from Randal, and in her last moments, he (and the doctor) permit her to forgive herself for her life’s mistakes. I think his was incredibly well handled. I’m not sure if people really were expecting the metaphorical “life flashing before her eyes”, because what they got was something significant and profound: a woman, at the end of her life, forgiving herself and being forgiven.

https://www.goodhousekeeping.com/life/entertainment/a40034247/this-is-us-season-6-train-episode-rebecca-miguel-fan-reaction/

[izabella]

1 hour ago, Notabug said:

At the point when Jack died, there wasn't any way for the doctor to know about his pre-existing cardiac disease, I imagine that came with the autopsy.  I think it is just human nature that the doctor felt like, if he had been there, maybe he could've done something that might've saved Jack and he was sorry he hadn't had that chance.  Just normal regret at a sad outcome.

I recall that Jack found out about his heart thing when he signed up for the military.  Did I imagine that?  He should have told the doctor about it, if he knew.

[ams1001]

24 minutes ago, GeorgiaRai said:

I think Rebecca looked & acted unusual because the circumstances were unusual!  This wasn't Rebecca on a train; it was Rebecca's mind creating images based on reality and fantasy.  The wide-eyed wonder seemed appropriate to me, especially considering how long her dementia has had her locked away.  And her clothing and make up was IMO, a projection of what she saw as her most beautiful self.  It wasn't meant to look natural, because the whole experience was supernatural.

I liked this take about Miguel (from Reddit but shared by Good Housekeeping, which who knew was still a thing?)

• I feel like a lot of people are missing the fact that all of this was going on inside Rebecca’s head, in the mind of someone with Alzheimer’s. In a way, she’s her own unreliable narrator, and her recollection of the last few years of her life is unfortunately non-existent. She’s not the late 70s-aged version of herself; she’s Rebecca at her prime. All of the people she sees actually manifest as they would have been at that time. Of course Miguel gets short shrift - he was only ever Jack’s friend in the time frame in which she sees herself. The big three appear as adults, but her flash of recognition seems more palpable when she sees them as children and young adults. William symbolizes the confusion and self-flagellation that came with keeping secrets from Randal, and in her last moments, he (and the doctor) permit her to forgive herself for her life’s mistakes. I think his was incredibly well handled. I’m not sure if people really were expecting the metaphorical “life flashing before her eyes”, because what they got was something significant and profound: a woman, at the end of her life, forgiving herself and being forgiven.

https://www.goodhousekeeping.com/life/entertainment/a40034247/this-is-us-season-6-train-episode-rebecca-miguel-fan-reaction/

Thank you for posting this! I was thinking along these lines and unable to clearly articulate my thoughts. I wrote and deleted a post a couple times because it didn't make sense when I tried to write it down. It also makes me feel better about Miguel getting so little time on the train.

[Notabug]

22 minutes ago, izabella said:

I recall that Jack found out about his heart thing when he signed up for the military.  Did I imagine that?  He should have told the doctor about it, if he knew.

We heard that he was supposed to be 4F due to some sort of heart issue.  However, it was never made clear what exactly was going on there and he eventually went into the military and served without a problem and then went years and years leading an active healthy life until he suddenly had a massive fatal heart attack, AKA a widowmaker.  There really is no correlation between whatever it was that was supposed to keep him out of the Army and his eventual heart attack, though, at least there wouldn't be in real life.

The thing about massive anterior MI's in younger men is that they often do come out of the blue in people who were previously asymptomatic.  There is no relation to having a heart murmur as a kid or any other issue, though.  

[Aloeonatable]

2 hours ago, Cristofle said:

This is true, and it's maybe a little sad/bittersweet for Miguel, but it's not really Rebecca's fault. She didn't choose to not be with Jack. He died. Whatever anyone else thinks might have happened in their marriage, in her mind, they had gotten past the hard parts and if he hadn't died they would have grown old together. Furthermore, Miguel knew all this better than almost anyone. He knew that to some extent, he was signing up to be second place. Miguel wasn't manipulated or lied to at any point. He decided that it was okay that he was the one she loved after she couldn't be with Jack anymore. Given that, I can't see it as a betrayal of Miguel that at the end of this train, she was heading where she wanted to be the most - back with Jack. She feels how she feels, and she was never dishonest about that.

I WAS surprised, I've said before, that Miguel's moment was as brief as it was (also, there was something a little off about the tone, especially on Rebecca's end in the beginning, although I thought she looked like part of her wished she could stay a little longer right before she left). But I wasn't surprised that her ultimate afterlife endgame was Jack. Even re: the amount of time mentioned elsewhere - as others have said, she WAS with Jack for a long time, so it wasn't exactly a brief love affair, but even if it had been briefer, the amount of time isn't everything. It's how you feel during that time. Jack was the love of her life. 

I wish I could "heart" this 1000 times. Loving one doesn't negate love for the other. 

[marceline]

I need to vent about the circumstances around Jack's death. There's something that's bothered me ever since the original episode but revisiting this brought it all back up again.

I never understood how Jack died while Rebecca was at the vending machine and yet there was no code blue or attempt to resuscitate him. When Rebecca returns to Jack's hospital room, he's just dead. No doctors or nurses lingering in the room. Just the body laid out like Joyce Summers on the couch. 

And now we learned in this episode that the doctor was gone for 20 minutes. ("He was presenting normal not 20 minutes ago") the other doctor said Jack died because "Cardiac arrest. Lifesaving measures did not work."

What lifesaving measures could they perform in 20 minutes?! Where was the call that Pearson in 107 was crashing? Where were the doctors and nurses? Why wasn't he covered with a sheet? I see nothing about those scenes that tells me they made even minimal effort to treat him. Not even so much as oxygen or intubation.

I love this show but Jack's death has never sat well with me from a medical standpoint. He went from fine to dead in 20 minutes.

Whew! It feels good to finally get this off my chest.

[Trillian]

4 minutes ago, marceline said:

I need to vent about the circumstances around Jack's death. There's something that's bothered me ever since the original episode but revisiting this brought it all back up again.

I never understood how Jack died while Rebecca was at the vending machine and yet there was no code blue or attempt to resuscitate him. When Rebecca returns to Jack's hospital room, he's just dead. No doctors or nurses lingering in the room. Just the body laid out like Joyce Summers on the couch. 

And now we learned in this episode that the doctor was gone for 20 minutes. ("He was presenting normal not 20 minutes ago") the other doctor said Jack died because "Cardiac arrest. Lifesaving measures did not work."

What lifesaving measures could they perform in 20 minutes?! Where was the call that Pearson in 107 was crashing? Where were the doctors and nurses? Why wasn't he covered with a sheet? I see nothing about those scenes that tells me they made even minimal effort to treat him. Not even so much as oxygen or intubation.

I love this show but Jack's death has never sat well with me from a medical standpoint. He went from fine to dead in 20 minutes.

Whew! It feels good to finally get this off my chest.

IIRC, there were background sounds of the code while Rebecca was on the phone and one could see people running around and into “a” room in the background. 

Just found the scene: I did remember correctly. Whether that all could’ve happened in the time allotted, I leave to you (I missed that class in law school).

 

[chabelisaywow]

Quote

let’s sit together. 

Can I join you.

Raises hand. Because I'm getting reamed on Reddit for stating the obvious. They have some This Is Us can do no wrongers over there

[marceline]

20 hours ago, Trillian said:

IIRC, there were background sounds of the code while Rebecca was on the phone and one could see people running around and into “a” room in the background. 

Just found the scene: I did remember correctly. Whether that all could’ve happened in the time allotted, I leave to you (I missed that class in law school).

I felt the same way. I thought that was meant to show that a lot more time had elapsed and I supported that as a creative choice. 

But in THIS episode the doc said 20 minutes. That doesn't work under any circumstances.

Edited May 19, 2022 by marceline

[Pallas]

2 hours ago, GeorgiaRai said:

I think Rebecca looked & acted unusual because the circumstances were unusual!  This wasn't Rebecca on a train; it was Rebecca's mind creating images based on reality and fantasy.  The wide-eyed wonder seemed appropriate to me, especially considering how long her dementia has had her locked away.  And her clothing and make up was IMO, a projection of what she saw as her most beautiful self.  It wasn't meant to look natural, because the whole experience was supernatural.

I liked this take about Miguel (from Reddit but shared by Good Housekeeping, which who knew was still a thing?)

• I feel like a lot of people are missing the fact that all of this was going on inside Rebecca’s head, in the mind of someone with Alzheimer’s. In a way, she’s her own unreliable narrator, and her recollection of the last few years of her life is unfortunately non-existent. She’s not the late 70s-aged version of herself; she’s Rebecca at her prime. All of the people she sees actually manifest as they would have been at that time. Of course Miguel gets short shrift - he was only ever Jack’s friend in the time frame in which she sees herself. The big three appear as adults, but her flash of recognition seems more palpable when she sees them as children and young adults. William symbolizes the confusion and self-flagellation that came with keeping secrets from Randal, and in her last moments, he (and the doctor) permit her to forgive herself for her life’s mistakes. I think his was incredibly well handled. I’m not sure if people really were expecting the metaphorical “life flashing before her eyes”, because what they got was something significant and profound: a woman, at the end of her life, forgiving herself and being forgiven.

https://www.goodhousekeeping.com/life/entertainment/a40034247/this-is-us-season-6-train-episode-rebecca-miguel-fan-reaction/

So Rebecca was moving through a dreamscape as her young-mother self. The tenth-anniversary Rebecca, the one who'd already moved beyond her worst anxieties and had demanded that Jack, too, do his best as a parent. And the Miguel she encountered was Jack's newly-divorced best friend -- flirting with her, and calling her his favorite person. She looked perplexed and took a step toward Miguel, when William intervened. To keep her from breaking through the illusion, perhaps, as well as to keep her headed where she needed to go.

[A.Ham]

3 hours ago, peeayebee said:

Is this clear in the timeline? I guess I didn't pay close enuf attention to Marcus's age. He was younger than the Pearson kids when Jack died.

The care scene with new "who are these people" helped establish a bit of a timeline--the biggest clue for me from the get-go is that mom was using one of them print-out maps people used in the mid-late 90's. (Mapquest came out in 1996 and gps tech did not come out until 2001, per google). I remember my father asking me to read them darn maps a couple of times when we went out of state, and me trying to calculate exact distances from the time you made a turn to the next one; luckily I did not suck at math. Anyways, this also lines up with Jack's death at the hospital in 1998. That (and the limp) was the biggest clue for me that Marcus was not Malik.